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Origins: The Flying Cloud
DigiTrad:
PENNY EVANS
THE FLYING CLOUD
Related threads:
Lyr Req: John O'Halloran (Sean McCarthy) (23)
happy? - Apr 15 ('Flying Cloud' launch) (1)
Flying Cloud: History (13)
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Stephen R. Date: 11 Sep 04 - 07:32 PM I've been looking at "The Flying Cloud" recently and I will revive this thread after a year's dormancy to respond to some of the comments. Joanna C. Colcord includes it in _Songs of the American Sailormen_ (New York: W. W. Norton & Company, 1938), pp. 144-147. This is, however, a revision of an earlier collection, _Roll and Go: Songs of American Sailormen_ (Indianapolis: The Bobbs-Merrill Company, 1924); I haven't looked at a copy of this yet. The singer was Joseph MacGinnis, about whom I have no information. Colcord notes that he remembered the name of the F.C.'s nemesis imperfectly, but apparently thought it was the _Dunmore_. Colcord then comments: "I have found since found a references to a raid on the Chesapeake region by a privateer squadron under Admiral Collier during the War of 1812, which did sever damage to tidewater plantations and coastal shipping. One of the British vessesl was the _Dunmore_. The discovery adds on to the probability that this was a genuine contemporary ballad based on fact." Colcord also states: "This song probably dates from somewhere between the years 1819 and 1825, when the West Indies were finally cleared of pirates by the joint efforts of the United States and several of the European naval powers." There is a degree of verisimilitude here, but a number of problems remain. The name of the ship is so consistently the _Flying Cloud_ that it is hard to believe that this replaced an earlier name when the reputation of the historical clipper _The Flying Cloud_ made the name synonymous with speed under sail. It is possible that an earlier ship of the same name left no record other than the ballad, but this does not seem a likely hypothesis for the nineteenth century. Another issue is the narrator's original port of destination. It is Valparaiso in the versions of Captain Archie Spurling--see Fannie Hardy Eckstrom and Mary Winslow Smyth, _Minstrelsy of Maine: Folk-Songs and Ballads of the Woods and Coasts (Boston: Houghton Mifflen Company, 1927), p. 214--; of Harry Sutherland--see W. Roy Mackenzie, _Ballads and Sea Songs from Nova Scotia (Cambridge, Massachusetts: Harvard University Press, 1928), p. 283--; of Captain Henry Burke--see William Main Doerflinger, _Shantymen and Shantyboys: Songs of the Sailor and Lumberman_ (New York: The Macmillan Company, 1951), p. 136--; of Howard Morry--see Kenneth Peacock, _Songs of the Newfoundland Outports__, National Museum of Canada, Bulletin No. 197, Anthropoligical Series No. 65 (Ottawa: National Museum of Canada, 1965), Vol. 3, p. 843--; of Richard Hartlan--see Helen Creighton, _Songs and Ballads from Nova Scotia__ (New York: Dover Publications, 1966; this is a photo-reprint of the first edn, Toronto: J. M. Dent & Sons, 1932), p. 127; of Yankee John Galusha--see Anne Warner, _American Folk Songs from the Collection of Anne & Frank Warner_, Syracuse, New York: Syracuse University Press, 1984), p. 48; and of Clifford Wedge--see Edward D. "Sandy" Ives, _Drive Dull Care Away: Folksongs from Prince Edward Island_ (Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island: Institute of Island Studies, 1999. An impressive list. And the "Bellfrazer" or various other spellings of the same name sung by anonymous--see Michael Cassius Dean, _Flying Cloud: And One Hundred and Fifty other Old Time Songs and Ballads of Outdoor Men, Sailors, Lumber Jacks, Soldiers, Men of the Great Lakes, Railroadmen, Miners, etc._ (Virginia, Minnesota: The Quickprint, 1922; reprint edn, Norwood, Pennsylvania: Norwood Editions, 1973), p. 1; unspecified (the James Ewing who supplied an unpublished tune? an unidentified broadside?)--see Gavin Greig, _Folk-Song of the North-East_ (Hatboro, Pennsylvania: Folklore Associates, 1963), CXVIII--; and A. F. Nelson--see H. M. Belden, _Ballads and Songs Collected by the Missouri Folk-Lore Society_; _The University of Missouri Studies: A Quarterly of Research_, Vol. 15, No. 1 (1940), p. 129; sounds like a garbled version of "Valparaison." Otherwise the destined port is Bermuda in the versions some Boston newspaper of 1916 --see Roland Palmer Gray, _Songs and Ballads of the Maine Lumberjacks with Other Songs of Maine_ (Cambridge, Massachusetts: Harvard University Press, 1924; photo-reprint edn, Detroit: Singing Tower Press, 1969), p. 117--; anonymous--see Charles J. Finger, _Frontier Ballads Heard and Gathered (Garden City, New York: Doubleday Page & Company, 1927), p. 84--; and anonymous again--see Stan Hugill, _Shanties and Sailors' Songs_ (London: H. Jenkins, and New York: Frederick A. Praeger, 1969), p. 226. It is Baltimore in the version of Stephen White--see Elisabeth Bristol Greenleaf and Grace Yarrow Mansfield, __Ballads and Sea Songs of Newfoundland__ (Cambridge, Massachusetts: Harvard University Press, 