Pear Tree Inn Southampton

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Andy Jackson
Date: 14 Mar 07 - 12:49 PM

Just to throw a few more names from the time into the pot...
Paul Hawkins - Steve Nunn, brother of Gary. Colin Grant-Adams, Dave Ingledew, Sibby.
Not wishng too blatant a plug, have a look at Forest Tracks
Andy
I think the Foc's'l'e LP "Residents Night Out" is also available as a cd now.
Incidentally I've contacted Cecil SHarpe House to see if the Christchurch Festival film is available to hire or even purchase.
Andy

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Andy Jackson
Date: 14 Mar 07 - 01:12 PM

Tim: Alan White hasn't changed a bit! He ran the Sidmouth campsite for years, now runs the very succesful Wareham Wail and is a moving force in the revamped Sidmouth Festival. Like I say, he's not changed a bit, the same twinkle in his eye even.

Andy

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: growler
Date: 14 Mar 07 - 04:21 PM

Scrump
I think the tall guy was Paul Brier, I went to school with him, but havn't had contact with him since the late sixties. I remember him going into Chappel music shop and asked to try out a banjo. He ended up blocking the street and was warned by the local plod that he was causing an obstruction

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Geordie-Peorgie
Date: 14 Mar 07 - 05:15 PM

Paul Hawkins is still around but doesn't 'club' any mair

Steve Nunn now lives in Cornwall in his wee recording studio

Gary Nunn still does kid's entertainment at festivals etc

And Dave Ingledew is still a leading light in The Bursledon Village Band - One of the most consistent and wunnerful bands aroond.

Not heard of Sibby for a great many years.

Nice story for anyone who knaahs Sooty Broughton - Lynch-pin of the Railway Folk Club for 300 years - At Brian Ingham's funeral Sue Apicella's hubby saw Sooty and said, "By Heck, George Wilson's let himself go, hasn't he?"

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,John Paddy Browne
Date: 15 Mar 07 - 03:54 PM

To answer Scrump's query of 14 March, it was indeed The Dixie Ramblers: Dave Betteridge (banjo) and Derek Glasspool (guitar). They occasionally used a bass-player (acoustic) whose name escapes me.
The Dixies appeared on the very first Forest Tracks album, FIRST TRACKS, and this is now available again on CD, with original cover and sleeve-notes, from Forest Tracks. Also on this album: Helen Woodall, Dave Williams, Ted Duckett and Harmonious Blacksmith.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Scrump
Date: 16 Mar 07 - 09:03 AM

Ah! Dave Betteridge - I'm pretty sure that was him, because as I said, I did see him doing solo gigs, as well as appear with the duo, so his name would have been announced. So it must have been the Dixie Ramblers. I wasn't sure before, but I'm pretty sure you're right. Does anyone know what happened to them?

Thanks to all who have provided info, and apologies for hijacking the thread Tim!

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Dave Ingledew
Date: 16 Mar 07 - 01:33 PM

Hi All,

Sibby is still alive and well, after retiring from the folk scene for about 15 years he came to The Bursledon Village Band's 20th birhday bash and decided to start calling again. He calls with us fairly regularly, travelling from darkest Essex where he now resides to sunny Hampshire.

He's still a star !! I can remember so many evenings when he's had us in stitches by a simple comment he's made to one of the dancers.

BTW it The BVB's 30th this May, we're having a dance and workshops at Hamble Memorial Hall. Check out www.bursledonvillageband.co.uk if you're interested.

We'll always be grateful to the F'o'c's'l'e' for providing the oportunity to get the band started in November 1996.

Cheers to you all.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,long suffering fiddle player/wife
Date: 16 Mar 07 - 02:17 PM

He means 1976!!!!!!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Peter Green
Date: 23 Mar 07 - 10:31 AM

Ah yes I remember it well. I cut my folk teeth with all those familiar names until I fled to the Isles of Scilly in '66
Returned in early 70s to Cutty Wren and some MCing with Alan (?) Rutter. Also there was Roger Bucknel who went on to make some exceedingly good guitars.
What no mention of Guta Purcha (spelling) or Vic, Vince & John
(Vince makes a fair guitar also)
Could reminisce for hours from here in Poole

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Terry McDonald
Date: 23 Mar 07 - 10:59 AM

Spelt Gutta Percha, I think, Peter. I can still remember some of his song, The Great Skiffle Disaster, sung to the tune of the Gresford Disaster. I think the first verse went:

You've heard of the skiffle disaster
Took place at a local hotel
A hundred and one skifflers turned up
Was there an audiunce? was there Hell...

also

A hundred washboard players
Had brought their washboards along
With their thimbles in place and a smile on their face
They rendered that old worried song....

