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Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'

GUEST,Lighter (w/o cookie) 19 Aug 04 - 08:14 PM
GUEST,Lighter (w/o cookie) 19 Aug 04 - 08:34 PM
SINSULL 19 Aug 04 - 09:14 PM
cobber 20 Aug 04 - 12:17 AM
dick greenhaus 20 Aug 04 - 01:52 AM
Roberto 20 Aug 04 - 03:47 AM
GUEST,longarm 20 Aug 04 - 04:06 AM
GUEST,Lighter (w/o cookie) 20 Aug 04 - 07:33 AM
Gibb Sahib 16 Sep 20 - 01:19 AM
GUEST,iains 16 Sep 20 - 04:20 AM
Lighter 16 Sep 20 - 10:18 AM
Gibb Sahib 17 Sep 20 - 12:49 AM
GUEST,henryp 17 Sep 20 - 04:28 AM
Lighter 17 Sep 20 - 07:50 AM
allanwill 17 Sep 20 - 11:07 PM
GUEST,Martin Ryan 18 Sep 20 - 02:28 AM
Gibb Sahib 18 Sep 20 - 04:49 AM
GUEST,Wm 18 Sep 20 - 10:29 AM
RTim 18 Sep 20 - 12:43 PM
Lighter 18 Sep 20 - 12:53 PM
Lighter 18 Sep 20 - 01:41 PM
Lighter 18 Sep 20 - 01:52 PM
Gibb Sahib 19 Sep 20 - 05:56 AM
Lighter 19 Sep 20 - 09:41 AM
Lighter 19 Sep 20 - 09:44 AM
Gibb Sahib 20 Sep 20 - 03:00 AM
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Subject: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: GUEST,Lighter (w/o cookie)
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 08:14 PM

On Nov. 12, 1939, in Belvedere, Calif., the folklorist Sidney Robertson Cowell recorded this text from Captain Leighton Robinson, Alex Barr, Arthur Brodeur, and Leighton McKenzie. You can hear them singing it at the Library of Congress's "American Memory" site.


         Sally, Sally, my love Sally!
          Way, he-ey, roll and go!
         Oh, Sally, Sally, my love Sally!
          Spend my money on Sally Brown!

[Similarly:]

         Sally Brown, I love your daughter....

         Sally she lives o'er the water....

         Sally Brown that gay mulatta,
         Oh, Sally she's a gay mulatta.

         Seven long years I courted Sally....

         She lived down along our alley....

         Sally, I will not deceive you....


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: GUEST,Lighter (w/o cookie)
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 08:34 PM

Left out the final verse:

                Off to sea I'll have to leave you....


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: SINSULL
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 09:14 PM

Damn! This thing has been noodling through my brain for over a week. I finally got rid of it and you have to post this!

Way Hey Roll and go!


AARRRGGGHHHHHHH!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: cobber
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 12:17 AM

I learned a slightly different version years ago in England.
Sally Brown She's a bright mulatta
Way Hey Roll and Go
She drinks rum and chews tobacco
Spend my money on Sally Brown

Ten long years I courted Sally
(twice)

Sally Brown she's got a daughter
Sent me sailing cross the water

The main difference is that some verses had two different lines instead of repeats.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 01:52 AM

And fom an old sailor (square rigger) I once knew--

"Sally Brown, I love your daughter..
I love the place she makes her water.."

Sailors were known to be, on rare occasion, less than polite.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Roberto
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 03:47 AM

Very good, Lighter. A fine recording, a great site.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: GUEST,longarm
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 04:06 AM

One of the verses I remember is 'Sally she flys a nice pair of topsails'

Pete


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: GUEST,Lighter (w/o cookie)
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 07:33 AM

Somewhere among the R. W. Gordon papers at the Library of Congress is the unpublished verse,

            Sally she's a nice little hooker,
            Taut and trim and a very good looker.

Gordon was sent this in the mid 1920s.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Gibb Sahib
Date: 16 Sep 20 - 01:19 AM

Olive Lewin (Jamaican folklorist) gives this song in her study of JA traditional material _Rock It Come Over_ (2000), which she recorded in 1968.

Sally was a whorin' mulatta
    Oh Sally
Sally was a whorin' mulatta
    Oh Sally
Sally sweet a day, Sally sweet a night
Sally sweet a day, Sally sweet a night
Sally was a whorin' mulatta
    Oh Sally

Work was performed on "Oh Sally."

It was used for hauling houses, which were propped onto logs and to which the ropes were attached.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: GUEST,iains
Date: 16 Sep 20 - 04:20 AM

A version with Teribus singing



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVNBbn8Zprw


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Lighter
Date: 16 Sep 20 - 10:18 AM

Outstanding performance.

Their version comes from a recording in 1968 by the band Sweeney's Men (Andy Irvine, Johnny Moynihan, Terry Woods).


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Gibb Sahib
Date: 17 Sep 20 - 12:49 AM

I'm curious, however, about what might have been the reasoning behind adding an extra beat after each refrain.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 17 Sep 20 - 04:28 AM

Planxty live

Andy Irvine again, this time with Planxty in the Abbey Tavern in 1980.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Lighter
Date: 17 Sep 20 - 07:50 AM

If I remember correctly, the original text and tune appeared in an early issue of the Journal of the English Folk Song Society.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: allanwill
Date: 17 Sep 20 - 11:07 PM

My interpretation of the lyrics by Paradiddle, an Aussie band of the late 1970's.

Sally Brown

I shipped on board of a Liverpool liner
Way-hey, roll and go.
And we rolled all night and we rolled 'till day-o
to spend my money along with Sally Brown.

