BS: American English usages taking over Brit

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 15 Jul 12 - 05:11 PM

Ice Hockey, the Canadian Game, not American.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Jul 12 - 06:24 PM

But, since it's about linguistics, the squirrels have changed from gray to grey since they came here, and are extremely unlikely to change back.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 15 Jul 12 - 08:31 PM

Grey squirrel in Canada (mostly the black phase in southern Ontario); gray squirrel across the border in the States.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Charmion
Date: 15 Jul 12 - 08:57 PM

Canadian squirrels are bilingual -- grey or gray, they answer to either.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Jul 12 - 09:26 PM

I think to a large degree the original examples and the premise of the thread are kind of bogus.

School Yard, vs Playgound? Where I grew up the school grounds were not fenced in. There was a parking area, the kids played where there were no cars parked and between the primary and elementary school buildings. The playground was a mile away in the park, next to the soft ball field.

And much as we were proud of our Imperial British heritage, we called the School Grounds, the school grounds and the playground the playgound.

Like wise, girls used to skip and they used to jump rope. There were ways to jump rope without skipping. They certainly would skip without a rope. Skipping with a rope was called skipping rope, often shortened to "skipping."

"Out of bounds" and "Off Limits" do not mean exactly the same thing. Americans are very familiar with the term "Out of Bounds" from football meaning not within the field of play. "Off Limits" is something posted on military installations meaning "authorized personnel only" Since both are used as metaphors and neither are particularly American or British aren't both fairly used?

The English speaking community is connected world wide in media and travel. The users of the language an the influencers are no longer exclusively on a couple of tiny islands. The main influencers are the purveyors of the largest media. Michael Bey, Martin Scorsese, Woody Allen, Ridley Scott, James Cameron, Peter Jackson even non English speakers like Ang Lee.

I'm for the best, most accurate word for the audience. The problem for the English is that the language is not exclusively theirs any more and because they did not do what the French did, they have lost all control.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: harmonic miner
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 10:14 AM

For some reason, people in Ireland havs started saying 'standing in line' instead of 'queueing'. Yet they still call it a queue intead of a line. And 'DEfault' instead of 'deFAULT'

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 07:04 PM

"Standing in line' somehow doesn't seem to quite equate to 'queueing'. It sound more subservient.

If you're in a queue you are waiting your turn for somethig to whic you are entited, such as service. Standing in line sounds more like hoping for a favour of some kind.

There's a kind of dignity in a decent queue.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 08:20 PM

"Standing in line sounds more like hoping for a favour of some kind."

I would have thought it was a physical description of what you are doing without moral or psychological weight.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 08:41 PM

Standing on the corner, watching all the girls go by....

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: GUEST,Lighter
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 09:22 PM

In NYC it's notoriously "standing *on* line." Just as you don't "bump" into things or people, you "bunk" into them.

Take it or leave it.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 09:27 PM

forgedabouwdid

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 05:33 AM

A letter about transport in this morning's Times ends ~~ "WE ALREADY HAVE A SYSTEM OF UP TO 100 TRUCKS WHICH USE FAR LESS FUEL, CAN TRAVEL faster when appropriate carrying far more, and don't conflict with other traffic. They are called freight trains." ignore those caps please

They used to be called goods trains, didn't they? Did this particular grey squirrel slip in before the influence of Elizabeth Cotten via Nancy Whiskey & the Chas McDevitt Skiffle Group, or were they responsible as I suspect?

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 07:17 AM

""(Once, twice, thrice a lady anyone?)""

Or in modern USAian: Once, two time, three timer lady!

Promiscuous or what?

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: GUEST,kendall
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 08:07 AM

Talk about a tempest in a tea pot! Is this National Pedants day?
Does anyone outside Maine use the word or phrase, "Door yard" or "Dooryard"?
My very British wife, English, actually, has some quaint words and phrases, such as, "The back garden". Here,. a garden is a plot of land that is used for growing vegetables. We call it the lawn. Ours is 3/4 of an acre. In England, the garden is a patch of land that can be mowed with scissors!

She has her own way of saying things that amuse me, and I don't want her to "Go native". "She flounced right by me into the bathroom so I couldn't have another go at her"! That broke me up! Sometimes when I write something on the computer, I intentionally stick a "U" in color,or humor just to irritate spell check.

