BS: British Army reward murderer.

Subject: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 08 Apr 05 - 01:03 PM

I bet you didn't think it could happen again folks, but it has. Yes the British Army are rewarding a soldier who shot dead an Iraqi civilan walking along a quiet road, with a couple of stripes for his arm.Trooper Williams watched an Iraqi civilan walking along a quiet road pushing his handcart with only a bit of food for his family on board , and a thought came to his mind, I bet that bastard is smuggling a couple of anti aircraft weapons under those spuds ! BANG the righ side of the poor Iraqis head was blowen out by a bullet from Trooper Williams SA80. Nothing was found on the cart besides food for his family. To keep the matter all above board the army took him to court. In the court Trooper Williams changed his story three times, he told of the handcart, then he changed it to his fear that the Iraqi might, just might try a steal a gun from his comrade, then back to the handcart story. The court let him off. General Sir Anthony Walker (a failed veteran of Northern Ireland)said after the courtcase was over, This young man will go far, he is the type of young soldier we need in the British Army(he got that right)we will push Trooper Williams on, he has all the credentials for an NCO. He will sit his first exam in two weeks in Germany. When you look at the number of soldiers that murdered innocent civilans in the North of Ireland over the years it's surprising to think that only 75% of them either got a medal for bravery or a step up the ranks. Well a short message to the family of the poor Iraqi if they are mudcatters, Don't allow this injustice get you down, they failed in my country and they will fail in yours.British Army orders for body bags continue at a steady rate.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 08 Apr 05 - 05:39 PM

And please could you tell me where you managed to find your information? Not in the press I hope, as misleading as they can be.
Please tell me your source and give a reference for it. Thanks very much and Best wishes, Mike.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: artbrooks
Date: 08 Apr 05 - 06:24 PM

Is this the same Trooper Williams who was involved in the death of an Iraqi pushing a cart full of machine gun ammunition? "Scotsman" story here, and it sounds a bit different.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Apr 05 - 06:24 PM

"he has all the credentials for an NCO."
I was a JNCO for 3 years & a SNCO for 12, I find your statement sweeping & insulting as many 1000s more will, but I have need or desire to bother to say any more.
Regards Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 Apr 05 - 07:02 PM

Here's the Guardian version - Trooper's murder charge is dropped

I note it say the cart actually did contain "heavy machine gun ammunition." Of course that might be as fictitious as the stuff "found" on victims of Bloody Sunday. The truth is, the truth is very unclear.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Apr 05 - 08:58 PM

yes, maybe you're right, but weren't the murderers in the Birmingham bombing and all the other atrocities promoted inside the IRA?
Two wrongs make a wrong and that's all.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: Peace
Date: 08 Apr 05 - 09:18 PM

"When you look at the number of soldiers that murdered innocent civilans in the North of Ireland over the years it's surprising to think that only 75% of them either got a medal for bravery or a step up the ranks."

This looks like bullshit to me.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: Dave (the ancient mariner)
Date: 08 Apr 05 - 10:45 PM

The man was judged and is not guilty, enough said. The Curator needs to vent and spew his shite on this forum, thats a pity. On behalf of the soldier who was accused. The Curator Fuck off and have a nice day.

Yours, Aye. Dave

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 04:06 AM

Now now Dave nice to see you can't take it, are you an old Squaddie ?? a failed British serviceman who left my green and pleasant land without the friends you arrived with ?? I will have a nice day now that I have informed the world of what the British Army get up to. And Guest, only one of the unit invovled in active service operations in the west midlands moved up a rank, this was due to the death (by natural causes) of his O.C. (officer in command)not as in the British army (commanding officer.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 04:40 AM

Curator ? anti English wanker more like.

eric

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 04:46 AM

Now now eric, who's a naughty boy using such language.You must be English.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,RÚN
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 05:30 AM

I think that some of these anti curator, know alls are still or have been the usual scum of the earth that bullied and shot fellow irishmen while serving their CUNT-RY as in most of the cases here like bloody sunday they got commendations from non other than the queen herself and in the case of Peter Mc Bride they were convicted of murder then released back in to the British army and no doubt promoted so they can kill again in the name of their queen and CUNT-RY and get off with it no matter which country they invade.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 05:41 AM

The Curator's powerful, well-documented argument and GUEST,RUN's (no offence meant by mistyping, can't do squiggle) eloquence have won me over.

