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BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train
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Subject: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 08:36 AM Obama, it is time. As I said this morning in another thread "what kind of pastor does this to their parishioner???" Wright is a pathetic, celebrity seeking narcissist that will destroy Obama if he doesn't get seriously kicked loose by Obama NOW. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: john f weldon Date: 29 Apr 08 - 08:54 AM Alas, Clergy-kicking does not go down well in the US of A, tempting as may often be. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: pdq Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:02 AM Jeremiah Wright has raised his stature to the level of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton in a matter of a few weeks. They are now the three main voices of African-American people in the entire Western world. They were put there by the US news media because they fit the stereotype the media want. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:12 AM Actually, I don't see many similarities between those three beyond them all being "men of the cloth". Sharpton and Wright do seem to *sort of* be birds of a feather, but Sharpton isn't as extreme as Wright, IMO. I like Sharpton as an untiring advocate for NY's African American community. He has served them extremely well for the most part. Don't forget, Jackson did a fair amount of shuttle foreign diplomacy tricks while running too, which made him look far better than Sharpton or Wright could ever hope to look. Jesse is also a far better orator than the other two, and way smarter. He also paved the way for Obama to run, by embracing that other rainbow coalition (GLBT) during his 1988 campaign. Wright is just an egomaniac who is obviously so jealous of Obama, he has set out to take the man down. Or so it looks to me. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bobert Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:30 AM Well, throwing Jeremiah from the train is perhaps too drastic and could make Obama look like yet "another politican"... Obama is caught in a bad situation but not of his doings... The "lynch mob" mentality of the McMedia is driving this story... Sure, Jeremiah ain't helping much but he isn't hurting that much either... Better to get take a whuppin' now than later... What the media and the Clinton's have effectively done is change the converstaion... Obama has done the dance-of-the-dieing-duck upon request but he isn't initiating this news cycle and nor is Jeremiah, who came into this with motives that have been misunderstood by the white dominated media... White people don't get Jeremiah Wright but they do get the white controlled media and the white Clintons who have effectively turned the race from "a man, who happens to be black, running for presiednt" to "a black man running for president"... This had to happen somewhere along the line and someone like Jeremiah Wright was going to have to take some heat somewhere along the line... That's is the part of institutiional racism that most white folks both ***don't get*** and ***deny***... ("Well, Ralph, I guess I can live with that black guy as president but I think he needs a good whippin' before he takes the oath just to remind him who is really the boss here...) B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:36 AM Yeah ol' Bobert, your hatred of Clinton/Bush blinds you. If you don't get that Wright is a self-inflicted liability, then you have no objectivity left. Last I heard, neither MSM or the Clintons had titled Obama's memoirs "Audacity of Hope". Why should we bother to engage in conversation with a destructive Obamabot? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: pdq Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:41 AM What I mean is that all three are now media stars. The media need them so the media made them stars. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 09:49 AM I don't believe any of them were made stars by the media. I do believe, however, that all 3 have sought the spotlight. All politicians do, just like all pastors and priests do, all teachers do, all talking heads do, all actors and musicians do, etc. That is a given, IMO. But what Wright is doing is beyond the pale, and threatens to destroy the Obama campaign if he doesn't act quickly. This could cost the primaries as early as next Tuesday. Before news of Wright's media blitz was made public last week, Obama was already sagging in the polls because of the bounce Clinton got (as expected) coming out of PA. No, if Obama doesn't make a major speech renouncing Wright and his divisive identity politics--which is what Obama claims he wants to transcend (but maybe only on one side of the divide?), his campaign is finished. Finished. