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Lyr Add: Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor

DigiTrad:
DARK EYED SAILOR
THE DARK-EYED CANALLER
THE LOUSY MINER


GUEST,.gargoyle 02 May 05 - 03:31 PM
nutty 02 May 05 - 04:42 PM
michaelr 03 May 05 - 12:19 AM
Liz the Squeak 03 May 05 - 03:33 AM
GUEST 03 May 05 - 05:43 AM
GUEST,Martin Ryan 03 May 05 - 05:44 AM
Liz the Squeak 03 May 05 - 10:08 AM
Joe Offer 03 May 05 - 01:03 PM
Liz the Squeak 03 May 05 - 02:31 PM
Malcolm Douglas 03 May 05 - 04:20 PM
michaelr 03 May 05 - 09:30 PM
Joe Offer 03 May 05 - 10:00 PM
Liz the Squeak 04 May 05 - 03:37 AM
Le Scaramouche 14 Oct 05 - 03:21 PM
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Subject: Lyr Add: FAIR PHOEBE AND HER DARK-EYED SAILOR
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 02 May 05 - 03:31 PM

DARK-EYED SAILOR - http://www.mudcat.org/Detail.CFM?messages__Message_ID=866171
THE DARK-EYED CANALLER - http://www.mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=6141

Similar in many aspects to the above listed songs - but also very different.

Emrich, Duncan, American Folk Poetry - An Anthology Chapter "The Broken Token, or Love Returned in Disguise," Little Brown, 1974 p157.

"Fair Phoebe and Her Dark-Eyed Sailor" was recorded by Phillips Barry from the singing of Mrs. Guy R. Hathaway, Mattawankeag, Maine, 1932, as leared when a child from her aunt. Reported, with two sets of music, by Barry in Bulletin of the Folksong Society of the Northeast, Cambridge, Mass., 6 (1933) :8-10. Barry feels that "Fair Phoebe" cannot be earlier than the 1830's. Laws, N-35-

FAIR PHOEBE AND HER DARK-EYED SAILOR

I'll tell you of a come-lye young lady fair,
Who was walking out for to take the air;
She met a sailor upon the way,
So I paid attention,
So I paid attention, to hear what they might say.

"Fail maid," said he, "why roam you alone?
For the night is coming, and the day's far gone;--"
She said, while tears from her eyes did flow,
"For my dark-eyed sailor,
For my dark-eyed sailor, so manly true and bold!"

Cries William, "Drive him from off you mind!
As true a sailor as him, you'll find;
Love turns aside, and cold does grow,
Like a winter's morning.
Like a winter's morning when the hills are clad with snow."

These words did Phoebe's fond heart inflame;
She cries, "On me you shall play no game!"
She drew her dagger, and then did cry,
"For my dark-eyed sailor,
For my dark-eyed sailor, a maid I'll live and die.

"It's seven long years since he left this land;
A diamond ring he took from off my hand;
He broked the token; left half with me,
And the other's rolling,
And the other's rolling at the bottom of the sea.

"His coal black eyes and his curly hair,
His flattering tongue did my heart ensnare;
Genteel he was, and no rake like you,
To advise a maiden,
To advise a maiden to slight the jacket blue.

"A tarry sailor I'll ne'er disdain,
But always I will treat the same;
To drink you health, here's a piece of coin,
For my dark-eyed sailor,
For my dark-eyed sailor still claims this heart of mine."

When William did this ring unfold,
She seemed distracted midst joy and woe.
"You're welcome, William, I've lands and gold
For my dark-eyed sailor,
For my dark-eyed sailor, so manly true and bold."

In a cottage down by the riverside,
In unity and love, they now abide;
So, girls, be true while you lover's away,
For a cloudy morning,
For a cloudy morning oft brings a pleasant day.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: FAIR PHOEBE AND HER DARK-EYED SAILOR
From: nutty
Date: 02 May 05 - 04:42 PM

This broadside of the song in the Bodleian Library is dated much earlier than 1830

Click Here


Printer:      [s.n.] ([s.l.])
   Date:      between 1767 and 1808
   
             Printer's Series: (39).
   