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Peter Green
Date: 23 Mar 07 - 11:20 AM

My Favourite Gutta Percha song was 'Dancing to the Eve of Destruction' about Pan's People dancing to the 60s hit 'Eve of Destruction' by Barry McGuire. I think it was irony at its best.

The Foc's'l'e spent a few months in an upstairs room used by the Order of Buffalos Its now the West key car park. Anyone remeber the pubs name?

Incidentally Ted Duckett, of spoons fame, worked for my dad!

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Geordie-Peorgie
Date: 23 Mar 07 - 01:34 PM

The Fo'c's'le is on the move again

Havin' been at the 'Wellington' for ten years they are now moving to The Richmond Inn' in Portswood, Southampton from 23rd March.

Since aah took ower MC from Brian Hopper aall those years ago it's moved aboot eight times in aall

Good on Jane & Trevor et al for keepin' it gannin'

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: inertmale
Date: 10 May 07 - 11:40 AM

Just a note to say that I remember the Bay Tree Inn at the junction of East Park Terrace and the road to Bitterne. It had completely black decor in my day and the beer was "Gales" and always had a slight metallic tinge to my palate.
I also remember the "Hay Wain" at Cadnam and the rural Games held there. Anyone else remember?

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: RTim
Date: 10 May 07 - 05:28 PM

The old club room at the back of The Haywain was very important to me when I started being involved in folk song and dance. The Bi-weekly dances were where I started singing with Helen Woodall (in the interval) and I met Alfie Woodall and Derek Binstead and we were all founding members of Tyneham Morris (of Christchurch) and with our female partners, we were all members of The Haywainers dance group led by Paddy Searle.
I also remember, but didn't go that often, the Friday night sessions with Sarah & The Sinnermen? Is that right? Helen Woodall and her then singer partner - Richard? used to sing during the break, as did sometimes my old friend and main influence- Dave Williams. Great times and many memories.

Tim Radford

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Terry McDonald
Date: 10 May 07 - 07:36 PM

Richard Thrift, Tim.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST
Date: 11 May 07 - 05:19 AM

Mention of Paul Brier above - if it's the same guy, I played in a jug band with him (mostly at the Anvil, 1970), he played a banjolin and/or harmonica; later on morphed into a fine electric blues guitarist (worked with Bob Pearce, who back in '70 played washboard at the Anvil) - jeez, that's a long time ago...

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: scouse
Date: 11 May 07 - 07:04 AM

Was it Gutta Percha who use to sing......

Oh, flamin',flamin,June, you've spoke half an hour to soon,
Your a better man than I am Gunga Din,
When the Sun shines bright on Totten,
The stench is somethin' rotten,
But it's better when the Tide is comin' in..
Chorus... As I seem to remember...
Oh,Jane,Oh, Jane, may I never smell your sweaty feet again,
In the Factory were she works makin' glass eyes for the Turks,
She my ////////////////////// Scarlet fevered Jane.

Brian (Crabbe) Neville-Lee. john Paddy Brown,Jeff I remember well also Geoff Jerram. RTim I must have known you as well.. I lived down with John Murphitt for quite a while.. and went to all the clubs including one near or in Chandlers Ford if memory serves correct.. We used to sit on bales of hay an drink Cider and the Farmer used to put his sick cows behind the stage area..told me the music seemed to buck them up no end.
As Aye,
Phil Jackson.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Terry McDonald
Date: 11 May 07 - 07:11 AM

Yes, that was one of his - I'd forgotten it. The 'flamin' June bit was the chorus, though. The tune was a variant of 'She'll be coming round the mountain', and there was a verse about when being asked for a light, being told to 'climb up and get it off the bloody flame', meaning the flame at the Fawley oil refinery. Gutta was Mike Sadlier and his sister was married to Dave Williams. I think.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: RTim
Date: 11 May 07 - 08:04 AM

Yes - David Williams was married to Christine Sadler and still lives locally.
Flaming June is still sung by Geoff Jerram - and it is about TOTTON - the place of my berth!
Sorry Phil, but your name does not ring bells with me, but it was all a very long time ago now. I have not lived in Hampshire since 1973, although I am often back there to visit my mother & sister who live in Marchwood & Hythe.

