BS: US & British war plans blocked

Subject: RE: BS: US & British war plans blocked
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 04:58 PM

Gareth-It's true that there haven't been many American or British casualties; in fact, Americans and bad luck have killed more British troops than the Iraqis. I can't be too happy about Iraqi casualty figures, though; current reports are more than 1,200 civilian deaths and twice that in military, most of whom are draftees.

Subject: RE: BS: US & British war plans blocked
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 05:04 PM

Claymore-That's it exactly. Let's illegally steal large quantities of infrastructure from nations we profess to consider friendly, and use it to make it easier for our oil companies to build their own power base in our new colony. Let's butcher the former government in massive lynch mobs, rather than giving them a fair trial, because after all that only applies to Americans, and only then when they aren't terrorists, or enemy combatants, or protestors, or . . .

And need I point out that NO evidence exists to link Iraq to Al Qaeda?

Subject: RE: BS: US & British war plans blocked
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 07:30 PM

FL, you clearly invoke your own prejudices.

The French have literally billions of dollars tied up in a regime that tortured and repressed its own people. To the extent that Jimmy Carter needed to offset the Iranian exremists, we began to give military aid to Iraq. But we realized our mistake, and to the extent of some one hundred casualties, and the other costs we have paid to liberate the country, we are doing our best to rectify things. The French have no such off-set. They were helping Saddam build nuclear weapons up until March 19th.

We have said over and over that we do not need Iraqi oil, and we don't. Moreover, using the Iraqi example to create a democratic, stable, and self sufficient Arab nation (as we are the only nation in the history of the world to do several times before) we do far more to ensure the stability of the worlds energy markets than the 7% that Iraqi oil would contribute to our Nations needs.

As for the lamposts, let the Iraqis determine how they are decorated. The Black Muslim is now back in the States and our justice will see to his fate.

By the way, your comment about the protestors was appallingly stupid; the anti-war protestors in the States have been totally ignored, and except for when they block traffic, left to stew in their own ignominy. As for the enemy combatants and terrorists, the Administrations position has been upheld by every court in the land, at every level, with few modifications and no reversals.

As to your point, about Al-Qaeda and Irag, I do not see how it relates to anything I have written, except to say that, obviously, not everything about this subject has been written. As I noted above, I suspect that several nations that have supported terrorism in the past, are undergoing the Bush International IQ Test, and some interesting answers will be forth coming.

And some point you will have to realize you and yours have lost... totally and for at least the next ten years, maybe forever... Your lies and exaggerations do not survive daylight, and while you gather in groups to fester your views, the world is moving on. To the extent that your views are held with sincere conviction, the world will look back in pity. To the extent your views were promulgated with lies and deceit, the world will look back with quiet satisfaction. But make no mistake, the world will be looking back...

Subject: RE: BS: US & British war plans blocked
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 07:48 PM

Claymore-It is quite possible that the French government has been selling materials necessary for a nuclear reactor to Saddam. Does that make it legitimate to nationalize French companies' property, given that not all of said companies engaged in such activity? Recall, we also have had billions of dollars tied up in regimes that tortured and oppressed their own people.

What "democratic, stable, and self-sufficient Arab nations" have we created?

You seem to have missed the occassion on which peaceful, legal protestors were fired on by police with rubber bullets and wooden dowels. You also may not have noticed that, according to the Patriot Act, those protestors were terrorists because they were undertaking illegal action (resisting arrest, for no particular crime) and endangering human life (their own, by being fired on) in an attempt to alter government policy (redress of grievances, anyone?). Regardless of what a number of stacked courts may say, anyone with half a brain can see that the Constitution DOES NOT make any exceptions to due process whatsoever.

Do you have any idea how many nations have supported terrorists? Let's see, the United States is up near the top of the list, with the Taliban as one of its best efforts. To invade every country that supported terrorism as much as Iraq did would require centuries of warfare, culminating in civil war.

Subject: RE: BS: US & British war plans blocked
From: GUEST, heric
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 08:09 PM

How peaceful and law-abiding you could be and still have Governor Moonbeam shooting at you?

Maybe you know the facts. I don't. But I've got to tell you, if Jerry thinks you should be shot at. . . .

Subject: RE: BS: US & British war plans blocked
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 08:29 PM

Forum L, While the wording of the sentence was perhaps to artful for your understanding or referring to history you seem unaware of, the following nations spring to mind: Japan, Germany, and Italy, as well as the Vichy French (people do forget that the first American casualties occuring in the European theater of WWII were by the Vichy French in North Africa) and every nation in Europe helped by the Marshall Plan.

As for my comments about the protesters and the Court system (which you cannot, for some reason, understand that the appeals process in which the above referenced decisions were made, IS THE LEGAL SYSTEM) remains virtually intact. And were they to be protesting in many other countries of the world, the bullets would have a periodic table number closer to plumbium.

And as you cast out your last sentence, you must have heard the snickering down the hall...

Subject: RE: BS: US & British war plans blocked
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 10:16 PM

Claymore-Just because some countries kill protestors, that doesn't make it moral to disperse a legally gathered crowd with excessive force. I'm not sure what you meant by the first sentence of the second paragraph of your post, but I understand that the court system is the judicial mechanism of the state. I simply disagree with its assessment of the Patriot Act, Homeland Security Act, et al. How do you reconcile some of these things with the Fourth and Fifth Amendments?

Subject: RE: BS: US & British war plans blocked
From: jimmyt
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 10:22 PM

I am watching every network right now and in each case I have seen cheering Iraqis waving AMerican flags, tearing down statues of this monster, and thanking the president of the United States. Not too much more needs to be said. Thank God for men like Tony Blair and George W Bush who have the courage of their convictions to do the right thing.

Subject: RE: BS: US & British war plans blocked
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 10:41 PM

jimmyt-If cheering people were all it took to make a leader good, Saddam would have had Bush and Blair beat by a long shot. His people cheered him whenever he wanted, and no one ever said a word against him ( or at least not more than once). I do not mean to state that Bush and Blair are using the same means of coercion, or intend to, but I don't know if the Iraqis realize that they don't have to cheer if they don't want to. If your only experience was in a police state, and someone invaded with hundreds of thousands of soldiers, you'd cheer too.