BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign

Subject: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 11:41 AM

Now that the conventions are over, but the campaign is not, I though it would be good to make a thread for the whole show.

For starters, here is a graphic of the comparative tax-reform plans promoted by the two sides. On the average the McCain plan reduces income tax by 4% for those making a million plus per year, and by less than 1% for those making less than 50K/yr.

The Obama plan provides cuts to 95% of taxpayers --those making less than 226K/year-- with decreases from 2.4 to 5.5% for those making less than 66K. The largest reductions would benefit thos emaking less than 20K.

Obama's plan means less taxes for about 80% of taxpayers, compared to McCain's plan. McCain's plan provides the greatets percentage reductions (2.5 to 4.4) for thos emaking between $111K and >2.87M/year.

A

Moved to BS section....clonedude

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 12:00 PM

Danke, clonedude.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 12:40 PM

The link is to party propaganda.
The new Congress will make or break any proposed legislation.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 12:58 PM

Besides, Obama has already changed his proposed tax plan!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 01:02 PM

The link is to a chart of numbers. If they are falsified, please point out how. I hate to disseminate false or misleading information, and I also dislike having good data smeared with idle comments.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 01:33 PM

Political website data is never more than campaign slogans.

If comparisons are to be made, use reliable sources, such as Wall Street Journal, New York Times, etc.
Even CNN- see Obama Tax plan on CNN.com/politics.

I would also ignore material on a Republican website. Both sources are 'dream' stuff.

Obama is an expert waffler; see Associated Press report, "Obama: Recession could delay rescinding tax cuts," Sept. 7. "....Obama says he would delay rescinding President Bush's tax cuts on wealthy Americans if he becomes the next president and the economy is in a recession, ...."
but also-
Obama ".....wants to push for his promised tax cuts for the middle class, he said in a broadcast interview aired Sunday."

A much better comparison was printed by CNN, "What they'll do to your tax bill," CNNMoney.com, June 11, 2008, Jeanne Sahadi.

Of course claims by both parties are so much dust in the wind; Congress will write the final version.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 01:43 PM

Yeah, not only that,---insert generic complaint here---

It does matter what they say now if only to hold them accountable for lieing later.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: pdq
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 01:52 PM

"...rescinding President Bush's tax cuts on wealthy Americans..." ~ Obama

What mealy-mouthed rubbish. The tax cuts enacted in 2002 were voted on and passed by a majority in both the House and Senate. They were signed and became law.

If the Democrats want to raise taxes again, they should should have the guts to say "we will raise your taxes". The American people do not trust Democrats because they never say what they really mean. Bill Clinton's word-twisting was the last straw for many of us (I was a Democrat for 32 years).

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Little Hawk
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 01:58 PM

"they should should have the guts to say "we will raise your taxes"

No politician in North America has the guts to say "We will raise your taxes."

Nevertheless, the cost of living keeps going up year by year, and the dollar keeps dropping in value, and things get more expensive.

Hmmm.

Sounds to me like they have ALL been lying to us, pdq.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 02:10 PM

LATs

Only I can bring change to Washington, McCain and Obama each claim
The rivals, appearing in different states, also talk up their economic plans in the wake of the worst jobless report in five years and the announcement of a planned Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac bailout.

By Noam N. Levey and Maeve Reston, Los Angeles Times Staff Writers
September 7, 2008

TERRE HAUTE, IND. -- Barack Obama on Saturday ridiculed John McCain's renewed emphasis on his reputation as a government reformer, mocking the Republican presidential nominee in unusually sharp language while campaigning in this traditional GOP stronghold.

"This is coming from the party that's been in charge for eight years. They've been running the show," Obama told some 800 supporters here at the Wabash Valley fairgrounds.

"I guess maybe what they're saying is, 'Watch out, George Bush. Except for economic policies, and tax policies, and energy policies, and healthcare policies, and education policies, and Karl Rove-style politics, except for all that, we're really going to bring change to Washington. We're going to shake things up.' "

Ever since McCain selected her as his running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin has cited their reputations for political independence to argue that they would be more effective in changing Washington than Obama and his vice presidential nominee, Sen. Joe Biden of Delaware.

"Sen. McCain has called the two of us a team of mavericks, and he knows that we've done some shaking up there in Alaska," she said at the Albuquerque convention center before a crowd of about 6,000.

Saturday, both campaigns also talked up their economic plans in the wake of the worst jobless report in five years and news that the Bush administration was laboring to devise a rescue plan for the nation's mortgage giants, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

But it was the dispute over who could bring change that created the most friction.

On the second day of their post-convention tour, McCain and Palin sought to woo voters with their message of change in Albuquerque and, earlier in the day, in conservative Colorado Springs at a rally in a breezy airplane hangar. But it was Palin, much more than McCain, who pressed the argument.

As she had in her speeches Friday, Palin lavished praise on McCain and ridiculed Obama, the senator from Illinois, for his judgment on Iraq and his "high-flown speechmaking."

"There is only one man in this election who has ever really fought for you, and that man is John McCain," she said.

Palin repeatedly questioned Obama's ability to reform Washington, but she also took aim at Biden, who has served in Congress a decade longer than McCain.

"Sen. Biden can claim many chairmanships across many, many years in Washington and certainly many friends in the Washington establishment," she said, "but even those admirers could not be able to call him an agent of change."

Obama, speaking in a pole barn where youngsters usually show off their livestock, offered a sharp critique of McCain's widely viewed convention speech, acidly noting that some of the Arizona senator's top advisors were lobbyists until they went to work for his presidential campaign.

"Suddenly he's the change agent," Obama said. "He says, 'I'm going to tell those lobbyists that their days of running Washington are over.' Who's he going to tell? Is he going to tell his campaign chairman, who's one of the biggest corporate lobbyists in Washington? Is he going to tell his campaign manager, who was one of the biggest corporate lobbyists in Washington? Is he going to tell all the folks who are running his campaign, who are the biggest corporate lobbyists in Washington? Who? Who is it that he's going to tell that change is coming? I mean come on. They must think you're stupid."

Obama also criticized Palin, who has touted her opposition to federal earmarks even though she lobbied for millions of dollars of earmarks when she was mayor of a small town and, as governor, she requested $197.8 million in earmarks this year.

"When you've been taking all these earmarks when it's convenient, and then suddenly, you're the champion anti-earmark person, that's not change," Obama said.

Later in the day, Palin said she was "surprised that he raised the subject" and noted that Obama has sought almost $1 billion in earmarks in the last three years.

"Just wait until President McCain puts a stop to that," she said.

Taxpayers for Common Sense estimates that, excluding earmark requests for national programs, such as breast cancer research, Obama has asked for $853.3 million in earmarks for Illinois since he took office.

Also on Saturday, both campaigns addressed the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac bailout.

In Colorado Springs, McCain made only passing reference to the crisis, but later in Albuquerque he talked about a possible federal bailout in the context of the everyday struggles of voters who are were trying to deal with the economic downturn.

"You're worried about keeping your job or finding a new one. You're struggling to put food on the table and stay in your home," he said. "The jobs number yesterday was another reminder of that. Today we're looking at possible failure of our home loan agencies we need to keep people in their homes, but we can't allow this to turn into a bailout of Wall Street speculators and irresponsible executives. We can't let it do that."

Obama, responding to a question after his rally in Indiana, said he believed the Bush administration would have to intervene, at the cost of billions in taxpayer dollars, to ensure that Fannie and Freddie would not collapse and further damage the housing market.

But Obama said that any federal bailout should be constructed in a way that does not reward the executives and shareholders of the two troubled mortgage companies.

"The one thing I want to make sure of is that whatever steps we take that we don't let them make profits and keep those private, but then when they have losses simply those are all public," he said. "You notice a lot of these folks don't like government when they're making money but the minute they start losing money, they think government's just swell."

Amid the day of partisan rancor, the candidates also found time for a bipartisan gesture: a joint statement announcing that they would appear together at ground zero in Manhattan to mark the seventh anniversary of the Sept. 11 attacks.

"We will put aside politics and come together to renew that unity, to honor the memory of each and every American who died, and to grieve with the families and friends who lost loved ones," the statement said.

[e-mail]

[e-mail]

Levey reported from Indiana, Reston from Colorado and New Mexico. Times staff writer Tom Hamburger contributed to this report.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: pdq
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 02:17 PM

Yep, more copy'n'paste sliming, professionally written by the sliming experts at the LA Times (aka the LA Slimes). Yawn.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 02:50 PM

Seems you're doing your own share of sliming from time to time, there PDQ.

Obama's tax plan will not "raise your taxes" unless you are already making huge amounts of money -- >~ $1M/yr.

I take it this is not your tax bracket.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 03:46 PM

I thought that little about US politics could surprise me although much of it can horrify me.

Hello? Can anybody hear me?

You have a recession.

What cures a recession?


Tax and spend. That's what.

All you need to check it out is a time machine or a history book.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 08 Sep 08 - 06:09 PM

MR. Bridge--there are only two alternatives to Tax and Spend. Either don't spend (which neither party appears willing to do) or don't tax (which means selling your country to lenders while you pile up monstrous debts.)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 09 Sep 08 - 04:16 PM

"Times staff writer Tom Hamburger contributed to this report."


                   And did they hold the onions?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 09 Sep 08 - 05:33 PM

"It's true that McCain's voting support for Bush policies has averaged slightly above 89 percent since Bush took office, according to Congressional Quarterly's vote studies. But it has ebbed and flowed. It reached a low of 77 percent in 2005. Last year it was 95 percent. By comparison, Obama's own record of supporting Bush policies has averaged slightly under 41 percent since the senator took office. However, Obama's voting record is no less partisan than McCain's. He has voted in line with his party an average of nearly 97 percent of the time. The truth is that neither candidate can claim a strong record of "breaking with his party" if Senate votes are the measure."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: irishenglish
Date: 09 Sep 08 - 06:18 PM

The sad thing about the mudslinging is that after such a prolonged election, people are starting to get desensitized to it. It's not holding much for either candidate. Obama's got some work to do, for sure, but my feeling is-he's gonna get it back in the public's eye real quickly. McCain may have gotten the best reaction to a mediocre speech I have ever seen, but the days ahead are going to be real tough. Biden hasn't yet begun the fight....to paraphrase. I think he's going to show some definite positive results to his selection very shortly. And Palin? Honestly (and I say this with no attack upon her as a person) is going to have a bit of a struggle when she has to explain her views in person, on the cuff, and away from McCain. They won't be continuing the joint appearances too much longer I would think. All of that is honest opinion, nothing more than my own. But my other opinion is that despite what the numbers may say, there are far more dissatisfied people in the country based on a number of issues who are going to vote for Obama than for McCain. Again I say, not based on any hard facts, just my gut reaction, despite of the media, the radio shows, the blogosphere, all of it.


One last thing-pdq-you never acknowledged in the Palin VP thread, despite attempting to call me out, that you were, in fact, wrong about the number of people who have gone from the Senate to President. Just for fun of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 09 Sep 08 - 10:45 PM

BARACK Obama has dismissed the US presidential campaign of rivals John McCain and Sarah Palin as putting "lipstick on a pig" in his most direct attack on the Republican odd couple aiming to keep him out of the White House.

However the line could be interpreted as a personal sledge against Mrs Palin, Senator McCain's surprise running mate who described herself as a "pit bull with lipstick" when she accepted the Republican vice-presidential nomination at the party's national convention last week.

"We've been talking about change when we were up in the polls and when we were down in the polls," Senator Obama told a rally in Virginia as surveys suggested Senator McCain and Mrs Palin have overhauled his lead for the election to be held on November 5 (Australian time).

"The other side, suddenly, they're saying 'we're for change too'. Now think about it, these are the same folks that have been in charge for the last eight years.

"You can put lipstick on a pig. It's still a pig. You can wrap up an old fish in a piece of paper and call it change. It's still going to stink after eight years. We've had enough," he said to instant applause.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 11:35 AM

But in a longer term and global analysis, what about the baldness gap??

~ Becky in Tucson

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Bobert
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 12:01 PM

There are two different forces at work on Obama's tax proposals...

The first is Obama saying that he would not extend the 2002 Bush tax cuts... The second is Obama's position on giving tax releif to 95% of Americans and increaing the burden on the remaining 5%...

John McCain has been running ads that do not recognize the 2nd half of Obama's tax proposal but only the first half... In other words, they are playing some real games with the truth... Yeah, okay, they are lieing but...

...who really cares???

They don't and they have made that perfectly clear in letting Sarah Palin misrepresent her stand on the "Bridge to Nowhere"...

The challenge for Obama is to point out that MCCain is lieing without saying "He's lieing" because the McCain camp is poised to jump on Obama as running a persoanl negative attack on McCain which, of course, plays into their strategy of having the electorate think:

1. Both campaigns are negative (false), and...

2. Both cmapaigns have avoided talking issues (again false) but...

...these misconsptions have set into alot of voters minds and it's going to be tough to root them out...

But with that said, Obama is still on the high road and if he stays there and jusr runs on the economy and leaves the resy alone, he should be fine by election day...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 12:05 PM

BB-
Youve proved my point. If you want to continue what the Republican administration has been doing, vote for McCain/Palin. If you don't, vote for Obama/Biden.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Bobert
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 12:25 PM

The problem, Dick, is that is exactly wnat bb wants... He has never criticised a single Bush decision or policy as far as I can recall...

BTW, without going into all the details because I can't the themes in my last post were in a Letter to the Editor of the Wsahington Post and I was contacted yesterday by them asking permission to use the letter... If it gets published then I'll get Amos to do a clicky but right now I am sworn to not go into too much detail... The Post is kinda funny about this stuff...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 02:04 PM

"He has never criticised a single Bush decision or policy as far as I can recall."

Then you have not read my posts.

I commented on the poor tactical approach to Iraq, complained that the administration waited too long ( ie, after the WMD materials had been removed) to invade Iraq, gave in to Turkey (risking Kurdistan) and did not plan for the occupation.

Now, waiting to hear when *you* have praised Bush for acting as you wanted in Darfur, etc...

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 02:14 PM

Here are the real things this presidential campaign should turn on:

1. How do we resolve the education gap nationally to create comeptitive science, engineering and business people tor evitalize the economy long term, to create a new generation of important artists to restore the nation's soul, and a new generation of leaders to create vital new visions and direction?

2. How do we turn our lame and limping oil-driven economy, battered by a flattening international market, into an innovative, energy-independent, self-reliant, fiscally sound economy?

3. How do we ensure the fundamental safety of the nation to ensure these things can happen?

4. How do we regenerate an infrastructure to accomodate the new order of magnitude of population of the country, including water, road, waste, and environmental services?

5. How do we manage our relations with neighbors, allies, and other nations do allow thiese thigns to happen with minimum disruption and maximum international benefit?

Note that these are the issues Obama talks about over and over, and the issues that ther media repeatedly avoids, and that the Republicans mock. Note that none of them involves sex, abortion, or a fixation on body parts, and none of them are predicated on hatred, revenge, or unkind attitudes toward others; they arepredicated instead on what is effective across the spectrum of national concerns.

A


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 02:21 PM

The fundamental problem with much education and not only in the USA is that other students admire jocks, and classify the academically able as "geeks".

This follows into politics where those who do actually have and display a detailed understanding are dismissed as "policy wonks".

If a Frenchman in France says he is an intellectual others nod approvingly.

In the UK (and, I suspect, much of the USA) if a man says he is an intellectual, the reply is moronic violence.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 02:27 PM

A critical part of the problem, I agree. While I think athletic excellence is wonderful, the notion of raising it to the summum bonum of learning at the cost of a wonderful rich array of much deeper and meaningful subjects is barbaric, IMHO.

When the barbarians arrive at our gates this time, they will be riding giant, lipstick-smeared boarhogs.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: irishenglish
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 03:08 PM

You know, I only said this yesterday, but again today I saw another joint appearance by McCain/Palin. When are they going to go in seperate directions on the trail? Also, Biden has been REAL quiet overall. Do we think he's working on a calculated response to Palin?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Bobert
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 03:09 PM

Actually, bb, Bush has handled the crisis in Georgia half right and a lot better than McCain...

Yeah, the sabre rattlin' is way down for this White House... Of course, if John McCain were the C-in-C he would have US embroiled in a nasty proxy war in Georgia with his cowboy mentality of the world but...

...me thinks that Bush has had his fill of war... It took long enough but I think is finally getting it...

That5 is waht worries me about McCain, however... I firmly believe that with his hot temper and his ractionary personality that he'd have US in another war within his 1st year...

As a citizen, he scares the living heck outta me...

But Bush??? I'd give him a B- on Georgia...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 03:11 PM

Gov. Edward G. Rendell of Pennsylvania just accused the campaign of Senator John McCain and Gov. Sarah Palin of flat-out "lying" about Senator Barack Obama's plan on taxes.

Mr. Obama would cut taxes for the majority of Americans, according to theTax Policy Center that has examined his proposals, and yet the McCain campaign continues to say that Mr. Obama would raise them.

"I call on Senator McCain to stop misleading, stop lying, about Senator Obama's tax plan," Mr. Rendell said in a conference call with reporters.

Politicians rarely accuse each other of lying, preferring euphemisms instead. Mr. Rendell's unusually blunt language is a sign of the anger that Democrats are feeling as they watch the McCain camp distort Mr. Obama's proposals (Factcheck.org says the McCain campaign is engaging in "a pattern of deceit") and their frustration at being unable to stop it. Governor Rendell was highlighting the issue in advance of a visit Tuesday to Pennsylvania by Mr. McCain and Ms. Palin.

Mr. Rendell repeated his accusation several times. He said that most speakers at the Republican convention in St. Paul last week had "lied" about Mr. Obama's tax plans and that Mr. McCain's television ads "have continued to lie." He said Mr. McCain was using "the big lie strategy," which is to repeat something often enough in hopes that it will stick. And, he lamented, "to some extent it has stuck."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 06:43 PM

"From the way the day started, no one could have predicted the festival of fatuousness that would eventually unfold. Around 9 a.m., Obama unveiled a new education plan during a speech at Stebbins High School in Riverside, Ohio. Breaking with Democratic orthodoxy (and the powerful teachers' unions) to embrace reform concepts normally associated with the GOP, Obama promised to double funding for charter schools and to launch a merit-pay program that would hold public-school instructors to higher standards of accountability. It was a serious package of policy proposals meant to address one of America's most pressing problems. At the same time, Obama unleashed a new ad (titled "What Kind?") meant to amplify the day's education message by drawing contrasts with McCain's record. "John McCain voted to cut education funding," it said. "He even proposed abolishing the Department of Education." Not exactly pattycake--but it was all policy, nothing personal, and pretty much par for the course.

The McCain campaign quickly saw and seized its opening. Instead of engaging Obama in a debate about the future of public education--McCain supports school vouchers, for example; Obama doesn't--Crystal City passed Go, waved off the $200 and skipped straight to the senseless mudslinging. In a hastily assembled response ad called "Education," McCain claimed that "Obama's one accomplishment" in the area of education was "legislation to teach 'comprehensive sex education' to kindergartners." "Learning about sex before learning to read?" intoned the announcer. "Wrong on education. Wrong for your family." Thus our bright, shining new era of inanity began in earnest. The point of the bill in question--which as an Illinois state senator Obama voted for but did not sponsor, and which never passed--was not to give kindergartners explicit sex-ed lessons. It was to give local school boards the ability to warn young children about inappropriate touching and sexual predators. Offended parents even could opt out of the program.

Maybe McCain thinks cautioning kids about creeps is a bad thing, but I doubt it. I even doubt that McCain buys what his own ad is slimily implying--that Obama is some sort of perverted sexual deviant who wants to parade pornographic images in front of the nation's prepubescent children. But the problem is, McCain is treating the American people as if they're stupid enough to believe just that. Obama spokesman Bill Burton called the effort "shameful and downright perverse." I think "cynical" is more accurate.

