BS: WalMart - AGAIN!

Subject: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: SINSULL
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 11:18 AM

Seems WalMart is a bit put out by the campaign cartoon featuring Garth Brooks. I am so happy. heh heh

Check it out at http://www.WalmartWorkersRights.org/

---

You've got friends with 'Clowne' faces. Link repaired.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: NH Dave
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 11:39 AM

Interestingly enough, NH just tried and failed to pass a bill financially dinging companies like WalMart that provide nonexistant or such poor health benefits that their workers strain the local charitable medical help roles, which eventually get paid by the state's limited finances. The bill would assessed WalMart et alle a financial levy or penalty until they changed their benefits packages so their employees did not deplete the state's medical care funds.

Of course the usual suspects lined up to decry the bill as demonizing entities like WalMart and other companies that offer poor or nonexistant health benefits, complained that it would tend to restrict free trade in the state, and the bill did not pass.

Dave

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Wesley S
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 01:14 PM

I couldn't get it to open.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 01:30 PM

Beautiful.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Kaleea
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 02:07 PM

I saw Garth on TV in December telling how he sold his soul to the devil--OOPS I mean, sold out, er, uh, made an esclusive deal with wallyworld to sell his latest retrospective cd set. I'm not the only one disappointed with that good ol' boy born in my hometown of Tulsa, Oklahoma, and he's surely not the only hometown boy or gal who has sold out.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: SINSULL
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 04:57 PM

Wesley,
Try the link in my second post. The first is bad.
Mary

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 05:03 PM

The second link appears to be good, but I gave it about 5 minutes and it only showed 9% download completed. Maybe later I'll try a "Save Target" and see if it will finish before the hens go to roost.

John.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 05:21 PM

Big Mick is gonna love it, Sins!

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: DougR
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 07:17 PM

I heard recently that the City of Chicago refused a permit that would allow Wal-Mart to build a Super-Center in that city. Wal-Mart moved a block or so from their chosen location to a neighboring town and is building there. That little town will reap millions of dollars in taxes from Wal-Mart which could have gone to Chicago. Stupid Chicage. Wal-Mart advertised that 370 jobs were available and received 25,000 applications for those positions. Stupid Chicago.

Also, it is incorrect to state that Wal-Mart does not provide healthcare plans for employees. They do.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Peace
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 07:22 PM

"Also, it is incorrect to state that Wal-Mart does not provide healthcare plans for employees. They do."


Thought I'd get a second opinion, Doug. Here it is.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 08:42 PM

Do they, now?

It seems that through my state taxes, I am paying for Wal-Mart's "health plan." Ka-ching!

Yes, Wal-Mart has a health care plan. The plan is to dump the whole thing on the taxpayers in the locality where a store happens to be. Wal-Mart costs the area it infests a whole lot more than people who think they're saving money by shopping there seem to think.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 08:48 PM

DougR - That says more about the jobless rate in Illinois than it does about the lack of benefits at WalMart.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: GUEST,Chongo Chimp
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 08:53 PM

You may've noticed that no ape is dumb enough to work for WalMart. People and baboons? That's another story.

The f*ckers destroy 4 or 5 local jobs for every new job they create. And that's a conservative estimate. If you want to employ more people in China and end small business free enterprise in America, buy at places like WalMart.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Once Famous
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 08:53 PM

DougR you are correct. The village of Oaklawn, which is on the southern edge of the city limits gets the store. Yes, thet have had 25,000 applicants for what I had heard was 250-300 jobs. I heard the mayor of Oaklawn interviewed on the radio and he was extremely happy for the tax windfall.

Working at Wal-Mart offers some with limited skills a clean environment with healthcare and a chance for advancement. 25K applicants cannot be denied.

Also patrons of the store will be able to buy name brand household items for much less tehn elsewhere.

Don, I pay indirectly for your disability or welfare and you don't do any work at all. You should consider being a Wal-Mart greeter. I am sure they would give you the opportunity.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Peace
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 08:58 PM

"with healthcare"

Martin, read the link I posted. About 60% do NOT have health care because they can't afford it on $8/hour.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 09:12 PM

Once again, Marty, you lie through your teeth.

You do NOT pay for my disability or welfare because I DO NOT NOW, NOR HAVE I EVER received disability pay or been on welfare.

