BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Ebbie
Date: 17 Mar 07 - 05:27 PM

I can see why Guest Ci Ci was so alarmed that s/he sent us to read this:

"The WWP describes itself as a party that has, since its founding, "supported the struggles of all oppressed peoples. It has recognized the right of nations to self-determination, including the nationally oppressed peoples inside the United States. It supports affirmative action as absolutely necessary in the fight for equality. It opposes all forms of racism and religious bigotry." Initially the WWP was confined to the Buffalo, New York area, where it had constituted the Buffalo and two other smaller branches of the SWP, but expanded in the 1960s. During the Civil Rights Movement the WWP had a youth movement, "Youth Against War and Fascism", which opposed the Vietnam War. Workers World and YAWF were also notable for their consistent defense of the Black Panthers and the Weather Underground along with Vietnam Veterans Against the War and the Puerto Rican Independence movement."

Ha

In from AP a few minutes ago:

"WASHINGTON - Denouncing a conflict entering its fifth year, protesters across the country raised their voices Saturday against U.S. policy in Iraq and marched by the thousands to the Pentagon in the footsteps of an epic demonstration four decades ago against another divisive war."

I have no hope that this protest will move Bush, et al, in any way but it may serve to bring people together across the country.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Amos
Date: 17 Mar 07 - 05:38 PM

Why would anyone think that killing people was pro-American?

Especially people who were minding their own business? What the hell is supposed to be pro-American about that?


A

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 09:31 AM

Sniff...

I hate missin' an anti-war/anti-Bush demonstartion and have made more than my share over the last secveral years but I had a serious conflict and couldn't make it up fir this one...

But my how time flies... It seems like yesterday that I was riding up from Richmond with a bunch of folks for the 1st one in, what, '67 (maybe '68)... I still have a small notebook with notes I took from that day that shows up now and then... Seems that under the current crooks and chickehhawk war-mongers things haven't changed much since then... That is depressing... But what isn't depressing is the numbers of young college aged kids who are into the movenemnt thse days... It is very heartening to see that the war-monging PR machine just can't seem to corral the pro-human/pro-Earth values that are very much alive and well...

Did anyone make it to the event??? If so, how'd it go??? One won't get the real story from the Post or Times because both under-report these demonstartions... The one I attended in DC in January during the mad-dash-to-Itaqmire was so badly under-reported that the Post even ran a story the following August admitting that they had fallen into a "culture" (whatever that means) and had failed in questioning the reasons for the invasion... I wrote them and asked what they had done to "correct" their "culture" issue but never heard back so I reckon it's business as usual with them on these events...

I will say this, I attended the Moritorium during the Vietnam War, which BTW was the first time that my father who had supported the war marched against continuing it, and the numbers of folks in that were estimated at 500,000 and the January march prior to the insane ivasion of Iraq was larger... But the post had it as "tens of thousands" and gave almost as much print to the 50 or so Bushites....

So, if anyone was there I'd like your report to balance the medias...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 10:30 AM

Just read the online Post story and seesm that nuthin' has changed... The Bushites, though being a very small minority, got about equal time...


I did learn one thing I hadn't hear but somehow the Bushittes pulled one of their patented "Swiftboat Liars For Truth" acts and had spread an internet rumor that the protesters planned on vandalizing the Vietnam War Memorial and that got the Hells Angels type there in their black lether jackets to kick some hippie's asses... You know, the usual lieing sack-of-pure-unaltered-bullcrap that the Bushites are so good at spreadin' but there were no reports, according to the Post, of an vandalism during the day by the dmonstrators...

There was a report, however, of a Marine Vet who had served in Nam, having come from over half the country away to particpate in the demonstartion and thought it would be a good opportunity to visit the Vietnam Memorial, who was prevented from seeing it by a few Bushite neanderthal goons... Noraml...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Dickey
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 10:40 AM

Bobert: were there any Fags, Gooks, Rag Heads or Camel Jockeys there or just the normal Bushite neanderthal goons?

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 11:42 AM

Dickey - You insist on comparing apples to oranges!

Political mudslinging is not the same as labelling someone on the basis of ethnicity.

A political affiliation is a choice, ethnicity is not.

You really do need to think it over.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Dickey
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 11:47 AM

So what ethnicity is a Fag?*

*Fag is used here for educational purposes only.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Amos
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 12:00 PM

You are one mean piece of work, Dickey-head.