               
   Copies:    Johnson Ballads 2483
   
               
   Ballads:   1.Fair Phoebe and her dark-ey'd sailor ("'Tis of a                      comely young lady fair ...")
                To the tune of: Female smuggler
                Subject: Lovers reunited
             2.Nothing at all; or Derry-down dale ("In Derry-down                   dale when I wanted a mate ...")


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: FAIR PHOEBE AND HER DARK-EYED SAILOR
From: michaelr
Date: 03 May 05 - 12:19 AM

Sounds to me like someone took the trad "Dark-eyed Sailor" and gave it the soap opera treatment (as in Victorian sentimental hype). It's obvious that the name Phoebe is not native to the song at all, at all.

Cheers,
Michael


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: FAIR PHOEBE AND HER DARK-EYED SAILOR
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 03 May 05 - 03:33 AM

What's wrong with Phoebe (variously spelt Phoeby, Phebe, Pheobe) as the original name? I've been researching my family history for over 20 years, been through countless parish records and made copious notes. Parishes I've looked through range from inland rural to major shipping ports and London Docks. I've only ever found one Nancy (Poplar, London 1881 census) but have several Phoebes ranging back to 1760.

If you want someone to blame for the 'soap opera treatment' then you probably have to blame John Ashton, the collector. He was born in 1834 and in the 1870's abandoned his former livelihood and took to researching the British Museum for songs. 'Dark Eyed strangler' is one of those songs and is in the book 'Real Sailor Songs'. Oddly enough, there are several Nancys (or Nanny in one) but there are also plenty of Dolls, Polls and Mollys; There's Marie, Phoebe and Sue or Sukey, Amelia, Jenny, Jeanie, Bet and Bessie. It isn't beyond the realms of possibility that Phoebe is correct. Besides, my daughter thinks it's her song... it has her name in it!

(Little aside here re: names... Nancys always seem to come from Yarmouth (unless it's the same Nancy!), Sukey always seems to work for the Pressgang and Mollys (my mother in law's name) are the heartbreakers most likely to marry another!)

LTS


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: FAIR PHOEBE AND HER DARK-EYED SAILOR
From: GUEST
Date: 03 May 05 - 05:43 AM

"dark-eyed strangler"! Could we have the words for that one, please?!

I have a CD of June Tabor somwhere - and still jump when, after a typically quiet not-to-say-morose number, she belts into an up-tempo version of "Dark Eyed Sailor".

Regards


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: FAIR PHOEBE AND HER DARK-EYED SAILOR
From: GUEST,Martin Ryan
Date: 03 May 05 - 05:44 AM

.. the above.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: FAIR PHOEBE AND HER DARK-EYED SAILOR
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 03 May 05 - 10:08 AM

Sorry... post Hastings festival tryping error.

Dark eyed Strangler - wasn't he the bass guitarist?

There's a Seaman's hostel nearby that is called the Strangers Rest... I dyslexed that the first time I saw it, and it's forever been The Stranglers' Rest - fairly appropriate as it's not too far from the haunts of Jack the Ripper....

LTS


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor
From: Joe Offer
Date: 03 May 05 - 01:03 PM

The Traditional Ballad Index has quite an entry on this song:

Dark-Eyed Sailor, The (Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor) [Laws N35]

