BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Teribus
Date: 19 May 03 - 08:22 AM

Thanks for the corrections Walrus,

On the P-51:

It's design specifications and requirements were driven entirely by the RAF in the form of an order from the British Purchasing Commission in 1940. Originally powered with an Allison engine, trials showed the aircraft to be best suited to aerial recon and ground attack, as it's performance dropped off dramatically above 12,000ft.

The British modified the airframes of two Allison engined Mustangs to mount Rolls-Royce Merlin engines. Combined with the aircraft's low drag airframe and laminar flow wings, the new engine provided an aircraft with truly staggering, at the time, top end speed.

One saying coined during WW II that describes the Mustang well:

"The Mustang won't do what a Spitfire does, but it does it over Berlin"

P51s had a staggering range upwards of 2,000 miles (full operational distance for most bombers) when fitted with drop-tanks. I have the pilots notes for the type including some quirks, they used to fly bomber escort for American day-light raids over Germany. Initially they would use the fuel in the external tanks first. If engaged early in the mission, these tanks had to be jettisoned. The main fuel tank was in the fuselage just behind the pilot, for a short period around the time when the tank was two-thirds full, the aircraft became very difficult to trim and awkward to handle in combat. This effect apparently did not last long but, in the pilots words was "unsettling".

Both the Whirlwind and the Mosquito were based on the DH88 design.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 19 May 03 - 11:26 AM

The Whirlwind is an interesting one, produced by Westland, but not in very great numbers. I'm still hoping Tamiya will do a 1/48 kit of it at some point.

The Me-262 deserves mention here, since people are getting into WWII planes. It's a gorgeous looking airframe, and was far and away the most advanced fighter of that war.

Another interesting and rare bird is the Kyushu Shinden, a Japanese fighter with an immense six-bladed pusher propellor and a canard design (tail at the front, wings at the back). It would have made a perfect configuration for a jet engine, but they used a conventional radial engine instead, and it was very fast and heavily armed (four 30 mm cannon in the nose, like the Me-262).

And my favourite Japanese fighter to fly: The Ki-84 Hayate (Frank)...just a superb fighter in every way.

Lockheed's P-38 Lightning is neat too...totally unique in appearance and very effective.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Les from Hull
Date: 19 May 03 - 11:59 AM

Leprechaun - that Dehavilland is a de Havilland, and the company made a number of different models that made it into squadron service. The fighers were the DH2 - a pusher biplane single seater that helped overcome the Fokker Menace (Eindekkers) and the DH5 was a tractor biplane with a curious backward stagger. And I wouldn't really believe anything that Mr Fokker said either. A notorious self-publicist and truth stretcher!

So my favourite WW1 plane? Siemens-Schuckert DIV for a fighter, but for real fun check out the German R-planes like the Staakens. The Putnam book 'The German Giants' (ISBN 0 85177 812 7) gives full details of design and operation.

The Whirlwind was a Westland design (WEW Petter) and I don't think it was based on the DH Comet, although it looked similar. It did 360mph, entered squdron service in June 1940 and had four 20mm cannon. But the Rolls Royce Peregrine engines were a bit suspect so production finished in 1942. A later Petter design, the Welkin, was designed to operate up to 44,000ft, but the German high altitude bombers and reccy 'planes never materialsed so they were never issued to a squadron.

The P51 was a North American design (Raymond Rice and Edgar Schuel) which came about when the company said they could produce a new 'plane rather than the Curtiss Hawk 81A-1 (P40 Warhawk) us Brits had asked them to make for us. From order to prototype in 120 days!

Favourites for WW2? It's got to be the 'wooden wonder' the de Havilland Mosquito - unarmed fast bomber, photo reconnaissance, night fighter, day fighter, maritime strike, even a carrier-based torpedo reconnaissance just after the war. Along with the Ju88 it did everything, but was a later design than the Junkers, and better-looking as well. But for pure looks only - the Martin-Baker MB5.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: The Walrus
Date: 19 May 03 - 03:38 PM

On the P-51 (sorry, creeping the thread back to WWII), there is a story, (probably apocraphal)about the external fuel tanks, apparently they were made of a 'paper-derived' composite (IIRC a dense, heavy, resin filled, cardboard like material, suitably proofed, with raw rubber interlining and aluminium foil coatings).
The story goes that before they went into service an enquiry went 'up the line' to the technical branch (or whatever it's called)of the USAAF as to the feasibility of these tanks being offered.
Such were the delays caused by distance, burocracy and 'farming out' of the work, that the fighters had been using these 'war economy' tanks for some months before a message came back saying that they wouldn't work.