A

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Dickey
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 01:20 PM

Amos: Thanks for not using a perjorative term.

You can call me Dick for short.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 01:35 PM

Currently in progress.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: ard mhacha
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 02:12 PM

I have just witnessed massive crowds throughout the world on RTE TV News, reported 100,000 in Madrid.
Martin Sheen said the present US administration in the White House should be imprisoned as war criminals.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Ebbie
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 02:16 PM

Last night's news said that although "The police no longer estimate crowd size but said that the anti-war demonstrators may have reached 20,000."

Does anyone have any more information? Barry?

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Peace
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 02:28 PM

'Last night's news said that although "The police no longer estimate crowd size but said that the anti-war demonstrators may have reached 20,000."'

The police no longer estimate crowd size. Right. My platoon is in place and we are deciding where to put the SAWs. I don't want to estimate the size of the opposing force because it might confuse where we want to polace the weapons. Right. I get it now.

Ebbie: One news article I read did say that the number of protest folks there wasn't as large as it was a few months back.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 03:58 PM

Yo, Dickey,

Check out Webster's definations of both "neanderthal" and "goob"... Neither definations are either bigoted or homophoblic...

Like d pointed out, you are comparing apples and oranges, not to mention coming off as a complete bigot...

Everyone else,

The printed Post had figures at 20,000 to 30,000 depending one who was doing the estimatin'... Not bad at all but I'd still like to know how many of Bush's "neahderthal goons" made up the hecklers, seein' as they got about half the ink...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 04:47 PM

I am proud and happy that so many Americans have participated but heh - you really have to hand it to those Spaniards, I guess they still remember what its like to live under a Fascist government.

A big thank-you to Spain.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 05:00 PM

Ahhhh, that was supposed to be "goon", not "goob"...

And yeah, thanks to the Spainards... They really stepped to the plate...

I think more Americans would have participated if they thought that Bush administartion actaully gave a gol-danged about what anyone thinks, except their little circle of friends... This is why the Bush administartion cannot be trusted... They don not belive in democracy... The are opposed to leting tax payin' residents of the District of Columbia have a vote tho they ceratinly don't mind taking their taxes and spendin' it on dumbass wars... And they ceratinly don't care what the American people want...

Right now it biols down in the Bush screw-ups allowin' folks like the "Swiftboat Liars for Truth" have their way with the majority with thugs...

Normal, for them....

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Barry Finn
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 06:36 PM

I got back at about 7am this morning so I'm just catching up on this thread, news & sleep.

The estimates seem close I'd say between 25,000 to 35,000 protested & a few hundred Bush/War supporters.

Dickey, you don't deserve an answer to your questions & won't get one from me but I will they you that there were people from all different life styles & backgrounds. There, that's more than you deserve.

The supporters of Bush & the War were mostly jacketed excuses for birth control who wandered through the crowd trying to provoke folks into confrontations & were extremely hostile at the side lines which agrees with the supporting of war & violence.

The march itself, I though was poorly attended but many airports were shutdown or delayed flights & it was the same with trains. We left Portsmouth NH an hour late & arrived at around 11:00 the next morning just in time a 13 hr ride from what shoul've been 9. Buses from Boston didn't leave as well as buses from Vermont, I was told by some that in all 67 buses didn't make it. SO I guess Bush does talk to God & God saw fit to throw a storm in the mix for him.

As for the event I was disappointed. There is a definite lack of organization & cooperation between the various groups represented there & there's an extreme lack of leadership. It was all well & good to get people up there who have very moving & personal reasons for spearheading the protests but there needs to be more in the way of good, intelligent public speakers that can move a mass. We lacked real leaders. The various groups didn't seem to be able to put there egos & agendas aside for the sake of the whole so when the main speakers were delivering from the main stage they were drowned out by the loud speakers of the sub groups who were also vying for attention, so no messages/speeches were being heard, the sum of the parts were more important than the whole. There was also a jocking for positions at the head of the march. I was 1st told & was under the impression that the Gold Star Families (Iraq Vet Families & Vets were to lead the procession but it was the Hip Hop something's who Cindy Sheehan was leading got the front spot with the Gold Star group & was told that she & her group got pirority. Viet Nam Vets Against the War behind the Gol Stars & behind them every other group trying to mix it up with the non affiliated marchers working in between.

