BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?

Subject: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 May 06 - 06:46 PM

Just wondering, because I'm Canadian and have never been to Cheshire, and there are those stories about the famous Cat, after all. So what would you say, UK residents? Are there more smiles per minute in Cheshire or is it just like any other place in the UK in that respect?

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: greg stephens
Date: 22 May 06 - 06:58 PM

Maybe in Crewe. Not so much in Northwich, I would say. Cholmondeston is sort of intermediate. In the north-east part of the county, Altricham and so on, women dont smile so much because thy have a lot of face-lifts there(or so I've heard).
    Lewis Carrol was up in Daresbury a lot, I believe, where he presumably conceived of the Cheshire cat.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: skipy
Date: 22 May 06 - 06:59 PM

Lots of money in Cheshire, so lots to smile about, but are they happy?
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: GUEST
Date: 22 May 06 - 07:01 PM

Depends.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 22 May 06 - 07:29 PM

They smile from Macclesfield to Mobberley

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: bobad
Date: 22 May 06 - 07:49 PM

I can surmise why this guy might be smiling, does he hail from Chesire?

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: catspaw49
Date: 22 May 06 - 09:36 PM

Only the cats Hawk, only the cats...............

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 May 06 - 10:48 PM

Crew! Norwich! Cholmondeston! Daresbury! Ah, what romantic visions those names summon forth. It all sounds simply so English that it could make one think that at any moment Penelope Rutledge might appear, motoring by in her Bentley or cantering past on a fine English steed....! (sigh)

Or perhaps her niece Veronica might flash by in the Zebra-striped Porsche...

Anything could happen in places named Cholmondeston or Daresbury.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 May 06 - 10:50 PM

Oops. I left the final 'e' off 'Crewe'. How mortifying!

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 23 May 06 - 02:33 AM

You also missed the "th" out of Northwich. Norwich is in Norfolk, which is on the other side of the country.


DC

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 23 May 06 - 05:09 AM

Don't forget that Cheshire also has the town where Bill Clinton didn't smoke dope...

He told us he smoked pot at Oxford, but he didn't in Hale....

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: greg stephens
Date: 23 May 06 - 06:37 AM

Little Hawk: if you liked the sound of Daresbury and Cholmondeston, you should come for a visit.You might also like Threapwood(and Upper Threapwood), Shocklach, Lach Dennis,Burwardsley, Bunbury,Bell o'th'Hill, No Man's Heath, Willey Moor,Tegg's Nose,Wildboarclough,Havannah, Bug Lawton, Kermincham Heath, Broken Cross, Flittogate, Lower Peover, Lostock Gralam, Foxwist Green. Ah, I could go on for hours, you coudn't make them up could you? I lived on a boat in Cheshire for 15 years, happy days.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Grab
Date: 23 May 06 - 08:07 AM

Or you can go further south. Take Chongo for a visit to Marsh Gibbon, Ape Dale, or further north, Monkeybeck Grains.

The problem is that England is blessed with so many great placenames that you can look anywhere and find some good ones. Just off those three sections of map, in addition to the already-mentioned simian ones, we also have:-

Lillingstone Dayrell
Hinton-in-the-Hedges
Evenley
More
Hopton Titterhill
Clungunford
Stanton Lacy
Great Knoutberry Hill
Shaking Moss
Cowgill Wold Meas

Graham.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 23 May 06 - 08:43 AM

I like Barton in the Beans, just south of Burton.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Leadfingers
Date: 23 May 06 - 08:59 AM

Its saying 'Cheese' makes them seem to smile !!

