BS: Barack Obama

Subject: BS: Barack Obama
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 09:22 AM

I normally don't start political threads, and I certainly don't want this one to degenerate into name-calling or knee-jerk conservativism/liberalism. But anyway

what did you think of Obama?

He's supposed to be a rising star for the Dems, and I've heard serious talk about a presidential run.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,mack/misophist
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 09:53 AM

What I think is that it's waay too early for any kind of national assessment.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Jeri
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 10:35 AM

Even Scarborough (Fox news channel guy who usually interrupts and shouts over people) was praising his speech last night. I liked what he had to say, and how he said it. It was the best political speech I've heard in recent years.

He still seems to have ideals, and the focus of his speech seemed to be about ideals and doing what's right, instead of the anti-Republican ranting I'm used to hearing. I think he has pretty broad appeal, probably as a result of his inclusiveness. I watched some discussion of him on one of the news channels (can't remember which) before the convention, and they said his supporters included independents and some Republicans as well as Democrats. I think he needs more of a history before tackling anything as big as the White House.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: saulgoldie
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 11:07 AM

We will be hearing more of him. Of that I have no doubt. This is a GOOD thing.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Mark Clark
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 11:26 AM

I thought his speech was brilliant. I figure after eight years of the Kerry administration and eight years of the Edwards administration Obama will have had enough time in the Senate to give us eight years of his administration. I figure it'll take twenty-four years to undo all the damage four years of du_mbya has caused. After that, I may no longer care.

I'm thinking I should move to Illinois just so I can vote for Obama.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amergin
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 12:02 PM

I don't think he'll ever be president....he's the wrong colour.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 12:08 PM

I don't think that's a requirement, Amergin...


A

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 01:46 PM

If Barack can fend off the Rovites for eight years maybe he'll be selected as John Edwards' running mate.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: saulgoldie
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 02:10 PM

But what if Kerry loses? (shudder!)

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Deda
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 09:52 PM

If Kerry loses, God save us all. The enviromental damage, and the destruction of our civil liberties and our system of checks and balances, will by then be beyond conceiving -- they're already beyond belief.

Barack Obama was fabulous! Great speaker, great story! I hope he rises to the top as fast as he seems to be.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Once Famous
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 10:01 PM

Obama is very well respected here in my home state. He is a Harvard Law School graduate and has been a teacher at the University of Chicago as well as a state senator from the Hyde Park district on the South side of Chicago.

He is articulate, personable, has much charisma and very smart. I wouldn't mind seeing him become President, however, I would not want to wait 8 years. Kerry is wooden and rigid and says a lot of nothing. Obama addressed more real issues in his 15 minute speech than I have heard out of Kerry.

My best scenerio is that Kerry loses because I would not want to wait 8 years for Obama.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: DonMeixner
Date: 28 Jul 04 - 11:50 PM

I think you all saw the first non-white American President last night.


Don

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: katlaughing
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 12:06 AM

I second that, Don!

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 10:52 AM

I would feel better if I knew who wrote his speech.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 11:29 AM

He sounded good.

Some very good points.

I was impressed how he was able control the moment and the listeners outbursts to get so much of substance into his fifteen minutes. And people, seemingly, were really listening.

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Rapparee
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 12:43 PM

Well, that's two things Martin Gibson and I agree on. (The other is the OUTSTANDING qualities of Chicago's hot dogs.)

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Kim C
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 01:25 PM

I didn't see his entire speech, but only sound bites on the news & such. He is well-spoken, intelligent, and actually seems sincere, which is a rarity among politicians of any party. If he can stay that way, and manage not to be corrupted by The One Ring of Political Power, then... you heard it here first ... I'd vote for a Democrat for President again.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: katlaughing
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 01:56 PM

Rog says we should find out who all the speechwriters are, the good ones, and vote them in, instead!**bg**

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Larry K
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 02:48 PM

I was mentioning Barack being the second black president (behind Clinton) and the person told me that Barack was not born in the USA making which would not allow him running for president.   I had never heard that before.   Does anyone know if that is true?   

I am not joking or looking for controversy.    I only to to validate or contradict what someone (who I think is knowledgeable) told me.

What will happen first- a woman, a jew, or a black president in the USA?

I believe Hilary or Colin Powell would have a shot at winning.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: michaelr
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 03:28 PM

Anyone can make a pretty speech. Let's wait until he has a record in the Senate, and then see.

Like all other speeches I saw at the DNC so far, his was long on feel-good stuff but very short on specifics.

Cheers,
Michael

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Les B
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 04:48 PM

Found on an offical looking site - looks like Barack is SOL.

Legal qualifications

The Constitution establishes only three qualifications for a president. A president must (1) be at least 35 years old, (2) have lived in the United States at least 14 years, and (3) be a natural-born citizen.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: CarolC
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 05:07 PM

I read that he was born in Hawaii, which is where his mother met his father when they were both college students there.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 05:22 PM

Some confusion is maybe caused by the fact that Barak Obama (which is how the name is correctly spelt) is also the name of his Kenyan father.

The younger Barak is as American as George Bush, John Kerry or Michael Moore.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: CarolC
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 05:56 PM

According to Barack Obama's website, his name is spelled Barack:

http://www.obamaforillinois.com/index.asp?Type=NONE&SEC={8683FB66-C0DB-4FAB-85C7-2FBCF770436E}

And I think I agree with michaelr on this one. Let's see how what his voting record looks like after he gets elected, if he does get elected.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Burke
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 06:01 PM

He hasn't been elected to anything more than his state senate. He has no real opposition in his bid for the Senate. Yet already he's the party hope for the future?

I have nothing against him, but I'd like to see more than one good speech. Anyone else remember when Mario Cuomo's keynote address made him the darling & future hope of the party?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: freightdawg
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 06:16 PM

I didn't get to see his speech, but from all the resulting furor over what he said I gather that he placed himself as a uniter instead of a divider. If that is his true nature, then I say let's have more of him.

He seemed to be emphatic that there is just one America, not two or more. Too bad Edwards didn't hear his speech.

I am so ready for a statesman, someone who will face the idiots in his own party with the same resolve that he faces the idiots in the opposing party. Is Obama the one? Or, will he be forced to become the official mouthpiece of the party of which he is a member? That will be what I am looking for.

