Roy Bailey returns his MBE

Subject: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: julian morbihan
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 01:16 PM

The following is a press release by Roy Bailey, which is also on his web site, and which deserves the fullest possible dissemination:

"As a life-long supporter of the Labour Party I am so appalled at the Government's foreign policy that I have decided to return the MBE I was awarded in the Millennium Honours List for "services to folk music". I can think of no better way for me, lawfully, to express my horror and opposition to our failure to call for an immediate ceasefire in the Lebanon and to our complicity with the USA's policy of supporting Israel's actions in Palestine.

Tony Blair's support for the policies of the USA is for me a betrayal of all I took the Labour Party to stand for. The death and destruction on all sides and the chaos in both Iraq and Afghanistan is the result of such decisions. The Parliamentary and Labour Constituency Parties, by remaining supportive of these policies, are discredited as far as I am concerned.

I am not so foolish as to expect any government to be able to deliver all its manifesto promises. I understand and accept that compromises have to be made. However, when it comes to waging an illegal war in Iraq, the killing of innocent people in Afghanistan, Palestine, Iraq and now, the Lebanon, I can no longer accept as an "honour" a recommendation supported by the Prime Minister, that I be awarded the MBE.

Tony Blair insists his decisions are in support of democracy. We cannot bomb people into accepting democracy any more than we could slaughter people into accepting Christianity.

I understand many people within the folk music community have applauded such awards as a welcomed recognition of the contribution folk music dance and song) makes to our common culture. I trust they will understand my reasons for now rejecting and returning that award."

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 01:33 PM

This has been on the newsgroup for a week now.
Its old news.
Scooby.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 01:39 PM

Not to me, Yaz. Which newsgroup are you on?

Rhiannon

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 01:51 PM

Well it was news to me too, and good news at that, we're not all as up to date and trendy as you Scooby.
G.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: MBSLynne
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 01:51 PM

Not to me either...it's the first I've heard of it.

Thanks you for that Julian

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST,Bill
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 02:00 PM

So what! Who does he think he is The Beatles?
99.999% of the british public have never heard of him.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 02:16 PM

Well done Roy Bailey,. Dick Miles

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 02:47 PM

Its the outlook newsgroup on folk
Yas.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 02:53 PM

New to me, too. Well done and I hope it has some effect!

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 02:56 PM

I doubt it will do any good but good for Roy that he stood up for his principles. I remember he was extremely proud to get the award.

Rhiannon

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST,Tom Bliss
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 03:01 PM

Bill, it would not matter one jot if no-one at all had heard of Roy - though of course millions know and admire him. This is a political gesture, not a publicity stunt. It's almost impossible to get the the idiots who are running the UK to listen to anybody at all these days (and goodness only knows what the heck's happening in the US) - so every voice raised is a voice to be respected - whatever your personal views on the issue.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST,Dave
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 03:26 PM

Throwing a hissy fit now is just a manifestation of Prof. Roy's ego as he tours the country with Viscount Stansgate on their "We're so radical, we're the Establishment" show. It won't make a blind bit of difference - much like all those agit prop songs that he has squandered his lovely voice on over the years.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 03:26 PM

Well said, Tom. I applaud what Roy has done.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: ard mhacha
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 04:16 PM

Well done Roy Bailey, it`s what this pathetic party deserves. It`s news to me, but very welcome.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: weerover
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 04:24 PM

GUEST, Bill reckons most of the British public have never heard of RB. I'm sure that doesn't apply to this forum. It may not make front pages, but at least it is a significant demonstration of hows he feels. A small part of me feels that it would have been better not to accept the tawdry bauble from Blair's government in the first place, but better late than never.

wr

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: weerover
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 04:25 PM

Actually, on reflection a lot more than "a small part of me".

wr

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 04:47 PM

I think one or two more people may have heard of Roy Bailey than they have 'Guest,Bill'. A lot more people will take notice of this gesture than they will of snide remarks from someone who will not even let us know who he or she is.

Well done, Mr Bailey.

DtG

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: MBSLynne
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 04:53 PM

So because we know something wont make a bit of difference, does that mean we should just lie down and let things go on as they are? It's a good thing all the protesters over the years didn't thi8nk that.