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: GUEST,mack/misophist
Date: 23 May 06 - 09:55 AM

Assuming that the question was asked in good faith, my copy of The Annotated Alice says that the 'cheshire cat' grin is a reference to their custom of marking cheeses with a sketch of a grinning sat's face. (eyes, nose, mouth, and whiskers. I think.}

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Flash Company
Date: 23 May 06 - 10:34 AM

Speaking as a Cheshire man I do smile a lot, usually when I'm reading stuff like the postings above.
I had seen the story about cat's faces on cheeses, although I've got to say I never came across it in practice.
I currently live in Altrincham, the CH is pronounced as G, which used to confuse the US servicemen based at Burtonwood no end. I was however born in Wincham, near Northwich, and grew up in Plumley, which used to be spelt Plumbley, don't know why they changed it.
In the days just after WW2 when we had no 'phone, a friend of Mum's from Manchester rang the local Post Office to leave a message for her, opening her conversation with the Post-mistress 'Is that Pee-over Call Office'. It may be spelt like that, but it's pronounced Peever!
FC

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: greg stephens
Date: 23 May 06 - 10:38 AM

The name Peover Heath amused Private Eye(and many other puerile people like myself) in the Edward Heath years.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 23 May 06 - 11:56 AM

My god, the names, the names! Totally cool. It all makes North America sound so drab and unsophisticated in comparison. I would expect to encounter dwarves, garden gnomes, fairy rings, mini-stonehenges, and possibly a community of hobbits tucked away here and there...

To think that Al Stewart got to grow up around those places...the lucky sod! ;-D

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Emma B
Date: 23 May 06 - 02:40 PM

Well I am Cheshire born and Cheshire bred and currently living on the edge of the Norman forest of Delamere. It is our local Folk Festival (Chester Folk Festival) in the village of Kelsall this weekend AND my birthday - so I will be smiling a great deal!
BTW Giok says I'm Hobbit sized !

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Severn
Date: 23 May 06 - 02:43 PM

I was in Chester today, and the biggest smile I saw was from a friend of Emma B's from North Wales. The folk I saw looked like they smiled as much as anyone else, no more noless, but it being Chester, they all might have been tourists, anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 23 May 06 - 02:48 PM

No Emma B I said you had bad hobbits!
G.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: greg stephens
Date: 23 May 06 - 04:21 PM

From my experience, there are more smiles in Lancashire than Cheshire, and more smiles in Cheshire than Yorkshire. But that is just a very subjective opinion. It probably needs a fat research grant to get to the bottom of this very serious question.
    You could probably stage some situation that will probably raise a smile(fat man falls on banana skin, Trekkie walking down the street dressed as Shatner, vicar with trousers fallen down, people singing praise songs with clapping in market place). Do this in various random locations in different counties, film reactions, then analyse for width and duration of smiles.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: GUEST,DB
Date: 23 May 06 - 04:37 PM

Dear Little Hawk,

If you're interested in the county of Cheshire you might like to read the works of the Cheshire author Alan Garner. 'The Weirdstone of Brisingamen' (1960), 'The Moon of Gomrath' (1963) and 'Elidor' (1965) are all early fantasies, originally published for children/younger readers. 'Red Shift'(1973) is a later, more sophisticated work (in fact The Times called it "...a superbly exciting piece of literature" and Ursula Le Guin described it as "a bitter, complex, brilliant book).
In all of these books Cheshire's modern inhabitants encounter, and interact with, aspects of its past history. In Garner's books the various layers of the past underlie the present like a palimpsest and can be accessed both physically and emotionally.
Cheshire is in North West England and I grew up in Eastern England, and first encountered Garner's books there. I moved to the North West in early aldulthood and, after these vivid books, found the real Cheshire a bit of an anti-climax! Still, it is a very attractive county, with varied scenery and many pleasing towns and villages, and well worth visiting if you get the chance.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 23 May 06 - 08:14 PM

I do recall seeing "The Weirdstone of Brisingamen" at some point, but I don't think I read it. If so, it was a very long time ago. I read all the Tolkien material and a bunch of neat medieval fantasy adventure/romance books by William Morris, but did not get around to reading Alan Garner or that other fellow...C.S. Lewis?

Among other classic English tales, I was very fond of the A.A. Milne books, Conan Doyle, H. Ryder Haggard, H.G. Wells, and some of the Kipling stuff. I basically grew up on English literature rather than American literature. That probably had a lot to do with being Canadian, and with my own family's tastes in literature.

Oh, I liked C.S. Forester too... (the Hornblower tales).