I can't vouch for the truth, but I always thought it a decent tale.

Regard

Walrus

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: catspaw49
Date: 19 May 03 - 05:05 PM

The P-51 to me was the top fighter of the war (WWII). I love a lot of others and it's hard to pick it over some great designs such as the Spit and the FW190, but from any standpoint of performance to do the job of a fighter, it did so many things well, if not the best, that any other choice requires far more justification.

It's final variation was in fact a new design but was known as the Twin Mustang...or the F-82 and was the last prop driven fighter ordered in quantity by the USAF.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Charley Noble
Date: 19 May 03 - 07:27 PM

So how many of you hung your models on your bedroom ceilings? My brother and I had this incredible dog fight going on, although the planes did tend to get dusty or festooned with spider webs after a few years, kind of ghostly when I think back on it.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Doug_Remley
Date: 19 May 03 - 10:20 PM

When I was a kid I always thought the SE-5A was sexy but for best all-around use learned tha Pfalz series was best. Anthony Fokker's memoirs say the D-VII was a hurry-up job to meet absurd specs. He didn't think anyone could fly it. But it was breathtaking in action.

In terms of WWII, ah, if the P-40 had ever been supercharged as designed! Best was the Skunkworks P-38 but it was huge! Probably the later Corsair fulfilled mot necessary all-around tasks.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Cluin
Date: 19 May 03 - 11:19 PM

I did that as a kid, Charley. I had about a dozen of `em up there. I remember a Messerschmidt, a Sopwith Camel, a Fokker Triplane, a Lockheed P-38, a P-51 Mustang...

My largest was a big B-17 "Flying Fortress" about 14" long. It was so heavy that the thumbtacks would never hold it up and it kept dropping down to the carpet below every few weeks or so. Every time I hung it up again, there would be a piece missing.

Talk about surreal looking.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 May 03 - 12:13 AM

Once I got past the amateur stage I mostly built them with the landing gear down, and placed them on shelves or in cabinets, preferably behind glass...because of the dust problem. At this point I have on display a Japanese type 99 Val, a Zero 52b, and a Shinden...a Hellcat...a Bf-109G and an Arado 234, nicely free of dust, plus a few tanks in 1/35 scale.

Models that are hung from ceilings get incredibly dusty pretty fast.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Doug_Remley
Date: 20 May 03 - 01:38 AM

I spent a few years in my thirties designing and flying RC types. The heavy wing loading of military fighters made for large engines. Much more fun were tiny engine, big wings for VTOL and flight time. The Storch was a beautiful plane followed by the Pilatus.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: stevetheORC
Date: 20 May 03 - 04:10 AM

My largest was a wellington bomber finished with my dads help, it was just to big for me to hold:-) Planes hanging off the celing, tanks and airfix soldiers on the shelfs (fort's n soldiers on the floor in the attic along with scaletrix racing setup:-)))))

De Orc

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Charley Noble
Date: 20 May 03 - 07:50 AM

One of the saddest memories has to be the large paper and stick model my brother had just finished of a Fokker D-VII. The new paint job wasn't drying fast enough so he held it over our coal stove and...;~(

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Les from Hull
Date: 20 May 03 - 09:30 AM

Doug - The P-40 always had a supercharger, in its original Allison engined version, and the later Merlin (P-40F) form. The main problem with the P-40 were its performance at altitude (being designed more for ground attack and coastal defence). No-one supposed the USA would need to defend against high-altitude attack. US fighter design was a little behind European at that time (but they did catch up fast!), and there was no armour protection and no self-sealing fuel tanks. The original design had just two machine guns (later four, then six).

In British and Commonwealth service it performed very well as a ground attack aicraft in North Africa.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: GUEST,irish sergeant
Date: 20 May 03 - 02:47 PM