Now there was a better side to the whole event & that was the people. They came from all over & were from all ethnic groups, very well represented. Except for the supporters of the war which were made up of ALL, I really mean ALL white & mostly men of Viet Nam era age & again mostly leather jacketed & various group colors. There were many Viet Nam vets marching as well as much older vets & the more recent as well as Iraqi vets. There were many religious groups, Muslim as well. The youth was the best by far, they were there in droves, they were the core, the backbone & the will & the committed, they were there in very strong numbers, a huge percentage & they were extremely vocal & determined. It was actually a group of youthful Goths armed with black simulated riot shields that stormed the bridge in a military file style to the Pentagon that cause the few arrests that were made. The group was peaceful & respectful. The March route was changed, it originally was to pass the Viet Nam War Memorial with strict orders to turn off all loud speakers & to remain silent so as not to disturb any visitors. I imagine because of the rumors that got circulated about upsetting the "Wall" the march by the Memorial was dropped & it never happened. Where & who started that rumor can only be imagined. The protectors of the Memorial kept it off bounds to everyone even the visitors, what idiots, it was they that insulted the dead.
As far as I could tell there were no problems, aside for the bridge incident with police & marchers. Both did what they were supposed to do & without any animosity. There was a bit of over zealousness of the law enforcement's side in the closing of certain buildings but I guess that's just being careful & can't be a cause for blame.

There is a future march planned & hopefully the weather will be more cooperative & the organizers can realize their shortcomings & can work on them & capitalize of their strengths.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 06:42 PM

Thanks fir yer report, Barry...

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 07:49 PM

"The protesters are traitors to the United States and are guilty of aiding and abetting the enemy. It is sedition plain and simple. They should not have been allowed to be here."
quotes from Tom Delay on Meet the Press this Sunday morning.

Along with Tom Delay on Meet the Press was the neo con Richard Pearle. He accused a retired US Admiral who is now a democratic Congressman of being unpatriotic and the only ex military person to say that withdrawl of our troops will lead to peace.

Tom Delay said the Admiral's strategy for withdrawl was crazy. The other guest was a retired General who chimed in to say that he would prefer to take military advice from the Admiral, and not Tom Delay.
Tom then looked visibly shaken/angry.

___________________

On Pacifica radio and CSpan I listened to protestors who called in after the event.

There were many complaints of agent provacateurs (goons) who roamed the crowd and maced protestors as well as lacerating people's legs with boots customized with metal blades. Some of the lady callers seemed to think a protest should be more like a picnic and were disturbed upon seeing protestors beaten and maced. (It must have been her first protest. DC has a lot of VERY patriotic police)

The quotes of the anti anti protestors were profane but when they were not profane they were repeating what Tom Delay said word for word.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Peace
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 07:52 PM

"Our day will come . . .".

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Ebbie
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 08:42 PM

There were many complaints of agent provacateurs (goons) who roamed the crowd and maced protestors as well as lacerating people's legs with boots customized with metal blades. Some of the lady callers seemed to think a protest should be more like a picnic and were disturbed upon seeing protestors beaten and maced." Donuel

What? Oh, come on. Source, please.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Dickey
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 11:28 PM

My father already regarded me as hopelessly stupid: hence his favorite pejorative for me, "goon boy." He also considered me genetically deficient, something better to have been discarded in an abortionist's garbage can: "You're just like your mother," he often said. "You have shit in your blood."

In its pejorative sense, a Neanderthal is someone who is considered to be old-fashioned and unwilling to 'get with it.' Neanderthal is also used as an insult meaning uncivilized.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Barry Finn
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 11:28 PM

I saw nothing to support the statement of people being beaten & maced & would think that if an incident like this had occured it would've caused a much noticed commotion. I did see many small groups of what I called above leather jacketed Viet Nam vets flying their colors, plowing through the crowds bumping into folks purposefully & trying to start a ruckus. They were mostly, by the time the event got rolling confined to the other side, where they were fliping the bird, shouting obsenties & shaking their fists. It was truely astonishing to see this mad display of hatred focus on those that would want not only bring soldiers home to saftey & end an unjust war but these were many of the same folks that brought them home saftely from Viet Nam. Essentially they behaved like mad dogs trying to snap at the hand that once fed them. Sadly there was also a small amount that saw a need & responded. My thoughts were that they deserved absolutely no attention at all & should not have been recognized by anyone.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Ebbie
Date: 18 Mar 07 - 11:58 PM

Not only that, Barry, but if protesters had been beaten or maced it would have made the news. There are people who like nothing better than that.

