Subject: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 08:26 AM The reason why the US is still haunted by this war: we slaughtered 3 million Vietnamese people, and have never taken on board just how horrendous our actions were. Our "military solution" was, like Iraq, unprovoked by the Vietnamese themselves. We had no beef with them or them with us when it all began. The reasons for invading their country were lies, just like the reasons for invading Iraq were lies. "On our side"--we did quite well limiting casualties in Vietnam, just as we are doing in Iraq. While 3 million Vietnamese are estimated to have been slaughtered by the US, only 58,226 Americans were killed or MIA. That's a great ratio. In Iraq, the slaughter score is 100,000+ Iraqis to only 1,500+ Americans. Of course, nobody counts the dead Iraqis and Vietnamese, because they don't really matter in the... war against communism...war against terrorism... Only Americans count, because we rule the world. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: robomatic Date: 01 May 05 - 08:37 AM When I saw the title I figured it would be another GUEST troll. It's a pile of horse manure so I have nothing to say in this venue. If someone with a real name and some guts wants to start a thread, I'll have a say there, but this is poisoned at inception. It's 30 years since we lost you turd. Grow a spine. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 09:16 AM In the big scale of life robomatic, I'd much rather live with the stain on my soul of posting anon in an internet chat forum, than to have participated in the slaughter of 3 million innocent human beings. This is the 30th anniversary of the fall of Saigon, and the defeat of US imperialism is SE Asia. I neglected to mention we also slaughtered 600,000 innocent Cambodians while we were at it too. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: RichM Date: 01 May 05 - 10:48 AM Too touchy a subject, Guest. One of my vivid memories is the endless trail of burned out and twisted Iraqi vehicles reaching from the border of Kuwait, and well into Iraq. We still don't know how many iraqis died in retreat, while providing target practice for American military hardware. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Rapparee Date: 01 May 05 - 10:53 AM Must be nice to be a preacher in the Church of the Self-Righteous.... |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 11:17 AM Speaking the truth isn't preaching. All I have said here is true, and "the facts" cannot be challenged. The US slaughtered 3 million Vietnamese innocents...600,000 Cambodian innocents. If stating that fact on the 30th anniversary of the fall of Saigon is self-righteous preaching, then I'm proud to be guilty of it. The US is currently doing exactly the same thing to the Iraqis it did to the Vietnamese and Cambodians. Those who insist upon denying history are already repeating it. You want to defend the slaughter of innocents by the US, go right ahead... War Dougie MacLean Our voice made silent our hands made still but deep and violent wait the ones who wait to kill the desert's burning, their reasons pale for there's no returning with some golden holy grail What have they done? what have they done? the blood will run to everyone oh, what have they done? Is it for freedom? or is it for truth that father's fall and all those young men trade their youth? or are they moved by deception's hand that rank and reckless scatters death across the sand What have they done? what have they done? the blood will run to everyone oh, what have they done? Is it for freedom? or is it for truth that fathers fall and all those young men trade their youth? and the desert's burning, their faces pale for there's no returning with some golden holy grail |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 11:34 AM On second thought, this song is probably the more accurate reflection of the era we're living in now than Dougie's is... Political Science Randy Newman No one likes us-I don't know why We may not be perfect, but heaven knows we try But all around even our old friends put us down Let's drop the big one and see what happens We give them money-But are they grateful? No they're spiteful and they're hateful They don't respect us-so let's surprise them We'll drop the big one and pulverize them Asia's crowded and Europe's too old Africa is far too hot And Canada's too cold And South America stole our name Let's drop the big one There'll be no one left to blame us We'll save Australia Don't wanna hurt no kangaroo We'll built an All American amusement park there They got surfin too Boom goes London and boom Paree More room for you and more room for me And every city the whole world round Will just be another American town Oh how peaceful it will be We'll set everybody free You'll wear a Japanese kimono And there'll be Italian shoes for me They'll hate us anyhow So let's drop the big one now Let's drop the big one now |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 11:43 AM Most of those Vietnamese were killed by other Vietnamese. And two million Cambodians were killed by other Cambodians. Deal with it, preacher. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: robomatic Date: 01 May 05 - 11:49 AM I used to pick up foreign students who would be moving in to my house. Took 'em to lunch and sang 'em that Randy Newman song. We loved it, but then we understood what it was really about. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 12:00 PM Boom! System Of A Down I'm walking through your streets Where all your money's earning Where all your buildings crying And clueless neckties working Revolving fake lawn houses Housing all your fears Desensitized by T.V. Overbearing advertising God of consumers And all your crooked pictures looking good Mirrors filtering information through the public eye Designed for profit sharing Your neighbor, what a guy Boom, Boom, Boom, Boom, Every time you drop a bomb You kill the god your child has born Boom, Boom, Boom, Modern globalization Coupled with condemnations Unnecessary death Matador corporations Puppeting your frustrations with a blinded flag Manufacturing consent is the name of the game The bottom line is money nobody gives a fuck 40000 hungry children Leave us per hour from starvation While billions are spent on bombs Creating death showers Boom, Boom, Boom, Every time you drop a bomb You kill the god your child has born Boom, Boom, Boom, Every time you drop a bomb You kill the god your child has born Boom, Boom, Boom, Every time you drop a bomb You kill the god your child has born Why must we kill our own child? Boom, Boom, Boom, Every time you drop a bomb You kill the god your child has born Boom, Boom, Boom, Every time you drop a bomb You kill the god your child has born Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom Every time you drop the bomb |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 12:02 PM Bombs over Baghdad John Trudell Bombs over Baghdad, Bombs over Baghdad Bombs over Baghdad, Dancers of Death Murder in the air, with the next breath Macho Queens selling war-makers toys Raining Destruction, Good Old Boys Death Bringer In Queen George's Eyes Read his lips, war-maker lies Religious Rights revenging sword Thou shalt kill in the name of the Lord The Sheep and the Cattle can't keep from milling Some are more than ready some aren't willing Volunteering in what they're not dying for The Young Republican Guard crying for war. Free speech as free as its thought Controlled behavior reacts as its taught Fighting for Peace can't comprehend Hate out of love is violent pretends Bombs Over Baghdad, Bombs Over Baghdad Bombs Over Baghdad, Bombs Over Baghdad Vampires drinking blood and oil cocktails Their violence works it hardly ever fails When blind man can't see he believes blind Blind obedience is the child of mindless minds New world order is an old world lie. Fighting for peace, see how they die. Dragging in God, as they turn violent. God says nothing, he just remains silent. Stop madmen from running loose. Mother earth woman cant take the abuse living right now is living for tomorrow Time is saying there's no more time tomorrow Vampires drinking blood and oil cocktails Their violence works it hardly ever fails Bombs over Baghdad Dancers of Death Murder in the air with the next breath Macho Queen war-maker toys Raining destruction Good Old Boys New world order is a whole world lie. Fighting for peace, watch them all die. Dragging in God, as they turn violent. God says nothing, he just remains silent. Bombs over Baghdad, Dancers of Death Bombs over Baghdad, Dancers of Death Bombs over Baghdad, Dancers of Death Bombs over Baghdad, Dancers of Death Bombs over Baghdad |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: robomatic Date: 01 May 05 - 12:02 PM "Bang Bang, I hit the ground... "Bang Bang, my baby shot me down.: Joe, I think this thread now qualifies for 'north' of the border. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 12:05 PM Now that the United States is Vietnam's chief trading partner, Hanoi's war seems to have been pointless. But it looks like we won after all. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 12:05 PM Thousands of feet below you Alice Walker Thousands of feet Below you There is a small Boy Running from Your bombs. If he were To show up At your mother's House On a green Sea island Off the coast Of Georgia He'd be invited in For dinner. Now, driven, You have shattered His bones. He lies steaming In the desert In fifty or sixty Or maybe one hundred Oily, slimy Bits. If you survive & return To your island Home & your mother's Gracious Table Where the cup Of loving kindness Overflows The brim (& From which No one In memory Was ever Turned) Gather yourself. Set a place For him. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 12:09 PM The bravery of being out of range Roger Waters You have a natural tendency To squeeze off a shot You're good fun at parties You wear the right masks You're old, but you still Like a laugh in the locker room You can't abide change You're at home on the range You opened the suitcase Behind the old workings To show off the magnum You deafened the canyon A comfort a friend Only upstaged in the end By the Uzi machine gun Does the recoil remind you... Remind you of sex Old man what the hell you gonna kill next Old timer who you gonna kill next I looked over Jordan and what did I see Saw a U.S. Marine in a pile of debris I swam in your pools And lay under your palm trees I looked in the eyes of the Indian Who lay on the Federal Building steps And through the range finder over the hill I saw the frontline boys popping their pills Sick of the mess they find On their desert stage And the bravery of being out of range Yeah the question is vexed Old man what the hell you gonna kill next Old timer who you gonna kill next Hey bartender, over here Two more shots And two more beers Sir, turn up the TV sound The war has started on the ground Just love those laser guided bombs They're really great For righting wrongs You hit the target And win the game from bars 3,000 miles away 3,000 miles away We play the game With the bravery of being out of range We zap and maim With the bravery of being out of range We strafe the train With the bravery of being out of range We gain terrain With the bravery of being out of range We play the game With the bravery of being out of range |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 12:40 PM I'm all for moving this upstairs. Heaven is falling Bad Religion As I walk beneath the valley I shall fear no evil for thanks to King George and his rainbow cabinet today murder is legal God I know that it's wrong to kill my brother for what he hasn't done and as the planes blacken the sky... it sounds like heaven is falling it sounds like heaven is falling you promised me a new day a dawning I've seen a thousand points of light like so many points of hatred shame and horror God I want to be a man but I don't want to die with a rifle in my hand and as the planes blacken the sky... it sounds like heaven is falling it sounds like heaven is falling you promised me a new day a dawning well nothing here looks new to me but a score of mothers' sons caught 'tween the devil and a deep blue sea |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 01:00 PM Omigod, she's unleashing poetry! What ever will we do????? |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 01:07 PM Song lyrics and poetry, my dear 01:00 PM. Last time I checked, this was still a music site, no? With lots of poetry posted to it, no? This is an anniversary thread. We humans are known to mark such anniversaries with appropriate poems and songs now and then, no? Buy War Toys for Christmas Foremen Little Johnny Johnson wants an M-16 Sister Susie wants an Uzi and a submachine Kids are making wishes and wartime strategies Singing, "Happy, happy birthday to the Prince of Peace" Buy war toys for Christmas, have a happy holiday Santa traded in his red cap for a green beret Teach those happy little children to be hellcats when they play And have a very merry, military day Janie wants the latest deadly laser gun Little Tommy asked his mommy for his own B-1 Kids are dropping napalm on their Christmas trees Singing, "Happy, happy birthday to the Prince of Peace" Buy war toys for Christmas have a happy holiday Santa knows the missile toes the line in every way Teach those happy little children to be hellcats when they play And have a very merry, military day We've all got our fingers crossed for another Cold War frost Singing, "Oh by golly, let's be jolly, deck the holly-caust" Darlin' Danny Simpson armed his own brigade Staged a coup and overthrew the Christmas day parade Kids are roasting chestnuts on burning effigies Singing, "Happy, happy birthday to the Prince of Peace" Buy war toys for Christmas have a happy holiday Santa's slain his reindeer, now he flies the Enola Gay Teach those happy little children to be hellcats when they play And have a very merry, military day And have a very scary, military day Singing, "Happy, happy birthday to the Prince of Peace" |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 01:09 PM Peace is out Foremen words and music by Roy Zimmerman We used to take a nonviolent stance In Nehru jackets and bell-bottom pants We even used to sing, "Give peace a chance" God, we must have been joking We used to slander the words of our prez And praise whatever the Tao Te Ching says We used to wanna sing like Joan Baez Jesus, what we were smoking? Now when someone says, "Hell no, we won't go" What they mean is "to Berkeley" Peace is out, love is out No one wants to hear about Peace and love anymore Now we're fighting In a war against homelessness, a war against drugs 'Cause it's in to be in a war We used to traipse around in tie-dye tights Dropping daisies in enemy sights Now we're fighting for property rights Must have come to our senses We used to say all we needed was love Olive branches and sign of the dove Now we're looking for something above 90K plus expenses Now when someone says, "What the world needs now" It's a private police force Peace is out, love is out No one wants to hear about Peace and love anymore Now we're fighting In a war against joblessness, a war against crime 'Cause it's in to be in a war All we wanna say Is peace... ain't PC, it's passé Now when someone says, "We shall overcome" They mean, "We'll be right over" Peace is out, love is out No one gives a rat's ass about Peace and love anymore Now we're fighting In a war against violence, a war against poverty A war against ignorance, a war against obesity A war against censorship, a war against cavities 'Cause it's in to be in... |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 01:18 PM And from George Shrub/Dave Lippman I WONDER WHO'S KISSINGER NOW Original song, 1909 Original words by Will Hough and Frank Adams Music by Joseph E. Howard and Harold Orlob {Deep Aplogies!