1933), p.349, but this is probably the result of contamination from the F.C.'s home port, Baltimore in this and most versions. In Welcome Tilton's version--see Gale Huntington, "Folksongs from Martha's Vinyard," _Northeast Folklore_ 8 (1966): 36--the narrator stays at home in Waterford and meets the ill-fated Moore there. Well, Valparaison clearly wins in a democratic vote, but it makes little sense to me; why would the narrator go there, and why would Captain Moore leave from there to go slaving to Africa (especially if the trip took ten days or three weeks, which even for the Flying Cloud defies credulity)? Bermuda is more likely; but my preference goes to the once-reported "Beleeza" = Belize of Archie Lant--see Doerflinger, _Shanty Men and Shanty Boys_, p. 139. The captain who leads the narrator to his downfall is Moore in just about all versions, and William Moore if he has a Christian name. I suggest that this is a reminiscence of the historical William Moore, the rebellious mate killed by Captain Kidd, who was later hanged for the deed, although if a respectable captain had done it it would certainly have been written of as justifiable homicide. Moore is mentioned in the Captain Kidd good-night ballad (is this why Kidd, William in history, is always renamed Robert in the song? Perhaps someone in the early history of the transmission felt that two Williams, one the slayer and the other the victim, were too many for one song and rebaptized the captain). As for the very reasonable question of how come, if the F.C. was so blooming fast, the nemesis ship, whatever her name, caught her, there is an answer in several versions: "a chain shot took our mizzenmast, of course we fell behind" (Creighton, _Songs & Ballads from Nova Scotia_, p. 129), et al. The other ship surprised the F.C within range of cannon (come on, you've seen "Master and Commander"--these things happen!); the F.C. ran before the wind and would have escaped, but a lucky shot from a chaser on the pursuer's fo'c'sle destroyed the mizzen rigging and probable fouled the mainmast's canvas too. And I cannot agree that the narrator justified the slaving voyage and was remorseful only about the subsequent piracy. In several versions he expresses real compassion for the slaves and regrets the horrible injustice commited against them. I expect that this subplot, which as someone has already noted is not essential to the main plot, survivied in the song because of anti-slavery sentiment. The song never spread in the Confederacy; the version in the Missouri collection is really from Wisconsin. It did spread inland. Probably originating in Ireland, it became a favorite in New England and the Canadian Atlantic coast among seafarers. But since sailing was much curtailed in winter months, many sailors worked in the woods during that slack season, and it became even more of a favorite among loggers. That's how it got to Wisconsin and how it bacame one of Finger's Frontier Ballads. Horace Beck tells us--_Folklore and the Sea_ Middletown, Connecticut: Published for the Marine Historical Association by Wesleyan University Press, 1973; reprint edn, Edison, New Jersey: Castle Books, 1999), p. 165--". . . we are told that when times were hard and jobs were few in Michigan, no man would be hired to work in a lumber camp without being able to sing all of 'The Flying Cloud'." I still have some reading to do on this, but if anyone cares to resume conversation in this thread, it might be fun. Stephen |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Dave Ruch Date: 28 Aug 03 - 04:23 PM You are wonderful, Art! Thanks. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Art Thieme Date: 28 Aug 03 - 12:49 PM Dave Ruch, I will try to post Yankee John's version of the song, as collected by Frank Warner, later today---if nobody does that first. Also, Dave, your cassette of Lyman King etc plus Utah's radio show featuring my tapes of Paul Durst will go out to you later today also. (Thurs. Aug, 28, '03) Art Thieme |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Art Thieme Date: 28 Aug 03 - 12:42 PM Ninety-one year old Charlie Cardinal of Chippewa Falls, Wisconsin (sometimes called Chippytown Falls) sang a great version of "De Lumber Scow Julie Plante" in French dialect for Judy Rose and Tom Martin-Erikson of Wisconsin Public Radio back in the late 1970s. I once had this lumber camp version on a tape, but no longer--- or so it seems. If I find it I will post it. Mr. Cardinal was found in a nursing home with every memory of those old times completely intact. Street names, place names that were now different, who was where and when, who owned what and who they sold it to coplete with the dates for all of it. Simply amazing. Mr. Charlie Cardinal originally sang his songs for the great collector of Wisconsin folksongs and lore, Helene Stratman-Thomas in the 1940s. Art Thieme |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: radriano Date: 28 Aug 03 - 11:22 AM "The Flying Cloud" is one of my favorite ballads. If you look at versions that contain all three elements discussed earlier you will realize that the main character of the song is lamenting the fact that he got caught for piracy. The slavery aspect of the song is almost incidental to the story and that's what makes the song. The slavery is condoned but robbing merchant ships is not. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 27 Aug 03 - 11:46 AM The one collected by Frank Warner? I don't have the book, but oddly enough I was looking at a friend's copy only yesterday. Probably someone else will have it to hand, but I'll see what I can do just in case. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Dave Ruch Date: 27 Aug 03 - 11:21 AM Does anyone have full text from the "Yankee" John Galusha version of this song? |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: GUEST,Q Date: 23 Feb 03 - 01:49 PM Many thanks for filling out the tunes- something I should learn to do. |
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Subject: Tune Add: THE FLYING CLOUD (from Kenneth Peacock) From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 23 Feb 03 - 01:43 PM Here are the two tunes printed by Peacock (see Q's post above). Both are versions of tunes used for quite a number of songs. The first goes with the text given; the second was printed with one verse only. Whether it's intrinsically superior to the first I wouldn't like to say, but it's certainly more interesting. X:1 T:The Flying Cloud S:Howard Morry, Ferryland, July 1951 Z:Kenneth Peacock B:Songs of the Newfoundland Outports, 1965 vol. 3 p. 842 N:PEA 10 No. 63 N:Roud 1802 L:1/8 Q:1/4=100 M:6/8 K:C (C/D/)|E2 E D2 C|(2DG B2 A/ A/|(GF) D C2 B,| w:Come_ all ye ram-bling sai-lor boys, take a warn_ing here from C4 z G|c2 B (2AB|(2cD D2 E /E/| w:me, I'm bound in hea-vy i-rons strong for the (2FG B2 A|G4 z G|c2 B (2AB| w:crime of pi-ra-cy; With eigh-teen more I (cD) D D2 E|(2FG B2 A|G4 z (C/D/)| w:am_ con-demned in sor-row to com-plain, For_ E2 E D2 C|(2DG B2 A|(GF) D C2 B,|C3 z2|] w:plun-dering and for burn-ing ships down on_ the Spa-nish Main. X:2 T:The Flying Cloud S:Mrs Mary Ann Galpin, Codroy, Sept 1961 Z:Kenneth Peacock B:Songs of the Newfoundland Outports, 1965 vol. 3 p. 844 N:PEA 195 No. 1153 N:Roud 1802 L:1/8 Q:1/4=100 M:3/2 K:G (FG)|A2 B2 A6 A2| w:I've_ of-ten seen that M:2/2 G2 (ED) C2 D D|(EG) (GE) D3 C| w:clip-per_ ship when the wind_ it_ blew a D6 C C|(3D2D2D2 c3 c|(BA) G2 A2 B c w:gale, With her top-sails and garn-sails set_ a-loft tak-ing (dc) A2 F3 F|G6 C C|D2 D2 c3 c| w:six-*teen from the rail. We were oft-times chased by (BA) G2 A2 (Bc)|d3 c (AG) F2|G6 FG| w:men-*of-war, fri-*gates and mi-*ners too, But to M:3/2 A2 B2 A6 A2| w:o-ver-haul that M:2/2 G2 (ED) C2 D D|(EG) (GE) D3 C|D6|] w:Fly-ing_ Cloud it was more_ than_ they could do. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: GUEST,Q Date: 22 Feb 03 - 04:25 PM Dungeness seems to have appeared late in the song versions, as a substitute for (misheard?) Dungeon in the Hollander text. The only constant name in the song is "Flying Cloud." In the Newfoundland version (above) the Spanish ship, Sanvo, is misheard San --- or Santa ----, if not completely an invention. The lucky shot that hit the mast was the Flying Cloud's downfall in that version; nothing to do with speed before the wind. In the old naval chases I read about as a child, becalming could stop any ship. Reading through George Washington's diaries, most daily additions have a description of the weather conditions. He wrote several times of "flying clouds." The ship's name may have come from one of the builder's remembering this, or another's colorful weather comments. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Les from Hull Date: 22 Feb 03 - 03:55 PM Abby - the only Royal Navy ship called Dungeness was a WW2 repair ship/depot ship. She could do 11 knots. I've also heard Dunmore as the warship's name. There was never an HMS Dunmore. IMHO we're dealing with a song whose origins are probably a bit land-based. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: GUEST,Q Date: 22 Feb 03 - 01:57 PM Read the story and see a painting of the real Flying Cloud at: Flying Cloud |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: GUEST,Q Date: 22 Feb 03 - 01:48 PM Intrigued by the line in the Hollander version posted by Malcolm Douglas about selling the slaves on the Quebec shore. Were they used as loggers or to work in the sugar maple forests? The "Balfrasur" could be Valparaiso. The Flying Cloud shows up in another guise in the Lakes song, "De Scow Jean La Plante." Here are three verses of dat epic. Here kom dem fas' scow dey call Flying Cloud, Cry Capitaine Batteece an' she's yall planty loud: "Put de wheel port, look out fo' yo' head, An' tol' Joe, de cook' fo' trow out de lead!" Joe trow de lead and yall, "Leventeen feet!" An'Batteece she's cry out, "Let go down do main sheet! Trow de dog ovaire an' all yo' can spare, We mus' beat dat scow boat 'cross Lac Sainte Claire!" ---------\ De mornin' she's kom wid de sun shinin' bright, But de Flying Cloud scow she's nowhere in sight, For her centerboar' catch on wan beeg catfeesh line, An' dat was de reason