New Labour Conference in Manchester?

Subject: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST,Hugo
Date: 29 Aug 06 - 12:08 PM

TIME TO GO!
Tens of thousands of anti war demonstrators will be in Manchester on saturday 23rd September to protest outside the New Labour Party annual conference .
The demonstration has been called by the Stop The War Coalition and the Campaign For Nuclear Disarmarment[CND ] .
The main themes of the march will be "No to The Wars in the Middle East" and "No To The Trident Replacement."
The demonstration is being supported by trade union groups,church and mosque delegation, students from FE colleges and universities and pensioner groups etc.
Are you going there ...if you are bring musical instruments etc!!
hugo

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Rapparee
Date: 29 Aug 06 - 12:09 PM

Down, boy! Down to BS!

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 07:56 AM

You will achieve a lot more of what you want by joining the majority of those of us inside the Party who want most of the same.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Gedpipes
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 08:08 AM

Bollocks guest!
Tell us exactly what you have achieved inside the Party?

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Scrump
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 08:28 AM

Hmm, I think we should send along as many Somerset folk singers as we can find.

Give 'em hell, lads!

;-)

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 08:38 AM

Good question gedpipes. The minimum wage, sure start and the longest period of economic growth in a very long time.

Yes, I am sure you can list 400 things we didn't do. But how much can be achieved by posting and demonstrating?

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Gedpipes
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 09:00 AM

The minimum wage is a myth and you know it well. In any event it was mooted by the Tories and if memory serves me well the CBI.

Demonstrations achieve much. They raise consciousness, encourage debate and inspire action post the event.

Its not just what you 'didn't do' its what New Labour 'is' doing thats frightening
Blue skies
Ged

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 09:12 AM

"The minimum wage is a myth and you know it well."
It is not as much as it should be.

In any event it was mooted by the Tories and if memory serves me well the CBI.
"Sorry, I thought they were against it.


Demonstrations achieve much. They raise consciousness, encourage debate and inspire action post the event.
Action such as what? Joining the SWP, Respect or the Greens?

Its not just what you 'didn't do' its what New Labour 'is' doing thats frightening.Most of us what a change of leader and of policies and in the end we will have it.

Will you be with us or giving finely considered advice from here or the pavement?


True enough, it frightens most of us in the Party too.
Blue skies
Ged

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST,dafydd
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 09:47 AM

Squadrons
of morris men
will be there
Rockabilly bands
high on lorries
Hip hoppers
on urban floats
chantey men
on canal boats
massed choirs
of middle england
singing Jerusalem
In the city square
all coming up
to taste the
Manchester air
there will be
a hammering
of dulcimers
a frailing
of banjos
a tribute
beatle band
just wanting to
hold a hand
saving john lennon
the last dance
let's give peace a chance
bread not bombs
and
nothing arty
just an
honest message to
the Labour Party........

time to tell Blair to be gone
with his chums at the Pentagon.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 12:17 PM

"I think the best chance, however slight, for the redistribution of power and wealth is through the Labour Party, not through posts and demos"

And how will this glorious day change anything?

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 12:28 PM

We've been there before Les. Nothing we can do can change anything, unless we accept that we can only change it in a diametrically opposite direction from what we want. Perhaps with you in there, they are moving slightly more slowly rightwards than they would otherwise have done. Multiculturalism is the latest target I see, so prepare for the attempt to outflank the BNP on the right.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST,WALT
Date: 30 Aug 06 - 12:53 PM

will this glorious day change anything asks Les in Chorlton...well, yes ,it may encourage those labour fainthearts to dump their leader who has led this country to wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and whose behaviour during the attack on Lebanon was appalling!
Blair also intends to spend billions on replacing Trident while lecturing the Iranians on the evils of nuclear weapons.
walt

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Aug 06 - 04:57 AM

Paul,

"Nothing we can do can change anything, unless we accept that we can only change it in a diametrically opposite direction from what we want."

I don't really understand this point. Can you make it clearer? What did the politics of Benn and Militant achieve? Thatcher? Was that good?

"Multiculturalism is the latest target I see, so prepare for the attempt to outflank the BNP on the right." I suspect you are probably correct although I don't think it is possible to get beyond the BNP.

Walt,

maybe, but wouldn't the effect would be much more significant if those people were inside the Party?

