BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market

Subject: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Jul 03 - 11:22 PM

Actually, I'm quite surprised this didn't get a mention anywhere here in the last couple of days. Of all the recent Bush Boy fiascos, this one surely has to take the cake:

Betting on Murder

Just makes you feel all warm, fuzzy, and patriotic, dunnit?

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: Ebbie
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 03:04 AM

Oh, yes, it has been mentioned, believe me. Check the Verichip thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 01:16 PM

Uh, I had checked that thread when it started, and it sure didn't seem to me as if it was about the Pentagon's website for terrorism futures trading. It seems to be that DG guy, off on a rant about I'm not sure what, so I skipped over it.

But I loved the Nation's spin on it (the link above). Here is a wee excerpt of it:

"Uh ... wait. That can't be right, can it? No, this is simply yet another "unbelievably stupid and offensive" idea from the Donald Rumsfeld Pentagon's own Dr. Strangelove, convicted Iran-Contra liar John Poindexter. Both aisles in the Senate have recoiled in anger from Poindexter's plan to spend millions of US dollars setting up a terrorism roulette wheel. (And talk about "moral hazard"! If I put a million-dollar hedge against someone gunning down Yasser Arafat on Tuesday, don't I have a million-dollar incentive to see that happen? And what if I place a very public bet with the Pentagon bookies against the life of, say, a top US official -- and then he or she is killed? Do I really just get a handshake and a check from DARPA?)"

So, the thing I wondered about is, just who are the people the Pentagon thought would wager bets in this pool anyway? Investment bankers? High level government bureaucrats? Ted Turner?

They say the people they thought would participate, would be people who were knowledgeable about the Middle East. So, just who is that exactly? The ayatollahs? The Saudi royal family?

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 01:18 PM

Yes...halfway down in the VeriChip thread Ebbie goes into severe denial of the obvious. Here's today's World Socialist Website article on the matter. These folks are also in denial, thinking there is a difference between Clinton/Bush, but they do write good articles:

Pentagon scheme for a futures market in terror

And below is a link to an article about Buzzy Krongard...the pioneer in this field of terrorism betting. The #3 man in the CIA on Sept. 11, and he and his former business associates made millions betting AGAINST American and United Airlines two days before the hijackings. The stocks fell on Sept 12, and Krongard made a fortune. The system worked so well, the terrorists who now control the US govt want to legalize their 'insider knowledge' of coming terrorit attacks. They got away with it in their trial run, so now it'll be an everyday fact of life:

October 9, 2001 -- Although uniformly ignored by the mainstream U.S. media, there is abundant and clear evidence that a number of transactions in financial markets indicated specific (criminal) foreknowledge of the September 11 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

In the case of at least one of these trades -- which has left a $2.5 million prize unclaimed -- the firm used to place the 'put options' on United Airlines stock was, until 1998, managed by the man who is now in the number three Executive Director position at the Central Intelligence Agency.

Until 1997 A.B. 'Buzzy' Krongard had been Chairman of the investment bank A.B. Brown. A.B. Brown was acquired by Banker's Trust in 1997. Krongard then became, as part of the merger, Vice Chairman of Banker's Trust-AB Brown, one of 20 major U.S. banks named by Senator Carl Levin this year as being connected to money laundering.

Krongard's last position at Banker's Trust (BT) was to oversee 'private Client relations.' In this capacity he had direct hands-on relations with some of the wealthiest people in the world in a kind of specialized banking operation that has been identified by the U.S. Senate and other investigators as being closely connected to the laundering of drug money.

Krongard joined the CIA in 1998 as counsel to CIA Director George Tenet. He was promoted to CIA Executive Director by President Bush in March of this year. BT was acquired by Deutsche Bank in 1999. The combined firm is the single largest bank in Europe. And, as we shall see, Deutsche Bank played several key roles in events connected to the September 11 attacks.

Krongard

Do some google searches for Krongard and Sept 11. He would be convicted at trial, yet he has never been charged.

DG

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 01:24 PM

Whatever, DG. But I would like to clarify one thing. It seems to me that most of the progressives here aren't in denial at all, and know that while there aren't any substantive differences in the ways the Democrats and Republicans/conservative and liberal politicians do the business to the nation, there are some very substantial differences between pre and post 9/11, which has resulted in some significant differences between Bush and Clinton in some things, but in other things, not.

In other words, progressives here can and do make these distinctions without going round the bend everytime they post.

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST,Boyd
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 06:05 PM

Now that DARPA Dude's head is due to be delivered to the Senate on a platter, and the program killed, does that mean that Poindexter will take the Terrorism Information Awareness Project with him when he goes?

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: Charley Noble
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 06:11 PM

Well, thanks for finally starting this thread. It really is an amazing story, well beyond my most cynical fantasies. I clearly need to re-tune my dark side shields. And the Pentagon think tank already admits spending over $600,000 on this made-for-the Sci-Fi channel pilot.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST,Boyd
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 06:31 PM

I read today that it was the Pentagon and "two private partners" who were going to run the program--no mention, of course, who those private partners were.

