BS: Help on US colleges please?

Subject: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: Morticia
Date: 26 Nov 02 - 02:56 PM

My daughter will be graduating in July and is expecting to go on to do her Masters in sociology ( ethnography to be exact). Her lecturer is recommending Berkeley or John Hopkins, and seems to be believe she will have little trouble attracting a scholarship.Has anyone here been to either of these places or perhaps has a son or daughter there?What can you tell me about them?

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: mack/misophist
Date: 26 Nov 02 - 03:47 PM

I live near Berkeley and go there often. If your daughter is innocent or unsophisticated, consider John Hopkins. Also, the social sciences department at Berkeley is very "post modern", I'm told. In ten years, this may not be such a good thing.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Nov 02 - 06:19 PM

Just to clarify it's actually Johns Hopkins. :-)

If she were there, she'd be a lot closer to you, Morticia, even though there would still be the pond to cross.

Also, you might PM Kathy Westra. I think she knows a bit about them.

Wow, they sure grow up don't they?

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 01:23 PM

Adding to Mesophist. Univ. California at Berkeley is very large (over 30,000), with many contending factions among the students. Johns Hopkins is only about 5000, and is centrally located with regard to the many east coast cultural and educational attractions. Both are excellent with regards to faculty, possibly more personal attention to students at the Masters and Bachelors levels would be given at Johns Hopkins. The lecturer probably had good reason for selecting these two.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: Morticia
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 03:29 PM

Thanks for your help.Obviously I am not thrilled at the idea of her being so far away but as Q says, I am sure her lecturer was giving what he felt to be good advice.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: mg
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 04:48 PM

Darn...the best university in the U.S. is probably Washington State University (not to be confused with the University of Washington). That is where I am proud to work..don't know about sociology, but if anyone is interested in agriculture, come on down.

mg

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: wilco
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 04:52 PM

Would she consider a school in the Southeast USA. I've just started my seventh child in college. Pace is much slower, people much more hospitable, etc. "down South." Someplace like Vanderbilt in Nashville, Tennessee. This would put her dead center for living ethnography.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: Morticia
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 06:52 PM

I think the point of a recommendation to a college in the US is that they offer an Msc in Ethnology, not that she study the local population for one *BG*.BTW Wilco, how in hell have you afforded 7!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 07:58 PM

The advisor and student may have in mind some particular specialization within the Ethnology tent. There are quite a number of schools that would allow an ethnological degree, some of them quite good. When I started looking for a place for specialized study, I picked one that had a staff member who could offer what I wanted. Luckily, I was able to get a teaching assistantship there.
Some schools like to have a graduate group with diverse backgrounds; I remember at mine that in my specialty there was always one spot (at least) for a qualified student from the British Isles. This was an inland state university.
Some schools have received large private scholarship funds from an individual or concern with certain restrictions on the type of student who is eligible. Again, the advisor may know of that kind of fund at the schools he recommended.
For these reasons, recommendations to other schools may not help.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 08:45 PM

Take Berkley. It is a true UNI-Versity. The it has diverse cultures, splendid weather, and the countryside is grand.

It is my family's opinion that a child needs to go to school.... far enough away from home.... that they cannot return home on the weekends.

The decision should not be yours Morticia - it should be the young adult's ....she is no longer your child. Visit the web pages - then have her visit the campuses in person.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 10:14 PM

If you daughter is ready to begin a Masters program, she probably already has figured out some of her own preferences - and knows at least a little about "where it's at" for her field of study. Of course the choice should be hers.

Especially if she's depending on financial aid, she should be in touch with any potential schools as soon as possible if not already. For graduate study, direct contact with the department(s) in which she's interested is probably appropriate.

Most graduate level financial aid is in the form of "Assistantships" where the student is "employed" to assist some member of the faculty, so if she knows, or can identify, a faculty member specifically interested in the areas where she'd like to work, politely seeking a contact is usually acceptable. The few graduate "scholarships" available are frequently tied to studies in specific areas, so the department may have information not "up front" at the general admissions office.

Most schools do require a GRE (graduate record exam) for entry into graduate studies; and if she hasn't already, she should immediately find out what's needed, and get the necessary test(s) scheduled. It can take a couple of months to schedule, and the tests are not given too frequently - especially if she'll have to travel to get to where she can take one(?), and if she needs one or more of the "specialized" tests.

And of course, search the web - for information from the colleges of choice, and for information about them from "outsider" sources.

