Spanish Influence in West Ireland

Subject: RE: Spanish Influence in West Ireland
From:
Date: 28 Apr 98 - 01:44 PM

There is certainly a lot of Norse blood in Ireland, but from what I remember of my Irish history, the Celts who "settled" (read invaded and killed every inhabitent) Ireland supposedly came from Northern Spain after the tin mines there in Castille played out. Those Celts did have red hair and blue eyes and freckles and you can still see those same characteristics in their decendents today in that part of Espana. There were lots of Celtic tribes around the continent at that time, however, but I don't know if any were darker or if they were part of that initial settlement. This is all from my admittedly sketchy memory, so if anyone has more accurate info, I'd love to hear it.

Subject: RE: Spanish Influence in West Ireland
From: Jon W.
Date: 28 Apr 98 - 01:21 PM

Hold on, I thought that the Celts and Picts were dark haired, dark eyed folks and that the red hair, fair skin, and blue eyed Irish came from the Vikings doing what Vikings did (as it was once expressed in a humor magazine: rape, plunder, pillage, rape, burn, rape, rob, steal, rape, rape, and rape).

Subject: RE: Spanish Influence in West Ireland
From: Tim O'K
Date: 28 Apr 98 - 10:13 AM

I believe more than twenty ships from the Spanish Armada wrecked off the western coast of Ireland on their return trip in a series of storms. If you've seen that coast, you'll understand why the chance of survival of a sailor in a shipwreck, in a storm, on that coast, was virtually nil, let alone enough for a viable gene pool. The genes producing the dark hair and eyes certainly came from the usual sources, traders, immigrants, misc travelors, and of course sailors doing what sailors usually do in port.

Subject: RE: Spanish Influence in West Ireland
From: aldus
Date: 28 Apr 98 - 09:37 AM

This Spanish Armada myth is just that... a myth. Very few Spaniards came ashore, certainly not enough of them to account for the dark hair and brown eyes of many Irish. Nice story, but it just ain't so.

Subject: RE: Spanish Influence in West Ireland
From: Dave Brennan
Date: 27 Apr 98 - 10:03 PM

Abbeydorney in Gaelic is Mainister O dTorna. There's a Spanish Point outside of Milltown Malbay in County Clare. I'm not sure but I think in Gaelic it would be Rinn na Spainneach. There's a lot of Irish songs that invoke Spain. Did you have any in particular in mind?

Subject: RE: Spanish Influence in West Ireland
From: Bruce O.
Date: 27 Apr 98 - 09:55 PM

"The Spanish Lady" is in my broadside index. There's also one on a Spanish Gentleman and a few others on Spanish women, and tunes "The Spanish Gypises" and "The Spanish Pavan", but I can't see any connection of any to Ireland. The question was asked on the Irish music thread a few months ago if the 'black Irish' were descended from Spaniards. The ovewhelming answer was that there's nothing known to be descended from Spaniards in Ireland. But later someone decided that the name of a pier (or something like that) in Dublin was Spanish or Italian.

Subject: Spanish Influence in West Ireland
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 27 Apr 98 - 08:44 PM

From the Spancil Hill thread I am reminded that during the times of the Spanish Armada there was a degree of procreation between the Spanish and locals from the West coast of Ireland. I don;t know the real speelling but my family came from Abbeydawney, somewhere near Tralee. The presence of olive skin and dark eyes in a few members of my otherwise Irish family has prompted some of my parents' generation to refer to the earlier Spanish genes.

Apart from Spanish Lady is there any other mention of this in song?

Regards John