First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....

Subject: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: skarpi
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 03:59 PM

Hallo all , today we just opened the first hydrogen station
for smaller cars in the world , ( or that is what they tell us )

so now I can sell my diesel and get me a Toyota prius hydrogen car .

How cool is that , but :>( unless every nation do something
to stopp or lower the glopal warming .......... well this is
a step .......

stainable Marine and Road Transport, Hydrogen in Iceland

there you find more info about hydrogen .....

All the best skarpi Iceland

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: MMario
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 04:05 PM

Whether or not it is sustainable depends on how they are producing the hydrogen; but since Iceland does have access to geothermal power Iceland can probably do it. On the other hand, in many locations the energy required to produce the hydrogen would be more then if you just used the oil in the first place.

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: Amos
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 04:09 PM

DIg deeper, MM! The thermal energy is down there, I guarantee!! Keep digging!!! You can do it, man!


A

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: skarpi
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 04:12 PM

I am very suprised that the USA has not used the thermal energy yet
you have alot of it

All the best Skarpi Icel

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: BanjoRay
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 06:48 PM

All that thermal energy in desert country - totally unused. Generate electricity with it, cable it to the coast and electrolyse sea water. Free hydrogen (and oxygen) once you've paid the setup costs.
Well, that's the world sorted out - what shall I do next?
Cheers
Ray

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: Tweed
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 07:20 PM

Good one Ray!

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 08:00 PM

I don't know, Skarpi. We're sitting right on the Yellowstone Caldera and in a area just as seismically active as you could want and NOBODY is looking at geothermal. Wind, yeah. Solar, yeah. But not geothermal, for some reason.

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: San Francisco Bill
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 09:32 PM

Up in Northern California, the electric utility has a plant called "The Geysers". Guess what power it works on?

I don't believe this 'global warming" hokum in the least. I think that - just like the oil and rubber companies did after WW2, in convincing us to rip out the interurban trains and streetcar tracks - the powers behind the global warming *Crisis* are in it for the money.

That said, I have insulated my house, put in double pane windows and any light bulb not flourescent is on a dimmer. We have bought energy star appliances. I drive a little 4 banger truck.

I do this because it saves money - and it's the right thing to do: The sooner we can cut our dependence with the war-torn mideast, the better (although most of their oil goes to Europe, Japan and China). Most of the USA imported oil comes from South America, Mexico and Canada.

Still, if we can make and handle (it's not easy) Hydrogen as a fuel, I'll use it.

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 10:55 PM

I think, Bill, that you're making a common mistake. You're confusing facts and theories.

The fact is that the average ambient global temperature has risen over the past couple of hundred years. The fact is that the Arctic (but not necessarily Antarctic) ice cap is melting. These are facts, and as such are not debatable. (If you doubt the facts, go look for yourself.)

WHY these things are happening is very debatable. You can disbelieve in any theory of WHY the temperatures are rising and the Arctic ice cap is melting. Heck, I think it's because Martians have been cooking the Earth with a heat ray and you can disagree with me or not, I don't care.

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: Metchosin
Date: 28 Nov 07 - 11:19 PM

skarpi, good news! but I'm pretty certain its not the first one in the world. We've had one here since 2002 and are in the process of building others.

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: skarpi
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 01:33 AM

Banjo ray , start drilling use the geothermal power its there
down under , use it to heat upp the houses , and if Yellow stone
is so big with it then start drilling .

Metchosin , like I said ( as they tell us ? ) but if there are
more , then better .:>)

All the best Skarpi Iceland .

P.s I was told yesterday that there is sort of a agreement
that Iceland and USA should work together to build up
geothermal power station ??? this is what I heard but ........

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 09:21 AM

Skarpi is gonna lord it o'er us all if we tell him that a UN study says: Iceland best place to live

Reuters
updated 7:38 a.m. CT, Tues., Nov. 27, 2007
BRASILIA, Brazil - Iceland has overtaken Norway as the world's most desirable country to live in, according to an annual U.N. table published on Tuesday that again puts AIDS-afflicted sub-Saharan African states at the bottom.