she's got lef' behin'! First printed in The Detroit Free Press, April 10, 1927, and reprinted in "Windjammers, Songs of the Great Lakes Sailors," pp. 161-162, Walton and Grimm, 2002, Wayne State University Press (Be sure and get a copy while it is still in print). |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Abby Sale Date: 22 Feb 03 - 12:59 AM All is pretty much said above but the song is so compelling and frustrating as to origin that there are many, many comments on it. Several of the more sea-oriented comentators make the point strongly that the ship couldn't in any way have been the famous clipper. They go to lengths since they are deeply insulted that one of the greatest of all sailing ships might be so tainted and slandered. It is stressed that every day of the ship's history is recorded in existing logs from the day it launched till it died. Apparently, not only was there never a pirate ship of this name but no Flying Cloud at all before 1851 back to the early 1600's. Another interesting aspect is the throw-away comment in Rickaby. In his great early study of Michigan logging songs he (like Doerflinger) records the many examples of sailors working off-season as loggers and bringing the sea songs with them. It was said (he said) that no one could get a job in a logging camp unless he could sing "The Flying Cloud" straight through. Exaggeration as this may be, it shows how popular the song was in North American tradition. I sing the version from Palmer & I sang it a couple of months back at the local club. One person asked, if the FC actually: 9.The Flying Cloud was a Yankee ship of five hundred tons or more; She could outsail any clipper ship hailing out of Baltimore. then how come she got caught by the man-o'-war, the Dungeness? This showed that a) at least one person was actually listening and b) one needn't take ballads totally literally. |
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE FLYING CLOUD (from Kenneth Peacock) From: GUEST,Q Date: 21 Feb 03 - 09:05 PM Lyr. Add: THE FLYING CLOUD Come all ye rambling sailor boys, take a warning here from me, I'm bound in heavy irons strong for the crime of piracy; With eighteen more I am condemmed in sorrow to complain, For plundering and burning ships down on the Spanish Main. When I was young and innocent, my heart it knew no guile, In a happy home I lived content, my parents on me did smile, But drinking and bad company have made a wreck of me. Take warning all by my downfall and beware of piracy. My name is Henry Anderson as you might understand, Born in the town of Waterford in Erin's lovely land; My parents reared me tenderly in the fear of God likewise, They little thought I'd die in scorn 'neath Cuba's sunny skies. My father bound me to a trade in Waterford's dear town, He bound me to a cooper whose name was William Brown. I served my master faithfully for eighteen months or more, I shipped on board the Ocean Queen bound for Valparaiso's alien shore. It happened in Valparaiso that we met one Captain More, He commanded the clipper Flying Cloud sailed out of Baltimore. The Flying Cloud was a clipper ship of eight hundred tons or more, She could easily sail around any ship sailing out of Baltimore. The canvasses white as the driven snow, on eight there was no stake, Those seventy five brass mounted guns she carried on her deck, Her iron chests and magazines were safely stored below; She had a Long Tom between her spars on a pivot inked in gold. I shipped on board the Flying Cloud on a slaving voyage to go, To the bonny shores of Africa where sugar canes do grow, ------------------- ------------------- And in a short time after we reached the African shore, Five hundred of those proud Africans from homes and friends we tore; We brought them boldly to the ship and stored them down below, And eighteen inches to a man was all they had to stow. And in a short while after we reached the Arabian shore, We sold them to the planters there as slaves forever more, To toil in the rice- and sugar-fields beneath the burning sun, And to wear away their weary lives till their courage was won. And when our money was all spent we came on board again; Captain More then called us all on deck and said to us, "My men, There's gold in plenty to be had forever on the Main, If you'll agree and come with me I'll tell you how it's gained." "When we have the fastest sailing ship that ever crossed the seas, Or ever frayed a main topsail into a heavy breeze." And then he cried, "My bully boys, 'tis with me you'll remain, We'll fly aloft the pirate flag and scour the Spanish Main." They all agreed except five brave lads who told them to land, And two of them were Boston boys, two more from Newfoundland, The other was an Irisnman belonging to Tramore. I wished to God I'd joined them now and landed safe on shore. We robbed and plundered manys a ship down on the Spanish Main, Caused many a widow and orphan child in sorrow to complain; We made their crews all walk the plank we held all o'er the rail, The saying of our captain was, 'dead men tell no tales.' We were often chased by