BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...

Subject: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Jun 04 - 11:25 PM

Okay, this is a shameless attempt in soliciting help in a homework assignment but I'm involved with a Main Street program and have to come up with some opportunities in dealing with a creek that runs thru our town.

I am aware of Austin, Tx, Kansas City, Mo and Fredrick, Md. and the way they have dealt with their water problems/opportunities but no others.

Anyone aware of other cities or towns?

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: mg
Date: 30 Jun 04 - 11:38 PM

Well, Kelso Washington has the Cowlitz river run through it. A bridge helped nicely, as did a huge number of saloons when I was growing up (Longview, which runs into West Kelso). mg

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Jun 04 - 11:39 PM

Thnaks, Mary, I'll check out their website and see what they've done...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: IvanB
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 12:56 AM

The Grand River runs through Lansing, MI, and the city has developed the riverfront into a series of parklands connected by an 8 mile walkway named, appropriately, The Riverwalk. East Lansing houses Michigan State University and the Red Cedar River flows through East Lansing (and the campus) to join the Grand in south Lansing. East Lansing and MSU have developed a river trail along the Red Cedar which eventually links up with Lansing's trail network to form an extensive network for hiking, running, biking, rollerblading or what have you. Unfortunately, a Google search turns up more info on the Riverwalk Theatre, which borders the riverwalk in the downtown area.

Riverfront Park, which encompasses the land on both sides of the river for a fair distance in the downtown area, is the venue for a number of festivals and other gatherings/functions each year.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 01:05 AM

San Antonio, Texas, has a quite famous River Walk. Dallas, Texas has been attempting to finalize a very large plan to do with the Trinity River (and Trinity Forest, etc.)

My back yard has a creek in it and there is a trail back there. But I don't suppose that helps you (but we really like it!)

The National Park Service has several sites in the east along the old canals. The C & O Canal, for one. http://www.nps.gov/choh/.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: GUEST,artbrooks
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 08:52 AM

The Rio Grande runs through Albuquerque for 20-plus miles. Almost all of the land along the river is state park...a long and skinny one, half mile wide at the broadest point. There is a paved bicycle/running/ walking/etc. trail the entire length, with a dirt path for horseback riders. There are several points along the trail to park gasmobiles, and the center point of it is the Albuquerque Biopark (aquarium and arboretum ...the zoo is several blocks away).

We were in Pueblo, CO a couple of weeks ago. They also have a riverwalk...much shorter and less commercially developed than San Antonio's. There is also a 35 mile trail along the Arkansas River, but the section in the city itself is closed for improvements.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: GUEST,Rapaire
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 09:37 AM

The Portneuf Greenway Foundation here has created the Greenway, a series of (often) interconnected trails in and around Pocatello, along the Portneuf River, and so on.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Pied Piper
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 11:31 AM

Nothing as physically impressive as in North America, but I live close to the longest Canal pound in Britain, a section of the Bridgewater canal the first section of which (built in 1763) went from Worsley to Manchester.
It transported coal from the Duke of Bridgewater's mines to Manchester. As a result the price of Coal dropped by half and a portable energy source for the industrial revolution became cost effective.
The Mines were linked by a 47 miles of underground Canals and water powered,inclined planes, and went as far as Bolton 10 miles away.

PP

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bobert
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 01:00 PM

Thankee all fir your contributions. I will try to find stuff on each one here on the internet, print a few and hope they collectively help in the presentation I'm going to make...

I'll keep checking this thread, however, for new ones...

Thanks again..

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: C-flat
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 01:38 PM

The river Tees, which runs through Middlesbrough and Stockton in the UK, has always been known for its pollution. With all the heavy industry based along the river it was an ugly commercial eyesore, tolerated because of the work it provided.
Now the heavy industry has gone and a lot of money poured into re-vitalising the river and its surroundings. They've done a remarkable job.
I wish I could provide some "before" pictures to give you a better perspective of what has been achieved!
C-flat.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: C-flat
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 01:52 PM

There's also some information here about the "white-water" canoe course, created at the newly built barrage and also some photographs of dinasour-type-sculptures which are part of another river-walk development further along the Tees.
C-flat.

Subject: ADD: Blue Sunset (Graeme Miles)
From: C-flat
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 01:58 PM

...........and why not add a musical connection.......


