BS: You Brits have gone too far

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 03 Sep 02 - 03:42 PM

They should include a few fly cemeteries in the All Day Breakfast so that one can tell the morning meal from the evening.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,patjoe
Date: 03 Sep 02 - 02:41 PM

Nigel

I can just imagine having All Day Breakfast three times a day.

For those that don't know, HP sells a concoction of beans chopped scrambled eggs, fried bread, tomatoes and bacon in a tin called All Day Breakfast. Yummy!

Pat

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 02 Sep 02 - 11:42 PM

G'day leeneia,

So, Bullfrog, how do you tell "cemetery" from "symmetry?"

Err ... (since Bullfrog has not given the obvious answer) ... by the pronunciation ... ? (Unless you happen to come from New Zealand!)

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 30 Aug 02 - 11:50 PM

Thanks for the recipes, Penny S. I'm going to print them out and cook them.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Walrus at work
Date: 30 Aug 02 - 08:29 AM

Penny,

"...We also had facecream pudding, which was cornflour pudding (aka custard), thick and lumpy, coloured a delicate underwear or face cream pink, and flavoured with.....something..."

When we were served the same stuff at school, the kitchen staff called it "blancmange" - we just called it "pink sick" (the falvouring was supposed to be strawberry or raspberry - or something similar).

Walrus

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Penny S.
Date: 30 Aug 02 - 05:17 AM

Health and safety update. If using fresh meat, it must be fully cooked first, with the onions and the gravy. Beef takes longer than lamb.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Penny S.
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 05:38 PM

Shepherd's pie, in my Mum's way - ie authentic. When the roast (beef or lamb or mutton - remeber mutton?) has got down to a quantity that, minced, will half fill your pie dish, mince it, and toss in seasoned flour. Chop and brown a middling onion. Add the mince. Also add some gravy, made, in our house, with an Oxo cube. Add it a bit at a time, to give the right sort of texture - there should be runny stuff between the meat, thickened with the flour, but not too much. It should not be thick like a pudding. Put it in the pie dish.

Meanwhile, you need to have boiled enough potatoes that, when mashed, they will fill the top of the pie dish. Or more, if you want to save them for bubble and squeak, or frying for breakfast. They need to be a floury potato, not waxy. When cooked, break them up so there are no lumps, and mix in a good lump of butter. A bit of pepper would be good, too. (The cooking water should have been salted, so salt isn't necessary at this point. Add a little milk, and mix to a good texture - not too stiff and not too runny. Top the meat with it. Then use a fork to make a rough ridged pattern on top.

Bake for about half an hour - about 180 C, I think.

You can modify this any way you like. Use fresh mince instead of left over. Add assorted vegetables. Our school used baked beans, so the tomato sauce contributed the thickening. Marks and Spencer did a variation with mint in with a fresh lamb mince base, topped with a potato and fresh pea mash, which was scrumptious, and has been discontinued. It is a folk recipe, so the way you develop of doing it will be authentic. For you.

If you only have waxy potatoes, you slice them after cooking, and then arrange them on the meat like roof tiles or shingles. That is not shepherd's pie. That was what my Mum called cottage pie. She came from the Wealden part of East Sussex, and cooked after the manner of her mother.

In the Depression, she told me, her mother served up what she called "hasty pudding" - there are other versions of what follows. Boil water with some flour and sugar in a saucepan. This is improved by using milk, or not using it at all.

In our school, tapioca was frogspawn. We also had facecream pudding, which was cornflour pudding (aka custard), thick and lumpy, coloured a delicate underwear or face cream pink, and flavoured with.....something. Not horrendously unpleasant, but not something one would seek out from specialist shops in later life. We also had dry fly pie. A pastry case filled with currants, coconut and syrup, and topped with more pastry.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Greyeyes
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 02:44 PM

Alternatively, to eat well in England, learn to cook.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 06:31 AM

My favourite food quote was from a French gastronome, who said "To eat well in England, Have breakfast three times a day". I must say I agree.

Nigel

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 05:57 AM

Cemeteries are rarely symmetrical, many gravestones having a pronounced list (pronounced 'l-i-s-t').
BJ

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 12:11 AM

So, Bullfrog, how do you tell "cemetery" from "symmetry?"

