BS: Illegal Immigration

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 01:22 PM

"Legal immagration is causing enough problems in the UK without illegal. The south of England has saw a rise in crime in recent years. As reported in the Daily Mail and Telegraph, a lot of it is related to Eastern Europeans."

Well if it's in the Mail & Telegraph it must be true.

Imagine how much worse the crime wave would be if all those Brit Crooks had not been taken in by those kind Spaniards.

L in C

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Ron Davies
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 07:20 AM

So the constant search--on both sides of the Pond--for scapegoats goes on.

And several posters have already pointed out how reliable anything in the Daily Mail is.

With the world-wide recession, Poles are now leaving the UK--and returning to Poland--which seems to be doing better than some other countries.

In the US, it's painfully obvious what Mr. Riginslinger's attitude is toward Mexicans. It's the Brown Peril--to add to his other conspiracy theories. His alleged concern with overpopulation only will convince only people who have not followed his postings--in a myriad of threads--for years.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: GUEST,Dean (Bristol)
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 06:58 AM

Legal immagration is causing enough problems in the UK without illegal. The south of England has saw a rise in crime in recent years. As reported in the Daily Mail and Telegraph, a lot of it is related to Eastern Europeans.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Arnie
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 05:19 AM

Here in the UK we've just had a documentary on the situation of illegal immigrants in Calais. This French coastal town is only 21 miles from Dover and is a gathering place for illegal immigrants from Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, Somalia, Ethiopia, Eritrea and a few other nationalities. The French interior minister visited the town this week and blamed the situation there on weak UK asylum and immigration controls. There are estimated to be between 2-300 immigrants in Calais at present with more joining them daily. The Brits have a border control at Calais port which involves searching in car boots and lorries to extricate any illegals before boarding the ferries, hence the backlog building up in Calais. Strangely, none of the illegals want to claim asylum in France, which they are perfectly entitled to do, they would rather live rough and eat at the Red Cross soup kitchens than claim asylum and be fingerprinted.This is because once the French take their fingerprints, they will always be returnable to France should they reach the UK and claim asylum. They seem to see the UK as some sort of Eldorado - not sure why though as they would get the same benefits here as are available in any other EU country.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 05:42 PM

I'm not sure anyone is worried about Mexicans in particular, it's simply the numbers of people.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 05:15 PM

I must confess I am confused!

Were they lying when they put all that in the history books about North America being opened up by:-

Germans, Englishmen, Irishmen, Poles, Swedes, Russians, French, Chinese, Spanish, Italians, Sicilians, etc. etc.

And you are worried about Mexicans because....?

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 02:39 PM

I guess you right Ringslinger.

I shouldn't really have joined in this thread without reading the previous 90+ posts. I complain when other people do it on my threads. So I am going out for a Curry and I wish you well.

L in C

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 01:35 PM

No, no strategy, but paying for 30 years of Reaganomics will probably keep people from consuming as much over the course of the next few years.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 12:46 PM

Well Ringslinger, a truer word had seldom been said but I'm not sure I see much of a strategy so far - what do you think?

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 12:39 PM

Yes well, it's a good time to cut down, I'd say!

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 12:32 PM

You live in a country that is rich in natural resources and you have used them rather a lot. That's it really.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 10:31 AM

Well, I guess if we've concluded that everybody in North America is an immigrant, it only makes sense that we began to start to protect the borders once we concluded that we already had to many people, and were rapidly devouring the resources.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 08:13 AM

No I have probably got that wrong. I understand that people may have traveled from Asia around the coast in some kind of boats / canoes maybe?

Cheers

Les

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 03:50 AM

Because almost nobody believes that a large collection of people lived in North America before people came across the SIB. However when they did arrive they exterminated a lot of big creatures,

Cheers

Les

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 04:10 PM

Les - Why not include the folks who arrived on the Siberian Ice Bridge and crowed out Kennewick Man while you're at it?