As Paul has noted I have been around these arguments many times. We generally cannot change much. One way is the pressure from outside the other is pressure from inside. They bother matter.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST,hugo
Date: 31 Aug 06 - 05:23 AM

Military Families Against The War knows at first hand the lies of the Blair government on Iraq and Afghanistan.
They will be hosting a peace camp in Albert Square ,Manchester on thursday 21st September until the 23rd.
Rose Gentle,the mother of scottish soldier Gordon ,who was killed in Iraq , will be speaking at the camp along with other members of the organisation.
The peace camp is part of the huge anti war demonstration organised by the Stop The War Coalition and CND on the 23rd sept which is going to tell Blair and the warmongers it is TIME TO GO!
Be there at the square!
hugo

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 31 Aug 06 - 06:17 AM

"What did the politics of Benn and Militant achieve?" said anonymous guest.

What did Blair achieve that was not in the same direction as Thatcher? He even SAID he was doing it. Are Militant the only possible opposition to Blair? (if they are, I might have to support them...) Are you going to support the complete privatisation of medicine just because you're afraid of being called a trot? Is there any end to rhetorical questions about New Labour?

No, what you said is just an illustration of doing the opposite of what you want, because it's all you can do... unless you really WANT UK Ltd. - or still worse, can't see that it has happened.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST,IFOR
Date: 31 Aug 06 - 08:10 AM

As a socialist I have to agree with Paul's posting.
We can't accept that Blair's Britain is as good as it is going to get.
The choice can't be Tweedledum New Labour and Tweedledee Tories chasing each other to the right with the far right BNP waiting in the wings.

The Stop The War Coalition has enabled people who are opposed to the war,nuclear arms and the arms trade to work together to stop the drive to war.
See you in Manchester when we can say farewell to Blair who will be shortly off to the corporate lecture and millionaire circuit in the USA.
ifor

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Dave Wynn
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 08:09 AM

Oh no....Go and protest in some other City. We mancunians will have to pick up the policing bill and NHS bill if anyone gets hurt. Sod off and do it in Brigthton or Londinium or somesuch place.

Blair is doing OK. Better than my party (the Tory's) did. He has out-Thatchered Thantcher. Leave him alone the boys doing good for us.

Spot the Dog

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: VIN
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 08:42 AM

Challenging for Labour's Future

The Mechanics Institute
103 Princess Street,
Manchester, M1 6DD
Manchester
Thursday 7th September 2006
7.30pm

Speakers include:
Tony Benn
Jeremy Dear (NUJ)
Alice Mahon
Dave McCall (TGWU)
John McDonnell MP

For more details, please email [e-mail] or ring [phone]

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 02:09 PM

Tony Benn
Jeremy Dear (NUJ)
Alice Mahon
Dave McCall (TGWU)
John McDonnell MP

Am I mistaken or are these not members of the Labour Part

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST,albert
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 02:26 PM

Yup
certainly Benn,Mahon and McDonald are members of the Labour Party and are probably heartily fed up of Blair and want him to go soonest as possible.

Just a quick reply to Spot The Dog who doesnt want the bother of the anti war movement in Manchester.

Think of how inconnvenient it was for the people of Bagdhad when Bush and Blair launched their highly illegal "Shock and Awe"on that city three years ago...all those big bombs,cruise missiles and cluster bombs....100000 dead and many more wounded and the place in turmoil.
I think Mancunians will turn out in droves to tell Blair and the wargang to go.
albert

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: shepherdlass
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 07:24 PM

And to whoever mentioned SureStart as one of NewLabour's achievements ... have you ever been patronized by a member of their staff just because you're raising children in the wrong postcode? Paternalistic tosh dressed up as social revolution. Another little sign of a party that's lost touch with its roots - no wonder they didn't listen to the anti-war protests.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 07:46 PM

Yes Yes...we all know Blair's an egotistical madman with the blood of thousands on his hands. I've lost count of the threads condemning his policies on this forum.
His support here has dwindled with each foreign policy disaster.
He has been exposed for what he is and has shamed those who supported him for personal advancment.

If the labour Party are to regain any credibility his resignation must be demanded at the Manchester conference.

Unfortunately there is no "man of the left" waiting to replace tarnished Tony, just a ragbag of sleazy opportunists queuing to fill his shoes.

Politically our country is bankrupt.....All that "political capital" wasted in the murder of thousands of innocents in Gaza, Lebanon, Iraq, to make the world a more dangerous place.

What fools we are. Time stop pretending that any of the labels have the aswer to our problems.

