BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 08:43 PM

Why Vegas. Talk about transcient. 75% of the folks that are tghere tonight won't be there next week at this time! It's a tourist town, fir gosh sakes!

Well, one thing that will happen if the Expo's come to D.C., they'll be a better team than BValtimore in no time at all. Baltimore is like any other monopoly in that it has no incentive to be good and therefore....isn't... Oh sure, they make their trademark August run before they throw in the towell in September. Now that's boring, Rap...

And as fir this idea that Baltimore and Wsahington are the same market. Well, sure, but if yer gonna go to an O's game from DC ya better leave 3 hours before the game and you won't get home to midnight...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 04:46 PM

I like the idea of Vegas, but I think baseball would be nervous having a team there considering their history with gambling. Pete Rose for manager??

I do not hear anyone mentioning Mexico, which I believe is still another strong contender.

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Once Famous
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 04:38 PM

I humbly am corrected. Baseball in Washington has had 2 chances. time for a Las Vegas team.

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: PoppaGator
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 04:18 PM

Baltimore and Washington are essentially the same metropolitan area these days. Years ago, most cities that had big league teams had two, one in each league, but those days are long gone. Only New York, Chicago, and LA/Anaheim seem able to support two teams these days, plus the Bay Area -- which, as noted above, has had its problems. Without that really beautiful new stadium for the Giants (my once-beloved Jints), they and the A's would probably be hurting.

At least the AL Orioles and the tranplanted NL Expos would represent the two leagues.

As I understand it, there are two competing groups, one in DC proper and one in Northern Virginia, bidding for the Expos. Seems to me that the Virginia suburbs might stand a better chance of surviving in the same market with the Orioles, just because their stadium would be a little further away from Baltimore than one within the district.

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 01:34 PM

As a baseball fan, I would love to see at team in DC. As a realist, with a minimal sense of business, I think MLB would be foolish to put a team in the area.

Baltimore has a legitmate concern in my opinion. If I bought a McDonalds franchise and then discovered that McDonalds sold another franchise across the street, I would be worried. I would also question the thought of the corporation for granting such a franchise.

Baseball is the same. 40 miles is not that far, especially when the fan base is mobile.   I also wonder what kind of fan base can be built.   Sure, there are many people who remember the Senators fondly, but if they supported the team in the first place they never would have left. Same with the Brooklyn Dodgers. If everyone who claimed they were a Dodger fan went to the games, the attendance would have been through the roof. (There were other factors in play with the Dodgers, including O'Malley's wish to build a new stadium that received little support from the local government.)

Bottom line is, wherever the Expos move will have a tough long term future.   I think baseball is oversaturated and there may be too many teams and too little talent these days.   

A team in Podunk??? No offense, but can you really imagine a road trip to Podunk?

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 01:07 PM

I'd really, really like Washington to have a baseball team again. I really would. But as I noted above, baseball has gotten boring and players, managers, and owners are too preoccupied with money to fix it.

But yeah, I would like DC to have baseball team again.

(For one thing it'd stop the complaining by my relatives-by-marriage.)

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Bill D
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 12:48 PM

Prediction--the Washington area will get another chance, spend a LOT of money, and then in a few years lose it again because there won't be enough attendence to support 81 games unless they are winning.

This town/area has too many transients and federal workers..etc to provide quite enough fan base. I'm sure it will be fine for a year or two, but Basketball, Hockey, and football already eat up the budgets of a lot of the 'sports' fans...

Would I like to be wrong? sure...

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: GUEST,chinmusic
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 12:26 PM

Alas, Bobert, I have to agree with Mr. Olesko on this one. As a ball fan, I can understand your desire to see baseball come back to the DC area, but I also think the main reason that Washington twice lost the Senators, was lack of fan support. It's still very much open to debate, whether the DC area can support two teams. The Bay Area has the Giants and A's, and for years, both clubs struggled with attendance. Since the construction of their new park, the Giants have flourished. I'm not a fan of Mr. Angelos, but I believe he's got a point on this issue. I think the sad story in this sorry mess, has been the way major league baseball has jerked around the Montreal Expos. Yea, their attendance has been awful for years, but the final nail in the coffin came during the infamous strike in the mid 90s, that in essence, doomed the ballclub. Arguably, they had the best team in baseball during that year of the strike, until baseball closed up shop for the rest of the season. More importantly, when original Charles Bronfman sold the Expos, the franchise never recovered. He was a solid owner, and the Expos always had a great farm system, with his hand at the wheel. Since his departure, they've become a farm team for the wealthier franchises. The Montreal fiasco simply illustrates the imbalance between the have, and the have nots, in the game. The Lords of Baseball just don't get it. Olympic Stadium is the worst facility in the majors. In a perfect world, Montreal needed local ownership with deep pockets, that could have provided a new ballpark in the downtown area.
    Being from Toronto, I fear the Blue Jays are headed down a similiar path as the Expos. I really hope that they don't migrate south in the future.

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 09:55 AM

Ouch, Rapster!

Fir folks that ain't had baseball in so long you can bet the farm that folks would be happy to jusr sit in the stadium. watch the players flex, swing bats and play catch. Oh, the sweet smell of the hot dogs, spilled beer and cigar smoke, and a mascot parading around!