(violating my pledge to not post to a political thread, but this is a good one. Thanks, Rapaire)

Freightdawg

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 06:29 PM

In Kenya the spelling would apparently be Barak, and that website of his has both spellings. But I suspect that the Barack spelling is the one he'll settle on - part of the American tradition of changing names.   (On the other hand people are more used to seeing the spelling "Barak", in the context of reports about Israel politics, though of course that is a completely different name.)

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Bill Hahn//\\
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 08:33 PM

How is this for a ticket----say, 2012 (assuming 2 terms for Kerry)===Hillary/ Obama?
      You know that it will not happen---so how about---Edwards/Obama--and hopefully Hillary will still be around ---or can we resurrect Eleanor.

Bill Hahn

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Charlie Baum
Date: 30 Jul 04 - 12:28 AM

McGrath--

The semitic root B-R-Q means "lightning" and gives us the Hebrew name Barak.

The semitic root B-R-Kh means "blessed" and is the origin of Barack Obama's first name. When encountered as a Hebrew name, it usually comes out as "Baruch." (I had an uncle by that name, though everyone called him "Sam.")

--Charlie Baum

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 30 Jul 04 - 03:41 AM

Charlie's quite right. Barak is a Swahili word adopted from Arabic, cognate with Hebrew Baruch.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Rapparee
Date: 30 Jul 04 - 10:00 AM

He can spell his name "S-A-M" or any way he wants as far as I'm concerned -- it's his name.

I agree, we need to know more about him than one speech. But if he develops as that speech promises...well.

(AND he said he'd speak for 15 minutes AND he kept his word! Now THAT'S two political firsts if there ever were such -- a pol keeping his word as well as a short speech when he's got the stump!)

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: katlaughing
Date: 30 Jul 04 - 03:29 PM

Personally I'd like to see a Hillary/Teresa or Teresa/Hillary ticket. This two are brilliant!

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Bill Hahn//\\
Date: 30 Jul 04 - 07:12 PM

Yes---Hillary/ Teresa. One problem. Teresa---I am still wondering why she spoke. Good speech---sort of like the old joke---"Well, enough about you let's talk about me".   The idea of the infoconvention was to nominate her husband.

      Hillary, on the other hand, had every right to be peeved---finally getting a speaker's spot only to introduce Bill. Which she did.   
      Now---Hillary/Obama---that is viable.   Administering your inheritance and running a nation are two different things.   Hillary, to me, is in the mold of Eleanor Roosevelt---though I do doubt that anyone, so far, has been able to fill her shoes---shoes for want of a better word.

    Eleanor---no Mamie(domestic), no Jackie (style/charisma), no Bess(dowdy), no Laura (prissy), no Ladybird (Billboards), no Nancy (astroligical powerplayer), no Barbara (mother earth figure)---no---she was unique.

    As the cliche goes---will we ever see her like again?


Bill Hahn


Bill Hahn

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Deda
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 03:04 PM

The New Yorker did a write-up a month or so about Obama --well before the convention-- which you shold be able to access here (knock wood).

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Bill
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 02:40 PM

I'm not sure people are ready for an islamic president just yet but maybe in 10 to 20 years.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Kim C
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 02:46 PM

If he can keep hold of his enthusiasm & sincerity after a stint or two in the Senate, he'll be a serious contender.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 03:16 PM

Obama is a Christian. His father was an agnostic African tribesman (Luo tribe, Kenya), his mother a Christian white woman from Kansas. In Kenya, Swahili, the lingua franca, borrowed many words from Arabic. But the use of Swahili does not indicate that one is a muslim.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Once Famous
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 03:16 PM

On Space Ghost, it would be Brak

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 03:28 PM

MG, you are obsessed with bad TV. (The Munsters? Space Ghost?)

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Once Famous
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 03:43 PM

Not obsessed.

Just love to see who's paying attention.

Interesting how you also know who Brak is.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 04:24 PM

Yes, I too love old, bad TV shows...but was Brak the cat creature or the bug creature?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,samsung
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 04:26 PM

He is perfect run him Oh please.

Sam

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Once Famous
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 04:46 PM

Brak is the cat creature with the patrol boy belts.

The bug eye creature, which I believe is supposed to be a mantis is Zorak.

Just think, if Brak was from Alabama we could call him Brak Alabama.

I don't think either one would be electable in the deep south, do you?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 04:51 PM

Here's a great article on Obama's religious views

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 04:52 PM

Maybe Barak is Zorak and Brak's love child...

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Once Famous
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 05:02 PM

He would figure to have a real strange mouth if that were so.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Rove
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 06:25 PM

Gimme Obama Please.
CR

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 07:53 PM

Well, now that Barack Obama has been elcted, it will take some time to see how he does with the new Senate which is going to have some very colorful (no pun intended) redneck Rebubs for Obama to wrestle around with...

Oughtta keep him real busy...

Prsident? No way. A black Dem doesn't have a chance of winning the presidency. Maybe in 50 years when most of us are sitting 'round that song circle in the sky...

Now a black Pepub.? That is doable because, like Bush, he will just be front man for a much larger behind the scenes operation...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 09:16 PM

Interesting take, Bobert. I'd like to think you're wrong, but you may be right.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 01:12 PM

"He is articulate, personable, has much charisma and very smart"

Yeah? Well so was Hitler.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 01:16 PM

What did you mean by that dumbass statement, GUEST, guest? And did you ignore the previous part of that post:

He is a Harvard Law School graduate and has been a teacher at the University of Chicago as well as a state senator from the Hyde Park district on the South side of Chicago.

Not very Hitleresque, methinks.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 01:21 PM

Why so touchy Nerd? Did I hit a nerve? Being a "Harvard Grad, teacher, etc.,etc. hardly makes a person untouchable. It's that kind of blind faith that corrupts. He's trying to be all things to all people, therefore he is untrustworthy.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Dino
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 01:24 PM

Sounds too much like Osama to me.

Black Osama?

Dino

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 01:30 PM

Interesting thought Dino

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 01:51 PM

I guess you guys are just plain stupid...

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 02:04 PM

Evidently Nerd, judging from your need to call people names shows you are intolerant of opposing viewpoints. I managed to voice my opinions in a civilized manner without calling you names. You however, seem incapable of the same civility. How unfortunate. It also shows what kind of blind followers Obama has. America take note.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 02:14 PM

Guest, guest,

yadda yadda yadda, hominy hominy hominy. You guys crack me up. It's alays the same...come in here and bait someone by saying Moronic things (this mixed-race liberal from Chicago is JUST LIKE HITLER!) and then when people tell you how dumb it is whine about how intolerant and uncivil they are. Do you really think that ANYONE here hasn't seen this a million times before?