For the record, I really admire you for making the effort and going, Barry. If I were in a reasonable distance, I would like to think I would go but I never have.

Dickey, stuff happens, doesn't it. I am sorry - very - that there are parents like that; is unforgivable and it cannot help but color one's spirit. May I add, however, that your father's actions in the past are no excuse for your actions today. It is up to us - no one else - to see and understand clearly and to vow that we will not be that kind of person.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Dickey
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 12:46 AM

Ebbie: What I was pointing out is that Goon and Neanderthal are pejoratives.

Who were the "Goons" at this protest?

Protesters, Supporters of Iraq War Voice March Downtown

Last Updated:
03-18-07 at 11:28AM

Opponents of the war in Iraq hit the streets of downtown San Diego Saturday, one of dozens of protests around the world calling an end to four years of war.

The protest in San Diego drew approximately 1,000 people and was relatively peaceful. The demonstrations came as the fourth anniversary of the war draws near.

San Diego police said their goal was to stand back and observe freely, admitting that a crowd this big and passionate could be unpredictable.

Marching through downtown, the protesters said that enough is enough.

"We are outnumbered in Iraq, our troops are dying, and we need to bring them home now," one protester said.

However, despite being outnumbered by war protesters, a small group of people showed up to voice their support for the war.

"I support the troops," war supporter Daniel Cord said. "We don't pull out on their watch, we'll pull out when the time is right."

When Cord was interviewed by News 8, the protesters chanted "fair and balanced," taking offense to the interview with Cord, who is a Marine.

The supporters of the war who gathered said they didn't want confrontation with the protesters, but wanted to say that Iraq is still a war worth winning.

"These people think that if we withdraw from Iraq, that somehow, just magically, peace is going to happen," said supporter John Linares, referring to the protesters.

Throughout the march, police were hoping to simply provide crowd and traffic control. However, approximately 20 minutes into the march, an anti-war protester grabbed the sign of one of the supporters of the war.

Police were able to get the supporters to safety.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 01:06 AM

Duh.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Barry Finn
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 01:36 AM

Double Duh.

You pick one article out of thousands & stand one incident to pitch as a defination to define some sort of unrelevant point to back your slanted view!

YOUR FATHER WAS RIGHT!

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Wordsmith
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 02:10 AM

Dickey, if certain blacks are now taking pledges not to use the "n" word, can we expect the same from you on your choice of equally unacceptable words?

Sorry to hear that Tom DeLay, who I'd hoped would just lie down and play dead, has risen up angry on Meet the Press. Shame on Meet the Press for inviting him in the first place. What relevant discourse could he possibly provide? Glad to hear the General took him down a peg or two. He should just go away and hide. Isn't he going to be wearing an orange jumpsuit soon? Guess he misses the limelight too much to do the decent thing. One could say, "he only opens his mouth to change feet!"

I, too, am glad that people still are actively marching for what they believe in...whatever their stripe. Ah, the good old days...the roar of the crowd, the smell of "ew, tear gas."

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 07:09 AM

Last words of "neanderthal goon Bushites"

neanderthal = adj., borish (Webster)

goon = thug, strike buster (Webster)

Bushite = supporter of Bush (mine and others)

So yeah, the biker types who heckled, cursed and prevented at least one Vietnam vet from seeing the Vietnam War Memorial because he had an anti-war sign seemed to fit the description to the tee...

BTW, the term goon has commonly been used as anti-union peoople who use violence and intimidation against folks trying to unionize a shop, "strike busters", so I don't see it's use to describe the kinds of activities that these thugs at the protest were involved as debatable...

Throw in the "BIG LIE" that the Bushites spread around their right winged blogs that the protesters planned to trash the Vietnem Memerial I'm not surprised that it got the goons down out of the trees withy their boots and leather jackets...

As for the beating of people or macing of peiople, I haven't seen any credible reports of that bu7t the Post certainly has reported on the cursing, the threats and the intimidation that the neanderthal goon Bushites used against the demonstrators...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 07:56 AM

source: Pacifica radio caller. They incidents were reportedly at the Viet Nam war memorial where feeling ran hot.

UK paleo anthroplogists said this week that Neanderthals were most likely eaten by the hairless tribes of people.