Anyway, Not to put too fine a point on it,American English can use a bit of class from the Mother country, but as long as we can communicate, that's what is important.

Everything evolves, even language. That's not always a good thing.

Is it true that Charles DeGaul insisted that they create a French word for television? I'd hate to have his nerve in a tooth.He planted his ass in England through the war among his allies, then when the war was won, he returned to France like Caesar as if he had won the war single highhandedly.

Anyway, I say, Viva le difference. Let's just stop abusing the language by, for instance, making an adjective (Important) into an adverb, (Importantly).
TV people drive me batty by pronouncing particularly with only 4 syllables, and that fat head on Pawn Stars who still doesn't know the difference between Cavalry, and Calvary.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 08:45 AM

Cor blimey Kendall, strike a light Guv, you must have really strong feelings on the subject - that's the longest post from you I've ever read! And I agree, language evolves, and it's hardly surprising, in view of the huge volume of US TV programmes on UK TV, that we've picked up many of your words and sayings. Hell, I even heard a kid in the street the other day declare that, "so-and-so sucks", which is an expression Brits of my generation would never use. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 09:00 AM

I find the word 'lorry' to be hopelessly outdated nowadays. It seems one must say 'truck'. No-one is a 'lorry driver', but a 'truck driver'. Kendall, any size of land around a house here in UK is 'the garden' My last one was half an acre and needed a ride-on mower to cut the lawn. Our present one is the size of a hanky, but is also 'the garden', presumably because one gardens in it! I believe Americans use the word 'yard' more than we do. A yard here is more usually a piece of hard standing where a bit of work goes on, eg car repairs or storage of outdoor stuff such as logs or piles of bricks. A yard isn't the garden.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 09:04 AM

I've just thought of something else, the word 'queue'. I've heard Brits using 'line' instead. I personally queue at the checkout to pay, I don't join the line. Do Americans 'queue'? Are there long 'queues' of traffic during rush-hour, or long 'lines' over there?

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 09:19 AM

A yard is 36 inches.

Dave H

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 09:44 AM

Kendall:
Does anyone outside Maine use the word or phrase, "Door yard" or "Dooryard"?

Ray Bradbury (Late of L.A./born Illinois) "When elephants last in the dooryard bloomed"

Cheers

Nigel

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Lighter
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 10:41 AM

>Let's just stop abusing the language by, for instance, making an adjective (Important) into an adverb, (Importantly).

How is that "abusing the language"? Please explain. What about nouns (default) that double as verbs (default).

(BTW, I haven't heard anybody who says "DEfense" say "DEfault." Yet.)

Many Americans have never even heard of a "queue" or of "queuing." Those of of who have are likely to think of "queueing" as the more "subservient" action. Perhaps it seems to imply to us "falling in line" rather than making (or should I say "taking"?) the tough decision to get yourself over there.

We usually "line up" or "get in/on line." Only then do we "stand" there.

To one who grew up saying "get/stand *on* line" (see an earlier post) "*in* line" sounds a little wimpy and subservient, because idiomatically when people "get in line for something" they dissolve themselves into a faceless group.

Not that any of it makes consistent sense or can be expected to. Language isn't logical. It's psychological.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Bill D
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 11:18 AM

Eliza...most Americans don't queue. They just 'get in line'. Queue is familiar to many, it's just not a common usage in 'most' places. Perhaps it is avoided becaue it sounds like 'cue' which has a couple of very different other meanings....*shrug*.. or maybe because no one wants to remember how to spell it.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 01:07 PM

I remember a music teacher (grade school) who taught us how to sing songs from England.
If a word starts with a vowel, put an "h" in front, and "a" is pronounced "i".
Bellamy singing "Mandalay" solo (youtube) is an example that bears out her advice.

The two languages are getting closer together; television works both ways, with British dramas and BBCNews and BBCAmerica seen over here.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: kendall
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 01:54 PM

We think it quaint that you pronounce Quay as Key.

Importantly is silly and unnecessary.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Lighter
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 02:24 PM

Atlantic Monthly, 1945:

"But it is based more importantly upon the thesis that world organization for peace can work only if an authoritative agency is established, [etc.]."

Sounds fine to me.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: kendall
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 04:24 PM

But, what's more important,...sounds finer to me.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 04:38 PM

Maybe, Kendall; but it is an adjective in apposition, and you err in callling it an adverb. The fact is that, even if you fiond the second uneuphonious [fort some obscure reason of your own, 'important' is an adjective whose derived adverb is 'importantly'.