Incredibly, the day only got more asinine from there. After Burton pissily, counterproductively questioned McCain's "honor"--a move that prompted teeth-gnashing and garment-rending among the Arizona's senators martial minions--Obama went on stage in Lebanon, Va., and said of McCain's newfound "change" message that "you can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig." Again, Crystal City was ready to pounce. Reminding voters that Palin had used the word "lipstick" in her convention speech while joking about the "difference between a pit bull and a hockey mom," former Massachusetts governor and current McCain surrogate Jane Swift quickly declared, in full faux-outrage mode, that Obama had "uttered what I can only deem to be disgraceful comments comparing our vice presidential nominee, Governor Palin, to a pig" and demanded an apology. Soon, other Republican flacks--all of them women, incidentally--were weighing in, as well. Meanwhile, Team McCain slapped together another ad, "Lipstick," told reporters that it would "air" on the "Web" and watched with delight as Chris Matthews and Co. broadcast it for free (predictably enough) on their evening gabfests.

The point, of course, was get everyone speculating about whether or not Obama had committed a heinous act of "sexism" and change the day's debate from education to gender insensitivity. Never mind that "you can put lipstick on a pig" is an old idiomatic expression. Never mind that Obama was talking about McCain--not Palin--when he used it. Never mind that Obama also said that "you can wrap an old fish in a piece of paper called 'change,' [but] it's still gonna stink after eight years." Never mind that McCain's former press secretary, Torie Clarke, wrote a book called "Lipstick on a Pig: Winning in the No-Spin Era." Never mind that Elizabeth Edwards once compared McCain's health-care plan to "painting lipstick on a pig." Never mind that Obama has used the phrase before, claiming last September that Gen. David Petraeus "has done his best to try to figure out how to put lipstick on a pig" in Iraq. And never mind that McCain said the same thing of Hillary Clinton's health-care plan the following month, characterizing it as "eerily" similar to her failed 1993 proposal. "I think they put some lipstick on a pig," McCain said, "but it's still a pig.""

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 10 Sep 08 - 11:55 PM

Tonight on NBC the commentator told Williams that the Republican candidate and his minions are doing this on purpose. He said they are consciously latching onto anything they can that will derail any talk about the economy, for instance, with the hope and belief that it buys them time. The current economy, he said, is not a strong point for the Republicans and so they don't want to discuss it.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Sep 08 - 06:39 AM

http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1840327,00.html?cnn=yes


"Key to McCain's lead in Virginia and Missouri is his appeal to Independent voters. While Obama holds an edge over McCain with self-identified moderate voters in all four states, he's losing among Independent voters in Virginia by 9 percentage points and in Missouri by 18 percentage points. The surveys ask participants to identify themselves by both party — Republican, Democrat and Independent — and ideology (conservative, moderate and liberal). On the income front, Obama is winning by double digits among those making less than $50,000 a year in all four states."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 11 Sep 08 - 01:09 PM

But the vice president isn't supposed to get any attention, and all people can talk about is Palin, Palin, Palin!

True. I think that's because she's from Alaska. It's got that frontier aura that we've missed since all the cowboy television series were canceled a generation ago. Plus, it gives us the opportunity to talk a lot about moose, which are a funny animal no matter how you slice it. If Palin had been a deer-hunting mom from New Jersey, John McCain would have gotten no post-convention bump whatsoever.

McCain, by the way, is the Republican nominee for president. You may remember him from the Sarah Palin convention in Minneapolis, where he gave a speech and was congratulated by Sarah Palin.

Have you seen that Republican lipstick video? They're trying to say Obama called her a pig!

Obama simply brought up the old saw about how "you can put lipstick on a pig; it's still a pig." The Republicans seem to be assuming that since Palin has a joke about how hockey moms are pit bulls with lipstick, all references to mammals wearing lip rouge are about her.

If you really want to see a strange line of attack, take a look at the wolf ad. It cuts from Palin's face to Obama's to packs of wolves prowling through the forest, presumably in search of vice-presidential prey. Then comes the text claiming that as Barack drops in the polls, "he'll try to destroy her." Given Palin's affection for shooting wolves from airplanes with high-powered rifles, it'd be more appropriate to have them cowering in their dens while she aims her machine gun from a diving Cessna.

You don't seem to appreciate how critical this election is.

Well, I definitely appreciate how long this election is. Time only seems short because these people have already been running for a year. Calm down. Remember, that 17-mile-long Swiss particle collider that people were afraid would create a black hole that swallows the Earth? It started operation this week. And so far, no planet-eating black holes. So you see, things could be worse.

(NYT)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 01:53 AM

Blizzard of Lies


By PAUL KRUGMAN (NYT)
Published: September 11, 2008

Did you hear about how Barack Obama wants to have sex education in kindergarten, and called Sarah Palin a pig? Did you hear about how Ms. Palin told Congress, "Thanks, but no thanks" when it wanted to buy Alaska a Bridge to Nowhere?


These stories have two things in common: they're all claims recently made by the McCain campaign — and they're all out-and-out lies.

Dishonesty is nothing new in politics. I spent much of 2000 — my first year at The Times — trying to alert readers to the blatant dishonesty of the Bush campaign's claims about taxes, spending and Social Security.

But I can't think of any precedent, at least in America, for the blizzard of lies since the Republican convention. The Bush campaign's lies in 2000 were artful — you needed some grasp of arithmetic to realize that you were being conned. This year, however, the McCain campaign keeps making assertions that anyone with an Internet connection can disprove in a minute, and repeating these assertions over and over again.

Take the case of the Bridge to Nowhere, which supposedly gives Ms. Palin credentials as a reformer. Well, when campaigning for governor, Ms. Palin didn't say "no thanks" — she was all for the bridge, even though it had already become a national scandal, insisting that she would "not allow the spinmeisters to turn this project or any other into something that's so negative."

Oh, and when she finally did decide to cancel the project, she didn't righteously reject a handout from Washington: she accepted the handout, but spent it on something else. You see, long before she decided to cancel the bridge, Congress had told Alaska that it could keep the federal money originally earmarked for that project and use it elsewhere.

So the whole story of Ms. Palin's alleged heroic stand against wasteful spending is fiction.

Or take the story of Mr. Obama's alleged advocacy of kindergarten sex-ed. In reality, he supported legislation calling for "age and developmentally appropriate education"; in the case of young children, that would have meant guidance to help them avoid sexual predators.

And then there's the claim that Mr. Obama's use of the ordinary metaphor "putting lipstick on a pig" was a sexist smear, and on and on.

Why do the McCain people think they can get away with this stuff? Well, they're probably counting on the common practice in the news media of being "balanced" at all costs. You know how it goes: If a politician says that black is white, the news report doesn't say that he's wrong, it reports that "some Democrats say" that he's wrong. Or a grotesque lie from one side is paired with a trivial misstatement from the other, conveying the impression that both sides are equally dirty.

They're probably also counting on the prevalence of horse-race reporting, so that instead of the story being "McCain campaign lies," it becomes "Obama on defensive in face of attacks."

Still, how upset should we be about the McCain campaign's lies? I mean, politics ain't beanbag, and all that.

One answer is that the muck being hurled by the McCain campaign is preventing a debate on real issues — on whether the country really wants, for example, to continue the economic policies of the last eight years.

But there's another answer, which may be even more important: how a politician campaigns tells you a lot about how he or she would govern.

I'm not talking about the theory, often advanced as a defense of horse-race political reporting, that the skills needed to run a winning campaign are the same as those needed to run the country. The contrast between the Bush political team's ruthless effectiveness and the heckuva job done by the Bush administration is living, breathing, bumbling, and, in the case of the emerging Interior Department scandal, coke-snorting and bed-hopping proof to the contrary.

I'm talking, instead, about the relationship between the character of a campaign and that of the administration that follows. Thus, the deceptive and dishonest 2000 Bush-Cheney campaign provided an all-too-revealing preview of things to come. In fact, my early suspicion that we were being misled about the threat from Iraq came from the way the political tactics being used to sell the war resembled the tactics that had earlier been used to sell the Bush tax cuts.

And now the team that hopes to form the next administration is running a campaign that makes Bush-Cheney 2000 look like something out of a civics class. What does that say about how that team would run the country?

What it says, I'd argue, is that the Obama campaign is wrong to suggest that a McCain-Palin administration would just be a continuation of Bush-Cheney. If the way John McCain and Sarah Palin are campaigning is any indication, it would be much, much worse.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 02:10 AM

This surprised the hell out of me. From the LA Times:

"Sarah Palin's secessionist sympathies sparked minor hysteria last week. Her crime was hailing with round praise the work of the cranky Alaskan Independence Party, which advocates a statewide plebiscite on the secession of Alaska from the Union. "The fires of hell are frozen glaciers compared to my hatred for the American government," the party's late founder, gold miner Joe Vogler, once said. "And I won't be buried under their damn flag."

Palin's husband was a member of the AIP for seven years, and Palin herself has courted the AIP for more than a decade. In an address to the party convention this spring, wearing a ski parka and looking like she was about to decamp into the back country, Palin told the secessionists, "Keep up the good work." Dexter Clark, the white-bearded vice chairman of the AIP, recently explained the motivation behind the "good work": "Through oppression, greed, corruption, incompetence and folly, the [U.S. government] is forfeiting its moral authority."

The thing is, it's not just residents of the Last Frontier who favor breaking away from the Union. According to a Zogby poll conducted in July, more than 20% of U.S. adults -- one in five, about the same number of American Colonists who supported revolt against England in 1775 -- agreed that "any state or region has the right to peaceably secede from the United States and become an independent republic." Some 18% "would support a secessionist effort in my state."

The motivation of these quiet revolutionaries? As many as 44% of those polled agreed that "the United States' system is broken and cannot be fixed by traditional two-party politics and elections."

Put this in stark terms: In a scientific, random sample poll of all Americans, almost half considered the current political system to be in terminal disorder. One-fifth would countenance a dissolution of the bond. This is not a hiccup of opinion. In an October 2006 poll conducted by the Opinion Research Corp. and broadcast on CNN, 71% of Americans agreed that "our system of government is broken and cannot be fixed."..."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: akenaton
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 02:49 AM

Hoorah!!......somebody "GETS IT" at last.
I just knew it would be American people who saved us all.

That naivety that all the intellectuals condemn, really means that there is still hope in their hearts...Ake

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: akenaton
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 02:58 AM

Hi Amos...lets be friends! When Scotland gets Independence we can visit one another. You can come to Scotland....I'll visit the Californian Free State......Ake

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 05:44 AM

Can I remind people who the principal promoter of political reform was, while that person was running for candidature?

Kucinich.

You're right, the system is broken.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 09:31 AM

"/...It would be silly to count out the Obama strategists; they have defied every prediction and surpassed every expectation thus far. But watching the Obama response to the Sarah Palin frenzy, conjures up sad images of John Kerry, Al Gore, or, dare we say it, Michael Dukakis.

"Once again, we have Democratic dignity on display. They are taking the high road, constantly acknowledging John McCain's honorable service to the nation and saying that Sarah Palin is a tough and talented politician.

"Meanwhile, on the low road and on their high horse, Republicans are making minced moose meat out of Obama. In 30 brutal minutes during the Republican Convention last week, Rudy Giuliani and Sarah Palin took Obama's anti-elitist, street cred and turned it against him."

Samuel then makes this remarkable statement: "Maybe it would have been better for Obama to have called Sarah Palin a pig, rather than to have spent a day explaining why he didn't. Voters actually respond to that kind of jibe, if they think you're fighting the good fight against people who don't have their interests at heart."

..." WaPo

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 10:17 AM

"...It would be silly to count out the Obama strategists;"


             Not really. They only deal with elites!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 10:44 AM

Gee, Rig, that's so succinct, and inaccurate, as to be close to mad drivel.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 11:21 AM

"Palin: wrong woman, wrong message
Sarah Palin shares nothing but a chromosome with Hillary Clinton. She is Phyllis Schlafly, only younger.
By Gloria Steinem
September 4, 2008

Here's the good news: Women have become so politically powerful that even the anti-feminist right wing -- the folks with a headlock on the Republican Party -- are trying to appease the gender gap with a first-ever female vice president. We owe this to women -- and to many men too -- who have picketed, gone on hunger strikes or confronted violence at the polls so women can vote. We owe it to Shirley Chisholm, who first took the "white-male-only" sign off the White House, and to Hillary Rodham Clinton, who hung in there through ridicule and misogyny to win 18 million votes.

But here is even better news: It won't work. This isn't the first time a boss has picked an unqualified woman just because she agrees with him and opposes everything most other women want and need. Feminism has never been about getting a job for one woman. It's about making life more fair for women everywhere. It's not about a piece of the existing pie; there are too many of us for that. It's about baking a new pie.

Selecting Sarah Palin, who was touted all summer by Rush Limbaugh, is no way to attract most women, including die-hard Clinton supporters. Palin shares nothing but a chromosome with Clinton. Her down-home, divisive and deceptive speech did nothing to cosmeticize a Republican convention that has more than twice as many male delegates as female, a presidential candidate who is owned and operated by the right wing and a platform that opposes pretty much everything Clinton's candidacy stood for -- and that Barack Obama's still does. To vote in protest for McCain/Palin would be like saying, "Somebody stole my shoes, so I'll amputate my legs."

This is not to beat up on Palin. I defend her right to be wrong, even on issues that matter most to me. I regret that people say she can't do the job because she has children in need of care, especially if they wouldn't say the same about a father. I get no pleasure from imagining her in the spotlight on national and foreign policy issues about which she has zero background, with one month to learn to compete with Sen. Joe Biden's 37 years' experience.

Palin has been honest about what she doesn't know. When asked last month about the vice presidency, she said, "I still can't answer that question until someone answers for me: What is it exactly that the VP does every day?" When asked about Iraq, she said, "I haven't really focused much on the war in Iraq."


She was elected governor largely because the incumbent was unpopular, and she's won over Alaskans mostly by using unprecedented oil wealth to give a $1,200 rebate to every resident. Now she is being praised by McCain's campaign as a tax cutter, despite the fact that Alaska has no state income or sales tax. Perhaps McCain has opposed affirmative action for so long that he doesn't know it's about inviting more people to meet standards, not lowering them. Or perhaps McCain is following the Bush administration habit, as in the Justice Department, of putting a job candidate's views on "God, guns and gays" ahead of competence. The difference is that McCain is filling a job one 72-year-old heartbeat away from the presidency.

So let's be clear: The culprit is John McCain. He may have chosen Palin out of change-envy, or a belief that women can't tell the difference between form and content, but the main motive was to please right-wing ideologues; the same ones who nixed anyone who is now or ever has been a supporter of reproductive freedom. If that were not the case, McCain could have chosen a woman who knows what a vice president does and who has thought about Iraq; someone like Texas Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchison or Sen. Olympia Snowe of Maine. McCain could have taken a baby step away from right-wing patriarchs who determine his actions, right down to opposing the Violence Against Women Act. ..." LA Times

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 02:30 PM

This moment eerily resembles the situation in 1988 when George H.W. Bush used his convention to define the campaign and never again ceded the agenda to Democrat Michael Dukakis.

Here's the problem: Few voters know that Obama would cut the taxes of the vast majority of Americans by far more than McCain would. Few know Obama would guarantee everyone access to health care or that McCain's health plan might endanger coverage many already have. Few know that Obama has a coherent program to create new jobs through public investment in roads, bridges, transit, and green technologies.

In short, few Americans know what (or whom) Obama is fighting for, because he isn't really telling them. And few know that McCain's economic plan is worse than President Bush's. As Jonathan Cohn points out in The New Republic, McCain would add $8.5 trillion in new debt over the next ten years. It's McCain who should be on the defensive.

It should not be hard for Obama to use crisp, punchy language to force the media and the voters to pay attention to the basic issue in this election: whether the country will slowly continue down a road to decline, or whether, to invoke a slogan from long ago, we can get the country moving again.

One test in the coming weeks will be whether Obama continues to contest North Carolina.

In truth, he has paid too much attention to broadening the political map and not enough to nailing down the states he must win. But North Carolina is a state on the edge. Despite one outlying poll showing McCain with a big lead, most give him an advantage of only four to six points. If Obama does his job in framing a national message, this state should at least be competitive enough to force McCain to expend resources here.

But Democratic politicians say that won't happen unless Obama grabs the campaign back. "One of the criticisms is that he hasn't cut through all the Republican rhetoric to reveal in a clear and simple way what his plan is, which I believe would resonate with the electorate," says Jerry Meek, the Democratic state chairman. Voters, Meek says, "like a fighting spirit."

Rep. David Price, a Democrat who represents the Chapel Hill area, argues that Obama has "offered economic proposals with a lot of promise ... but there has not been the direct personal connection that there needs to be." Obama "needs people to feel angry, he needs to get people to feel something is at stake."

McCain has shown he wants the presidency so badly that he's willing to say anything, true or false, to win power. Obama can win by fighting for what he believes. What he can't do is wait for the media to call McCain out -- although they should -- or expect voters to know he'll fight for them when they are not yet sure that he's willing to stand up for himself.

(RCP site--"Tiptoeing Through the Mud"_

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 04:36 PM

It looks like big oil is dropping their prices for the end of the peresidential campaign.

You have to admit its wierd when the Gulf gets hit by hurricaines the price drops further.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 05:59 PM

"With the Obama-McCain race so close less than two months until the election, several factors could prove pivotal in coming weeks, including how the two campaigns do in winning the support of the roughly 15 percent of voters who could go either way, and how well Republican vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin does in assuring skeptics that she's up to the job.

The poll finds that registered voters continue to wonder whether Palin, a first-term Alaska governor, is as qualified to step up to the job of president as her Democratic counterpart, Joseph Biden, who's been in the Senate for more than three decades.

A majority of voters, 60 percent, think that Biden is qualified to be president, while 31 percent think he is not.

By comparison, 48 percent of voters think Palin is qualified, while 44 percent think she is not.

"While Palin has electrified the base, her overall appeal is less than Biden's," Young said.

On issues, McCain leads on foreign policy and national security. Obama leads on jobs and the economy, health care and representing change.

Voters split almost evenly on which is a better leader. "Neither has been able to dominate on that," Young said.

At stake for all the candidates are the roughly one in six voters still up for grabs, a total that includes those still undecided and those who still could change their minds about Obama or McCain.

Among McCain supporters who are registered voters, 77 percent said they'd definitely vote for him; 13 percent said they'd probably vote for him; and 10 percent said they still could change their minds.

Among Obama supporters, 80 percent said they'd "definitely" vote for him; 12 percent said they'd "probably" vote for him; and 8 percent said they could still change their mind.

McCain leads 57 percent to 34 percent among non-Hispanic whites, and by 53 percent to 38 percent among voters age 55 and older.

Obama leads among voters age 18 to 34 by a margin of 55 percent to 34 percent, among non-Hispanic blacks by 90 percent to 3 percent, and among Hispanics by 58 percent to 34 percent.

They're in a dead heat among voters age 35 to 54.

METHODOLOGY:

The Ipsos\McClatchy poll was conducted Sept. 5-9, 2008.

For the survey, a nationally representative, randomly selected sample of 1,018 adults across the U.S. was interviewed by Ipsos. With a sample of this size, the results are considered accurate within ±3.1 percentage points, 19 times out of 20, of what they would have been had the entire U.S. adult population been polled. The margin of error will be larger within regions and for other sub-groupings of the survey population." (KansasCity.com>

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 11:37 PM

Thanks for the Steinem piece, Amos!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 12:21 PM

I am amazed. In browsing the statewide newspaper in WY, I have read several letter to the editor in which folks praise Obama and weigh in on Palin. I am really pleased with the support I am seeing for Obama. There are a few samples on This Page.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Stringsinger
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 12:27 PM

Anyone who really trusts polls believes in Media Propaganda.