They went on to say that mothers may have been the ones to select the cute hairless babies over the hairy ones which led to a predoominence of hairless people.

Neanderthals were at least as hairy as Robin Williams and were likely considered to be animal game.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Dickey
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 10:39 AM

Ebbie:

I am sorry if I gave the impression that the thing about goon boy was me. I should have out it in quotaion marks and given a source.

I will do better in the future.

Bobert: I didn't know that goons lived in trees or that they always wear boots and leather jackets.

Where do Neanderthals live and what do they wear?

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 10:53 AM

The last Neanderthal throwback I saw was in Lackawanna NY in 1973.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: dianavan
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 12:46 PM

"These people think that if we withdraw from Iraq, that somehow, just magically, peace is going to happen," said supporter John Linares."

Dickey - Have you ever heard anyone on Mudcat say that? I doubt it. Its a gross misrepresentation of those who are opposed to the war and is a good example of those who can't listen to reason.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 01:17 PM

"I am sorry if I gave the impression that the thing about goon boy was me. I should have out it in quotaion marks and given a source."

You most certainly should have.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Dickey
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 02:03 PM

What I have heard on Mudcat is that if US forces pull out of Iraq, everything will get "sorted out in two weeks ".

It took a little longer to get things sorted out in Rwanda.

"...Between April 6 and mid-July, a genocide that is estimated to have left between 800,000 and 1,071,000 Tutsis and moderate Hutus dead at the hands of organized bands of militias, as reported by Helen Vesperini...
...Their Achilles tendons were cut so they couldn't run, and the Belgian soldiers — all of them privates — were castrated and died choking on their genitalia..."

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 02:44 PM

"What I have heard on Mudcat is that if US forces pull out of Iraq, everything will get "sorted out in two weeks ".


Please cite who said that and where and when. I have heard NOBODY say anything even close to that.

You wouldn't want to be suspected of being a liar, would you?

Something that those who fault the anti-war people as well as the Democratic party for not having a good or foolproof solution to the mess in Iraq bespeaks to the very problem: We had no business there in the first place. And it wasn't the anti-war people or the Democratic party who put us there.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: beardedbruce
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 02:50 PM

"We had no business there in the first place."

A matter of debate, which either side has reason to argue. There are those who feel the LACK of action in Iraq would have lead us to Global Thermonuclear War.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Peace
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 02:50 PM

Ahem!

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Amos
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 03:20 PM

NEW YORK (AP) -- Hundreds of protesters calling for the end of funding for the Iraq war or the immediate return of U.S. troops marched Sunday and converged on a park near the United Nations headquarters.

Union members, representatives of Rev. Jesse Jackson's Rainbow-PUSH Coalition, war veterans and others joined the demonstration, one of several staged during the weekend across the country to mark the fourth anniversary of the U.S. invasion of Iraq.

The crowd of a few hundred protesters grew as the procession, which stretched for several blocks, moved on.

Actor Tim Robbins, among the speakers at the rally, organized by the New York chapter of United for Peace and Justice, told the crowd that getting Congress to cut off funds for the war "would be a good way" to get the troops home.

"The American people want this war to end," Robbins said. "That's the message they sent last November in the election. When are we going to start listening to them?"

Robbins, a frequent war protest participant with his partner, actress Susan Sarandon, also referred to the recent revelations of substandard care and facilities at the military's Walter Reed Medical Center in Washington.

"You want to support the troops? First get them home, then take care of them," he said.

Police lined sidewalks, and some walked ahead of the protesters as they marched toward the offices of Sens. Charles Schumer and Hillary Rodham Clinton.

Demonstrators carried signs reading "Impeach Bush," and "Not one more dollar, not one more death."

No counter-demonstrators were visibly present, as they had been at a larger anti-war rally in Washington on Saturday.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: GUEST, Ebbie
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 04:09 PM

There are those who say that the Vietnam war would have ended markedly sooner if Congress had cut off the funds for it. Do we really need to keep this war going?

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Barry Finn
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 04:23 PM

"There are those who feel the LACK of action in Iraq would have lead us to Global Thermonuclear War."

Well you were wrong, weren't you?

With what? They had little enough to blow their onw foot off with! (speaking literally, so please don't go there.