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bobert Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:03 AM Well, Fantz... I don't hate either Bush or Clinton... I dislike and hate some of what they have done... Bush more than Clinton... I did not like Clintons caving on "welfare reform" which was punitive and ill-thought out and as a result incresed poverty levels in the US... I didn't like Clinton having an affair and then lieing to his family and the nation about it... I do not like some of the code words that mostly BIll had used in this campaign to change the conversation toward race... As for Bush??? Geeze... The tax cuts, the war, Katrina, post-911 posturing and chest pumping, his combative foriegn policy, his "No Child Left Taught to Think, etc... But no, I don't hate them... And I do get what Jeremiah Wright is doing... He is defending himself... I understand that... Of course, it was the white media that pounded and pounded away at him for a month before he had had enough and when he had had enough he came out of the corner with fire in his eyes just as I would have expected... Now he has scared white people who have little understanding of the black culture or the black church experience and it has white people caught off guard... If it costs Obama the presidency this year, so be it... It will toughen him yup for thw '12 campaign but more importantly it may do one of the good things that Bill CLinton did in '97 and that is have a real discussion about race in America... Tnat is long overdue and perhaps has to happen before a black man or woman can be electyed president... I think back to the beginning of the conservative movement... It was '64 and Goldwater was smashed... But what he said sank in and maybe that's what is happening here... Maybe the country would be better off having McCain ***and*** a "discussion on race" if they can't have Obama... I see this, at the very least, good for America... Go, Jeremiah, go... You rock, brother... You rock!!! B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 10:13 AM Putting the old black vs white racial identity politics on the front page as a slugfest between a black preacher and a black politician is A Good Thing? Just how does THAT work, exactly? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Riginslinger Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:01 AM "Throw the Reverend from the Train..." Toss 'em all. The world would be a better place. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Uncle_DaveO Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:01 AM pdq said, in part: Jeremiah Wright has raised his stature to the level of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton in a matter of a few weeks. pdq, your sentence is not quite correct as written. It should more accurately say, Jeremiah Wright has raised his notoriety to the level of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton in a matter of a few weeks. Or, even better, The media have helped Jeremiah Wright raise his notoriety to the level of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton in a matter of a few weeks. Dave Oesterreich |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: pdq Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:07 AM I can live with the revised edition. Thanks, Uncle Dave. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: CarolC Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:18 AM I really appreciate the way Obama is responding to the current Rev. Wright situation. It's his ability to respond to people in this way that made it possible for me to feel ok about voting for him this time around. I think I'm far from unique in feeling this way. I also think that for Obama to respond in kind would make him look weak rather than strong, and that would be a mistake. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:50 AM Mike Huckabee was right. because of his generation and his age and his service to the contry, we need to cut Wright some slack. Obama is doing what id right. He just needs to more strongly disavow Wright's statements. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 11:55 AM That isn't what Mike Huckabee was saying last night on MSNBC. Not by a long shot. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Donuel Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:05 PM All Rev Wright needs to do now is get a diagnosis of Alzheimers. That is the only thing that might explain his behavior, either that or he has been bribed with everything he ever wanted by people who know how to bribe and extort with impunity. Joe Scarbourough is saying over and over that Obama is on a sinking ship. After 1,200 repetitions people might just believe the TV. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Ebbie Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:14 PM Last night on Newshour with Jim Lehrer there were talking heads discussing this situation with Judy Woodruff. All three of the men she was interviewing are black. Their consensus was that if Obama can transcend this situation, putting it where it belongs, he will have demonstrated that he is ready for the presidency. If not, he is not ready. hmmmm? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Donuel Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:24 PM I do not believe that bringing the pastor's remarks into the presidential election is an attack on the black church, as Wright said to the National Press Club. THat is merely a remark that is designed to cause trouble for anyone who would try to refute it. Wright might think he is shaping the debate or steering the conversation but sadly his self serving remarks do harm far beyond his personal focus. His behavior is human, full of foibles with grains of truth scattered like rice on black velvet, but unfortunately he will divide more than unite. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,TIA Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:27 PM The entire Jeremiah Wright "controversy" is manufactured by Fox, Scarborough, et. al. By even being here talking about it, you (and now me) are feeding *those* trolls. It is classic propaganda - paint someone as the demon, make them fear the demon more than the very real problems they face, and convince them only you can save them. Will any disavowal of Wright's person or remarks truly affect the amount of money my kids will be paying to the Chinese, and whether I will lose any more cousins in Iraq? Congratualtions, this thread is right in line with MSM behaviour. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:27 PM Same was happening on the cable news (I too saw the piece w/Judy Woodruff). Lots of African American commentators from across the social and political spectrum. Pretty unanimous opinion. Consensus seems to be Wright is a loose cannon, and will take Obama down with him--so it's Time. Time to throw Wright off the train, or risk it leaving the station w/out Obama. Same is true on the African American blogsites today like theroot.com. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bill D Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:30 PM http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/28/AR2008042802102.html?hpid=opinionsbox1 "Where Wright Goes Wrong By Eugene Robinson Tuesday, April 29, 2008; Page A17 We all have our crosses to bear. The Rev. Jeremiah Wright has become Barack Obama's. I'm sorry, but I've had it with Wright. I would never try to diminish the service he performed as pastor of his Chicago megachurch, and it's obvious that he's a man of great charisma and faith. But this media tour he's conducting is doing a disservice that goes beyond any impact it might have on Obama's presidential campaign. The problem is that Wright insists on being seen as something he's not: an archetypal representative of the African American church. In fact, he represents one twig of one branch of a very large tree." more at link |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 12:34 PM I agree a bazillion percent, BillD. Obama should have cut him loose before he ever announced, when it would have been far easier to do than it will be now. This is a pile of shit, no matter which angle you are viewing it from, IMO. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bill D Date: 29 Apr 08 - 01:07 PM I used to work in the Civil Rights movement, and sadly, I met several guys with attitudes similar to Wright's..(without the overlay of 'reverend', thankfully) If Wright was not connected to Obama, we'd probably not hear of him, and it is beyond ridiculous to paint Obama with shadows of this man's rhetoric! The **MEDIA** is creating a self-fulfilling hypothesis with its rhetorical questions.."Can his ex-pastor's ideas derail Obama's campaign?" Obama has SAID he disavows Wright's ideas...but there sure are those who feel that keeping this issue alive might hurt him. I wonder who that might be? (he said cynically) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: catspaw49 Date: 29 Apr 08 - 01:12 PM I read a good piece this morning which I can't find now but was a suggested speech for Obama and probably about as good as he could do. This is the true rock and hard place dilemna. Additionally Wright has thrown in so much more than the original "problems" that almost anything said will have to be very carefully crafted. The idea that Obama is just a politician is probably the most hurtful to his momentum and campaigh in general. I like Obama although I'm certainly not one of his zealots but in this case I gotta' feel sorry for the dude! Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 01:33 PM It also isn't a situation unique to African American identity politics. You see the same stuff in Latino/Latina identity politics, Native American identity politics...too many "old school" guys who don't like the upstarts outshining them. Another aspect of the phenomenon, is the old school guy hogging the limelight has usually lost the support of their community. I can't tell you how ugly it got in some of the communities I've worked in over the years. Like, really ugly. I can't stand Obama, but I do feel for him right now--and for all of us. Because the tired, old racial identity politics is NOT the road we should be heading down at this crucial juncture in American politics. And if I didn't know better, I'd really have to say--who got to Jeremiah Wright? You may have read the piece at Salon.com? They had one of those articles this morning. It was a good "say this" blurb. Honest to god, I don't know how the hell Obama ballet dances his way outta this one. I haven't a clue. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bill D Date: 29 Apr 08 - 01:38 PM Exactly...once the line "just a politician" is on the table, anything Obama says can be tossed back at him by just cynically remarking.."See? He is just respondinglike a politician!" I'm not sure what anyone expects him to say... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Joe Offer Date: 29 Apr 08 - 02:03 PM Another thread on "The Reverend," Janet? Multiple election threads is bad enough, multiple threads on individual candidates is worse, but having multiple threads on the candidates' pastors is going a bit too far, isn't it? See if you can restrain yourself and start no more than one new thread a day, willya? It has been stated before that starting more than one new thread a day is probably too many. If you can practice some self-restraint, maybe I won't have to put you on a diet. -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: catspaw49 Date: 29 Apr 08 - 02:30 PM I dunno' Joe.......I hate all the crap myself but we either stop it all (cries of censorship), let it all go and hope everyone including those on all sides can restrain themselves a bit (unlikely), or start 4 threads.........Clinton, Obama, McCain, Primary News. When the conventions come along allow two more then close them all after the conventions are both over and start three new ones. That's doable but will get some bitching. To me it just keeps all the political crappola within a few threads. On the other hand, if all the poli/sci fetishists will cough up 20 bucks apiece and send it in to the 'Cat, we can devote an entire section to the election! No dough, 4 threads. Spaw
-Joe- |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Amos Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:11 PM That's why the "Popular Views" series was started. The hope was, one bin would serve for all the Obama chat, another for all the Bush junk, and another for all the McCain trash, and maybe one for the Hillary gunk. Unfortunately, every day is a new topic to some folks, not to mention every minute and every thought... A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Wolfgang Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:14 PM Wright, in an interview, March 13, 2007 (yes, more than a year ago): Question: Do you think (Obama) will be President in two years? Wright: No. Unless Barak pulls off nationally what he was able to pull off locally, and wins the hearts and minds of people who have been perennially anti-black. Racism is so deeply engrained in this country that he could be flawless in terms of his policies. But he's still a black man in this country, which has a sorry history in terms of how it sees African-American males. That's my 65-year-old, jaded perception of where this country is. I was pleasantly surprised in the Senate election. I would like to be as pleasantly surprised in the presidential election. Wolfgang |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bobert Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:15 PM As others have argued, Fantz, you have it dead wrong in thinking this is Wright v. Obama, it's... ...Jeremiah v. McMedia and right now Jeremiah is ahead on points!!! B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Charley Noble Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:26 PM Joe- I was thinking of initiating my own thread on this topic, titled "Rev. Wright - a Loose Canon." Of course I don't disagree with a lot of what he's actually saying but saying it loud and clear now at major news events, such as the Washington Press Club, can only provide aid and comfort to those who would like to see the Obama campaign derailed. Rev. Wright becomes the issue, rather than the campaign issues that voters should really be concerned about. I don't think Rev. Wright is going to retire quietly. Charley Noble |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:26 PM From Reuters, just a few minutes ago: "Whatever relationship I had with Reverend Wright has changed as a consequence of this," Obama said. Y'all will hear the rest of it soon enough. Consider Wright "off the train". Obama did the right thing, hit the right note with his comments. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: catspaw49 Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:35 PM The very thing Wolfgang posted was similar to what the Governor of Pennsylvania said and got in hot water for. Sadly thouhg it is the truth. Here in the heartland you can bet your ass that Obama will have a tough time in November. There are still some folks who won't tolerate a black prez and others here won't have a woman. But of the two a woman comes out ahead every time. Racism is still alive and well although its insidious and often well hidden. A woman will always fare better at this point in time. Obama can do it here but he's going to have to overcome much history with Rev. Wright and get back on track as a "healing non-politician." Tough row to hoe........This is the unstated backing for the Clinton challenge when they say she can carry the "big states." Everyone is going to have to bring this issue out from the depths and see what the Dems can do. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:48 PM I seem to be having a lot of trouble with my return key these days. Actually, I think a person--OK--a man of color could be elected fairly easily in the US, especially if it was Colin Powell for the Republicans. I think it just depends upon the person, and whether they are conservative. Conservative whites, even the racist ones, would go for Powell over a Clinton, IMO, even though there isn't much difference between the two ideologically. Think Margaret Thatcher and Golda Meir. Non-traditional "change" candidates can be elected, but only if they are conservatives, IMO. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bobert Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:49 PM Same 'round these parts, Spawzer... As long as black folk act like white folk want them to act then everything is okee dokee but "step outta line the man come and t6ake you away"... That's 'bout as far as alot of white folks have come... Here's what makes the Reverand a problem for Obama: the media thinks this is the only story??? How 'bout some of the things that McCain's men of cloth have said??? Hmmmmmmm??? (Well, that;s okay, Boberdz... Them folks is white...) Yeah, racism has reared it's ugly head and it's coming our living rooms thru satalittes, rabbit ears and cable... And since media is white it has complete control of information and the conversations... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:57 PM >>From: catspaw49 Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:35 PM The very thing Wolfgang posted was similar to what the Governor of Pennsylvania said and got in hot water for. Sadly thouhg it is the truth. Here in the heartland you can bet your ass that Obama will have a tough time in November. There are still some folks who won't tolerate a black prez and others here won't have a woman. But of the two a woman comes out ahead every time. Racism is still alive and well although its insidious and often well hidden. A woman will always fare better at this point in time.<< What you say is true enough but the people who vote that way have been voting Republican for the last forty years and wouldn't vote for a white male Democrat who was eiter for Gun Control or Not anti-Gay Rights. I find it ironic that Hillary's main claim to be electable is that she can beat Obama head to head among people who will and always have overwhelmingly voted Republican in November. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Donuel Date: 29 Apr 08 - 03:57 PM TIA is right and Wright is wrong. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 04:07 PM Sorry, but I ain't buyin' it's all the MSM's fault. This whole Wright debacle demonstrates extremely poor judgment on Obama's part. This wound is self-inflicted. That said, I do think he will likely stop the bleeding with the *second* press conference he called w/in 24 hours of Wright's National Press Club shenanigans. If the MSM doesn't back off by tomorrow, then you will have a case to make against them. But today? No, it is their job to cover this story, just like it was their job to cover it yesterday. I hope for the sake of the nation everybody transcends this crap, because there is far worse shit to deal with than a bunch of washed up black nationalist race baiters, hogging the airwaves and hijacking the election to further their personal agendas and vendettas. Do I sound bitter? ;) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 04:12 PM NYT just posted a transcript of this afternoon's Obama press conference in NC. Here is the link: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/29/us/politics/29text-obama.html?pagewanted=all |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bobert Date: 29 Apr 08 - 04:47 PM No, Fantz, it is only "dabacle" in McMedia's eyes and that's the way that McMedia wants to keep it... This is about as much a non-story as I can rememeber in politics... It has lapped Willie Horton twice (Sorry, Willioe, but you can't outrun these guys...) There are real stories out there but they might lead to corporate crap like the FCC selling off what were supposed to be free airwaves... Yeah, media loves to keep it right where it is... Every day they can hold Obama down is a good day for McMedia... They sell lots of ads and they keep alot of conversations from occuring... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: beardedbruce Date: 29 Apr 08 - 04:48 PM Washington Post: ( will be gone in a few days) A Pastor at Center Stage And a Parishioner With Questions to Answer By George F. Will Tuesday, April 29, 2008; Page A17 Because John McCain and other legislators worry that they are easily corrupted, there are legal limits to the monetary contributions that anyone can make to political candidates. There are, however, no limits to the rhetorical contributions that the Rev. Jeremiah Wright can make to McCain's campaign. Because Wright is a gift determined to keep on giving, this question arises: Can persons opposed to Barack Obama's candidacy justly make use of Wright's invariably interesting interventions in the campaign? The answer is: Certainly, because Wright's paranoias tell us something -- exactly what remains to be explored -- about his 20-year parishioner. In yesterday's speech at the National Press Club, Wright repeated -- decorously, by his standards, but clearly -- his accusation, made the Sunday after Sept. 11, that America got what it deserved. His answer yesterday to a question about that accusation was: "Whatsoever you sow, that you also shall reap" and "you cannot do terrorism on other people and expect them never to come back on you." As evidence that "our government is capable of doing anything," he strongly hinted that he has intellectually respectable corroboration -- he mentioned several publications -- for his original charge that the U.S. government is guilty of "inventing the HIV virus as a means of genocide against people of color." But yesterday he insisted that he is not anti-American: It is, he said, Americans' government, not the American public, that is a genocidal perpetrator of terrorism. So, he now denies that America has a representative government -- that it represents the public. He believes that elections constantly and mysteriously -- and against the public's will -- produce a genocidal, terroristic government. Yesterday, Wright also espoused the