Origins: Night Rider's Lament

Subject: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST,Marty
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 10:53 AM

I would like to record this song for a CD I am working on but have been unable to find out who can send me a mechanical license. Harry
Fox doesn't have it and doesn't know. Groper Music no longer handles it. BMI hasn't returned my calls...

If anyone can give me a definative answer, I would greatly appreciate it!

Please write me at: [e-mail]

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Amos
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 10:59 AM

Words and music by Mike Burton, copyright 1975 Groper Music, Inc.

Recorded on Fashioned in the Clay, FSI-104, 1985, Gordon Bok, Ann
Mayo Muir, and Ed Trickett. Also recorded earlier by Jerry Jeff
Walker with a yodel at the end. It's a nice statement about
different strokes for different folks with a little bite to it.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Amos
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 11:01 AM

Emailed rangermarty with the above info.


A

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 11:05 AM

Amos,

Tnanks for your quick repy...I know Michael Burton wrote it, but don't know how to get in contact with him. Groper Music is/was associated with Jerry Jeff Walker's Music Company, but when I contacted them, they no longer "have interest in the song". Apparently there was a lot of legal problems over it years ago, and so they couldn't help me and could not refer me to anyone who could.

If anyone can help me track down a definative answer that results in me getting the mechanical license, I will send you a free CD of my music when it is finished.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: open mike
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 04:11 PM

I think he was from alaska or canada...
good luck and let us know what you
find out! I love to sing that song,
and would be interested in finding
our more about him..did he write and
other songs? record any?

Who was Jenny?
Who was Dougie?

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 04:50 PM

Hi, Marty - You can get a U.S. mechanical license from the Harry Fox Agency's www.songfile.com. Cost is 8 cents a copy, available only in lots of 500. There's a small processing charge - two bucks, I think. Make sure your browser is set to allow popups - the site works better with Internet Explorer, and not so well with Firefox.
Search under "Night Rider's Lament" - the songwriter name brings up too many "hits."
Note that it may take a week to get the response with the license number. I was in a hurry last time, and they were renovating their Website and it took more time than I had - so, the lesson is, do it before your deadline.
-Joe Offer (e-mail sent)-

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Amos
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 05:24 PM

If that doesn't work out, perhaps Kendall could find out from Gordon Bok how he got his recording blessed.


A

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Peace
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 05:25 PM

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:wcybVH5VxyYJ:www.bobsokol.com/lyrics/ntrider.htm+michael+burton,+night+rider%27s+lament&hl=en

The chording on the above link is a bit more user-friendly than what's in the DT. Ya may want to look at it.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 06:57 PM

Joe and Marty,

I recorded this tune with mu band last year. Did a hell of a job.
Harry Fox refused to release it for license and nowhere were we able to get it cleared.

Very expensive recording too. Should have cleared it before we recorded.

Don

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Peace
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 07:33 PM

I noticed that Garth Brooks recorded the song. On this site http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:M2obstl1JV4J:www.planetgarth.com/lyrics/night_riders_lament.shtml+night+rider%27s+lament,+gar the following disclaimer appears. It might be worth trying    [e-mail]


DISCLAIMER:
Reprinted under license from BMI, ASCAP or SESAC. The material reprinted here is copyrighted by its respective artists and publishers and provided under license to Planet Garth and The Roughstock Network and may not be reproduced, redistributed or used for any other purpose than the private study, scholarship, or research or enjoyment of our readers. E-mail [e-mail] for more licensing information.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Mary Katherine
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 08:11 PM

Nanci Griffith recorded this song on her CD "Other Voices, Other Rooms" on Elektra, and she also printed the lyrics in the CD booklet. She gives the same credit as has been stated above: Words & Music by Michael Burton, Groper Music, BMI. The fine print in the back of the booklet says "all lyrics reprinted by permission," so somewhere along the road there *is* someone empowered to give permissions and licenses. Don't give up!

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: open mike
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 01:26 AM

I asked at my singing circle today and got back that
Michael Burton was a cowboy in Alaska and no one has
ever heard another song by him..
good luck!
I do love that song...we condsider it our
anthem at the folk music society (espeically
the "we all must be crazy out here" part.)
We sang it today...it is best when the
camp cookie yodels!