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 28 Aug 02 - 09:36 AM

That's three syllables as opposed to four, Blackcatter, cem-e-terr-y, which seems to be the way some of our friends above want to pronounce it.

BJ

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 28 Aug 02 - 03:20 AM

Dead man's eye was semolina in our school... the tapioca had a different consistency, so got it's name.....

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 11:32 PM

Diner Counter Lingo Glossary (albeit incomplete)

Adam and Eve on a raft Two poached eggs on toast.
Adam and Eve on a raft & wreck 'em Two scrambled eggs on toast.
Adam's ale Plain water.
axle grease or skid grease Butter.
baby, moo juice, Sweet Alice or cow juice Milk.
belch water Seltzer or soda water.
birdseed Cereal.
blue-plate special A dish of meat, potato, and vegetable served on a plate (usually blue).
Bossy in a bowl Beef stew, so called because "Bossy" was a common name for a cow.
bowl of red A bowl of chili con carne, so called for its deep red color.
bowwow A hot dog.
breath An onion.
bridge or bridge party Four of anything, so called from the card-game Bridge.
bullets Also called "whistleberries" or "Saturday nights." Baked beans, so called because of the flatulence they cause.
bun pup A hot dog.
burn one Put a hamburger on the grill.
burn the British A toasted English muffin.
cat's eyes or fish eyes Tapioca.
China Rice pudding.
chopper A table knife.
city juice Water.
clean up the kitchen Hash or hamburger.
Coney Island chicken or Coney Island A hot dog, so called because hot dogs were popularly associated with the Coney Island stands at which they were sold.
cowboy A western omelet or sandwich.
cow feed A salad
creep Draft beer.
crowd Three of anything (From the old saying, "Two's company, three's a crowd").
deadeye Poached egg.
dog and maggot Cracker and cheese.
dog biscuit Cracker.
dog's body A pudding of pea soup and flour or hardtack. dough well done with cow to cover Buttered toast.
draw one Coffee.
eighty-six (86) "Do not sell to that customer" or "The kitchen is out of the item ordered." Perhaps from the practice at Chumley's Restaurant in New York City of throwing rowdy customers out the back door, which is No. 86 Bedford Street. The term certainly predates its first appearance in print circa 1967.
Eve with a lid on Apple pie, referring to the biblical Eve's tempting apple and to the crust that covers it.
fifty-five A glass of root beer.
first lady Spareribs, a pun on Eve's being made from Adam's spare rib.
fly cake or roach cake A raisin cake or huckleberry pie.
Frenchman's delight Pea soup.
GAC Grilled American cheese sandwich. This was also called "jack" (from the pronunciation of "GAC"); a "Jack Benny" (after a radio comedian) was cheese with bacon.
gentleman will take a chance Hash.
go for a walk An order to be packed and taken out.
gravel train Sugar bowl.
graveyard stew Milk toast.
groundhog Hot dog.
hemorrhage Ketchup.
high and dry A plain sandwich without butter, mayonnaise, or lettuce.
houseboat A banana split, made with ice cream and bananas.
in the alley Serve as a side dish.
Irish turkey Corned beef and cabbage.
java or joe Coffee.
looseners Prunes, so called because of their laxative effect.
lumber A toothpick.
maiden's delight Cherries
Mike and Ike or the twins Salt and pepper shakers.
Mud or murk Black coffee.
Murphy Potatoes, so called because of their association with the Irish.
Noah's boy A slice of ham, because Ham was Noah's second son.
no cow Without milk.
on the hoof Meat done rare.
on wheels An order to be packed and taken out.
pair of drawers Two cups of coffee.
Pittsburgh Toast or something burning, so called because of the smokestacks evident in Pittsburgh, a coal-producing and steel-mill city. In meat cookery, this refers to a piece of meat charred on the outside while still red within.
put out the lights and cry Liver and onions.
radio A tuna-fish-salad sandwich on toast punning on "tuna down," which sounds like "turn it down," as one would the radio knob.
sand Sugar.
sea dust Salt.
sinkers and suds Doughnuts and coffee.
Vermont Maple syrup, because maple syrup comes primarily from Vermont.
warts Olives.
wreath Cabbage.
wreck 'em Scramble the eggs.
yum-yum Sugar.
zeppelins in a fog Sausages in mashed potatoes.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 11:10 PM

"round our way, 'cemetery'is a three-syllable word with the accent on the first syllable."