I too want to serve truth, just as they are. Where do I sign up?

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: Dave (the ancient mariner)
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 06:00 AM

Curator, My job was, and is, saving lives even scum like you that are at war with England. I have nothing against the Irish, and yes I lost friends in Ireland catholic and protestant ones... republicans and loyalists...

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: ard mhacha
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 06:10 AM

Army officers giving evidence on behalf of their men after a fatal shooting of a civilian, will always follow the same pattern,"he is a good soldier, he was only fulfilling his duty in trying circumstances, he will be welcome back in my unit",.

We have had the same old Brit Army guff in the north of Ireland for years. In Iraq when the first hint of torture concerning the Brit Army was raised, we had the usual support of the Army from various catters,
"our lads do not murder or torture", was the cry, all of which has since been proved wrong, remember if it wasn`t for the decent lady in the photoshop in England, who brought the grisly evidence to the police, the culprits would have continued as before.

Blindly defending the indefensible is not very clever.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 06:43 AM

Dear Dave
Your country never admitted they were at war in the North of Ireland.
Although when you look at the following,Ulster Special Constabulary (B Specials) disbanded in 1970. Unionist Government disbanded 1972.Ulster Defence Regiment disbanded 1992.Disbandment of the Royal Ulster Constabulary. All our volunteers released from British jails. No further British Government prop up cash for the unionist Belfast shipyard(closed last year)I think I know who's flag has the battle honours.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 07:01 AM

You tell him, Curator...
Where do I sign?

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: Dave (the ancient mariner)
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 07:01 AM

Nobody wins in a civil war Curator, all the British did was buffer the two sides apart till they got tired of seeing their children learn to hate and kill each other, and us... None of my friends ever murdered anyone...

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 07:22 AM

Blindly defending the indefensible is not very clever.

Well, that's true enough, whoever does it. There's a lot to be said for focussing our attention on the misdeeds of the people on the side we are inclined to favour in a conflict, more especially in the aftermath.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 07:33 AM

El Greko, see you in the Square in Crossmaglen on Sunday, bring a pen.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,Paranoid Android
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 07:51 AM

Curator, I think it is reasonable to assume that many of the IRA activists who murdered people were rewarded witin the organisation.
You seem to me to be more in favour of resuming the armed struggle that trying to find common ground with your "enemies". What is your reaction to Gerry Adams' latest appeal to the IRA to disband?

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 08:29 AM

Look for me there at 12 noon, Curator.
You'll recognise me easily; I'll be wearing my special nail-lined vest. Might as well start as I mean to go on, eh?

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 08:42 AM

Nice to hear from you again paranoid Android, there was very little in the line of reward for volunteers within the movement. When joining they were told it could be death or a long prison term on offer. No I am not in favour of a resumption, I am in full agreement with the leadership of the movement.Regarding Gerard's statement to the leadership, again I agree with him. I think there will be a statement before the end of the month, and it will announce that the war is over.As for finding common ground with those who hold a differing viewpoint, I doubt the D.U.P./Third Force will welcome Catholic backsides on seats of government. As to my enemies, all I wish for is England to leave Ireland, afterall it is our land, they stole it 800 years ago by sword and by bayonet.They have left (or been chased) out of many other world countries they raped, so why remain here ?

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 08:46 AM

Yes Curator I'm English and proud of it I'm also ex British Army and ptoud of that too.

I never served in Northern Ireland though, I was invalided out before it started again.

From what I can gather , you just visit this forum to cause trouble not make peace, to make peace you need to talk to your enemies not just start fights and shout at them.