BLUE SUNSET
(Graeme Miles)

In Summertime the blue sunset fills a grey Northern sky.
Across the grime-covered rooftops the yellow seagulls do fly.
And the grime from the tall factory chimneys turns orange, violet and grey
As it moves away down the river and along the amber Tees Bay.

Now what makes the blue Summer sunset? What turns a Northern sky green?
What turns the seagulls to yellow, when white is what they should be?
And the smoke from the tall factory chimneys, O, why is it not oily black
As it rolls away down the river from the top of the tall chimney stacks?

Chorus:
And the grime from the tall factory chimneys turns orange, violet and grey
As it moves away down the river along the amber Tees Bay.

Now I know the blue Summer sunset is caused by factory fumes
That fill the sky full of sulphur and turn it greenish from blue.
And the light shines on the birds flying and gives them their yellowy sheen
And the smoke turns orange and violet and reflects in the Tees' muddy stream. Chorus

In Summertime the blue sunset fills a grey Northern sky.
Across the grime-covered rooftops the yellow seagulls do fly.
And the grime from the tall factory chimneys turns orange, violet and grey
As it moves away down the river and along the amber Tees Bay. Chorus

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Emma B
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 02:13 PM

When visiting friends in south Manchester we usually end up walking part of the Mersey Valley.
see www.manchester.gov.uk/leisure/parks/mersey                Chorlton Water Park

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: open mike
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 03:36 PM

In Oroville, there is a river which flows near downtown. On the river side of the leveee the recreation dept. has put a hiking/biking trail.
this leads form the fish hatchery to the swimming beach and beyond to a disc golf course and fishing access spot. The Feather River Nature Center is an historic Chinese Bathhouse used by rail road workers many years ago. It was a hang out for homeless people, and a place where murders occurred, and now has been transformed into a Nature Center. http://frrpd.com/westpark.shtml
WALK THE FEATHER RIVER WITH REX BURRESS
Rex shares his wealth of knowledge as he
takes groups on a unique stroll along
the Feather River Bike Trail. Bring your camera!
No Admission Fee LOCATION DAY DATE TIME AGE/LVL
Meet at Muni Aud Sa 05/22 9:00-11:00 Adlt
http://frrpd.com/walkingtheriver/riverwatcher.pdf
http://oroville-city.com/

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 08:16 PM

I grew up in Wichita, Kansas, where the Big & Little Arkansas rivers meet. They had a serious flood control problem years ago, 'mostly' solved by digging the "Big Ditch", to drain excess water. Now they have an annual RiverFest on the river, and can landscape and use places that used to flood.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: CarolC
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 08:45 PM

There's one in Columbus, Georgia near here on the Chattahoochee River. It's nice in its own way...

http://columbus.vanderkrogt.net/us2/columbus_ga_riverwalk.html

...but my favorite is Town Run in Shepherdstown. Have you ever tried to find all of the really cool places that little creek runs through, under, over, and in between? If you haven't, I suggest getting together with Claymore and having him give you a tour. It's very very cool.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bobert
Date: 01 Jul 04 - 10:34 PM

Well, Carol, I know it runs right thru the Blue Moon Cafe and thru the college, but no, I don't know where else...

I need a good excuse to hook up with that ornery ol' cuss anyway...

Woulda ya mind PM'ing me his phone nummer again. I've misplaced it...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: open mike
Date: 02 Jul 04 - 01:18 AM

here is another eating place htat has a stream running thru the middle of it. http://www.brookdalelodge.com/history/index.html

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 02 Jul 04 - 06:48 AM

Mottingham is near the Great River Quaggy, which from it's humble source in Darrick Wood, Locks Bottom, (where it is called Kydd Brook)flows through the rolling countryside of Petts Wood, Chislehurst, Elmstead Wood, Sundridge Park, Sutcliffe Park, Kidbrook (which was evidently named after it's earlier designation), and Lee, until it unites with the famous River Ravensbourne at Lewisham and makes it's way via Deptford Creek into the River Thames.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jul 04 - 12:05 PM

You got it, Bobert. PM on the way.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: wysiwyg
Date: 02 Jul 04 - 12:17 PM

Our small town. Want a local contact? You might find that someone still has the presentation materials that they used.