Is it pronnounced differently in other places? I've been trying, but it's pretty difficult to knock it down to just two syllables. Certainly, it can be done, but it doesn't sound that much different.

Walrus - too true, too true.

And lest you all think I'm brilliant, the Buddhist Hamburger line comes from Spider Robinson an SF writer of whom I've had the fortune to get drunk in the presence (or something like that....)

I still haven;t been aboe to think of weird American names for food. The only thing that comes to mind is "diner speak" the alternate terms for meals used at the great American diner. "Adam & Eve on a raft & wreck 'em" would mean scrambled eggs on toast.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 08:04 PM

Liz, round our way your tapioca with a lump of jam in the middle was called 'dead man's eye'. And Leeneia, round our way, 'cemetery'is a three-syllable word with the accent on the first syllable.

BJ

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Mr Happy
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 01:03 PM

'just give i boiled parsnips, an' a gerrt dish o' taties, an' a lump o' fatty bacon, an' a pint o' good ale!!'

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Walrus at work
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 08:36 AM

Swan,

A local Indian owned corner shop near me was, at one time, selling "Bread Pakora"

Blackcatter,

If you try one of those Buddhist Hamburgers, make sure you have the right money, because the propriator doesn't give change after all "...all change must come from within..."

Walrus

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 12:00 AM

Did you hear about the South-East Asian bar? Thai-One-On

The Mexican soul food joint? Nacho Mama's

How about the Buddhist Hamburger Stand where they can make you one with everything.

Not food names (or info about cemetery either), but It's my bedtime...

pax yall

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 11:21 PM

Surprised no one has mentioned dingle berry pie

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 10:49 PM

That must be why our church's latest cookbook had a recipe for Tex-Mex Won Ton.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Roughyed
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 07:15 PM

In Oldham where I now live a muffin is a dense white bread barmcake/roll cooked on the oven bottom which forms an integral part of the local delicacy, a chip muffin. The most encouraging thing I have seen for a long while is the food available in a local asian takeaway which is a samosa muffin. Multiculturalism is here whether you like it or not!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 11:18 PM

This time I had to look up a derivation. I was sure "slumgullion" would be a corruption of an Irish or perhaps Indian word, but no. There is no derivation, which must mean that somebody just made it up. And, it originally referred to insipid drink, such as weak tea.

Just goes to show how strongly people felt about their tea.

As for "skink", it's either a kind of lizard which lives in warm, sandy regions or a verb meaning "to draw, pour out or serve." Either sense seems baffling.

Maybe somebody should inform Cullen that "Cullen" comes from the Gaelic for holly.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: artbrooks
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 12:37 PM

This is Jenn, called "herself" by Art (what airs!). I don't get to use the computer much, but I have really enjoyed reading this thread (from the get-go). On the American side, how about "hangtown fry"? And we ate a lot of slumgullion when we were younger and poorer. And there was Finnan Haddie--some kind of smoked fish, not easy to find here--it was poached and eaten absolutely drowned in melted butter--yumm.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: artbrooks
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 10:32 AM

Thanks for the book reference, Wotcha.

Rocky Mountain Oysters are, of course, what's left over when you make a male calf into a steer. Not bad, with lots of hot sauce, and they go well with a main course of grilled fillet of rattlesnake.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Walrus
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 05:09 AM

Go back in time and some of the names get worse.
I seem to recall that Grosse[1] mentions the "Four Turd" supper, consisting pig's trotter, pig's nose and pork chittlings - the name comes from "tread turd" (trotters), "stir turd" (snout), "hold turd" (chittlings) and mus-turd.

Walrus

[1] I can't confirm, because I STILL can't find my copy.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: zonahobo
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 04:26 AM

Here's a good ol merican one. Rocky Mountain Oysters .. course there's no oysters near the Rockies .. had a meal of calve lights in Austria recently and was quite enjoying it when I asked the waiter what it was and he sort of coughed and struck his chest .. I asked again and got roughly the same response .. Finally he said something like lunge .. oh .. lungs .. gulp ..