McCain has now become McNasty. His 527's are odious and he approves these
messages. (Even when they are outright lies).

This is one of the dirtiest campaigns ever and believe me, Karl Rove knows how to do them.

100 years in Iraq is too long.

Victory with an Occupation?   I don't think so.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 12:43 PM

As we watched Sarah Palin on TV the last couple of days, we kept wondering what on earth John McCain was thinking.

The Board Blog
Additional commentary, background information and other items by Times editorial writers.
Go to The Board »
If he seriously thought this first-term governor — with less than two years in office — was qualified to be president, if necessary, at such a dangerous time, it raises profound questions about his judgment. If the choice was, as we suspect, a tactical move, then it was shockingly irresponsible.

It was bad enough that Ms. Palin's performance in the first televised interviews she has done since she joined the Republican ticket was so visibly scripted and lacking in awareness.

What made it so much worse is the strategy for which the Republicans have made Ms. Palin the frontwoman: win the White House not on ideas, but by denigrating experience, judgment and qualifications.

The idea that Americans want leaders who have none of those things — who are so blindly certain of what Ms. Palin calls "the mission" that they won't even pause for reflection — shows a contempt for voters and raises frightening questions about how Mr. McCain and Ms. Palin plan to run this country.

One of the many bizarre moments in the questioning by ABC News's Charles Gibson was when Ms. Palin, the governor of Alaska, excused her lack of international experience by sneering that Americans don't want "somebody's big fat résumé maybe that shows decades and decades in that Washington establishment where, yes, they've had opportunities to meet heads of state."

We know we were all supposed to think of Joe Biden. But it sure sounded like a good description of Mr. McCain. Those decades of experience earned the Arizona senator the admiration of people in both parties. They are why he was our preferred candidate in the Republican primaries.

The interviews made clear why Americans should worry about Ms. Palin's thin résumé and lack of experience. Consider her befuddlement when Mr. Gibson referred to President Bush's "doctrine" and her remark about having insight into Russia because she can see it from her state.

But that is not what troubled us most about her remarks — and, remember, if they were scripted, that just means that they reflect Mr. McCain's views all the more closely. Rather, it was the sense that thoughtfulness, knowledge and experience are handicaps for a president in a world populated by Al Qaeda terrorists, a rising China, epidemics of AIDS, poverty and fratricidal war in the developing world and deep economic distress at home.

Ms. Palin talked repeatedly about never blinking. When Mr. McCain asked her to run for vice president? "You have to be wired in a way of being so committed to the mission," she said, that "you can't blink."

Fighting terrorism? "We must do whatever it takes, and we must not blink, Charlie, in making those tough decisions of where we go and even who we target."

Her answers about why she had told her church that President Bush's failed policy in Iraq was "God's plan" did nothing to dispel our concerns about her confusion between faith and policy. Her claim that she was quoting a completely unrelated comment by Lincoln was absurd.

This nation has suffered through eight years of an ill-prepared and unblinkingly obstinate president. One who didn't pause to think before he started a disastrous war of choice in Iraq. One who blithely looked the other way as the Taliban and Al Qaeda regrouped in Afghanistan. One who obstinately cut taxes and undercut all efforts at regulation, unleashing today's profound economic crisis.

In a dangerous world, Americans need a president who knows that real strength requires serious thought and preparation.(NYT)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 12:50 PM

I esp. like this bit form Dino Wenino's letter in Casper WY:

After graduating from Columbia University and before going to Harvard Law School, Barack Obama went to Chicago to work as a community organizer to help those less fortunate than himself. Isn't helping the less fortunate considered a high Christian ideal?

Sarah Palin mocked Barack Obama's community service. Is mocking the helping of the less fortunate considered appropriate Christian behavior? Personally, I found her mocking behavior disgusting and I think that it was disgusting that people listening to this mocking cheered her on.

Some of Sarah Palin's criticism of Barack Obama was dishonest. Isn't honesty supposed to be a highly valued Christian virtue?

So, Sarah Palin calls herself a Christian while mocking Barack Obama's helping of the less fortunate and while being dishonest and Republicans cheer. Wow! Is this the Republican Party's idea of family and Christian values?

I guess this just goes to show that calling oneself a Christian has very little meaning these days and that partisan politics holds much greater value than Christian virtue -- at least for self-righteous people like Sarah Palin and her supporters and admirers.

Actually, I would suggest that the religious right has done an excellent job of reducing Christianity to little more than partisan politics. Is it really any wonder that some people have such contempt for Christianity and for politics?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 10:00 PM

From the Atlantic Monthly:

McCain: Liar Who Won't Correct

13 Sep 2008 03:48 pm

If McCain were a blogger, he would have had to retract by now. But he's running for president of the United States, so he can say anything, lie about anything and not have to answer for it. Yesterday, John McCain lied on national television about something that no one disputes in the public record. He was challenged by the only serious journalists on television right now - the hosts of "The View" - about the large number of pork barrel earmarks Sarah Palin sought and secured as governor of Alaska, including the "Bridge To Nowhere" that Palin and McCain lied about and are still lying about in public. Here was his clear and irrefutable statement:

    Palin's comments came after McCain sat for a feisty grilling on ABC's "The View," where he claimed erroneously that his running mate hadn't sought money for such pet projects. "Not as governor she didn't," McCain said, ignoring the record.

It has now been a day since McCain lied this explicitly in public. And he hasn't yet retracted his lie. This AP piece is dated as of this afternoon. Why not?

Because if he has to retract this lie, he will have to retract his multiple other lies? While the media demands that Obama respond to things he never said and never meant, McCain is not even asked to retract a bald-faced, massive, obvious, refutable lie.

In the last month, McCain has become the biggest liar in the modern history of presidential politics. He makes Bill Clinton look like George Washington.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 10:44 PM

What was George Washington lying about?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 12:13 AM

"I didn't chop down the cherry tree. Honest." *g*

I would love to see Sarah Palin visit The View.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 12:20 AM

Obama has come out swinging on behalf of straight talk and an end to red herrings, PR deceptions, and show-biz politics. The weakest link in this campaign is Sarah Palin's grasp and position on the core issues.

All her tapdancing will not cover that up.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 12:20 AM

Oh, that old myth!

Ebbie, they would eat her alive! :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 10:41 AM

Ah, but she might learn a little humility. :)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 10:47 AM

"I would love to see Sarah Palin visit The View."


                If she's smart, she'll avoid those old hags.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 02:41 PM

Friedman lays it on the line in Making America Stupid, an examination of the Republican impact on American intelligence.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 02:56 PM

Interesting news headline, a quote from Karl Rove!

Rove: Some McCain ads don't pass '100 percent truth' test
"McCain has gone in some of his ads — similarly gone one step too far," he told Fox News, "and sort of attributing to Obama things that are, you know, beyond the '100 percent truth' test."

click

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: akenaton
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 04:29 PM

I've posted this on another thread, you ladies might be interested :0)

Camille Paglia on Mrs Palin

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 05:37 PM

Read THE WRECKING CREW


It shows why the conservatives always run up an impossible deficit they say they are against, but by doing so it cripples every liberal cause.


Start pre emptive wars, ship crates of 100 billion in cash into a war zone, just five it away to Haliburton and anyone who will take it in Iraq, buy 200 dollare per gallon gas for the Army////
It all goes to tie the hands of a Democrratic administration like it did to Clinton. Buy down the deficit a bit and then let the Republicans do it again.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 05:38 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lyaMrS0hzk

Above link to an incident where a woman standing on public property holding a piece of cardboard with "McCain = Bush" written on it is told she will be arrested for trespassing. She says at the end of the video of the incident, Why would a Republican be offended by a sign that says McCain = Bush?


John McCain Kicks Librarian Out of Town Hall Event
"On orders from Senator John McCain's security detail, Denver police escorted a 61-year-old woman away who was waiting in line to attend a so-called town hall meeting with McCain that was billed as open to the public."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 04:51 PM

Sarah Palin is the real deal. When Biden stokes out she will lead from the pulpit and the full force of the US nuclear military.

Who thought that the anti Christ would be a woman?

The campaign is almost drowned out by financial and storm disaster news. Help us on those slow news days...they give us things like lipstick.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:00 AM

Palin is the ultimate small-town renegade rising from the frontier to do battle with the corrupt establishment. Her followers take pride in the way she has aroused fear, hatred and panic in the minds of the liberal elite. The feminists declare that she's not a real woman because she doesn't hew to their rigid categories. People who've never been in a Wal-Mart think she is parochial because she has never summered in Tuscany.

Look at the condescension and snobbery oozing from elite quarters, her backers say. Look at the endless string of vicious, one-sided attacks in the news media. This is what elites produce. This is why regular people need to take control.

And there's a serious argument here. In the current Weekly Standard, Steven Hayward argues that the nation's founders wanted uncertified citizens to hold the highest offices in the land. They did not believe in a separate class of professional executives. They wanted rough and rooted people like Palin.

I would have more sympathy for this view if I hadn't just lived through the last eight years. For if the Bush administration was anything, it was the anti-establishment attitude put into executive practice.

And the problem with this attitude is that, especially in his first term, it made Bush inept at governance. It turns out that governance, the creation and execution of policy, is hard. It requires acquired skills. Most of all, it requires prudence.

What is prudence? It is the ability to grasp the unique pattern of a specific situation. It is the ability to absorb the vast flow of information and still discern the essential current of events — the things that go together and the things that will never go together. It is the ability to engage in complex deliberations and feel which arguments have the most weight.

How is prudence acquired? Through experience. The prudent leader possesses a repertoire of events, through personal involvement or the study of history, and can apply those models to current circumstances to judge what is important and what is not, who can be persuaded and who can't, what has worked and what hasn't.

Experienced leaders can certainly blunder if their minds have rigidified (see: Rumsfeld, Donald), but the records of leaders without long experience and prudence is not good. As George Will pointed out, the founders used the word "experience" 91 times in the Federalist Papers. Democracy is not average people selecting average leaders. It is average people with the wisdom to select the best prepared.

Sarah Palin has many virtues. If you wanted someone to destroy a corrupt establishment, she'd be your woman. But the constructive act of governance is another matter. She has not been engaged in national issues, does not have a repertoire of historic patterns and, like President Bush, she seems to compensate for her lack of experience with brashness and excessive decisiveness.

The idea that "the people" will take on and destroy "the establishment" is a utopian fantasy that corrupted the left before it corrupted the right. Surely the response to the current crisis of authority is not to throw away standards of experience and prudence, but to select leaders who have those qualities but not the smug condescension that has so marked the reaction to the Palin nomination in the first place.

(David Brooks, NYT)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:16 AM

The Atlantic's James Fallows, writing at his blog for the magazine, explains why it matters that Sarah Palin, by all appearances, had no idea what the Bush Doctrine was during her interview with Charles Gibson on ABC News.

The incident "implies a disqualifying lack of preparation for the job," Fallows writes. "Not the mundane job of vice president, of course, which many people could handle. Rather the job of potential Commander in Chief and most powerful individual on earth." He later elaborates:

What Sarah Palin revealed is that she has not been interested enough in world affairs to become minimally conversant with the issues. Many people in our great land might have difficulty defining the "Bush Doctrine" exactly. But not to recognize the name, as obviously was the case for Palin, indicates not a failure of last-minute cramming but a lack of attention to any foreign-policy discussion whatsoever in the last seven years.

In addition, Fallows notes, "The view she actually expressed — an endorsement of "preemptive" action — was fine on its own merits. But it is not the stated doctrine of the Bush administration, it is not the policy her running mate has endorsed, and it is not the concept under which her own son is going off to Iraq."

Matthew DeLong of The Washington Independent puts it this way: "The Bush Doctrine is the most controversial foreign policy concept of the 21st century, and it lies at the heart of the debate over the justification of the war in Iraq. Anyone who has followed this debate, or the broader national discussion of American foreign policy over the last eight years should be familiar with the concept and [its] association with President George W. Bush."

The American Conservative's Daniel Larison, writing at his Eunomia blog, is even more worried. He writes, "Worse than being simply uninterested and uninformed about foreign affairs, Palin is now in a position where she will have to be utterly dependent on the 'expertise' of McCain foreign policy advisors for her understanding of these matters, and these just happen to be some of the most irresponsible and dangerous advisors she could have."
Palin "tried to bluff her way through" the interview, "pretending to know what she obviously did not know," writes David Frum, a former speechwriter for President Bush, at his blog for the magazine. "It's an understandable impulse, and in the context of a single interview, not so very terrible. But is it an impulse that she'd lay aside once in office? Or is it a deeper habit? A lot may turn on the answer to that question." President Bush shares the trait, Frum says. He writes:

A president does not need to know everything. In fact, it's certainly impossible for him (or her) to know everything that he might possibly need to know. That's what the White House staff — and beyond them the whole vast apparatus of the U.S. government — is for. Collectively, the U.S. government knows a lot. And all of that knowledge is at the service and disposal of the president. All the president has to do is — is ask.

But that's not as easy as it sounds.

Somebody who knew President Bush well once remarked to me. "You'll notice he never asks questions."

"Why not?" I said.
"Because he doesn't know what it's okay for him not to know."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:34 AM

On Monday, the Obama campaign released a list of major female backers--some there from the start of his campaign, but more important, names of women prominent in the Clinton presidential campaign and some visible females who are just now making a public endorsement. Obama spoke to the group Monday in a conference call, first reported in the Huffington Post.

On Tuesday, Ellie Smeal of the Feminist Majority and Kim Gandy of NOW--the National Organization for Women-- hold a press conference at the National Press Club to make their endorsement of Obama public. These Democratic-allied groups had been in the Clinton camp.

On Wednesday, Michelle Obama and Lilly Ledbetter, a leader in the battle of equal pay for equal work, take part in a roundtable in Richmond, Va. and headline a Virginia Women for Obama voter registration rally.

At 8 p.m. eastern on Wednesday, Joe Biden and Clinton will be part of a video forum hosted by Women for Obama.


Biden and Clinton will, according to a note sent to backers, 
"will discuss a range of issues important to women, from Equal Pay for Equal Work to reproductive health, from expanding the Family Medical Leave Act to giving tax cuts to strengthen the middle class. But they also want to know what's important to you. 

Be part of the conversation on women's issues with Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden."

..."Women for Obama" and the Democratic National Committee on Oct. 10 and 11 in Chicago are holding a two-day fund-raising conference in the city featuring the who's who of Obama's policy and political world.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 11:54 AM

RE; Camille Paglia's article (and I quote):
"It is premature to predict how the Palin saga will go. I may not agree a jot with her about basic principles, but I have immensely enjoyed Palin's boffo performances at her debut. A feminism that cannot admire the bravura under high pressure of the first woman governor of a frontier state isn't worth a warm bucket of spit."

It's pretty clear in which direction Ms. Paglia's valuation of style vs. substance tips. Ah, if Clint Eastwood had ovaries....

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 12:10 PM

In Why Doesn't Obama Lie?" SLate discusses the frequency, magnitude, and persistivity of lying in the two major camps. They conclude Obama lies, but much less than the McCain camp, and corrects falsehoods when pointed out much more readily.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 12:52 PM

A discussion of Palin's inclination to lie about things by Eugene Robinsom in the WaPo.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 03:37 PM

Gov. Sarah Palin "knows more about energy than probably anyone in the United States of America." --John McCain, ABC interview, Sept. 11, 2008.

"My job has been to oversee nearly 20 percent of the U.S. domestic supply of oil and gas." --Gov. Sarah Palin, Campaign event in Golden, Colorado, Sept. 15, 2008.

The woman touted by John McCain as the most knowledgable person in America on energy issues has been having a lot of trouble getting her basic energy statistics straight. Last week, Sarah Palin told Charlie Gibson of ABC News that her state, Alaska, produced "nearly 20 percent of the U.S. domestic supply of energy." Yesterday, she told a campaign rally in Golden, Colorado, that she had been responsible for overseeing "nearly 20 percent of the U.S. domestic supply of oil and gas." Both claims are way off.

The Facts
While Alaska is a leading producer of crude oil, it produces relatively little natural gas, hardly any coal, and no nuclear power. Its share of oil production has been declining sharply, and now ranks lower than Texas and Louisiana. As the following table shows, Alaska is the ninth largest energy supplier in the United States, accounting for a modest 3.5 percent share of the nation's total energy production.

State Total production Percent of U.S. Total
Texas 10,829 Trillion Btu 15.6
Wyoming 9,154 13.1
Louisiana 6,760 9.7
West Virginia 4,061 5.8
California 3,198 4.6
Kentucky 3,097 4.5
New Mexico 2,752 3.9
Pennsylvania 2,694 3.8
Alaska 2,417 3.5

SOURCE: Energy Information Administration

After the non-partisan Factcheck.org pointed out Palin's error in her interview with Gibson, the Alaska governor revised her claim somewhat, limiting it to oil and gas. But data compiled by the Energy Information Administration contradict her claim that she oversees "nearly 20 percent" of oil and gas production in the country. According to authoritative EIA data, Alaska accounted for just 7.4 percent of total U.S. oil and gas production in 2005.

It is not even correct for Palin to claim that her state is responsible for "nearly 20 percent" of U.S. oil production. Oil production has fallen sharply in Alaska during her governorship. The state's share of total U.S. oil production fell from 18 percent in 2005 to 13 percent this year, according to the EIA.

The McCain-Palin campaign did not respond to a request for an explanation.

The Pinocchio Test
The Republican vice presidential nominee continues to peddle bogus statistics three days after the original error was pointed out by independent fact-checkers. Four Pinocchios.

(WaPOs "FactChecker"

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 04:54 PM

Who will win the 2008 U.S. presidential election? Ends: 11/04/08 @ 12:00 PM PST
sign up to begin trading in this market...
show real-time results of this market on your blog or website

TIP: Current value = probability prediction will occur, e.g. $10 = 10% chance prediction will occur.
PREDICTIONS CURRENT VALUE TODAY
Barack Obama $65.02 $1.89
John McCain $34.97 $-1.82


THis is a sort of betting pool or "trading pool" run by CNN.

It strikes me as odd that it is consistently in favor of Obama by distinct margins even thought he polls so widely touted have rollercoastered so heavily.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 04:59 PM

That's because it's run by CNN.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 05:49 PM

Nope. It's entirely determined by its subscribers.

(You can be funny without being a schlmiel, Rig!! :D)


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 06:47 PM

With staffers like these: CSMonitor - Jimmy Orr - "McCain staffers attempt to derail McCain's campaign".

Excerpt (Fiorina is co-chair of McCain's presidential campaign):

Then in a weird attempt to clarify what she meant, Fiorina in a separate interview said that John McCain wasn't qualified to run a corporation either.

Then she clarified the clarification.

"I don't think Barack Obama could run a major corporation," she said. "I don't think Joe Biden could. But it is not the same as being the president or vice president of the United States. It is a fallacy to suggest that the country is like a company, so of course, to run a business, you have to have a lifetime of experience in business, but that's not what Sarah Palin, John McCain, Barack Obama or Joe Biden are doing."

WTF!? None of them are qualified? Talk about your loose cannons!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 07:03 PM

What with American elections coming up very soon, Weebl and Bob have
decided to step up to the political plate with this very subtle bit of
satire. Animated by new boy Zekey who is from the US which means he's
probably on some sort of list for helping make this.

Click

MORE PIE!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 07:14 PM

"(You can be funny without being a schlmiel, Rig!! :D)"


                      A schlmiel?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 08:33 PM

Sorry, I mistyped. I meant schlemiel.