So for the record, no I don't REALLY think you're stupid. You are playing a role of "guy who says stupid right-wing stuff and calls a left-of-center politician Hitler," and I am playing the role of "guy who points out how stupid that is." This allowed you to play the role of "wounded right-winger who for once gets to call another person intolerant and uncivil." Or to invoke the Nazis again, you are the agent provocateur, I am the provoked citizen, now you try to win the crowd to your side.

It's all just a play and we've both been in it before, Guest, guest. Does that make you feel better?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 02:27 PM

You play the martyr well Nerd. Unfortunately it doesn't correct your poor manners or closed minded approach to the viewpoints of others. You obviously are not mature enough to have an adult conversation. I also was not aware that there were sides to be taken or people to be won over. But if you feel the need to posture and paw at the ground please feel free to do so. And for clarification Nerd, I did not call your Golden Child "Hitler" I said "so was Hitler" I also did not call him a mixed race liberal. Please pay better attention to sentence structure or you run the risk of twisting a person's words. But then maybe that was your goal. I thought this thread was a place were one could state their opinion. Evidently that is true only if one's opinion agrees with the majority. How undemocatic of you. Hopefully you will never be in political office, I'm sure your first task would be to squelch free speech. Enjoy your thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 02:30 PM

I'm not playing the Martyr, buddy. That would be you. I'm just being honest about what this exchange really is. You're still playing the same old role.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 05 Nov 04 - 06:26 PM

Hmm...

Guest, guest says:

" It also shows what kind of blind followers Obama has. America take note."

Then Guest, guest says:

"I also was not aware that there were sides to be taken or people to be won over."

Guest, guest wants it both ways, as usual...

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Plain Stupid
Date: 06 Nov 04 - 10:37 AM

I'm Nerds daddy.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Nerd
Date: 06 Nov 04 - 10:59 AM

Hi, Dad. I dodn't know you posted to Mudcat! But why did you take the name "plain stupid?"

Oh, gosh, I guess you really got me...



































NOT!

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: 3refs
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 12:10 PM

Barack Obama is to Christianity what Michael Jackson is to heterosexuality. He might be one, but he's not the poster child for the cause. You know, when I watch Obama and the other overtly ideological southpaw's queue up to play the Christ card, it takes me back to Kerry in '04 when he tried to convince gun owners and hunters that he's a Nimrod.

Full Article HERE

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: 3refs
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 12:14 PM

That was by Doug Giles.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Alice
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 12:17 PM

What venom, 3refs. You have quite a twisted view of Democrats... and of Christ.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: 3refs
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 12:45 PM

It was not my intention to take ownership of the posting. It was written by Doug Giles!
I'm not in total disagreement or agreement! I have my views and beliefs which are left, right, on the fence and much of what is in between.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: bobad
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 12:49 PM

Why post the venomous rantings of a single issue fanatic?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: wysiwyg
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 01:27 PM

Isn't the the latest/current political "deity"-- you know, the one   we haste to praise now but will soon be eager to "pants" in as vitriolic and public was as possible?

The reality is, anyone who can get far enough in US politics to be electable as Prez is gonna have a lotta dirt-stripes in their drawers.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 01:38 PM

Who is "Doug Giles"? If this is a copy from some publication, why not give a link to it?

It always seems to me strange when people who are opposed to abortion concentrate their attention on the stuff about what's legal and what's not, and not on the business of looking for ways to get rid of the kinds of pressures and injustices that often push women into having abortions which they would far sooner avoid.

Change the world so that those pressures and injustices were eliminated, and the number of women choosing abortions would probably fall dramatically. Keep those pressures and injustices, and the numbers will stay steady or rise whatever restrictions on abortion existed.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,His Middle Name is
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 04:28 PM

Not a problem but a Repulican Op Ed Rodgers was stessing his middle name Hussein:

Barack Hussein Obama

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: kendall
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 04:29 PM

No one whose last name ends with a vowel has ever been elected president.

As far as experience goes, what did George W Bush have? Governor of Texas? That qualifies a man to be president of the whole USA? The man has failed at everything he has tried, including the presidency.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Don Firth
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 06:31 PM

Hell, I wouldn't care if Barack Obama's middle name was Osama. Or even if his name was Osama Obama! He's the best thing I've seen on the horizon so far.

Is it possible to do worse than George W. Bush?"

"Papa Bush gave Georgie the presidency to play with. And he broke it."

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: dianavan
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 06:46 PM

I like Obama. At least I think he's right for the U.S. at the present time. I'd like to see Dion in Canada and Obama in the U.S. I believe they represent the will of the people. Isn't that who are leaders are elected to support?

With Obama and Dion, we have hope.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Elmer Fudd
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 08:30 PM

I thought we weren't supposed to post long cut-and-paste stuff. No source is given, the person who posted it doesn't even cop to agreeing with the whatever-it-is. So, what's it doing here?

Elmer

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: kendall
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 10:12 PM

Thinking back to Washington, it seems that many of the presidents had last names that ended in "n".

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: bobad
Date: 03 Dec 06 - 10:13 PM

What is the significance of names ending in vowels?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: kendall
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 04:28 AM

I don't know that there is any significance, but a friend of mine mentioned that when we were discussing the 2008 election. I mentioned Giulaini and that's what he said. I think he has a "Mafia" hangup.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Bill D
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 10:41 AM

what a choice Obama has.....run now with only a couple years of public experience, and at a fairly young age- but with a groundswell of support, or wait (probably) 10 years till whoever wins in '08 finishes.....with no idea what the political climate will be by then.

I'd 'prefer' to see him wait, but maybe THIS is "when the iron is hot".
*IF* he runs, I hope the Democrats make the race congenial and help each other, no matter who gets the nomination. Too much to hope for?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 12:41 PM

I'd have thought Hillary Clinton would be trying to get him to settle for being her vice presidential candidate, with a promise of her backing him to follow her as President, if she wins. And a pretty good chance to be the Democrat candidate in 2012, if she loses.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: kendall
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 01:15 PM

Neither Hillary nor Obama will ever be elected president. In this country, the best man/woman seldom wins.Mark my words, if either of them gets nominated to run it will be a sure thing for the republican.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 01:52 PM

Anyone presented to you as a "good choice" by the major media (privately-owned media) is a shill. That person has been vetted and has answered all the questions properly. That person will serve the interests of the ruling elite.

