Tech: Linux networking help

Subject: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Mar 25 - 08:07 AM

I have posted in Linux Mint forums but no luck yet. I have an HP mini PC running a media server on Linux Mint 21 and want to aggregate the wireless and wired LANs for resilience and throughput. I have seen a few suggestions that it can be done through the NM GUI but I can never see the wireless connection to add to a bond if I go down that route. I did find a thread on Stackexchange that said "NetworkManager GUI does NOT present wifi as an option with bonding" but that was for Mint 17 and goes on the suggest using the NM CLI but the later commands produce errors about the psk. I am pretty familiar with UNIX cli but to be honest just don't know enough about networking to modify the commands to suit my setup.

I know one or two people on here are tech gurus so - Can anyone help?

For reference, all the details of my setup are included in my Mint forum post here - https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=442221

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 18 Mar 25 - 10:55 AM

I ran a recent tech thread here that touched on my WiFi/LAN setup and after hashing that topic back and forth in the thread and on tech sites I ended up finding the answer in Reddit. Good luck!

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Mar 25 - 04:22 PM

Thanks Stilly

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: DaveRo
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 03:41 AM

I'd not heard of network bonding, so I read about it for my SuSE box:
Managing Network Bonding Devices
I found that Wicked only supports bonding of ethernet and infiniband. This is unsurprising - it's obviously a feature used by enterprises.

... to aggregate the wireless and wired LANs for resilience and throughput

If you can make it work I think it would only usefully provide active-backup, so resilience but not throughput. Unless your ethernet is very slow and your wifi very fast (and not contended) it can only slow it down.

I have a Debian laptop that uses ethernet if it's plugged in and otherwise wifi. It's a default network configuration. I don't know how it does it - I've never had to look.

My RaspberryPi music/backup/file server has wifi turned off.

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 05:02 AM

The wired and wireless downloads perform around the same when I run speed tests but the uploads are considerably better on wireless. As it is a media server I prefer the better upload speeds in the main. Yes, on reflection, I agree about the resilience rather than throughput. It is getting the IP address to switch from one adapter to the other that I am having issues with. I know from my days in High Availability (HP ServiceGuard was my speciality) you can have adapters with different IPs and then a virtual adapter with yet another IP that will sit on whichever network is up. If I cannot get it to work with the inbuilt tools I suppose I could script it but I prefer to not re-invent the wheel! :-)

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: DaveRo
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 05:30 AM

I wonder why upload performance us better on wifi? Do both connect to the same router (+switch+WAP)? Is all traffuc local when serving media?

What does your speed test measure - upload/download to/from where?
Can you measure download speed at a client of the server?

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 06:55 AM

Yes - Same router and WiFi as far as I know. I use the standard Google one which they run in partnership with M-Lab

I have never delved deeply enough into what it actualy does to answer your other questions though!

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 10:59 AM

Definitely given up on bandwidth now - I have plugged a 5Ghz dongle with antenna (11.99 from Amazon) in and have more than enough bandwidth (200mpbs download and 25mpbs upload). I just want a mechanism to fail over to the wired ethernet in the event of wireless failure. It is only serving my household and some family and friends outside so it is not vital but it is a nice to have and I am now more than a little interested in whether it will work :-)

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 12:22 PM

That is odd that WiFi upload would be faster than wired.

Are you still on that household Internet access wiring setup? Through the "mains" I remember reading about.

I had a horribly slow upload on the cable (the company here is Spectrum) with copper and coax from a pole at the back of the yard. When AT&T installed fiber optic I was astonished to see how fast the upload was, mirroring download.

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 12:29 PM

Yes - Powerline adapters. I have disabled on the PC in question though and just use the 5Ghz WiFi

From the Vodafone help site If your connection is provided by Cityfibre you would get the synchronous 100/100.

However if your connection is openreach the 100/20 would be correct.