A loser or a fool; A person who is clumsy or who hurts others emotionally
en.wiktionary.org/wiki/schlemiel


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:03 PM

Well, I certainly never intended to hurt anybody emotionally.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 12:30 AM

NYT - McCain Seen as Less Likely to Bring Change Poll Finds

By ROBIN TONER and ADAM NAGOURNEY
Published: September 17, 2008

WASHINGTON — Despite an intense effort to distance himself from the way his party has done business in Washington, Senator John McCain is seen by voters as far less likely to bring change to Washington than Senator Barack Obama. He is widely viewed as a "typical Republican" who would continue or expand President Bush's policies, according to the latest New York Times/CBS News poll.

Polls taken after the Republican convention suggested that Mr. McCain had enjoyed a surge of support — particularly among white women after his selection of Gov. Sarah Palin of Alaska as his running mate — but the latest poll indicates "the Palin effect" was, at least so far, a limited burst of interest. The contest appeared to be roughly where it was before the two conventions and before the vice-presidential selections: Mr. Obama had the support of 48 percent of registered voters, compared with 43 percent for Mr. McCain, a difference within the poll's margin of sampling error, and statistically unchanged from the tally in the last New York Times/CBS News poll, in mid-August.

The poll showed that Mr. McCain had some enduring strengths, including a substantial advantage over Mr. Obama as a potential commander in chief. It found that for the first time, 50 percent of those surveyed in the Times/CBS News poll said they considered that the troop buildup in Iraq, a policy that Mr. McCain championed from the start, had made things better there.

The poll also underlined the extent to which Mr. McCain's convention, and his selection of Ms. Palin, had excited Republican base voters about his candidacy, which is no small thing in a contest that continues to be so tight: 47 percent of Mr. McCain's supporters described themselves as enthused about the Republican Party's presidential ticket, almost twice what it was before the conventions. As often happens at this time of year, partisans are coalescing around their party's nominees and independents are increasingly the battleground.

But the Times/CBS News poll suggested that Ms. Palin's selection has, to date, helped Mr. McCain only among Republican base voters; there was no evidence of significantly increased support for him among women in general. White women were evenly divided between Mr. McCain and Mr. Obama; before the conventions, Mr. McCain led Mr. Obama among white women, 44 percent to 37 percent.

By contrast, at this point in the 2004 campaign, President Bush was leading Senator John Kerry of Massachusetts, the Democratic challenger, by 56 percent to 37 percent among white women.

Among other groups, Mr. Obama had a slight edge among independents, and a 16-percentage-point lead among voters ages 18 to 44. Mr. McCain was leading by 17 points among white men and by the same margin among voters 65 and over. Before the convention, voters 65 and older were closely divided. In the latest poll, middle-age voters, 45 to 64, were almost evenly divided between the two.

The latest Times/CBS News nationwide telephone poll was taken Friday through Tuesday with 1,133 adults, including 1,004 registered voters. The margin of sampling error is plus or minus three percentage points for all respondents and for registered voters.

The poll was taken during a period of extraordinary turmoil on Wall Street. By overwhelming numbers, Americans said the economy was the top issue affecting their vote decision, and they continued to express deep pessimism about the nation's economic future. They continued to express greater confidence in Mr. Obama's ability to manage the economy, even as Mr. McCain has aggressively sought to raise doubts about it.

This poll found evidence of concern about Ms. Palin's qualifications to be president, particularly compared with Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr. of Delaware, Mr. Obama's running mate. More than 6 in 10 said they would be concerned if Mr. McCain could not finish his term and Ms. Palin had to take over. In contrast, two-thirds of voters surveyed said Mr. Biden would be qualified to take over for Mr. Obama, a figure that cut across party lines.

And 75 percent said they thought Mr. McCain had picked Ms. Palin more to help him win the election than because he thought that she was well qualified to be president; by contrast, 31 percent said they thought that Mr. Obama had picked Mr. Biden more to help him win the election, while 57 percent said it was because he thought Mr. Biden was well qualified for the job.

This poll was taken right after Ms. Palin sat down for a series of high-profile interviews with Charles Gibson on ABC News.

Over the last two weeks, Mr. McCain has increasingly tried to distance himself from his party and President Bush, running as an outsider against Washington. The poll suggested the urgency of Mr. McCain's task: The percentage of Americans who disapprove of the way Mr. Bush is conducting his job, 68 percent, was as high as it has been for any sitting president in the history of New York Times polling. And 81 percent said the country was heading in the wrong direction.

The poll found that 46 percent of voters thought Mr. McCain would continue Mr. Bush's policies, while 22 percent said he would be more conservative than Mr. Bush. (About one-quarter said a McCain presidency would be less conservative than Mr. Bush's.) At a time when Mr. McCain has tried to appeal to independent voters by separating himself from his party, notably with his convention speech, 57 percent of all voters said they viewed him as a typical Republican, compared with 40 percent who said he was a different kind of Republican.

Although nearly half of voters also described Mr. Obama as a typical Democrat, the party's brand is not as diminished as the Republicans'; the Democratic Party had a favorability rating of 50 percent in August, compared with 37 percent for the Republicans, a fairly consistent trend in the Times/CBS News Poll since 2006, and part of the general political landscape that many analysts believe favors the Democrats.

In one of the sharpest differences highlighted in the poll, 37 percent said that Mr. McCain would bring real change to Washington, up from 28 percent before the two parties' conventions. But 65 percent of those polled said that Mr. Obama would bring real change to Washington.

Despite weeks of fierce Republican attacks, Mr. Obama has maintained an edge on several key measures of presidential leadership, including economic stewardship. Sixty percent of voters said they were confident in his ability to make the right decisions on the economy, compared with 53 percent who felt that way about Mr. McCain. Sixty percent also said he understood the needs and problems "of people like yourself," compared with 48 percent who said that of Mr. McCain.

More than twice as many said an Obama presidency would improve the image of the United States around the world, 55 percent, compared with those who believed a McCain presidency would do so. Mr. Obama also gets high marks for "sharing the values most Americans try to live by," despite concerted Republican efforts to portray him as elite and out of touch with average voters. Sixty-six percent said Mr. Obama shared their values, compared with 61 percent who said that about Mr. McCain.

Mr. McCain, however, was maintaining some core advantages, particularly on preparedness to be president and ability to serve as commander in chief. Forty-eight percent said Mr. Obama was prepared enough to be president, compared with 71 percent who rated Mr. McCain as adequately prepared.

Fifty-two percent said it was "very likely" that Mr. McCain would be an effective commander in chief, twice as many as felt that way about Mr. Obama.

The two men received similar rankings when voters were asked about what had long been perceived as a McCain strength: the ability to make the right decisions about the war in Iraq. Fifty-two percent said they were "very" or "somewhat" confident in Mr. Obama's ability on this front; 56 percent said they felt that way about Mr. McCain.

In general, Ms. Palin was viewed more favorably (40 percent) than unfavorably (30 percent). She was particularly popular among fellow Republicans, conservatives and white voters who describe themselves as evangelical Christians, which explains her energizing effect on the Republican base. Nearly 70 percent of Mr. McCain's supporters said they were enthusiastic about the selection of Ms. Palin; 27 percent of Mr. Obama's supporters said they were enthusiastic about the selection of Mr. Biden.

When asked who they thought would win in November, 45 percent said Mr. Obama and 38 percent said Mr. McCain.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 02:18 AM

hey kat,

Imagine Sarah Palin using a free Yahoo email account to conduct official Alaskan government business including her remarks about her training to be VP.
Now imagine someone hacked this fascile email account.

and then put it on the web.

Yahoooooooooooo


jeez, what an imagination, its getting late

.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 11:40 AM

Poll Date Sample McCain (R) Obama (D)                Spread
RCP Average 09/10 - 09/1745.3 47.0             Obama +1.7
Rasmussen Tracking 09/15 - 09/17 3000 LV 48 48          Tie
CBS News/NY Times 09/12 - 09/16 LV 44 49                Obama +5
Quinnipiac 09/11 - 09/16 987 LV 45 49                        Obama +4
Battleground Tracking* 09/10 - 09/17 800 LV 47 45       McCain +2
Gallup Tracking 09/14 - 09/16 2787 RV 45 47             Obama +2
Hotline/FD Tracking 09/14 - 09/16 909 RV 42 45          Obama +3
Reuters/Zogby 09/11 - 09/13 1008 LV 45 47                Obama +2
Newsweek 09/10 - 09/11 1038 RV 46 46                     Tie

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 11:49 AM

I know, Donuel, effing amazing, isn't it? What an idjit!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 12:03 PM

This might have been posted here already, but the state government in Alaska under Palin has routinely been using their personal email accounts to do state business because they decided their communication then could be kept secret. Communication that is public government business is by law a matter of public record and there are legal standards for retaining those records for a certain amount of time. This problem is not only an Alaska government problem. See this article:
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2008180084_palinemail15.html

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 12:57 PM

Polls: McCain, Obama tied in 5 battleground states

Story Highlights
CNN/Time Magazine/Opinion Research Corp. polls released Wednesday

Poll shows the race for Florida and its 27 electoral votes,is tied

The race, according to the poll, is also tight in Ohio, which has 20 electoral votes

In Indiana, the survey puts McCain up by six points, 51 percent to 45 percent

   
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- New polls in five battleground states that could decide the presidency suggest the fight for the White House between Sens. John McCain and Barack Obama remains a dead heat.

A new poll out Wednesday shows a virtually tied race between John McCain and Barack Obama in key states.

The CNN/Time Magazine/Opinion Research Corp. polls out Wednesday indicate the race for Florida and its 27 electoral votes is tied.

Florida decided the 2000 election between then-Texas Gov. George W. Bush and then-Vice President Al Gore. Four years ago, President Bush won Florida by 5 points over Sen. John Kerry.

The new survey, conducted Sunday through Tuesday, indicates 48 percent of registered voters in Florida back Republican presidential candidate McCain for president and an equal amount support Obama, the Democratic candidate.

"Florida is a state that would be directly affected by offshore drilling, but voters in that state may be more affected by high gas prices," said CNN Polling Director Keating Holland. "Two-thirds of all Floridians favor increased offshore drilling for oil and gas." Watch how the candidates are doing in key states »

The poll shows a tight race for Ohio and its 20 electoral votes. The new survey suggests that 49 percent of registered voters in Ohio back Obama and 47 percent support McCain.

The small Obama advantage is well within the poll's sampling error, making the race a tie. President Bush's narrow victory in Ohio four years ago clinched his re-election.

A CNN poll of polls in Ohio, also out Wednesday, gives McCain a 3-point lead, 48-45 percent. The poll of polls is an average of the latest public opinion surveys in the state.

"In Ohio, higher-income voters have moved more toward McCain in the last few weeks, while lower-income voters have trended toward Obama," Holland said. "It looks like economic issues are increasingly dividing voters along income lines -- at least in Ohio -- in the classic pattern that we have seen in previous elections."

The poll suggests Obama is staying competitive in two red states that his campaign is trying to turn blue.

In North Carolina, which Bush won by 12 points in the last presidential election, the poll indicates that 47 percent of registered voters back Obama, 1 point behind McCain. But other polls in the state suggest McCain has a larger lead, and when averaged in a new CNN poll of polls out Wednesday, McCain has a 10-point lead.

In Indiana, the survey puts McCain up by 6 points, 51-45 percent. The lead is within the poll's sampling error. Indiana has not favored a Democrat in a presidential election since 1964, but the Obama campaign is putting a lot of time, effort and money into trying to be the first since then.

Wisconsin has voted for the Democrats in the last four presidential elections, but it was extremely close last time, with Kerry topping Bush by 1 point. It seems Wisconsin remains divided, with 50 percent of voters questioned in the poll backing Obama and 47 percent supporting McCain.

"Obama's strength is in the city of Milwaukee and along the Wisconsin-Illinois border, where he may have a home-field advantage," Holland said. "McCain does well in the rest of the state."

Third-party presidential candidates could affect the results in some of these states.

When included in the results, independent Ralph Nader, Libertarian Bob Barr and Green Party candidate Cynthia McKinney grab a total of 7 percent of the vote in Indiana, 6 percent in Florida and Ohio, and 5 percent in North Carolina, which could be enough to influence the outcome in those states.

So, where does the overall race for electoral votes stand?

Taking into account these polls, CNN estimates if the presidential election were held today, Obama would win 233 electoral votes and John McCain 189. There are 116 electoral votes up for grabs; 270 electoral votes are needed to win the White House.

The CNN Electoral Map takes into account a number of factors, including the most recent state polls, voting trends and campaign ad spending and events in the particular states.

In the poll, 907 registered voters in Florida, 890 registered voters in Indiana, 910 registered voters in North Carolina, 913 registered voters in Ohio and 950 registered votes in Wisconsin were questioned by telephone.

The sampling error is 3.5 percentage points in Florida, Indiana, and North Carolina and 3 percentage points in Ohio and Wisconsin.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 01:07 PM

Colorado is purple, but I think it is going to be blue come election day.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 01:21 PM

And MD is blue, so it does not matter if I bother to even vote.

As I have stated, with the Democratic Party lock on the 4 MD counties that matter in national elections, ( large populations), the electronic voting machines with no tracability or accountability, and the local Democratic control of the election boards, MD's electorial votes are so solidly Democratic that Abe Lincoln would lose here. A few percent "overcount" in thses four counties will overwhelm even a landslide in the remaining counties.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 01:48 PM

That's a lot of innuendo, there, Bruce. ANything to substantiate your implications of corruption?


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 02:06 PM

Only the same level as you have brought out about Florida and Ohio- ei, nothing that can be brought into a court.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 02:11 PM

I have rtelayed reports on the Ohio and Florida scandals of 2004 as they appeared in the popular press.

You appear to have made up your conjectures out of whiole cloth.

In other news, the Third Wing is still alive:

"Video:
Cynthia McKinney urges new 9/11 investigation http://www.ireport.com/docs/DOC-83498
Cynthia McKinney discusses major issues
http://www.youtube.com/user/RunCynthiaRun
http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=RunCynthiaRun
Press conference, Sept. 10 at the National Press Club in Washington, DC http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_5ivgS4asc
Ms. McKinney on the Democratic Party: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpYlQx2MLuw

WASHINGTON, DC — Green Party leaders expressed support for Green presidential nominee Cynthia McKinney's call for a new investigation of the 9/11 attacks and for public release of important evidence and files related to 9/11.

On Thursday afternoon, Ms. McKinney spoke at St. Marks Church in Manhattan at a 9/11 anniversary press conference promoting a New York City ballot initiative for a new investigation (http://www.nyc911initiative.org). Ms McKinney is speaking at other events related to 9/11 in the next few days (http://www.allthingscynthiamckinney.com/event).

Greens also supported a resolution passed by Veterans For Peace at the latter's annual meeting earlier this week in Minneapolis addressing Bush military policy in Afghanistan and Iraq and impeachment and prosecution of President Bush and Vice President Cheney for crimes, violations of the US Constitution, and abuses of power. The text of the resolution is appended below.

"A curtain of censorship hangs over several major national issues in this election," said John M. Wages, Jr., Green candidate for the US House of Representatives in Mississippi (District 1) (http://www.VoteJohnWages.com). "The related issues of unanswered 9/11 questions, illegality of the Iraq and Afghanistan occupations, and Congress's failure to impeach President Bush and Vice President Cheney deserve the kind of discussion that Democrats and Republicans are avoiding. The Green Party, Green candidates like Cynthia McKinney, and groups like Veterans For Peace are working hard to keep them in the public eye."

Ms. McKinney has supported calls by families of the 9/11 victims for a transparent investigation into what was called a "failure of intelligence," although it more closely resembled a failure of response, of standard operating procedures, and of government officials and agencies to respond, prepare for, and comprehend the source of these attacks. In 2002, Ms. McKinney questioned the Bush Administration's response to 9/11 and said that Bush officials may have had evidence that the attacks would take place. Although she was denounced in the media as a conspiracy theorist for her remarks, the 9/11 Commission confirmed McKinney's assertions. The Green Party has consistently supported calls for a new investigation (see http://www.gp.org/press/pr_2006_09_11.shtml and http://www.gp.org/press/pr_07_29_04b.html).

The Green Party has long alleged that President Bush exploited public fear, anger, and confusion about 9/11 as an excuse to launch illegal invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq, which the administration justified with claims based on manipulated intelligence and numerous deceptions. The party endorsed impeachment of Mr. Bush in July, 2003, and Ms. McKinney, as US Representative from Georgia, introduced the first motion for impeachment in 2006.

..." (See this page for original).

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 02:19 PM

"WASHINGTON, D.C. -- DC Statehood Green Party members responded to published claims that the mystery of lost Statehood Green and Republican primary votes has been solved, saying that explanations from the D.C. Board of Elections and Ethics (DCBOEE) raised new questions about the integrity of D.C. elections.

On October 23, the Statehood Green Party announced that former candidate Philip Blair, in routine review of votes after the September 25 primary election in Ward 5, discovered discrepances: only 89 votes recorded for 140 Statehood Green voters, with 51 votes apparently 'lost'; 40% of Republican votes also disappeared in the same Ward 5 primary (see "Voting irregularities discovered in Ward 5 primary election results in Washington, D.C." or )."

http://www.gp.org/press/states/dc/dc_2006_10_26.shtml

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 03:43 PM

Gee. WOnder what happened!


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 03:47 PM

Well, losing 40% of the votes by the minority party is OK, in DC...

With electronic machines that the Dem. controlled state legislature would not allow to be replaced with machines that provided a hardcoy log, there is no way to verify the votes in MD.

Amazingly enough, the Dems ( who control the voting machines) seem to win most of the elections...

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 04:12 PM

Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, who was to star at two major California fundraisers and an Orange County rally for 15,000 next week, has canceled her two-day swing through the Golden State, campaign sources said.

The change is a shocker, because Palin's presence had electrified the GOP base in California. Party insiders were distributing 15,000 tickets to her Sept. 26 rally in Orange County -- and fundraisers reported an almost instantaneous sell-out of her two $1,000-a-head Sept. 25 fundraising events in Orange County and Santa Clara.

Both fundraisers had generated such high ticket sales that the OC Lincoln Club event was moved to the Orange County Performing Arts Center, and the Bay Area event was moved from the Woodside home of Tom Siebel to the huge Santa Clara Convention Center.


The change comes in the same week a new Field Poll showed that Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama still leads Republican presidential candidate John McCain in California by a whopping 16-point margin.

So Palin's pullout from her Western state swing is sure to ramp up chatter that the GOP ticket -- which has insisted it will compete here -- may be reassessing its Golden State presence. (Team McCain says it's just a scheduling issue.)

The Field poll had some troubling news for McCain-Palin here: The Alaska Gov's addition to the ticket, while strengthening the GOP base, hasn't advanced the ball for the Republican team among the 1 in 5 California voters who are independent or decline to state.

Field Poll director Mark DiCamillo noted this week that those independents and middle-of-the-roaders are the same critical voters who elected Arnold Schwarzenegger here -- and weigh heavily in the election nationwide. A New York Times poll released today, which shows Obama ahead by 5 points, appears to reflect the same trend.

Just last week, powerhouse Bay Area GOP fundraiser Kristen Hueter said Palin was a ''gangbusters'' fundraiser with folks snapping up tickets and coming from around the country for her Sept. 25 appearances.

---

Oh, Bruce!! You don't remember the crooked elections of 2000 and 2004? The disenfranchisement of thousands? JEb's crooked chads?

How easily we forget.

So how is it the Dems "control" the voting machines? In what region?

And how do you know it is not just the aura of incumbency?


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 04:21 PM

At rallies in the week following the convention, the McCain-Palin duo saw their best attendance and a newfound zeal, and the Republican ticket took the lead in national polls for the first time.

But polls show that the momentum has shifted once again.

Palin's favorable rating is at 40 percent, according to a CBS News/New York Times poll. That's down 4 points from last week. Her unfavorable rating is at 30 percent, rising 8 points in a week.