The British have a great appreciation for subtlety, and I really like that. The American ideal or their favoured archetype is much more centred on frontier notions that "rough and simple is always better than sophisticated", that you can trust the simple plain-spoken man (who cannot pronounce "nuclear") but not the intellectual, and they harp on that to no end in their art, their media, their literature and their political propaganda. I do not empathize with that philosophy, I despise it. Most common criminals and bullies and most political demagogues (who also hate intellectuals) are themselves among the rough and simple, their constituency is the rough and simple....and they are NOT trustworthy in the least.

The Nazis hated intellectuals too. Intellectuals are usually people capable of seeing shades of grey.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: frogprince
Date: 23 May 06 - 11:00 PM

So, L.H., you despise the American preference for simplicity over sophistication. Have you looked up "sophisticated" in the dictionary lately? Here's the definition for the verb "sophisticate"
1 : to alter deceptively;
2 : to deprive of genuineness, naturalness, or simplicity;
3 : to make complicated or complex

Interesting.... : }

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 24 May 06 - 03:22 AM

Emma, Severn- hows about a thread telling us how the boat trip went. Water, water everywhere, nor any drop to drink?

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 24 May 06 - 04:32 AM

Nah - they had to stick to the beer.....

LH. NorTHwich in Cheshire is one of several town above seams of salt. The name "wich" is something to do with salt production (there are also Nantwich and Middlewich).
At Northwich there is the Salt Museum - dedicated to the history of extracting salt since roman times - salt is still used extensively in the chemical industry.
At one time salt was extracted from underground seams by pumping water down to dissolve the salt and then pumping the brine out. It left air filled holed which caused the ground to subside. I doubt the people whose houses disappeared into the holes (photos in the Salt Museum) were smiling much.
Quack!
GtD.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Dave Roberts
Date: 24 May 06 - 05:13 AM

I have to say that they don't smile a lot in Middlewich.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: greg stephens
Date: 24 May 06 - 10:02 AM

Little Hawk: the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. So you find our Cheshire placenames pretty cool, but I have just had a browse at my trusty map of Ontario(your home, I believe), and here are a selection of places I found which look pretty nice to me, and not at all like boring old Cheshire.
Snug Harbour, Penetanguishene, Burk's Falls, Orillia, Sawlog Bay, Balsam lake, Pleasant Point, Kassabog Lake, Bobcaygeon, Hickory Beach, Marlbank, Hell Holes, Rideau Ferry, Echo, Throoptown, Manhard, Hallecks, Burrits Rapids, St Polycarpe, Old Woman's River, Smokehouse Island, Killbear Park, Burpee.

I just put Marlbank in as I live in Stoke, and that's a good Stoke name. But apart from that, none of those names could possibly be in Cheshire, what a picture they conjure up of a distant exciting world. Now, dont tell us in here in England that these places are all dreary suburbs of Toronto...they sound impossibilty romantic and pioneery to me.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Flash Company
Date: 24 May 06 - 10:06 AM

Geoff... Not been to Northwich for a while, but believe they have now built on what, in my time there, was called Marston Black Hole, the site of the biggest subsidence in the area.
I'm not sure I would trust it. even after many years of landfill.

FC

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: GUEST,DB
Date: 24 May 06 - 02:52 PM

Dear Little Hawk,

Ironically it would appear that you have read far more English literature than I have! I grew up on American Science Fiction ... what can I say?

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Robyn
Date: 24 May 06 - 03:45 PM

Most of the Hobbits are here in New Zealand.
Cheshire always makes me think of cheese.
When we were in Cheshire in 1990 we went into a big supermarket in Cheddar, intending to buy some Real! cheese.
There was a big display of cheeses from all around the country and there, in the middle of the display, behind a big glass counter, was the prize cheese!
NZ cheddar!
Boy, did we feel cheated!
Robyn

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 24 May 06 - 04:22 PM

Yes, there are a lot of cool place names in North America, no doubt of that. And, yes, the grass often does look greener on the other side. The great thing about North America, I'd say, is the immense landscape, the natural beauty and variety of that landscape, the vast open spaces...and the fact that things are mostly a lot less expensive here! We're very fortunate in those areas.

I will reiterate, Frogprince, that my memories of my own schooldays have shown me that simple, rough people who can't pronounce words like "nuclear" are NOT nicer and more trustworthy than articulate, well-read people who can. I don't care how you interpret the word "sophisticated" to fuel an argument. Your interpretation of it obfuscates my intended meaning of it entirely in the context in which I was speaking.