racialist doctrine that blacks have "different" learning styles from others'. This doctrine of racially different brains, or of an unalterably different black culture, is a doctrine today used to justify various soft bigotries of low expectations regarding blacks, and especially black children. It has a long pedigree as a rationalization for injustices. Slaveholders and, later, segregationists loved it. Obama should be questioned about whether he agrees about "different" learning styles. It is, however, predictable that journalistic and political choruses will attempt to suppress such questioning by suggesting that it is somehow illegitimate. The "daisy ad" and "Willie Horton" will be darkly mentioned. There have been two television ads in presidential campaigns concerning which there is a settled consensus of deep disapproval. In both cases, the consensus about these acts of supposed mischief is mistaken. The first ad was used in 1964 by Lyndon Johnson against Barry Goldwater: A small girl plucked petals from a daisy as a voice counted down to a nuclear explosion. The ad, reflecting Johnson's fear that his large lead would cause complacency among his supporters, concluded with a voice saying: "The stakes are too high for you to stay home." Goldwater and many of his supporters were incensed. But Goldwater had said several things suggestive of a somewhat cavalier attitude about the use of force, including nuclear weapons. He had made his judgment a legitimate issue. In the spring of 1988, in a debate among candidates for the Democratic presidential nomination, Tennessee Sen. Al Gore used the matter of Willie Horton against Massachusetts Gov. Michael Dukakis, one of Gore's rivals. Horton had been in a Massachusetts prison serving a life sentence for the murder of a boy he stabbed 19 times during a robbery. Horton was frequently released on weekend furloughs. Finally, he fled, kidnapped a couple, stabbed the man and repeatedly raped the woman. Because the ad, made by supporters of Vice President George Bush, included a photo of Horton, critics called it racist. But supporters of Bush argued that the Horton episode was emblematic of Massachusetts' political culture, or of a liberal mentality, pertinent to assessing Dukakis. When North Carolina Republicans recently ran an ad featuring Wright in full cry, McCain mounted his high horse, from which he rarely dismounts, and demanded that the ad be withdrawn. The North Carolinians properly refused. Wright is relevant. He is a demagogue with whom Obama has had a voluntary 20-year relationship. It has involved, if not moral approval, certainly no serious disapproval. Wright also is an ongoing fountain of anti-American and, properly understood, anti-black rubbish. His speech yesterday demonstrated that he wants to be a central figure in this presidential campaign. He should be. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 06:15 PM I dunno. Did Wright actually do this act, so Obama COULD throw him under the bus and somehow salvage his sagging campaign? Or am I just too crazy to even think that? I also am not too sure it will be enough to save Obama's campaign anyway. As I said elsewhere yesterday, the Wright controversy is over a decade in the making, based on choices Obama obviously made when deciding to get into Chicago & Illinois politics as a way onto the national stage. Sticking by Wright through thick and thin has been a very serious error in judgment on Obama's part. Today, I can't help but wonder if it isn't too little, too late, and leaving far too many questions unanswered. And thinking it isn't just Wright's arrogance that is at the heart of it, but Obama's arrogance too. I've long viewed both Michelle and Barack as having a serious arrogance problem. This whole sordid mess seems to have confirmed it for me, not made me think he is finally pulling out of the woods with throwing the reverend off the train. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Riginslinger Date: 29 Apr 08 - 06:31 PM The problem is, are the Democrats stuck with him as a candidate, or is there still time to do something? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: catspaw49 Date: 29 Apr 08 - 06:38 PM With apologies to Kris Kristofferson........ Help Me Make It Into June Throw the Reverend from the train Let the wheels slice through his ass Hope his balls get smashed as well And make his dick a pulpy mass Could a coupler knock him dead And flip him off into a ditch? Throw the Reverend off the train Gotta' beat that fuckin' bitch. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bobert Date: 29 Apr 08 - 07:28 PM Gotta a nice little beat to it, Spawzer... I'd give it a solid "7".... B;~) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Donuel Date: 29 Apr 08 - 07:36 PM Whoring with psychotic pastors is usually the domain of the right. At least Obama had the common sense to finally call this pastor to be outside the mainstream and out of his mind. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: GUEST,Fantasma Date: 29 Apr 08 - 07:45 PM But this pastor is NOT outside the African American mainstream. And if even one other prominent African Americans leaps into the fray to defend Wright, what then? It's still a huge mess, no matter what way you try and spin it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Throw the Reverend from the Train From: Bobert Date: 29 Apr 08 - 08:34 PM Jeremiah Wright '08 |