Ours is through OpenReach so the upload speeds are < 20% of download. I am OK with that,

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 01:00 PM

I'm assuming there is a price point to be admired in the difference between the two services? And agreed, upload doesn't need to be as fast. I was astonished to see it but it isn't critical to the work I do (I upload files for a site I manage, is the main reason I would notice). No online gaming here, where it can make a difference.

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: DaveRo
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 01:06 PM

Ah. Powerline adapters. I have a BT IPTV 4K-UHD streaming box ('YouView') which has ethernet and no wifi - presumably because at the time the BT Hub wifi was likely to be too slow. It came, unusually, with about 10m of ethernet cable. It warned that if the router was further away than that you could try powerline, but it would probably be too slow for UHD. I bored through a wall to get ethernet to it and laid flat ribbon ethernet under the carpets. I could probably have used a wifi bridge but that would have been expensive - two WAPs.

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 01:16 PM

I don't know whether powerline adaptors have been improved, but they gained a reputation in their early days for spraying the vicinity with wideband radio interference*; the amateur radio people did not love them for it, as they're always seeking faint signals from distant lands. There's many Web articles saying "it's not a problem, honest" .... on the sites of adaptor manufacturers.

I've inherited an amateur-radio receiver. One of these days, I'll drag it out, and find out for myself whether the powerline-adaptor link for our upstairs phone (mea culpa, but we had little choice) is as noisy as alleged. I'll report back.

* House wiring rarely follows best radio-frequency practice.

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 02:57 PM

The powerline adapters I use are pretty good. TP link. I have 2 with a single rj45 and two with twin ports. The one behind the TV for instance, added when the TV WiFi broke, just gave me an acceptable 27mbps in both directions. I like that they have a pass through socket on the front so they are not stopping us from using the socket.

I did realise something while testing though. While I am getting the advertise 250mbps downloads I should be getting 68mbps uploads. Quite common and fixable by Vodafone 2nd line support. Thanks all for getting me to dig deeper :-)

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 03:18 PM

There are a lot of people in the world who just call the company and a tech is sent out and something changes, they pay a fee, and it is fixed (or not).

Those of us old enough to have watched the advent of the personal computer and the connection to the Internet via 2400 baud modem and the changes since then, plus our getting under the hood to do things ourselves, are hopefully what keep some of the provider companies honest. We ask questions and fix things ourselves. Keep up the good work!

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 05:22 PM

It's not what the powerline adaptors are doing for you, DtG, it's more what they're spraying over the environment while they're doing it. Even the best-designed wired networks will leak (the trade keyword is TEMPEST*), and house wiring is not designed as a computer network.

I'll save you the coredump on our radioastronomical Project's adventures with avoiding interference from a stray overtone emitted by the campus network. Trust me: that saga has the "How are you?" --- "How long have you got?" nature.

* An acronym, as well as a cuss-word.

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Mar 25 - 06:15 PM

I think that they have encryption modules but to be honest my Internet usage is no secret and the traffic in our house isn't like in a large office block. Now you mention it though it is an interesting little project to investigate:-)

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 25 - 11:32 AM

I had a look and couldn't see how to secure the powerline network. I am probably missing something but, as I said before, I have no particular need for security over it sio I am not going to spend any more time. Passed an interesting couple of hours where I lost conatct with all the adapters! Back now :-)

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 25 - 06:29 PM

Well, I had to reset my router, which resulted in spending a couple of hours reconnecting (not so) smart devices but I now have upload speeds of 60+mbps. Sorted!

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 20 Mar 25 - 07:40 PM

Good job! It's all of those connected not-so-smart devices that make one reluctant to change things. Did you end up with any bruises, banged head or knees, and were there cuss words flying through the air?

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 21 Mar 25 - 03:59 AM

No physical injuries but the air was blue at times. Plus, with the update to the router, it seems I cannot switch WPS off. Vodafone support will get some earache today.

Subject: RE: Tech: Linux networking help
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 21 Mar 25 - 02:41 PM

Got an unexpected bonus though. Found out that Vodafone will provide me a static IP address. Should help with my media server :-)