Most students at this point "know just about everything" so she'll get through it. It's mom who needs (and gets) our support and good wishes, since her survival is less certain.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 10:27 PM

Go for Berkeley. "Post Modern" isn't a bad thing, and it's a dynamic approach to scholarship, one that generally promotes an interdisciplary approach to critical thinking.

For a nice music segue in this, Barre Toelken is involved in various aspects of anthropology/ethnography at U of Arizona. He is a fine collector and singer of folk songs. (I'd have to go look him up to tell you specifically his field, but he works a lot with the Navajo language).

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: catspaw49
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 10:37 PM

WEll Mort, you got lots of good advice and I'm sure she will be investigating both more in depth as well. The only thing I can add is this.....The two schools are very different, but not just in size. You know how things you have or do often "make a statement" about you or your beliefs? Both of these schools are well known and well recognized, very well respected in Soc.......But a degree from Johns Hopkins makes a far different statement than a degree from Berkeley. Have her do a little background checking on grads from both and let her determine which "road" she wants.

Uncle Pat--who would go to Berkeley

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 11:25 PM

Cspaw - THIS about the only legitimately rational thing... I have EVER read.... that you have written.

Mort....follow his advice.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 01:18 AM

Yes, two entirely different schools. Johns Hopkins has small classes, concentrates in certain fields and is located in the most interesting city on the east coast. They are justly world-famous for their medical school and medical science research. If interest lies in the application of DNA and other medical science advances to ethnology, it may be a good choice. Interdisciplinary studies are encouraged (history-anthropology, Institute for Global Studies, etc.).
Ethnology, as I said earlier, is a large tent- the aspect of interest must be selected before a useful recommendation can be made. The student and advisor are certainly in a better position to judge than any of us out here.
UCB is large, an attempt is made to cover everything including big money sports. Unfortunately some students get involved in politics and ridiculous protests rather than concentrating on their work. California would take some getting used to for many people.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: NicoleC
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 01:40 AM

Hmmm. As a Southerner/East Coaster from VA, I was mostly struck by 2 things when I moved to CA. 1) how short everyone was, and 2) how friendly everyone was. CA is, however, very diverse and that diversity can be somewhat assaulting for a while to someone (like I was) who was familiar with rather homogenous surroundings. I would think that an ethnography student would be prepared to take this in stride!

I went to a rich-kid "party" school (USC), but rarely partied and certainly wasn't rich. School reputation is not all; good educations can be found at almost any large university if the student wants it. But I worked in the entertainment industry, so going to USC was as much about making contacts and establishing credibility as it was about, well, them being the ones that offered me the most money to go there.   

'Spaw is 100% right -- she should spend some time looking at how the industry views the schools, and what their alumni are doing. The contacts that can be made through the teaching staff are also crucial, because that's likely the place where she'll get her first job offer.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: Morticia
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 09:51 AM

Gargoyle, I am sure you mean well but I have not TOLD my daughter what to do since she was 14 or so;she is her own woman and has been living away from home for three years now. I was merely expressing the fact that I would miss her, since visits will be reduced by her being at such a distance.

Further to that, I cannot follow Spaw or anyone else's advice, it is indeed her decision. I am merely using my kind and knowledgable friends in the States to get some real background to inform her decision, particularly as it would be an expensive and time consuming task to visit in person.

Thanks for all your help everyone, I have posted her a link and hopefully, it will help....information is power or so they tell me.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 12:09 PM

Hello, this is Morticia's daughter. I'm finding that it's none to easy to find out too much about the colleges from here. Wherever you look at tells you it's the best place to go. The lecturer also mentioned Wisconsin, does anyone know anything about that? The advice is really helpful, thank you

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: Morticia
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 03:00 PM

refresh

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: catspaw49
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 05:27 PM

I would ask you this........

When you are considering a school, what are your priorities?

Success of graduates in the field...and are they doing what I want to do?........What type of Social Work do you intend to do?

What is the campus life like? What about class sizes and the like? ..........Can you adjust to a small or large setting or are you more comfortable in one or the other?

What's it like to live in the area? ....You're going to be there for awhile and it's easier to get along some places then others.

There are a lot of things I don't know about you that only you can answer, but if you can line up some priorities/expectations out of what you're looking for, it would be a lot easier.   You can get a quality education at the Masters level from any number of schools here and I would be happy to help if I knew a little more about what your priorities of choice are. I have a lot of friends in Social Work and I can draw a lot from them too if you like.......You can post here or PM me.