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 03:28 PM

Riginslinger

"And if we're lucky, this legislation will include some kind of language that will direct these jobs to legal American citizens, with strict sanctions for managers found in violation."

the real problem is all those people who arrived after 1492

Best wishes

L in C

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 09:53 PM

If we're lucky, the Democrats and the Republicans can get together long enough to pass an Economic Recovery Act. Hopefully, there will be jobs in the act for people, much like the jobs that were generated in the legislation that was passed under FDR during the the Great Depression--not to be confussed with the last depression that was caused by whoever was running Ronald Reagan.
                   And if we're lucky, this legislation will include some kind of language that will direct these jobs to legal American citizens, with strict sanctions for managers found in violation.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 10:14 PM

I don't know. The Latinos just seemed to want to jump in the middle of it. Probably because they're always taking it in the shorts for being in the country illegally, but if you're related to a sitting senator, you not only get to stay, buy you're rewarded with public housing to boot.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Ebbie
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 10:04 AM

Latinos for Reform (LFR) called on Senator Barack Obama to come clean with the American people, and particularly with the Latino community ...

Why the Latino community, particularly?

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 06:21 AM

Once Again Senator Obama Needs to Come Clean with the Latino Community:


Contact: Robert Deposada, Latinos for Reform, [phone]


WASHINGTON, Nov. 1 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ -- Latinos for Reform (LFR) called on Senator Barack Obama to come clean with the American people, and particularly with the Latino community regarding the issue of his aunt, who has been in the U.S. illegally for four years now.


"We have no doubts that Senator Obama is once again hiding the truth from the American people when it comes to the story of his aunt," said LFR Chairman Robert Deposada. "For crying out loud, everyone would agree that when people in other countries have relatives in government, it is a common practice to contact them for assistance when they have a problem. She knew she had a powerful Senator as her nephew, considering that she attended his swearing-in ceremony in the Senate. And this was not a traffic ticket we're talking about. She was ordered to leave the country by an immigration judge. So you can rest assure that she did contact him."


"Senator Obama must come clean about his knowledge of her illegal status," Deposada added. "This situation makes us question why he remained so quiet during the immigration debate in the Senate and why he supported all the poison pills to kill the bipartisan legislation introduced last year in the U.S. Senate. He should have put his personal interest aside and help address the issue of comprehensive immigration reform."


SOURCE Latinos for Reform

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 09:35 PM

I guess it all comes down to people believing, or not, whether he didn't know.

At this moment, I can't tell you what any of my family members other than my wife are up to. Hell, I don't even know exactly where more than a couple of 'em live. Every one of them could be breaking the law in some fashion for all I know and I would be totally ignorant of it. Why should I expect Obama to be any more aware than I am about what members of his extended family are doing?

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 09:17 PM

It seems much more likely he didn't know. Why should he have known, after all?

I rather suspect that it would have been easy enough to sort out some way of sorting this out, if he had known.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Big Mick
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 09:15 PM

What he wants is for Obama to not be elected. He cannot dissuade folks by his brilliant intellectual and economic arguments, so he reverts to the weapon of the uninformed and the ignorant, namely using innuendo, falsehoods, and half truths. I don't blame him as his mentors, Grampy McSwain and Caribou Barbie, are doing the same.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 09:08 PM

I guess it all comes down to people believing, or not, whether he didn't know.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Ebbie
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 09:07 PM

Ah, but you see, Rig is just protecting the nation. Obama's aunt, for all we know, is a cat burglar or is out dealing drugs or using her trusty acetyline cannister on stolen cars. One cannot be too careful with these furriners.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 09:03 PM

True, it's an immigration matter. But, as such, it has no more relevance to the campaign than the hundreds of other immigration violations the INS investigates every day. That this particular violator was related to Obama is coincidental and irrelevant. Obama has already said she should be treated the same as any other violator.   What more do you want?

