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BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals
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Subject: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:15 PM The Program: Click |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: gnu Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:23 PM I've got to admit, even though I'm choking a bit, and don't quite agree, well written. Hope you can play by your own rules on this one. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: michaelr Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:28 PM Go away, Martin. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:29 PM Aldaynet - Chairman of the Republican Attack Squad |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:30 PM I didn't write this but yes it is well written. michaelr, I'm glad you enjoyed it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: gnu Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:35 PM You did not write it? You did not cite it. Really. Oh well. BTW, do you know the basic difference between capitalist and communist economics? "Yes/No" don't cut the grass. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: PoppaGator Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:38 PM Criticism of the military-industrial complex is NOT "Hating America." Please refer to Republican President Dwight D. Eisenhower's farewell address to Congress (1960). We may have honest differences about economics, about what America is, and about which forces actually represent and benefit the people of our nation, but please don't wrap your most partisan causes in the red, white and blue. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:38 PM It is humourous. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: gnu Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:48 PM It could be. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:51 PM Why are you folks feeding the troll? Who wrote that thing? Ann Coulter? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Bill D Date: 22 Apr 05 - 03:52 PM a quick search reveals many, many copies of this 'program'...not only didn't he attribute it, he didn't note that it WAS someone else's. It read vaguely like a Rush Limbaugh piece, and this is just the latest "dittohead" to quote it. As might be expected, it is so full of logical, factual and rhetorical errors that it would take hours to carefully deal with each one. (I think that's a technique....throw out so many half-truths and distortions that folks get weary and quit trying.) ...and, whether MG and his buddies want to believe it or not, it is quite possible to love this country without agreeing with all that claptrap! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: gnu Date: 22 Apr 05 - 04:07 PM Thanks for reinforcing that Bill D. I assume MG realizes that citing an author is not only good manners, but is legally required so as not to be sued for plagiarism. Of course, I would also assume that, even when one copies and pastes, one should be able to defend and discuss the hypotheses put forth. Well... do you have a grasp of the basic diffrence in economics? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 22 Apr 05 - 04:09 PM bill d, I did attest that I did not write it a few down. also, I have been posting it in other places with it's author's name. My purpose has been served that it made you uncommmmmmmmmmmmfortable. Truth hurts ya, I guess. BTW, I hardly believe you love this country. You and your socialist stooges mock it everyday. I say mock the mockers. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Don Firth Date: 22 Apr 05 - 04:12 PM FYI An alternate view. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 22 Apr 05 - 04:18 PM Don Firth, now if only you can get a politican to buy into that without coming across as a socialist. Of course this was written before Kerry failed to deliver this message or anyone remembers anything he said at this point. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Bill D Date: 22 Apr 05 - 04:18 PM made me unconfortable????? Only in the sense that seeing ANY drivel in print makes me uncomfortable.(and truth doesn't hurt ME at all....offer me some, and I'll show you..*grin*) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: kendall Date: 22 Apr 05 - 04:32 PM Wrong. The truth never hurts. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: gnu Date: 22 Apr 05 - 04:36 PM "...also, I have been posting it in other places with it's author's name." Yeah, sure. "...My purpose has been served..." Yeah, sure. As for answering me, I thought not. Same old tripe from the same old. GUEST 03:51 PM asked, "Why are you folks feeding the troll?" Well, apparently for no good reason. I actually thought this might be a change, for the good mind you, from his ways of the past. I posted my first post because I thought, FINALLY, we could get MG to swing around to constructive discussion and not be so "argumentative", to put it mildly. I thought he might have a clue and this might be a real discussion. Then I find out he didn't even write the damn thing and can't respond to simple questions regarding the hypotheses he put forth as his own. Once again, sorry to say, I am outta here... and, no, MG, you don't have to tell me not to let the door hit me on my arse on the way out. PS... Why do you even try to seem like you have a brain when you continue to shoot yourself in the foot?... when it's not in your mouth. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 22 Apr 05 - 04:38 PM Hey, Don. Great to see you back. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 22 Apr 05 - 04:51 PM gnu, just for old times sake, don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out! guffaw. Great Fred Flintstone impersonation, though. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: gnu Date: 22 Apr 05 - 06:15 PM Hehehehe. Thanks for the laugh. I need it these days. Bonne chance. g |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Amos Date: 22 Apr 05 - 06:20 PM Martin, Same old shit, different day. Your own lies are thicker and more self-serving than Clinton's ever were; and as for economics, your gang has driven our national economy into the toilet with complete irrational abandon. Stop justifying fascism, Martin. It doesn't become you. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 22 Apr 05 - 06:27 PM Democrat, Conservative, Communist, Natural Law, Independent, Joe or Jane Doe: FYI Maybe it's time to beat the swords into plowshares. Y'all got a problem that y'all ain't lookin' at. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST Date: 22 Apr 05 - 06:34 PM If being a Liberal was good enough for Lloyd George then its good enough for me. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 22 Apr 05 - 06:36 PM Lloyd George knew my father. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST,Peter Woodruff Date: 22 Apr 05 - 07:21 PM I am a Liberal and proud of it! "I,Me,Me,Mine Screw You!" Is not ME! Peter |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Little Hawk Date: 22 Apr 05 - 07:26 PM To be a liberal is in itself such a blessing that it hardly needs additional help, in my opinion. (grin) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Ebbie Date: 22 Apr 05 - 07:54 PM Thanks for posting that about the national deficit, brucie. Wish it would alarm the bushits as much as it does me. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Little Hawk Date: 22 Apr 05 - 07:57 PM It's like being graceful or attractive. It is its own justification. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 22 Apr 05 - 08:03 PM Basic flaw in reasoning, MG. George Dubya and his sycophantic cadre of cronies, including our own Tony Blair, are not a nation, and criticising, or mocking, them is not the same as mocking the USA or Britain. These idiots work for us, and if they are doing a bad job it reflects on their incompetence, not the quality of the nation they are supposed to represent. If executives of a corporation messed up in the same way, they would be canned instantly. Unfortunately, it isn't quite that easy to get rid of a bad administration. If you see a dislike of Bush policies as tantamount to treason, then your notion of American democracy and freedom is sicker than Dubya's. Don T. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: CarolC Date: 22 Apr 05 - 08:37 PM Personally, I can't think of anything more "liberal" than running up a huge national debt and a huge budget deficit and leaving it for future generations to clean up, and destroying our environment just because we can and we want more stuff, instead of conserving our resources and environment for future generations. Sounds like a bunch of spoiled brats running the government. What we need is a few conservatives in government instead of all these liberal radicals we've got in there now. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Amos Date: 22 Apr 05 - 08:41 PM Seven TRILLION |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: CarolC Date: 22 Apr 05 - 08:46 PM And we need a few Free Market Capitalists, too, instead of all of these monopolists and cronyistic kleptocratic oligargichists. Free Market Capitalism... a great idea that's never been tried! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 22 Apr 05 - 08:53 PM Hye, y'all. I can help out with the thrity-three cents. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: CarolC Date: 22 Apr 05 - 08:55 PM Thrity-three? How many twonies is that? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: CarolC Date: 22 Apr 05 - 08:57 PM Wait, I know... that's sixteen twonies and one loonie, right? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 22 Apr 05 - 08:57 PM Ouch. Today, it's about 20% of one. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST Date: 22 Apr 05 - 08:58 PM Avoid all needle drugs. The only dope worth shooting is marvin gibbon. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Bobert Date: 22 Apr 05 - 09:11 PM Yeah, this is really wierd... I was just onphone with a guy who I have never met who lives down in Luray about buying a building he owns and we'd talked about an hour when national politics came into the converstaion and he he says that he is a life long Republican, a Vietanm vet and voted for Bush in 2000... Then he went on to say that that Bush is out to bankrupt the country!!! Kinda strange thing to hear from a Repub who voted fir Bush in 2000??? But he was very adiment that he was thru with Bush's brand of "Republicanism"... This is getting less and less about liberals and conservatives and more about true liberlas and conservatives verses the radical Bushites, which are nither!!! These folks are way out in lala-land of political thought... It's lie a bad nightmare where you wake up from dreamin' that Jerry Fallwell was in charge with Charles Manson as his VP... That's about what we have today and the problem with it is two fold: 1.) the media are whores and... ... 2.) Joe Sixpack is too busy scurryin' from job to job to make ends meet to know that the media is lieing to him... Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 22 Apr 05 - 09:17 PM On the bright side, they had to estimate the debt based on how many Americans there are. So, making the assumption that they have erred by 10,000 Americans, then the debt is likely less than that. Knock about $270 million off that figure and yer left with New Debt Figures for April 23, 2005. I will leave the math to someone with a calculator. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST Date: 22 Apr 05 - 09:30 PM Reading MG is like reading the Daily Mail. I buy it occasionally just to remind myself who the enemy is. Bigotry, arrogance, ignorance, prejudice, and violence. I'll agree with his creed on one thing only, it's no good being a pacifist when faced with a fascist. My father taught me that, as did his whole generation. How those young Americans of the Rooseveldt generation who came to Europe and died would mourn what America is becoming today. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 22 Apr 05 - 09:39 PM Can't believe I typed that. I will have to go back to looking at the keyboard. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Bobert Date: 22 Apr 05 - 11:08 PM Same problem 'round this keyboard, brucie, 'cept my letters is wored off mos' the keys so I do a lot o' guessin'... And good points, GUEST... Looks like you hit Martin right on the head. Yeah, he's sho nuff full of it... Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Bill D Date: 22 Apr 05 - 11:11 PM Father knew Lloyd George |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST,C.A conservative anon Date: 22 Apr 05 - 11:56 PM Help for Mudcat Conservatives; The Program: Step 1: Admitting that you've really messed up this Country. This is the first step for every fundamentalist Conservative on the way to recovery. It is important to understand that you're not compassionate, moderate or in touch with reality. You're a psuedo Facist, and you need to be honest with yourself about that fact. Step 2: Pledge to support your beliefs with facts Realize that TRUTH IS more important than your moral superiority and is the only way to come over to reality. You must research beyond propaganda from Tom De Lay, Rush Limbaugh, Karl Rove and Fox News to understand things as they really exist in the world. You can no longer argue based on hallucinations and hysterical Political blindness. You will actually need to back up your arguments with real information as the WMD incidents have shown you. This is a difficult step, because it means you can't blame Liberals any more. Your Politicians lie and People die. Step 3: Love America This may be the most difficult step for those of you who are Capitalists. Admitting that the country you pretend to Love is now hated because of this Administration's actions throughout the world. Now this may have made some of you physically and mentally ill. You might want to make a visit to a military cemetery to better understand that these men and women who gave their lives so that you could spew hatred to people of other faiths and Cultures were mostly Reserves, they didn't have a choice in the matter. Some even went to War in Vehicles with plywood armor. You are currently very close to living in a police state that is attempting to make you hate all Beliefs, Religious and Political, and Races expect your own great white way and may arrest you if you speak out against your government's attempts to hack apart the Constitution of this wonderful Democracy of Ours called America. Step 4: Take a college level economics and English class Remember.. "no child left behind" well it's actually no funding left for education. Then write a fearless "MORAL" economic inventory of the mess this current administration has made of this Country in just five Years. oh and find out the difference between Socialism and Communism...it's really sad when you show that your lack of education on that one....or where you the Child that got left behind that day in class? Step 5: Say Yes" to Humanitarianism and Socialism While this concept is obvious to most of the free world, it is an important step in your recovery process. If you have difficulty with this step, spend a Year living and working in a Low Income Slum in say, Chicago. Get sick, go to the ER tell them your Child is sick have no money or Health Insurance....get back to us on that one. Step 6: Corporations are not all evil but some are. If you're reading this article online or in an e-mail, it's thanks to corporations. If you get some kind of paycheck, you can thank corporations if you happen to work for one. If you work for a non-profit or the government, you still have to thank corporations. The non-profit sector and the government wouldn't have any money to pay you without corporations and Tax payers cash, remember the Government are public servants and we pay them,. It is also important that you understand that making a profit doesn't equate to "greed" or exploitation. Just ask a small, non coporate, Business owner with 3 or 4 well looked after Staff. Evil enters the Corporate picture in many guises ie: when Corporations send their work overseas to be produced by slave labor, often children working for a Year to earn what some of the lowest ranking Corporate executives earn in a morning and American workers lose their jobs because of these moves. Capitalism has created the greediest society in our world's history. Even communist countries need corporations to survive now..., so enjoy a nice, hot cup of reality. If there's a problem.....we are part of it. Take responsibility for creating such gross imbalances in our Society. Step 7: The government is inefficient If you are one of those Conservatives who believe the government should tax the rich less and the working Folk more you really need to pay special attention to this step. You need to realize that government bureaucracy will waste most of your tax dollars, while the private sector will put their tax breaks to much better use, tax free donations to Political causes and pork barrel issues. Even most Democrat politicians understand this to some degree, which is why Hillary Clinton's healthcare proposal (inspired by Healthcare systems which work very well in other Countries that have implemented Socialist values into their workings for the good of all their people) was voted down by a majority of both Democrats and Republicans. There is no money to back it now the rich pay less tax than the average person...and of course the rising National Debt doesn't help there. I mean why introduce something that gives Healthcare to all. Better to send our Seniors into Canada, who has a NHS, and get their Medications there cheaper!!! Go to your local ER and see how many people just can't afford Healthcare in the most medically advanced Country in the World! Step 8: The earth is your " Home," and it's being drained and sucked dry of it's resources. The time has now come to start your