Tim Radford

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Terry McDonald
Date: 11 May 07 - 08:07 AM

Just remembered - the melody to Flamin' June was Maggie May, not She'll be Coming Round the Mountains!

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: RTim
Date: 11 May 07 - 09:39 AM

Flaming June - words Mike Sadler, tune - Maggie May.
Chorus:
Oh, FlaminÕ FlaminÕ June you spoke half an hour to soon
YouÕre a better man than I am Gunga Din
When the sun shines bright on Totton
The stench is something rotten,
But itÕs better when the tide is coming in.

I knew a man Silvester comes from somewhere near Winchester
Had a row of 40 medals on his chest
He came all the way from Tokyo and with a ////// Banjo
And with //////// these skiffle types /////////

I was on my way to Fawley feeling somewhat poorly
Cadged a fag off someone who I dare not name
When I asked him for a light he sure gave me a fright
He said climb up and get one off the Fawley Flame.

Now I went to a party both Bohemian and arty
All the local bums and parasites were there
When some they had a nogginÕ
The rest were merely snogginÕ
TheyÕll be tipsy when they all come up for air.

The morals of this nation give us cause for consternation
//////////////// every day
They say keep the party clean, so donÕt go where sheÕs been
//////////////// next day.

With all this radiation there is bound to be mutation
And the sexual roles will have to be revised
And if a woman lingers with a beast with 15 fingers
She wonÕt be ///////////////
SheÕll just be televised.

*************************

Taken down - as well as possible! From a recording made by Ron Coe at Chichester College, Sussex in 1966.
Performed by Dave Williams, Vic Wilton and Pete Mills.
This track is available on the CD - YouÕre On Nipper: Dave Williams.
This being a compilation of Dave Williams performances made after his death by Forest Tracks Records, of which Dave was a founding member.
See: http://www.forest-tracks.co.uk/


Tim Radford

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Terry McDonald
Date: 11 May 07 - 09:51 AM

Isn't it 'they say keep the party clean, 'cos you don't know where she's been'?

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Peter green
Date: 16 May 07 - 09:52 AM

Still on the subject of Gutta Percha don't forget the song of The Woolston Ferry, now an historical document!
Also RTim mentioned Dave Williams and Vic Wilton who also played with Vince Hockey as Vic, Vince & John. Vince, I understand, now makes fine guitars. He owned the first Martin I ever touched!!!!!!!!!
Brian Hooper was playing there when I was a boy and I'm almost a hundred

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Andy Jackson
Date: 16 May 07 - 04:07 PM

Paul Brier mentioned above, played with the "Phoenix Jug Band". I still have a copy of a fine demo tape I recorded for them. The Band also included Jackie Whitren.
I am gradually unearthing several recordings of the early SOuthampton Folk scene, they may be the basis of a nostalgia CD someday. The nightmare of contacting all concerned is fairly mind boggling but we all love Mudcat don't we.

Andy

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: growler
Date: 16 May 07 - 04:23 PM

Inertmale
The rural pastimes you referred was ' Nurdling ' I can't remember what the objective was, as it was over 40 years ago, but I remember it involved ' dwile flunking ' and drinking cider. Somebody won and somebody lost, but they were both pissed,so it didn't matter

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: RTim
Date: 16 May 07 - 05:04 PM

After all this time - I can't remember which is which ie. John Murfitt or Pat McMillian. One of them would often turn up at The Fo'c's'le wearing dark glasses because he was a welder or something? and regularly got "Arc-eye". I thought it strange, because at that time I too was a welder, but seldom suffered that fate.
Now - am I right about that, or is it just time playing tricks with my memories? And which was which? One played Banjo and the other played Guitar.

Tim Radford

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Geordie-Peorgie
Date: 16 May 07 - 06:13 PM

ye'll be pleased te knaah that Vince Hockey is alive and well and still mendin' Martin Guitars but aalso building 'Hockey Guitars' and mekkin' a grand job of it.

Brian Hooper is retired from the mundane 9-5 and has just released a solo CD as well as a duo effort (with Jeff Henry - Both late of Cat's Whiskers')) of songs about Soothampton.

Hooper is the consumate 'GENTLEMAN' and many years ago writ a book caaled "So You Want To Be A Folk Club MC?"

He giv uz a copy (and signed it) when aah took ower from him as MC at The Fo'c'sle MANY years ago.

I eventually passed it on te someone who was takin' ower as MC at Chichester - and aah signed it.

The last aah heard it had been passed on with SEVENTEEN signatures in it!

Not bad for a freebie eh?