men-o'war and English skippers too, But to over-haul our goodly ship was more than they could do, Always in vain astern of us their cannon roared so loud, But none of them by any means could match the Flying Cloud. At length a Spanish man-o'war the Sanvo hove in view, She fired a shot across our bows, a signal to heave to; But we paid no attention but ran with the wind A main shot struck our mizzen mast and we soon fell behind. We cleared our decks for action as she ranged up 'long side, And soon along her quarterdeck there ran a crimson tide, We fought till Captain More was killed and eighty of his men, A bombshell set our ship on fire, we had to surrender then. Prisoners we were taken and into prison cast, Tried and found guilty and to be hanged at last. See what I have come to by my unlucky hand, For it's on the gallows I must die by the laws of the Spanish land. So fare you well sweet Waterford town, and the girl I loved most dear, Your voice like music soft and sweet I never more will hear, No more to kiss your ruby lips or press your lily-white hand, For it's on the gallows I must die by the laws of the Spanish land. Kenneth Peacock, 1965, "Songs of the Newfoundland Outports," Vol. 3, pp. 842-845. Sung by Howard Morrey, Ferryland, Nfld., 1951. Sheet music shown. Another fragment, with a "superior" tune, is shown, sung by Mrs. Mary Ann Galpin, Codroy, Nfld., 1961. I've often seen that clipper ship, when the wind it blew a gale, With her top-sails and garn-sails set aloft taking sixteen from the rail. We were ofttimes chased by men-of-war, frigates and miners too, But to overhaul that Flying Cloud it was more than they could do. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: GUEST,Q Date: 21 Feb 03 - 03:12 PM A long version of "The Flying Cloud" is given in Kenneth Peacock, 1965, "Songs of the Newfoundland Outports," vol. 3, pp. 842-845. The narrator is Henry Anderson, and he meets Captain More in Valparaiso. Sheet music to two tunes is provided, one of which Peacock says is much superior. The slaves are sold on the Arabian shore. The Flying Cloud was accosted by the Spanish ship Sanvo, and Captain More and 80 of his men were killed; the remainder taken prisoner and sentenced to hang. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Declan Date: 23 Dec 02 - 11:01 AM The Irish lad who went on shore at Quebec is likely to have been from Tramore than Timore. Tramore is a seaside village near Waterford where Hollander or Holohan came from. There may be a place called Timore, but I've never heard of it. |
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Subject: Tune Add: WILLIAM HOLLANDER / THE FLYING CLOUD From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 22 Dec 02 - 02:30 PM X:1 T:William Hollander (The Flying Cloud) S:James Ewen, Aberdeenshire, 1906. Z:Gavin Greig. B:Patrick Shuldham-Shaw and Emily B. Lyle (eds.) The Greig-Duncan Folk Song Collection, vol.I, 1981. L:1/8 Q:1/4=100 M:4/4 K:D HA2|D2 D2 E2 F2|G2 B2 A2 F2|G2 E2 D2 C2| w:My name is Wil-liam Hol-lan-der as you may un-der- D6 A A|d2 d d B2 B2|=c B3 A2 G2|F2 D2 F2 G2| w:stand I was born in the town of Wa-ter-ford in Er-in's hap-py A6 A2|d2 d2 B2 B2|(=c2 B2) A2 G2|F2 D2 F2 G2| w:land. I be-ing young and can-*ty kind for-tune on me A6 A2|D2 D2 E2 F2|B4 A2 F2|G2 E2 D2 C2|D6|] w:smiled My par-ents doat-ed on me I was their on-ly child. Note that the first verse as given with Greig's staff notation omits "then" in line three, which is however given in the text transcription. |
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Subject: Lyr Add: WILLIAM HOLLANDER (from Greig-Duncan) From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 17 Dec 02 - 10:08 PM Here's the 1906 set from the Greig-Duncan Collection. You can tell from the text that it wasn't new at that time, and had probably spent some while in tradition already. WILLIAM HOLLANDER (Noted from James Ewen, Aberdeenshire, 1906.) My name is William Hollander as you may understand I was born in the town of Waterford in Erin's happy land. I being young and canty then kind fortune on me smiled My parents doated on me I was their only child. My father bound me to a trade in Waterford's town He bound me to a cooper there in the name of William Brown. I served my master faithfully for eighteen months and more Till I slipped on board the Ocean Queen bound for Balfrasur's shore. After some time sailing we arrived at Balfrasur's shore Lying in harbour there I met in wi' Captain More Which asked me to ship with him a slavish voyage to go To the burning shores of Africa where the coffee seed do grow. The Flying Cloud like a gallant ship carrying six hundred tons and more She could easily have sailed from any port she sailed out of Baltimore With her main top gallant and her mizzen sail set and the wind being after beast You'd often seen that gallant ship carrying sixteen of the reel. After some time sailing we arrived at the African shores Till five hundred of these poor souls from their native land we tore. The crew they marched them on the deck and stowed them down below Till scarce eighteen inches to