BS: The MOST British given name of all is...

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Rowan
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 04:36 PM

Kaleea, I've come across a couple of Oz Godfreys and more than a couple of Jocelyns but the most frequent occurrences in Oz of the ones you mention (excepting Jocelyn) are as surnames. And, again, it's Stirling rather than Sterling.

More generally, although Little Hawk asked for names that were British, from a US perspective, the examples on the thread indicate the influence of British heritage in Oz names is still extensive. When we had our first child, a daughter, her mum wanted names from out of our joint family trees; she'd been genealogically ferreting around hers between proper jobs. The two we liked most had already been picked by my brother (who, at that stage, knew nothing about the family beyond our grandparents) for his two daughters; such is life.

What we noticed about our ancestries (hers 4th generation Oz with lots of English and Irish, mine First & Second Fleet with some English, some Scottish and a bit of French) though, was how limited was the range of names for the male parts by comparison with the female parts, pace Dariel Fo. The range of women's names was at least twice and almost thrice the range of men's names.

At least, we found that interesting.

Cheers, Rowan

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Richard in Manchester
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 05:10 PM

My brain is still fighting a losing battle trying to grasp Herga Kitty's phrase "quintessentially British". Something that is equally typical of the English, the Welsh and the Scots? I'll take the quest to find the Holy Grail, any day....

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 16 Nov 07 - 04:11 PM

Richard - so how come you left the Irish (who have revelled in classical allusions) out of your post on quintessence?

I read "MOST British" in the thread title as meaning the most concentrated essence of British, not English.

Kitty

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: PoppaGator
Date: 16 Nov 07 - 05:29 PM

Most Irish do not self-identify as "British," but I believe that the average Scot or Welshman readily accepts that designation (although, of course, they would balk at being described as "English").

Scotland and Wales, of course, share the same island with England. Perhaps that helps them feel British.

Also, while the Celtic peoples of those two nations endured conquest, and a degree of discrimination, by England, their subjugation was hardly as severe nor as long-standing as that suffered by Ireland.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Rowan
Date: 16 Nov 07 - 06:39 PM

PoppaGator, while what you say is generally true, I sometimes wonder about the self identification of those in Northern Ireland. On top of that, I also suspect the particulars of self identification of people living in the various parts of the British Isles have changed over the last 2-3 generations, which is long enough to capture such changes but still be within the living memory of any family member.

And, although the notions of self identification have been so thoroughly canvassed elsewhere, in other threads, that we don't need to get into such diversions on this thread, I also suspect that parents choose names for their offspring for a huge variety of reasons; self identification (in the "wishing to" as well as "wishing to avoid" senses) will be only one.

Using my daughters' naming process as a personal example, both their mum and myself have single-syllable family names (OK "surnames") and hers is particularly percussive; we wished to avoid given names that might have effectively augmented the percussiveness. We also wished to avoid names that easily became diminutives, those that led to unfortunate combinations of initials and those with initials that might cause confusion on letterrs addressed to them in our household; we weren't too keen on feminised male names either.

Being in Oz, ethnic or other forms of self identification received no conscious consideration at all (though, if the Japanese had won in 1942 I might be writing differently) but I can imagine that, where self identification (in terms of 'allegiance' to a particular subgroup) is taken seriously, it might receive slightly higher prominence when choosing names.

Aliases chosen in adulthood are a different matter.

Cheers, Rowan

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Michael
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 08:33 AM

Can't remember if we've had Ralph, with its two pronunciations:- Ralf and Rafe (as in Ralph Vaughan Williams).

Also the difference between the UK & US pronounciations of Colin:-
US- Colin Powell was Coalin where as in the UK the Coll rhymes with doll.

Mike

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Celtaddict
Date: 17 Nov 07 - 10:29 PM

Besides Cyril, Nigel, Trevor, and Cecil, I always think Malcolm sounds very British. Agatha and Cecily do too.
And in the US, naming daughters by names traditionally male or traditionally surnames has been enormously popular for a generation and more, so there are plenty of females called Hunter, Tyler, Madison; also names fairly commonly in the US go from male to female (Vivian, Frances, Leslie) but almost never go from female to male.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: DMcG
Date: 18 Nov 07 - 12:19 PM

My (British) father-in-law's middle name was Welborn.   How does that rate?

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: ard mhacha
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 07:20 AM

Any Percys yet?.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Mr Red
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 07:30 AM

FWIW
I typed-in Felicia and that name is 518th in popularity in the US.

Which did surprise me. The one I know used to get a bit of stick (sic) over it. So rare I have never seen it in the UK.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: GUEST,Nancy King at work
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 12:12 PM

Santa, my Dad, who was born in Canada, was named Sterling. Named for a favorite uncle.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Anne Lister
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 12:28 PM

Are we talking past or present? Because you're highly unlikely to find any Agathas or Cicelys these days, and I suspect still fewer Percys!

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Celtaddict
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 12:57 PM

I had understood the original question to be, what given names sound the most 'British' to people (presumably, non-British English speakers, such as Americans & Australians). I do understand that names that sound 'teddibly teddibly' British to us are likely to sound quite dated to you on the Eastern side of the Pond, and in fact may never even have been all that common.
On the other hand, I don't think I have ever met a Tex, Hank, Daisy Mae, or Elvis, though I do not doubt that those names shout 'American' to someone over there. (I do have a nephew named Zeke, though he is the only Zeke I have ever known.)