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Amos
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 01:38 AM

I went to my dear friend the oceanographer's house for dinner to night, and after dinner the guitars came out; and "Night Rider's Lament" was the first one he asked for. So we were yowling it out tonight too! :)

A

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 10:10 AM

It's on my second LP for Kicking Mule Records---about 1977...

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST,DonMeixner
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 10:26 AM

Art,

You are a trend setter.


Don

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST,Marty
Date: 10 Jan 06 - 09:42 PM

Thanks for all the help so far...I emailed BMI again today, but so far I haven't heard anything from them.

I guess I will try and contact Nanci Griffith's folks (I love her music) and see if they could ever look it up in their files.

Michael Burton, apparently is/was a lawyer in LA and has written other songs, but this was his only cowboy song. I had heard that before, and Nanci Griffith mentions it in her album notes.

I had heard that this an elusive song to track down..and I guess that is true. Again, if anyone knows of anyone who recorded it (with permission) and can contact them to find out what they know, I would be very grateful. I really want to do this right...

Tnanks,

Marty

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Jan 06 - 10:56 PM

Ian Tyson

Chris LeDoux

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST,Dale
Date: 10 Jan 06 - 10:59 PM

I forgot Suzy Bogguss, good versions all

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Phil Cooper
Date: 10 Jan 06 - 11:10 PM

A lawyer friend connected with a recording company once mentioned that forgiveness was easier to get than permission sometimes. He suggested that if you didn't hear from someone concerning licensing, to go ahead and record the song, put the royalties in an escrow account, and pay up when contacted. I'm not necessarily recommending that you do that, but that is an option. Art's version of the song is still my favorite.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Francy
Date: 11 Jan 06 - 01:02 AM

Cowboy singer Don Edwards just recroded it on his second saddle song cd.......I will try to find out from him what to do......
       I put it on my second cd and did what was suggested above....I recorded it and have the money put aside 8 cents a cd in case someone contacts me./........Frank of Toledo

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: MAG
Date: 11 Jan 06 - 09:42 PM

My favorite is still Fred Holstein's but that is because I learned it from him. But then he prob'ly learned it off Art. This conversation has a certain deja vu flavor about it.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Francy
Date: 11 Jan 06 - 09:53 PM

I also learned it from Art & I had the pleasure of singing it once with Don Edwards at one of our Toledo Folk Music Concerts.....I have Fred's version on an old live tape along with The Man Who Sings.....Frank of Toledo

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: David C. Carter
Date: 12 Jan 06 - 06:41 AM

I have this song on an old vinyl by Jerry Jeff Walker.The album is,Ridin'High.There is a photo of Mike Burton on the inside cover.Walker says,in his comments,that Burton is from Alaska.Ian Tyson also did it on Old Corrals & Sagebrush.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jan 06 - 08:49 PM

The 'escrow' account idea is a good one. Once a song has been released by the writer--or the writer has signed away 'first recording rights', then anyone can record it. I don't think you are under legal obligation to get permission.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Jan 06 - 08:58 PM

I appreciate all the help you are all sending my way. Peace, I did email the Garth site you mentioned but no response...BMI never responded either...It's nice to know I have some folk music fans out there trying to help me...Francy, thanks for trying to check with Don Edwards..this is just the kind of help I need. And some point when I get it all figured out I will post it for all of you, so the next person doesn't have to jump through so many hoops!

Thanks,

Marty

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 08:32 AM

On my old LP for Kicking Mule Records the song is listed by them as being with Groper Music. That company was owned by ED Denson and Stephan Grossman. It was sold wholw hog by them to Fantasy Records.

That was a long while back. I thought it was a fine song and an even better sentiment.

Phil, thanks for your kind comments on my old rendition of it.

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 13 Jan 06 - 08:43 AM

In my post above, "That company..." refers to Kicking Mule Records which was sold to Fantasy Records. The name of the album that contains this song is "Songs Of The Heartland"====KM-148. It probably won't come out on CD until I'm dead! After milking it for all the $$$ they can, it will probably be sold to Collector's Choice catalogue and put out in a chesp CD compilation with the first album I did for Kicking Mule...