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Terry McDonald
Date: 16 May 07 - 06:47 PM

Weren't 'Nurdling' and 'Dwile Flonking' invented by Michael Bentine? I saw his stage show at the Bournemouth Pavilion in the very early 60s (late 50s?) and one of the sketches featured those 'rural pastimes.'

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Growler
Date: 17 May 07 - 10:22 AM

If Ibremember rightly The Haywain used to hold Nurdling championships

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Geordie-Peorgie
Date: 17 May 07 - 05:05 PM

"Drat me! - He's Nurdled!!"

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: growler
Date: 17 May 07 - 05:11 PM

Bugger me, so is I

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: dj bass
Date: 18 May 07 - 07:21 AM

Miskin Man mentioned Jaki Whitren. I had a fabulous album by JW released in the early 70s. Somewhere at home I think I still have a couple of tracks on casette. I used to sing one of her songs - A Little Bit Extra Please...

So I just bought that album again after all these years on Amazon. Thanks MM for the reminder.

Any idea what Jaki is doing now? Her myspace doesn't seemto show any gigs, although she does seem to be doing something.

dj

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST
Date: 19 May 07 - 05:46 AM

Miskin Man, I didn't know that Jackie Whitren sang with a jug band - more info please?

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Warwick Slade
Date: 21 May 07 - 10:53 AM

The best band in those days of yore was THE STINKIN' PRONG FULL.
Remember them?
might have something to do with Dave Williams & Geoff Gerram

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: RTim
Date: 03 Nov 09 - 07:25 PM

Hi All, I just wanted to revive this thread - so many memories, so many great people....

I will be in England next week - not much time to do folk things, but it would be great to see ALL my old friends again - after so many years, maybe another time - Yes, wouldn't be great to get together again?

Best to all - Tim Radford

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Andy Jackson
Date: 04 Nov 09 - 08:56 AM

Well done Tim. What a great thread for us old nostalgics.

Did anyone ever start a book? I know I haven't sorted out all my old tapes yet so I mustn't complain.

Andy

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: RTim
Date: 04 Nov 09 - 09:20 AM

Andy - If you have sorted out your old tapes! - Any sign of the Sounds of the South prog. on Songs collected by George Gardiner for Radio Solent that we did way back in 197??? ?

Tim (I am going to keep on about this!)

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Andy Jackson
Date: 04 Nov 09 - 03:27 PM

I know it's on the Isle of Wight!!!! In a big store in Ventnor. The day is getting closer, honest.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: growler
Date: 04 Nov 09 - 04:18 PM

It's great to have this thread back, this club inspired me when I was in my teens. I now have run my own folk clubs, for the last ten years. had it not been for 'The Fo'c's'le in the sixties, many people would have been spared my voice, over the last40 years.
Paul Briar, if your out there, please PM me

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Bonecruncher
Date: 04 Nov 09 - 11:01 PM

Tim Radford.............
If you are going to visit your family in the Totton/Marchwood areas please throw a stone into the water at Eling Quay for me!
Also born/brung up in Totton.
Colyn Blundell.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Nov 09 - 03:14 PM

I've just discovered this thread - wow does it bring back memories of Southampton area folk in the mid to late 60s.
Must have been to the Pear Tree, but don't remmber it at all, although all the other clubs mentioned are so familiar.

Miskin Man wrote -
"Blacksmiths Arms in Shirley every Monday,had the Funario Folk Club hosted usually by the "Funario Folk Three" memory says it comprised Brian (Crabbe) Neville-Lee, Robin Parker and another. Other notables included John Murfitt & Pat McMillan, John Heslop etc."

I was in a "Funario Folk Three", together with John Murfitt, and originally Colm McLaverty, later Brian Jones.

Does anyone know where John is now?

Regards,
Hamish West

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Crabbe
Date: 01 Aug 10 - 05:03 AM

Good to see that Hamish is still going! Just to put things straight, Robin Parker, John Heslop and I sang under the name of "Omen". When John went on to greener pastures, Robin and I became "Volume II". Happy Days!
All the Best
Crabbe (Bryan Neville-Lee)

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Alan Rutter
Date: 01 Aug 10 - 11:18 AM