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: PoppaGator
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 02:14 PM

I know several real-life American Hanks. No Elvises or Daisy Maes, though.

"Tex" is almost invariably a nickname, and I've known a few characters who occasinally answer to "Tex," but for whom that is not their primary identification.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Blowzabella
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 02:59 PM

Slightly off-topic but I think that one of the most badly done to names in the history of the UK is Mabel.

It speaks to us of nhs spectacles and pinnies but is, in fact, a Norman name, originally pronounced Ma-belle. How different and how lovely.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Rowan
Date: 19 Nov 07 - 04:22 PM

And was the name of my paternal grandmother, who pronounced it Maybelle

Cheers, Rowan

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Stu
Date: 20 Nov 07 - 10:52 AM

Abernathy

Welsh I would hazard a guess, as the prefix 'Aber' means 'mouth of'. Not sure what a Nathy is though.

"Also, while the Celtic peoples of those two nations endured conquest, and a degree of discrimination, by England, their subjugation was hardly as severe nor as long-standing as that suffered by Ireland."

Not as long standing? Where did you get that from? Wales has suffered incursions and invasions by the Irish, Romans, Scots (invited by Vortigern), Normans and finally the English. The idea that the Welsh 'got away' with less severe subjugation than the Irish is ridiculous - just because it happened a long time ago and Meibion Glyndŵr stopped burning down holiday cottages years ago doesn't mean that everything's hunky dory in the most oppressed kingdom in the Isles.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 04 May 08 - 03:02 PM

Actually my daughter in named Penelope and called (by me at least ) Penelope......

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Gurney
Date: 04 May 08 - 04:37 PM

Thread creep.   Has anyone else ever noticed that most Trevors seem to be boffins? I've never met one less than clever. Sometimes odd, or even peculiar, but not stupid.

My parents were Cyril and Doris, but they caught religion, so I'm Christopher, my siblings are named after saints, too.

I understand Elvis and Duane are English names too, But not much used there.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 04 May 08 - 04:53 PM

I used to know a labor lawyer named Lynnville G. Miles, known as "Lynn".
This is in the US, Indiana to be exact. He would have been born in Indiana or Illinois, I think, probably not earlier than 1910 and not later than 1920.

I started to write this post thinking his name was Lynn, because that's how everyone actually addressed him, but only thought of "Lynnville" in writing that first paragraph.

Does that count?

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 May 08 - 05:31 PM

I'm a bit puzzled where little Hawk got the idea that Lester is a name you'd ever be likely to find in England, or even in Scotland or Wales.

There was the jockey Lester Piggott, but apart from him, the only Lesters I've ever heard of have been North American - for example the jazz musician Lester Young, and the Canadian prime minister Lester Pearson.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Penny S.
Date: 04 May 08 - 05:56 PM

Having taught for forty years, I can safely say I've never come across an Elvis or a Duane. Aaron pronounced Arran, after Elvis, but not the King himself.

When I started teaching, boys had boring standard names, John, Peter and so on, and girls had pretty names, Natalie and Gemma. Boys then got a little more different, and girls became very American. One year we had four Alicias, all spelled differently. Elysha (It began with E anyway), Alisha, and I can't rememeber the other one. Life has got hard for teachers, because this children are a) insulted if it's their name, and b) think the teacher's daft if the teacher can't pronounce it.

There has been a class difference in names abservable until recently. Posh families have fancier boys names, and especially those names which the lower classes think are girls' names. Evelyn, Jocelyn, Hilary, Vivian, and a few others which escape me for the moment. Their girls tended to be more ordinary. Apart from the odd Penelope.

In the days of service for young women, there would be renaming of young women who were thought to be bearing names above their station. I have heard of it in my own family, but can't remember who - perhaps my grandmother Rhoda, and it also happened to a friend's relative. I would certainly have been renamed.

Penny (short for?)

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 May 08 - 07:36 PM

Duane, no - but spell it Dwayne and it's all over the place. At least that's probably how it's spelled.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Don Firth
Date: 04 May 08 - 08:04 PM

Alistair and Georgina?

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: GUEST,dianavan
Date: 05 May 08 - 01:50 AM

Yes, Hermione tops the list.

Now that we have exhausted the British list, how about Scandanavian names?

My Danish grandmother was Sina and one of my aunts was Walborg. I've never heard either name in N.A.

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: GUEST,dianavan
Date: 05 May 08 - 02:02 AM

On the other side of the family, I have an aunt Mopsy. Other than Peter Rabbit's sister, does anyone have a clue to the origin?

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 05 May 08 - 02:34 AM

"There was the jockey Lester Piggott, but apart from him, the only Lesters I've ever heard of have been North American - for example the jazz musician Lester Young, and the Canadian prime minister Lester Pearson."

What about my erstwhile sailing-and-singing pal, Lester Simpson? Derbyshire born and bred. Thought you were supposed to be a bit of a Folkie, McG? :-) :-)

Subject: RE: BS: The MOST British given name of all is...
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 05 May 08 - 02:38 AM

"Aaron pronounced Arran"

Only pronounced Arran since it became popular with the Brickies-Arse-With-Thong-Showing, Tyler-Morgan and Chardonnay-Madonna types, Penny. Where and when I grew up it was 'Air-ron'.