DESCRIPTION: The singer courts a girl, but she remains true to William, her sailor, gone these seven years. William at last identifies himself and produces his half of their broken ring. The two are married and settle down
AUTHOR: unknown
EARLIEST DATE: before 1809 (broadside, Bodleian Johnson Ballads 2483)
KEYWORDS: love courting brokentoken marriage
FOUND IN: US(Ap,MA,MW,NE,SE) Canada(Mar,Newf) Britain(Scotland,England(Lond)) Ireland
REFERENCES (18 citations):
Laws N35, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor (Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor)"
Gardner/Chickering 57, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text plus 1 excerpt and mention of 2 more, 1 tune)
Doerflinger pp. 300-301, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
SHenry H232, p. 318, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
JHCox 93, "The Broken Ring" (1 text)
Huntington-Whalemen, pp. 120-122, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Ord, pp. 323-324, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
BrownII 95, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text (with mention of a variant collection) plus 1 excerpt)
MacSeegTrav 26, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Creighton/Senior, pp. 144-146, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" ( 2 texts, 1 tune)
Creighton-NovaScotia 29, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Greenleaf/Mansfield 36, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text)
Peacock, pp. 513-514, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Karpeles-Newfoundland 55, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Lehr/Best 27, "The Dark-eyed Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Darling-NAS, pp. 125-126, "The Dark Eyed Sailor" (1 text)
Silber-FSWB, p. 147, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor" (1 text)
DT 460, DARKEYED* DARKEYE2

Roud #265
RECORDINGS:
Warde Ford, "Nightingales of Spring" (AFS 4198 A1, 1938; in AMMEM/Cowell)
BROADSIDES:
Bodleian, Johnson Ballads 2483, "Fair Phoebe and her Dark-ey'd Sailor," unknown [Printer's Series:(39)], 1767-1808; also Harding B 11(498), "Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor," J. Catnach (London), 1813-1838; Harding B 11(499), Johnson Ballads 452, Firth c.18(141), Harding B 15(99a), Harding B 11(1120), Firth c.12(261), Harding B 11(1119), Harding B 11(3030), Harding B 16(84b), "Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor"; Firth c.17(53), Harding B 11(2824), Firth b.27(475), "Fair Phoebe and her Dark-ey'd Sailor"; Harding B 16(326b), "Fair Phoebe and her Dark Eyed Sailor"; Firth b.25(142), Harding B 15(98b), "Fair Phoebe and her Dark Ey'd Sailor"; Harding B 11(3493), Johnson Ballads 1837, "Fair Phoebe, and the Dark-Eye'd Sailor"; Firth b.25(193), "Fair Phoebe and the Dark-Eyed sailor"; Harding B 15(99b), "Fair Phoeby and Her Dark Eyed Sailor"; Harding B 18(114), "Dark Ey'd Sailor" ("'Tis of a comely young lady, fair")
LOCSinging, as102640, "Dark Ey'd Sailor," J. Andrews (New York), 1853-1859; also sb10077b, "Dark Ey'd Sailor"
Murray, Mu23-y1:016, "The Dark-Eyed Sailor," R. M'Intosh (Calton), 19C; also Mu23-y1:102, "Fair Phoebe And Her Dark-Eyed Sailor," James Lindsay (Glasgow), 19C

CROSS-REFERENCES:
cf. "John (George) Riley (I)" [Laws N36] and references there
cf. "Brave Wolfe" [Laws A1] and references there (tune)
cf. "The Female Smuggler" (tune, per broadsides Bodleian Johnson Ballads 2483, Bodleian Harding B 11(498), Bodleian Harding B 11(499))
Notes: Ford sings this to the tune usually associated with "The Blacksmith," which -- so far as I know -- hasn't been otherwise collected outside Britain except as "Brave Wolfe." - PJS

Lines shared with The Banks of Sweet Primroses: Young girl's be true while your love's at sea, For a dark cloudy morning Brings forth a pleasant day."
Broadside LOCSinging as102640: J. Andrews dating per Studying Nineteenth-Century Popular Song by Paul Charosh in American Music, Winter 1997, Vol 15.4, Table 1, available at FindArticles site. - BS
File: LN35


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The Ballad Index Copyright 2005 by Robert B. Waltz and David G. Engle.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 03 May 05 - 02:31 PM

It seems to vary between 2 and 7, the book I mentioned earlier (Real Sailor Songs) has '2 long years since he left the land', the book professes to be the result of John Ashtons' researches in the British Museum. Either there is more than one broadside with different years, or someone made a mistake copying it down, or else it's a mistake with handwriting. If it was written numerically, it could be quite easy to mistake 7 for 2.