Charlie: I still have an abreviated collection catching cobwebs in the basement. On to the topic as stated.
My favorite World War One Aircraft? The SpadXIII and the Neiuport 17 for the French (ANd Americans) The Vickers Gunbus, Spowith Camel and SE5 for the British and the Fokker Eindecker, Albatross DVII for the Germans AS far as fighters go Bombers? Handley-Page 400 and the CAproni series from Italy.
World War Two: British: Spitfire, Hawker Hurricane (The true hero of the BAttle of Britain) DeHaviland Mosquito, AVRO LAncaster and the Fairey Swordfish (The glorious "String bag" of Royal Navy fame) German: Bf-109, Focke-Wulf 190, Dornier DO-17 Messerschmidt ME-262 UNited States; P-51 Mustang, F4U-1 Corsair, B-17, P-40 Japan A6M Type 0, Emily flying boat, VAl dive bomber and strangely the Oka rocket powerd suicide bomber France: The Detowaine 240 which got little press and gets even less now but was one of France's best aircraft. Post WW2: The A-7 Corsair, Nimrod, F-4 Phantom, A-4 Skyhawk, P-3 Orion, the P2V Neptune, Dassault Mirage, IAI Kfir the Mig 17 anf the F-14 Tomcat.(To be honest, I worked on some of these while in the NAvy. Kindest regards, Neil

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 May 03 - 05:15 PM

Hey, Neil, that's the Dewoitine 520, I think. It was a beautiful fighter, quite comparable to the Spitfire and the Bf-109. Tamiya has a superb 1/48 kit of it out, and those French colors are really something to see.

The Italians had some lovely planes too. Their C.R.42 was probably the best biplane fighter of them all (debatable), and the Macchi 202/205 series were gorgeous, as were the Fiat G.55's, all built around the German Daimler Benz engine that powered the Messerschmitt fighters as well.

Those Italian camouflage schemes are hell to airbrush, though!

Then you've got some very stylish Russian fighters...like the Mig-3, Yak-3 to Yak 9 series, and the La-5N and La-7. They were very good airplanes. Dig those patriotic slogans. Amazing how the Germans succeeded in turning most of the Russian people into willing and determined soldiers for that cold-blooded murderer, Joe Stalin...and it took them less than a year to do it.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Les from Hull
Date: 20 May 03 - 07:23 PM

Thanks for mentioning the Soviet WW2 fighters, LH. Great 'planes, excellent performance. Some good designers over there. And the Pe2, the Russian Mosquito. And the Stormaviks, very efficient.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: leprechaun
Date: 20 May 03 - 10:37 PM

So which one had the fuselage above the lower wing?

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Greycap
Date: 21 May 03 - 08:21 AM

The Sopwith Dolphin always did it for me

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 21 May 03 - 02:32 PM

You've got me stumped with that question, leprechaun. Nice going. How far above?

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Irish sergeant
Date: 21 May 03 - 04:03 PM

Didn't mean to neglect our Russian friends nor the Italians. The Stormovik was quite possibly the best ground assault aircraft of the second world war And Little HAwk thank you for the correction . (Proves I should check my books before opening my mouth.) I'm afraid I can't help with the question unless you tell me what war. The Italians also fielded a hybrid aircraft that was sort of a combination between reciprocating and jet engine but the model erscapes me at present I also thought the Dornier 335 "Arrow" was neat The tandem engine design was quite unique. Kindest regards, Neil

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 May 03 - 12:04 AM

Yeah, the Do335 is an old favourite of mine. Years ago there were some 1/72 scale models of it by Lindberg (not bad...). Then Monogram did a beauty in 1/48. Then Tamiya finally did it in several versions, and you can't get better than that.

The Germans called it "the anteater", and it's not hard to see why when you look at it from the side. It's weird looking, but great looking at the same time.

And the Sturmovik? Accurate Miniatures finally did the definitive version(s) of that one in 1/48 to absolute perfection. It's amazing how good models are now.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Teribus
Date: 22 May 03 - 06:44 AM

leprechaun,

The Bristol Fighter F2B's fuselage was above the lower wing, so that is one possible answer to your question.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: leprechaun
Date: 22 May 03 - 11:36 PM

Yep, that was it.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Irish sergeant
Date: 23 May 03 - 11:47 AM

Isn't the FB2 the one the pilkots called the "Brisfit"? By the way, the Owl's Head Transportation museum in Owl's Head, Maine has a lovely operational Bristol Gun bus. Or at leaast it was when Peggy and I Honeymooned there ten years ago. Neil

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 23 May 03 - 12:33 PM

Now just think if they'd ever succeeded in getting Ornithopters (planes with wings that flapped like a bird's wings) operational...!

Then we'd really have some weird planes to look at and build models of. Imagine trying to sight in on a target from one of those... :-)

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Les from Hull
Date: 26 May 03 - 03:08 PM

The Bristol Fighter was the Brisfit (designation F.2A or F.2B). It served on well after WW1, dropping bombs on Iraquis (some things never change).