Our situation-- low-lying town in a small valley, as towns up here are usually sitch-e-ated. Periodic town flooding from runoff coming down into town, I guess. Anyway there is now a small concrete channel running through various parts of town. Dunno if they made this from a creek or dug it from scratch. Solved the problem, tho-- in the three years I ran the local Red Cross, we had no in-town floods while other nearby parts of the county did flood.

PM for further contact info and I can try to hook you up.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Don Firth
Date: 02 Jul 04 - 02:04 PM

Dunno if this is the kind of thing you're looking for, but Seattle is surrounded by water:   Puget Sound to the west, Lake Washington to the east, Lake Union and Green Lake within the city limits, with numerous bodies of water not more than a half-hour's drive from city center. Beaches at Golden Gardens and Lincoln Park on Puget Sound, beaches and walks along the shores of Lake Washington and all the way around Green Lake (joggers' and roller skaters' paradise!), Gasworks Park on the north shore of Lake Union, and all kinds of park and walkway areas along the Lake Washington Ship Canal that connects Lake Washington with Puget sound (and going through Lake Union and Portage Bay). The U. of W. Arboretum includes walkways along the water's edge. Rivers, creeks, and sloughs everywhere! I've heard that one family in five in the Seattle area owns a boat of some kind—anything from an eight foot rowboat to an eighty foot yacht (more of the former than the latter). Not so nice is the Duwamish River that runs up through south Seattle and into Elliott Bay. It's a bit of an industrial sewer. Map. Be careful not to slip in the goose poop.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bobert
Date: 02 Jul 04 - 03:21 PM

Thanks CarolC, Don, Susan, etal...

Actually, the creek that WYSIWYG is the exact scenerio that I'm dealing with. It floods aver few years and makes a mess but, seeing as my business was right on the creek, I have always felt a certain love fir the danged thing...

The town, Leesburg, Va., is the county seat of the fastest growing county in the nation and is growing in leaps and bounds, except some 14 acres along the creek which are prime for a major *town-within-a-town* redevelopement. I kinda see the creek being turned into a canal that could be used for paddleboats with retail and restuarnts on first floors, offices and condos on upper floors (we have a 4 story limit on building).

I am really impressed with Lansing, Michagan and also with San Antonio, Texas and plan to use them in my presentation next week. I'll get with you, Sauas to see what you have 'cause it sounds like at least the engineering part of project...

Thanks all, and I'll keep checking this thread for further goodies.

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bert
Date: 02 Jul 04 - 05:02 PM

There's 'The Embankment' in London.

Here in Phoenixville, PA. we have The Schuylkill Canal with it's towpath but it doesn't get much use.

And that little trickle of water in that great big ditch in Pueblo CO. shouldn't really be called a river.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: EBarnacle
Date: 02 Jul 04 - 05:09 PM

Don't forget New York City. It is almost possible to walk all the way around Manhatten in designated walkways. Brooklyn has several, one from Owl's Head Park to Dead Horse Bay passes under the Verrazano Bridge, One from Sheepshead Bay goes through Gateway National Park and ends near JFK Airport. Eventually, they will be connected in Coney Island. All are bicycle and skate accessable as well as having lanes designated for pedestrian use.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: wysiwyg
Date: 02 Jul 04 - 06:17 PM

No walk path here tho. Unobtrusive and workmanlike jobbie.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Rapparee
Date: 03 Jul 04 - 09:26 AM

Bobert, here's a map of Pocatello's Greenway trail system, including the bike lanes and such.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: open mike
Date: 03 Jul 04 - 06:00 PM

music input:

I got a mule and her name is Sal
15 miles on the Erie Canal
She's a good old worker and a
good old pal
15 miles on the Erie Canal


We've hauled some barges in our day
filled with lumber, coal and hay
and every inch of the way we know
from Albany to Buffalo .

Low bridge, everybody down
Low bridge, cuz we're coming to a town
and you'll always know your neighbor
you'll always know your pal
if you've ever navigated on
the Erie Canal..

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Mr Red
Date: 04 Jul 04 - 05:03 AM

Gloucester - Sharpness canal and Stroudwater. They meet at the Saul junction and as it happens there is a Folk Festival on this very w/e.

The S to G cuts-off land near the river Severn which is called (after the canal engineer) Ephraim Island. It takes sea-going vessels and still has a sizeable docks in Berkely (whichis square-ish). they bring a tanker full of house heating feul to Frampton where Saul Junction is.