The poll was conducted September 12-16 and has a sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.

Former Bush adviser Karl Rove predicted Wednesday that Palin's star power would wear off.

"Nothing lasts for 60-some-odd days," Rove told The Associated Press. "Will she be the center of attention in the remaining 48 days? No, but she came on in a very powerful way and has given a sense of urgency to the McCain campaign that's pretty remarkable."

But this week, the Democrats recaptured the headlines, and Obama regained his lead in the national polls.

CNN's latest poll of polls, out Thursday afternoon, shows him ahead of McCain by 3 points, 47 percent to 44 percent.

The poll of polls consists of six recent surveys: CBS/NYT (September 12-16), Quinnipiac (September 11-16), IPSOS-McClatchy (September 11-15), Gallup (September 15-17), Diageo/Hotline (September 14-16) and American Research Group (September 13-15). It does not have a sampling error.

After a week in which McCain put Obama on the defensive over allegations of playing the gender card, the economic crisis has given Obama an opportunity to go on the offense. Most Americans see Obama as more capable than John McCain when it comes to handling the economy, polls show.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 04:52 PM

There's a kind of fun op/ed piece at the NYTs which pokes some gentle fun at Democrats: HERE.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 07:53 PM

From Voice of America:

"If we are focusing on economic issues, which has never been John McCain's strength and where Americans are looking for change, and where the CBS poll suggests one other problem for McCain, which is that a majority of Americans see him as a typical Republican, not as an agent of change. The change gap remains extremely strong, then Obama has a very significant amount of traction [i.e., has the potential to gain supporters]," said Norman Ornstein, a political analyst at the American Enterprise Institute in Washington.

Polls have long shown that voters consider the economy the number one issue in this year's election, a factor that should favor the Democrats.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 09:58 PM

It should. I wonder why it doesn't?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 01:25 AM

But it does, Rig. The polls have flipped in the last 3-4 days.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 08:29 AM

Australia always follows US - diplomat

...
"McCain has said that he'll try and throw Russia out of the G8 organisation because of what they did in Georgia, they're going to stand up to the rise of the Chinese military, they're going to stay in Iraq until victory, whatever that means, so in foreign policy it will be a kind of revived, muscular version of Bush foreign policy," he said.

"If Obama's elected ... in foreign policy he will bring back in the Clinton professionals, who are less confrontational, stress diplomacy, stress working with multi-lateral institutions."
...

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 11:24 AM

"A media consensus has formed that John McCain is telling whoppers to win the presidency. Influential commentator Mark Halperin, for example, says, "Lies are more central to the McCain campaign than to the Obama campaign."

Halperin said the same thing in 2004--the Republican candidate was more dishonest than the Democratic one, his lies more "central to his efforts to win"--and he was wrong then.

He's wrong, too. Exhibit A in the media's case against McCain as a man who will say anything to win is his ad on Obama's support of sex education for kindergartners--but McCain is right.

Sure, McCain has sometimes stretched the truth, putting himself in the best light and Obama in the worst. But Obama is now running an ad taking Rush Limbaugh's words out of context and, ludicrously, suggesting that McCain and Limbaugh are close political allies on immigration. Obama has previously distorted McCain's comments about maintaining a military presence in Iraq to suggest, falsely, that McCain wants 100 years of war, and seized on snippets of McCain comments to suggest that he thinks all is well with the economy.

If one were in a partisan frame of mind, one might even say that Obama's self-portrayal as someone interested in reaching across the aisle to accomplish things is a lie. I don't expect reporters to say that. But when they say that McCain is campaigning dirtier than Obama, a partisan cast of mind is exactly what they're revealing."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 11:55 AM

As far as I know McCain is not right at all on the "sex ed" issue, intentionally distorting it to make it sound very different than it is.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: heric
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 01:25 PM

Palin gave the crowd a Wisconsin welcome, "It's so nice to be in a state where people appreciate good hockey and good huntin' and good fishin' and great football."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 01:58 PM

"Wouldn't it be absurd if we had a two party system where one party supported reality and the other opposed it? Sound like a Monty Python sketch or a sequel to the movie "Idiocracy"? Well, "Now for something completely different. It's...John McCain's Freaking Circus!"

(An interesting essay on reality and those who argue against it.)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 06:31 PM

He is still confused or dumb:

On the campaign trail in Minnesota today, McCain incorrectly suggested that the executive pay that former Fannie Mae CEOs Frank Raines and Jim Johnson earned came from taxpayers.

"That same executive got $21 million of your money," McCain said of Johnson. "And the other CEO, another supporter of Senator Obama, Mr. Raines got $25 million of your money. Let's tell them to give it back. Let's tell them to give it back."

Lucian Bebchuk of Harvard Law School, an expert on corporate governance, confirmed to First Read that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were private companies until being recently taken over by the federal government (which came after Raines' and Johnson's tenures).

Read the rest of it HERE.

Whoops...seems she's putting herself in as Prez: scroll down for video.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 06:36 PM

It is our money, though, after the fact. We just have to start paying now, for what we previously pretended was the glory of private markets.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 06:43 PM

Garrison Keillor remarks:

"It is a bold move on the Republicans' part — forget about the past, it's only history, so write a new narrative and be who you want to be — and if they succeed, I think I might declare myself a 24-year-old virgin named Lance and see what that might lead to. Paste a new face on my Facebook page, maybe become the Dauphin Louie the Thirty-Second, the rightful heir to the Throne of France, put on silk tights and pantaloons and a plumed hat and go on the sawdust circuit and sell souvenir hankies imprinted with the royal fleur-de-lis. They will cure neuralgia and gout and restore marital vigor.

Mr. McCain has decided to run as a former POW and a maverick, a maverick's maverick, rather than Mr. Bush's best friend, and that's understandable, but how can he not address the $3 trillion that got burned up in Iraq so far? It's real money, it could've paid for a lot of windmills, a high-speed rail line in Ohio, some serious R&D. The Chinese, who have avoided foreign wars for fifty years, are taking enormous leaps forward, investing in their economy, and we are falling behind. We're wasting our chances. The Republican culture of corruption in Washington hasn't helped.

And a former mayor of a town of 7,000 who hired a lobbyist to get $26 million in federal earmarks is now running against the old-boy network in Washington who gave her that money to build the teen rec center and other good things so she could keep taxes low in Wasilla. Stunning. And if you question her qualifications to be the leader of the free world, you are an elitist. This is a beautiful maneuver. I wish I had thought of it back in school when I was forced to subject myself to a final exam in higher algebra. I could have told Miss Mortenson, "I am a Christian and when you gave me a D, you only showed your contempt for the Lord and for the godly hard-working people from whom I have sprung, you elitist battleaxe you."

In school, you couldn't get away with that garbage because the taxpayers know that if we don't uphold scholastic standards, we will wind up driving on badly designed bridges and go in for a tonsillectomy and come out missing our left lung, so we flunk the losers lest they gain power and hurt us, but in politics we bring forth phonies and love them to death.

I must say, it was fun having the Republicans in St. Paul and to see it all up close and firsthand. Security was, as one might expect, thin-lipped and gimlet-eyed, but once you got through it, you found the folks you went to high school with — farm kids, jocks, the townies who ran the student council, the cheerleaders, some of the bullies — and they are as cohesive now as they were back then, dedicated to school spirit, intolerant of outsiders, able to jump up and down and holler for something they don't actually believe. But oh Lord, what they brought forth this year. When you check the actuarial tables on a 72-year-old guy who's had three bouts with cancer, you guess you may be looking at the first woman president, a hustling evangelical with ethics issues and a chip on her shoulder who, not counting Canada, has set foot outside the country once — a trip to Germany, Iraq and Kuwait in 2007 to visit Alaskans in the armed service. And who listed a refueling stop in Ireland as a fourth country visited. She's like the Current Occupant but with big hair. If you want inexperience, there were better choices."

A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 07:23 PM

He used to go after Jesse Ventura too, one of the few honest politicians I've known in my life time.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 20 Sep 08 - 11:30 AM

McCain stands accused as a liar by a simple reference to McCain's own (slightly) earlier statements. I have never heard a candidate contradict himself so often, and certainly never heard one who perseveres with lies even after they're publicly exposed.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 21 Sep 08 - 03:34 AM

Fran Rich on McCains Truthiness Tactic.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 21 Sep 08 - 08:50 AM

dick g. - You're right! It almost seems like the voters reward the politician who can lie the loudest and most often.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 21 Sep 08 - 11:57 AM

Right to Smear


Published: September 20, 2008
The wholesale descent into Swift Boat campaigning has been blocked — for now — by a federal judge in Virginia. But voters should not rest easy.

---

An interesting warning on thew resurgence of swiftboating, which was declared illegal after it was used against Juhn Kerry.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 21 Sep 08 - 12:09 PM

"...Mr. Obama seems likely to pick moderate justices, who would probably not take the court back onto a distinctly liberal path, but also would be unlikely to create an unbreakable conservative bloc.

Mr. McCain has promised the right wing of the Republican Party that he would put only archconservatives on the Supreme Court. Even moderate conservatives like Anthony Kennedy, the court's current swing justice, would not have a chance.

Mr. McCain, whose Web site proclaims his dedication to overturning Roe v. Wade, would appoint justices who could be expected to lead the charge to eliminate the right to abortion. The kinds of justices for whom Mr. McCain has expressed a strong preference would also be likely to undermine the right of habeas corpus, allowing the government to detain people indefinitely without access to lawyers or family members.

Mr. McCain's justices are likely to join the conservative crusade against the power of Congress. They could be expected to strike down, or sharply limit, federal power to protect clean air and water; ensure food and drug safety; safeguard workers; and prohibit discrimination against women and minorities. They would also likely further erode the separation between church and state.

Mr. McCain has voted to confirm federal judges chosen by Mr. Bush who are radicals, not conservatives. One, Janice Rogers Brown, now on the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit, has attacked Supreme Court decisions upholding New Deal laws as "the triumph of our own socialist revolution."

Mr. Obama, a former professor of constitutional law, has clashed with Mr. McCain in the Senate over legal issues. Mr. McCain backed the odious Military Commissions Act of 2006, which the Supreme Court held to violate the right of habeas corpus; Mr. Obama opposed it. Mr. McCain was a rubber stamp for Mr. Bush's judicial nominees; Mr. Obama voted against the worst.

Mr. Obama has said he wants justices who have "the empathy to recognize what it's like to be a young teenage mom" — as well as to be gay, poor or black. He has promised to make "preserving women's rights under Roe v. Wade a priority as president."

At the same time, Mr. Obama has put distance between himself and legal liberals on issues like the death penalty for child rapists and the constitutionality of gun control. As president, Mr. Obama would probably be more inclined to appoint centrist liberals, like Justice Stephen Breyer, than all-out liberals, like William Brennan or Thurgood Marshall.

Predicting vacancies on the court is difficult. But odds are that members of the liberal bloc, like 88-year-old John Paul Stevens, will leave first. That means that if Mr. Obama is elected, he might merely keep the court on its current moderately conservative course. Under Mr. McCain, if a liberal justice or two or three steps down, we may see a very different America...."NYT Ed

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 22 Sep 08 - 12:23 PM

latest poll results:

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/map/polling/index.html



Who gets which state

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/06/10/electoral.map/index.html

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 22 Sep 08 - 12:41 PM

The national polls, as you know, Bruce, are always formed along a spectrum depending on who polls whom and how.

RCP's current status has Obama ahead by two points on a national average:

RCP Average 09/09 - 09/21 -- 47.6 45.6 Obama +2.0
Rasmussen Tracking 09/19 - 09/21 3000 LV 48 47 Obama +1
Gallup Tracking 09/18 - 09/20 2720 RV 49 45 Obama +4
Hotline/FD Tracking 09/18 - 09/20 922 RV 45 44 Obama +1
Battleground Tracking 09/14 - 09/21 800 LV 47 48 McCain +1
CBS News/NY Times 09/12 - 09/16 LV 49 44 Obama +5
Quinnipiac 09/11 - 09/16 987 LV 49 45 Obama +4
Pew Research 09/09 - 09/14 2307 LV 46 46 Tie

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 22 Sep 08 - 09:00 PM

I guess the bad economic news is turning some away from the incumbent party:

RCP Average        09/09 - 09/21        --        48.1        45.4        Obama +2.7
CNN/Opinion Research        09/19 - 09/21        697 LV        51        47        Obama +4
Gallup Tracking        09/19 - 09/21        2740 RV        48        44        Obama +4
Rasmussen Tracking        09/19 - 09/21        3000 LV        48        47        Obama +1
Hotline/FD Tracking        09/19 - 09/21        922 RV        47        42        Obama +5
Battleground Tracking        09/14 - 09/21        800 LV        47        48        McCain +1
CBS News/NY Times        09/12 - 09/16        LV        49        44        Obama +5
Quinnipiac        09/11 - 09/16        987 LV        49        45        Obama +4
Pew Research        09/09 - 09/14        2307 LV        46        46        Tie

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 10:21 AM

UMass chaplain fails in effort to boost Barack Obama's chances
Tuesday, September 23, 2008


University of Massachusetts officials yesterday quashed efforts by an Amherst campus chaplain to offer two college credits to any student willing to campaign in New Hampshire this fall for Democrat Barack Obama.

Chaplain Ken Higgins told students in a Sept. 18 e-mail, "If you're scared about the prospects for this election, you're not alone. The most important way to make a difference in the outcome is to activate yourself. It would be just fine with McCain if Obama supporters just think about helping, then sleep in and stay home between now and Election Day."

Higgins added that an unnamed "sponsor" in the university's History Department would offer a two-credit independent study for students willing to canvass or volunteer on behalf of the Democratic nominee.

"It is relatively (easy) to do late add-ons," Higgins wrote.

But university officials disavowed themselves of the effort after inquiries yesterday by the Associated Press. They said it could run afoul of state ethics laws banning on-the-job political activity, as well as university policy.

"There is no independent study for credit in the History Department that involves partisan political work, and no such activity has ever been approved," said a statement issued by UMass-Amherst spokesman Ed Blaguszewski.

Higgins refused to identify the History Department sponsor and referred all further questions to university officials.

Blaguszewski said Higgins is one of about a dozen chaplains from different faiths working in Amherst, the flagship campus among the university's five schools.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 10:24 AM

5th Grader Suspended For Anti-Obama Shirt

Last Edited: Tuesday, 23 Sep 2008, 7:51 AM MDT
Created: Monday, 22 Sep 2008, 9:15 PM MDT

Aurora fifth-grader suspended for home madetshirt reading "Obama is a terrorist's best friend." 9/22/08


An 11-year-old boy was reprimanded for wearing a homemade shirt reading "Obama is a terrorist's best friend" to school this week. Do you think it was appropriate for the school to punish the student.




AURORA (MyFOXColorado.com) - An 11-year-old in Aurora says his first amendment rights are being trampled after he was suspended for wearing a homemade shirt that reads "Obama is a terrorist's best friend."

The fifth grader at Aurora Frontier K-8 School wore it on a day when students were asked to wear red, white and blue to show their patriotism.

The boy's father Dann Dalton describes himself as a "proud conservative" who has taken part in some controversial anti-abortion protests. Dalton says the school made a major mistake by suspending his son for wearing the shirt.

"It's the public school system," Dalton says. "Let's be honest, it's full of liberal loons."

According the the boy's father, the school district told the student, Daxx Dalton, that he had the choice of changing his shirt, turning his shirt inside out or being suspended.

Daxx chose suspension.

"They're taking away my right of freedom of speech," he says. "If I have the right to wear this shirt I'm going to use it. And if the only way to use it is get suspended, then I'm going to get suspended."

Daxx's dad agrees with him and is encouraging his son to stand his ground. "The facts are his rights were violated. Period."

Aurora Public Schools would not talk about the case but said the district "Respects a student's right to free speech, such as the right to wear specific clothing," but administrators say they review any situation that interrupts the learning environment.

Paperwork submitted by the school district says Daxx Dalton was not suspended for wearing the shirt, but for willful disobedience and defiance.

The boy's father says he intends to pursue a lawsuit against the district.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 10:33 AM

It appears to me that the school district offered him the proper alternatives.

Had the boy turned the shirt inside out, other kids would have questioned it but the school would have made its point.

The choices would be just as valid if a kid showed up wearing a 'McCain is Senile' t-shirt.

Inside out for that one too.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 10:43 AM

I don't get it. The kid doesn't vote, and dioesn't even understand the writing on his own tee-shirt. Sounds to me like a made-to-order learning opportunity--have him stand up in front of the class and explain each part of the phrase until his underlying ineptitude is blatantly exposed.

The only grounds for intercession is that it is a form of hate speech, not just political speechy.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 10:30 PM

"The kid doesn't vote, and dioesn't even understand the writing on his own tee-shirt..."

               Would you agree that the kid is a victim in all of this, and that making him stand in front of the class to explain his t-shirt would do more damage than good. Are we in the process of creating another Columbine shooter?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Sep 08 - 11:27 PM

The conclusion of George Will's column for today (you might have to sign in to access it):

Conservatives who insist that electing McCain is crucial usually start, and increasingly end, by saying he would make excellent judicial selections. But the more one sees of his impulsive, intensely personal reactions to people and events, the less confidence one has that he would select judges by calm reflection and clear principles, having neither patience nor aptitude for either.

It is arguable that, because of his inexperience, Obama is not ready for the presidency. It is arguable that McCain, because of his boiling moralism and bottomless reservoir of certitudes, is not suited to the presidency. Unreadiness can be corrected, although perhaps at great cost, by experience. Can a dismaying temperament be fixed?

From the NYTs:

WASHINGTON — One of the giant mortgage companies at the heart of the credit crisis paid $15,000 a month from the end of 2005 through last month to a firm owned by Senator John McCain's campaign manager, according to two people with direct knowledge of the arrangement.
Slatest political news from around the nation. Join the discussion.

The disclosure undercuts a remark by Mr. McCain on Sunday night that the campaign manager, Rick Davis, had had no involvement with the company for the last several years.

Mr. Davis's firm received the payments from the company, Freddie Mac, until it was taken over by the government this month along with Fannie Mae, the other big mortgage lender whose deteriorating finances helped precipitate the cascading problems on Wall Street, the two people said.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 06:25 AM

I think most people are aware that McCain wouldn't select Supreme Court justices that would suit George Will. That's probably why its become a non-issue in the campaign.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 11:36 AM

George Will is a conservative. The judge thing is not as important as his conclusion that McCain is not fit to be president. That is HUGE, coming from such a bastion of the conservative base. He as good as told his readers to vote for Obama because McCain is not capable.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 03:13 PM

U.S. Democrat Barack Obama has opened a nine-point lead in the race for president against Republican John McCain amid voter concerns over the U.S. financial crisis, according to a poll published Wednesday.

The Washington Post-ABC news poll suggests Obama has backing from 52 per cent of voters, compared with McCain, who has support from 43 per cent of voters.

According to the poll, respondents gave Obama a double-digit edge in his ability to handle a troubled economy over McCain, while just nine per cent of those questioned rated the economy as being in good or excellent shape, reported the Washington Post.

The new numbers mark the first time Obama has garnered more than 50 per cent of the vote, and indicates a significant shift in voter attitudes compared with two weeks ago at the conclusion of the Republican national convention.

With McCain's newly appointed vice-presidential candidate Sarah Palin garnering headlines and handclaps across the United States, the Republican candidate held a slight lead in polls, edging Obama 49 per cent to 47 per cent.

But the economy has since become the top issue in the race to the White House following widespread turmoil in U.S. financial markets.

McCain has repeatedly come under criticism for his handling of the issue, particularly for comments he made a week ago when he characterized the economy as "fundamentally sound." ...

(CBC News)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 09:37 PM

"'McCain has repeatedly come under criticism for his handling of the issue, particularly for comments he made a week ago when he characterized the economy as "fundamentally sound." ...'"