} You encouraged those massacres in East Timor Not as famous as Vietnam true You have wreaked your affliction on each one in turn and have sworn each one you didn't do You were our Svengali, a master by golly The extent of your crimes no one knew does it ever occur to you later my boy that you could be tried, even you? Chorus I wonder who's Kissinger now How's the old coup-binger now wonder who's looking out from his eyes breathing sighs, telling lies I wonder who's home in his head Is there remorse for the dead wonder if he still thinks he'll go free I WON-DER WHO'S KISSINGER NOW If you want to feel justice, be given your due just imagine yourself sharply dressed In the docket of some War Crimes Tribunal hearing from the people you cruelly suppressed Oh the time slips away and your crimes in Chile flit away with a sword and a tear So though you can tell where is Kissinger now You might be in jail this time next year Chorus |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Ebbie Date: 01 May 05 - 02:01 PM Isaiah's Dream Guy (Buddy) Tabor © 2005 Album: Hope "Hope is the First Step toward Disillusionment" Oh the soldier sleeps in a flag-draped grave You hid your lies behind the life he gave He obeyed your will but you lied to him Now the tears like water stain the faces of his next of kin When we rose up to say you were wrong Like Saul you gnashed your teeth with propaganda's song You wanted power, to gain control And yes, it seems that you have lost your very soul Oh the vine is green and the wine is red And the word was made flesh and you know that flesh has bled There'll come a time but I don't know when All I know is that spark of hope still burns within Isaiah's dream is coming 'round And the sword hammered into the plow on fertile ground Oh the thorns are sharp but peace will come One day all of us will dance to a different drum Oh the vine is green and the wine is red And the word made flesh and you know that flesh has bled The time will come but I don't know when All I know is that spark of hope still burns within Yes there'll come a day when there'll be no more war And it won't be taught to the nations of the world any more Yes that day will come but I don't know when All I know is that spark of hope still burns within All I know is that spark of hope still burns within |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Rapparee Date: 01 May 05 - 04:58 PM Yeah, yeah. And I, a veteran of the Infantry of the Vietnam time, also know Talking Vietnam Blues I got a letter from LBJ Sergeant, I'm a draftee Draft dodger rag Universal Soldier Galveston and a slew of others. We sang 'em on patrol. Deal with it, Preacher. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Peace Date: 01 May 05 - 05:18 PM Loved the song "Galveston" by Campbell. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Peace Date: 01 May 05 - 05:20 PM The hits just keep on rollin'. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Rapparee Date: 01 May 05 - 07:48 PM Civilization, a historian wrote, is a magnificent city situated next to a river down the middle of which constantly flows a trickle of blood. Sometimes, the river overflows its banks. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Peace Date: 01 May 05 - 07:59 PM Too true, Rapaire. With a quick count I was up to about fifty million, and I don't think that included the World Wars. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 08:22 PM So if I'm catching you gents' drift, millions of innocent human beings are slaughtered, butchered, murdered--millions more in the 20th century than throughout all the rest of human history combined...but it's nobody's fault? C'est la vie? No need to worry, it's just "human nature"? |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST,Don Firth Date: 01 May 05 - 08:28 PM Sometimes I despair of my species. Don Firth |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Peace Date: 01 May 05 - 08:33 PM "So if I'm catching you gents' drift, millions of innocent human beings are slaughtered, butchered, murdered--millions more in the 20th century than throughout all the rest of human history combined...but it's nobody's fault? C'est la vie? No need to worry, it's just "human nature"?" You are catching THIS gent's drift wrong. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Rapparee Date: 01 May 05 - 08:35 PM Likewise. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 09:57 PM The Ballad of the Green Beret ~Sgt. Barry Sadler and Robin Moore Fighting Fighting soldiers from the sky, Fearless men who jump and die. Men who mean just what they say, The brave men of the Green Beret. Silver wings upon their chests, These are men, America's best, One hundred men we'll test today, But only three win The Green Beret. Trained to live off nature's land, Trained to combat, hand to hand. Men who fight by night and day, Courage take from The Green Beret. Silver wings upon their chests, These are men, America's best, One hundred men we'll test today, But only three win The Green Beret. Back at home a young wife waits, Her Green Beret has met his fate. He has died for those oppressed, Leaving her this last request. Put silver wings on my son's chest, Make him one of America's best, He'll be a man they'll test one day, Have him win The Green Beret. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 10:02 PM (Warren Zevon) Lear jet S.W.A.T. team On a midnight run With the M16 And the Ingram gun We parachute in We parachute out "Death from above" We're screaming now Where the pay is good And the risk is high It's understood We'll do or die Sten gun in hand Where the gun is law From Ovamboland To Nicaragua Strength and muscle and jungle work Three young men In a Russian truck With a little Mac10 Sent 'em running to the huts A few young men The few who dare To battle in hell Le Mercenaire! Strength and muscle and jungle work |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 10:04 PM Roland was a warrior from the Land of the Midnight Sun With a Thompson gun for hire, fighting to be done The deal was made in Denmark on a dark and stormy day So he set out for Biafra to join the bloody fray Through sixty-six and seven they fought the Congo war Fingers on their triggers, knee-deep in gore For days and nights they battled the Bantu to their knees They killed to earn their living and to help out the Congolese Roland the Thompson gunner... His comrades fought beside him - Van Owen and the rest But of all the Thompson gunners Roland was the best So the CIA decided they wanted Roland dead That son-of-a-bitch Van Owen blew off Roland's head Roland the headless Thompson gunner (Time, time, time For another peaceful war Norway's bravest son But time stands still for Roland 'Til he evens up the score) They can still see his headless body stalking through the night In the muzzle flash of Roland's Thompson gun In the muzzle flash of Roland's Thompson gun Roland searched the continent for the man who'd done him in He found him in Mombassa in a barroom drinking gin Roland aimed his Thompson gun - he didn't say a word But he blew Van Owen's body from there to Johannesburg Roland the headless Thompson gunner... The eternal Thompson gunner, still wandering through the night Now it's ten years later but he still keeps up the fight In Ireland, in Lebanon, in Palestine and Berkeley Patty Hearst heard the burst of Roland's Thompson gun And bought it |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Peace Date: 01 May 05 - 10:06 PM "Fighting soldiers from the sky, Fearless men who jump and die." That was always a bad song. Sorry to all who like it, but the first two lines really need re-write. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 01 May 05 - 10:10 PM too bad brucie: gordon fuckin' lightfoot couldn't touch that lyric by reachin' up and jumpin' here's more: Trey Parker: America, Fuck Yeah America... America... America, FUCK YEAH! Coming again, to save the mother fucking day yeah, America, FUCK YEAH! Freedom is the only way yeah, Terrorist your game is through cause now you have to answer too, America, FUCK YEAH! So lick my butt, and suck on my balls, America, FUCK YEAH! What you going to do when we come for you now, it's the dream that we all share; it's the hope for tomorrow FUCK YEAH! McDonalds, FUCK YEAH! Wal-Mart, FUCK YEAH! The Gap, FUCK YEAH! Baseball, FUCK YEAH! NFL, FUCK, YEAH! Rock and roll, FUCK YEAH! The Internet, FUCK YEAH! Slavery, FUCK YEAH! FUCK YEAH! Starbucks, FUCK YEAH! Disney world, FUCK YEAH! Porno, FUCK YEAH! Valium, FUCK YEAH! Reeboks, FUCK YEAH! Fake Tits, FUCK YEAH! Sushi, FUCK YEAH! Taco Bell, FUCK YEAH! Rodeos, FUCK YEAH! Bed bath and beyond (Fuck yeah, Fuck yeah) Liberty, FUCK YEAH! White Slips, FUCK YEAH! The Alamo, FUCK YEAH! Band-aids, FUCK YEAH! Las Vegas, FUCK YEAH! Christmas, FUCK YEAH! Immigrants, FUCK YEAH! Popeye, FUCK YEAH! Demarcates, FUCK YEAH! Republicans (republicans) (fuck yeah, fuck yeah) Sportsmanship Books |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Rapparee Date: 01 May 05 - 10:16 PM It was a lousy song, full of pathos and jingoism. That's why we parodied it: Fighting fuckups of the land Fearless men who come by hand.... |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Rapparee Date: 01 May 05 - 10:59 PM My (activated) National Guard unit used to bust up bars at Chu Lai, fighting (and winning) with Special Forces: SPECIAL FORCES SONG Bird shit falling from the sky, These are men who jump and cry. One hundred men will shit today, And wipe their ass with a green beret. Sixth Regiment, you know the name, Throughout Vietnam, you've heard our claim When it comes to pride and fame, Who needs that silly green beret? Silver wings upon my chest? I ride in choppers above the rest. Although I get less dough this way, Who needs that silly green beret? At Ha Tahn or at Tra Bong, I dare you, cunt, to say I'm wrong, A dozen men we saved today, And every one was a green beret. In your compounds, there you sit. The folks back home believe you, shit. If they knew, they'd change their tone, And pack your bags and send you home. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Bobert Date: 01 May 05 - 11:01 PM Ahhhhh, sorry to be late to the song-writtin' contest but don't matter... Yeah, the US has taken over where Hitler left off as the world's assasins.... And they have performed, and continue to perform, well in this role... Bobert |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 02 May 05 - 08:50 AM Just like some of the proud men posting here Bobert. They love being little Hitlers and butchering the innocent. There is nothing special about the US "Special Forces" except their barbarity. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Rapparee Date: 02 May 05 - 09:08 AM Yes, sir, Preacher. That Quartermaster Unit I was with in NG sure were paid killer drug-crazed assassins. Why, when that convoy of JP-4 was ambushed on Highway 1 and the driver of the lead truck was hit bad and he told his Assistant Driver to jump so he could drive the truck off a 50 foot embankment and let the rest of the convoy get clear of killing zone, why I'll betcha he was just buckin' for a medal! (Good thing the Army never gave him one, huh? If he'd lived he mighta gotten a swelled head.) And my late friend Bob, who used to go into villages on MEDCAP and take care of the kids and the old folks, he only did it so that later he could call in napalm strikes and listen to the bodies sizzle. You pompous, worthless, sorry gas bag, sitting in your pile of self-righteous manure, parroting back what far better women and men originally said forty years ago, knowing nothing beyond what you learn in the media and on the Internet, doing nothing but mocking your betters and vampire-like living off their responses while hiding behind anonymity! I hereby challenge you to do something to prove what you say are your beliefs! I challenge you to actively participate in the work of "Clear Path" -- as former Vietnam Vets have -- and help Cambodia and Vietnam get rid of unexploded landmines and other explosives (not all of which were of US origin). Come on, Preacher -- put you life where your mouth is. Never mind -- I shan't be back to see if you do. Loudmouthed coward. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 02 May 05 - 10:39 AM Why shouldn't US soldiers/vets who are ordered to kill innocent people and then do it, expect to be attacked, captured, tortured, killed? That's the game. Don't like your prospects for survival when you are part of a military force invading and conquering other peoples' countries, especially countries where you are killing millions of civilians--don't go. You don't get any sympathy or honor points from me for "serving" the US murder machine. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Peace Date: 02 May 05 - 11:50 AM GUEST, Despite my admiration of your anti-war position, I think you should know that the man you are addressing is both honourable and honest. You may think that your rhetoric is motivated by a desire for world peace, but then your words indicate something that is quite the opposite. PS Don't bother ranting at me. I've probably spent more days in custody for anti-war demonstrations than you ever have. YOU go put your body on the line. Right now, it just seems to be your mouth. Walk the walk then come tell us all about it. Then, I will listen to you. PPS I seem to share more in common with Rapaire than I ever will with you. And maybe you should be aware, I know that man well enough to assert that he hates war much more than you do. Think about that the next time you decide to shoot your mouth of at him. He's better than that; you should try to be. BM |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 02 May 05 - 01:42 PM Honorable and honest men don't slaughter innocent civilians. End of discussion for me. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Peace Date: 02 May 05 - 02:03 PM OK. Goodbye then. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Rapparee Date: 02 May 05 - 02:05 PM Why GUEST, you've found me out. My fondest memories are of cutting the throat of a young girl we'd just finished raping and then swinging her little brother by the legs and smashing his head against a tree. Then we took the village teacher and tied her spread-eagle between two trees -- it was much more efficient to disembowel her that way. And as for the headman of the village, why, he sure did squirm when we shoved that bamboo pole up his ass! Oh, wait. Sorry. Wrong atrocities. These were done by Charlie. Oops. My bad. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 02 May 05 - 02:10 PM Nice try Rapaire, but the entire world (except for the apologists for the US troops) knows that it wasn't just "Charlie" committing atrocities and slaughtering innocent civilians in Vietnam. For one thing, "Charlie" didn't own any B-52s. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: sixtieschick Date: 02 May 05 - 02:58 PM I usually avoid getting involved in these mud-slinging fests on political threads, but I feel compelled to jump into this one. I too have more anti-Vietnam war protests and lungs-full of tear gas in my past than most. However, Guest, if you consider yourself a proponent of nonviolence, I invite you to look at the arrows you are slinging on this thread. The greatest proponents of nonviolence in our time, from Mohandas Gandhi and Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. to legions of unnamed conscientious objectors and peace workers ALL advocate examining the violence in one's own heart as a necessary precursor to taking nonviolent action. Action includes speech. Some of the finest men I know have gone to war or otherwise served in the military. They had their reasons. Those who went to Vietnam had a bad time over there and sometimes even a worse time when they returned home. Why continue to attempt to wound them? |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 02 May 05 - 03:16 PM That's a pretty outrageous attempt to equate being curt and strident to other posters, to being violent. Nice try, buy homey don't play that tune. I'm very clear, in both my convictions and my actions. Of course there are people taken aback by such plain, direct, and forthright stridency. But what I am doing isn't violence--not by any stretch of the imagination. I am not behaving any differently here than I would with my own family members who are former military who did active combat duty--and I have one brother-in-law--a Korean War vet--whom I go round with on a regular basis on this issue. Actually, the men and women I've known who have served in the US military don't impress me one way or the other just because of military service. I don't buy that propaganda line. Nor do I feel I "owe" Vietnam vets or the post-Vietnam soldiers and vets who did active combat duty, any thanks--quite the opposite. They didn't murder in MY name, regardless of what the propaganda tells you. And the current active duty soldiers engaged in the slaughter of innocent civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan are butchers too. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: GUEST Date: 02 May 05 - 03:17 PM BTW, I'm not claiming to be a proponent of non-violence. I AM opposed to the slaughter of innocent civilians around the world by the US military in the name of "national security" or "freedom" or "democracy". Butchery by armed thugs is still butchery, even when my fellow country men are the ones engaging in it. |
Subject: RE: BS: American Slaughter of Vietnamese From: Rapparee Date: 02 May 05 - 03:19 PM Goodbye, Preacher. I leave you with these thoughts: ...In 1953 the Communist Viet Minh (as they were then known) launched two of their murderous "land reform" programs in North Vietnam, the so-called "sky-splitting and earth-shaking" mass campaigns. "A particularly shocking device of these two savage campaigns," notes Professor Rummel, "was murder by quota."(31) The Communist Party Politburo ordered that "5 percent of the folk in each village and hamlet had to be eliminated: five in a village of 100, twenty-five in a village of 500 and fifty in a village of 1,000." Rummel cites estimates of the murder toll for these campaigns alone as somewhere between 15,000 to 500,000.(32) All told, says Rummel, between 1953 and 1956 the Communists likely killed 195,000 to 865,000 North Vietnamese. These were noncombatant men, women and children. That can hardly be considered winning by occupying the "moral high ground." In 1956, high Communist official Nguyen Manh Tuong admitted that "while destroying the landowning class, we condemned numberless old people and children to a horrible death." This same genocidal pattern became the Communists' standard operating procedure in the South also. This was unequivocally demonstrated by the Hue Massacre. In addition to reporting the exact reverse of the actual military outcome of the Tet Offensive, the liberal media covered up another very important part of the story: the massive atrocities committed by the Communists in the city of Hue during Tet. When they were driven out of Hue 26 days later, thousands of people were missing. A series of mass graves was discovered containing the bodies of 2,750 missing civilians who had been shot, clubbed to death, or buried alive. An equal number remained missing, presumed to be abducted or executed. According to the 1972 U.S. Senate Internal Security Subcommittee report entitled The Human Cost of Communism in Vietnam, "the killings were in no sense random, but were carried out on the basis of explicit directives and from prepared lists of names, the Communists moving through the streets methodically with their clipboards and pulling the victims from their houses." |