You know this perfectly well, Martin, and as you usually do when it suits you, you try to make points by lying about people who disagree with you. I have worked all my life, paying taxes and paying into the Social Security system all the while. I retired a few years ago, and I do receive a monthly Social Security check, which YOU do not pay for. I paid into the system and I am now receiving the benefits for which I paid. It is a Federal Insurance program.

And even though I am retired from the "nine-to-five," I continue to work. I get paid for much of my writing, and I am still actively teaching guitar.

Again, Martin Gibson, you are a LIAR

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 09:21 PM

So Martin, why are there so many with 'limited skills' in such a small region?

WalMart is just a band-aid for the underlying disease of ignorance and poverty.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Once Famous
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 09:28 PM

Guest, the south side of Chicago is overall pretty poor. And for a metropolitan area of 8 million, 25K is not a lot. That should make some sense to you.

Don, be glad you have that Federal Insurance program. Great thing about America isn't it? I don't know how many times you have lied about me, don, but it sure was great turning the table on you and sticking it up your rump. You got pretty pissed. Calm down

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 09:57 PM

Marty, other countries have far superior "federal insurance" programs than this country does. Also, education up through college level in some countries is free, and, I might point out, there are several European countries with a higher standard of living than we have. "Great thing about America isn't it?" The United States is the only industrialized country in the world that DOESN'T have a national health program. Yeah, GREAT!

And when have I ever lied about you? Cite specific instances.

You see? you're still lying.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 10:02 PM

On the other hand, I did say once that you were born in a Dumpster and raised by feral alley cats. But I'm not too sure that wasn't the exact truth.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Once Famous
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 10:58 PM

I's not, don. I would be telling the total truth if I said that you were a hypocritcial, pathetic, old man.

I have no trouble with health insurance. I work hard to have it.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 11:09 PM

If you indeed have health insurance, Martin Gibson, you should seriously consider drawing down the mental health portion with some serious counselling. You really need it.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Once Famous
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 11:19 PM

SRS, you are seriously not qualified to make that assumption. by making it, you admit your own inadequacies, which is how you deal with life in general.

You have to get over your own mental and physical problems before you give such advice that you continue to be treated for.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Amos
Date: 01 Feb 06 - 11:47 PM

I think she is much better qualified than you are; unlike you she is not beset with paranoid delusions. Unlike you she is not beset in a constant battle against large classes of people. And unlike you, she is capable of appreciating the similarities, differences and associations between different people without confusing them.

I suggest you find some kind of help, honestly.

A

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 12:16 AM

A very wise man (possibly Aristotle, possibly my drinking uncle) once said, "Never get into a pissing contest with a skunk!"

Obviously good advice. I need to remind myself of it from time to time, especially when the stench rises to a really disgusting level.

In the meantime, back to the subject at hand:

I checked the television listings this evening, and coincidentally enough, there was a most interesting and illuminating program on. I watched it. MOST interesting!

Give it a look. Windows Media or RealPlayer.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: NH Dave
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 01:54 AM

Don, Social Security is a big governmental Ponzi or Pyramid scheme, where the money that you and you employer sent in, pays for the Social Security benefits of the people drawing benefits during the time you were working, and your Social Security benefits are being paid for by the workers of today. That worked fine, like most pyramid schemes, as long as the population was growing, and contiunued to grow, but the WWII so called baby boomers are just beginning to hit the age of 65, where they could collect full benefits, and ever since say, about 1950, less and less people were born, so although the population WAS increasing, it was increasing more slowly than during the war years, and there are less people working now, contributing their weekly payments into the system, to pay for your and my retirement. This is the theory behind the statement that the system is broken, and will run out of money by 2030, or whatever date you wish to accept.

    Additionally, every illegal alien, or person who has paid little into the system over the yeaars still can receive a minimum amount of Social Security enefits, although they never generated enough input to the system to justify even these minimum benefits.

    Dave

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Old Guy
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 10:32 AM

The American people have in their hands to power to defeat Walmart, spammers, telemarketers, high gas prices, etc. overnight.

Don't deal with anything you consider bad.

Do you think the government should do that for us?

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Ron Davies
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 10:55 AM

Maryland recently passed the kind of law that did not pass in NH--and passed it over the governor's veto.

There is absolutely no reason Walmart cannot either provide reasonable health care to its employees--or give money to the state so that a given state, in this case Maryland, does not wind up subsidizing Walmart through Medicaid. That's the crux of the matter.

Mick and I brought this up in 2004, as I recall.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: GUEST,Martin gibson
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 11:54 AM

No, amos she is not qualified and neither are you.

