Origins: 'Once in China there lived a great man...

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,John from Kemsing
Date: 15 Nov 13 - 06:53 AM

Here`s my one. It`s called "Choo, Choo, Choo-Chin-Chow".

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,John from Kemsing
Date: 15 Nov 13 - 06:58 AM

I just haven`t mastered this "blue clicky" business. Any guidance on cut and paste is welcome.

https://soundcloud.com/#john-hills/choo-choo-choo-chin-chow

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,Scotty L
Date: 28 Nov 13 - 05:23 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tiuwMxre-8

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,John from Kemsing
Date: 29 Nov 13 - 03:56 PM

Let me try this "Blue Clicky" thing again.

https:/soundcloud.com/#john-hills/choo-choo-choo-chin-chow

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 13 - 09:46 PM

This is the way my father sang it:

Once in China lived a man, his name was Chili Chalu Chalan.
His legs were short and his arms were long,
And this is the way he sang his song.

Chili Chalu Chalee Chali, Chili Chalu Chali Chalee,
Chili Chalu Chali Chali, Cholika Bolika Chinaman.

When he died they buried him, in a coffin long and thin,
For his legs were short and his arms were long,
And this is the way he sang his song. (Chorus)

Subject: Origins: Once in China there lived a little man..
From: GUEST,patchouliaison
Date: 14 Jun 14 - 11:06 AM

My great grandfather used to sing this song, and it's been handed down in the family. I find it entirely racist and have asked my parents to stop singing it to my baby. They, of course, we're horrified I would make this request. Basically, I'm trying to prove them wrong, that it is a quite offensive song. Any ideas on where it came from? The version we learned goes like this:

Once in China there lived a little man.
His name was Ching-a-ling-Ching-a-ling-Ching.
His legs were short and his feet were small,
And this little man couldn't walk at all.

Ching-a-ling-Ching-a-ling-Ching-a-ling-Ching,
Ride all day oh happy man.
You no fishy-go, shorty-o.
He wept and he wept in Chin-e-o.

Thanks for any tips on its origin!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,Fred McCormick
Date: 18 Jul 14 - 06:06 AM

patchouliaison. I quite agree. I find this song racist and offensive and I woder why anyone would want to bother singing it.

Just for the record, there is a version on CD, but no, I'm not prepared to provide any details.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,Bazza
Date: 21 Mar 15 - 10:44 PM

There lived in China a very funny man
His name was chicker raka Ching Chong chan
His legs were skinny and his feet were small
This little man couldn't walk at all
Chiker raka Ching Chong Cha chikeronie
Ala bala fat man okeronie
Itchy bitchy caterpillar
Ikabie ikabie oh oh oh
His servants carry him in sampan
Funny little screwed up gentleman
Chiker raka Ching Chong Cha chikeronie
Ala bala fat man okeronie
Itchy bitchy caterpillar
Ikabie ikabie oh oh oh

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,Kittymama
Date: 01 May 15 - 06:07 PM

It's racist and offensive (for those who are collecting support for that position, patchouliason). We sing it privately, because it makes us think of our late mother, but we know better than to sing it in front of people. Which makes it sound as though we have a private little racist club, but, sigh, it is what it is. At least we've protected succeeding generations.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,Barbara
Date: 08 Nov 15 - 12:07 PM

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Feb 18 - 06:55 PM

In China once there lived a great man
his name was Chickarraka chee chi chang
his legs were long and his feet were small
hat poor man couldn't walk at all

cheeee chikarraka chee chi cho
chickalorum on my orum inny vidneys got to go
ishy kishy co
inny vi china man

the servants used to carry him around
on their backs while the folks used to shout
here he comes and their he goes
the China man with a monkey nose

cheeee chikarraka chee chi cho
chickalorum on my orum
inny vidneys got to go
ishy kishy co
inny vi China man.

(as I remember it being sung by my sister in the sixties)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,MarieaGrace
Date: 22 May 19 - 06:35 PM

CHICKA LA CHE, CHILI CHILO,CHICKA LA WANAGO IN THE BANANA GO, WANNA GO WANNA GO CHANASEE, IN THE GOWANA GO NOTCHO

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,Trevor R
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 11:40 AM

Hello all.
It is neat to see so many variations of the same song.
This was our version of the song growing up. Sung on May a car ride to the cottage.

There was an old man and he lived in china
his name was chickaracka chee chi cho
His legs were long and his toes were short
and he could neither walk nor talk.