Art Thieme

Subject: Origins: Night Rider's Lament...update
From: GUEST,Marty
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 06:54 PM

For those of you who were in on this discussion last week, here is what I have found out.

First of all, in Nanci Griffith's book, Other Voices, this is what she says about the song..."Michael Burton, who wrote "Night Rider's Lament", is originally from Alaska, and this is the only real cowboy song he's ever written. He was very good friends with Jerry Jeff Walker, Guy Clark, etc...The part about losing your shares is a big thing if you are a native of Alaska, because if you leave the land, you lose it. That's why I always found that song so endearing and so opposite to what Michael Burton really is. He lives in London and L.A. and is very sophisticated...."

Now, if you ever want to record this song, let me make it easier on you than it was on me...it took a bit of research, but you need to contact:

Michael Burton Music (they are going to get a website soon which should help)
email: [e-mail] (Karen is Michael's wife)
phone: [phone]

It is a great song...thanks for everyone that tried to help me...I'll let you know when my CD is out (sometime in March)

Thanks again!

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament...update
From: open mike
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 07:10 PM

this could possibly be posted as an addendum to the thread that it refers to so all the info would be grouped together??
are you out there and listenting, clones??

good thing you found him. Laruel

Subject: Lyr Add: NIGHT RIDER'S LAMENT (Mike Burton)
From: open mike
Date: 22 Oct 09 - 10:52 AM

there is another thread (Oct. 2009) about Michael Burton.
Probably several more, as well, He is elusive, and so
many have searched for him in order to usethis song.

It is woefully incomplete in the DT (only the chorus and last verse)
so I will add the first and second verse here:

NIGHT RIDER'S LAMENT (WHY DO YOU RIDE FOR YOUR MONEY?)
(Mike Burton)

Verse 1:
When I went out a-ridin' graveyard shift midnitght til dawn
The moon was as bright as a reading light
For a letter from an old friend back home

Chorus:
He asked me: "Why do you ride for your money
Why do you rope for short pay?
You ain't gettin' nowhere and your loosin' your share
Well you must have gone crazy out there."

Bridge:
But he's never seen the northern lights
Never seen a hawk on the wing
Never seen the spring hit the great divide
Never heard old camp cookie sing
Yodel-ay ee o, yodel-ay ee o, Yodel-ay ee

Verse 2:
Last night I ran into Jenny
She's married and has a good life
You sure missed the track
When you never came back
She's a perfect professional's wife

Chorus:
She asked me "Why does he ride for his money
Why does he rope for short pay?
He ain't gettin' nowhere and he's loosin' your share
Well he must have gone crazy out there."

Bridge:
But she's never seen the northern lights
Never seen the hawk on the wing
Never seen the spring hit the great divide
Never heard old camp cookie sing
Yodel-ay ee o, yodel-ay ee o, Yodel-ay ee

Verse 3:
Well I read up the last of his letter
I tore off the stamp for black Jim
And Billy come by to relieve me,
Just looked at my letter and grinned

He asked me "Why do we ride for our money
Why do we rope for short pay?
We ain't gettin' nowhere and we're loosin' our share
We all must be crazy out here."

Bridge:
But they've never seen the northern lights
Never seen a hawk on the wing
Never seen the spring hit the great divide
Never heard old camp cookie sing
Yodel-ay ee o, yodel-ay ee o, Yodel-ay ee

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: open mike
Date: 22 Oct 09 - 11:21 AM

other thread on Night Rider/Michale Burton
http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=7&messages=10

http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=12953#104868

one search in DT opened a blank page...

i saw reference to three being chords in the d.t.
but saw no evidence...has it been erased??

