BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage

Subject: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Amos
Date: 26 Jan 04 - 05:33 PM

At last, a single sign of good news on the Constitutional violations front:

http://www.dissidentvoice.org/Jan04/Valenzuela0126.htm

Part of Patriot Act Ruled Unconstitutional

By LINDA DEUTSCH

LOS ANGELES (AP) - A federal judge has declared unconstitutional a
portion of the USA Patriot Act that bars giving expert advice or
assistance to groups designated foreign terrorist organizations.

The ruling marks the first court decision to declare a part of the
post-Sept. 11 anti-terrorism statute unconstitutional, said David
Cole, a Georgetown University law professor who argued the case on
behalf of the Humanitarian Law Project.

In a ruling handed down late Friday and made available Monday, U.S.
District Judge Audrey Collins said the ban on providing "expert advice
or assistance" is impermissibly vague, in violation of the First and
Fifth Amendments.

...

The Humanitarian Law Project, which brought the lawsuit, said the
plaintiffs were threatened with 15 years in prison if they advised
groups on seeking a peaceful resolution of the Kurds' campaign for
self-determination in Turkey.

...

"The USA Patriot Act places no limitation on the type of expert advice
and assistance which is prohibited and instead bans the provision of
all expert advice and assistance regardless of its nature," the judge
said.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Rapparee
Date: 26 Jan 04 - 05:38 PM

Gee, that could really be a kick in the head to those students studying here, couldn't it? I mean, the prof saying "Okay, all you good American students, you have to use plutonium-239 for your A-bombs, but all you non-American terrorist students, you go on and use use lead or iron or something."

Good for the Court!

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Amos
Date: 27 Jan 04 - 05:15 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Teribus
Date: 28 Jan 04 - 04:34 AM

Hells teeth, I bet that guy who was hell bent on selling those SAM's to fundamentalist terrorists wishes he'd flown into L.A. instead of New York.

Under this ruling would that mean that the prat could fly back to the UK and try again?

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: katlaughing
Date: 28 Jan 04 - 07:28 AM

I thought this was going to be about the shrub getting a brain and backpeddling; kind of a combo of Scrooge waking up and the Wizard of Oz dispensing largesse...oh no, wait a minute, the Wiz only helped them realise what it was they already had...so that couldn't be it!

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Jan 04 - 08:20 AM

Don't put a lot of money on the BuShites getting brains and backpedalling, Kat. A little recreational wager would be OK, I supopose.

Ya gotta remember, god & jesus speak directly to these people and inspire their every waking and sleeping moment.

They have to be right (Right?) in all they do.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Amos
Date: 01 Feb 04 - 11:15 AM

And in other news, the Canadians say it like it is:

Click here for article.


Regards,

A

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Feb 04 - 11:27 AM

Thanks for that good article Amos.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: GUEST,Johnny in OKC
Date: 01 Feb 04 - 05:36 PM

Unconstitutional Patriot Act Expert Advice Related Program Activity:

I guess the expert advice might include something like,
"Don't do it". What's wrong with that?

Love, Johnny in OKC

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: dianavan
Date: 01 Feb 04 - 05:57 PM

On the radio today I heard a woman say, "The reason the U.S.A. is so unpopular is because everyone is envious of success." My heart sunk.

Then I turned to Mudcat. Thanks for the article. Very clear, very good journalism. Thank goodness, the truth is finally being told.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: DougR
Date: 01 Feb 04 - 09:05 PM

My understanding of the Judge's ruling is that any American who aids a terrorist cannot be prosecuted. Anybody that thinks that's okay, in my opinion, needs to have their own head examined.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Amos
Date: 01 Feb 04 - 10:52 PM

DougR:

The interpretation you have made is surely inaccurate.

There are plenty of grounds for prosecution in situations such as the one you describe other than charges of giving expert advice illegally. That's just a stupid point ti use for the result desired.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Feb 04 - 11:14 PM

Thanks for the excellent article, Amos.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: GUEST,Clint Keller
Date: 02 Feb 04 - 03:27 AM

Doug, I believe the judge's ruling is that "aid" must be defined more precisely than "expert advice and assistance."

In this case the "expert advice" of the plaintiffs was to seek a peaceful solution. This hardly justifies the15-year sentence they were threatened with.