We'll take it! And we will come. Heck, thousands of SC'er get in their cars and travel to Baltimore for each home game and Baltimore hasn't had a decent team in 10 years. Yet, we go because we love baseball...

Like I said, if DC get ripped off again, I will be real steamed. Hey, if there was another good market out there it would be different but DC is head and shoulers above the rest of the cities being considered. Richmond already has a team, the Braves, which is a fram team of the Atlanta Braves and they only draw 2000 a game so what makes Bud Selig think that Richmond will put 10,000 in the seats for yer another team?

Pudunk is outta the running because they can't even get the Podunk High players to their own games and frequently play with only 8 or 9 players...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 09:24 AM

Yeah, and frankly, baseball has gotten boring. Before every inning starts they play catch and swing bats for about 15 minutes, warming up to play the game they've been playing. Those mascots spend the time clowning on the field. Fans got get hotdogs and beer.

Bring back the days of Sandy Koufax, Killibrew, and the rest. I can sleep in City Council meetings.

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 11:50 PM

I hope you do get baseball back in DC, but I would not catagorize the first two Senators as having been "stolen". You aren't the only city that had two teams "stolen" anyway.   While Brooklyn is considered by many as a separate city (or even country!!), there were three teams in New York City at one time. We lost the Giants and Dodgers but we gained my beloved Mets. There is another team that still plays in the Bronx. (The team that shall not be named).

It is always about money. It always has been. It is slowly killing the game, and it started over 50 years ago. Walter O'Malley was greedy and convinced Horace Stoneham to join him on the other coast. Even before that the Browns moved out of St. Louis to head to Baltimore, the Athletics moved from Philly to KC, eventually ending up in Oakland. As you mentioned, DC lost two Senator squads.

There would be nothing worse than putting the Expos in DC and the fans not coming out.   Sure, there are plenty of people who moan the fact that there is no baseball in the nations capital. The problem is, the fans did not support the other two teams.   Even Brooklyn, where the Brooklyn Dodger fans still seem to outnumber the Mets and Yank.... oops, I almost said it, the attendance during their final years was pitiful. Even after they won the series in 55, the fans did not come out to Ebbets Field.

It is unfortunate, but the game follows the money. Maybe that is the true national pastime.

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 11:15 PM

Thanks, Ron. I thought it was like that but wasn't 100% so I let it pass...

I do remember taking the bus down to Griffith Stadium in D.C as a kid to take in an occasional double header. I loved Jimmy Persall. Yeah, he was a tad disturbed but very entertaining. Folks would by the $1 tickets and sit out in the outfiled bleachers and mess wid him very game and about half the time he'd end up trying to climb thre fence to get to 'um and the cops would get involved and all.... Great drama...

I also liked Eddie Yost because he was mattied to a woman my mom worker with.

Then it was Harman Killabrew who put a scare into Babe Ruth's homerun record. Man, he could hit 'um. This was before the "lively balls" they got these days when homers weren't as easy to get...

Yeah, sniff, I miss baseball...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 11:02 PM

Typos. The Senators final game was in 1971 and their first game in Texas was 1972.

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 11:00 PM

Wrong Martin. The second Washington Senators did become the Texas Rangers in 1970. The Seattle Pilots were expansion team in 1969 that moved to Milwaukee in 1970. The Expos also joined the league in 1969.

I remember listening to that final Senator game on the radio. They played the Yankees and ended up forfeiting the game when their remaining fans ran onto the field.

As Casey would say "you could look it up".

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 10:54 PM

They could call them the Washington Scalliwags..

Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 10:52 PM

We allready got a stadium, RFK, ready to go next season while a new stadium in either DC or Northern Virgina is built. Podunk, on the other hand, would have 'um playin' at Podunk High...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Once Famous
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 10:29 PM

Wrong Bobert

The second Senators became the Seattle Pilots and then they became the Texas Rangers.

I vote for Podunk, Iowa.

If you build it, they will come.

Subject: BS: Baseball to Washington, D.C.?????
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 10:03 PM

Hey, like what gives? Here the Montreal Expos, which are co-owned by all the teams owners are loosing big bucks and it's way past time to move them. The candidates: Richmond, Va, Podunk, Iowa or the Nation's Capitol, Washington, D.C.

Well, givens D.C.'s solid financial proposals this should be a no brainer except...

...there's a little mobster, Peter Amgelos, who owns the Baltimore Orioles and he's afraid his perennial sucky team will loose it's D.C. fans!

Bud Selig has been draggin' his foot so bad that he's worn off the entire side of his shoe, his sock, the shin and he's down to the bone...

This should be a no brainer.

Heck, D.C. is the only city that has had not one, but two, baseball teams stolen from it. The Senators that became the Minnesota Twins and the Senators (Part 2) who became the Texas Rangers.

Well, my mama told me that life wouldn't always be fair but this absolutely sucks and if Bud Selig knuckles under to Thug Angelos then I'm gonna attempt to bring a suit against the friggin' baseball mobsters...

Anyone want in?

Mad as heck!

Bobert