Chorus:
Chickaracka chee chi chum chickalora bungalora piggy wiggy wag
Cho cho cho hit him on the go go
chitta-boy chitta-boy chee chi cho

the chinaman, he grew so stout
the servants couldn't carry him about
They took him up to the top of a hill
and rolled him down like a rolling pin

(Chorus)

the china man he had a wife
he kept her in a miserable life
Because her pigtail was so long
he sold it for a Chinese song

(Chorus)

the china man, he will die
in his coffin he will lie.
Then they'll send him back to japan
and that's the end of the china man.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,Allyson Watson
Date: 20 Jun 20 - 08:52 AM

We were taught one when we were kids 50 years ago.

THERE WAS AN OLD MAN HIS NAME WAS CHANG
CHICKA RICKA CHOO CHIN CHANG
HIS ARMS WERE LONG AND HIS FEET WERE SMALL
THIS POOR MAN COULDN'T WALK AT ALL
CHICKA RICKA CHOO CHIN CHANG.

CONKA LORUM PUGGY WUGGY WEE
EECHA PEACHA ETICA PETICA ETICA PETICA CHEETAH CHEETAH.

NOW THIS OLD MAN HE WENT TO SEA
TO SEE THE ISLE OF JUBILEE
THE SHIP WAS SUNK AND SO YOU SEE
THAT WAS THE END OF THE POOR CHINESE
CHICKA RICKA CHOO CHIN CHANG.

CONKA LORUM PUGGY WUGGY WEE
EECHA PEACHA ETICA PETICA ETICA PETICA CHEETAH CHEETAH.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 20 Jun 20 - 09:40 AM

Has anybody here looked closely at the lyrics before jumping on the usual bandwagons?

I've just been looking through the original 5 verse version from c1836 and the full song is definitely about one person and in no way implies this person is in any way typical of any race, in fact quite the opposite. The song is vaguely 19th century comic and there's lots of nonsense employed particularly in the chorus. There is just one hint that it might be a proto-minstrel song. If there is any prejudice implied here might I suggest that it is one of mocking a disabled person?

However, I do agree that one wouldn't want to offend by singing the song in public simply for the reactions and false perceptions it might invoke.

In the early 19th century there were thousands of songs of a similar nature caricaturing the Irish or a fictional Irishman. Some of these stage songs eventually were adopted into the Irish traditional repertoire and are still sung today by the Irish. Is it fine for the Irish to sing them but nobody else? (A rhetorical question)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 20 Jun 20 - 04:59 PM

This thread is a testament to what can be achieved by a forum such as Mudcat. For a researching folklorist it is a goldmine. A plethora of variants. can I just make my usual plea, if you post a version sung in your family or community can you please tell us where and when at least?

As for any racist allusions, it is worth reading Azizi's post somewhere in the middle.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST,Anonymous
Date: 25 Mar 21 - 05:59 PM

This is the version I remembered from the mid 60s.

Chinaman had a wife, let her lead such a miserable life.
Led her up to the top of a hill.
Let her roll like a rolling mill.
Chicka lie chee chi cho chicka lora
Bunga lora piggy wiggy wack wack.
Hoka poka hit him in the coca.
Chatterby chatterby chee chi choka.

Chinaman had a daughter, let her play on the teeter tauter.
Led her up to the top of a hill, let her roll like a rolling mill.
Repeat Chicka....

I am sure a lot of words are wrong, but this is how I remember it. Sang it while jumping rope.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Aug 21 - 05:51 PM

Nan from Liverpool UK sang us this version

Once there was a very great man, his name was
Chicaraca Chee Chi Chi,
His face was merry and his sins were small,
He went to the Cross and he lost them all

With a Chicaraca chee chi, chi chicalora.
Concalora, many pee cat.
Cat go, too go, aticatti catti go,
Hush a bye, china buy, Chinese go.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 'Once in China there lived a great man...
From: Joe Offer
Date: 15 Aug 21 - 11:09 PM

This is one of our earliest threads on "Chinaman" songs. And yes, it is still a fucking racist song. And if you are more disturbed by the word "fucking" than by the racism of this song, then maybe your head isn't screwed on right. I included the word "fucking" as a test.

Mudcat is often criticized for allowing the posting of songs that are considered racist. But yet, Mudcat is a Website that studies folk songs, warts and all. It is not a site for cleaning up songs - "euphemization" is more-or-less anathema here. We post songs as they were originally sung, although we may clean them up a bit when we sing them.

But a song like this is pure racism, and can't be cleaned up like "The Cat Came Back" and "I've Been Working on the Railroad" or "Shortnin' Bread." This song is racist to the core. Sometimes, people will sing songs like this to illustrate the racism of the "Good Old Days," but songs like this should never be sung for enjoyment or entertainment. Songs like this may sound cute to some, but they're not. They're fucking racist.

If you don't like the word "fucking," get over it. If you're a racist, get over that, too.

Take a look at the Racist Songs threads. We do not support racism in any way, but we do our best to report it accurately. There's a difference, although it may take a certain level of intelligence to understand that.

Joe Offer, Mudcat Music Editor