So Obama, Edwards, Clinton...they're all shills. But it's interesting to figure out what purpose each is meant to play in the scheme of things. In Obama's case, the subject is a black man with a muslim-sounding name (even sounds a lot like 'Osama'). As if Americans are going to vote for a black for president, or a bin Laden sound-alike. Obama is meant to be the less-offensive alternative to the reeking Hillary Clinton.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 01:55 PM

Pardon me. He's the MORE offensive alternative to Hillary Clinton. When Americans are faced with the prospect of a BLACK in the WHITE house, even Hillary will seem a welcome choice. That's the scheme. Just divisive racial politics forced on us by the elites, as usual.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 02:56 PM

I suppose there'd be a gauntlet of witticisms about "Barat Osama"...

...........................
No one whose last name ends with a vowel has ever been elected president.

What about Kennedy?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GLoux
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 04:18 PM

No one whose last name ends with a vowel has ever been elected president.

Monroe
Fillmore
Pierce
McKinley
Coolidge

?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: kendall
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 07:51 PM

Well, I finally got a response!

By the way, Coolidge wasn't elected.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 08:10 PM

Well, as I pointed out a couple of years ago, Obama ain't gonna get elected as president... Wrong party for a black to win...

Now as fir this Dog Giles article... Hmmmmmmm??? Let's put this Christainity in a little perspective here... upwards of 650,000 people murdered by the Bush war machine yet the Christain Right thinks that George is one of them???

Give my boney hillbilly butt a break...

George Bush had better not hope for the Rapture to occur because the first thing that Jesus is going to do is expose all these war-mongers for what they are: heathens, creeps and rednecks...

But not to worry, Bush won't be going to be in the call up... No, he'll be left right here with the rest of the cockraoches...

That is, if one believes in the "Rapture" which, BTW, flies in the face of everything I believe at a follower of Christ...

Beam me up...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 09:15 PM

I'm sure there'll be pollsters rushing around in circles trying to work out the impact of the fact that Obama had a black father and a white mother, and how both those facts might influence how various people voted, and whether they voted.

It's possible to postulate it working either way.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: dianavan
Date: 04 Dec 06 - 11:18 PM

Obama is the brown face of America.

How many people are now all white or all black?

Its already been discussed and decided that he will get the inter-racial vote which might well be a majority by now. If they are not, they are probably the parents of an inter-racial child.

He will also get the votes of those that don't give a damn about the colour of a person's skin.

It may be that white folks are actually a minority in the U.S. anyway. Just in case, it doesn't hurt to have Baptist roots (does he?) to woo the Christian Right.

Nobody wants Hilary although she would probably be a better president.

A Hilary/Obama ticket might actually defeat the Republicans.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 05 Dec 06 - 07:10 PM

I think the country would welcome a black president. They were quite excited about Powell, who might have won. I like Obama. He seems sensible and practical. I think he had a Muslim father..not sure about his mother. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Jeri
Date: 05 Dec 06 - 07:29 PM

I spent about 45 minutes answering poll questions a little while ago. Obama was my second choice, and one of the questions WAS about his parents origin. Didn't mention color or race, just that his father was from Kenya and mother from Kansas. No effect on my decision to vote for him at all. I don't know if his race effects my decision to vote or not to vote. To be honest, it's high time there was an African American president, but race shouldn't be a reason for voting for someone. One wonders how many brilliant possibilities have never been considered over the years.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 05 Dec 06 - 07:36 PM

Here's a lengthy extract from Obama's book The Audacity of Hope� where he writes about abortion and religion and so forth.

Very well worth reading. You could have quite a president there.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Dani
Date: 05 Dec 06 - 09:22 PM

I'm SO excited about the possibility of an Edwards/Obama ticket, I can't even tell you.

I think it's time.

'Course we lost Bill Bradley that way: more good than we deserved.

Dani

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: tarheel
Date: 06 Dec 06 - 03:13 PM

One speech does not qualify anyone for President!
Tar...

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Bobert
Date: 06 Dec 06 - 06:08 PM

Yeah, I think I could vote for an Edwards/Obama ticket rather than doin' my usual Green thing but that depends more on what the Dems do in the next 2 years to stick it to Boss Hog and his buddies...

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 06 Dec 06 - 08:13 PM

How about Obama/Edwards instead. I like them both but would like to see a woman (ABH..let's make that ABP too) on board. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Dani
Date: 06 Dec 06 - 10:14 PM

Yeah, maybe that ticket could go that way.

They are very different.

It strikes me that the President needs to be the 'ideas' guy, the 'face', the firestarter and feather-smoother all at the same time.

The VP seems to have more down and dirty work to do. I know more about Edwards than Obama, but the thought of the two working together in any combination is very encouraging.

Think we could elect a black President?

Dani

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 06 Dec 06 - 10:37 PM

of course. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Dani
Date: 07 Dec 06 - 09:52 PM

I mean more "we's" than just us'ns.

Dani

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Azizi
Date: 07 Dec 06 - 10:09 PM

I agree with Jeri's statement that race shouldn't be a reason for voting for someone.

Condolezza Rice is an African American. So does that mean that if she was nominated for President by the Republicans, Black Americans would vote for her? I just don't think so {that said with much attitude}.

In the last election Republicans in Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Virginia ran a Black candidate with the hope that African Americans would be stupid enough to vote for that candidate just because he was African American. Each of those candidates lost. Why? because African Americans were smart enough to vote for the candidate that represented their best interests and the best interests of their state & and the best interests of this nation. In each of those cases, that candidate happened to be a White male.

The Republicans played a new version of the race card. And lost.

Good for us.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Azizi
Date: 07 Dec 06 - 10:12 PM

Btw, I agree with tarheel's 06 Dec 06 - 03:13 PM post, except I would say that "One speech should not qualify anyone for President"

Who one's father is * should also not qualify anyone for President.

*think Bush

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Azizi
Date: 07 Dec 06 - 10:21 PM

Correction-those states in which Republicans put up a Black candidate to entice Black people to vote Republican were Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Maryland.

