BS: GW does something right

Subject: BS: GW does something right?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 06:07 PM

I don't believe it! (Non UK catters, this is a defining grumpy old man quote from a TV series - character name Victor Meldrew).

I may have to approve of something GWB did. I don't have details but apparently he has snubbed the murdering bastard (this is political rhetoric, not an allegation sounding in defamation) Gerry Adams from Sinn Fein.

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 07:10 PM

If Dubya did it, then it can't be right. The man is a sociopath. He does nothing unless it benefits himself and his narrow agenda.

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: beardedbruce
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 07:11 PM

BOSTON, Massachusetts -- U.S. Sen. Edward Kennedy has called off talks with Sinn Fein leader Gerry Adams set for St. Patrick's Day.

The decision to scrap Thursday's meeting added to mounting pressure on the Irish republican leadership following the alleged involvement of the Irish Republican Army in the killing of a Roman Catholic man in Northern Ireland.

Adams has already been refused a meeting with U.S. President George W. Bush at the White House and will not be attending the St. Patrick's Day lunch hosted by U.S. House Speaker Dennis Hastert.

It is the first time since Northern Ireland's 1998 Good Friday peace accord that Kennedy, a Democratic Irish-American senator from Massachusetts, has refused to meet Adams on St. Patrick's Day.

In a statement, Kennedy spokeswoman Melissa Wagoner cited "the IRA's ongoing criminal activity and contempt for the rule of law" as the reason for Kennedy's decision.

"Sinn Fein cannot be a fully democratic party with the IRA albatross around its neck," The Associated Press quoted her as saying. "The time for decisive and final action is long overdue."

Sinn Fein is reeling from accusations that the IRA mounted the world's largest bank robbery, stealing .26.5 million ($50 million) from a Belfast bank on December 20, and was responsible for killing Robert McCartney outside a Belfast pub on January 30.

Adams had been banned from visiting the United States until 1994, when then-President Bill Clinton overturned State Department policy to encourage an IRA cease-fire.

This year marks the first time since 1995 that Adams hasn't been invited to the White House on St. Patrick's Day.

Instead Bush is set to welcome the sisters of McCartney, a 33-year-old forklift truck driver who was beaten and stabbed to death in a bar fight. He lived in a working-class Catholic district considered an IRA heartland.

Nobody has been charged with the murder despite the attack taking place at a crowded pub and allegedly involving well-known local IRA figures.

The IRA initially denied any involvement in the killing. Last week, though, it said held a meeting with McCartney's sisters and fiancee, during which it "stated in clear terms that the IRA was prepared to shoot the people directly involved." The victim's family rejected the offer, it added.

CNN European Political Editor Robin Oakley said the shooting and the IRA's unprecedented public offer had horrified the political community.

The British and Irish prime ministers, Tony Blair and Bertie Ahern, both denounced the IRA's offer as bizarre.

The outrage over the offer quickly spread to Washington, where U.S. special envoy Mitchell Reiss said it was "time for the IRA to go out of business."

One of Sinn Fein's top supporters in the U.S. Congress, New York Republican Sen. Peter King, also has called on the IRA to disband.

King said the IRA had made a series of poor decisions that had sparked anger in Irish-American circles.

He said it was now standing in the way of a powersharing deal between Sinn Fein and Ian Paisley's Democratic Unionists and that Americans were finding it "hard to see what the justification is for the continued existence of the IRA."

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 07:16 PM

MI5 have won. Peace process in tatters.

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: robomatic
Date: 15 Mar 05 - 07:13 AM

From the yank side: Calling him 'GW' is confusing to some Americans and all Texans. We will understand you better if you simply call him 'W'.

I've been reading that not only is Gerry Adams not in the picture, but the McCartney clan is to visit the White House.

I understand the confliction that a lot of you may be feeling at this juncture. So, turn to your tapes of 'West Wing' and bask in the splender of President Bartlett.

There, there.

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 15 Mar 05 - 10:24 PM

Ah - the pendulum swings - it was US donations that helped keep the IRA alive for many years...

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: Boab
Date: 15 Mar 05 - 11:27 PM

The day that somebody points out to Ian Paisley that nothing is standing in the way of a "power-sharing agreement" between his Democratic Unionist Party and Sinn Fein is the day that he'll discover he is completely blind, and come up with his next outlandish demand. Two good men at war one with the other is a tragedy; a good one and a bad one in a fight at least attracts support for the "goodie"; a pair of villains at each other's throat inspires only disgust, and pity for the innocents who suffer thereby.
    I can only feel satisfaction at the attitude being taken by Ted Kennedy with regard to Gerry Adams. He was no doubt sincere in his belief in the justice of his cause, and the morality of his methods, when he was an active I.R.A. "footsoldier"; but there is little doubt that Mr Adams could, right now, point his finger at the guilty men who lead the continued violence from some of the Republican faction.