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Wavestar
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 01:47 AM

Jimmy C - In St Andrews, across the country, they do indeed deep fat fry both Mars Bars and pizza, including haggis pizza. Just come on down the the Kinness Fry Bar...

-J

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Wotcha
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 09:54 PM

sorry, forgot to reset the cookie ... Guest ... Wotcha.
Cheers,
Brian

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 09:49 PM

Artbrooks: the gastronomic companion to Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey/Maturin novels is "Lobscouse & Spotted Dog," authored by Anned Grossman and Lisa Thomas (W.W. Norton & Company 1997). This fine cookbook lists such wonders as Pig's Fry, Sucking Pig, Frumenty, Jam Roly-Poly, Bashed Neeps (or Neeps Hackit with Balmagowry), not to mention Treacle Dowdy and Figgy Dowdy, there's also Plum-Duff, Dog's Nose, Floating Archipelago, Whipt Syllabub, and the ever tasty Forcemeat Balls ...
Surprised nobody has mentioned Jam, Chip, or mushy pea butties ...
and for us 'Mericans ... Moon Pies ...
Meanwhile back to dessert and Goosebery Fool or Quaking Pudding ...
Cheers,
Brian

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 08:19 PM

Hi Kitty, welcome along to the gourmet thread. Are you sure about the Woolton pie remark? *BG* Myself I'm too young to remember lots of things, like "what did I go upstairs for?" You know what the TOGS sweater says; "Do I come here often?"
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 06:06 PM

Dead Man's Leg is another one.

Going to the other extreme, there are Nice Biscuits.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: RolyH
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 05:42 PM

The road signs say

'Welcome to Cullen , Home of "Cullen Skink" '

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: RolyH
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 05:35 PM

I was in Cullen earlier this week (working!)and had Cullen Skink

It is nectar from the Gods!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 04:57 PM

I've only just caught up with this, and have read carefully through, and seen the names of several dishes that I remember from school dinners. But, amazingly, no mention of spam fritters. Luckily I'm too young to remember Woolton pie.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 10:09 AM

Cullen Skink Recipe

Ingredients
12oz smoked haddock
1 onion, peeled and chopped
1.5pt boiling water
1pt milk
1.5lb potatoes, peeled and chopped
0.5oz butter
salt
pepper
finely chopped parsley for garnish

Method
Place the haddock in a large pan and pour the boiling water over it. Bring back to the boil and add the chopped onion. Cover and simmer until the haddock is tender. Allow to cool a little. Drain off and keep the liquid. Carefully remove and discard any bones in the fish. Put the fish onto a plate and put into the fridge. Add the milk to the fish liquid, cover and simmer for an hour. Meanwhile, cook the potatoes in a separate saucepan until soft. Drain and mash. Remove the fish and milk liquid from the heat and add the potatoes and flaked fish (check again for bones). stir the soup with a wooden spoon and season to taste. Add the butter and reheat gently.
Garnish with parsley.

Cullen is a small fishing village in the north east of Scotland. I have no idea of the etymology of skink though.
With regard to Bloaters, these are English in origin, we Scots have our own superior version called an Arbroath Smokie. This is a hot smoked haddock, and is delicious eaten hot or cold.
Failte.....Giok

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 09:39 AM

Ah, British dog's breakfast = American mishmash.

I knew that someone would have to give the derivation of cemetery. It just wouldn't be the Mudcat without it.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 11:38 PM

Hi all,

Cemetery was first used in the 14th century by Greek Christian writers. In comes via the late Latin coemeterium from the Greek koimeterion which oroginally meant dormitory (as said above). It was a derivative of the verb koiman 'put to sleep'. The Greek Christian writers used it to mean burial ground, but in a euphimisic sense. It is probably tied to the Book of Revelations discussion of the dead rising from their graves (sort of sleeping). In the early 19th century, when the modern cemeteries in Paris and London were being established - large areas, with meadows, streams, etc. the term began being used for them. It later became part of the official terms used by the developing funeral industry. Other words: "funeral director" instead of undertaker (although today many of them like the term "grief counselor" as well, "casket" instead of coffin, "Client" instead of cadaver or corpse, "cremains" instead of ashes - cremated + remains = cremains.