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 08:34 PM

It looks to me like it's an immigration matter, and not a family matter at all.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 07:26 PM

If Barrack Obama knew what every member of his extended family was up to at all times, he wouldn't be needing to run for President. He'd already be God.

If he helped his aunt stay in the country illegally or if his campaign took money from her while knowing she was a foreign national, this would be an issue. But there's no evidence that either occurred, so it's irrelevant. That she happens to be related to him is coincidental.

Even the McCain campaign is calling this a family matter and leaving it alone. Take a clue from them.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Barry Finn
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 06:36 PM

Rig, you can't even prove that Obama had anything to do with this, as much as you can prove that you didn't.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Ebbie
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 06:30 PM

That's right. Rig, how did you get to know so much about all these guys? Just who are your associates?

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 06:09 PM

Prove it.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 05:10 PM

Ebbie - I had nothing to do with Obama's relative being in the country illegally.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Ebbie
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 04:54 PM

"Plus, you've got to wonder why people keep putting those "steaming piles" out there in the first place, in this case another one of Obama's relatives."

I agree, Rig. Why do you do it?

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 04:50 PM

Everyone hopes the American public doesn't make a terrible terible mistake. Fortunately at the moment it looks as if they probably aren't going to. Touch wood.

God preserve us all from the vicious small minded people who crop up at times like this.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 02:04 PM

Just trying to keep the American public from making a terrible, terrible mistake.

                Plus, you've got to wonder why people keep putting those "steaming piles" out there in the first place, in this case another one of Obama's relatives.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Ebbie
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 01:15 PM

By "feeding sparrow", Rig, I was recognizing your predictability. Ya know, the fresh, steaming pile? I knew you would be the first on this bit of news.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 01:15 PM

the entire story

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 01:04 PM

Great! After he's elected he can personally escort her out of the country.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 12:56 PM

It will be one more thing the Desperate McCan't and 'Spalin' will try to use, but it will do them no good. Here is further response:

CHICAGO (AP) — Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama says he didn't know that one of his relatives was living in the United States illegally and believes the appropriate laws should be followed.

The Associated Press found that Obama's aunt had been instructed to leave the country four years ago by an immigration judge who rejected her request for asylum from her native Kenya. The woman, Zeituni Onyango (zay-TUHN on-YANG-oh), is living in public housing in Boston and is the half-sister of Obama's late father.

A statement given to the AP by Obama's campaign Saturday says, "Senator Obama has no knowledge of her status but obviously believes that any and all appropriate laws be followed."

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 12:53 PM

A feeding sparrow?

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 12:48 PM

That post, Rig, is barely relevant to the general discussion of 4 years ago. You are frantically seeking ANY pretext to smear Obama and his candidacy with insinuations that HE is somehow responsible for everything you might object to.

   If there is an immigration violation in this case, OR a matter of a few $$$ donations, it can be handled without using it as a bludgeon against Obama.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Ebbie
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 11:18 AM

You are as reliable as a feeding sparrow, Rig. ^g&

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Riginslinger
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 10:36 AM

WASHINGTON – Barack Obama's aunt, a Kenyan woman who has been quietly living in public housing in Boston, is in the United States illegally after an immigration judge rejected her request for asylum four years ago, The Associated Press has learned.

According to Federal Election Commission documents filed by the Obama campaign, Onyango has contributed $260 to Obama over a period of time. Under federal election law, only U.S. citizens or green-card holders are legally permitted to give money to campaigns. Onyango, who listed her employer as the Boston Housing Authority, gave in small increments to the Obama campaign. Her latest contribution was $5 on Sept. 19.

Boston Mayor Thomas Menino said Saturday that he had no idea how Onyango might have qualified for public housing with a standing deportation order. He said he's not involved in the operations of the agency, even though he appoints the head, because it runs mainly on federal and state dollars.

William McGonagle, deputy director of the Boston Housing Authority, said when contacted: "I know nothing about it and I've got no comment."