Is that the same Hamish that later ran the club in the Anchor at the bottom of East Street ? if it is -- we didnt half have some good nights there.
I only discovered Mudcat a few weeks ago too and it certainly brought back old memories. I used to live opposite the Haywain and used to pop over and do the odd spot once I got to know Dave Williams. The hall was always packed and full of atmosphere until the twerp who moved into the house at the far end of the shed put the boot in with his complaints.
Theres a big gap in Mudcat postings since talk of JPB or AJ writing a history - but maybe theres still hope yet and there are a few things somewhat mixed in Miskins memories.
The Cutty Wren started life at the Hythe Hotel then moved very up market to the Stewart Lodge in Frost Lane (hence the name of the first LP). It then moved when Don Stewart, the owner bought the Westcliffe Hall Hotel, which was then right on the edge of Southampton Water. Some of the best nights were had there with some very big name guests, but after a few years and very suddenly, we fell out with Don, who was always a bit of an odd character, so in the space of a week the club mpoved to the Station Hotel in Totton and finally to the Abbey Hotel in Romsey where it unfortunately died. The Westcliffe Hall was subsequently fell into a poor state of repair, suffered fire damage going through the hands of several developers and the last I heard (about 18 months ago) it was going to be renovated and become a top notch hotel once again. Who knows, with right approach - another club in the basement ?
Anyway, back to the Pear Tree - I remember lots of hot smokey nights in the early 70's upstairs in the Bay Tree where the singers were always excellent, usually superbly MC'd by JPB and the beer - Gales - was always spot on.
I'm glad the club has survived.
Regards to all
Alan Rutter

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: growler
Date: 01 Aug 10 - 04:43 PM

Hi Alan
I spent a lot of time at The Haywain in Cadnam.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: growler
Date: 01 Aug 10 - 04:46 PM

Sorry, hit the wrong key. Seem to remember getting out of my head Dwyle Flunking at the Haywain

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: RTim
Date: 01 Aug 10 - 07:20 PM

Hi All,

Alan Rutter is a name I remember very well, but sorry Alan - that is about all.
We are talking about nearly 40 years ago!! I am sure we must have know each other back in the day?
Do you have any other web presence, ie. Myspace or Facebook or whatever - are you still performing, if so - what?
Dave Williams is responsible for almost everything I do - even to this day. I loved the man.

Tim Radford
Woods Hole, USA.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: Al Rutter
Date: 02 Aug 10 - 02:33 PM

I arrived from the North East in 1970 and after singing at both the Foclsle and Cutty Wren fairly regularly decided that the Cutty was more in need of culture (and a bit closer to where I lived) so by 1972 I was involved in its running and continued to do so until sometime in the 80's.
I do remember seeing you occasionally at the focsle, but not that often - I also knew a few members of Twynham Morris and I used to pop over to Twynham FC to do the odd floor spot. Alan White got me involved with Xchurch Festival and I was song director for a year or two with himself director of dance.
At one time a few of the residents of the Cutty formed a band, King Henry's Fyre (nasty disease we used to say) and gig'd locally. At the height of our fame we used to do theme gigs and the only one I can remember with any sort of clarity was "Transportation" performed at the Focsle when it was at the Joiners. From memory, the band consisted of Les & Pete Warland, Roger (Fylde) Bucknall, Allan Mornington-West, Barry Lockyer, Chris Buet & myself (appologies if I missed out anyone).
I also used to play bass with Squeeze & Wheeze during the 80's and must have deafened hundreds in the process.
I retired from singing about 15 years ago but discovering Mudcat recently and seeing some of the posts resulted in this blast of reminiscence.
I have to admit I also Dwyle Flunked, but couldnt say who else was in the circle - clarity having rapidly vanished.

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: growler
Date: 02 Aug 10 - 04:41 PM

Al To my memory, clarity vanished the following day

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Gadaffi
Date: 23 Sep 10 - 09:50 AM

Sorry to revive this thread - well, not really...

My next question is can anyone out there remember Roy 'Cobblers' Harrison and/or his songs? (I've already contacted Paul Marsh and Andy Jackson on this, but would welcome contributioons from anyone else).

Subject: RE: Pear Tree Inn Southampton
From: GUEST,Pete Green
Date: 24 Sep 10 - 05:15 AM

Sorry Gadaffi the name does not ring any bells from the early '60 period. However, It was good to see Alan Rutter pick up the thread. I mentioned his name back in 2007 when this thread started. We used to do alternative weeks at the Cutty Wren as compare. I had the old Martin in those days and was like a dog with two tails. I wonder what happened to the old regulars who were on the Frost Lane album., Mo, the Mitchells and I wonder if Roger Carman still has my banjo! Someone should arrange a reunion from those old days but I guess everyone has moved on to greater things.