"This is a very interesting discovery," he announced importantly.

You couldn't say "He announced important", could you; because it isn't an adverb for all your saying. And if, as you would seem likely to suggest, you would substitute, "He said in an important manner", you would simply have substituted an adverbial phrase using the adjective, which would strike me as otiose use of superfluous words.

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 07:08 PM

Quay is pronounced "key" according to the Oxford English Dictionary
(Ki with a mark above the i, which I haven't checked in html).

Merriam Webster's allows kwa (a as in cane) as a third choice, cay in 2nd place, Ke in first.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: kendall
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 07:16 PM

What ever.

How is my spelling?

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 08:14 PM

Eliza, I am shocked. In England "checkout" (meaning a place at which to pay for goods) should surely be termed a "till". The adjacent serving area is a "counter".

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Lighter
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 08:42 PM

Every one of us Yanks knows that a "till" is a cash drawer or cash box, including the drawer in a cash register.

BTW, the English "garden" is indeed called a "yard" here (it would only be a "garden" if vegetables or flowers were being cultivated).

But we also have industrial "ship yards" and "rail yards" and "brick yards."

And "the whole nine yards."

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Airymouse
Date: 10 Oct 13 - 11:21 PM

I am completely unqualified to post on this subject, because for me half the mystery in British mysteries is figuring out what the characters say. But here are a few random comments: PRESENTLY "Now I am a sensible man, by and by a fool and presently a beast" Clearly "presently" does not mean "now." GOT If you prefer "got" to "gotten" how would you like "his only begot son", "moon for the misbegot" or "While I pondered weak and weary over some ... of forgot lore"? AMERICANS can't pronounce foreign names: We can't even pronounce our own names. Just listen to a newsman talk about Norfolk VA or Appalachian mountains. My theory is the news presenter(?) is afraid that the correct pronunciation of "Norfolk" will get bleeped by the censors and that he wants to pronounce "Appalachian" as if it came from Latin (with a long A as in data, status, ignoramus, caveat etc.) Accented syllables: We Americans have a terrible time with this issue. We say de spic* able for des* picable, vague* aries for va garies*, fort A* for forte and then there's the pesky bit where the stress changes with the use e.g., the fre*quent visitor fre quents* the bar or the cabbage re tails* for 50 cents a head, so that its re* tail* value is ... Finally, we in Amereicnsa are losing nice distinctions in pronunciations: The POOR man POURED a cup of coffee as he PORED over the want ads; will MERRY MARY MARRY?

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 01:18 AM

"Presently" originally meant 'now' over here also. Then its meaning drifted to mean 'soon'. My impression is that it has recently [or even presently] reverted to the original meaning; possibly due to US influence.

We too have always made the distinction by shifting enphasis between adjective & verb usages of words like frequent, absent accent &c.

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 03:49 AM

A checkout is the place where the till (or cash register) is. But a till needn't be present and a till doesn't need to be at a checkout.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Lighter
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 08:36 AM

The OED shows both meanings of "presently" arising around 1400, along with the "now rare" sense of "without delay; at once." For some unexplained reason the meaning "now" was "avoided in literary use between the 17th and 20th centuries" and is considered "by some [sic] usage writers" today as "erroneous."

Go figure.

> we in Amereicnsa are losing nice distinctions in pronunciations: The POOR man POURED a cup of coffee as he PORED over the want ads; will MERRY MARY MARRY?

Not everybody ever had all those distinctions. Do you distinguish "horse" and "hoarse"? (Some Americans do.) Then there's "which" and "witch."

Go figure.

For northerners, the Appalachians have an "a" as in "date." For southerners, an "a" as in "hat."

Go figure.

You may be right about "Norfolk," but "Norfik/ Nawfik" were the only versions I ever heard up until the '90s. (Never lived there either.)

Long ago I knew a disgruntled ex-sailor who said that when conditions warranted the city was often called "Nor-fuck," with emphasis. (There was a less subtle name as well.) Maybe "Nor-foke" is being promoted to
undermine that feature. (Not that it will make any difference.)

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: sciencegeek
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 09:58 AM

The two languages are getting closer together; television works both ways, with British dramas and BBCNews and BBCAmerica seen over here.

LOL England & America.. two countries separated by a "common" language. It does sound like something Shaw would have said.