You have an ego as big as a cow pie and just as offensive. I suggest that you get your self-righteous, self-serving head examined or cut it off.
It just flaps in the breeze and pollutes the American landscape.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 12:25 PM

When psychology and counselling students around the world open their text books to learn about "denial" they see Martin Gibson's photo.

He has no real answers to anything, he has only insults and innuendo. This is his attention-getting device.

The fellow IS seriously sick.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: GUEST,Martin
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 12:50 PM

When students want to see a phot in their textbooks of an angry broad who can't even take care of her own health, they will see SRS and the picture will be repulsive.

She is one sick feminist. God gave her a message for sure.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 01:01 PM

We should form a club here, and call it "The Hating Game". It would make a good sitcom.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Ebbie
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 01:44 PM

"...it sure was great ... sticking it up your rump."

Ah.


I like it. The Hating Game Has a certain ring to it.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 02:15 PM

Yeah, NH Dave, I'm fully aware of the ins and outs of the Social Security system. Nevertheless, if I am required by law to pay into the system for my entire working life, then I feel perfectly justified in cashing my monthly Social Security check. From my end, it's the same as if I'd paid insurance premiums over a long period of time, which, incidentally, would by voluntary, not compulsory. I would certainly be justified in expecting the insurance company to make good on its end of the deal.

This doesn't mean that Martin Gibson is supporting me (as he apparently tries to imply) because he is required by law to pay into the system. In fact, I think I would prefer to cut my throat rather than have to accept anything from the likes of Martin Gibson.

The more I look into the way some European countries handle things like education, health care, public transportation, Social Security, etc., the less truly civilized I think the United States is.

Yeah, yeah, I know! Now is the time for some half-assed super-patriot to say, "Well, if you don't like it here, why don't you move somewhere else?"

Believe me, I'm thinking about it!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 03:37 PM

NHDave said, "That worked fine, like most pyramid schemes, as long as the population was growing, and contiunued to grow, but the WWII so called baby boomers are just beginning to hit the age of 65, where they could collect full benefits, and ever since say, about 1950, less and less people were born, so although the population WAS increasing, it was increasing more slowly than during the war years, and there are less people working now, contributing their weekly payments into the system, to pay for your and my retirement."

Its easy to fix. Increase immigration.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Ron Davies
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 04:02 PM

No, "Martin" is just a typical Bush voter--that's the way they "think".

That's why the hate and fear 2004 campaign was such a smash hit.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 04:15 PM

I saw that documentary,
Interesting bit about Walmart taking the side of Chinese manufactures
...

(CEO Hopson of) Five Rivers Electronics Innovations, which assembles televisions for companies like Philips, Samsung and RCA, and whose factory is located in Greenville, Tenn.

Hopson says the number of imported Chinese televisions on the U.S. market increased 1,100 percent between 2000 and 2003. He filed a complaint with the International Trade Commission charging the Chinese with dumping televisions in the U.S. market for prices below free-market value and won his case in May 2004. Hopson tells FRONTLINE, "There's no doubt in my mind that if [we] had lost this case, this factory would not be in business." He says he was surprised to learn that Wal-Mart had filed briefs in support of the Chinese television manufacturers, who were vigorously contesting Hopson's suit. "Why would an American company fight American companies and American jobs unless it was for their own profit?" he asks.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: LilyFestre
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 06:04 PM

In our small rural community where jobs are hard to come by, $8.00/hour is better than the state minimum which is $5.15 per hour...so yeah...it's not great, but it's better than welfare or nothing.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 06:50 PM

I guess that depends on whether or not you have to pay for daycare.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: LilyFestre
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 07:02 PM

Well, that brings up a whole other point that was brought up on the Poverty thread. The way the system works, sometimes it IS better to stay home and take care of your kids....but then again, getting out in the world and feeling productive is a good thing too. Given that welfare isn't something you can take advantage of forever (anymore), the $8.00 a hour is better than the minimum wage of $5.15 an hour...both jobs likely have no health care. I didn't say it was the best thing in the world, but I know it IS helpful to many who live in my area.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: GUEST,sorefingers
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 07:09 PM

and their shares have lost 20% in the last few months. Next thing will be institutions backing off then WMT will be around the $27 mark, IF they are lucky. See MS and a few more high movers from 10 years ago if you are having difficulty with this scenario.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Burke
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 08:01 PM

" Also patrons of the store will be able to buy name brand household items for much less tehn elsewhere."

But is it the same product as elsewhere?