And Frampton has a folk evening every Tues in the Village Hall.

Very rural though.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Leadfingers
Date: 04 Jul 04 - 07:14 PM

If the mood should come upon you , you can walk almost the entire length of the Thames From London to The Source . And ALL the canals have got Towpaths you can walk ( or cycle) .
By the way Birmingham has more miles of canal than Venice , though some of the adjacent architecture is not quite so interesting .

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Helen
Date: 04 Jul 04 - 08:30 PM

Hi Bobert,

Here in Newcastle, New South Wales, Oz Newcastle City Council has done a lot of work to make the local creek which leads into the river mouth & harbour, into a nice place for a walk with bicycle or wheelchair access as well. They have done up what they call The Foreshore on the Harbour and cleaned up the creek and put a cycleway/walkway along it. You can look up the Council website and cruise around it looking for images.

You can do image searches on Google for

"Throsby Creek" Newcastle Australia

e.g.   Throsby Creek - just down the road from where I live

or for

Foreshore Newcastle Australia

This whole project has totally changed the way the CBD (central business district) of Newcastle looks as well as the inner suburb I live in now and the one I moved from a few years ago, across Throsby Creek.

There are some local walks listed here
Newcastle Tourism Walks

Honeysuckle Dev't Corp - commercial venture doing a lot of buildings, redevelopment etc

I'll see what else I can find.

I used to be involved in Main Street programmes firstly as a Council Main Street Coordinator, and then as the local Coordinator working with a Main Street Committee.

Helen

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Jul 04 - 10:48 PM

Thanks, Helen and others...

Yeah, Main Street is a cool concept and we are kinda new at it but just starting to put together some successful programs. Nothing breeds sucess like a little success...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: greg stephens
Date: 06 Jul 04 - 05:01 AM

Bobert:
I have been involved all my working life with events on canals/rivers/ the sea. I have had many decades of contact with two great northern English cities, Liverpool and Manchester, which have managed to start to regenerate themselves enornously, after great economic decline. And a lot of th the focus of this regeneration has been waterways led, and a lot of it was pumped up and driven by the arts in the early days. A typical scenario(taking many many years) goes like this
1) dirty old canal, no boats (trade finished) full of dead dogs,supermarket trolleys. beside the canal a large empty windowless warehouse, trees going out of the roof.
2) Volunteers start tidying up the canal, pressurise British Waterways to reopen it for boats,
3) Someone organises a Canal festival by it one summer. A few stalls, the local folk group, some morris dancers, a couple of boats.
4) School natural history projects on canal. Water is getting cleaner(businesses forced to reduce pollution). Bick colony of crayfish found, publicity in local paper.
5) Festival goes well. next year, more music, and a firework show on the Saturday night: shells fired off the roof of the warehouse, giant firedrawing attched to fire escape pn side of warehouse overlooking canal basin.
6) Community arts company hires premises by canal.
6) Enterprising developers (used to run a local trendy night club) take a look at the warehouse.
7) Grotty old pub by the canal cleans out the yard that is next to the canal, turns it into a beer garden.
8) 15 mile stretch of canal reopened to traffic, now connected to national system. Big marina opens in old canal basin.

9) Small industrial units (printing firms etc) open on site of demolished outbuildings beside ware house.
10) Warehouse bought by developers, turned into trendy flats. Locals laugh in derision. One year later, all flats let, trendy young professional couple and gays.
11) New concert hall for city orchestra built 1/4 mile up canal from warehouse. Coffe bars and ridiculous clothes shops start to spring up along back streets round canal.
11) Person who owned grotty little canal-side business hiring out rusty old beaters sells up his little bit of land for £15,000,000 and retires to private Caribbean Island (last bit's for you Bobert!).
   That is a mythical scenario, but it's roughly what has happened with the various bits of water in Manchester, Liverpool and Birmingham, and can be paralleled in loads of town in England( and I am sure in America too). Go for it guys.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: GUEST,Hugh Jampton
Date: 06 Jul 04 - 07:48 AM

And not to be forgotten, the walk from London to Bath by way of the Avon and Kennet canal and rivers, a corker!!