             Fortunately, he didn't really screw up and indicate that he thought Barack Obama was fundmentally sound."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ed T
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 10:12 PM

Much noise in your house? Could it impact your politics?
Check out the latest science.

http://www.world-science.net/othernews/080917_physiology.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 11:09 PM

Rig:

What is this passion of yours for the snide, the snarky, and the cutting? Are you working on an MA degree in passive aggression?

Obama IS fundamentally sound, and any one who has examined his policies and accomplishments would recognize that.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 08:35 AM

"Obama IS fundamentally sound..."

                     At least Tony Rezko thinks so...

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 12:32 PM

I suspect you consider yourself a wit, Rig. As my brothers used to tell each other, at least you are half right. *g*

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 01:28 PM

Vice presidential candidate Gov. Sarah Palin met with a series of world leaders as a sort of crash course on foreign policy. What do you think?

Johnny Moreland,
Hotel Clerk
"Wow, she's a lot better at meeting people than I expected."

Kevin Freamon,
Tour Guide
"All she needs to do is make a simple mnemonic device for remembering each country, its form of government, its gross domestic product, its military history, its relationship to the United States, and what it's best known for."

Karla Greggs,
Rock Climbing Teacher
"This should allay voters' concerns about electing a candidate with no experience being photographed with foreign leaders."

(Compliments of the wags at The Onion, a parody site.)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 01:36 PM

FOX said that Obama and Olain have now met with the same number of foreign leaders.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 02:28 PM

Right. And a six-year old girl is just as good at being a Mom as a thirty-five year old one because she has the same number of body parts....



A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 02:33 PM

Only in Democratic Party circles!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 03:19 PM

Snark, snark, snark, Rig. Your humor is on a par with W's, I believe.



A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 03:25 PM

OHmygawd, Amos! I think you just outed the shurb as a Mudcat member!! That's why Rig seems so non-sequiterish, etc.!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 11:34 AM

A beautiful, thoughtful essay on the state of the nation just before the election, by Peggy Noonan. Recommended.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 02:49 PM

Wesley Clark, U.S. General, comments on McCains qualifications for command.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 02:52 PM

"Another early newspaper endorsement for Barack Obama, and this one is as much a critique of John McCain, particularly his judgment in picking Sarah Palin as his running mate.

Endorsing a Democrat for president for the first time in 72 years, the Stockton Record in California praised Obama as an inspirational leader.

"He has demonstrated time and again he can think on his feet. More importantly, he has demonstrated he will think things through, seek advice, and actually listen to it," the newspaper said in its Sunday editorial. "Obama is a gifted speaker. But in addition to his smarts and energy, possibly his greatest gift is his ability to inspire."

Of McCain, the editorial compared him unfavorably to President Bush, saying "He tends to shoot from the hip and go on gut instinct. The nation cannot go through four more years of literally and figuratively shooting now and asking questions later."

It also questioned the Republican for his surprise choice of Palin, who struggled in her interview last week with Katie Couric of CBS. "We worry he won't have four years," the editorial said. "If elected, at 72, he would be the oldest incoming president in U.S. history. He's in good health now, we're told, although he has withheld most of his medical records. That means Gov. Sarah Palin could very well become president. And that brings us to McCain's most troubling trait: his judgment.

"While praiseworthy for putting the first woman on a major-party presidential ticket since Geraldine Ferraro in 1984, his selection of Palin as a running mate was appalling. The first-term governor is clearly not experienced enough to serve as vice president or president if required."

"

Boston.com

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 07:41 PM

I'm in love with Tina Feye



A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 09:29 PM

As soon as John McCain fixes the financial crisis, he can take the time to wrap up the election.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:31 AM

Not worth a new thread.

Any comments on this? What if it was in support of McCain?

----------------------------------------------------------------
Virginia Teachers Union Sparks Outrage With 'Obama Blue Day'

NEW YORK: Virginia Republicans are in uproar over state teachers union's effort to get educators to show their support for Barack Obama during school hours.

Thursday, October 02, 2008


Virginia Republicans are in an uproar after the state teacher's union sent an e-mail to its members encouraging them to wear blue-colored shirts to school to show their support for Barack Obama.

State Republicans are calling it an undisguised attempt to influence students' political views.

The Virginia Education Association sponsored "Obama Blue Day" on Tuesday. In an e-mail sent last week, it urged teachers to participate by dressing in blue.

"There are people out there not yet registered. You teach some of them," the Sept. 25 e-mail reads. "Others, including our members, remain on the fence! Its time for us to come together, voice our unity, because we make a difference!"

"Let's make Obama Blue Day a day of Action!" the e-mail continues. "Barack the vote!"   

In a statement released to FOXNews.com Thursday, VEA President Kitty Boitnott defended the e-mail, saying that it called for teachers to wear blue shirts, but not ones that mentioned a candidate.

The invitation was not intended to "encourage teachers to use their classrooms for partisan political purposes," Boitnott said.

"The e-mail did not encourage teachers to talk with students about voting for any specific candidate, although it did suggest that teachers can encourage eligible students to register to vote. There certainly is nothing wrong with encouraging students who are 18 years of age or older to register to vote."

But many state Republicans are miffed by the plan, which they characterize as an obvious attempt by the teachers union to encourage young, impressionable voters to cast their ballots for Obama.

"It's a breach of public trust on many levels," Virginia Republican Party Communications Director Gerry Scimeca told FOXNews.com.

Scimeca, who described the VEA as a "very political organization," said the school environment is "a completely inappropriate place for teachers or education staff to be politicking on behalf of any candidate. Parents send their kids to school to get a bipartisan education."

The controversy surrounding the VEA's "Obama Blue Day" is not the only clash between partisan politics and education this election season.

The teachers union in New York has also come under fire for distributing thousands of Obama campaign buttons to its members, prompting a backlash from education officials and parents.

"Schools are not a place for politics and not a place for staff to wear political buttons," New York Department of Education spokeswoman Ann Forte told FOXNews.com.

"We don't want a school or school staff advocating for any political position or candidate to students and we don't want students feeling intimidated because they might hold a different belief or support a different candidate than their teachers," she said.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 10:14 AM

The self interest of the teachers is obvious.

               Keeping political bias out of the classroom is one of the toughest things a teacher is faced with, and absolutely essential.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 11:24 AM

In my opinion the email and the mindset behind it are completely out of line, whether for Obama or McCain.

Once a candidate has been elected I am all for it, whether for the sake of a policy or a project or a person.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 07 Oct 08 - 08:19 AM

Obama doesn't weed out illegal cash, GOP says
Sun Oct 5, 2008 5:15pm By Andy Sullivan

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Republican Party on Sunday said Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama had not done enough to screen out illegal campaign contributions and asked U.S. election officials to look into the matter.

Citing news reports, the Republican National Committee said Obama had accepted contributions from foreigners and taken more than the $2,300 maximum from donors who give in small increments. The Obama campaign denied the charges.

The RNC said it will ask the Federal Election Commission to examine Obama records in detail to determine the extent of the problem.

The Obama campaign could face fines if found guilty of violations by the FEC, but any decision would likely come after he faces Republican John McCain in the November 4 presidential election.

Obama spokesman Bill Burton said the McCain campaign has had to return over $1.2 million to donors who potentially violated the law with their contributions, including money from foreign nationals.

"Our campaign has shattered fund-raising records with donations from more than 2.5 million Americans. We have gone above and beyond the transparency requirements," Burton said.

"While no organization is completely protected from Internet fraud, we will continue to review our fund-raising procedures to ensure that we are taking every available to step to root-out improper contributions," he said.

But Republican officials said the Obama campaign had not done enough to weed out illegal donations.

"It seems to the RNC that the Obama campaign knew they were excessive," RNC chief counsel Sean Cairncross said in a conference call. "Yet they appear to have taken no action on their own."

Obama opted out of the public financing system so his money totals include both the primaries and the general election. More than half of the $454 million raised by Obama has come in small increments of $200 or less.

By contrast, one-third of McCain's $230 million raised during the primary campaign has come in small donations. McCain is taking public funds in the general election campaign so he is limited to $84 million.

Campaigns are not required to report small donations, and some donors appear to have given well beyond the legal limit, Newsweek magazine reported.

Two apparently fictional donors using the names "Doodad Pro" and "Good Will" gave Obama more than $11,000 in increments of $10 and $25, according to Newsweek.

Other news accounts suggest that roughly 11,500 donors who gave a total of $34 million to the campaign may be citizens of foreign countries, who are not allowed to contribute to U.S. elections, the RNC said.

"We see a lack of control, a lack of willingness on the part of the Obama campaign to ask relevant questions," Cairncross said.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 07 Oct 08 - 08:20 AM

RNC to File FEC Complaint on Obama Fundraising Practices
By Matthew Mosk

A lawyer for the Republican National Committee today said the party will ask the Federal Election Commission to look into the source of thousands of small-dollar contributions to the presidential campaign of Sen. Barack Obama.

The RNC is alleging that the Obama campaign was so hungry for donations it "looked the other way" as contributions piled up from suspicious, and possibly even illegal foreign donors.

"We believe that the American people should know first and foremost if foreign money is pouring into a presidential election," said RNC Chief Counsel Sean Cairncross.

Cairncross alleged there was mounting evidence of this, and cited a report in the current issue of Newsweek magazine that documents a handful of instances where donors made repeated small donations using fake names, such as "Good Will" and "Doodad Pro."

The Newsweek report says that earlier this year the Obama campaign returned $33,000 to two Palestinian brothers in the Gaza Strip who had bought T-shirts in bulk from the campaign's online store -- purchases that count as campaign contributions. The brothers had listed their address as "Ga.," which the campaign took to mean Georgia rather than Gaza.

"While no organization is completely protected from Internet fraud, we will continue to review our fundraising procedures," Obama spokesman Ben LaBolt told the magazine.

At the heart of the RNC complaint is a federal fundraising rule that lets campaigns accept donations under $200 without itemizing the names and addresses of the donors on its campaign finance reports. The rule was intended as a matter of practicality -- it did not seem reasonable to ask a campaign to gather that information from every five-dollar donor.

But the Obama campaign has raised more than $200 million this way, a staggering sum for donations that will not be subjected to outside scrutiny.

Obama campaign aides said today that a number of steps have been taken to safeguard against foreign or illegal contributions coming in in smaller increments. The measures include: requiring donors to present a passport at fundraising events held for Americans overseas, ending contributions to the Obama Store from contributors with addresses outside the U.S. or its territories, and requiring donors to enter a U.S. passport number when contributing via the Americans Abroad page.

"When we were made aware of an ad for a Nigerians for Obama fundraiser in a Nigerian paper, our attorneys sent a letter to the paper making it clear the event had nothing to do with our campaign, and that we would not accept contributions from the event," one Obama aide said.

And aides note that Sen. John McCain had his own foreign fundraising issues, having been forced to refund about $50,000 in donations solicited by Jordanian Mustafa Abu Naba'a, who was raising money on behalf of one of McCain's top Florida bundlers.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 07 Oct 08 - 08:21 AM

Obama's 'Good Will' Hunting
By Michael Isikoff | NEWSWEEK
Published Oct 4, 2008
From the magazine issue dated Oct 13, 2008

The Obama campaign has shattered all fund-raising records, raking in $458 million so far, with about half the bounty coming from donors who contribute $200 or less. Aides say that's an illustration of a truly democratic campaign. To critics, though, it can be an invitation for fraud and illegal foreign cash because donors giving individual sums of $200 or less don't have to be publicly reported. Consider the cases of Obama donors "Doodad Pro" of Nunda, N.Y., who gave $17,130, and "Good Will" of Austin, Texas, who gave more than $11,000—both in excess of the $2,300-per-person federal limit. In two recent letters to the Obama campaign, Federal Election Commission auditors flagged those (and other) donors and informed the campaign that the sums had to be returned. Neither name had ever been publicly reported because both individuals made online donations in $10 and $25 increments. "Good Will" listed his employer as "Loving" and his occupation as "You," while supplying as his address 1015 Norwood Park Boulevard, which is shared by the Austin nonprofit Goodwill Industries. Suzanha Burmeister, marketing director for Goodwill, said the group had "no clue" who the donor was. She added, however, that the group had received five puzzling thank-you letters from the Obama campaign this year, prompting it to send the campaign an e-mail in September pointing out the apparent fraudulent use of its name.

"Doodad Pro" listed no occupation or employer; the contributor's listed address is shared by Lloyd and Lynn's Liquor Store in Nunda. "I have never heard of such an individual," says Diane Beardsley, who works at the store and is the mother of one of the owners. "Nobody at this store has that much money to contribute." (She added that a Doodad's Boutique, located next door, had closed a year ago, before the donations were made.)

Obama spokesman Ben LaBolt said the campaign has no idea who the individuals are and has returned all the donations, using the credit-card numbers they gave to the campaign. (In a similar case earlier this year, the campaign returned $33,000 to two Palestinian brothers in the Gaza Strip who had bought T shirts in bulk from the campaign's online store. They had listed their address as "Ga.," which the campaign took to mean Georgia rather than Gaza.) "While no organization is completely protected from Internet fraud, we will continue to review our fund-raising procedures," LaBolt said. Some critics say the campaign hasn't done enough. This summer, watchdog groups asked both campaigns to share more information about its small donors. The McCain campaign agreed; the Obama campaign did not. "They could've done themselves a service" by heeding the suggestions, said Massie Ritsch of the Center for Responsive Politics.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 07 Oct 08 - 08:24 AM

CBS Poll: Presidential Race Tightens
Survey Shows Obama Leading McCain 47 Percent To 43 Percent Among Registered Voters Nationwide Following V.P. Debate


http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/10/06/opinion/polls/main4504633.shtml


So, Biden wins on technical points, but Palin tightens the poll numbers.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 07 Oct 08 - 08:31 AM

OCTOBER 6, 2008 A Month Away, Some Voters Can't Decide
By EASHA ANAND and BRAD HAYNES

Pete Tiffany voted for George W. Bush in 2004 on the basis of an online quiz, which asked him 12 questions about his views on issues such as abortion, free trade and gay marriage, and told him which candidate was closest to his views.

The 44-year-old construction worker in the battleground state of Virginia said he isn't sure how he will vote this year. "I want to say I'll vote on the economy, which Democrats are better on, but I'm not sure if the economy is all that bad," he said recently.

Undecided in Ohio Blog
A group of undecided voters try to figure out which candidate to support.
"Obama's pastor bothers me, but I take everything I hear on television with a grain of salt."

Mr. Tiffany is one of the select pool of voters who will have an important voice in this election -- those who say a month before Election Day that they are undecided between John McCain and Barack Obama, or may reluctantly lean toward one, but not firmly.

Mr. Tiffany was one of 9% of the 1,085 voters who participated in a Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll between Sept. 19 and Sept. 22 saying they were undecided or were only leaning toward one candidate. The Journal followed up in recent days with two dozen voters who said they hadn't "definitely" made up their minds, asking why they were unsure and what might make them reach a firm conclusion.

Many are like Mr. Tiffany: Voters who chose Mr. Bush in 2000 and 2004 but are unhappy with the way things turned out. They worry about their pensions and don't trust another Republican to handle the economic crisis.

At the same time, these voters -- many of whom don't consider themselves "political" -- don't feel like they have the information they need, particularly about the Democratic nominee. They have seen emails about Sen. Obama's upbringing, religion and associates that concern them.

William Kilpatrick, a 65-year-old corrections officer from Pennsylvania, said he is leaning "a hair towards McCain." He said he has worried about the economy since his pension "took a hosing" with the bankruptcy filing of Bethlehem Steel, but he still has concerns about Sen. Obama's background.

"What changed me was finding out about Obama going to the same church all those years when the preacher was a hatemonger," Mr. Kilpatrick said. "Why didn't he just go to a different church?"

Mr. Kilpatrick was referring to the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Sen. Obama's longtime Chicago pastor. The Illinois senator distanced himself from Mr. Wright and quit his church earlier this year after incendiary comments by the religious leader were widely aired on the Internet and on television.

Though most voters tell pollsters that the economy is their No. 1 concern -- and that they favor Sen. Obama on the economy -- other issues, such as national security and the war in Iraq, often come in a close second.

Alonzo Deleon, for instance, is a 49-year-old photographer from Florida who says Mr. Bush has made him "ashamed of being a Republican." Though he thinks the economy is in bad shape, he still feels passionate about the war in Iraq and wants to put in a candidate more likely to resolve the war.

"Being a Navy man, my sympathies lie with John McCain on who should be leading us in this war," Mr. Deleon said. But Sen. McCain's choice of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin as his running mate -- while exciting many conservatives -- has turned him off. "After he picked someone who isn't qualified to be a dogcatcher, much less a vice-presidential candidate, I'm leaning heavily against him," Mr. Deleon said.

Kathy Romero, a 47-year-old human-resources worker from New Mexico, voted twice for Mr. Bush, and is now leaning toward Sen. Obama, despite being a registered Republican with lingering loyalties to her party. She thinks the economy is "in really bad shape," and that Sen. McCain would follow too much in Mr. Bush's footsteps.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 07 Oct 08 - 10:04 AM

Here is an article that explains a lot about us 'real' Americans.

Who IS a Real American?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 07 Oct 08 - 03:00 PM

Oct 6, 8:05 PM EDT


SEC sues Democrat fundraiser for alleged $60M scam

SAN FRANCISCO (AP) -- Federal regulators on Monday sued political fundraiser Norman Hsu for allegedly operating a $60 million investment scam and using some proceeds to contribute to Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton and other prominent Democrats.

The Securities and Exchange Commission filed a lawsuit in U.S. District Court in Los Angeles that accuses Hsu of using a company called Next Components to solicit investments that promised high rates of return by providing short-term loans to other companies.

Instead, Hsu used the investments to pay off early investors in a classic Ponzi scheme while using the rest to make political contributions and support a lavish lifestyle, the lawsuit states.

The SEC is seeking to recoup the investors' money and financial penalties.

Public records show Hsu donated millions to numerous Democratic campaigns since 2003. He also attended many well-publicized fundraisers.

Hsu was indicted last year in New York on federal charges of fraud and violating campaign finance laws - a case that came on the heels of a 1992 conviction in California for bilking investors of $1 million. He was declared a fugitive for a while in that case, but finally was sentenced in January to three years in state prison. He has been moved to a jail in New York to await the federal trial.

Federal prosecutors said a year ago that Hsu hoped the profligate campaign spending would raise his public profile enough to draw money to his scheme.

"He allegedly then used the veneer of respectability created by his political connections to persuade his investors that the investments he offered were legitimate," said Linda Chatman Thomsen, director of the SEC's division of enforcement.

The federal indictment alleges that Hsu lost at least $20 million of the investor money, and says the rest of Hsu's assets are frozen. The federal criminal case is scheduled for January.

"He plans to contest the charges," said Martin Cohen, his defense attorney in the case.

Hsu raised more than $1.2 million for Clinton and other Democratic candidates in recent years.

The Clinton campaign returned more than $800,000 to donors whose contributions were linked to Hsu after it was revealed in 2007 that he was wanted in California since 1992, the year he fled the state after pleading no contest to bilking investors of $1 million.

He voluntarily returned to California and posted $2 million bail in August 2007, claiming that the 1992 conviction was a misunderstanding.

The next month, Hsu skipped a court hearing in Redwood City, Calif., and was once again declared a fugitive. He was arrested days later in a Colorado hospital after trying to commit suicide by drug overdose on a train.

He was ultimately sentenced to three years in a California state prison for the 1992 conviction and now faces a maximum sentence of 20 years in federal prison if convicted of the latest charges.

In May, a federal judge in Los Angeles ordered Hsu to pay $28.8 million to aggrieved investors who sued him. Hsu wasn't represented by a lawyer in that case and never responded to the lawsuit.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 07 Oct 08 - 04:21 PM

"Here is an article that explains a lot about us 'real' Americans."