I'm willing to accept that the British Army have done some bad things, why do you seem to think that IRA/Sinn Fein are always innocent of everything ?

eric

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 08:49 AM

Please El Greko don't wear the vest,the war is about to end, don't you listen ? Tell the wife you will be late home because we'll get a few pints. Why not put your nail clippings down the toilet like the rest of us.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 08:58 AM

Does anyone else think I only visit this forum to start fights or cause trouble ? Then again I am a paddy to eric.I do accept military blunders occurred for P.I.R.A. active service units, but the leadership admitted it and took the flack.VNever once did they say they were fine young men, then again this is a British military line.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 09:10 AM

Yes Curator I do.

Please don't get me wrong. Although I am English, I do not believe every action carried out by British forces has been right (any more than I do actions of the IRA or of Loyalist groups), I am aware of our ability to whitewash things, I am angry about Iraq, my wish for Northern Ireland is peace for all..

I don't even see the point of you bringing NI into this in the way you did if your motivation is not to cause trouble.

(I'm probably feeding a troll here)

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 09:32 AM

OK, Curator, pints at noon it is, and the first round's on me for your sense of humour.

Like eric the red, I scanned your previous postings and came to a similar conclusion with him (troublemaker); and the way this thread started reinforced that opinion. But your last couple of postings made me take a step back and rethink.

I can accept that you feel strongly about rights and wrongs; I can also accept that our views may not coincide. But blanket unquestioning condemnation is just as bad as blindly defending the indefensible (little dig at ard mhacha). Not all soldiers behaved honourably in Ireland. Or anywhere else. Ever. It is part of the ugliness of war, that releases the beast from man. (By the way, I use the term "soldiers" the way you would mean it, to cover all sides in the conflict).

But the majority act within their army's code of honour (which by the way, may differ between armies, I can accept that too).

But even if only one ever behaved honourably, then blanket condemnation is wrong, and appears bigoted. The story behind Harvey Andrews' "The Soldier", for example, is documented. Don't heap shit on the honourable self-sacrifice of the lad, otherwise the rest of your argument loses strength.

I am glad the war looks like ending. And I am even more glad you feel the same. Let's focus on the peace now:

Mine's a Guinness.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,Jacqued
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 09:40 AM

Curator,

The Briish Army did not fail in Northern Ireland, the politicians did.

The truth is important.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: ard mhacha
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 01:43 PM

Don`t ask that question of 99% of nationalists, the Brit Army = football thugs in uniform, national front/ combat 18 hoods.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 02:22 PM

No I don't come to this site to cause trouble, nor do I lie.What I do is bring the facts which many wouldn't get the opportunity to hear on their television/radio news.It's always been the same, if an Irishman speaks out against Britian he's a trouble maker. At least on this site you don't loose teeth, as I did in 1975 courtesy of a British army baton when they arrived at my home for a search at 5.35am. All I asked was their reason for being there. And before you all start, no nothing was found in my home and they left after 40 minutes. As to my three front teeth, according to the army it never happened.And I don't mind the verbal insults cast at me here, says more about them than it does about me.And Jacqued, when a government think the talking has failed they send the army in, so both failed. A general service medal with a bar was all they left with.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 03:18 PM

I'll be wearing my special nail-lined vest.

That'd be the one with the nails pointing inwards wouldn't it, El Greko?

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 04:45 PM

Ah, Kevin, you saw me for the masochist that I am! (Just a little tighter now, dear...)

Curator,
there's no way I can excuse what happened to you in '75, and wouldn't want to anyway. You came up against some nasty b*****ds there, that's certain (the one who did it, and the ones who hushed it up). But I hope you would agree with me that the whole regiment did not consist entirely of their kind.

Only a few years before that, back home, the same and worse happened, inflicted by Greek soldiers and policement against Greek citizens; I am referring to the '67-'74 CIA-sponsored "Colonels' Junta". It took a regime change for some of the truth to come out, and many of the "details" like broken teeth and arms and legs and torn-out nails were not really admitted till many years later. And that was "brother against brother", no religious differences involved.