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 06 Jul 04 - 12:12 PM

Yes Greg and once all the trendy flats are built, they put up fences with locked gates (not BW keys either) and you find that you've got a 2 mile walk from where you moor your boat (if you can even find a visitor mooring - ie Statford-on-Avon) to the nearest pub. I can think of many trendy canal-side pubs which are now very boater unfriendly.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: greg stephens
Date: 06 Jul 04 - 01:30 PM

Dave Bryant: please note, I didnt say I liked all these sort of changes that happen as places regenerate/gentrify. If you get me on the subject of BWB heritage-style railings round locks and hanging baskets and "moorings officers" (mostly previously sacked from concentration camps for over-zealous behaviour).....well I'd never stop.
   I worked in the Albert Dock in Liverpool before it went....well, like it is now. I don't revisit it now for pleasure, put it that way. But it has certainly generated jobs, and preserved the fabric of the water-front buildings.
   At least the Rochdale Canal is now open again at Miles Platting...some years ago they filled it in with concrete (leaving a cosmetic water depth of 6 inches), did a bit of "landscaping", and got an architectural award for doing so. I will forgive the tweeness, the cafe latte, the whole package of tarting up, at least it's kept the places operational and full of life, instead of dirty ditches full of crap and haunted by degenerates.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bobert
Date: 06 Jul 04 - 01:36 PM

Well, thanks to both of you. I'd like to end up somewhere in between where access is universal to everyone and where the mix of redevelopment will pay as much attention to moderate priced housing as it does to million dollar condos. This mix is paramount as far as I am concerned and I let my feelings be known in every meeting and private discussion.

I will agree with Greg though that "degenarates" are not part of the overall vision... Gotta draw the line somewhere...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: greg stephens
Date: 06 Jul 04 - 01:46 PM

Well, I've stood with Bobert beside the Virginian creek in question, so I can confirm that at the moment they have a fairly open access policy. And also some very nice butterflies, i may say.
   Now what they need is a little folk festival by the creek, Bobert. or maybe you've had one already?
    If you do have one, please consider the Boat Band: we have played more canal,river and sea festivals than most, in Britain at least. And if we did come and play there, you get a consultant on Urban Regeneration through Waterways Art thrown in.(Thrown in to the deal that is, not the creek. Or perhaps in the creek as well, after a few beers).

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 07 Jul 04 - 10:22 AM

Greg - have you any idea what's happening at Foxton (Leicester Branch, GU). The last I heard BW were going to build a big new pub on the site of "Bridge 61". I should really ring Tony Matts and find out I suppose. It was 1980 when Dave Blagrove and myself started the original annual charity folk session and as far as I know, the one two years ago was the last.

I don't suppose that BW have made any progress with their proposed scheme to rebuild (there's not enough left to restore) the inclined plane. I must admit that I'd rather see the money spent on the suggested Bedford - GU link.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Leadfingers
Date: 07 Jul 04 - 11:25 AM

The sad thing about cleaning up the Canal System is what has been the nasty side effect of tidying Gas Street Basin in the centre of Birmingham . ALL the pubs seem to have been 'Themed' and despite being named after Canal engineers and the like are NOT the sort of pubs Folkie Boaters would want to go wthin a mile of !!

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: greg stephens
Date: 07 Jul 04 - 11:32 AM

Leadfingers
Youve put your finger on the contradiction of it all: the price we have to pay for the survival of the canal system is that nobody wants to go boating any more.

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bobert
Date: 07 Jul 04 - 05:37 PM

Gregster,

When we get this project finished I'm going to promote the largest ever music festival in Leesburg along side our new water feature and the Boat Band can play any time slot it wants...

Sho nuff...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: greg stephens
Date: 07 Jul 04 - 06:29 PM

You got me wrong, Bobert. Art must lead regeneration, not follow it. Don't wait for the redevelopment, raise awareness now. Have the little festival to start with. Only needs a few musicians sat on chairs under a tree somewhere by the creek, enjoying the butterflies, doing a little guitar picking, eating good food. And beer-drinking (maybe that's not possible in America? I've heard bad reports of dry folk festivals there).

Subject: RE: BS: Creek, River or Canal Walks near you?...
From: Bobert
Date: 07 Jul 04 - 07:58 PM

Actually, Greg, when I used to have my office right there on the creek I kept a beater guitar in the office and spent many a lunch hour sitting over there by the creek playinn' while folks strolled by... But, hmmmmmm, a larger festival? Grand idea!!! Absolutely genious... But timing is everything...

Bobert