BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?

Subject: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: The Shambles
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:13 PM

Perhaps you could provide an answer? As the main point of membership, was that we could contact each other via PMs and folk are encouraged to join - do you think that now encouraging and supporting the posting as a guest or as 'Joe Clone' [or even JC) to protect your membership identity is really necessary or is setting the very best example?

The following link has an example.
http://help.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=2686&messages=6

After all these years of complaining about it - is posting anonymously now acceptable and something to be encouraged?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:23 PM

A few weeks ago there was a glitch on the Mudcat which for a time meant that every post was marked as being from an unnamed GUEST. It was quite amusing, but instantly demonstrated that without names or the equivalent we would cease to be able to communicate collectively.

"Act only according to that maxim by which you can at the same time will that it should become a universal law." (Kant)

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: artbrooks
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:28 PM

As Mudguard noted in the thread to which you linked, Mudcat Help does not automatically insert member names. As far as I know, this is nothing new.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:35 PM

You are wrong, McGrath. Everyone posting with the guest label doesn't render collective communication impossible, as long as we have the date/time stamp on each post. Which means you have to respond to what is being said, instead of your personal perceptions of a person.

Which means you wouldn't be able to be as lazy about communicating as you are now. The whole real/fake name thing on Mudcat is an illusion created by the little man behind the curtain claiming to be the great and powerful Oz. That's what was proved with the glitch.

You, and the handful of others around here with the profound discomfort of people posting anon, constantly use the name label as a lazy form of shorthand for not having to respond to what a person says, rather than who they claim to be.

C'est la guerre.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:39 PM

It should be neither encouraged or discouraged. Nobody has the right to. And guest 12/04/04 2.35pm is spot on.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:42 PM

Neither encouraged nor discouraged. Like the person above said.

What is to be encouraged is a good attitude...

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:43 PM

Did you try using the Mudcat during the time when all the names were done, GUEST Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:35 PM ?

It just wouldn't work. It'd be so clumsy and unwieldy. Even a post as simple as "How true" becomes completely ambiguous if there is no indication as to whether it is meant ironically or literally.   Finding a post further up the thread, in order to respond to it, would become completely impractical.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST,2:35
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:52 PM

I did, and found it incredibly refreshing McGrath. Enjoyed it immensely. For the first time ever since I've been here, we had a level playing field.

And if we could eliminate "How true" and "Me too" posts completely because people are too lazy to look at the date/time stamp instead of the from line, all the better, IMO.

As the Mudcat forum works now, trying to find ANY post further up a thread is a pain in the ass, not just anon posts.

Face it McGrath, you and a small handful of other influential members have an irrational fear about anon posters/posting on the internet. Why, I have no idea. And it is, of course, your right to be paranoid. But to run an entire chat forum based upon that irrational fear, and take it to the extremes it has been taken in this forum is just bloody sick and twisted.

You are also just being lazy. One can look at the date/time stamp just as easily as one can look at the from line. You're just an old dog refusing to learn new tricks, and trying to shame and blame all the young pups outrunning and outplaying you here.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Nerd
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:59 PM

McGrath is right. Generally when reading a thread I like to read the whole thing, rather than getting to a post I want to respond to and then responding before I've read the rest of the thread. If you do that, and see 3 or four things you want to respond to, then you get to the end, and then what? Go back up through a hundred posts to find the right datre and time stamps? Ridiculous! But if you remember, "Oh, McGrath and Brucie and LH had some good points I can add to" it's much easier to find the posts again.

Also, GUEST, 12 Sep 04 - 02:39 PM, it isn't true that nobody has the RIGHT to. Max has the right to make this a members-only forum if he wants to. This forum isn't an empty area filled with our speech. It's more like a private club owned by Max, and it wouldn't exist without his software. Since he built it and owns it, he sets the rules. If he says only members can enter, so be it.

That said, I don't think Max should do that.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Peace
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 03:09 PM

Are threads about anonymous posting to be continued?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 03:09 PM

Are threads about anonymous posting to be continued?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST,GROK
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 03:10 PM

Are threads about anonymous posting to be continued?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST,brucie
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 03:11 PM

Are threads about anonymous posting to be continued?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Peace
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 03:14 PM

So, Shambles, does one of the four questions poated have more validity because of the name attached? And other than the first, how do you prove the rest are written by me?

This fixation is becoming like the bird that flew in ever-dininishing circles and eventually disappeared.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 03:16 PM

Nerd I didn't think it necessary to state the obvious.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 03:24 PM

For a new kid, you are starting to catch on brucie. Sort of.