I think plastic carrier bags are one of the evils of the modern age. This may sound silly to you. I NEVER accept plastic bags in shops. Will this make any difference? Probably not, but I will continue to do it. and no one has heard of me either

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Santa
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 04:59 PM

It is his award, he is free to do whatever he wishes with it. However, if he deserved the award (and I'm certainly not suggesting he didn't) and was proud to receive it, then he should keep it. What he disapproves of in the current government's actions is not relevant to why he was presented with the award. Sending it back is a futile gesture.   This government will go - and probably be replaced with one not one whit better.

Ah well, he will always remember that he was given the award in the first place.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST,Puck
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 06:08 PM

Santa - He does well deserve the award,and returning it is NOT a futile gesture to Roy, nor to a great many others with a conscience. It will cause some embarrasment to the Gov't and as such is highly commendable. Well Done Roy!
P.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST,Tam
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 06:25 PM

Why did he, like so many other creeps, accept this 'honour' in the first place?

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 06:28 PM

He accepted it with pride, as far as I remember. He thought it brought much needed attention to the folk world. Good for him.

Rhiannon

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Leadfingers
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 07:00 PM

How any one who purports to be of a Socialist inclination can have ANY thing to do with a 'Labour' Government that is well to the Right of John Major's Tory Government rather confuses me !!
Remember that New Labour dropped Socialism from the manifesto before the 1997 eletion !

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 07:39 PM

Poor Roy. It seems he can't do right.

Rhiannon

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Bill D
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 08:50 PM

"Its the outlook newsgroup on folk"

"outlook" doesn't have a newsgroup....Outlook is a Microsoft program for reading newsgroups.

I suspect he means uk.music.folk. , which can be read in Googlegroups as well as with Outlook and many, many other special programs.

There are also a few other 'folk' related newsgroups.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Bill D
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 08:54 PM

did a search ....posted on Wed. Aug.23

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: jeffp
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 10:12 PM

Some rather stiff opposition from some who never received an MBE in the first place. It's real easy to criticize isn't it?

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: freda underhill
Date: 26 Aug 06 - 10:22 PM

Roy Bailey is well known to folkies in Australia. His music is enjoyed and respected here. I applaud what he's done, both in accepting the award initially, which is a recognition of folk music and his contribution, and in later handing it in. He's the one who has to live with how he felt about the war and the award, he did the right thing and the statement on his website was courageous and blunt. I have posted it to the ausworld folk forum in Australia.

freda

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Stu
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 05:11 AM

Good on Roy, that's what I say. Returning an honour is a good way of registering your dissent and if I had an honour to return, I would too. Nothing wrong with standing up for your principles.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: shepherdlass
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 05:15 AM

Good for Roy. Presumably someone reasonably influential in NewLabourOldTory had heard of him or he'd not have had the award in the first place, therefore his returning the award will at least have given that person pause for thought.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Scrump
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 01:07 PM

If Roy Bailey had refused to accept the MBE in the first place, most of us wouldn't have known he had been offered it, because the government would have kept it quiet. So by accepting it and then returning it later, he is achieving a greater effect than if he had refused it right away.

With the recent cash - sorry, I meant to type "loans" not "cash", silly me - for honours scandal hitting the headlines, these so-called "honours" are becoming worthless anyway, so IMO Roy is doing the right thing by sending it back.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Santa
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 02:28 PM

Do you seriously believe that anyone in "the government" will be embarrassed that he returned the award? Like who? The only people affected will be those who thought that he deserved the award in the first place, and worked towards getting it for him.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Peace
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 02:34 PM

It's too bad he didn't make mention of innocent Israelis being killed.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 02:34 PM

The Government will not care at all,they are always having Medals thrown back in their faces.The only people making a fuss is some folkies on Mudcat and UK.music folk.
Scooby

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST,PJS
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 03:15 PM

I'm sure Roy did what he thought was right (for him) the approval or disapproval of anyone else doesn't really matter....