               And it didn't even mention affirmative action!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 07 Oct 08 - 08:05 PM

Bruce, you don't seem to grasp that Democrats and those who resonate to their causes, in other words, non-Republicans, have no trouble understanding and accepting that there are criminals out there. Don't you understand that it is a pertinent fact that Hsu is a *criminal*? That he may be a Democrat is *not* the point.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 08 Oct 08 - 10:07 AM

"... Senator John McCain and Gov. Sarah Palin have been running one of the most appalling campaigns we can remember.

They have gone far beyond the usual fare of quotes taken out of context and distortions of an opponent's record — into the dark territory of race-baiting and xenophobia. Senator Barack Obama has taken some cheap shots at Mr. McCain, but there is no comparison.

Despite the occasional slip (referring to Mr. Obama's "cronies" and calling him "that one"), Mr. McCain tried to take a higher road in Tuesday night's presidential debate. It was hard to keep track of the number of time he referred to his audience as "my friends." But apart from promising to buy up troubled mortgages as president, he offered no real answers for how he plans to solve the country's deep economic crisis. He is unable or unwilling to admit that the Republican assault on regulation was to blame.

Ninety minutes of forced cordiality did not erase the dismal ugliness of his campaign in recent weeks, nor did it leave us with much hope that he would not just return to the same dismal ugliness on Wednesday.

Ms. Palin, in particular, revels in the attack. Her campaign rallies have become spectacles of anger and insult. "This is not a man who sees America as you see it and how I see America," Ms. Palin has taken to saying.

That line follows passages in Ms. Palin's new stump speech in which she twists Mr. Obama's ill-advised but fleeting and long-past association with William Ayers, founder of the Weather Underground and confessed bomber. By the time she's done, she implies that Mr. Obama is right now a close friend of Mr. Ayers — and sympathetic to the violent overthrow of the government. The Democrat, she says, "sees America, it seems, as being so imperfect that he's palling around with terrorists who would target their own country."

Her demagoguery has elicited some frightening, intolerable responses. A recent Washington Post report said at a rally in Florida this week a man yelled "kill him!" as Ms. Palin delivered that line and others shouted epithets at an African-American member of a TV crew.

Mr. McCain's aides haven't even tried to hide their cynical tactics, saying they were "going negative" in hopes of shifting attention away from the financial crisis — and by implication Mr. McCain's stumbling response.

We certainly expected better from Mr. McCain, who once showed withering contempt for win-at-any-cost politics. He was driven out of the 2000 Republican primaries by this sort of smear, orchestrated by some of the same people who are now running his campaign
..." (NYT)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 08 Oct 08 - 10:48 AM

Released: October 08, 2008
Reuters/C-SPAN/Zogby Poll:
Obama 47%, McCain 45%

The telephone tracking poll shows neither candidate with a clear advantage in the national horserace

UTICA, New York - The race for President of the United States remains far too close to call between Democrat Barack Obama and Republican John McCain as both candidates head toward the finish line, a recent Reuters/C-SPAN/Zogby daily tracking telephone polls shows.


Data from this poll is available here


The survey, including a three-day sample of 1,220 likely voters collected over the previous three days - approximately 400 per day from Oct. 5-7, 2008 - shows that Obama holds a slight advantage amounting to 1.9 percentage points over McCain. This represents a bit of a recovery by McCain, who had been sliding in some polls before his running mate, Sarah Palin, put in a strong performance in her one and only debate performance last Thursday.

Three Day Tracking Poll
10-7
10-6

Obama
47.1%
47.7%

McCain
45.2%
45.3%

Others/Not sure
7.7%
7.0%


The Reuters/C-SPAN/Zogby poll, was conducted before Tuesday's Obama-McCain debate. It was performed by live telephone operators in Zogby's in-house call center in Upstate New York, included a total of 1,220 likely voters nationwide, and carries a margin of error of +/- 2.8 percentage points.

Candidates Doing Well Among Their Own Party Members

The two candidates are doing well at attracting support from their own partisans - Obama is winning 84% of the Democratic Party support and McCain is winning 85% of the Republican Party support - but Obama has the edge among independent voters. He leads McCain among independents, 48 to 39%.

Obama wins support from a slightly higher percentage of conservative voters than McCain is winning from liberal voters, but the advantage is small.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 08 Oct 08 - 11:31 AM

Today's aggregate polls, au contraire:

RCP Average 10/01 - 10/07 -- 49.1 44.4 Obama +4.7
Rasmussen Tracking 10/05 - 10/07 3000 LV 51 45 Obama +6
Reuters/CSpan/Zogby Tracking 10/05 - 10/07 1220 LV 47 45 Obama +2
Hotline/FD Tracking 10/05 - 10/07 904 LV 45 44 Obama +1
GW/Battleground Tracking 10/02 - 10/07 800 LV 49 45 Obama +4
Gallup Tracking 10/04 - 10/06 2747 RV 51 42 Obama +9
NBC News/Wall St. Jrnl 10/04 - 10/05 658 RV 49 43 Obama +6
CBS News 10/03 - 10/05 616 LV 48 45 Obama +3
CNN 10/03 - 10/05 694 LV 53 45 Obama +8
Democracy Corps (D) 10/01 - 10/05 1000 LV 49 46 Obama +3

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 08 Oct 08 - 11:38 AM

Amos,

Without listing the margin of error, the numbers are not meaningful. - feel free to cherrypick ones you like, but GIVE THE MARGINS OF ERROR!!!!!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 Oct 08 - 12:03 PM

"forced cordiality" - that's the phrase I was looking for. If you saw a character in a film acting like McCain did in that debate, you'd know he was meant to be a phony and not to be trusted.

I was reminded of the old joke about the actor saying the mist important thing in acting was sincerity - if you could do sincerity you could do anything. And it struck me that McCain couldn't do sincerity. That's not necessarily to say he'd not sincere, just that his attempts to out that across didn't ring true, a matter of technique.

But then maybe that's not how it came across to Americans. After all, it seemed to have been generally agreed, even by his opponents, that Bush was the kind of bloke people would be glad to have a beer with or have at a barbecue. I never could understand that - he'd a perfect example of the kind of bloke who'd make me wish I'd stayed home.

And why doesn't McCain do something about that bizarre comb-over hairstyle that seems designed to make people focus on his baldness. Reminds me of "The Baldy Man".

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 08 Oct 08 - 10:09 PM

Nothing these buffoons do or say ring true to most American voters. It's a charade we go through every four years, the purpose of which seems to have been forgotten.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 09 Oct 08 - 07:47 AM

"The (Obama) national headquarters in Chicago airily dismisses complaints from journalists wondering why a schedule cannot be printed up or at least e-mailed in time to make coverage plans. Nor is there much sympathy for those of us who report for a newscast that airs in the early evening hours. Our shows place a premium on live reporting from the scene of campaign events. But this campaign can often be found in the air and flying around at the time the "CBS Evening News with Katie Couric" is broadcast. I suspect there is a feeling within the Obama campaign that the broadcast networks are less influential in the age of the internet and thus needn't be accomodated as in the days of yore. Even if it's true, they are only hurting themselves by dissing audiences that run in the tens of millions every night.

The McCain folks are more helpful and generally friendly. The schedules are printed on actual books you can hold in your hand, read, and then plan accordingly. The press aides are more knowledgeable and useful to us in the news media. The events are designed with a better eye, and for the simple needs of the press corps. When he is available, John McCain is friendly and loquacious. Obama holds news conferences, but seldom banters with the reporters who've been following him for thousands of miles around the country. Go figure.

The McCain campaign plane is better than Obama's, which is cramped, uncomfortable and smells terrible most of the time. Somehow the McCain folks manage to keep their charter clean, even where the press is seated.

The other day in Albuquerque, N.M., the reporters were given almost no time to file their reports after McCain spoke. It was an important, aggressive speech, lambasting Obama's past associations. When we asked for more time to write up his remarks and prepare our reports, the campaign readily agreed to it. They understood.

Similar requests are often denied or ignored by the Obama campaign aides, apparently terrified that the candidate may have to wait 20 minutes to allow reporters to chronicle what he's just said. It's made all the more maddening when we are rushed to our buses only to sit and wait for 30 minutes or more because nobody seems to know when Obama is actually on the move.

Maybe none of this means much. Maybe a front-running campaign like Obama's that is focused solely on victory doesn't have the time to do the mundane things like print up schedules or attend to the needs of reporters.

But in politics, everything that goes around comes around."

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/10/07/politics/fromtheroad/entry4507703.shtml

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 09 Oct 08 - 07:55 AM

Pollster: Don't believe the Dem hype

By Joe Dwinell & Jessica Fargen
Wednesday, October 8, 2008 - Updated 23h ago

The presidential race is still too close to call and could come down to the very last weekend before voters decide if they like or distrust Barack Obama, a national pollster predicts.

"I don't think Obama has closed the deal yet," pollster John Zogby told the Herald yesterday.

Zogby's latest poll, released yesterday in conjunction with C-Span and Reuters, shows Obama and John McCain in a statistical dead heat, with the Illinois Democrat up 48-45 percent.

Zogby said the race mirrors the 1980 election, when voters didn't embrace Ronald Reagan over then-President Jimmy Carter until just days before the election.

"The Sunday before the election the dam burst," Zogby said of the 1980 tilt. "That's when voters determined they were comfortable with Reagan."

Now voters are wrestling with two senators with opposite resumes - Obama, at 47, the unknown, and the established 72-year-old McCain.

Zogby said he's still hearing from moderates and non-partisan voters - what he calls "the big middle" - who are still shopping for a candidate.

"It still can break one way or the other," Zogby says.

The Numbers

The three-day survey polled 1,220 likely voters - about 400 people a day. Zogby will continuously poll right up until the November election.

The latest poll numbers may reflect the bump that McCain received after his running mate, Alaskan Gov. Sarah Palin sparred with Obama's running mate, Delaware Sen. Joe Biden during the first and only vice presidential debate last week.

The poll shows that the two White House contenders have no problem attracting support from their own parties.

Obama is winning 84 percent of the Democratic Party support and McCain has 85 percent of the GOP support, but Obama has the edge among sought-after Independent voters.

He leads McCain among independents, 48 percent to 39 percent, according to the poll.

Obama also has support from a slightly higher percent of conservative voters than McCain gets from liberal voters, but the advantage is small, according to the poll.

Pollsters surveyed 1,220 likely voters and asked approximately 39 questions. The margin of error is plus or minus 2.9 percentage points.

http://news.bostonherald.com/news/2008/view.bg?articleid=1124117&srvc=2008campaign&position=8

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 11 Oct 08 - 01:04 PM

A far, far better choice.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Charley Noble
Date: 11 Oct 08 - 01:21 PM

Amos-

I like the quote that "This is one candidate that is coming up from behind."

Where do I send my check?

Cheerily,
Charley Noble, who will not run if elected!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 11 Oct 08 - 03:44 PM

So, you've decided to back McCain, what?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 11 Oct 08 - 03:54 PM

Rig:

You are flying in circles with your eyes closed, my friend.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Oct 08 - 03:23 PM

CNN's most recent poll of the commonwealth, conducted September 28-30, showed Obama with a 57-40 lead over McCain in southeast Virginia. (In the context of this poll, southeast Virginia encompasses not just Hampton Roads, but also some inland counties that may include larger populations of African-Americans.) A Mason-Dixon poll of registered voters released on October 1, suggested a statistically insignificant 47-46 lead for McCain in Hampton Roads.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Oct 08 - 03:25 PM

Forgot to post this from the same article:

Palin was campaigning in Virginia: Unfortunately for Palin, her botched pronunciation of "Norfolk" likely won't go unnoticed by the locals.

"Very good to be here in the home of the Naval Station Nor-fork, yeah, and the Naval Air Force Station also, Oceana," she said.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 13 Oct 08 - 11:29 PM

Hey, now don't get your knickers in a twist..but this just came to me, via e-mail, so, like a good little sweetheart, I thought I'd post it here, to get your feedback....and for God sakes, don't shoot the messenger,...I've heard this before, but this clip is new to me...so...
whadya' think???
P.S. I already know what Amos thinks..or should I say 'Feels'...


http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/10/this_could_be_the_game_changer.html

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 13 Oct 08 - 11:34 PM

From: Amos
Date: 08 Oct 08 - 10:07 AM

"... Senator John McCain and Gov. Sarah Palin have been running one of the most appalling campaigns we can remember.

"we"????....like....

Roses are red,
Violets are blue,
I'm a schizophrenic,
And so am I

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 12:52 AM

Clean up in Aisle Five!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 01:06 AM

Thank you, Kat...I've heard that there was that posting on the net..I guess, according to the man in the other video, that the certificate posted was a fraud. However, I myself, have made no determination, at all. Apparently, this thing is suppose to go to court....Am curiously watching. Thank you, again, for not 'shooting the messenger'....
Regards,
GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 01:14 PM

"October 14, 2008
Bulls, Bears, Donkeys and Elephants

By TOMMY McCALL
Since 1929, Republicans and Democrats have each controlled the presidency for nearly 40 years. So which party has been better for American pocketbooks and capitalism as a whole? Well, here's an experiment: imagine that during these years you had to invest exclusively under either Democratic or Republican administrations. How would you have fared?
As of Friday, a $10,000 investment in the S.& P. stock market index* would have grown to $11,733 if invested under Republican presidents only, although that would be $51,211 if we exclude Herbert Hoover's presidency during the Great Depression. Invested under Democratic presidents only, $10,000 would have grown to $300,671 at a compound rate of 8.9 percent over nearly 40 years."

Chart can be found here.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 01:17 PM

What a crock, Guest-from-Paranoia.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 01:18 PM

To the Editor:

Re "Fire the Campaign" (column, Oct. 13):

William Kristol argues that John McCain should stop "unveiling gimmicky proposals," "tell the truth," show the "kind of sound judgment and strong leadership," the readiness to be commander in chief "he's shown in his career."

But the problem with Mr. Kristol's advice is that Mr. McCain's campaign is the very reflection of who he is and who he has been for the last 26 years. Unpredictability and going your own way are the essence of "maverick-hood."

Finally, if Mr. McCain isn't able to control his campaign or its message, as Mr. Kristol implies, what kind of commander in chief does that portend?

Bonita Rothman

Staten Island, Oct. 13, 2008

•

To the Editor:

William Kristol is right on the money in advising John McCain to fire his inept campaign, saying "McCain needs to make his case, and do so as a serious but cheerful candidate for times that need a serious but upbeat leader."

At the same time, however, it is critical for Mr. McCain to point out that this election is not about George W. Bush and the past eight years of mistakes, but rather about which candidate the voter trusts to lead the country over the next four years.

Does the country want to elect a man who has shown a total lack of leadership qualities as evidenced by his 130 "present" votes on controversial issues as an Illinois state senator, or does the country require an experienced hand at the helm to solve the domestic and foreign policy challenges to get the nation back on track?

That is the case John McCain must make Wednesday night, or he is toast.

Paul Schoenbaum

Williamsburg, Va., Oct. 13, 2008

•

To the Editor:

One of the main reasons a candidate campaigns for election is to show the people how he or she will govern. Should the McCain campaign take William Kristol's advice, the American people would ask yet again: Who is John McCain?

Is he the man who campaigned a certain way until three weeks before the election, or the man who decided to truly put his country first and behave himself as a last resort, simply because he was losing?

Also, if Mr. McCain were winning with his current campaign of ugly tactics, would Mr. Kristol call on him to fire his advisers and take on a positive, constructive tone? David C. Zweig

Los Angeles, Oct. 13, 2008

To the Editor:

Bob Herbert is right. The G.O.P.'s mask has slipped (column, Oct. 11).

All at once, our country has reached the tipping point where demographic, cultural, scientific and economic realities have "shocked and awed" our country, leaving the G.O.P. — and its "base" — behind.

My children, 26 and 28, see racism, sexism and anti-intellectualism as a kind of traditional insanity. They are alarmed by the McCain-Palin campaign's cynical willingness to fan the flames of destructive rage against a modern, thoughtful multiracial American who is likely to win the presidential election.

I think that what we are now witnessing are "the birth pangs" of a 21st-century American democracy ... and they aren't pretty. Robert Stern

Montauk, N.Y., Oct. 11, 2008

(Random letters from the NYT re McCain's campaign to date)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Stringsinger
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 01:31 PM

The taxes have to go up to pay for the things that need to be done to reform the malpractices of the Bush Administration.

Obama has had the courage to say that he would raise taxes on the rich.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 01:41 PM

Well, sems as if John McCain has changed course yet again... All this bouncing from pillar to post ion his part can't be helping him shore up this idea that he ain't consistent... If this were a race between two sail boats, Obama's is the one with all the sails full and everyone working together and McCain's would be the one with a drigter reacher floppin' over the bow and draggin' in the water and crew running all over the place trying to figure out how to get it out...

I ain't sayin' that McCain can't win... I mean, we all lived thru the 2000 bad joke of an attempted election but...

...should he somehow pulll it off, the country will be in more serious trouble than it is with Bush...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 02:23 PM

Just saw Palin on the news saying McCain is going to cut out all unnecessary spending and just focus on things like aid to veterans. Um, gee, he's changed direction again. Now he's going to support what he's been voting against.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 02:36 PM

"In theory, John McCain, with his long record of service as a Navy pilot and prisoner of war story from Vietnam, should have the market cornered on the military vote.

Instead, he has drawn opposition from many veterans because of his voting record in the Senate. Sen. McCain has voted against bills that would have improved veterans' benefits, particularly health care, or measures to ease the strain on active-duty troops and their families.

The disapproval among vets for Sen. McCain has fed surprising support for Barack Obama, who has voted for many of the veterans' initiatives in the Senate that his opponent rejected."
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/opinion/content/opinion/epaper/2008/08/03/m2e_moffe

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: PoppaGator
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 02:51 PM

You tell 'em Alice!

For those who haven't seen fit to click the link, here's a pertinient excerpt from that Palm Beach Post article:

The Disabled Veterans of America gives him [McCain] a 20 percent rating, compared with an 80 percent rating for Sen. Obama. The Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans for America gives Sen. McCain a D and Sen. Obama a B+. The Vietnam Veterans of America say Sen. McCain has voted against them on 15 issues.

One of the most vocal and fastest-growing veterans groups to oppose the McCain campaign is VoteVets.org. Formed in 2006, the organization claims a membership of roughly 100,000, with a political action committee devoted to electing congressional candidates who oppose the handling of the Iraq war.

Especially galling to VoteVets.org is Sen. McCain's opposition to the new, bipartisan GI Bill that increases education benefits for Iraq and Afghanistan vets. Sen. Obama voted for the bill when it passed 75-22 in May; Sen. McCain was on the campaign trail and did not vote.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 05:44 PM

"Nutty Attacks On ACORN


In recent weeks, conservatives have escalated their attacks on ACORN, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now. Conservative lawmakers were able to remove a provision aimed at aiding low-income housing programs from the Bush administration's $700 billion economic bailout bill by calling it a "slush fund" for ACORN. Before that, conservatives blamed ACORN for "precipitating the subprime crisis." And last week, they alleged that the "purpose" of ACORN is to engage in voter fraud. However, as columnist Joel McNally correctly noted, the "underlying motive for attacking ACORN" seems to be that it is the "nation's largest grassroots community organization of low- and moderate-income people." "It is an organization that engages in that dreaded community organizing," McNally wrote. "It actually tries to give a voice to the poor and most vulnerable among us." Indeed, after years of enacting policies catering to the wealthy, the right-wing seems to be fearful of millions of new low-income voters registered by ACORN casting their ballots in favor of progressive policies.
 