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Bill D
Date: 28 Oct 04 - 11:29 PM

*grin*...it isn't rational, Kevin....I have in all my life, NEVER heard a Portugese speaker offer an opinion.....and since we get very few Brazilian immigrants, they are not speaking out on the matter. But I suppose 'if' a Brazilian were to settle here, he'd probably be classified as 'latino' for convenience sake. (our convenience, not his) Italian-Americans consider themselves a separate group, mostly....certainly no one around here would mean to include Italians as Latinos....the term is 97.2714% reserved for Spanish speakers from Mexico, Cuba, Puerto Rico, Dominican Republic & Central America

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Oct 04 - 07:01 PM

I'd assumed that Latino was to take account of Portuguese speakers.   Wouldn't people from Brazil count as "Latino"?

And I'd have rather thought that Italian Americans would object to not being included in the term, since it was Italians developed Latin and exported it to Spain. And Spanish and Italian are still remarkably similar languages.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Ebbie
Date: 28 Oct 04 - 12:02 AM

Something that struck me anew last winter may not be familiar to everyone. You know those WALK figures we are all familiar with at street corners or those yellow PEDESTRIAN CROSSING signs? Well, at the US border and for some miles up into California there are cautioning freeway signs depicting fleeing people, a jarring reminder of desperation.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Bill D
Date: 27 Oct 04 - 06:39 PM

it seems that 'Latino' is the preferred term chose BY the majority of the Spanish speaking citizens lately, rather than Hispanic or a couple of other terms.

dianavan...I would not be surprised to see a number of startling Bush policies if he gets to play for 4 more years. He lives in Texas, and had a term as Governor to decide that cheap labor and grateful Latinos would help his cause...along with exporting many American jobs. I do NOT understand his reasoning, but he pushes onward with strange ploicies.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 Oct 04 - 07:14 AM

Isn't it strange how language works? "Lingua franca" is the Latin for the French language, but in English it doesn't mean that; and when Americans talk about "Latinos" that apparently doesn't include Italians.

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: dianavan
Date: 27 Oct 04 - 12:26 AM

Bill D - You have certainly thought this through. Sound reasoning too, I'd say.

I just heard that Bush has an immigration policy on hold until after the election. If elected he is going to flood the U.S. with immigrants who will work for very low wages. Looks like you should investigate this rumour because if what you say is true, all hell will break loose stateside.

It would be just like Bush to flood the country with immigrants and fail to provide the support systems required for successful inclusion. Sounds like more conflict ahead if Bush gets in.

d

Subject: RE: BS: Illegal Immigration
From: Bill D
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 09:53 PM

it is possible that certain states will deal with larger Latino populations long before others will. It is one of the things that makes the United STATES a tricky way to run a country. We are constantly debating what things individual states should have final say over, and what should be regulated by the Federal government. That leads to strange conflicts like the current one about the serial snipers being tried in the DC area. Three different states and the District of Columbia, with differing approaches to punishment, are all wanting to try these guys, and it took months just to decide who got first chance.

It also leads to women in one state sneaking over to another for abortions, and smuggling of cigarettes, and driving over the border for better bargains on alcohol.

So...Texas may need to deal with Mexican immegrants, legal and illegal, but Louisana, just to the east, may not like ANY compromise, given the large Acadian-French (Cajun) speaking population....and both those states have serious attitudes about 'their' culture. You can barely imagine what the Swedish/German/Norwegian areas in Minnesota or Wisconsin would have to say if they were informed that their kids MUST learn Spanish.

I can't tell you what will happen in 20-40-80 years, as much demographic change will depend on politics and the world situation as regards oil and religion..etc..but I think that the only way that 'might' prevent serious conflict (at least in the US) is to encourage keeping one's ethnic heritage alive, while insisting that immigrants and communities adapt to the lingua franca of the country, as defined by National commerce, business and the media. This would (IMHO) allow the best opportunity for advancement and integration that are necessary to compete in a complex society.