How many millions of dollars worth of FOIA lawsuits do you suppose John Q. Public will have to pay for, just to get the Cheney/Rumsfeld/Wolfowitz Axis of Evil to give us the names? Do you suppose they can stall this scandal until after the election too?

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: Bobert
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 06:42 PM

Well, it seems the gambling is the "new idea" for funding the governemnt. What a concept. Only problem is that most gamblers are those who can least afford to loose their hard earned dough.

Just like in Maryland. They elect a Republican governor, Erlick 'er Errich, 'er... Anyway, he answer to funding the state governemnt. Slot machines on every corner...

Nevermind. I'm sure I've missed the point...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: Gareth
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 07:05 PM

Hey Bobert -

Something we agree on, so I've made a Doctors appointment. Just to check, you understand !!

On a more serious note, in the UK, a gamble, or wager, is not enforcable at law.

It is an offence to wager on the life of the Monarch, or heirs, or members of the Privy Council (which includes most leading politicians - and IDS) and there is a rather nice piece of legislation, "The Gambelling Policies Act 1908" (SP)- Which precludes setting up a wager as an insurance policy.

But this proposal - Well words fail me !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gareth

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 07:10 PM

Well, apparently with this nifty little plan, Ariel Sharon could bet on Arafat getting assassinated. As if Sharon didn't have enough of a personal interest already for assassinating the guy, under this plan, he'd get a big fat pay out for actually assassinating him.

Great idea, don't you agree?

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: kendall
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 07:27 PM

Admiral Asshole just resigned.

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 08:22 PM

>>>On a more serious note, in the UK, a gamble, or wager, is not enforcable at law.

It is an offence to wager on the life of the Monarch, or heirs, or members of the Privy Council (which includes most leading politicians - and IDS) and there is a rather nice piece of legislation, "The Gambelling Policies Act 1908" (SP)- Which precludes setting up a wager as an insurance policy.<<<

I am quite surprised that this wagering on death and crime is not illegal in the U.S. under both state and federal laws. Perhaps it is. Perhaps there were loopholes based on semantics. Strange we haven't read a little more about that.

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: Greg F.
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 09:18 PM

Admiral Asshole wass only one of many front men. Nothing has fundamentally changed with his resignation.

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 09:34 PM

This plan has not been scrapped. Money-making enterprises are not abandoned. Buzzy Krongard set the precedent and got away with it, so now it'll be commonplace. They only went public with this to desensitize us. They want us to feel so hopeless that we just throw up our hands and say 'whatever', like the Guest above. Poindexter was a political liability going into the upcoming election, so they had him put on his Dr. Strangelove act one more time before he exited public life. But he and this program will be even more powerful next month. These people don't go away. They just pull the strings of their replacements, change the name of the offensive program and continue to rake in the money. A freakin' BUSINESS ASSOCIATE of mid-east terrorists ran the last 9-11 'investigation', fer cryin out loud. We are being beat over the head with the fact that the terrorists are in control of the US govt.

DG

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: Bobert
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 09:40 PM

Gareth:

Sorry, my friend, to put you in such a bind. Hope you'll be able to sleep and not be up all night pacing the floors....

Here in the US there a re folks who will gamble on *anything*. I mean it... *any-danged-thing*. Hey, it were all rich folks, I wouldn't care less but it ain't...

What most states have are lotteries and every Friday night (payday) you go in stores and see folks lined up to buy them lottery tickets. Ain't nobody wearing suits. These are the working class and many are at the lower end of the working class, hoping to hbit it big and get out of the celler.... Sad.... Like the cook down at Leesburg Restuarnt, who gets up a 4:30 in the morning to get to work on time where she makes about $9.00 and hour with no benefits. She's pushin' 60 and has held that same job in that hot kitchen for the last 30 years. But there she is. Tryin' to beat a system that is very much stacked up against her.

And so I listen to C-SPAN and hear these rich white ladies calling in talking about "personal responsibility" and it makes me sick.

There, Gareth, I've probably touched on enough of my "ompassionate humanism" so that you can now cancel the appointment with the doctor.

Jus' funnin'... Kind of...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 09:45 PM

Hey...I listened to Howlin' Wolf today, Bobert. One of a kind...one of a kind.

DG

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: Bobert
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 09:52 PM

Howlin' Wolf was the Man. Been doing "Little Red Rooster" lately and tryin' to get it down like he did it.... Ain't easy... Like you say, DG, one of a kind....

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 10:04 PM

Don't try to get it EXACTLY like he did it...that would wreck a voice. lol. It's amazing a croak like that could sound sublime.

Also listened to a bit of an interview about Sam Phillips of Sun Records on NPR today. Never knew he got booed off the stage in Cleveland when he said the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame should rightfully be in Memphis. He was right. Elvis, Orbison, J L Lewis, Johnny Cash...PLUS all the 'race music' records he used to record...B B King, Ike Turner, Rufus Thomas, Bobby Blue Bland, etc. And that was just one tiny record label in the town in the 1950's. So where do they put the R&R Hall of Fame? Cleveland. lol

Subject: RE: BS: Bushonomics: a terrorism futures market
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Aug 03 - 05:01 PM

AAM

As I said, they'll just change the name. From PAM to AAM, and the betting continues.

DG