Subject: DT Corr: Night Rider's Lament (Michael Burton)
From: open mike
Date: 12 Jan 10 - 02:27 AM

I looked in the D.T. and there is only the last verse of this song,,
it is missing the first two...here it is complete from Michael Burton's new web site. this site has contact info, a form to request permission to record the song, links to those who have, and info about Michael....http://www.nightriderslament.com/

NIGHT RIDER'S LAMENT
(Michael Burton)

Last night as I was out a ridin'
graveyard shift, midnight 'till dawn
the moon was as bright as a readin' light
for a letter from an old friend back home

CHORUS:
He asked me why do you ride for your money
Why do you rope for short pay
You ain't getting' nowhere
And you're losin' your share
Boy, you must have gone crazy out there
But he's never seen the Northern Lights
Never seen a hawk on the wing
He's never seen Spring hit the Great Divide
And never heard Ol' Camp Cookie sing

He tells me last night I run onto Jenny
she's married and has a good life
Ah, you sure missed the track
when you never come back
she's a perfect professional's wife

CHORUS:
She asked him why does he ride for his money
Why does he rope for short pay
He ain't getting' nowhere and he's losin' his share
He must have gone crazy out there
But she's never seen the Northern Lights
Never seen a hawk on the wing
Never seen Spring hit the Great Divide
And never heard Ol' Camp Cookie sing

Well I read up the last of that letter
and tore off the stamp for Black Jim
When Billy rode up to relieve me
he just looked at the letter and grinned

CHORUS:
He sang . . .Now. . .
Why do they ride for their money
Why do they rope for short pay
They ain't getting nowhere
And they're losing their share
Son, they all must be crazy out there



Lyrics and Music by Michael Burton

@cowboy
filename[ WHYRIDE
ED

also the site says he has a ranch near Tombstone, Arizona
(whoever said he was a lawyer in L.A.?)

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Art Thieme
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 12:23 AM

Yep, it is a fine song. Many of us folkies have been asked by some who might construe themselves to be our betters a very like-minded question. Often our answers are similar to Mr. Burton's stated answers---but with some anger -- and a modicum few f-words tossed in for emphasis.

I never did the yodel because I couldn't. But it was all me when I sang it--and singing it felt truly good.

Art

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Deckman
Date: 13 Jan 10 - 01:55 PM

Thanks to whoever re-established this thread. I love this song and sing it often. This thread really contains a LOT of useful information. Thanks again ... Bob(deckamn)Nelson

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Art Thieme
Date: 10 May 11 - 08:08 PM

REFRESH

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: open mike
Date: 10 May 11 - 10:20 PM

Michael Burton's web site

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST,Oz Childs
Date: 17 Mar 15 - 08:52 AM

A friend of mine sometimes sings this song. I woke up this morning with it in my brain and looked it up. For a mere 9 cents a copy ($.091) it is yours with (written) permission. That's $91 per thousand pressed (or downloaded). Web site posted above on 10 May 11.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Joe Offer
Date: 17 Mar 15 - 02:03 PM

This link should lead you to the licensing page. I like the idea of paying the songwriter directly for a license, instead of going through a big concern like Harry Fox Agency that no doubt takes a healthy percentage.
-Joe-

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: olddude
Date: 17 Mar 15 - 09:32 PM

Here is a version I did that Art Thieme taught me

night

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: Elmore
Date: 18 Mar 15 - 11:18 AM

Great job, olddude.

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: olddude
Date: 18 Mar 15 - 11:30 AM

Thank you

Subject: RE: Origins: Night Rider's Lament
From: GUEST,Karen Burton
Date: 16 Jan 16 - 05:06 PM

Hi Everyone!

If you want to record Night Rider's Lament written by Michael Burton, you can email us at: [e-mail] or visit our website www.nightriderslament.com to download the mechanical license form. The cost is the 2016 standard industry licensing agreement rate of .091 per copy, and we have a 500-copy minim fee. Therefore, for 500 copies the cost is USD $45.50, and for 1000 copies the cost is USD $91.00.

Michael owns all the rights to own his music, and he is not with the Harry Fox agency.

I apologize that it is so very difficult to find the licensing information on the internet.

I just now stumbled on this site since I'm currently updating the nightriderslament.com website

You can mail a copy of the completed mechanical license and payment to:
Michael Burton Music
PO Box 549
Vail, AZ 85641

Thank you for your patience and if you have any questions, please contact us at [e-mail]