When I wrote "Virginia" I might have been thinking of former Senator Allen. But, technically, he's an African American since his motehr comes from North Africa. But we don't want to claim him, and he sure as heck doesn't want to claim us.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Mrrzy
Date: 08 Dec 06 - 12:29 PM

And if you pronounce his first name in Hungarian it means Apricot.

I don't think the US is ready for a president without a WASP-ish name.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 Dec 06 - 12:45 PM

Once again, the fact you elected Kennedy suggests otherwise.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: dianavan
Date: 09 Dec 06 - 02:30 AM

Mrrzy - Do you really think Americans are stupid enough to vote for a president, based on the person's name?

Are you implying that the people in the U.S. will vote for someone named Bush, no matter how stupid he is, because his name is Waspish? Are you saying the voters are so uninformed that issues do not matter.

If so, America is in bigger trouble than I thought.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 10:19 AM

OPINION By DAVID YEPSEN
REGISTER POLITICAL COLUMNIST
Nov. 12, 2007

The six leading Democratic presidential candidates showed up for the Iowa Democratic Party's big Jefferson Jackson Dinner on Saturday night, and five of them gave very good speeches.

Barack Obama's was excellent. It was one of the best of his campaign.

The passion he showed should help him close the gap on Hillary Clinton by tipping some undecided caucusgoers his way.

His oratory was moving, and he successfully contrasted himself with the others — especially Clinton — without being snide or nasty about it.

That was an important thing for him to do. Historically, the Iowa party's "JJ" dinner is a landmark event in Democratic presidential caucus campaigns. All the key party activists, donors and players are present. This year, about 9,000 of them showed up.


(Most were from Iowa, though there was some grumbling that Obama packed the place with ringers from Illinois. Joe Biden even greeted them in his speech. The charge that they brought in outsiders was denied by the Obama people, who were nevertheless pleased they beat the other candidates in the noise war inside Veterans Memorial Auditorium.)

What's important isn't the hoopla. It's what the candidate does on the stage and while all did quite well, Obama was particularly impressive. Should he come from behind to win the Iowa caucuses, Saturday's dinner will be remembered as one of the turning points in his campaign here. For example:

He said the Iraq war "should have never been authorized and should have never been waged," a shot at the votes Clinton and most of the others cast in favor of it.

• Obama took another dig at the Clinton era when he said "we have a chance to bring the country together to tackle problems that George Bush made far worse and that festered long before George Bush took office."

• He tweaked Clinton for not taking questions at some of her events by saying: "Not answering questions because we're afraid our answers just won't be popular just won't do it." (Clinton is also currently vexed by controversy over her staff trying to plant questions with Iowans.)

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: EBarnacle
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 11:35 AM

There was a profile of Obama in the New York Times Magazine on November 4 or this year. I found it compelling.
I also find it interesting that his campaign is the only one which has not been asking me for money for the past year. I don't know how I avoided being put on his list but I will be contacting them later today to get put on for the information factor. I may even end up working for his candidacy.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 11:50 AM

Dianavan, I think Azizi is correct that having an unusual and/or non-Waspish name will lose a candidate some votes in an American election. Matter of fact, I'm sure of it. A god many people ARE that stupid...or they are that set in their habits and reactions to things. They fear the unfamiliar and are attracted to the familiar. That does not mean she said that the name will be THE vital and deciding matter in who wins the election.

"Kennedy" is not an unusual name in mainstream middle-class America. Dukakis and Obama are unusual names in mainstream middle-class America, and having such unusual names will lose a candidate a certain amount of support.

Imagine if someone with the surname Bin Laden or Hitler or Stalin or Satan tried to run for office. ;-) They could be the absolute perfect candidate, the best in every way...they'd still lose.

I wish Obama luck. He seems like a pretty good man to me.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 11:58 AM

What would the Arab world's(where we have spent the past 7 years nuturing hostility) reaction be to an American President named Barack Hussein Obama? On the main very positive, I would think.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 12:01 PM

Interesting point, L.E.J....but they don't get to cast votes for him. Too bad. ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 12:21 PM

No -- but that good-will might be cash in the bank as far as effectiveness in foreign relations is concerned. He'd have a lot more credibility with Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia and so on than a brush-cutting, Texas white-boy, fathead named "Bush".


A

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 01:07 PM

Excellent article from Atlantic Magazine on Obama's candidacy here.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 02:20 PM

"At its best, the Obama candidacy is about ending a war—not so much the war in Iraq, which now has a mo­mentum that will propel the occupation into the next decade—but the war within America that has prevailed since Vietnam and that shows dangerous signs of intensifying, a nonviolent civil war that has crippled America at the very time the world needs it most. It is a war about war—and about culture and about religion and about race. And in that war, Obama—and Obama alone—offers the possibility of a truce.
The traces of our long journey to this juncture can be found all around us. Its most obvious manifestation is political rhetoric. The high temperature—Bill O'Reilly's nightly screeds against anti-Americans on one channel, Keith Olbermann's "Worst Person in the World" on the other; MoveOn.org's "General Betray Us" on the one side, Ann Coulter's Treason on the other; Michael Moore's accusation of treason at the core of the Iraq War, Sean Hannity's assertion of treason in the opposition to it—is particularly striking when you examine the generally minor policy choices on the table. Something deeper and more powerful than the actual decisions we face is driving the tone of the debate. "

(From LEJ's link above, Atlantic. I think this writer has his act together, me.)


A

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 02:25 PM

From "RadioIowa"...a web news site:

"Obama: "people are paying attention"
Friday, November 9, 2007, 1:49 PM
By O.Kay Henderson
Barack Obama is in the midst of a barrage of media appearances as he works to overtake rival Hillary Clinton, the perceived front-runner for the Democratic party's presidential nomination. Obama made a brief appearance on last week's "Saturday Night Live" and this past week he granted a number of interviews to national media as well as to Radio Iowa.

Obama will be the guest on this weekend's "Iowa Press" program on Iowa Public Television and after Friday's taping, Obama spoke with reporters in the third news conference he's held in Iowa.

"People are paying attention now, so it's a good time to get out there," Obama said. "Obviously we're in a tight race here in Iowa. We're in a tightening race in New Hampshire and we want to make sure that voters -- when they're now paying attention -- have as much of a chance to hear from me as possible on the widest range of issues as we can offer."

Obama describes the contest among himself, Clinton and John Edwards as a "horse race" and Obama contends it will come down to which candidate voters believe can "deliver" on their promises. "I feel more passionately than ever that we need some truth-telling, that we can't just run the conventional, sort of mealy-mouthed political campaigns that we have in the past," Obama said during the news conference. "I believe that that message that we're delivering is resonating and that's why we're doing well here in Iowa."