Yet, in the middle of that conflict, we all recognise the courage of those soldiers who refused to mistreat their fellow citizens (one notable case is of the tank gunner refusing the order to fire against the crowd at the '73 Athens Polytechnic sit-in, even though his captain put a revolver to his head). We knew all along that the majority were decent, and would disobey orders if they could.

I only mentioned that to show that b******s have no nationality - you find them everywhere. But they are not the majority.

Still, I cannot blame you for having your view coloured by your personal experiences. But I hope your logic can fight through that, pin blame where it deserves to be pinned, and not blanket cover a whole nation.

Today, 9th April, several children were born in Ireland, and in Britain, and in Greece, and in Iraq, and in N.Korea, and in the USA. They were born blameless and without preconceptions and prejudices. We owe it to them to shield them from such.

As best we can.
For their sake.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 05:17 PM

Nice one El Greko, so you have ingrowing toe nails,can be painful.A great reply with a lot of truth in it. Have been to your country and understand the feelings which you express.Greek soldiers against Greek people, try to imagine the Turks coming in against the Greek people for over 30 years.I never met a British soldier who looked upon an Irishman other than something he stepped in. Even as a medic who treated them I found they had a attitude towards me.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: puck
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 05:32 PM

What a nasty hateful snide little thread this has turned out to be. I thought Mudcat was about music and the love of it. I am disappointed with Curator and others. Learn to live and love others not harbour hatred and loathing. NOW PISS OFF BACK TO IRELAND and learn from your many many other countrymen and women how to be a warm humourous and thoroughly humane human being. Puck

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,Ooh-Aah2
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 05:41 PM

The little fact is that when one looks at the articles in the Scotsman and the Guardian (hardly a newspaper uncritical of the British army) the little story the Curator told to begin this thread appears as what it is - a hysterical lie, characteristic of both nationalists and loyalists in the Northern Ireland mess. When will this kind of Irishman grow up?

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 06:23 PM

Ooh-Aah2,
I am afraid that the answer to your last question may be "when his broken teeth grow back". We are all what our past makes us - unless we have enough strength to fight our prejudices. Which (prejudices) we all have, me included. It's unfortunate, but wounds are not healed with a simple "sorry" - even when that is forthcoming. It takes time, and plenty of positive example.

Puck,
your own words "Learn to live and love others not harbour hatred and loathing. NOW PISS OFF BACK TO IRELAND is not only self-contradicting, it also does not provide the positive example that is needed. By the way, this thread is in the BS section, so by definition non-music. Calm down, a discussion IS being had.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 06:49 PM

Dearest Puck I am at home in Ireland, the land your countrymen could not take and tame. As to the thread, truth hurts doesn't it. Great name PUCK (in Irish it means THE GOAT) need I say more about this one folks ? well he did advise humour.As to ooh Aah2 The story is not a lie, I saw it on the television news, also your favourite rag THE SUN newspaper covered the story in full yesterday (Friday) according to a phone call I got tonight.As to me growing up, I am well grown up and wise to you my friend. Never get involved in this kind of chat without the facts. Nite nite from Eire.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 07:00 PM

Some say the devil is dead
The devil is dead
The devil is dead
Some say the devil is dead and buried in Killarney.
More say he rose again
More say he rose again
More say he rose again and joined the British Army.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,loving it
Date: 09 Apr 05 - 07:20 PM

puck and ooh aah, have you both a bad case of Irish envy? Do you feel inferior when in the presence of the Irish?

Sure we're wittier, intellectually on a different plane, possessed of rugged dark looks that improve with age, an accent that can melt ice, generous to a fault, not to mention being the darlings of the female population for our easy charm and sensitivity.

But never mind lads, we can't all win eh?