each man was all they had to go So we set sail the very next day with our cargo of slaves But better far for these poor souls they had been in their graves For the fever and the plague set in which carried them half away We dragged their bodies on the deck and heaved them in the sea. After some time sailing we arrived at the Quebec shore Sold them to the planters there to be slaves for evermore The cotton and the rice to hue beneath the burning sun To lead a hard and wretched life till their career was run. After our money being all spent we set out to the seas again The captain stood upon the deck and spoke unto his men He said that there was going to be had if we with him remained We'd hize aloft a pirate flag and scour the Spanish Main. We all agreed except five young lads so they were told to land Two of them were Boston boys and two from Newfoundland The other was an Irish boy belonging to Timore I wish if I had joined these lads and gone with them on shore. We sank and plundered many's the ship down by yon Spanish main Leaving many a widow and orphan to remain The crew they marched them on the deck gave them a watery grave As the saying of our captain a dead man tells no tale. Twas on the twentieth of November the Dungeon heaved in view She fired a shot across our boom for a signal to hold to But we no answer gave to her but kept before the wind Till a chain cut our mizzen mast it was then we fell behind. We prepared our boat for action as you soon shall know We fought till Captain Moor got killed and eighty of his crew ........ Till a boom shell set our ship on fire and we'll have to surrender now. Patrick Shuldham-Shaw and Emily B. Lyle (eds.) The Greig-Duncan Folk Song Collection, vol.I, 1981. Tune to follow. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: toadfrog Date: 17 Dec 02 - 06:06 PM Thanks all, & especially Masato and Malcom. This is considerably more information than I had expected. And actual proof that musical threads are still possible! |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 15 Dec 02 - 03:18 PM Those three elements are all present in the 1906 Scottish set. The ships there are The Flying Cloud and The Dungeon. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: GUEST,Q Date: 15 Dec 02 - 02:18 PM When did the three elements of the song came together (disgruntled apprentice, blackbirder, pirate). Were they there from the start (the ca. 1906 referenced version cited by Malcolm Douglas)? With red face I admit that I should have checked Lomax 1934, otherwise I would not have attributed the composite to the "folk song era." It is the kind of song McColl loved to sing, and the two are stuck together in my mind. Now it seems that the song may be of 1860-1900 vintage, when pirate songs were very popular (long after the western pirates' heyday). The Lomax version (ABFS)is an admitted composite in which the Flying Cloud is a "Spanish ship" of 500 tons, not the American ship. Where did this come from? The tune in Lomax is "from Shay's More Drunken Friends and Pious Companions (New York)." What else has this tune been used for, and what other tunes have been used for "Flying Cloud"? |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Don Firth Date: 15 Dec 02 - 01:06 PM FWIW, in Songs of American Sailormen, Joanna C. Colcord, Bramhall House, New York, 1938, Colcord says the following:— "This was the era when Baltimore stood third of all American ports is a shipping center, but neither the Flying Cloud nor Captain Moore has been identified through the literature of the times. The ship should not, of course, be confused with the famous American clipper of the same name, which was not built until 1851.There follows an excellent version of the ballad, complete with tune. I first heard it sung by Dick Wilder, Pirate Songs and Ballads, Elektra EKL 18, (19" LP), 1954. He sang it without accompaniment, which is the way I do it. With this song, I think an accompaniment actually detracts from the impact of the story. The only time I ever heard anything about Dick Wilder was that one very good record. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: John Moulden Date: 15 Dec 02 - 12:41 PM The most interesting thing about this is really two things - that no ballad sheet versions are known and yet the song was so widespread early in 20th Century that it must have been disseminated in print or be much older than mid-19th. The version commonly sung in Britain is that spread by Ewan MacColl in his performances or in The Singing Island - it is attributed to the singing of one Barney Hand from Belfast )of whom no-one has otherwise heard.) |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Charley Noble Date: 15 Dec 02 - 10:48 AM Nice notes on this old mystery. Charley Noble |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: EBarnacle1 Date: 15 Dec 02 - 09:34 AM Ask Liam's Brother. He sings it regularly and, I believe, cites his own interpretation in his book. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: masato sakurai Date: 15 Dec 02 - 09:26 AM From Albert B. Friedman, The Viking Book of Folk Ballads of the English-Speaking World (Viking, 1959, 1963, p. 411): How and when the ballad originated remains a mystery. The Flying Cloud was Donald McKay's trimmest California clipper. Built in 1851, she set a record that same year by plowing from New York around Cape Horn to San Francisco in eighty-nine days and twenty hours--a record not yet beaten. Of a much less fortunate design, the slow Ocean Queen served her owners as an immigrant boat during the 1850s. Neither was ever a slave or pirate ship. Their names were borrowed arbitrarily to grace a tale with which the ships had nothing to do. The events the ballad describes must have happened, if they ever really happened, in the 1820s, when Britain, Spain, and the United States were making a concerted drive to stamp out piracy and unlicensed "blackbirding" in West Indian waters. While Hollahan (the usual form of the name) was in Newgate awaiting trial, some ballad writer may have got hold of the young lrish cooper's story and spun it into a broadside goodnight, as an earlier writer had done for Captain Kidd. But there is no record of a Hollahan trial and no broadside print. Horace Beck argues mistily (JAF, 66:123) that "The Flying Cloud" is a modernized combination of two lost mid-eighteenth-century pieces about Caribbean piracy. More arresting, though not quite proved, is William Doerflinger's suggestion in Shantymen and Shantyboys (1951, pp. 135, 334-35) that the ballad was inspired by a twelve-and-a-half cent temperance tract "purporting to be the confession of one of the crew of the notorious Benito de Soto, on the eve of his execution in Cadiz in 1829." Those who sang "The Flying Cloud" in dockside dives and inland taverns were merely amused, we may be sure, by the cautionary sting in the tail stanza. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: masato sakurai Date: 15 Dec 02 - 04:17 AM "The Flying Cloud [textual transcription]" (sung by Warde Ford; recorded by Sidney Robertson Cowell in Central Valley, California on December 27, 1938) is in the California Gold: Northern California Folk Music from the Thirties collection. It begins with "My name is Edward Anderson. As you shall understand, I was born in the City of Waterford In [?] happy lonely land". The collection has also Ford's sound recording [fragment]. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: masato sakurai Date: 15 Dec 02 - 03:47 AM From G Malcolm Laws, Jr., American Balladry From British Broadsides (American Folkore Society, 1957, pp. 154-155): K 28 THE FLYING CLOUD The narrator becomes an apprentice to a cooper in Waterford but leaves him to ship on board the Ocean Queen, bound (usually) for Valparaiso. There he falls in with Captain Moore, commander of the Flying Cloud, which goes to Africa for a cargo of slaves, many of whom die on the return trip to Cuba. Moore decides to turn pirate and all the crew but five join him. The pirates rob and plunder many ships on the Spanish Main. Often pursued by warships, they outrun them all until finally a ship shoots away their mizzenmast. In the fight that follows, Captain Moore and many of his men are killed and the rest are captured. The narrator and his fellows next appear in Newgate under sentence of death. My name is Edward Holleran, as you may understand, I was born in County Waterford, in Erin's lovely land; I being young and in my prime, my age scarce twenty-one, My parents doted on me, I being their only son. Eckstorm, 214, 16d (N.S. via Me.). Belden, 128, 15d (Mich. via Wis.). Colcord, 145, 15d, m. Creighton, 126, 17d, m. (N.S.) Creighton and Senior, 223, 15d; 2d (N.S.). Dean, 1, 16d (Minn.). Doerflinger, 135, 17d, m. (N.S.); 3d, m. (N.Y.) Notes and refs. Finger, 84, 12d, m. Gray, 116, 24 sts. (from a Boston newspaper); 12d sts. (reprinted from JAF 35, 370) Greenleaf, 349, 30, m. (Nfld.). Leach, 778, 30 (Me.). Lomax, Amer. Ballads, 504, 13d. m. (Mo.). Mackenzie, 283, 16d (N.S.) Refs. Rickaby, 145, 15d, m. (N.D.). Thompson, 39, 15d (N.Y. a composite text) . Shay, 183, 15d, m. JAF 35, 370, 12d (Minn. A composite text). Greig, cxviii, 12d ("William Hollander"). Doerflinger, 334-335, feels that the author of this ballad was influenced by a prose temperance pamphlet of 1830 entitled "Dying Declaration of Nicholas Fernandez, Who with Nine Others were Executed . . . for Piracy and Murder on the High Seas". Most of the parallels he cites, however, are commonplaces in crime literature of this type. For an enlightening analysis of the ballad see Horace P. Beck, "The Riddle of 'The Flying Cloud'", JAF 66, 123-133. From Library of Congress Online Catalogue: Dying declaration of Nicholas Fernandez, who with nine others were executed... LC Control Number: 42043486 Type of Material: Book (Print, Microform, Electronic, etc.) Brief Description: Fernandez, Nicholas. [from old catalog] Dying declaration of Nicholas Fernandez, who with nine others were executed in front of Cadiz harbour, December 29, 1829. For piracy and murder on the high seas. Translated from a Spanish copy by Ferdinand Bayer. Annexed is a solemn warning to youth (and others) to beware of the baneful habit of intemperance ... [New York?] 1830. 