Why shout 'MacIntire'? - Old Dun Cow

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: Waddon Pete
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 03:19 PM

...are you sure you are not using modern day vernacular to explain a problem that doesn't exist?

Harry was born and raised in Camberwell. One of the pubs on the Old Kent Road was the Dun Cow. I can remember it being there. It is now a doctor's surgery. He was noted as being inspired by the things around him to write his songs, so maybe the pub did actually have a fire and that gave him the idea!

Let Mcintyre be whoever you want him to be. Harry left no clue in the words he wrote. Like all songs that have become popular around the world, many extra verses, characters and tweaks have been added.

I bet Harry would chuckle at this thread!

Best wishes,

Peter

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: Gurney
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 03:19 PM

Shouted TO McIntyre. McIntyre was nearest to the cellar door.
I almost wrote 'nearest the cellar door' which also lacks the TO.

I first heard the extra shout at a Liverpool Spinners concert.

Works for me.

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: The Sandman
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 02:12 PM

maybe we should change the words to.
dont let em im in till its all mopped up,so..... shouted mcintyre

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: Phil Edwards
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 01:39 PM

I think Seamus has nailed it. One of the other Mudcat threads about this song quotes the later verses, which show that McIntyre was one of the firemen. The "McIntyre!" call and response probably started as a deliberate misreading of an awkwardly-written line (the "somebody" comes after a definite pause, so it's easy to hear it as "somebody shouted 'McIntyre'", not "...somebody,' shouted McIntyre"). Ill-behaved audiences can be heard to interject irreverent comments to this day, as I discovered the first time I did Pleasant and Delightful.

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 01:31 PM

"Don't let them in till it's all mopped up, somebody." shouted McIntyre.

In other words McIntyre wanted the door barred until all the lads could finish guzzling the beer.

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: Waddon Pete
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 01:24 PM

The song was written by Harry Wincott.

You can read all about him here

I don't think there was a London Beer called McIntyre's. It was customary to put the word 'entire' after a brewer's name, however.

As in Nalder& Collyer's Entire....entire being a style of Porter or light stout (originally 6.6 abv!)

But it is doubtful whether this has anything to do with anything!

I guess Harry used the name because it fitted the song and rhymed with fire!

Best wishes,

Peter

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: The Sandman
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 12:55 PM

well its better than shouting rhubarb

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: Old Roger
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 11:20 AM

McIntire's was a brand of beer. The shout was one of excitement and exultation at the discovery of this treasure in the cellar. That's why folk shout it out now. It's in the spirit of the song.

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 10:19 AM

"Why shout 'MacIntyre'?"

Why indeed?

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: Declan
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 10:01 AM

Because they are the words of the song. There doesn't have to be a reason for everything. Some things are just meant to be nonsensical.

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 09:44 AM

... or perhaps it means that it might have been MacIntyre who shouted, but the narrator isn't sure: so it would be punctuated, "Someone shouted ~~ MacIntyre?"

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: John J
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 08:33 AM

Or perhaps it was his round next?

JJ

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: s&r
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 07:38 AM

Read somewhere that shouting fire in a pub was illegal if there was no fire - hence MacIntyre from the audience

Stu

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: Charley Noble
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 07:35 AM

Steve-

If you plow through all the old threads on this question, I believe you'll find the suggestion that the fire chief's name was "MacIntyre."

Works for me, and it does rhyme.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: JHW
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 07:33 AM

Mackeson doesn't rhyme with fire

Subject: Why shout 'MacIntire'?
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 07:25 AM

... or Mcintyre or however you want to spell it. I have a very vague recollection of asking this before, but nothing comes up on the mudcat search (or google), so ...
Most of us will recognise it from 'When the Old Dun Cow caught fire', and I guess it was a well-known catchphrase when the song was written. When I was a lad (50s, 60s) there was a string of adverts in the UK for Mackeson stout, where two bottles of stout (and I kid you not) would be boxing, running a race, or otherwise competing; one would drop behind/down/out until a bottle in the crowd yelled 'Mackeson!' and the loser would come back to life and win. It's tempting to think there's a connection here, that one came from the other.
Any ideas?