The majority seems to be in favor of an end now & had there been a little bit of thought & foresight the present saying of "if we had known now" wouldn't be heard round the chambers & on political trail today. Keeping on the same course after the wind's shifted is charting a course for disaster. We now know that there would've have been no "Global Thermonuclear War" now or then or any other "Global War", all hype but still there are those that can't get past that. Move on before it becomes the "100 Year War".


Barry

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 05:55 PM

neaderthal, not Neaderthal, Dickey...

Spend a little time with Mr. Webster...

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 06:59 PM

Well, before Prickey, who has nuthing to add to this discussion other than playin' his usual ***ah-hah-gotcha-Bobert*** stalkin' game that has become his new hobby I have to confess that...

there is no neaderthal in the dictionary as being used as a adjective but...

..."Neanderthal" which can mean man, as in a noun, like in Neanderthat man or "Neanderthal" as an adjective meaning "boorish"...

Note: I have 'bout 12 dictionaries and I looked it up last night and set the one down that had "neanderthal" with lower case as an adjective but can't seem to find that edition so until I find it I'll have to stick with "Neanderthal Bushite goons", 'er "Neanderthal goon Bushites"....

Might of fact, I'll just let Prickey decide which one he likes better seein' as he has nuthin' really to add to this discussion other than critiquin' my posts...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 07:00 PM

Lets not have a knee jerk response to Dickie.

What can happen after we pull out but keep air support in the area is that muslim jihadists/terrorists/alQida/isamo fascists/muslim brotherhoods/radical violent extremists/sons seeking revenge for their families death... will continue to bomb Spain, France, Italy, UK, Netherlands and the US.

I feel that as a result of the US blunders and invasions under false pretenses, it will take more terrorist acts to mobilize Europe and other attacked nations to get fed up and put their foot down. UK and France have a nuclear foot to put down.

The US has delayed a real coalition of western countries to react in a deliberate manner that would cause muslim policing of their extremists.

Then again maybe jihadists would celebrate victory and go home once we do. but I doubt it.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Mar 07 - 07:21 PM

False pretenses??? Let me count the lies...

The lastest, which I heard Bush use yet again today is that if we don't defeat the terorist over there (iraq) then we'll have to fight them here???

That's funny... DoD and independent analysts don't agree with this assumption one bit... No, quite to opposite...

They are sayin' that it is "Unlikely" (Mike McConnell, Director of National INtellegence, Washington Post, March 18) but like all the other now-debunked-lies for why the US needed to invade Iraq here we have the new-and-imporved-lie....

You know it's said that once opne begins to lie and is caught one will come up with bigger and better lies to cover up the 1st lie.... I'm not sure which generation of lies we're now hearing but it makes WMD's seem like a great, great grand-daddy...'Er is is great, great, great, great, great???

I've lost count...

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Teribus
Date: 20 Mar 07 - 03:35 AM

Count the lies Bobert, you and your fellow travellers to date have been unable to prove one.

How's the Impeachment going Bobert, I'd have thought that with the amount of "evidence" you lot claim exists, the whole process would be a "cake-walk". The fact that it isn't proving to be so, may have something to do with the fact that for those who actually know what "evidence" is they are far from convinced that a prima facia case could be made for impeachment.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: beardedbruce
Date: 20 Mar 07 - 06:13 AM

"Well you were wrong, weren't you?"

We took action. So how can one state that we were wrong?

Or do YOU claim to have EVIDENCE of lack?


Lack of evidence IS NOT evidence of lack.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Amos
Date: 20 Mar 07 - 08:17 AM

"We took action. So how can you claim we were wrong?"

Ummm...Bruce, ole buddy... the guy who cut them to shreds in McDonalds, and the guy in the University of Texas clock tower, and the guy in Colorado in the black raincoat, were all men of action.

And they were all completely wrong.

The two things are independent variables indeed.

A

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: beardedbruce
Date: 20 Mar 07 - 08:23 AM

Amos,

"There are those who feel the LACK of action in Iraq would have lead us to Global Thermonuclear War."


IF we do not take action, THEN we will have a GTW.

Given that the first circumstance DID NOT OCCUR, the validity of the conclusion CANNOT be determined.


Had we NOT taken action, THEN it could be judged valid or invalid.

I happen to consider global thermonuclear war to be wrong, and a BAD THING.

Subject: RE: BS: The march on DC for Impeachment 3/17/07
From: Scrump
Date: 20 Mar 07 - 09:18 AM

Sorry to interrupt, but...


...100!