Neil - that would be a Vickers Gun-Bus (FB5).

You get get a wide range of injection-moulded kits of WW1 aircraft from smaller manufacturers over here in the UK, and presumably elsewhere in the world. There are also vacuum moulded kits but these are quite a bit harder to build.

LH - the nearest thing to an ornithopter would be one of the German 'Taube' monoplanes, wing-warpers with a very bird-like wing. I'm sure you could find a kit for one somewhere.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Phot
Date: 26 May 03 - 04:29 PM

Sorry I'm not to hot on WW1 fighters, but Gareth's comment about the Swordfish got me going.

Call me lucky, but one of the great things about working at RNAS Yeovilton, or HMS Heron, if you prefer, is I get to see them almost every day during the show circut season,....aint life a bitch!

But not just the Swordfish, the Fairey Firefly is up and about at the moment, and there isnt much better than listening to a Griffon V12 at max chat to provide the background music at lunchtime.

Wiht a bit of luck the Sea Fury should be back on the circuit next year, and also the Mk1 Swordfish, after its main spar refurb. If I get any more info on whats happening I'll let you all know.

But for all time speed machine, it has to be the English Electric Lightning.......100% British Beef!!

Cheers all Chris.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: GUEST,Snoopy
Date: 26 May 03 - 07:35 PM

Curse you Red Baron

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: The Walrus
Date: 26 May 03 - 08:54 PM

Phot,

You have a 'stringbag', Firefly AND a Sea Fury on your doorstep?

I've just gone off you in a major manner....
muutermutterluckybuggermutter

The best I can do is occasionally acting as part of the ground-crew for a flight of (2/3 scale) replica SE5s.

If you want to see some strange expressions, watch the faces of some of the other users of the Airfield in the morning at the Biggin Hill show when they see a number of 'First World War' aircraft being handled out of the hanger by a mob in First War uniform -it's quite amusing to watch the unsuspecting...

Regards

Walrus

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 May 03 - 11:25 PM

The Czech model company Eduard has done a series of beautiful WWI airplane kits in 1/48, but I'm not sure if they've covered the Taube yet. It was a lovely looking plane.

I'd like to pass on a word from the Red Baron...

"Ja, Schnoopy! Vell, you can curse all you vant, but I am not zo impressed. Zat silly plane/doghaus you are tryink to fly does not even haff vings! Und you are un kleines hundt...too schmall for flyink viss ze experten, I am sinking (thinking). Vy don't you chust go und raid ze butcher shop instead und haff a nice weiner or bludwurst or zwei und forged aboud it. I sink you are barkink up ze wrong tree, mein kleines hundt."

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Teribus
Date: 27 May 03 - 03:22 AM

Hi Phot,

Do they still run the lottery for "joy-rides" in the Stringbag down at Heron? They used to have one when I was down there - always heavily over subscribed.

Allen D,

Your memories of watching WW I "dog-fights" over the Wicklow mountains brought back some memories for me. First Irish International Airshow at Rathfarnum, they had just filming "Blue Max" and "Darlin' Lily" - all the aircraft were there and staged this incredible show. I talked to the pilot of the Fokker tri-plane and asked him what it was like to fly. He said it was amazing in the air but an absolute bastard to land, you literally had to fly it onto the ground. It was a beautiful summer if memory serves me correctly.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Phot
Date: 27 May 03 - 03:38 AM

Walrus, nothing wrong with being ground crew, I did it for 16 years in the RAF and the RN, trust me, if flying was difficult, the ground crew would do it!

It was great being a rigger, [Airframes technichan] give me a hammer, a GS screwdriver, and an adjustable spanner and I'll fix anything!

Terribus, not anymore, by I'm up for an air to air photo shoot with the Stringbag and a pair of Lynx next week.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 27 May 03 - 12:19 PM

The Fokker Triplane is a strange little bird, maneuverable as hell but too dang slow in my opinion. I've flown it in some pretty good simulations. My favourite to fly remains the Fokker DVII. That was one amazing airplane for its time.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Les from Hull
Date: 27 May 03 - 02:00 PM

Possibly the best fighter 'plane of WW1, faster and more manoeuverable than anything else was the ... wait for it ... Martinsyde F4 Buzzard. Yes I knew you would be shocked. But Mr Trenchard didn't seem to like it much, so the RAF got the Sopwith Snipe instead.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Irish sergeant
Date: 27 May 03 - 04:12 PM

As I understand it, the Fokkeer DR I (Triplane) Had a nasty little habit in that the top wing had a tendency to peel off in high speed dives. The DVII was a far superior aircraft according to a couple of old German pilots Dad knew back in the sixties.
   Phot: I was an aircraft engine mechanic in the US Navy. It was a hell of a lot of fun and I still could handle my own witih a hammer and a screwdriver if push came to shove. Have a great night all, Neil

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 27 May 03 - 06:07 PM

Ah, well, that's the whole idea behind the 3 wings on the Tripe, Lep. You lose the top one...you've still got 2 left to nurse the little Fokker down with and make a safe landing... :-)

(Not!)