PJS

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 03:40 PM

Just like you hide under a guest name who cares about what you think.
Yas.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: skipy
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 04:08 PM

Never could stand the man anyway & what he has done now for attention can only hurt the music.
Skipy

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST,PJS
Date: 27 Aug 06 - 07:02 PM

"Just like you hide under a guest name who cares about what you think."
Yas


Scooby Doo? Yas?

- Maybe as many as care about anyone Else's on a forum.

PJS

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 02:49 AM

Strange how these kind of threads bring out the best in people.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: DoctorJug
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 02:57 AM

I suppose if you're sleeping under tarps and using your dead neighbour's shop for a toilet it's some comfort to know that Mr. Bailey has handed back his gong.
Really, though, he's done what he can. Can we all say that?

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Betsy
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 03:54 AM

The award (I'm only summising) would have been proposed by someone(s) in the Labour Party (Democrats in the US ). The process is heavily vetted to ensure the individual does not have any skeletons in his cupboard. It is awarded in recognition of services to the NATION by the individual, from the people of Britain, and is not a wholly political award .
That Roy has seen fit to return it - is a personal choice and we need to respect it.
I would have thought, better to return it, on a point of principle concerning the reason he received it - Folk Music - if he was so moved.
After all, he didn't receive it for his political views.
There is an avenue of thought that says it would have been much better to have kept the award , and then his letters and thoughts may have carried more weight than us average Joes.
A letter to the Times signed by Roy Bailey M.B.E. DOES carry much more weight than signed simply Roy Bailey and certainly has more chance of being published.
Apologies to our overseas friends who may find this matter a little confusing,it is part of the British Class and Honours system, which which strangely enough, many Socialists feel comfortable in accepting, when bestowed upon them.
It's called an Honour,and it IS an honour to be recognised by your peer group as being that bit more special.
Keep singing your songs Roy, and pray to God that you never have to wrestle with some of the awful decisions which face senior politicians all over the REAL world.
They,like us, can't be correct ALL of the time.

Cheers,
Betsy

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: r.padgett
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 05:00 AM

Roy's MBE was for services to Folk music (I assume) proposed by Folk music people and accepted as such. This makes it an award given not by the government but by The Queen on behalf of the people of this country

Roy's political beliefs are not those of all of us (folkies) on every issue

I personally believe that the Rule of Law needs to come from the people of any country, and dictatorships and oppression cannot be tolerated

Such an act (to return his MBE) must be heart rendering and a very great gesture

When I started this I thought he was in err, and had sleighted the Folk Community, now I really dont know!!

Ray

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST,Cath
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 09:02 AM

Anybody can propose anyone else for an award for whatever they like - whether it is accepted or not is another matter.
Many years ago some of the regulars of the Folk Club at the Nook in Holmfirth put forward Angela Roberts who was licensee at the time. She didn't get an MBE or an OBE but she was invited to the palace along with David, her husband. Anyone who remembers David can imagine the scene.
Angela was absolutely delighted, they had a wonderful time and David was on his best behaviour.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Flash Company
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 09:33 AM

A government that includes a prat who said during the debate on the licensing act that 'Three Folksingers singing in a bar is my idea of hell' is hardly going to be embarressed by Roy's gesture! My darlin' Sheila is wont to say when anyone criticises TB 'Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never harm me'.
It don't matter what anyone says or does, this government will continue on it's own foul way, and, regrettably, probably get re-elected. That is assuming they don't cancel the next election on security grounds!

FC

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 09:54 AM

I don't think we are bombing people into accepting Christianity.

I think its valid what he did. John Lennon did something similar over Vietnam. Just wish he'd worded it more carefully - it tends to make all folkies look woolly minded.

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 10:58 AM

- it tends to make all folkies look woolly minded.

No, no this is a jest too far Drummer!

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST,Geoff P
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 12:06 PM

Well done Roy !!!!

Geoff

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: The Badger
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 07:58 PM

He helped get them in, so it is only right he should help get them out!

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 29 Aug 06 - 03:59 AM

Worst Labour government in history, but what's the alternative ?

eric

[ and well done Roy ]

Subject: RE: Roy Bailey returns his MBE
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Aug 06 - 05:33 AM

The alternative is for the Labour Party, with some attempt at dignity, to reacert its authority, change the leader and quite a few policies.
Les.