The only labels of any value are thoe which say....
"Supporting political parties can be very dangerous to your health"
Ake

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST,FREDERICK
Date: 02 Sep 06 - 01:26 AM

Does anyone have a song about Blair or the last days of Blair?
frederick

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Dave Wynn
Date: 02 Sep 06 - 07:44 AM

GUEST albert, You do it then. Just don't bother me with the details. Remember I'm a Tory..I didn't vote this madman in, presumably you did!


Spot the Dog

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: ifor
Date: 02 Sep 06 - 09:26 AM

reply to spot the dog


I'd rather be a stag
at bay
and gory
Than be a tory
.
adrian mitchell..writing in different times

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: The Sandman
Date: 02 Sep 06 - 05:43 PM

now i believe this conference would be alot more fun if blair brown ,two jags,beckett and straw had to spend an hour in the stocks each day and be pelted with suitable material.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: The Sandman
Date: 02 Sep 06 - 05:44 PM

oh and the same for the other two parties, tory and liberal.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Sep 06 - 04:56 AM

We get the government we deserve. Walk down any street any day and you will find examples of how most people couldn't care less about their neighbours any more. The government reflects the mood of the nation. Protesting will not make any difference. The government already know that people don't like the war. They don't care.

Next election make a real protest. Spoil your ballot paper. Write straight across it that you will not vote for any meglamaniac who thinks he can run your life better that you can. I wouldn't let a single one of them through my front door, let alone let them run my country.

The alternative? Me of course. A benign dictator...

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 03 Sep 06 - 06:27 AM

Stay calm Dave, think of your health.

The real Tories are just around the corner. Remember " Labour Governemnt doesn't work" and that poster of the dole queue? They certaily knew how to create a dole queue didn't they?

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: ifor
Date: 03 Sep 06 - 06:40 AM

I don't agree at all that people don't care for their neighbours. We have had successive governments that have promoted freemarket policies and a kind of "me first and me second " approach but people through their work,family and wider social relationships tend to look out for each other .

In my school for example the pupils have been very keen to raise money during earthquake appeals and for an anti landmine charity.They were very moved when an Indian lady came to our assembly to talk about the earthquake and its effects.

I know a woman near me who spends every sunday morning of the year at a car boot sale raising money for a vietnamese orphanage and I am sure there are countless acts of thoughtfulness and caring that go every day.

On a more overtly political scale think of the 100000 anti war demonstrators in London last month who called for an "immediate ceasefire "in the Lebanon and those anti war protestors in Ireland and Scotland who took peaceful direct action to try and prevent the supplying of weapons of mass destruction to the warmakers.
All is not lost...but it could have been so much better! And get to the mass lobby of the Labour Party in Manchester on the 23rd Sept.
ifor

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Sep 06 - 01:26 PM

Ask your MP if he will be nominating Robert Marshall-Andrews in the (I hope) forthcoming leadership election.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 08:00 PM

"Unfortunately there is no "man of the left" waiting to replace tarnished Tony, just a ragbag of sleazy opportunists queuing to fill his shoes." I don,t believe this applies to John McDonnell. He is in a fine tradition of Labour MPs with links into the trade union movement who genuinely try to represent the views and interests of ordinrary people. I'm actually thinkin of rejoining the party just so I can vote for him as leader.

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 04:13 AM

Welcome back guest!

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: akenaton
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 10:39 AM

No matter how much the Labour party "change tack" their policies will never solve the problems of our society.

Blair may be a madman, whose name should only remain on the history books to remind us that it was we who brought him to power and sustained him there, as his self- aggrandisement and cowardice became daily more evident;   but he got one core point right....People are no longer prepared to live a life of slavery and sacrifice for others and like it or not that is what Socialism means for those who lack the ability to drag themselves out of the mire of Capitalism.

I say this as a lifelong socialist and it pains me to do so, but these days people need a "carrot" to turn against the barbaric system which causes such despair amongst our young people at home and such slaughter among our brothers and sisters abroad.

That "carrot" must be happiness and contentment and neither can be offered by any of the "isms" which use material possesions or materialistic advancment as an end in themselves.
Although an atheist, I am sure we need a spiritual element in our lives, a spirituality which is mindful of the natural world we have inherited and which through our adherance to capitalist materialism we a rapidly destroying.......Ake

Subject: RE: New Labour Conference in Manchester?
From: ifor
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 04:17 PM

Surely one of the "Carrots" mentioned by akenaton is the massive active opposition to the wars and the warmongers that exists across the world.It may not be socialism but it is a form of anti imperialism which has thrown grit into the war drive.And may it grow!
ifor