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Mar 05 - 11:37 PM

Bottom line is that Gerry Adams is more like the US's George Washington who told King George to stick it and then went about terrorizing the Brits who were stuck here in the "New World"...

Of course Bush ain't gonna like him... I mean, he wants an idependent Ireland...

Like what am I missing here?

Colonialists like to stick together...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: DougR
Date: 16 Mar 05 - 12:35 AM

Bobert: methinks you may be swimming in murky waters. Best stick to your tirades against GWB. Somehow I suspect you are not an expert in the ways of the Irish "Troubles."

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: LadyJean
Date: 16 Mar 05 - 01:50 AM

Some years back the American I.R.A. had a float in the Pittsburgh St. Patrick's day parade. They were next to last, and didn't roll past until 1:00 in the afternoon. Most of the crowd had been there since 10:00 that morning and had been drinking steadily. They would have cheered if a wolfhound watered a fire hydrant.
But they didn't cheer the I.R.A. The float rolled by a silent crowd. A few people muttered things about terrorists, but that was it.
Then came the Eat n' Park giant cookie balloon, a feature at all local parades, the drunks cheered their hearts out.

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: GUEST,Paul Burke
Date: 16 Mar 05 - 03:48 AM

It's probably no coincidence that Bush is against the Irish nationalists, when the "Loyalists" in NI are a bunch of fundamentalist nutcases similar to his own entourage (Pailsey has a 'degree' from Bob Jones - I nearly wrote Bob Hope). It's also true that although the Loyalist paramilitaries continue their attacks, they get little publicity.

Yes, the IRA and Sinn Fein have made a huge and unforgivable blunder- allowing underdisciplined members to throw their weight around, then defending them- but it's not fundamental to the progress of the peace process. Disarmament is- of ALL parties- including the Loyalists and their supporters in the British army and the secret services.

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: beardedbruce
Date: 16 Mar 05 - 04:01 AM

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/03/16/ira.mccartneys/index.html

Subject: Lyr Add: THE HOUSE OF ORANGE (Stan Rogers)
From: robomatic
Date: 16 Mar 05 - 04:34 AM

THE HOUSE OF ORANGE
(Stan Rogers)
As recorded by Stan Rogers on "From Fresh Water" (1984)

I took back my hand and I showed him the door.
No dollar of mine would I part with this day
For fueling the engine of a bloody cruel war
In my forefathers' home far away,
Who fled the first Famine wearing all that they owned,
Were called 'Navigators', all ragged and torn,
And built the Grand Trunk here, and found a new home
Wherever their children were born.

Their sons have no politics. None can recall
Allegiance from long generations before.
O'this or O'that name just can't matter at all
Or be cause enough for to war;
And meanwhile my babies are safe in their home,
Unlike their pale cousins who cower and cry
While kneecappers nail their poor Dads to the floor
And teach them to hate and to die.

It's those cruel beggars who spurn the fair coin.
The peace for their kids they could take at their will.
Since the day old King Billy prevailed at the Boyne,
They've bombed and they've maimed and they've killed.
Now they cry out for money and wail at the door
But Home Rule or Republic, 'tis all of it shame;
And a curse for us here who want nothing of war.
We're kindred in nothing but name.

All rights and all wrongs have long since blown away,
For causes are ashes where children lie slain.
Yet the damned U.D.L. and the cruel I.R.A.
Will tomorrow go murdering again.
But no penny of mine will I add to the fray.
"Remember the Boyne!" they will cry out in vain,
For I've given my heart to the place I was born
And forgiven the whole House of Orange,
King Billy and the whole House of Orange.

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: jacqui.c
Date: 16 Mar 05 - 07:19 AM

Great words Robomatic.

That is the only way that there will ever be peace in Ireland - when the past is forgotten and the people look to the future.

Unfortunately, human nature being what it is, I can't see much chance of that happening.

Subject: RE: BS: GW does something right
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 16 Mar 05 - 08:16 AM

The gunmen are a definite presence on both sides of the unpleasantness. ant attentive reader of these pages will know that they aren't without supporters. We need someone at the table who represents them.

Everything else is just admitting defeat and going back to a war situation. Mind you there are people on both sides who seem to favour that.