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Ian Darby
Date: 27 May 03 - 08:26 PM

Wasn't the 'Stringbag' the Fairey Swordfish?

I built the Airfix model at a very early age and it was a sod to put together.

I liked the Albatross and the Sopwith Camel as well, and still get transported back every time I get a whiff of glue....

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 27 May 03 - 08:54 PM

Yup, the Stringbag was the Faery Swordfish of Britain's WWII Fleet Air Arm. It was the most antiquated torpedo bomber in service anywhere, but it did surprisingly well...partly because of the excellent British aircrews, partly because the opposition (the Germans and Italians) had no aircraft carriers in service. The Japanese would have massacred the Swordfish.

The Airfix model of it in 1/72 was a pretty horrible little kit by today's standards. Artiplast/Smer also did a kit in 1/48 that was quite primitive. A few years back Tamiya finally did a gorgeous kit in 1/48 that costs about as much as a fairly cheap guitar might have a few decades ago! It's worth it if you really want to build a Swordfish.

The Swordfish were so slow that German Focke-Wulf fighters in 1942 lowered not only their flaps but their landing gear (!) in order to slow down enough to make a reasonable firing pass from behind on them. This was during the famed "Channel Dash of the German ships Scharnhorst (my old favourite), Gneisenau, and Prinz Eugen from France back to Germany by way of the English Channel....an unexpected move that was risky, but succeeded. The FW-190's shot those poor Swordfish down like clay pigeons.

Yet the humble Swordfish scored tremendous victories against Germany and Italy, dooming the Bismark and sinking several Italian battleships and many smaller vessels. It was effective and reliable, even if it was as slow as a turtle going uphill on a cold day.

The world's finest torpedo bomber in 1941-42 was the Japanese Nakajima Kate, soon to be surpassed by the American TBF Avenger, which was itself surpassed (debatably) by the Japanese Nakajima Tenzan (Jill) and most definitely by the Japanese Ryusei (Grace), a really impressive airplane in every way...but there weren't many of them put into service.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Teribus
Date: 28 May 03 - 03:37 AM

LH,

There was reason for the Swordfish's success against the Bismark. Bismark's A.A. guns or more correctly their fire control systems were designed to engage targets attacking at a minimum speed of 115 knots. When the Swordfish attacked Bismark their attack speed due to weather conditions was 85 knots, the pilots were surprised that the intense A.A. flung up at them all seemed to burst in front of their aircraft.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 28 May 03 - 12:34 PM

Isn't it ironical that being outmoded can sometimes be an asset? The fact that the German flak was falling short was probably not very evident to the German gunners either. It wouldn't have been easy to see the discrepancy from where they were sitting.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Les from Hull
Date: 28 May 03 - 01:49 PM

While we're on about the Swordfish, we ought to recognise that one of the major factors over its long service was that it became a very successful anti-submarine aircraft. It carried rockets to deal with subs on the surface and could land back on a heaving escort carrier deck in a North Atlantic gale. Just imagine the bravery of the guys who did that job!

And its original designation? TSR1.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 28 May 03 - 01:52 PM

Yup, and the guys in the subs had to be pretty brave too. I'd hate to have been on either side in that conflict.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Ian Darby
Date: 29 May 03 - 08:44 PM

I built every 'plane in the Airfix range when I was a kid, even the civil aircraft. If only I'd saved the things in the original packaging.

I also had most of the Marvel comics from issue one, X Men, Iron Man, The Rawhide Kid, Spiderman, Fantastic Four, etc.

Sorry, I've digressed and await my punishment....

P.S. I could be retired now.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Rapparee
Date: 30 May 03 - 09:05 AM

Here's something interesting -- a WWI precursor of the V-1.

(The USAF Museum at Wright Patterson AFB has a wonderful collection of WWI and other aircraft, as does the Smithsonian - if you get to Washington DC, try to wrangle a visit to the Silver Hill facility.)