donations to Greenpeace, The Sierra Club, and every other Conservation organization to which you can belong. Face the reality that the earth, society, and our environment are far worse off today than ever in recorded history and that the actual figures supporting these facts continue to show a desperate decline. I realize that many of you SUV, Snowmobile, ATV huggers will have a very difficult time letting go of the Ski Doo on this one. I would suggest reading The Skeptical Environmentalist by Bjorn Lomborg. Mr. Lomborg is a former member of Greenpeace and is currently a statistics professor at Aalborg University in Denmark. He set out to prove the world was in bad shape and ended up surprising himself by taking on a study for a few large Corporations which helped in proving the exact opposite.. It will amaze you to know how by using totally inaccurate statistics you can twist even an moderately rated Academic mind like Lomborg's. Step 9: Stop smoking anything and cut down on the Alcohol and red meat. Okay, some of you might need to enter another 12-step program to complete this step. Marijuana and Alcohol and Fox News is distorting your sense of reality, and you need to stop using it. Besides, you'll save a fortune on snacks, Pay per View Nascar Races and Wrestling matches. Hippies realized this a long time ago ( they became enlightened) that's why they moved on and became Politicians, small Business owners and Computer Techs and Lecturers, Writers, Artists, Songwriters and Performers, Teachers and amazing Academics and a host of wonderful contributors to American Society. So if you need help with these issues talk to someone who has been there done that , talk to an old Hippy...they will be happy to set you straight. Also you could call the White House as it is possible the President at one point may have had some experience in this area. Step 10: Eat a Veggi Burger now and again You can put tomatoes and pickle on the Veggi burger,. You'll look and feel better than you ever imagined. You can always remind yourself that Mother Teresa and Ghandi were vegetarians to get you through this step. Then again if you wish to go for a Meat Diet... just look at George and Laura Bush and Karl Rove...... remember you are what you eat so if you really want to look like a Steer's Ass go right on chomping down on the red blood highway...but then diet is a choice not always a political statement...just a dietary one. You got to Love a Country where you actually have a choice of Foods....some places are starving while we are throwing out daily what would sustain the World's Poor and Starving nations. While obesity is on the rise in children in the USA...yeah Maw throw another Burger on the Grill and some fries too... Step 11: Stop re-writing political history It's now time to admit that Bill Clinton shagged an intern and lied, Nothing new there. Presidents did it (some even had Children by their Mistresses) and some Senators did it (and has children by their Mistresses) some are still doing it...it''s all a question of remembering that what goes around comes around so when one of your own is targeted don't get all whinny and say it's a Democratic conspiracy...nope it's just plain old...f**k ya....ya hypocrites. Al Gore did NOT lose the 2000 election, plain and simple, Gorbachov ended the Cold War and Reagan helped him out on that particular Political piece of History by taking Air Force One to Berlin and grabbed a photo op of him saying "tear down these walls"! duh wasn't that what the East was planning to do anyway? Reagan also played a massive role in creating the homeless problem and bringing us Star Wars (not the Movie) John McCain is unfortunately not a typical Republican, you all should listen to this Man you might learn something...about Moral fiber and Honesty, serving your Country and bi partisanship, and Jimmy Carter is a Good man but has one of the less note worthy presidential records but not as downright disgusting as Richard Nixon's legacy obviously. Yes Carter's Presidency wasn't remarkable, I mean apart from getting the hostages released and never getting the credit for it and since leaving office has worked tirelessly to house thousands of Families ( some that Reagan's policies helped onto the streets) through Habitat for Humanity. Reagan however got an Airport named after him and an Air Craft carrier...way to go Ronnie. I suppose both serve the public but one of these things requires daily effort. You figure out which one! Step 12: Be an REAL American Once you have completed the previous steps to overcoming the disturbing view of what it takes to be a Conservative, it's time for you to share this awakening with others who are not as fortunate. Go out amongst Bush's sheep and spread the good word of your freedom from the chains of ignorance that once bound you to your right wing, fundamentalist thinking patterns. While your at it...look at this abuse of the 12 step program issue... There is no cure for the dis -ease of extreme Conservative thinking but by admitting that you actually know nothing about and care very little about the planet or the other people in it you are taking a tiny step towards becoming a real member of the Human race and a truly good Citizen of one of the Greatest Countries in the World...notice I say ONE of the greatest Countries.. not the only greatest...we just happen to have a Nuclear Power that is pretty intimidating. We used to have respect and a huge economic pull but the last 4 and one half years has done away with that completely. Admit You are Powerless and you have made a fatal flaw by voting for this Administration...some elect them some reject them, but it is always wise to remember that we all pay them and they are in their particular jobs because they are Public SERVANTS...so don't get so hung up on the disrespect aspect.....The President is only a man not God's Rep on Earth and as such has to earn respect.....he has 3 and one half years left....and it is not looking to good to a lot of Folks here in this wonderful Country. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: CarolC Date: 22 Apr 05 - 11:59 PM LOL ...and I spelled "oligarchists" (a word that I have apparently made up, according to Mr. Webster), oligargichists. I blame it on the paper cut on my finger. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 23 Apr 05 - 12:05 AM I like your word better. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 23 Apr 05 - 12:30 AM MUDCAT LIBERALS: HELP HAS ARRIVED Republican National Convention Schedule New York, NY 6:00 PM Opening Prayer, led by the Rev. Jerry Falwell 6:30 PM Pledge of Allegiance 6:35 PM Burning of Bill of Rights (excluding 2nd amendment) 6:45 PM Salute to the Coalition of the Willing 6:46 PM Seminar #1: Getting your kid a military deferment 7:30 PM First Presidential Beer Bong 7:35 PM Serve Freedom Fries 7:40 PM EPA Address #1: Mercury, it's what's for dinner 8:00 PM Vote on which country to invade next 8:10 PM Call EMTs to revive Rush Limbaugh 8:15 PM John Ashcroft Lecture: The Homos are after your children 8:30 PM Roundtable discussion on reproductive rights (MEN only) 8:50 PM Seminar #2: Corporations: the government of the future 9:00 PM Condi Rice sings "I Can't Help Lovin' Dat Man" 9:05 PM Second Presidential Beer Bong 9:10 PM EPA Address #2 Trees: the real cause of forest fires 9:30 PM Break for secret meetings 10:00 PM Second prayer, led by Cal Thomas 10:15 PM Lecture by Karl Rove: Doublespeak made easy 10:30 PM Rumsfeld demonstration: How to squint and talk macho 10:35 PM Bush demonstration of trademark deer-in-headlights stare 10:40 PM John Ashcroft demonstrates new mandatory Kevlar chastity belt 10:45 PM Clarence Thomas reads list of black Republicans 10:46 PM Third Presidential Beer Bong 10:50 PM Seminar #3: Education: a drain on our nation's economy 11:10 PM Hilary Clinton Pinata 11:20 PM Second John Ashcroft Lecture: Evolutionists: the dangerous new cult 11:30 PM Call EMTs to revive Rush Limbaugh again 11:35 PM Blame Clinton 11:40 PM Laura serves milk and cookies 11:50 PM Closing Prayer, led by Jesus Himself 12:00 AM Nomination of George W. Bush as Holy Supreme Planetary Overlord I found the above at politicalhumor.about.com/ library/jokes/bljokerncschedule.htm |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 23 Apr 05 - 12:43 AM "The Republican Convention goes on all week, and of course, the highlight will be toward the end of the week. George Bush will show up for one day, you know, just like he did in the National Guard." —David Letterman I loved that one. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST,ragdall Date: 23 Apr 05 - 01:37 AM "Who wrote that thing? Ann Coulter?" According to ChronWatch, it was written by Jeremy Robb. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Bobert Date: 23 Apr 05 - 07:51 AM Yeah, brucie, that just about wraps it up... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Amos Date: 23 Apr 05 - 08:18 AM The following quote from my Temple Goddess, Maureen Dowd, ends with a very telling quote. From today's NY Times: Cardinal Ratzinger did not shrink from advising American bishops in the last presidential election on bringing Catholic elected officials to heel. He warned that Catholics who deliberately voted for a candidate because of a pro-choice position were guilty of cooperating in evil, and unworthy to receive communion. Vote Democratic and lose your soul. "Panzerkardinal," as he was known, definitely isn't a man who could read Mario Cuomo's Notre Dame speech urging that pro-choice politicians be allowed in the tent and say, "He's got a point." The Republicans can build their majority by bringing strict Catholics and evangelicals - once at odds - together on what they call "culture of life" issues. But there's a risk, as with Tom DeLay, Dr. Bill Frist and other Republicans, that if the new pope is too heavy-handed and too fundamentalist, his approach may backfire. Moral absolutism is relative, after all. As Bruce Landesman, a philosophy professor at the University of Utah, pointed out in a letter to The Times: "Those who hold 'liberal' views are not relativists. They simply disagree with the conservatives about what is right and wrong." We don't need help. We need some sanity and less damn meddling. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 23 Apr 05 - 03:09 PM [bleep - for antisocial behavior]Perhaps so, Amos. But as for facism, do something about your own ugly face. Can't you cut it off or something? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Amos Date: 23 Apr 05 - 03:21 PM Wow, I am at a loss for words. How do you ever come up with such succinct, telling points of discussion? You should join a debating club, MG. As the mascot. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: jpk Date: 23 Apr 05 - 03:44 PM hi mg. if you could make one tenth as much sense as ann coulter then you might have something to say,without tring to copy her work. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 23 Apr 05 - 03:48 PM [bleep - for antisocial behavior]I do it Amos to fuck with your head. Seems to work. You keep coming back for more. Jesus, what a stroke you are. BTW, jpk, I can't stand Ann Coulter. She is a smelly cunt with scabs that won't heal. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Don Firth Date: 23 Apr 05 - 05:48 PM Judginng from your obsessive references to such, Marty, I thought that was your type of woman. In view of the following excerpts:— Liberalism is a political [position] current embracing several historical and present-day ideologies that claim defense of individual liberty as the purpose of government. It typically favors the right to dissent from orthodox tenets or established authorities in political or religious matters. In this respect, it is sometimes held in contrast to conservatism. Since liberalism also focuses on the ability of individuals to structure their own society, it is almost always opposed to totalitarianism, and often to collectivist ideologies, particularly communism.Most mature, civilized countries embrace various flavors of this position, and although they may not be as wealthy and powerful as the United States, nor do they necessarily have as many citizens who are mega-billionaires, the citizenry in general is free, happy, productive, and secure, and such things as poverty and homelessness are rare to nonexistant. Working to live rather than living to work, they are less driven by the urge to acquire goods (such as a new SUV every year or a larger television set or the latest electronic gizmo), and due to humanitarian labor laws (restrictions on the number of hours per week they can be required to work and with several weeks of vacation per year rather than a mere week or two), they are able to enjoy much more leisure time with family and friends, education, cultural events, amusement, and recreation. Seasoned travelers frequently attest that most Europeans are relaxed and open, and tend to enjoy life in general much more than most Americans, who, by contrast, are driven, overworked, worried, and generally up-tight, rarely seeming to have time to enjoy themselves, and don't seem to know how even when they do get a little time off. In a country in which the primary concern is not the welfare and well-being of the people, and in which the government is of the corporations, by the corporations, and for the corporations, such concerns as the welfare of the populace is often inimical to the primary concern of those corporations. That primary concern is not goods and services (which should be the purpose of their existence in the first place), but the bottom line and the quarterly report to stockholders, i.e. maximizing profit. This, as we have seen, "justifies" all manner of ethical bottom-feeding, resulting in a total disregard for the welfare of those whom the system ultimately depends on, including its investors (pension funds, for example). This promotes a culture driven by greed and lust for acquisition that results in the insecurity and anxiety that plagues and drives most American working people at all levels, including the highest paid. And ultimately, it influences the foreign policy iu a way that brings the country into unnecessary conflict with the rest of the world. I am a liberal and proud of the fact. I need no help, thank you very much. Don Firth The full article (entry) HERE |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: gnu Date: 23 Apr 05 - 06:34 PM Ugly face, stroke and smelly cunt? That's all you have to contribute to the thread you started since I was here yesterday? I am SO glad I checked in tonight to see how this was going. Your debating skills are right on par per usual. Maybe you should try music. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Don Firth Date: 23 Apr 05 - 06:50 PM I know what you meant, gnu. Confronted with such a Cosmic level of intellectial accuteness and perspicacity, what can I say? I, too, am in awe! Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Bobert Date: 23 Apr 05 - 06:54 PM Word on the street is that Martin can do a fairly decent "Puff the Magic Dragon' in G using 1st position chords so maybe that is his calling, gnu??? But maybe not... I haven't actually heard his version yet so, hey, his debating skills may yet be his stronger suit... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST,Orpheus Date: 23 Apr 05 - 07:03 PM Anyone as permeated with hatred as Martin Gibson is has no music in him. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST,Clint Keller Date: 23 Apr 05 - 07:27 PM Folk Wisdom: It's not a good idea to rassle with a hog. He won't know if you win, you get shit all over you, and the swine loves it. clint |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: gnu Date: 23 Apr 05 - 07:34 PM BTW, Marty, when confronted with a mountain, the capitalist builds a road around the mountain while the communist tunnels through the mountain. You don't need a college level economics class to understand the difference. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Little Hawk Date: 24 Apr 05 - 04:20 PM Well, liberals are normally feared and despised in 2 kinds of political systems...those that are already a military (or religious) dictatorship...or those that aren't yet, but are heading in that direction. A liberal is basically someone who is flexible when it comes to ideas. In most places that is considered an asset...but not in a place that wishes to establish mind control over its citizenry. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 24 Apr 05 - 05:56 PM Debating skills? Why bother? I am not here to debate as I have said over and over again. Debate here is worthless. It proves nothing when you converse with socialist types who are mired in their own little world of didain for most everything that is decent and good, anyway. I would just rather put my ideas out there and watch you jump up and down, bobert. I'll take a nice family like I've got bobert anyday over your debating skills, which really aren't much but a lot of bad grammar, pal. BTW, what was bleeped is that I do not like Ann Coulter, but in a stronger, more colorful way. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Little Hawk Date: 24 Apr 05 - 06:11 PM Life is good. (smile) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 25 Apr 05 - 03:54 PM don firth, would you enjoy it if Ann coulter sat on your face? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: jpk Date: 25 Apr 05 - 04:32 PM i do not think that responding to mg,s mudslinging,insults or other democratic party style conversation is worth the time or effort. hence i will bide my time and let him fade into the darkness of the(mind) from wence he slitherd. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 25 Apr 05 - 04:46 PM jpk, you are just peachy keen! I'm standing in the bright sunlight and plan to for a long time. Forums need types like you who are so easily offended. Makes for great entertainment. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 25 Apr 05 - 04:52 PM All the above taken into consideration, I must admit to being a liberal. And a conservative with some other issues. And an anarchist with yet others. And a communist with others. And somewhere to the right of George Bush with others. Scary, huh? I gave up supporting political 'parties' in my youth because I found it to be counter-productive. I hated lock-step all my life, and that is the ultimate in lock-step. That's all I gotta say. A good friend of mine here wrote to me a few days ago and said he was gonna give up the political threads. I think I may join him, because I see little new coming out of these things. SSDD. Be good to go away for a bit. Later, BM |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 25 Apr 05 - 05:00 PM brucie, Perhaps you are a moderate, like I have always claimed to be. trouble is, the middle is just too far right for radical far-left wingers. tehy just don't get it that they are as ranting as the far right. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST,Gilda Date: 25 Apr 05 - 06:25 PM Gobson...a Moderate...Members that are still coming down here to martian's BS Section have got to laugh at that statement. G |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST Date: 25 Apr 05 - 07:06 PM I find these American political threads really weird. Perhaps we should wind up the Yanks with threads about how Republicans are left wing terrorists and drug dealers. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Chris Green Date: 25 Apr 05 - 07:16 PM I find it far more scary that they're insular, feeble-minded cretins who couldn't find their arses with both hands, a compass, a map and a sherpa guide! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: CarolC Date: 25 Apr 05 - 07:24 PM I find these American political threads really weird. There's a very good reason for this. American politics are really weird. The threads just reflect the actual political reality here. Perhaps we should wind up the Yanks with threads about how Republicans are left wing terrorists and drug dealers. We don't need you to wind us up. We are quite capable of winding ourselves up, thank you. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Alba Date: 25 Apr 05 - 07:26 PM LOL Carol... Blessings Jude |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 25 Apr 05 - 09:47 PM I liked that also, CarolC. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST Date: 25 Apr 05 - 09:54 PM Very true, CarolC. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Little Hawk Date: 25 Apr 05 - 10:05 PM (chuckle) I think you're on the right track, Bruce. Like you said, SSDD. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST,Fenian Raider Date: 25 Apr 05 - 10:06 PM Once I stopped laughing my ass off, I actually considered some of what Martin had to say. And then continued to laugh my ass off.
Uh-huh. And the only reason the radical far-left rant is because THEY'RE SICK OF HEARING THE RADICAL FAR-RIGHT RANT. Strange, I just don't see a "middle", as you claim to be, posting what you did. ~FR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 25 Apr 05 - 10:16 PM Guest, Fenian, I don't know who the hell you are, but I can tell you for sure I sit on the moderate fence. Once upon a time I was also a dope smoking old hippie like many here until I realized life was much more rewarding if you lived it instead of constantly criticised it. If a few others here grew up also, they would know what I am talking about. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: harpgirl Date: 25 Apr 05 - 11:21 PM martin gibson is really lepus rex. lepus I'm getting very bored with your attacks on old people. five years is too long for this to go on. grow up |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Ebbie Date: 25 Apr 05 - 11:33 PM Really, harpgirl? That would be most interesting. I'm going to go check personas... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Ebbie Date: 25 Apr 05 - 11:57 PM Nope. No way. 1) Lepus Rex sometimes exhibited a sense of humor and a light touch. 2) Lepus Rex was able to reason. 3) Lepus Rex was able to make clickys. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST Date: 26 Apr 05 - 08:23 AM //*QUOTE: Guest, Fenian, I don't know who the hell you are, but I can tell you for sure I sit on the moderate fence. //end QUOTE Somehow I find that so convincing. ~FR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Little Hawk Date: 26 Apr 05 - 09:12 AM Martin, I didn't smoke dope even in the early 70's, when everyone else I knew did. I didn't smoke cigarettes either. Yuck. I was also more socially radical than most of them (cause most of them were just doing it to be cool, whereas I was doing it out of true belief). I am still more radical than most of them. I also believe in God...way, way more than I believe in most things, in fact. I love God. I honor God. But I am no fundamentalist...I shudder when I think of the fundamentalists of any organized religion. And I am not opposed on principle to people owning guns. I've known plenty of totally responsible and harmless people who owned guns, so why would I be opposed to it? A stereotype is just something people make up in their own minds, and they use it to clothe their raging fears and hatreds. Then they go around trying to dress other people up in the false clothing they made for them. (And we probably all do it at times, so it would be best to watch one's own thoughts carefully so as to weed out this nasty tendency, wouldn't it?) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: harpgirl Date: 26 Apr 05 - 11:42 AM well, I was wrong about you and sorcha, ebbie. so i could very well be wrong about mg and lepus. but I don't think I am. so lepus will have to prove he isn't mg. my theory is lepus found a jewish girlfriend...if lepus isn't mg he will find a way to make a fool out of me for this accusation. My intent though is to inject some reasonableness into the forum again since no one will ban mg like they did gargoyle. oh well, i'm an old hippie fool! l,h |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 26 Apr 05 - 02:03 PM No, harpgirl. You are a REAL OLD hippie fool. Little Hawk, you were always pretty cool in my book. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Little Hawk Date: 26 Apr 05 - 03:06 PM Well, thanks, Martin. I appreciate your good points too. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: harpgirl Date: 26 Apr 05 - 03:27 PM I am a real old hippie fool but mg, you're lepus rex. why don't you just be yourself? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Little Hawk Date: 26 Apr 05 - 03:47 PM Seems to me that his sense of humour is a bit different from Lepus Rex, as I recall Lepus Rex. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: jpk Date: 26 Apr 05 - 04:14 PM pray be but can mg. do anything besides spew insults and profanity |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: jpk Date: 26 Apr 05 - 04:53 PM just goes to show, that is all he knows |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: frogprince Date: 06 May 05 - 02:50 PM As I've looked through this, and other related material here, lately, I've seen a great light, and I feel led to submit this for your consideration: "A Creed for the American Conservative of Today" 1. Remember that the founders of this country were inspired by Almighty God. Any change in our nation's laws or Constitution more recent than the original 10 amendments, the "Bill of Rights", is in violation of His will. 2. Whatever the Bible says is wrong, is wrong; we have already gone astray in far too many respects, such as: A. not only allowing women to speak in our churches, but in many cases allowing them to usurp positions of authority. B. abolishing slavery; the Bible gives extensive guidance in the care and management of slaves; it should be obvious from this that our almighty and unchanging God has always willed that slavery be a normal institution of society. 3. If God had wanted the other people of this earth to enjoy the privileges and benefits of American citizenship, they would have been born here. 4. If you want to enjoy the privileges and benefits of American life, speak American; not some heathen foreign tongue, not some dialect distinct from that spoken by our Founding Fathers, not "English", but proper American. 5.. The goverments, and legal systems, of the other nations of earth are NOT inspired by God. Therefore it is inappropriate for any American to pay any heed to them whatever. 6. No one has ever achieved a position of earthly authority apart from the will and purpose of God. Therefore Americans not only have no right whatever to disobey any American law, but it can be further stated that it is a sin before God, and should be punishable under law, to fail to cooperate to the full extent of one's ability with all policies and actions of our national leaders. Above all it is crucial that no American should ever hesitate to kill whomever our national leaders tell us to kill. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 06 May 05 - 03:30 PM frogprince, you are finally catching on. Now, if we can just do something about those homosexual Christian priests........................... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 06 May 05 - 07:31 PM "homosexual Christian priests" The problem is not one of homosexuality, per se. In fact, Catholicism does not see homosexuality as 'wrong'. Basically, two issues are being conflated here and I think that should be addressed. 1) The Catholic church states that homosexuality itself is not wrong. ACTING on sexual urges that lead to same-sex contacts IS wrong. (I know, I know.) 2) There are homosexual rabbis who practice and lead congregations. I believe reform Judaism accepts same-sex civil marriages, although I am aware that Conservative Judaism does not. Years back I read a study which boiled down to this: Your child is statistically sexually safer with a homosexual than with a heterosexual. The issue that raised its ugly head in the past few years was the one of children having been molested and sexually abused by priests and ministers. That has nothing to do with homosexuality. So, maybe we should keep the issues separate. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Ebbie Date: 06 May 05 - 08:32 PM frogprince, in the interests of sanctity and an unblemished people, I think you should add several other nefarious activities to your list, from adultery to bestiality to heresy to gossip. The people who indulge in these are all subject to being put to death, preferably by stoning. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 06 May 05 - 09:02 PM Sheeeeeeet. Hey, I was just kidding about the goats. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 06 May 05 - 09:07 PM But then again, how stoned do ya get? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: GUEST Date: 06 May 05 - 09:17 PM Just stoned enuf to say 100 and pass it over here. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Peace Date: 06 May 05 - 09:26 PM Like, hey man, like, huh? Wha . . . ? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Once Famous Date: 06 May 05 - 10:55 PM brucie, sure there are gay rabbis in the reform sector. Thankfully, mine is not. He does tend to lean to the conservative side of the reform movement. I think he's quite perfect. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: frogprince Date: 06 May 05 - 10:57 PM No argument, Ebbie; I just went for a couple of "worst case" examples, in the sense that the vast majority of liberal have not only let their standards down completely in these instances, but they also have rationalized and excused their positions. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: Ebbie Date: 06 May 05 - 11:09 PM frogprince and brucie, picture me as nudging your ribs. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Help for Mudcat Liberals From: frogprince Date: 06 May 05 - 11:22 PM Ebbie, picture me as knowning darn well what you were doing. I never pictured you as remotely stupid enough to take the "creed" at face value. |