LTS


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 03 May 05 - 04:20 PM

All the broadside examples I've seen have two, not seven, years; Ashton did make occasional errors of transcription, but I don't see any reason to think that he made one in this case. I suspect that the years stretched to seven when the song moved into oral currency; "seven years" is a nice, round, traditional span and would come automatically to mind.

The set Christie printed in 1881 (Traditional Ballad Airs, II, 100-101) was from tradition, with two years changed to seven and Phoebe's name dropped from the title, but otherwise hardly changed from the broadsides. Later broadsides sometimes dropped her name from the title while retaining it in the song (De Marsan of New York, for example, c.1860: see Bodleian, Harding B 18(114)) but on the whole it seems to have been oral currency that trimmed the song down and lost or sometimes changed the heroine's name.

There's no particular evidence that the broadsides are elaborated versions of some unrecorded folk-song (though they certainly follow the standard formulae for such subjects); more likely, on the whole, that the traditional sets are reductions of the broadside.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor
From: michaelr
Date: 03 May 05 - 09:30 PM

Thank you all for correcting my misconception.

Cheers,
Michael


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Subject: Lyr Add: Fair Phoeby and her Dark Eyed Sailor
From: Joe Offer
Date: 03 May 05 - 10:00 PM

After that post from Liz, I figured I'd better go to Ashton's Real Sailor Songs (1972 reprint of the 1891 book) and find out about that strangler. I have to say I was disappointed. Liz led me astray. And to think that I trusted her...
But here's the version from Ashton:

Fair Phoeby and Her Dark Eyed Sailor

It's* of a comely young lady fair,
Was walking out for to take the air;
She met a sailor upon her way,
And I paid attention to what they did say.

Said William, Lady, why roam alone?
The night is coming on, and the day near gone,
And she said, while the tears from her eyes did fall,
It's a dark eyed sailor that's proving my downfall.

It's two long years since he left the land,
I took a gold ring from off my hand,
We broke the token—here's part with me,
And the other rolling at the bottom of the sea.

Said William drive him all from your mind,
Another sailor as good you will find,
Love turns aside, and soon cold do grow,
Like a winter's morning, when lands are clothed in snow.

These words did Phoeby's fond heart inflame,
She said, On me you shall play no game,
She drew a dagger, and then did cry,
For my dark ey'd sailor, a maid I'll live and die.

His coal black eye, and his curly hair,
And pleasing tongue did my heart insnare,
Genteel he was, but no rank like you,
To advise a maiden to slight the jacket blue.

But still, said Phoeby, I'll ne'er disdain
A tarry Sailor, but treat the same,
Then drink his health, here's a piece of Coin,
But my dark ey'd sailor still claims this heart of mine.

Then half the ring did young William show,
See** seem'd distracted 'midst joy and woe
Oh, welcome, William, I've lands and gold,
For my dark ey'd Sailor, so manly, true and bold.

Then in a village down by the Sea,
They joined in Wedlock, and well agree;
All maids be true when your love's away,
A cloudy morning brings forth a fine day.


(* ? - text says "Ir's")
**sic - most probably "she"


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 04 May 05 - 03:37 AM

Joe - we have the same book! Big shit brown coloured thing?

And I'm happy to lead you astray any time!

Can't help thinking that I wouldn't want to marry someone that a) I professed to love but didn't recognise after only 2 years, and b) would play such a mean and nasty trick on someone obviously in some distress!

I guess the Dark eyed Strangler will get written, as soon as I've learned the tune properly!

LTS


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Fair Phoebe and her Dark-Eyed Sailor
From: Le Scaramouche
Date: 14 Oct 05 - 03:21 PM

Who says only the Victorians were capable of hideous sentimental hype?
Anyone read Pamela?


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