BS: Go Librarians!

Subject: BS: Go Librarians!
From: mack/misophist
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 10:56 AM

This says it all.

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Elmer Fudd
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 11:08 AM

Thanks for posting this.

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Sorcha
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 11:53 AM

RIGHT ON!!

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 12:08 PM

Yeah, well...you have to do more than cheer us on.

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: MMario
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 12:09 PM

The check is in the mail, Rapaire.

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 12:12 PM

That's nice. But try working for libraries, too.

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Kaleea
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 01:53 PM

Perhaps "Librarians" would be a good name for a sports team, as they sound like winners to me.

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: artbrooks
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 02:51 PM

Personally, I feel that I do my part by breeding librarians...and high school teachers.

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Don Firth
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 03:20 PM

Actually, I guess you could say that a librarian is supporting me. I'm retired, but my wife is still working at the Seattle Public Library (the new building).

I don't know about the computers, but SPL has gone on record that they don't keep a lot of records. If you have a book checked out, have one on hold, or owe fines, then they have a record of it. Other than than, nada. I can't see that, to the library, there would be much point in keeping records of who used which computer when. Pretty soon they'd have to build a new building (at the city's--taxpayer's--expemse) to house all the filing cabinets, only to discover that once a guy named Charlie Farquarson (now deceased) spent a half an hour looking at porn sites.   

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 05:51 PM

It is very good news but I'm not sure it actually does much.

The library objected, and after an apparently lengthy period a judge said that they could not be prevented from revealing that they had received an order to provide information. The article does not say specifically whether they were relieved of the requirement to provide the information demanded, and no citation is given to the case or the decision. The implication is that they filed suite only to contest the "gag order," as a preliminary to perhaps being able to protest the demand for information (that they possibly didn't have to begin with.) It appears that they did not provide any information, but it's not clear whether the ruling permitted them to do that(?).

The Government's appeal of the unknown judge's order was abandoned after the "law" was changed to require (subject to renewal) the gag order on such demands to expire after a year. By the time the appeal was abandoned more than a year had, or would have before an appeal could be heard, elapsed.

It appears, pending finding the original order by the judge who made the ruling that was appealed, that the FBI still remains free to demand information from libraries and to demand that they not reveal that the information was demanded and/or given, all without a court order or warrant.

Within the jurisdiction of the Court that heard the first contest of the gag order additional parts of this may or may not be limited; but that's unknown (to me at least) from what's here.

What these librarians accomplished is IMMENSE, but I believe that the hairy dirty big-brother beast still lurks somewhere in all our homes, crapping in unknown places, stealing our food from the refrigerator while we sleep, going through our personal things when we're not looking, and fully believing that we don't know he's there.

To large extent, we don't know exactly where all the beast is, but the smell of his presence permeates an awful lot of places.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Barry Finn
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 06:04 PM

Thanks to the Librarians that fight to keep all our lives from becoming open books.
Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: open mike
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 06:05 PM

oops--you should not have mentioned this guy's name--
   
    LIVE         CHARLIE FARQUARSON
    Duration: 00:07:00
Charlie Farquharson, played by Don Harron, celebrated his 50th birthday, and talks about his aborted run at politics,
his new book and the Japanese tour of Anne of Green Gables.
         FORMER BROADCASTER/PERFORMER/MOTIVATIONAL SPEAKER, DON HARRON
         PRODUCER, ARIF NOORANI
THIS MORNING--DATE: 1/4/02
BROADCAST INFORMATION--        Program City: TORONTO
Broadcast Date: 1/4/02
Start Time: 08:06:00
End Time: 11:00:00
Radio1/Radio2/Both: Radio
         HOST, SHELAGH ROGERS
         STUDIO DIRECTOR, TOM JOKINEN
         ASSOCIATE PRODUCER, SEAN FOLEY
         TECHNICIAN, CAROLE ITO

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 09:40 PM

We keep SOME "history" items. Mostly they are records of fines and problems on people who have shown themselves to be, ah, less than reliable (shall we say?). Other than these few (and they ARE few), we only keep records such as is described above. The information on the "last user" is kept for three days so that if problems are found with a book we can contact the person who last had it out, but after that or when someone else borrows it that information is overwitten.

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Don Firth
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 09:54 PM

Well spotted, Mike!

Well, 'scuse me all to hell, Charlie, I misspelled your name. I left the "h" out. Shoulda been "Farquharson."

Now I recall where I heard the name. From "The Red Green Show." Charlie Farquharson allowed as how he was a farmer, and when he was initiated into Possom Lodge, he commented that he would probable feel much better about it in the future than he would in the pasture.

He just went to the library to do some research on composting and he accidentally blundered into the website. Shows how silly it would be to try to charge him with being a terrorist. When he started looking at the graphics, he was the one who was terrorized!

At least that's his story.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 10:19 PM

Well, nobody's given us the money to buy the computers, etc. to keep the data. So we pretty much delete it. You might be able to get some information off of old backup tapes, but we pretty much reuse them over and over.

When the Patriot Act was passed nobody asked the librarians if we COULD, much less DID, keep such records. If and when the Feds DO get around to asking we'd pretty much have to tell them that we sure would like to help, but....

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: Sorcha
Date: 28 Jun 06 - 11:36 PM

Pat. Act.....stoopid, un Constitutinal....I really don't want to go there any more...let alone now!

Subject: RE: BS: Go Librarians!
From: SunnySister
Date: 29 Jun 06 - 01:11 AM

Hi everyone!

I'm with you Rapaire! In the library science grad courses, we are taught to think very hard about where we stand on freedom of speech, censorship, and privacy.

I just finished a class where I took a survey of all of the major libraries around my area and they came out saving data about where you are... fines and little things saved for the minimum of day-to-day operations but other than that... oops! Mr. FBI man, oh, so sorry, we didn't save any information like that... so sorry... :)

Grad school has been eye-opening in more ways than one, however, I value to free speech and privacy a whole lot more than I ever thought possible. A gift of appreciation.

Thanks for posting this blog article!

--SunnySister, who is marching, marching, marching towards finishing hopefully by December...