36 p. incl. front. 20 cm. ~Masato |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 15 Dec 02 - 01:00 AM The earliest set listed in the Roud Index (where it is number 1802) which has a definite date is one which Gavin Greig got from James Ewan (somewhere in Aberdeenshire) in 1906, called William Hollander. (Greig-Duncan Folk Song Collection, vol.I p.93, 1981). The song is very rare in Britain and Ireland, though; most examples seem to be American or Canadian, and to date from the 1930s or later. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: toadfrog Date: 15 Dec 02 - 12:43 AM GUEST Q: That makes good sense. I just don't want to believe it. The Trad. Ballad index, below, has a number of references. The only one I am able to check is Lomax, the 13th edition from 1955. The name of the singer seems to vary a lot. DT has Arthur Hollandin. Lomax says, Gilbert Howdelling. Below, we have Edward Hollohan, and my CD says Edmund Hallahan. Flying Cloud, The [Laws K28]DESCRIPTION: Singer Edward (Hollohan) abandons the cooper's trade to be a sailor. At length he falls in with Captain Moore, a brutal slaver. Moore later turns pirate. When his ship is finally taken, the remaining sailors are sentenced to death AUTHOR: unknown EARLIEST DATE: 1894 KEYWORDS: sailor slavery pirate execution gallows-confession FOUND IN: US(MA,MW,NE,So) Canada(Mar,Newf) REFERENCES (10 citations): Laws K28, "The Flying Cloud" Doerflinger, pp. 135-139, "The Flying Cloud" (2 texts, 2 tunes) Leach, pp. 778-781, "The Flying Cloud" (1 text) Friedman, p. 411, "The Flying Cloud" (1 text, 1 tune) Warner 2, "The Flying Cloud" (1 text, 1 tune) FSCatskills 115, "The 'Flying Cloud'" (1 text, 1 tune) Lomax-ABFS, pp. 504-507, "The Flying Cloud" (1 text, 1 tune) Botkin-AmFolklr, pp. 845-847, "The Flying Cloud" (1 text, 1 tune) Darling-NAS, pp. 98-100, "The Flying Cloud" (1 text) DT 409, FLYCLOUD* RECORDINGS: Warde Ford, "The Flying cloud" [fragment] (AFS 4202 B1, 1938; tr.; in AMMEM/Cowell) Notes: Doerflinger notes that there is no pirate ship known to have carried the name "The Flying Cloud." He suggests that the story is based on the book The Dying Declaration of Nicholas Fernandez, based loosely on the life of one of Benito de Soto's pirate crew (Fernandez was executed in 1829). - RBW File: LK28 |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: GUEST,Q Date: 15 Dec 02 - 12:05 AM Almost looks like three ideas in the song; in other words cobbled from an early 19th century apprentice song to which was added a modern anti-slavery ballad, and a pirate song (very popular in the late 19th century). I believe that it originated in the folk song era, 1950s-1960s. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Charcloth Date: 14 Dec 02 - 11:53 PM I don't know if this is what you are looking for or not but, "The Flying Cloud" was a clipper ship built by Shipwright Donald McKay, She was launched in 1851. Her first voyage she averaged 314 miles per day for 4 days. Among the captains she had were Cpt. Creesy, Cpt. Alexander Winsor. Her crew was made up of 101 men 1 Cpt., 4 mates, 2 Boatswains, 2 Carpenters, 2 Sailmakers, 3 Stewards, 2 cooks, 75 Able seamen, & 10 "boys before the mast" she was burned for whatever metal they could salvage in June of 1875 See the book "The Frigate Constitution & Other Historical Ships" I hope this was useful Charcloth |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: Richie Date: 14 Dec 02 - 10:33 PM There's a "Flying Cloud" or "Flying Cloud Cotillion" that's a fiddle from the early 1900's maybe earlier. I doubt that this is the same song as it's usually an instrumental. There's also a 'Flying Cloud' memtioned in Levy sollection but it's a different song. Richie |
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Subject: RE: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: toadfrog Date: 14 Dec 02 - 09:34 PM Correction. Traditional ballad Index says 1894. A typo. |
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Subject: Origins: The Flying Cloud From: toadfrog Date: 14 Dec 02 - 09:31 PM The song, THE FLYING CLOUD (Laws K28?)is a good ballad. It sure does sould like it was originally a broadside, maybe from the mid 19th Century. So far as I can make out, there are no Mudcat threads on the song, no mention in Bodleian, and nothing on the net except versions of the lyrics and discographic references. The Traditional Ballad Index gives the "earliest mention" as 1896, states it may have been based on a novel about a Spanish pirate, and observes that no pirate ship known as the "flying cloud" is known to have existed. (Citing Doerflinger, which I am not familiar with. The discussion of slavery in the song suggests that it might have originally been a political tract, although a long, Irish or pseudo-Irish, nautical ballad seems like an odd choice of vehicle for an anti-slavery tract. In fact, so far as I know the political "folksong" is more a mid-20th Century phenomenon. Does anyone know more about it? |
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