Every living language undergoes change. Slang and jargon get added in and over the course of time become generally accepted. Or do you really want the Queen's ( or King's ) English to join the ranks of a dead language? Not gonna happen of course, but one should be careful about what they wish for.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 10:35 AM

I used to call a till a cash register. And to me a counter is static, whereas in a supermarket there's a conveyor belt. I fairly recently came across a delightful American couple in Kensington Gardens. They were considering a visit to Kensington Palace, and I said it was most interesting but they may have to queue. This seemed to throw them and they asked what I meant, so I assumed it's a word not often used in USA. I actually love it when language evolves and new, sometimes startling expressions come into use, often by the young. I particularly like Multicultural London English, as spoken by Lee Nelson and Ali G. Wicked! Qualiteee!

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 12:28 PM

'Checkout' is certainly not the same as 'till'. All shops used to have a till, aka a cash register, to keep the money in & get the change from. But the 'checkout' consists only partly of a till, but with the addition of a belt on which one places one's purchases from one's trolley, which are then scanned by the operator & a total sum for payment reported to the customer -- who then, unless paying by credit card, hands over the money, which is put into the till, which is a part, but only a part, of the total apparatus involved.

The whole of the area concerned -- the aisle thru which one passes to place one's purchases on the belt prior to paying one's money to be put into the till, is subsumed under the designation 'checkout'. Probably originally an American word, because the supermarket system of self-service & checking out originated there. But a very useful & comprehensive term it is indeed.

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: GUEST,Allan Conn
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 12:52 PM

" PRESENTLY "Now I am a sensible man, by and by a fool and presently a beast" Clearly "presently" does not mean "now." GOT If you prefer "got" to "gotten" how would you like "his only begot son","

It's not quite right to suggest these are differences between British and American though. In Scotland 'presently' did and still does mean at the present time and also 'gotten' is used. The COD confirms the use of 'presently' in Scotland but fails to mention the use of 'gotten' here.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: sciencegeek
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 12:58 PM

Back in the day.... gak choke LOL, sorry couldn't resist...

well, anyhow, an aside about when cash registers first came into common use.

During the transaction, the till drawer opened and the little bell chimed to let the owner/staff know that the cash drawer was open - detering those whose who would try to steal from the register when it was "unguarded". However, not all employees were trustworthy either, pocketing cash from customers and then not putting it in the till. So along comes the pricing system that is with us to this day... the 5 dollar item is now $4.99. And the till must be opened to provide the customer with their change. It also sounds cheaper... that psychological factor beloved by salespeople the world over.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Lighter
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 01:28 PM

M, you don't need the conveyor belt. Not all "check-outs" have them.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: GUEST,kendall
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 02:43 PM

Change is inevitable. resistance to change is also inevitable.

The Dinosaurs died out because they could not cope with changes.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 03:45 PM

In one grocery supermarket chain here, each item is bar-coded; one shows the barcode to a wand or window, and the amounts are recorded and totalled. Do your own packing. Then you pay with credit card to the "cashier", who handles no cash.

They also have the old-fashioned conveyor belts and a real cashier for the luddites.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Airymouse
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 06:06 PM

Of course, someone living near Norfolk Virginia or the Appalachian mountains is more likely to use the correct pronunciation, than someone living elsewhere. Similarly, we in Virginia are likely to have difficulty with "Spokane" or "Nevada". But it's not a North-South issue. If you put on a production of Richard the Third and you start talking about the Duke of "Nor folk", I think your audience, English or American, will not be happy. Also New Yorkers don't seem to have any trouble with "Suffolk County Long Island". As for using a long A in "Appalachian", nobody seems to want to do that with "Apalachicola Florida" or with the "Apalachee" Indians for that matter. As someone has pointed out, it is curious that there is a long history to defend two nearly opposite meanings of "presently". I think this is true of "cleave", but if you go back far enough, the two opposite meanings of "cleave" came from two different words.
P.S. I've noticed that the British do use "do" differently from us.

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 11:04 PM

Do we?

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Oct 13 - 11:17 PM

Re that old Madonna number Hanky Panky ("Nothing like a good spanky!"), & the lines "All I want is the back of your hand Somewhere on my behind". It occurs to me that, to us, 'the back of the hand' means the knuckle side, which might sometimes be used aggressively across the face but it would be difficult to administer in a spanking on the buttocks, and what she must have meant was what we would call "The flat of the your hand", ie the palm side.