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,Paranoid Android
Date: 10 Apr 05 - 08:22 AM

Sorry to hear about your "visit" from the army. It gives us some insight into the cause for your bitterness. I can't justify their actions but it is probable that some of those soldiers had friends who has been killed by the IRA and they were bitter as well. The same applies to the RUC. When a police force is operating in the knowledge that each member is a "Legitimate target" for a section of the community it is impossible for them to exercise "normal" policing within that community. Hopefully we have seen the end of tit-for-tat atrocities and the fact that no policeman or soldier has been shot for several years bears out that hope. I've just heard on the radio of an incident in Belfast this morning where a policeman discharged one shot. While you might wish to view this as as another example of "armed repression" I would view it (purely on the basis of the news report) as a neccessary action and take consolation in the fact that in a similar situation 20 years ago that policeman would have found it necessary to shoot to kill in order to preserve his own life. As for Mr. Paisley, I always viewed him as the IRA's best recruiting officer but even he must by now have come to the realisation that co-operation is the only way forward. We can only hope for a PEACEFUL re-unification of Ireland sooner rather than later.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Apr 05 - 08:32 AM

I can't justify their actions but it is probable that some of those soldiers had friends who has been killed by the IRA and they were bitter as well.

pa that's mathematically probably not very close to the truth. But even if it were the case, the soldiers were being paid well to do a professional job out there. The fact that they had been recruited during a feverish anti-Irish period of UK history, resulted in hired uniformed yobs parading the streets of someone elses city. Would they have been welcome in your city?

And the visit that took away the teeth, well that's just one of many similar incidents that I could also relate. It happened daily.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,Ooh-Aah2
Date: 11 Apr 05 - 03:34 AM

Dear Lovin' It - if one is born English one has won first prize in the lottery of life. The Irish? Who are they? A bunch of resentful little dwarves who sing the same depressing songs through their nose ad nauseum. It's quite lucky for you we played with your soggy little island for a time to give you something to base your culture on - a chip on the shoulder's better than nothing I guess...




For any Irishmen reading this IT IS TONGUE IN CHEEK. Let peace and love rule.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 11 Apr 05 - 05:02 AM

Yes Ooh Aah, the English are loved in every country in the world, ask anyone. They depend on nobody (besides the Americans to win them two world wars).As to my green and pleasant land enough of your fellow countrymen left it in a horizontal position. Your dead right over here we view being English is like a lottery win, you always depend on somebody playing with your balls, and in Ireland your number is well and truly up !

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Apr 05 - 06:40 AM

Curator, I have every sympathy with you. Honestly. The plight of the Irish was, and still often is, a terrible thing and down purely to the past and recent wrongs committed by the English government. I do not wish to detract from this one iota. But (did you know there was one of them coming;-) ) I must take exception to the following from yourself.

What I do is bring the facts which many wouldn't get the opportunity to hear on their television/radio news.
and earlier
Nothing was found on the cart besides food for his family.

However two independant sources, both the Guardian and the Scotsman, neither known for their pro-establishment views give us the opposing view. Trooper Williams was on patrol with other soldiers when they discovered six Iraqis moving a cart containing heavy machine gun ammunition. Three of the men were detained. A fourth, Mr Said, ran off, pursued by Trooper Williams and Corporal Jeffrey Blair. When caught, Mr Said refused to be handcuffed and, amid attempts to restrain him, was shot by the trooper who, said Mr Horwell, believed he was trying to get hold of Cpl Blair's weapon.

I do not know whether you are right or whether the press is. I dislike the press intensely and by no means believe all I read but in the absense of any other corroborated view who am I meant to believe? I am happy to belive you. I am as against the Iraq war as anyone. I well remember your well reasoned and persuasive arguments about the Northern Bank raid and your adamant requirement of proof of guilt. Can you provide proof of your statement that the cart contained nothing but food was true and therefore prove that trooper Williams was guilty?