Would you not agree that American books and movies have always idealized the frontier qualities of roughness and simplicity, and looked askance at "city slickers" and well-dressed, well-educated people? I find that a bit odd, because it is so evident in hundreds and hundreds of American movies, etc...it is repeated over and over as if it were gospel. It's misleading.

You would find the approach to that rather different in the UK and Europe, which are much older societies which do not harken back to a recent frontier tradition.

The fact is, nice people are found among the simple people AND found among the less simple people. To turn either type of people into a cliche for good or evil is misleading, but when I was in school I generally found the middle class kids to be less brutal to others, let's say, than the kids who'd had a rougher upbringing. That should not be surprising. A rough upbringing does not encourage gentleness of either manner or behaviour in most people. And gentleness is where the word "gentleman" comes from.

I'd rather have a hero like Sherlock Holmes than a hero like a John Wayne character, given the choice. They both have courage, no doubt about that, but Sherlock also has culture, wit, and subtlety. Those are worth a lot in my book.

Some of the rough-hewn American heroes, like Davy Crockett, actually were pretty sophisticated men in various ways, and I mean by that that they were knowledgable, not that they were given to deceiving people. The movies would rather just show their rough and tough side, because that is apparently what sells best to the American audience.

The recent "Alamo" movie depicted a complex David Crockett character who was really quite interesting. What a refreshing change that was!

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: frogprince
Date: 24 May 06 - 05:11 PM

Hmmm, I think I pulled L.H.'s chain... Actually I was just messing around because I know that one word "sophistication" had at least some dubious connotations for me, and when I went to the dictionary, I found what I found. Truth be told, I agree that the American people's tendency to elect the "unwashed" and distrust those who can speak proper English hasn't been to our (or the world's) advantage.

Well, there's one thing and a shore thing I've learned since I've been born
Every educated feller ain't a plumb greenhorn.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 24 May 06 - 05:22 PM

Yeah...you did pull my chain. But I asked for it by bringing up the whole thing in the first place. ;-)

If one looks for a fight, one usually finds one.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: autolycus
Date: 24 May 06 - 06:04 PM

"I think I pulled LH's chain." LOL. loved it.



   BTW, looks like I can be first to say - Happy Birthday,Emma B.





    Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 24 May 06 - 10:03 PM

I should perhaps now start a thread saying, "Do people rob graves a lot in Goole"?

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 25 May 06 - 03:11 AM

No, Rob Graves a lot in Wimbledon, Oxford, France, Cairo and Majorca, but never Goole.

And happy bidet, Emma Birth.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Emma B
Date: 25 May 06 - 04:33 AM

Thanks for the birthday wishes - I really must be mad to come here :)

http://home.wxs.nl/~ekici000/alice.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 25 May 06 - 05:25 AM

We know you're mad Emma B, more than a little too!
Happy Birthday when it comes !
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Stu
Date: 25 May 06 - 05:50 AM

"When we were in Cheshire in 1990 we went into a big supermarket in Cheddar, intending to buy some Real! cheese."

Did you mean Chester Little Robyn? Cheddar is in Somerset, 200 miles south of Cheshire.

In my opinion, the easter border of Cheshire is one of the most unspoilt areas in the country. The Peak District climbs up from the plain and we get fantastic views all the way across to the Dee Esturay, Wales and as far as the Long Myndd in Shropshire.

Superb country pubs, loads of walking and just a stones throw to Manchester to boot.

The tradtional music isn't bad either!

stigWeard

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: GUEST,DB
Date: 25 May 06 - 03:27 PM

LH,

Did you mention Goole because, like me, you are intrigued by the name?

For many years I was fascinated by this (relatively) odd place name. One day I could contain my curiosity no longer and drove across the country to have a look. I have to tell you that it is a (relatively) weird place! It is a bit like a rather run down dockland area, from some decrepit Northen industrial city, that has been ripped out of its setting and plonked down in my native Fenland - actually the true Fenland is 30 or 40 miles further south but the area around the Humber estuary is very similar.