So have I got it right that Americans think of the hand the opposite way around from us ie, with its 'back' on the opposite side?

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Gibb Sahib
Date: 12 Oct 13 - 12:13 AM

So have I got it right that Americans think of the hand the opposite way around from us ie, with its 'back' on the opposite side?

No, it's the same side.

Americans are just masters at slapping asses. The variations in the way we that slap asses is like a language in itself, which foreigners can only learn under the great risk of their identity dissolving into vapor, or that pink stuff Chicken McNuggets are made from.

One fine day, perhaps, Britons will learn to slap asses in the back-handed way. They'll dub it "The American way," just to be clear. Part of the population will rush to do it that way just because it is the American way. The trend will spread from Liverpool, whose fake-tanned population will embrace it with a will, while Southern urbanites will disparage it. But it will finally spread to the communities outside London, and even the old country geezers will take notice. News outlets will deem it a "chav" thing, and others will use its example rhetorically to express their on-going bitterness (or, "butthurtness," in America-speak) over the fact that American ways have spread in the world, and Chinese students are not putting a "u" in the word "color."

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: GUEST,Allan Conn
Date: 12 Oct 13 - 05:36 AM

Re the Madonna thing. A bit of a sidestep but I've never understood the lyric in Sting's "An Englishman In New York" that is the bit that says "I don't like coffee, I take tea my dear, I like my toast done on one side".

I don't know anyone who has their toast done like that and had never heard the idea prior to hearing this song. Is it something peculiar to parts of England, to parts of English society, is it just something US folk think English people do, or is it just a daft lyric?

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: mayomick
Date: 12 Oct 13 - 08:32 AM

"that old Madonna number Hanky Panky" The use of "number" in that particular way - from which country does it come, MgM ?

I don't think the problem that most people have is with Americanisms (or Britishisms). It's the fact that you so often first comes across the new words or phrases when speaking to followers of naff TV shows and ads that bothers most people. Guardian readers resent hearing buzzwords that they suspect must have originated with somebody like Ruby Wax - especially when they know that they will have to use such words sooner or later to make themselves understood in the modern world. I'm sure many Americans must fear that the use of British English would make them sound pretentious .


Here are some words and phrases from wiki's entry on the American lexicon:

strike it rich. The word blizzard probably originated in the West. A couple of notable late 18th century additions are the verb belittle and the noun bid, both first used in writing by Thomas Jefferson.

caucus, gerrymander, filibuster,exit poll).

commuter (from commutation ticket), concourse, to board (a vehicle), to park, double-park and parallel park (a car), double decker or the noun terminal
breakeven, merger, delisting, downsize, disintermediation, bottom line;
hobo, bouncer, bellhop, roustabout, white collar, blue collar, employee, boss [from Dutch], intern,busboy, mortician, senior citizen), businesses and workplaces (department store, supermarket, thrift store, gift shop, drugstore,motel, main street, gas station, hardware store, savings and loan, hock [also from Dutch]), as well as general concepts and innovations (automated teller machine, smart card, cash register, dishwasher, reservation [as at hotels], pay envelope, movie, mileage, shortage, outage, blood bank

, disc jockey, boost, bulldoze and jazz, originated as American slang. Among the many English idioms of U.S. origin are get the hang of, bark up the wrong tree, keep tabs, run scared, take a backseat, have an edge over, stake a claim, take a shine to, in on the ground floor, bite off more than one can chew, off/on the wagon, stay put, inside track, stiff upper lip, bad hair day, throw a monkey wrench, under the weather, jump bail, come clean, come again?, it ain't over till it's over, what goes around comes around, and will the real x please stand

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 12 Oct 13 - 08:36 AM

We don't have monkey wrenches; they are still spanners, I think, & a spanner is what we throw into the works to disrupt processes.

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: American English usages taking over Brit
From: Lighter
Date: 12 Oct 13 - 09:21 AM

Since the Appalachians extend into Canada, the "correct" pronunciation is entirely moot.

Older New Yorkers usually don't enunciate the "r" in "New York." Younger ones do. Which is "correct"?

(If you say "the one that matches the spelling," you'll be stuck with "Nor-folk" - with an "L.")

My larger point is, "Go figure." (A relatively recent Americanism, useful and concise, if a bit tart for some tastes.)