During his appearance on "Iowa Press" Obama suggested one of the main problems with Clinton's candidacy is half of the American people indicate they wouldn't consider voting for her and that leaves little margin for error next November if she's the party's nominee. Moments later, during the news conference, Obama resisted a direct verbal assault on Clinton, however.

"I'm not interested in taking pot shots just for the sake of taking pot shots," Obama said. "...I'm not somebody who dislikes Senator Clinton. Nor do I dislike Senator Edwards. I intend to win because my message is better and because I can be a more effective leader for the Democratic Party but I'm not going to manufacture stuff just for the sake of manufacturing it and so I feel very comfortable in being clear about where there are differences and being honest about where there's common ground. I mean, after all, we're running in the same party.""

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Janie
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 02:31 PM

Well worth reading and pondering, LEJ. Thanks for the link.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 03:31 PM

Kennedy is a Waspish name? The heck it is. They were Venetian Blind Irish..mg

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 08:09 PM

I didn't say Kennedy was "waspish". I said it was a common name in the white North American middle class culture. And it is. You don't have to be a "wasp" to have a common North American middle-class name. The name can be of English, Scottish or Irish origin... and either of Catholic or of Protestant origin.

Dukakis is not such a name. Obama is not such a name. They don't fit the common mould of white middle-class America. As such, they are somewhat disadvantageous names for a presidential candidate.

It is also somewhat disadvantageous to be female or to be non-white or of mixed race.

It is somewhat disadvantageous to be openly gay. (did I say somewhat????)

It is somewhat disadvantageous to be really short or overweight or physically unattractive in some way.

All these things play some part.

How much? That varies.

The one thing that is NOT disadvantageous is to have powerful friends in the Coporatocracy that both chooses and funds the front-runners. That is hugely advantageous, and it is the single most important key to winning....they who can afford to buy the most airtime are they who will get elected.

Thus, if you want to be president you are pretty much required to sell your soul to the Corporatocracy, and say what they want you to say.

And after you are elected, you do what they want you to do.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 13 Nov 07 - 07:11 AM

I'd suggest that "WASP" is an expression that should be pensioned off in this kind of discussion, rather than being gratuitously extended to cover people who aren't "White Anglo-Saxon Protestants".

I suppose Barack Obama could be called a Black Anglo-Saxon Protestant...

If you could elect him it'd do an enormous amount to roll back the distaste for America and its politicians that has been generated in recent years around the world.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 13 Nov 07 - 05:39 PM

To hell with his etymology. It's his ability I am interested in; he sounds like an able and rational man. The question is, can he fight and win in the rat-infested sewers that constitute the halls of national government? I would like to bet he can.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 05:12 PM

just to be fair and balanced...

Fox news tells me that he is the one that was brought up in a radical muslim madrassa.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 08:56 PM

Do you believe that for a New York minute?

I don't.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: artbrooks
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 09:03 PM

Snopes on the Obama/Muslim/madrassa myth.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 09:56 PM

Surely Donuel's purpose in crediting Fox News with that story was to indicate that it was garbage.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 10:25 PM

Well, the debunk link leaves the smear in shreds. It's another of those hateful Swiftboat schmear campaigns, vitriolic and without regard for honesty, venomous and irresponsible, that gives Fox the worst of its repute.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 11:49 PM

Well, I'm sceptical that FOX News reported this, as much as I am not a fan of them. Where's that evidence?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 11:54 PM

If you could elect him it'd do an enormous amount to roll back the distaste for America and its politicians that has been generated in recent years around the world.

Why would it do that, McGrath?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 01:20 AM

Here is information about the Fox coverage.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 09:30 AM

Who will remember the debunking except you?
About a third will remember.
At last count almost 30% polled believe the radical Obama muslim story to this day.

Whispering campaigns now use the megaphone of fake news conferences, fake magazines and fake organizations.

Its perfect! It helped elect a fake president, start a fake war and spend between $1,600,000,000 snf 3 trillion $ depending upon which fake budget office numbers you want to believe.

Thats a of of money we spent but thik of the people who
The FOX stories are fake, only the lies and the money are real.

PS even the value of our money is now becoming fake.
Its down 38% since 2001.

We had our money in our homes which are now worth about 20% less on top of the 38% drop in the dollar. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That is some pretty slick thievery if you ask me.

Let the banks buy them u at 50 cents on the dollar and the rip off cycle will be complete.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 09:48 AM

The Times opines:

"If the globe can't vote next November, it can find itself in Obama. Troubled by the violent chasm between the West and the Islamic world? Obama seems to bridge it. Disturbed by the gulf between rich and poor that globalization spurs? Obama, the African-American, gets it: the South Side of Chicago is the South Side of the world.

Michael Ignatieff, the deputy leader of Canada's opposition Liberal Party, said: "Outsiders know it's your choice. Still, they are following this election with passionate interest. And it's clear Barack Obama would be the first globalized American leader, the first leader in whom internationalism would not be a credo, it would be in his veins."

To the south, in Mexico, resentment of the Bush administration has less to do with American unilateralism and more with stalled immigration policy and the building of a border fence. But the thirst for change is the same.

"Mexicans want evidence that things are shifting, which means the Democrats, and of course a woman like Hillary Clinton, or a black like Obama, would signal a huge cultural change," said Jorge Castañeda, a former foreign minister.

"My sense is the symbolism in Mexico of a dark-skinned American president would be enormous. We've got female leaders now in Latin America — in Chile, in Argentina. But the idea of a U.S. leader who looks the way the world looks as seen from Mexico is revolutionary."
"

I think this answers the question CarolC asks. Between Dennis and Obama we'd have more brains in the White House dining room than have been there since Kennedy dined alone.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 09:54 AM

I'm interested in learning what McGrath has to say about why he thinks Obama getting elected will do that he said it would to. I'm a bit confused. I would think it has something to do with foreign policy, but I can't really see any difference between Obama's foreign policy and that of the Bush people.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 09:56 AM

He will still accept a Vice Presidency in a heart beat.
I hope.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 10:36 AM

An Obama VP would be Hillary's life insurance.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 10:44 AM

There's a triangle dance worth watching -- Bill, Hill, and Obama. I would choose some sort of doo-wop for the background music.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 12:50 PM

LOL! Yeah, it's quite an image isn't, it? Bill could play the saxophone.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 02:15 PM

There's not much to add to what Amos said there, Carol.