[more at the link]

Thread BS: IPCC FAR IV: The Global Warming Reports has a link to the full report, along with some related bits that might be of interest. The one cited here is tough reading if you try to absorb it all; but:

http://hdr.undp.org/en/media/hdr_20072008_en_complete.pdf gets you the full 399 page, 12,297 KB, .pdf report. The table of contents says that the "index" cited in the article starts on page 229, but including unnumbered separator pages you want page 245 of the .pdf. The table that Reuters extrapolates into their conclusion is about three pages. [Iceland is the first line in the Table, but likely would move down if we all went to live on Skarpi's front portch.]

There is a summary report from the same UN group that's only 31 pages, 894 KB, pdf, but I't doesn't appear to include the table discussed in this Reuters article.

John

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 10:08 AM

Hydrogen isn't a source of energy--it's a means of transporting energy. It takes energy to generate hydrogen. In Iceland, geothermal energy is plentiful and cheap--so hydrogen is a practical option.

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: skarpi
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 05:22 PM

dick Gr, yes its an option thats true and a healthy one

"Iceland has overtaken Norway as the world's most desirable country to live in, according to an annual U.N. table published on Tuesday that again puts AIDS-afflicted sub-Saharan African states at the bottom."


John it may well be that this is true , but it aint so sorry

if this would be true , then I would not have to pay for doctors visit
my mom would get full pension from the state and the auld people
would get almost everything free , for examble , buses, doctors , lower medison we have the most exspensive medisons cost in scandinavia
and so on , sorry people I dont belivie this .
there would be no poor people , and so on .

we have a great country and a lot of thing s are good but
many things we have to fix .


how do they messure this ??

all the best Skarpi Iceland

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 08:22 PM

skarpi -

A somewhat inadequate explanation of how they calculate their "Human Development Index" is given in the report:

The human development index (HDI) is a composite index that measures the average achievements in a country in three basic dimensions of human development:
(1) a long and healthy life;
(2) access to knowledge; and
(3) a decent standard of living.

These basic dimensions are measured by
(1) life expectancy at birth,
(2) adult literacy and
(3) combined gross enrolment in primary, secondary and tertiary level education, and
(4) gross domestic product (GDP) per capita in Purchasing Power Parity US dollars (PPP US$), respectively.

A note cautions:

The HDI in this Report is constructed to compare country achievements across the most basic dimensions of human development. Thus, the indicators chosen are not necessarily those that best differentiate between rich countries. The indicators currently used in the index yield very small differences among the top HDI countries, and thus the top of the HDI ranking often reflects only very small differences in these underlying indicators.

For these high-income countries, an alternative index—the human poverty index (shown in Table 4)—can better reflect the extent of human deprivation that still exists among the populations of these countries and can help direct the focus of public policies.

Unfortunately(?) Table 4 shows data for Iceland in only two of the 9 columns, so that comparison is a bit vague.

It's quite clear that the "index" isn't intended to show the "best places to live," and the news release was just some reporter's attempt to make a headline. It's nice to make a list like this, even given the inappropriate "interpretation for us" by the reporter; but such lists generally have little significance - other than possibly for "beer brags."

For reasonably developed countries, the second index is closer to indicating the "amount of misery left in the tolerable places." At that, the US scores far too high and the "score" for Iceland is, at best, ambiguous.

There's not really much significant difference among the "rich developed" countries - which includes most of us here.

There are citations in this report for other sources of details of the index calculations; but this isn't the information I downloaded the report for, so it likely will be a while before I chase any of them down.

John

Subject: RE: First hydrogen station in Iceland fo....
From: skarpi
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 01:37 AM

thanks John , but many of us here in Iceland are not Happy
with this report , as I said many things are good , many more are bad.



but I am still happy with my life :>Þ so
All the best Skarpi