Sally Brown is a nice-a young lady
Way-hey, roll and go.
And we rolled all night and we rolled 'till day-o
to spend my money along with Sally Brown.

Her mother doesn't like a tar-ey sailor
Way-hey, roll and go.
And we rolled all night and we rolled 'till day-o
to spend my money along with Sally Brown.

She wants her to marry a one-legged captain
Way-hey, roll and go.
And we rolled all night and we rolled 'till day-o
to spend my money along with Sally Brown.

I shipped on board of a Liverpool liner
Way-hey, roll and go.
And we rolled all night and we rolled 'till day-o
to spend my money along with Sally Brown.


Allan


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: GUEST,Martin Ryan
Date: 18 Sep 20 - 02:28 AM

Several mentions in this thread of Johnny Moynihan, once of Sweeneys Men. He’s still to the good in Kinvara in the West of Ireland. Pre-lockdown, Sally Brown was still a regular feature from him.

Regards


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Gibb Sahib
Date: 18 Sep 20 - 04:49 AM

Lighter -

Hmm, there is a vague similarity in form and the phrase "Liverpool liner," but they are nowhere near close enough to say the Sweeney's Men version is from the Folk Song Society article. Unless... they just glanced at it, said to hell with the tune and we'll make up lyrics / cull them from various places. And no extra beat after the bobbins in JFFS.

Here's my example of the bit in
1914        Sharp, Cecil J., A.G. Gilchrist, and Lucy R. Broadwood. “Sailors’ Chanties.” Journal of the Folk-Song Society 5(18):31-44.
"Sally Brown" in JFFS (1914) sung by Gibb Sahib


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: GUEST,Wm
Date: 18 Sep 20 - 10:29 AM

Sweeney's Mens seems to have sourced their text (and tune?) from J.M. (Sailor Dad) Hunt.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: RTim
Date: 18 Sep 20 - 12:43 PM

Sally Brown - Roud 2628. – James Bounds - Portsmouth
(GG/1/14/885) – Tune & Text – Bounds – 5 Aug 1907
Collected by Dr. G. Grardiner.

Sally Brown she’s a gay old lady
Weigh heigh roll and go
Sally Brown she’s a gay old lady
Spend my money on Sally Brown

Sally Brown she’s a matelot’s daughter
Sally Brown she is a fine daughter

Mrs. Brown I love your daughter
Oh, Sally Brown I’m a-going for to leave you

Good-bye Sally, good-bye darling
While I’m away Sally won’t you write me?

Yes, I’ll write to you my darling
When I return I’ll marry your daughter

And we’ll have a great big supper
After the supper we’ll have a dancing

There’ll be dancing and singing the whole night
The bands they will play and the bones they will rattle

And shan’t I be glad when I marry Sally.
And shan’t I be glad when I marry Sally.


Tim Radford


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Lighter
Date: 18 Sep 20 - 12:53 PM

I guess I remembered incorrectly.

But they still didn't invent it out of whole cloth.

Nice presentation, Gibb. Lloyd popularized this tune (from John Short's), with extra Sally verses, some apparently original with him, on the LP "A Sailor's Garland" (1962).

The album, regrettably, has never appeared on CD. It's a good one.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Lighter
Date: 18 Sep 20 - 01:41 PM

John M. "Sailor Dad" Hunt (1876-1951) was an American seaman who performed chanteys at the White Top Folk Festival in the 1930s.

In May, 1934, Hunt took part in what is said to have been the first radio program ever broadcast from the White House. He sang "Santy Anno."

Hunt told a reporter, "The President he says to me, he says, 'Sailor Dad, I ain't never heard nawthing like it before.'"

In 1939 he recorded "When Jones's Ale was New," "Johnny's Gone to Hilo," and "Sally Brown" for the Library of Congress.

I'm posting Hunt's "Santy Anno" to this thread:

https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=10074#68184


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Lighter
Date: 18 Sep 20 - 01:52 PM

And I've posted Hunt's "Hilo" here:

https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=15683&messages=35


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Gibb Sahib
Date: 19 Sep 20 - 05:56 AM

Ah yes, Sailor Dad. Thank you, GUEST, Wm!

Oh and Lighter, I wasn't chewing you out about the reference (in case you thought that)! I was just confused.

And thanks for reminding me of the Lloyd recording. I went back and listened and now I'm confused by another thing: Why Lloyd decided to perform so a-rhythmically / non-metrically. For all the talk people do about how "the rhythm of chanties is so important," they sing a lot in a way that has no sensible working rhythm.

I never got to listen to the Sailor Dad recording in LOC. I wonder if he added the extra beats or if Sweeney's Men did. If Hunt added them, I would guess it's because he was singing solo and so he had to sing both call and response, and needed to take a breath. Same goes for the "Sally Brown" collected by Sharp (1914) that I sang, which has an extra beat in the notation, though in a different location.

One reason why I'm interested is that I've theorized the cotton screwing songs included an extra beat as a matter of course. It would be interesting if that was preserved in Hunt's "Sally".


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Lighter
Date: 19 Sep 20 - 09:41 AM

Gibb, check your email.

I don't know much about beats, but when Stan Hugill sang "Santy Anna" at Mystic many decades ago, he added a couple:

We're sailing down the river from (X) Liverpool,
Away, Santy Anna1
Our sails are set and our (X) hatches full,


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Lighter
Date: 19 Sep 20 - 09:44 AM

>Damn!<

All on the plains of Mexico.

He said it was often (sometimes?) done. Maybe he was thinking of Caribbean shantymen?

FWIW.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: 'Sally Brown'
From: Gibb Sahib
Date: 20 Sep 20 - 03:00 AM

I don't think so. Caribbean singing is like clockwork.
Feeny Brown


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