My remark wasn't based on what Obama would actually do, and on whether he'd live up to his promises or the hopes he might arouse. Politicians very rarely do either, and there's no reason to think he'd be the exception.

It was based on the message that his election would send to the rest of the world.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 02:43 PM

That's interesting, McGrath. Sounds like it's all about appearances then.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 04:05 PM

Precisely. But that's sometimes the most important thing. "All the world's a stage..."

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 05:00 PM

It's important, but I don't see the nature of the importance in the same way that you do perhaps. For instance, appearances are important for the practice of sleight of hand, but what does that get you? Well, if it's sleight of hand that is being used in a shell game, for instance, if you allow appearances to determine your actions, you'll just end up with your money being taken from you.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Ron Davies
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 10:50 PM

Don't give up on Obama. The Hillary juggernaut can still be stopped.

2 scenarios:

1) Hillary wins in Iowa but not by much. Obama second, Edwards third. Edwards should immediately volunteer to be Obama's VP, and urge his supporters to support Obama. That will make it a real horserace.

2) Obama wins over Hillary, Edwards third. Edwards should do the same thing--and Hillary will be in trouble.

Everybody who hasn't done so yet--the Atlantic article on Obama is truly worth reading, and makes his case vividly.

In a nutshell: Hillary is and always will be burdened by the 60's legacy--and Obama is not.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Mike
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 10:09 AM

Wow. Going back and re-reading this thread from the beginning is fascinating! It begins right after his speech to the 2004 DNC.

I am wondering three things right now.

First, would Edwards actually accept the VP slot, even though he says he doesn't want it?

Second, would Barack choose Colin Powell to serve in his administration? There are rumblings again that Powell might endorse Obama, which will be a big blow to the McCain campaign.

Third, the left bloggers and pundits are starting to be much more critical of Obama for positions he is taking since winning the nomination. Arianna Huffington and Keith Olbermann are two high visibility people who are doing this. Will moving to the right hurt Obama, and keep new voters from joining the Elect Obama movement that became so powerful so quickly in the primaries?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 10:45 AM

You know, I heard all about that 2004 convention speech, but I never had a chance to hear it. Anybody know where I can find it?

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Mike
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 10:48 AM

I'm guessing it's available at the American Rhetoric website, Joe.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 11:07 AM

Thanks for the hint, Mike - it's here (click).
-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: irishenglish
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 11:17 AM

Regarding Powell. Obama will take his endorsement of course, but to serve in the administration? After the UN debacle, it would be very risky I think for Powell to serve in Obama's Cabinet. Some see his pending endorsement as an act of contrition for the UN speech, but my gut reaction is, no.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: GUEST,Mike
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 02:01 PM

I agree with what you say irishenglish, but then I'm a leftie.

But the MSM spinners keep putting Obama's name with Republicans for his VP choices, as they do at this MSNBC blog today (scroll to the bottom story):

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/07/02/1179652.aspx

The other story that is odd to me is the first one on the blog.

First, they say Obama is acting like a 'typical' Democratic candidate, using the same strategy Gore and Kerry used, ie tack left in the primary, right in the general.

Then they say he is different because (wait for it) "Barack Obama is a different kind of Democrat. He is one who actually intends to win."

Doesn't that sound a little strange? I mean, I certainly think both Gore and Kerry wanted to win. Does a MSM spinner saying Obama is "a different kind of Democrat" make it so, espcially when the campaign strategy is pretty much the same as Gore/Kerry/Clinton, but using his issues instead of theirs?

I'm voting for Obama no matter who he chooses as VP, and no matter how far right he swings to hit that constantly moving target the MSM spinners refer to as "the center".

But with him tacking so far to the right these days, I sure would feel better if the "unity" we were talking about would to unite Democrats like Edwards, rather seeking unity with Republicans like Powell and the evangelical right, for god sake!

Also, what is with this 'Obama brand' thing I keep hearing about? What exactly is the 'Obama brand'?

Clearly, I don't think like these folks do. But maybe someone here gets it, and can explain it to me?

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: irishenglish
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 02:19 PM

Mike, I agree, and I'm voting for Obama as well. Kerry and Gore of course were trying to win. Actually....Gore did win of course!!! I can't think of an election where the country was waiting with such anticipation for a VP, and that goes for both Obama and McCain. Can anyone say Dan Quayle?! I also really, really hope he would choose Edwards, and frankly, I can't see why Edwards wouldn't want the job. I think Richardson is still a very strong possibility, but there are all sorts of strategies for picking a VP these days, so he might make a strategic choice, rather than a personal one. I do not think as well, that Obama will choose a Republican, as a way of striding towards unity. I also think that, while this would not be an easy thing to do, Obama needs to tell his campaign staff right now, and I mean now, July 4th weekend, that what I say goes, let me handle it. In other words, they are in entrenched mode now, they don't want any big screw ups, which leads to Obama's campaign right now looking like anyone elses. Forget the celebrities, forget the other diversions, get him out there right now with the fervor that was so rampant just a few short months ago. I know he's still getting huge rallies, and donations, but what some of the pundits are saying is true, and he needs to get it back. The sooner the better I think. Maybe he's just holding back for the bacchanalia of the convention, but I think he should stop worrying about what his advisors will say, and focus on what got him to this point

All in my ever so humble opinion of course!

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Riginslinger
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 04:19 PM

Assuming they will have to make a VP pick before the conventions, Obama will have to choose before McCain.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 04:24 PM

COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. (AP) — In a bastion of the religious right, Barack Obama urged Americans Wednesday to look past the "bustle and busyness" of their everyday lives to find a way to help make the American dream real not just for themselves, but for all.

The call for service is part of a flag-draped week focused on God, country, veterans and freedom. They are larger-than-life themes, all prominent in the successful campaigns of President Bush and aimed at introducing Obama to Americans who know little about the presumed Democratic nominee.

Before a boisterous University of Colorado crowd, Obama said the quiet following Friday's Fourth of July celebrations would be a good time for every person to consider how they can contribute "to our most pressing national challenges" — whether in the military, overseas or just next door.

"I hope that you take a moment to think about what you can do to shape a country we love, shape its future," Obama said. "Loving your country shouldn't just mean watching fireworks on the 4th of July."