Cheers

Dave the Gnome

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: The Curator
Date: 11 Apr 05 - 07:07 AM

Dave
Report from Sun newspaper Friday April 8th 2005. KEVIN SHOT DEAD A MAN SUSPECTED OF SMUGGLING ANTI AIRCRAFT SHELLS IN A HANDCART. IT WAS ALLEGED IN COURT THE IRAQI HAD ARMS. Report from Irish Television News RTE Thursday April 7th 2005. A BRITISH SOLDIER WHO SHOT DEAD AN IRAQI WHO HE THOUGHT HAD ARMS UNDER FOOD SUPPLIES WALKED FREE FROM COURT TODAY. NO REPORT OF ANY ARMS OR AMMUNITION FOUND AT THE SCENE WAS PRESENTED. Dave please note the words SUSPECTED, ALLEGED and NO REPORT OF ANY ARMS OR AMMUNITION FOUND AT THE SCENE. The court found him not guilty. Did this Iraqi pose a threat ? did he aim a gun ? did he actually reach out and handle Cpl Blair's SA80 ? What was in his hands when he was shot ? In neither report which I list is there any report of other British soldiers present other than the one who Tropper Williams felt would loose his weapon.The bottom line is the Iraqi could of been arrested and the cart searched, but no he was shot dead long before the handcart was searched. Your listed reports state ammo was found. The reports I list did not state this.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Apr 05 - 07:11 AM

Dave that account doesn't look too promising either? Two armed soldiers had admittedly captured an unarmed civilian, and in the melee ( sure there's meant to be a stroke somewhere near that word),the unarmed civilian was shot dead.

The reason, When caught, Mr Said refused to be handcuffed and, amid attempts to restrain him, was shot by the trooper who, said Mr Horwell, believed he was trying to get hold of Cpl Blair's weapon.

He hadn't even got hold of the weapon? It was merely believed he was trying to? The British Army are either severely lacking in restraint skills or it's another case of, 'Lie through your teeth lads, it's always worked in the past.'

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Apr 05 - 07:13 AM

Dave sorry for the double whammy there, just cross posted with the curator.

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Apr 05 - 08:50 AM

No problems with the double post Curator and Guest. I still do have problems however with posting unsubstantiated 'facts' that turn out not to be! Remember What I do is bring the facts which many wouldn't get the opportunity to hear on their television/radio news.

Again I am not saying it was a good thing that this soldier did, nor am I saying that Mr Said (the victim) was completely blameless. The simple truth of the matter is that we have a number of newspapers and other sources saying that the cart did contain ammunition and we have at least one saying it did not. I feel that in this case the right decision has been made based on the 'facts' as known.

I believe very little I read in the press myself but given the choice I would tend to believe the Guardian (even with it's spulling orrors.) above the Sun. I remember the Sun's coverage of people picking the pockets of the dead and urinating on police at the Hillsborough disaster well enough for me to give them no credance whatsoever.

I am happy to support your views that the British army has been involved in some awful attrocities but to include this as one of them is, in my view, incorrect. Putting Trooper Williams alongside the perpetrators of genuine attrocities is not only unfair to him but also unfair to the victims of the real villians.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: British Army reward murderer.
From: GUEST,RÚN
Date: 11 Apr 05 - 09:20 AM

IT IS JUST TYPICAL OF THE TACTICS OF THE BRITISH ARMY TO SHOOT FIRST THEN MAKE UP THE ANSWERS NEVER MIND ASKING THE QUESTIONS, LIKE MANY OCCASIONS HERE IN IRELAND, WERE THEY BELIEVED SOMEONE WAS ABOUT TO PULL A GUN OUT OR PUSH A BUTTON THE ONLY ARMS THEY WERE CARRYING WAS PROBABLY THE ONES THEY WERE TRYING TO HANDCUFF IN THE FIRST PLACE NOTHING CHANGES NO MATTER WHAT COUNTRY THEY INVADE TO TORTURE,BULLY,AND MURDER,THEN THEY WONDER WHY SOMEONE SENDS THEM HOME IN BOXES.