BS: Microsoft make money from oppression

Subject: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: Stu
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 08:03 AM

A quick look at this story as reported by Wired news or the BBC reveals an appalling tale of corporate greed and the suppression of free speech in China.

I thought the Americans were fighting for freedom, not assisting in extinguishing it for the sake of making a few bucks. It seems strange ythey are willing to sacrifice their soldiers lives in one part of the world whilst snuggling up to another brutal regime taht will bite them in the arse in years to come.

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 08:08 AM

Don't forget Walmart as in ... http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/trainecon.jpg

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: Stu
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 11:03 AM

My spelling is truly awful. Apologies.

Good link Donuel!

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 11:35 AM

A very well done image idea, Donuel. It tells your story at a quick glance.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: wysiwyg
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 12:19 PM

Microsoft make money from oppression

But.... really, don't we all? Knowingly or unknowingly, don't we?

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 01:06 PM

The Chinese government made the rules. Microsoft has the option of providing, in China, a blog service that conforms to Chinese law or of providing no service at all. I fail to see how NOT PROVIDING a blog service for the Chinese market would be a more positive action than providing as much of a service as the local government(s) permit.

Virtually all programs include the ability to "censor" web content to exclude specific content. It's called the "privacy filter" and is most likely part of your own browser - even if it's not by Microsoft. The usual implementation simply blocks all access to any site that contains any instance of whatever "offending language" you choose to list in the filter settings. It would appear that, for the Chinese, Microsoft has significantly extended this filtering capability so that some communication can be provided, and the opportunity is presented to "clean it up" and continue to have some contact with the rest of the world. The alternative would be to allow the Chinese to shut down any blog that ever, even inadvertently, used any word or phrase that THE CHINESE GOVERNMENT found offensive.

Failure to provide the service as described would be to yield to the intent of the CHINESE GOVERNMENT to completely silence anyone who might - innocently or intentionally - talk about some forbidden subject. That would be better?

John

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 02:19 PM

Aww comon deamonizing Microsoft for their smug monopolistic big brother attitude is as American as apple pie
- even if MS is merely obeying Chinese regulations to the letter.

It was nearly two years ago that a mudcat poster from China said they could not view any of my images.

I suspect the Chinese internet censorship has been long standing.

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 02:45 PM

Donuel -

See - even the Chinese aren't all bad....

(It's a joke.)

John

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: Rapparee
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 02:48 PM

This isn't news. It's been going on for some years. Check out Myamar (Burma), too. And Russia would like to and probably does. (And the US also monitors the Web.)

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: DougR
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 04:11 PM

It's just so much more fun to blame the big corporation than it is to blame the Chinese government, John. You should realize that. :>)

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 04:18 PM

Scan and OCR from Technology Review, June 2005. This "summary" is not on line, hence the lengthy post.

VACCINES

Market Injection: Nongovernmental organizations can meet a severe need in the market for vaccines: buyers

In January, GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) launched Rotarix, a rotavirus vaccine, in Mexico. That launch may alter the course of vaccine development for the better: Rotarix was the first vaccine from a major pharmaceutical firm to debut not in the United States or Europe but in a poor country. The story of Rotarix (see "The Vaccine That Almost Wasn't," p. 36) shows that getting vaccines where they are needed most requires giving companies like GSK financial incentives. The emergence ofwhat can be thought. of as a superbuyer for vaccines—the Global Alliance for Vaccines and Immuluzation (GAVI)—may help create those incentives.

Before GSKs Rotarix, the vaccine story usually went like this:

A drug company would develop a vaccine for a European country or the United States. It would charge a relatively high price for about 15 years. then, once it had made a profit, and the medicine had gone off patent. it would introduce the vaccine at a lower price to poor countries.
The trouble with this model is not just that 15 years is a long time to wait; it's also that certain diseases are much more dangerous in poor countries than in rich ones.

Rotavirus, which induces diarrhea, is one such disease. Although almost every child is exposed to it by the age of five, its horror is not universal. In the United States. it kills between 20 and 40 children per year; in the rest of the world, it. kills an estimated half-million children (about 1,000 in Mexico alone).

Part ofwhat made GSK alter its model was the emergence of GAVI, which was founded five years ago, thanks largely to $750 million from the Bill and Melinda Gates Founiation. In 2005, GAVI named rotavirus a top priority, and this January, the Gates Foundation pledged another $750 million to it over the next 10 years. GAVI's Vaccine Fund serves countries whose per-capita gross national income is less than $1,000. Though the fund will not directly benefit Mexico, whose average income levels are too high. it is poised to help fund vaccination in scores of countries. GAVI's buying power helped convince GSK to forgo the traditional road to vaccine development.

If all goes according to plan, GSK wi1l introduce Rotarix to other Latin American countries, and Asia, by the end ofthe year. While it plans to target Europe and the United States later on, the developing world is its first priority. This is as it should be. Countries should support GAVI and programs like it so that drug developers like GSK have the financial incentive to meet the most urgent medical needs.

You can see the full article (about 6 pages) at The Vaccine That Almost Wasn't, By Jim Kling June 2005.

An additional sidebar that, as far as I can tell isn't posted, reports that the "Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation" has now passed the Carnegie Foundation in total funding, making it the largest single charitable organization in the US. The Gates Foundation has been concentrating its efforts on the alleviation of illnesses in poor countries to date.

Maybe some art re the need for special funding to develop medicines for those in poor countries?

John

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: GUEST,Shanghaiceltic
Date: 15 Jun 05 - 06:06 PM

Many websites are self censoring in China, and if they dont delete inflamatory posts then the watchdogs will, as well as shutting down the website.

Much of the software provided to China to watch the web has come from US companies. The Chinese are still busy developing their own.

While I cannot access the BBC news website, the written one, I can access BBC via broadband, so the blocking is somewhat patchy.

I was away on business the other week and I had CNN on in the hotel room (yes a sad bastard I am). There was an interview with Jung Chang about her latest book a biog of Mao. Halfway through it was interupted, a few minutes later it was back, the interview was over. So there is also the ability to block satellite feeds too.

I can buy foreign newspapers and magazines which often contain article critical of China, but Chinese ones all toe the party line.

Strange country this.

Subject: RE: BS: Microsoft make money from oppression
From: Stu
Date: 17 Jun 05 - 05:09 AM

Well, of course I do blame the Chinese Government more than Microsoft, but that is not the thrust of my argument. I am questioning whether it is acceptable for companies to profit from the suppression of freedom of speech and dissemination of information.

John's argument that refusing the service provided would in fact be yielding to the Chinese Government's desire to silence free speech may be true to some degree and is often trumpted by corporate interests, but past history has shown this does not work with the Chinese (otherwise they would have left Tibet years ago).

Unfortuately, the feeding frenzy going on in China by western companies and governments is purely short-term profiteering and the kickback from the strengthening Chinese economy will prove a real problem in years to come, when they will dominate the world markets. Remember - this country is run as a brutal dictorship the sort of which we all profess to hate - just look here if you need reminding. You can't help but wonder if the Third Reich had prospered many of our business and political leaders would be justifying working with them sixty years after the holocaust.

As for the idea that multinational pharmaceutical companies have an overwhelming desire to help the developing world cope with the disease pandemics that are killing millions every year, don't even go there. Examples of their altruism can be read here, and the appalling Nigerian episode is touched onhere in this article.

stigWeard