Obama talked in almost achingly intimate terms about the impact service had on him, as a boy who "spent much of my childhood adrift" and often had little idea "who I was or where I was going" because of the absence of his father. But early in college, he said, values like hard work and empathy instilled by his mother and grandparents resurfaced "after a long hibernation." He eventually found himself working as a community organizer in a devastated South Side Chicago neighborhood, and said he was transformed.

Obama's call echoed Bush's "love a neighbor like you'd like to be loved yourself," an enduring staple of the president's political speeches of the last eight years. But Obama's campaign said the focus on service was meant not to recall Bush, but to reach back to President John F. Kennedy's generation-captivating "ask not" address or President Clinton's legacy of creating AmeriCorps.

To Obama, the problem is not that Americans are not willing to serve. It's that they have neither been asked aggressively enough nor given enough opportunities. In a clear slap to Bush, he decried that Americans eager to pitch in after the 2001 attacks were merely "asked to shop."

His solution is to promise repeated calls for American sacrifice as president and, to put teeth behind that, a major proposed expansion of government national service programs, first unveiled in Iowa in December, that would cost $3.5 billion a year. His campaign said he would fund the spending with some of the savings from ending the war in Iraq and by canceling a new tax break for multinational corporations.

One new piece announced Wednesday would create a new "Green Vet Initiative" offering counseling, job placement and mediation with industry for veterans wanting to enter the rapidly expanding renewable energy field.

...

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: irishenglish
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 04:42 PM

To Obama, the problem is not that Americans are not willing to serve. It's that they have neither been asked aggressively enough nor given enough opportunities. In a clear slap to Bush, he decried that Americans eager to pitch in after the 2001 attacks were merely "asked to shop."

Interesting and true point Amos, thanks for posting that. Adding to that was the aftermath of Katrina. I remember thinking, as the news got worse and worse, I know people were just itching to say, let me in coach, I'm ready. Why didn't they organize people with small boats who were willing to come and help? Why didn't they comandeer a couple of commercial airline flights filled with all the donations people were making, and fly them in as close as they could get them? WHy didn't they ask for anyone, and I mean anyone, who would volunteer to drive supplies as close to the city as they could possibly get? Instead we got....well, we all know what happened. I still get so upset about that.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Bobert
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 05:45 PM

I would love to see Colin Powell back at Secretary of State but with new mission... He allready knows the players and I never thought he felt too comfy with Bush's foriegn policy...

Yes, John Edwards would jump on the VP if was offered to him but it won't be and should Obama be elected then Edwards would more than likely be his Attorney General...

VP's: Bill Richardson or Jim Webb... It's a toss up...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 06:12 PM

I hear you, irish. The blatant, manifest insanity of government has gone on too long. My hope for Obama is that so far he thinks rationally and does not duck and hide from problems.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Riginslinger
Date: 02 Jul 08 - 10:31 PM

"I would love to see Colin Powell back at Secretary of State but with new mission..."


                   Well, he sure got the short end of the stick the last time around. Frankly, I can't think of anyone who could do the job as well as Colin Powell, no matter who the president is.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Stringsinger
Date: 03 Jul 08 - 07:24 PM

"Evidently Nerd, judging from your need to call people names shows you are intolerant of opposing viewpoints."

There is no opposing viewpoint, here, just an ignorant cant with no facts to back up
any of these assertions. These prejudices are a disease in our political landscape.

Obama has problems in my view. 1. He wants to build up soldiers in the Mid-East,
a dangerous precedent. 2. He embraces Faith-based initiatives which erode the
First Amendment of the Constitution. 3. Some argue that his acceptance of Telecomm
immunity have a chilling effect on spying on the public. (Will he prosecute them later in a criminal court? Remains to be seen).

It's obvious that he is more knowledgeable than McCain on most issues particularly
having to do with law, foreign diplomacy and economics. McCain's economic proposals
are disastrous for our country. ( McCain doesn't know the difference between a Sunni and a Shi-ite). Obama is more even tempered than McCain and is not given to tantrums and outbreaks. Also, Obama is one of the most articulate politicians in recent history.
McCain's use of the language would be an embarrassment for the Founding Fathers
of our country. Obama would fit in well.

His speech on Civil Rights will go down as one for the history books.

Frank Hamilton

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: pheen
Date: 08 Nov 08 - 07:51 PM

What a prophetic and hope giving thread this has been over the past 4 years. I've critised apathetic US citizens for not using their vote to keep out GW Bush (I'm Australian) but you've impressed me here by voting in a multicultural human rights activist visionary. The rest of the world has renewed hope. Gold star on the back of the hand USA people!

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Bill D
Date: 08 Nov 08 - 09:00 PM

What fun reading this old thread...and noting the slightly mistaken predictions of some of us....

But, thank you pheen: we are pleased at how well it worked out, even though 55 million of us DID vote for McCain. I suspect that in a few years, even more will be glad it went as it did.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Alice
Date: 08 Nov 08 - 10:15 PM

I was just watching Pat Robertson on Larry King saying that Obama may be one of our greatest presidents. Now that's a miracle.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Nov 08 - 10:36 PM

Obama will either become great or...well, he has greatness thrust upon him. He was absolutely correct today: he MUST hit the ground running at full tilt. He has no choice, no honeymoon period, not even a "Hundred Days."

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Ron Davies
Date: 09 Nov 08 - 10:03 PM

Source: WLBT

But it seems this is in fact happening-it's not just a Web rumor.

"Reginald Simpson, a student at Pearl Junior High School, MS, was one of two students kicked from the bus after saying the president-elect's name. Simpson said that the driver told the students to stop saying Obama's name because she didn't want to hear it."

"In another incident, a girl's basketball coach told students they would be suspended for saying Obama. Superintendent Ladner said that both the driver and the coach were disciplined and assured that no student will be punished for saying Obama's name".





At least the superintendent is willing to step in and stop these characters--I suppose that's progress in Mississippi.

And in case the officials in the area flag in their zeal for freedom of speech, the ACLU is saying anybody who feels their freedom of speech is being infringed can contact them.

Subject: RE: BS: Barack Obama
From: Amos
Date: 10 Nov 08 - 10:15 AM

He seems already to have hit the ground running. He is swinging into action in forming up his team, and has already caused a stor by ordering a review of Bush's "Executive Orders" for remediation.


A