& Teribus, I believe there are other laws in place that prohibit private individuals supplying missiles to terrorists. It's apparently ok if the government does it.

clint

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 02 Feb 04 - 05:48 PM

Well a liberal judge in the most liberal Circuit in America (known as the "Overturned 9th" for being the most overturned in Supreme Court history) has made a ruling. I don't think it will last long (as long as the designation of "terrorist organization" is properly made). Otherwise the Justice Dept can simply charge under the old conspiracy laws and make the same case.

As for David Kay, the "passionate truth teller about Iraq" I noticed that the Toronto editorialist did not mention Kays testimony in front of the Senate in which he disembowelled Kennedy, who was tring to suggest that the Bush Administration had tried to influence the intellegence analysts to upgrade their reports prior to the war. I have rarely had more fun watching CNN than I did during his testimony. If you think that testimony hurt the Bush Administration, than this election is going to be easier than I think.

He not only told Kennedy he found no such efforts at any point but also believed that Saddam was a true menace who needed to be stopped as soon as possible, and that the Presidents actions were reasonable with what he knew at the time. And the comment about "exaggerations" was Mr. Siddiquis, and not any portion of Mr. Kays testimony.

Now why do you think Mr. Siddiqui left those items out?????

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Amos
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 08:35 PM

Another spark of sanity from the New York City Council, resolving to support the Bill of Rights over the PAtriot Act II, can be found at this page. Three cheers.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Amos
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 08:36 PM

Resolution calling upon federal, state and local officials, and upon New
York City agencies and institutions, to affirm and uphold civil rights
and civil liberties.

Excerpts:[ ... ]

    Resolved, That the Council of the City of New York opposes requests
    by federal authorities that, if granted, would cause agencies of the
    City of New York to exercise powers or cooperate in the exercise of
    powers in apparent violation of any city ordinance or the laws or
    Constitution of this State or the United States; and be it further

[ ... ]

    Resolved, That the Council of the City of New York calls upon our
    United States Representatives and Senators to take a lead in
    Congressional action to prohibit passage of the Domestic Security
    Enhancement Act, known as .Patriot II.

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 09:10 PM

I wouldn't start celebrating yet. Ashcroft's Federales are still busy at work, spying on you, me, your neighbors and work colleagues, and of course, political dissenters.

Because people here get up in arms when you provide links to NY Times articles, I'll just exerpt a bit of this story from today's online issue:

An Antiwar Forum in Iowa Brings Federal Subpoenas
By MONICA DAVEY

Published: February 10, 2004

DES MOINES, Feb. 9 — To hear the antiwar protesters describe it, their forum at a local university last fall was like so many others they had held over the years. They talked about the nonviolent philosophies of Mahatma Gandhi and the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., they said, and how best to convey their feelings about Iraq into acts of civil disobedience.

But last week, subpoenas began arriving seeking details about the forum's sponsor — its leadership list, its annual reports, its office location — and the event itself. On Monday, lawyers for the sponsor, the Drake University chapter of the National Lawyers Guild, went to court in an effort to block the federal prosecutors' demands.

Those who attended the forum, at least four of whom said they had received subpoenas to appear before a federal grand jury on Tuesday, said that they did not know what to make of the inquiry and that they feared it was intended to quash protest.

Late on Monday, prosecutors in the United States attorney's office for the southern district of Iowa took the unusual step of issuing a confirmation of the investigation, stressing that its scope was limited to learning more about one person who had tried to scale a security fence at an Iowa National Guard base in a protest a day after the forum.

"The United States attorney's office does not prosecute persons peacefully and lawfully engaged in rallies which are conducted under the protection of the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States," a written statement issued by the prosecutor here, Stephen Patrick O'Meara, said."

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 10:36 PM

Just found a link to the above story at Yahoo News (story provided by AP):

Feds Win Right to War Protesters' Records

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Sorcha
Date: 10 Feb 04 - 11:46 PM

'repairing the damage'.....HA. it will take years, if ever....

Subject: RE: BS: Bush: Repairing the Damage
From: Mickey191
Date: 11 Feb 04 - 11:33 AM

Repairing the damage---Only if Bush can raise the dead.