pax yall

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Greyeyes
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 03:07 PM

Cullen Skink. Don't know the actual meaning or derivation, but it's a delicious smoked haddock & potato soup.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Trevor
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 09:46 AM

A dog's breakfast where I come from is any kind of mess, tangle or disorganisation. Dog's bo****ks, on the other hand (if you see what I mean!) for some reason means the best, the zenith, the absolutely absolutely, erm, dogs bo****ks!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 05:51 AM

Liz, I never elucidate in public.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Raedwulf
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 05:41 AM

A Bloater is a salted & lightly smoked herring. Hence bloater paste is fish paste (much like pate, etc, only different... ;) ).

As to to cemetery (since someone sort of asked!), it derives via MidEng & Latin from the Greek for 'dormitory', itself derived from a word meaning 'put to sleep'. My OED is of the opinion that cemetery is more often used for a graveyard not attached to a church.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 04:42 AM

I have not yet heard of the creative imagination being applied to the two delicacies you mention. Perhaps there is a challenge here?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Jimmy C
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 01:46 AM

Moleskin Joe, I hear they deep fry pizza slices and also Mars bars in Glasgow - is this true ?. If so what are they called ?.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 11:48 PM

Sure, there's good English food, just as there's good American food. Just don't expect it at a fast food place or a John Menzies which is geared to getting people recharged and on their way promptly.

This thread didn't start talking about food per se, but food names.

After supper I was looking at a book of Scottish recipes. How does "bloater paste" grab you? Of course, I don't suppose it was meant to be ironic, like some names, but nonetheless...

By the way, what's a dog's breakfast?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Moleskin Joe
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 09:29 AM

If you come to Glasgow you will be able to get a really offensive delicacy - a darkie's walloper.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Trevor
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 08:46 AM

Yeah, but swede and parsnips...........'scuse me while I heave at the thought of it (as mentioned on another thread)

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 01:58 AM

Whoever says English cuisine is bland has never tried mediaeval English cuisine. Neither have they been eating in the right restaurants!

As wth many things, the English cuisine depends on subtlety and contrast rather than all out grab you by the throat and overload your senses.... One of the best fragrances in the world is the smell of a good thick juicy stew simmering on the stove at the end of a long cold day.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 01:21 AM

Hi all,

Cemetary seems to be a fairly new "alternate" spelling. I operate cemetery tours in Orlando, FL and several people have actually tried to correct my spelling. I looked in a new unabridged disctionary, and the spelling with an "a" is not in there.

I think it's odd that Americans don't like kidneys but usually consider liver ok - at least we used to. Seeing that a kidney just stores waste material prior, while a live actually collects bad stuff and holds on to it.

Art - don't forget about "not" dogs - tofu hot dogs.

Also - early on I mentioned that it was ironic that English food is the one cuisine I know of that has unappetising names - I assume that after 117 posts that most will understand the souce of that irony - English food has a reputation to be bland and not very good. I do not hold to this position - the best bowl (4 actually) of soup I have ever had was a cream of broccoli in a pub in the town of Broadway south of Stratford. There are few gastronomic events I have had that compare with how good that soup was. And it cost 1 pound for each bowl and came with as much homemade bread as I could eat. I had a Icelandic lobster bisque that was remarkable too, but the richness of lobster is almost unfair to compare to the humble broccoli.

pax yall, I'm going to go eat.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Coyote Breath
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 09:28 PM

Being of Cornish descent (on mom's side, from Gweek and near the Tolvan Cross) I have had many a pasty. In fact just had one tonight made with venison and peas and no rutabegas (sp?) potato instead, prefer them to rotarooters, my sister lives up in the Grass Valley, Nevada City area of California, many old hard rock miners from Cornwall set the areas kitchens aright with home style cooking but Pan Haggelty I've never heard of. My mom used to have a saying: "By tre, pol or penn, shall ye know the Cornishmen" her name was Moyle, they were either plantationed out of Ireland or were "soupers" cause she came from a long line of Methodists.

CB