But don't fault Shambles. He is just pointing out the double standards and hypocrisy that surround the issue of anon posting in this forum.

Max feeds the paranoia of people like McGrath and Nerd. I think he does it because he is easily entertained by making others feel uncomfortable. Personally, I think anybody who is obviously as manipulative as Max, is a jerk.

But hey, that's just cheerful, l'il ole 2:52 me.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: CarolC
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 03:47 PM

This fixation is becoming like the bird that flew in ever-dininishing circles and eventually disappeared.

This discussion was going on, pretty much exactly as it is right now, more than four years ago when I first joined. And it had been going on like that for quite a while before I joined. The only difference, as far as I can see, is the cast of characters, although some have not changed.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 04:13 PM

Nameless thread

A level playing field for "GUEST Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:35 PM" Enjoy.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 04:23 PM

But this link might work better

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 04:28 PM

No, definitely not.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 05:01 PM

God, how very clever of you, McGrath. I just can't wait for the rest of your multiple personalities to join in.

Why, I don't believe I've ever been to another spot in the universe where quite so many older adults were so completely at-onement with their personal identity fixations.

At least, not since brucie and his multiple personalities left on vacation.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 05:03 PM

I love Brucie, all of them.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST,GROK
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 05:06 PM

Thank you GUEST. I love you, too. You are badly in need of it.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: beardedbruce
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 05:07 PM

"all we need is love..."














and a winning lottery ticket.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Sam L
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 05:51 PM

I really don't mind anonymous guests at all, except for one who likes my posts sometimes, who I'd like to get to know better by following theirs. If I can't tell what a short anonymous comment refers to I decide what I want them to mean, and remorselessly don't care much beyond that.
I notice guests often talking about "influential" members, insiders, kings, feudal lords, about as often as I notice them calling these members "paranoid." A guest above sounds just like Treehouse in this regard. Treehouse seemed to feel that members who knew each other and got along well were pretty sinister, like a mafia or something. Talk about paranoid. I don't personally know a single person here, on a site maintained by someone else I don't know. So I'm happy to be tolerated at all, membership or none.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 05:56 PM

Nice try, Shambles, but no cigar. No, anonymous posting is not encouraged, but it is tolerated as long as people don't get nasty.

Use of the term "JoeClone" is another matter. The term "JoeClone" is no more anonymous than, say, "Shambles." We ask the JoeClones to post editorial explanations under the name "JoeClone" to separate their editorial actions from their posting as individuals. They are not supposed to make any sort of policy statement - those come from Max, Joe, and Jeff, under their own names. The use of the term "JoeClone" stops people from attempting to interfere with our process of supervision. I think we have a right to choose to supervise our editorial assistants directly, rather than subjecting them to interference and attacks from people outside our chain of supervision. If you have a complaint about the action of a JoeClone, you have to contact Max, Jeff, or Joe about it. That's what we want you to do.

You will note that the "JoeClone" message Shambles linked to (click) is a perfect example of what a Clone should do. It's impartial, helpful information - much like editorial comments signed "Ed" in a magazine. That's our intent.

-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:20 PM

So do you find that thread an enjoyable "level playing field" or not, "GUEST Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:35 PM"?

My feeling is that, while maybe it makes an interesting change, it somehow lacks something. I don't think it would be much fun if they were all like that, not even for nameless GUESTS.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:32 PM

Well McGrath, judging by yours and brucie's paranoid pixies activities in the thread, I'd say the only thing missing from it are yours and brucie's wits.

Hello Fred. You are still sorta new around here, so let me introduce you to the forum dynamic of which I so often fondly speak. Now, I know it's an awful lot for you wade through all at once. But if you can finish this admittedly rather difficult assignment, I think things will become a bit clearer to you.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Peace
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:38 PM

GUEST:

Do you realize that you have a fixation. You are a very sick puppy. Find the help you need. Soonest.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Jeri
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:39 PM

And, as Joe has pointed out previously, if anyone has a problem with something a JoeClone does or says, they should contact Joe about it. Centralised authority exists so 1) we don't get stalked (even mildly) in threads that have nothing to do with Clonage, 2) Joe can keep a handle on things and remain aware of all problems and 3) you don't get something worked out with one of us, only to find the other 37 clones (or is it 38 now, Joe?) don't 'get the memo'.

I don't have a problem with anonymity. I don't care for nasty posts. I have a problem with those who follow others around in Mudcat and try to yank their chains at every opportunity.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:40 PM

I notice "GUEST Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:32 PM", ignores the question in my last post. But then it was addressed to "GUEST Date: 12 Sep 04 - 02:35 PM".