This is a big country and like anyplace else it has a lot of differences from one place to the next. I know we'd all like to see you make the best choice for yourself so you get the learning experience you want along with the life experience that you can enjoy.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: Morticia
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 07:45 PM

Spaw, have I ever mentioned that I love you dearly????

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: Grab
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 01:39 PM

Go round the campuses (campi?) and towns and see which one works for you. If one's all concrete and tightly packed in and the paint's falling off everywhere, and the other's all trees and mellow and nice smart buildings, the choice is pretty obvious! :-) This applies to the uni in general, and also to your department in particular - you'll not infrequently find that some departments are the poor relatives and get stiffed in the funding.

Studying at a place you like will get you a better degree than studying at a place you hate. And even if it doesn't, you'll've had a better time whilst you're there, anyway! ;-)

Graham.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 01:59 PM

Unfortunately it won't be possible to go round campuses or anything like that. I'm not that bothered about the size of the campus. I'd like somewhere where I could carry out ethnographic research, it's not really social work I suppose it's kind of like doing a degree in people watching! My main strengths are in sociological research so I'd be looking for somewhere that has a good reputation in that kind of area. As for location I'm not that bothered really though it would need to be somewhere where its not too expensive to live. I really appreciate your help, thanks

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: NicoleC
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 03:31 PM

I didn't get to visit my campus, either. Maybe the departments could put you in touch with a current student? They could probably help with a lot of your questions.

Berkeley is in a pricey area, but it's manageable if you have a car and can commute from a little farther east. Or maybe they have student housing?

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: fretless
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 03:39 PM

Wait a minute. If you're talking about doing "ethnographic research" through a graduate program in the U.S., then you're equally likely to be interested in a grad program in (cultural) anthropology as one in sociology, at least in terms of how those fields are taught in the U.S.

The schools you are listing (Berkeley, JHop, Wisconsin) are all top ranked, but remember that graduate programs in the U.S. are very department rather than school/university focused. Worry less about the university's general reputation and character than about the indivdual scholars, course offerings, research opportunities, and fellowship opportunities in your department. Talk to people in your field as your best source of advice, at least as far as the academic decisions go.

Other sources can provide useful information regarding the related contexts of your academic choices. Baltimore, Berkeley, and Madison are very different cities and each offers different life opportunities. But completing your degree will take only a few years, so you're looking for a relatively short-term academic placement. The quality and compatibility of the academic program with your academic/career goals should be paramount in your decision.

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 05:07 PM

Guest, your post indicated that I made a made a good guess from "ethnology" that you did not want social work as such and might be interested in continuing to the doctorate level. I also take it that you have completed a batchelor's program at a good school.
Fretless gives good advice; a school with a good program in cultural anthropology (perhaps social studies-international studies minor) would, I think, be what you are hoping for. If you intend to do research, a doctorate is necessary and it is at the Master's level that you make the contacts that get you the teaching assistantships and scholarships. Getting a scholarship for Master's level may take a lot of work- Apply to several and be prepared to take second or third choice. Once you have a Master's, getting support becomes easier- you have the credentials and the faculty support.
All three schools you mention have excellent reputations and would provide the coverage you require. Get their course catalogues (some of this possible on line) to check on professors, specialties and advanced courses offered. I would add more schools to the list.
I got my master's at a large school, as did my wife, both of us veterans and able to live on the GI Bill. We could not afford the smaller schools, which we would have preferred. Getting support at this level, when one is still expected to take a variety of courses, is more dificult than the next step, the doctorate with a specialty. Our professors at the master's level advised on contacts and provided encomiums. One is definitely not encouraged to stay on for a doctorate (fear of inbreeding). I got a teaching assistantship and my wife (who did not wish to continue, a child had been born) landed a research assistantship at a state survey facility associated with the university. This gave us a roof until, a year later, we were able to get a university apartment for veterans. Housing is always tight at every university. If we had not been veterans, we would probably been stuck with inconvenient off-campus housing for the entire period.

Hmmmn, The University of Hawai'i at Manoa (section of Honolulu), 300 beautiful acres , a truly multicultural institution (in a state only 30 per cent white), offering much in the Pacific Rim field, excellent cultural anthropology choices, Japanese and Korean cooperative projects. Now If I were young again......!

Subject: RE: BS: Help on US colleges please?
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 07:45 PM

I'm just about to finish my BA but I've got an extra qualification in research and analysis so I've also done about half of a Masters.