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 May 03 - 10:27 AM

I built just about every Airfix kit too. Some were quite good, others were dreadful. Most of them are still available today, but in different packaging. If you had them in the original packaging in mint condition they would be worth a fair bit to some people.

Other companies back then were Frog (Airlines), Hawk, Pyro, Revell, Monogram, Lindberg Line, AMT, and Aurora, plus a couple of others I can't recall at the moment. About half of them are still with us. Revell and Monogram have combined into one company. Pyro mutated into Life-Like, I think. AMT made cars back then, but now makes everything.

In the meantime the Japanese and Koreans and Chinese have pretty well taken over. Tamiya and Hasegawa rule when it comes to airplanes.

There is a French model company too...it's called Heller. From them you can get French vehicles that no one else models.

And then there's Italeri from Italy...quite good.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: The Walrus
Date: 30 May 03 - 03:11 PM

Speaking of Airfix models, I had a shock in my local newsagent recently, they've started selling model kits and there was one on sale,1/72 Supermarne Spitfire which came with a couple of pots of paint and a brush (presumably with glue) and I'm sure the box carried the 'Airfix' logo (I'd thought they'd go out of business years back), the price was in the £3-6 range - I remember that kit (hopefully from a different set of moulds) for 2/- (10p for the younger Brits), sold in a plastic bag.
How things change.

Walrus

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 May 03 - 04:05 PM

Yeah, the price of a model kit has gone up by about 2400% or more since the late 60's. The quality has gone way up too, on the whole, but still...

Airfix is still very much in business, and doing the odd new release from time to time, as well as selling all the old stuff in new boxes. Their latest boxtop art is not very good.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: HuwG
Date: 31 May 03 - 10:08 AM

As a final note on the poem, "High Flight" (see MGrath of Altcar's post, here, someone once faxed a copy to the Federal Aviation Authority, who immediately issued the following directives:


1. Pilots must ensure that all surly bonds of Earth have been slipped entirely before aircraft taxi or flight is attempted.
2. During periods of severe sky dancing, crew and passengers must keep seatbelts fastened. Crew should wear shoulderbelts as provided.
3. Sunward climbs must not exceed the maximum permitted aircraft ceiling.
4. Passenger aircraft are prohibited from joining the tumbling mirth.
5. Pilots flying through sun-split clouds under VFR conditions must comply with all applicable minimum clearances.
6. Commercial operators are prohibited from performing a hundred things you've not dreamed of.
7. Wheeling, soaring, and swinging will not be attempted except in aircraft rated for such activities and within utility class weight limits.
8. Be advised that sunlit silence will occur only when a major engine malfunction has occurred.
9. "Hov'ring there" will constitute a highly reliable signal that a flight emergency is imminent.
10. Forecasts of shouting winds are available from the local FSS. Encounters with unexpected shouting winds should be reported by pilots.
11. Pilots flinging eager craft through footless halls of air are reminded that they alone are responsible for maintaining separation from other eager craft.
12. Should any crew member or passenger experience delirium while in the burning blue, submit an irregularity report upon flight termination.
13. Windswept heights will be topped by a minimum of 1,000 feet to maintain VFR minimum separations.
14. Aircraft engine ingestion of, or impact with, larks or eagles, even where such birds never flew, should be reported to the FAA and the appropriate aircraft maintenance facility.
15. Aircraft operating in the high untresspassed sanctity of space must remain in IFR flight regardless of meteorological conditions and visibility.
16. Pilots and passengers are reminded that opening doors or windows in order to touch the face of God may result in loss of cabin pressure.




This gem, and some other homourous quotes on flying can be found at www.skygod.com.

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: Phot
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 06:23 AM

Latest from the far side of the airfield, or the RN Historic Flight.

The Mk1, Respar, almost complete, may be on the circuit this year.

The Mk2, undergoing Xray on main spars, watch this space.

Sea Fury, Engine rebuild complete, should be on the circuit this year, at least on the static display at the RNAS Yeovilton Air Show.

Sea Hawk, after a long overhaul, this pretty little jet should be back on the circuit this year, work by British Aerospace, and The RNHF, have made this restoration an absoulte belter.

After Easter leave I'll have a word with the boss of RNHF and try and let you know whats happening.

Wassail
Chris

Subject: RE: BS: Favourite World War 1 Fighter Plane
From: el ted
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 06:28 AM

Post no 100. I thank you.