Despite the drive towards uniformity and homogeneity, Britain is still full of odd and interesting places (often well off the tourist trail). I suppose that this post may appear not to be very complimentary to the good people of Goole but I like odd places, especially if there are intriguing contrasts and juxtapositions involved.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Robyn
Date: 25 May 06 - 04:18 PM

Did you mean Chester Little Robyn? Cheddar is in Somerset, 200 miles south of Cheshire.

Actually, I forget now just where we were because we had been in Cornwall and were heading for Nantwich, via Wookey Hole so it could have been either.
Robyn

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 25 May 06 - 04:49 PM

Yes, DB, you have it right. ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: greg stephens
Date: 30 May 06 - 07:29 AM

Well, from Cornwall to Nantwich it would have been Cheddar, not Chester.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Robyn
Date: 31 May 06 - 03:49 AM

We did the Cheshire Ring in a narrowboat named Water Sable, then visited the Waterways museum at Ellesmere Port, near Chester, I believe. We smiled a lot on our travels!
If we ever win LOTTO, we intend to buy a canal boat and commute (by air, not sea) between NZ's summer and Britain's summer! Then we'd really be smiling!
Robyn

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 31 May 06 - 04:06 AM

Commute by boat. Some Canadian did the Atlantic in a narrowboat, so it's only a little bit further.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 31 May 06 - 04:53 AM

Good Lord! I think I'd rather be dead than experience crossing the Atlantic in a narrowboat. I don't take well to rough water.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Emma B
Date: 31 May 06 - 05:05 AM

I'm hoping Severn will write a slog (the narrowboat/lottsa locks equivalent of a blog) about our trip around the Avon Ring I think that you might find the current summer not quite up to expectations Robyn!
Just away to finish dismantling the festival site - greetings from a muddy field in Mid Cheshire :)

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Little Robyn
Date: 31 May 06 - 04:10 PM

Actually, I'd like a TARDIS so I could zip back and forth, from a festival there to a sunny day here or a concert somewhere else.
That long flight from New Zealand to almost anywhere is a killer!
But I don't think Water Sable could cope with the Pacific Ocean - not at 4 miles an hour!
Robyn

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smirk a lot in Cheshire?
From: Severn
Date: 31 May 06 - 06:09 PM

I rented a Re-TARDIS by mistake. It only went in reverse.

But who needs a TARDIS when you can be a Tardy Bugger on the Tardebigge at a snail's pace. I will try to come up with a mind- boggling Slog/Blog for you all to flog of the Route de Canal soon if time allows, in which will be a summary of what passes for summery conditions over there.

Meanwhile I'm back in Laurel Maryland, USA in genuine humid weather in the 80's and I just got back from picking up my community pool pass. I'll probably spend most of the weekend at The Washington Folk Festival at Glen Echo, but I'll try to make some time for it.

But my last post to this thread was only after merely having been to Chester itself. After having been to ChestFest for two days, I saw lots of smiles (or at least similes), even some from some Cheshire Catters, so I got to see the besta Chester, with some folks even happier than Mr. Happy himself! Lots of big grins, from people standing on the ground, on stages or even on chairs high atop Sunshine Mountain (see Emma's birthday thread for details on THAT one!)...

It was good to have been there and I will fondly remember it as the sun goes down, while I hum your local traditional ditties, such as.....

"Chester Song at twilight,
When the lights are low....."

(Child 15438-A)

...and the like.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Chris Cole
Date: 01 Jun 06 - 05:27 PM

all those lovely romantic Cheshire names... just add Stockport to the list... visualise Adswood, Brinnington and Lancashire Hill.. anyone for Rose Hill coloured spectacles?

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 02 Jun 06 - 04:09 AM

If you'd added Robinson's brewery Stockport would have looked a lot better.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Snuffy
Date: 02 Jun 06 - 09:24 AM

I used to live in Hazel Grove, but even in the 50s it wasn't very sylvan.

Mind you, we then moved to Wildboarclough - and that definitely was.

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 11 Jun 06 - 10:10 AM

testing

Subject: RE: BS: Do people smile a lot in Cheshire?
From: Severn
Date: 11 Jun 06 - 07:22 PM

Hark! The Chester Tester pesters?