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Peace
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:41 PM

GUEST,

I shall be addressing the site manager. I believe you to be a stalker. I will be requesting that your URL be exposed, because I feel a sense of threat from you. I think you are a very sick person, mentally. And we shall then see what we see. You have so far followed me to four threads today. Enough, you misreable piece of shit.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:41 PM

BTW Fred, you must admit your member photos do bear an uncanny resemblance to your Mudcat persona, don't you think?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Once Famous
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:42 PM

I am also considering pulling a Brucie and posting under another Guest so and so name.

Do I smell a field day with this?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: The Shambles
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 06:42 PM

I can go the to HELP forum and post as Joe Clone or Joe Stalin! How is this protecting anything other that the identity of the unknown numbers of unknown volunteers by encouraging them to post anonymously and also as guests and to encourage others to follow this example?

Joe Clone is a term that is used to protect the identity of the individual volunteer - By actively encouraging the use of this you are clearly encouraging anonymous postings. Something that was actively discouraged because so many posters did not aprove or felt threatened by. It is a double standard that blindly defending, only makes worse.

Now I accept that most volunteers are fine folk doing their best - I do question why they need to be anonymous and to post anonymously - if this is the case. As a few do not feel they need to be anonymous - perhaps there is really no need for any anonymous volunteers or anonymous posts from them?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Peace
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 07:37 PM

Sorry,

Make that seven threads. I am being stalked by a guest. I have just started to look into who you are, and when I assemble the linguistic analysis of what you have posted when you follow me around, I will start a thread on it and play the game back. You have no fuckin' idea what you just bit off. However, you will find out over the next while. I hope you enjoy it as much as I do.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 07:56 PM

Assembling my linguistic analysis? Why brucie, you shouldn't have! That is just so sweet. And looking into who I am? How precious! I didn't know you cared so very much. Shall I send you a Hallmark card?

I find it utterly charming that an egomaniac who loves to see himself posted in nearly every BS thread on the top half of the board, believes I am stalking him!

Brucie, we can't avoid ye, no matter where upon the Mudcat we might roam. So, I'm sure you are right when you say...

I'll be seeing you, in all the old familiar places...

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Peace
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 08:03 PM

You are going to find that out.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 08:04 PM

But there aren't any BS threads in the top half of the board!

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 08:17 PM

Shambles you just like making trubble, and bloddy always moaning at something!
you was moaning about useless shit been delted, now you moan about volounteers been anonomouse!

if you fall in street, and people came to help you, would you demand to know their name and address, and ask to see identification before you accept their help?

you just are a moany old bloke, like that moany bloke off the telly [i forgot his name now], and one day you might have a problem, but nobody will listen to you, tghey will say "dont listen to him, he's alays moaning"


[Victor Meldrew.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 08:26 PM

I don't beleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeive it.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Nerd
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 08:33 PM

GUEsT 12 Sep 04 - 03:16 PM

Nerd I didn't think it necessary to state the obvious.

You didn't state the obvious, you contradicted the obvious, which is always a foolish position to take...

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Once Famous
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 08:41 PM

The Guest who has been posting to this thread had his own smegma for dinner tonight.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Peace
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 08:42 PM

Her, Martin, her.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Once Famous
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 08:49 PM

Brucie, see the PM I sent you.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Peace
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 09:03 PM

Got it and answered. Thank you.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Ebbie
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 09:25 PM

Guest 12 September 02:35 P.M.: The other night I went to a party where I knew very few of the people present. Everyone was very nice, however, and there were several - Joyce, Johnny, Keith among them- that I look forward to meeting again.

But rather later than the others a man came in who never introduced himself to me although I thought I heard him say something in a low voice that sounded like, "Doin' tonight?" as he went by me. He looked interesting, hidden behind his beret pulled over his eye and with his leather jacket, so the next time I saw Mary, the hostess, I asked her who he was. She was mystified. Who was I talking about?

I said, Well, he was kind of tall. He had a funny hat on, and I think a dark jacket. She laughed. You're going to have to give me more information than that!

I said, Well, he came in about 9 o'clock- does that help?

We looked over the crowd. There was no one wearing a hat or a coat, for that matter. There were several tall men, but she identified each of them and none of them sounded like the man I was talking about.

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 11:36 PM

And?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 11:40 PM

Ebbie-Maybe he was a Gohst?

Subject: RE: BS: Is anonymous posting to be encouraged?
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 11:45 PM

I've been a guest ever since I found I cannot re-set my cookie. Some kind of new glitcj. Truth be known, I like it this way---so I quit trying to re-up.

Art