I've been told on good authority that cake mixes from Pillsbury look like the same box, but actual weights are shorter (12 oz. vs 16 oz.) Ingredients may not be the same either, but this is harder to verify. This was because they could not produce the same product for the price WalMart would give.

That same authority works at an upscale dept. store. They will take returns from other stores as long as the barcode is their system. Many products appear the same, but there's not match on those discounted products. Who can check the innards of their consumer electronics to see what's really there?

Chinese televisions that break a week after the warranty period?

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Once Famous
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 08:12 PM

Burke, the brand names are the same and they are not going to risk their reputations.

I have bought 3 Sanyo TVs from Wal-Mart. The oldest is now 8 years old. Never had a problem with any of them. Sanyo is made in Japan. If you bought Chinese junk, you made the moronic choice. Wal-Mart did not tell you to buy it.

don, wave when you leave. OK?

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 09:00 PM

On the other hand, marty, I may just stick around and, like a true patriotic American citizen, see what I can do (with the help of like-minded people) to see if this country can be elevated to the level of civilization enjoyed by many of the more experience, more mature European countries I spoke of—the ones with governments that genuinely care about their citizens rather than occupy themselves aiding robber-baron cronies screw the citizenry in order to maximize corporate profits.

It would be like cleaning up a garbage dump, but if enough folks pitch in (and I know they're out there), I'm pretty sure we can get the job done.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Once Famous
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 10:00 PM

I hope we never become like Europe, Don.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 10:12 PM

You should travel more. Really! Very educational.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Once Famous
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 10:13 PM

I like it right here. I've seen the whole country.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 10:33 PM

I mean see a few other countries. Gives you some perspective.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Ron Davies
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 10:52 PM

All "Martin" really needs to do is get out of the bathroom--that would be big progress. Of course he can't see anything outside but cow pies. Does this "man" possibly have a one-track mind?-- (if any mind at all)?

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 11:09 PM

Actually, I'm not sure that Marty should travel to other countries. He'd probably hate it, and he would also add fuel to the image of "The Ugly American."

So forget it, Marty. Bad idea.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Don Firth
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 11:12 PM

You know, I could have nailed Marty for being the "half-assed super-patriot" I predicted when I said I was thinking about leaving the country. But that would have been too easy.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Ron Davies
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 11:46 PM

And can we actually get back to the topic?

NH Dave--in MD the bill dealt only with firms with 10,000 employees in the state.   Walmart was the only one to qualify. Was it the same in NH? What other firms treat employees as badly?

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Ron Davies
Date: 02 Feb 06 - 11:49 PM

All the other large firms in MD already gave their employees reasonable health insurance.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: SINSULL
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 11:07 AM

Actually it is generally the case that retail stores and fast food chains allow their employees less than 30 hours per week so that they don't qualify for health insurance.
My objection is to their heavyhanded approach to squelch anyone who dares to discuss more favorable alternatives for employees such as unions.

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: tarheel
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 12:37 PM

Note the WalMartWorkersRights---Some union is trying to
organize WalMart. I am not against unions per se but am
always suspicious. Had it not been for the CWA and IBEW,
I suspect the AT&T Engineers (Western Electric, Long Lines,
Field Forces, etc.) would not have received a number of the
benefits which they did. On the other hand, I feel some organizers
are parasites and, in too many cases (one is enough), the power
falls into the hands of selfseekers who thirst for power, money
and prestige to feed their egos.
tar...

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: SINSULL
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 02:16 PM

Tarheel,
I agree. When you look at the work conditions that first spawned the union movement in this country and then look at a near bankrupt automobile manufacturer contracted into giving a worker his birthday off...well.
Corruption isn't limited to the unions - take a look at what is going on in Washington. That is not a valid argument for opposing unions. They, government and corporate America need to clean up their act.
Walmart's history of worker abuse and use/abuse of illegal aliens almost mandates the unionizing of its workforce.
Again, I have never set foot in a Walmart and never will. I personally prefer to pay a little more to a local merchant, get personal service and support and keep my neighborhood in tact.
SINS

Subject: RE: BS: WalMart - AGAIN!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 02:27 PM

There's no question that unions tend to become corrupt and self-serving as time goes by. So do political parties. So do corporations.

And you know why? It's all about the money.

WalMart at this point needs to be unionized, though. It would be some improvement. That's not saying it would be perfect. It would still be all about the money...but there'd be more than one hand on the tiller, and that would benefit the workers some.