VOTER 'FRAUD': In early October, ACORN announced that it had registered 1.3 million new voters for the November election. Seizing on reports of apparently fraudulent voter registrations in some states, conservatives began claiming that the "purpose" of ACORN is to commit "voter fraud." However, all that was found during a raid of ACORN's office in Nevada was apparently fraudulent voter registration forms, which do not constitute voter fraud. "It's not voter fraud unless someone shows up at the voting booth on election day and tries to pass himself off as 'Tony Romo.'" And who would try to do that?" wrote Rep. Jesse Jackson (D-IL). As New York University's Brennan Center for Justice noted, "[T]here are no reports that we have discovered of votes actually cast in the names of [false] registrants." Under most state laws, in fact, voter registration organizations like ACORN are required to turn in all the forms they receive, even the suspicious ones. Furthermore, as Brad Friedman pointed out in the Guardian, "[I]f [ACORN] can't authenticate the registration, or it's incomplete or questionable in other ways, they flag that form as problematic...In almost every case where you've heard about fraud by Acorn, it's because Acorn itself notified officials about the fraud that's been perpetrated on them by rogue canvassers."
 
THE ECONOMIC CRISIS: Before alleging that it was engaging in voter fraud, conservatives claimed that ACORN was responsible for the subprime crisis and the ensuing financial meltdown. Stanley Kurtz wrote in the National Review that ACORN "had a major role in precipitating the subprime crisis," and then said in the New York Post that ACORN helped "undermine the US economy by pushing the banking system into a sinkhole of bad loans." Thomas DiLorenzo claimed that ACORN forced lenders to make bad loans to low-income people "through a process that sounds like legalized extortion." However, the claim that ACORN -- or loans to low-income people in general -- caused the financial crisis by enabling lower-income families to buy homes has been debunked again and again. As Daniel Gross wrote in Newsweek, "[D]id AIG plunge into the credit-default swaps business with abandon because ACORN members picketed its offices? Please." Most economists blame the current crisis on market failure and sparse regulation, but conservatives are attempting to draw attention elsewhere by smearing the victims of predatory lending and implicating ACORN.

A LONG-RUNNING CAMPAIGN: Last Friday, conservative members of Congress "sent a letter to Attorney General Michael Mukasey requesting the Department of Justice ensure that the actions of ACORN did not violate federal laws." But conservatives have gone down this road before, only to find nothing. In 2004, ACORN faced three lawsuits pertaining to alleged voter fraud, all of which were dismissed. As noted at the time, "several politically motivated law firms brought baseless charges of voter registration fraud against ACORN in an effort to inhibit its work to register low-income and minority voters." But the Bush administration was so intent on furthering these trumped-up charges of voter fraud that in 2006 attorneys from the Department of Justice -- including New Mexico's David Iglesias -- were fired for not pursuing fraud cases "to the satisfaction of their bosses." Revealing the shallowness of the conservative outrage though, the New York Times reported last week that "tens of thousands of eligible voters in at least six swing states have been removed from the rolls or have been blocked from registering in ways that appear to violate federal law." This has garnered scant attention compared to the uproar surrounding ACORN"

The Progress Report

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Oct 08 - 07:29 PM

Nothing quite like a summing up by a Brit:

    Friday October 3 2008
      guardian.co.uk
      
      Flirting her way to victory
      Sarah Palin's farcical debate performance lowered the
      standards for both female candidates and US political
      discourse
      
      
      At least three times last night, Sarah Palin, the adorable,
      preposterous vice-presidential candidate, winked at the
      audience. Had a male candidate with a similar reputation for
      attractive vapidity made such a brazen attempt to flirt his
      way into the good graces of the voting public, it would have
      universally noted, discussed and mocked. Palin, however, has
      single-handedly so lowered the standards both for female
      candidates and American political discourse that, with her
      newfound ability to speak in more-or-less full sentences,
      she is now deemed to have performed acceptably last night.
      
      By any normal standard, including the ones applied to
      male presidential candidates of either party, she did not.
      Early on, she made the astonishing announcement that she had
      no intentions of actually answering the queries put to her.
      "I may not answer the questions that either the
      moderator or you want to hear, but I'm going to talk
      straight to the American people and let them know my track
      record also," she said.
      
      And so she preceded, with an almost surreal disregard for
      the subjects she was supposed to be discussing, to unleash
      fusillades of scripted attack lines, platitudes, lies,
      gibberish and grating references to her own pseudo-folksy
      authenticity.
      
      It was an appalling display. The only reason it was not
      widely described as such is that too many American pundits
      don't even try to judge the truth, wisdom or
      reasonableness of the political rhetoric they are paid to
      pronounce upon. Instead, they imagine themselves as
      interpreters of a mythical mass of "average
      Americans" who they both venerate and despise.
      
      In pronouncing upon a debate, they don't try and
      determine whether a candidate's responses correspond to
      existing reality, or whether he or she is capable of talking
      about subjects such as the deregulation of the financial
      markets or the devolution of the war in Afghanistan . The
      criteria are far more vaporous. In this case, it was whether
      Palin could avoid utterly humiliating herself for 90
      minutes, and whether urbane commentators would believe that
      she had connected to a public that they see as ignorant and
      sentimental. For the Alaska governor, mission accomplished.
      
      There is indeed something mesmerizing about Palin, with her
      manic beaming and fulsome confidence in her own charm. The
      force of her personality managed to slightly obscure the
      insulting emptiness of her answers last night. It's
      worth reading the transcript of the encounter, where it
      becomes clearer how bizarre much of what she said was. Here,
      for example, is how she responded to Biden's comments
      about how the middle class has been short-changed during
      the Bush administration, and how McCain will continue
      Bush's policies:
      
      Say it ain't so, Joe, there you go again pointing
      backwards again. You preferenced [sic] your whole comment
      with the Bush administration. Now doggone it, let's look
      ahead and tell Americans what we have to plan to do for them
      in the future. You mentioned education, and I'm glad you
      did. I know education you are passionate about with your
      wife being a teacher for 30 years, and god bless her. Her
      reward is in heaven, right? ... My brother, who I think is
      the best schoolteacher in the year, and here's a
      shout-out to all those third graders at Gladys Wood
      Elementary School , you get extra credit for watching the
      debate.
      
      Evidently, Palin's pre-debate handlers judged her
      incapable of speaking on a fairly wide range of subjects,
      and so instructed to her to simply disregard questions that
      did not invite memorized talking points or cutesy
      filibustering. They probably told her to play up her spunky
      average-ness, which she did to the point of shtick - and
      dishonesty. Asked what her achilles heel is - a question she
      either didn't understand or chose to ignore - she
      started in on how McCain chose her because of her
      "connection to the heartland of America. Being a mom,
      one very concerned about a son in the war, about a special
      needs child, about kids heading off to college, how are we
      going to pay those tuition bills?"
      
      None of Palin's children, it should be noted, is
      heading off to college. Her son is on the way to Iraq ,
      and her pregnant 17-year-old daughter is engaged to be
      married to a high-school dropout and self-described
      "fuckin' redneck". Palin is a woman who
      can't even tell the truth about the most quotidian and
      public details of her own life, never mind about matters of
      major public import. In her only vice-presidential debate,
      she was shallow, mendacious and phoney. What kind of
      maverick, after all, keeps harping on what a maverick she
      is? That her performance was considered anything but a farce
      doesn't show how high Palin has risen, but how low we
      all have sunk.
      
      Copyright Guardian Newspapers Limited 2008

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 11:05 AM

I love it when that tradition among the best of Britain of hard-nosed plainspeaking eloquence resurfaces. Ta so!

From a geek site:

"McCain vs Obama: How the Meta-Data Stacks Up
By Micah L. Sifry, 10/13/2008 - 11:27pm


You can look up the hard numbers of "friends" each campaign has on Facebook or MySpace here on techPresident, and you can track the ups and downs of the candidates on the blogs, or see how their web traffic is doing. But here are some of the more esoteric and intriguing nuggets of meta-data I've found lying around the web in the last few days:

-# of upcoming McCain events happening within a 25 mile radius of Orlando, Florida: 8

-# of upcoming Obama events happening within a 25-mile radius of Orlando: 84

-# of upcoming McCain events within a 25-mile radius of Dayton, Ohio: 8

-# of upcoming Obama events within a 25-mile radius of Dayton: 57

-# of photos posted to Flickr since September 1, 2008 referring to, or tagged with, the word "Obama": 49,256

-# of photos in that same period referring to, or tagged with "McCain": 16,611

-# of hits on the phrase "voting for Obama" on Google blog search: 22,713

-# of hits on the phrase "voting for McCain" on Google blog search: 16,023

-Average user rating of McCain's campaign videos on YouTube until September 2008: 3.5 stars (out of 5) or higher

-Average user rating of McCain's campaign videos since the beginning of September 2008: 3 or lower (hat tip to TubeMogul)

-Total number of video views of McCain's channel on YouTube in the last month: 4.6 million

-Total number of video views of Obama's channel: 11.4 million

-Number of times Obama used the word pie at a rally in West Philadelphia on October 11: 15"

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 11:12 AM

How the candidates compare on critical technical issues: broadband policies, H1B visa, green technologies, net neutrality, etc. Worth a read.



A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 12:29 PM

THings are not looking good for McCain at the moment. Look for him to try a heroic reboot "underdog fights back against oppression" shtick in tonight's final Presidential Campaign debate.

The polls:

  RCP Average 10/07 - 10/14 -- 49.9 42.4 Obama +7.5 
  Rasmussen Tracking 10/12 - 10/14 3000 LV 50 45 Obama +5 
  Reuters/C-Span/Zogby Tracking 10/12 - 10/14 1210 LV 48 44 Obama +4 
  Hotline/FD Tracking 10/12 - 10/14 823 LV 49 41 Obama +8 
  GW/Battleground Tracking 10/08 - 10/14 800 LV 51 43 Obama +8 
  Gallup Tracking (Traditional)* 10/11 - 10/13 2140 LV 51 45 Obama +6 
  Gallup Tracking (Expanded)* 10/11 - 10/13 2289 LV 53 43 Obama +10 
  LA Times/Bloomberg 10/10 - 10/13 1030 LV 50 41 Obama +9 
  CBS News/NY Times 10/10 - 10/13 699 LV 53 39 Obama +14 
  Ipsos/McClatchy 10/09 - 10/13 1036 RV 48 39 Obama +9 
  Pew Research 10/09 - 10/12 1191 LV 49 42 Obama +7 
  IBD/TIPP Tracking 10/07 - 10/13 825 LV 45 42 Obama +3 
  USA Today/Gallup (Traditional)* 10/10 - 10/12 761 LV 50 46 Obama +4 
  USA Today/Gallup (Expanded)* 10/10 - 10/12 1030 LV 52 45 Obama +7 
  ABC News/Wash Post 10/08 - 10/11 766 LV 53 43 Obama +10 
  

A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 03:31 PM

More mindless 'copy and paste'..whoopie!! Amos, Ever had an original thought??...think hard, and reach deep, before you post.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 03:40 PM

Bend over, darlin', there's a good little girly.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 03:48 PM

Oh, c'mon, Amos. You're better than that ilk...let it starve for attention.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 04:19 PM

Yeah, sorry, but not very very....

I don't know where this came from exactly--it was a recent remark attached to a different story in a Minneapolis paper:

"Featured comment

Headline to come, detaisl to follow: AK GOV Sarah Palin was indicted today on fraud charges and continued lying
Impeachment proceedings have begun by the very same Republican Party Ms. Palin filed ethics charges against to obtain high public office. … read more The irony is that Palin was recently found guilty of similiar ethics violation, a violation of public trust. Palin's VP nomination brought her to the national stage, which set the scene for greater scrutiny due to the mishandling of the AK governors office by McCain campaign operatives. That action alone outraged Alaskans and precipitated additional charges. Impeachment proceedings begin next week and could lead to the end of Ms.Palin's political career!......................"

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 05:14 PM

"Any president, Republican or Democrat, will face enormous pressure -- from his base and from entrenched interests -- in confronting this challenge. McCain has a party allergic to raising taxes. Obama has a party addicted to government spending, reflexively opposed to any benefit cuts and chafing under years of pent-up demand for new programs. "


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/14/AR2008101402562.html

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 05:32 PM

Vote on whether or not Sarah Palin is a qualified candidate for Vice Presidnet of the United Sates.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 05:35 PM

The Truth About Voter Fraud

As the 2008 election process draws near -- and with early voting in many states having already begun -- conservatives are raising a great hue and cry about the threat of voter fraud. Attacks have centered on the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN), the "nation's largest grassroots community organization of low- and moderate-income people," whose workers have registered 1.3 million new voters this year. Conservatives like Rep. Tom Feeney (R-FL) and former Ohio Secretary of State Kenneth Blackwell have seized on reports of improperly filled-out forms as evidence of "lawlessness" and "voting fraud," which will lead to "the kind of chaos you expect from a category-five hurricane." But mass voter fraud is just a conservative myth used to justify increasing the difficulty of the voting process. In an interview with Salon, Lori Minnite, a professor of political science at Barnard College who investigated allegations of widespread voter fraud, explained, "From 2002 to 2005 only one person was found guilty of registration fraud. Twenty people were found guilty of voting while ineligible and five people were found guilty of voting more than once. That's 26 criminal voters -- voters who vote twice, impersonate other people, vote without being a resident ... Meanwhile thousands of people are getting turned away at the polls."

COMPLEX AND ONEROUS RULES: Although the United States has a long and dark history of voter disenfranchisement and voter suppression, recent laws passed at the state and federal level have focused instead on the vaporous threat of voter fraud. These laws particularly discourage the poor and the young. Because voting, even for federal elections, is regulated by state law and administered at the local level, there is no consistent standard for voting machines, ballot design, the counting of provisional ballots, or voter identification. The 2002 Help America Vote Act (HAVA) requires that "any voter who has not previously voted in a federal election" must provide a form of ID.  But "twenty-four states have broader voter identification requirements than what HAVA mandates" -- seven require photo ID for all voters, and 17 more require some form of ID. In April, the U.S. Supreme Court upheld Indiana's draconian photo ID law that could disenfranchise as many as 400,000 voters, although Indiana Secretary of State Todd Rokita "conceded the state has never presented a case of 'voter impersonation.'" In his dissent, Justice David Souter compared Indiana's unjustified regulations to a poll tax, "because it correlates with no state interest so well as it does with the object of deterring poorer residents from exercising the franchise." 

MASS DISENFRANCHISEMENT AND INTIMIDATION: Last week, the New York Times reported that "[t]ens of thousands of eligible voters in at least six swing states have been removed from the rolls or have been blocked from registering in ways that appear to violate federal law." Last Wednesday, U.S. District Judge Donald Molloy issued a scathing order Wednesday "lambasting the Montana Republican Party for challenging the registrations of thousands of Montana voters," writing, "The timing of these challenges is so transparent that it defies common sense to believe the purpose is anything but political chicanery." On Sunday, the Ohio Republican Party "requested information on voters who registered to vote and cast an early ballot on the same day," not long after Greene County Sheriff Gene Fischer requested registration information -- including driver's license and Social Security numbers -- "for the 302 voters who took advantage of the window in that county, which has five colleges and universities, including two historically black colleges." In Indiana, state NAACP president Barbara Bolling said voters in three northern cities "are being disenfranchised each day they can't cast ballots at their local clerk's offices," after "two Republicans on the Lake County Election Board voted against the sites last month, contending in-person absentee voting makes vote fraud easier." In Colorado, the El Paso county clerk Bob Balink has engaged in an "emerging and consistent pattern" of purging voter rolls and challenging inaccurate registration information as "election fraud." 

ROVE'S FINGERPRINTS: The Department of Justice, whose responsibilities include ensuring the right to fair elections, was subverted by the Bush administration to pursue the false threat of voter fraud. In 2002, former attorney general John Ashcroft announced an initiative that required "all components of the Department" to "place a high priority on the investigation and prosecution of election fraud." The 2006 purge of eight U.S. attorneys -- all lifelong Republicans -- at the behest of the Bush White House exposed the depths of this politicization. The White House justified the dismissals by telling reporters, "President Bush mentioned to Attorney General Alberto R. Gonzales in October that he had heard complaints from Congress that some federal prosecutors were lax in pursuing voter fraud." As the Washington Post reported last year, "Nearly half the U.S. attorneys slated for removal by the administration last year were targets of Republican complaints that they were lax on voter fraud, including efforts by presidential adviser Karl Rove to encourage more prosecutions of election-law violations," Rove has made it his specialty to raise the specter of vote fraud throughout his political career, from his days working on state races in Alabama. ..." (The Progressive)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Oct 08 - 11:26 AM

From ABC:

"Battleground States: Looking at the electoral landscape, there are seven must win states for McCain, including Ohio, Florida, Missouri, Colorado, Nevada, Virginia, and North Carolina.

Given the way the electoral map is right now, McCain has to win every single one of those states to eek out a narrow electoral college victory, unless there's a massive shift in the race.

Right now Obama is ahead or at the least tied in every single one of McCain's seven must-win states. If the election were held today, Obama would win 300 electoral votes -- a presidential candidate needs to win 270 to take the White House. "

---

The current state of the States:

FLORIDA: RCP Average 10/04 - 10/14 -- 49.8 45.0 Obama +4.8
OHIO: RCP Average 10/03 - 10/13 -- 48.9 45.5 Obama +3.4
COLORADO:RCP Average 10/05 - 10/14 -- 50.4 44.6 Obama +5.8
MISSOURI: RCP Average 10/04 - 10/14 -- 48.8 47.0 Obama +1.8
NEVADA:RCP Average 05/16 - 09/30 -- 54.0 35.3 McCain +18.7
VIRGINIA: RCP Average 10/03 - 10/14 -- 51.6 43.0 Obama +8.6
N. CAROLINA: RCP Average 10/03 - 10/13 -- 47.9 46.7 Obama +1.2

On a national average, Obama is pulling ahead with a 6.9% lead.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 16 Oct 08 - 01:46 PM

From: katlaughing
Date: 15 Oct 08 - 03:48 PM

Oh, c'mon, Amos. You're better than that ilk...let it starve for attention.   

I don't confuse attention with love.....you??

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Oct 08 - 04:43 PM

Well, of course this ain't scientific 'er nuthin' but I had to fetch a hack of plywood today from Harrisonburg and drove the backroads back to stay off the I-81 and was amazed at the number of Obama signs in front yards and at driveways to farms... The Obama signs outnumbered McCain signs 2-to-1 and we're talking rural Virginia here...

In years past Dems haven't even campaigned in these counties thinking it was a waste of time and money...

Purdy heartening...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 17 Oct 08 - 10:27 AM

Acorn is a nonprofit group that advocates for low- and moderate-income people and has mounted a major voter-registration drive this year. Acorn says that it has paid more than 8,000 canvassers who have registered about 1.3 million new voters, many of them poor people and members of racial minorities.

In recent weeks, the McCain campaign has accused the group of perpetrating voter fraud by intentionally submitting invalid registration forms, including some with fictional names like Mickey Mouse and others for voters who are already registered.

Based on the information that has come to light so far, the charges appear to be wildly overblown — and intended to hobble Acorn's efforts.

The group concedes that some of its hired canvassers have turned in tainted forms, although they say the ones with phony names constitute no more than 1 percent of the total turned in. The group also says it reviews all of the registration forms that come in. Before delivering the forms to elections offices, its supervisors flag any that appear to have problems.

According to Acorn, most of the forms that are now causing controversy are ones that it flagged and that unsympathetic election officials then publicized.

Acorn's critics charge that it is creating phony registrations that ineligible voters could use to cast ballots or that a single voter could use to vote multiple times.

Acorn needs to provide more precise figures about problem forms and needs to do a better job of choosing its canvassers.

But for all of the McCain campaign's manufactured fury about vote theft (and similar claims from the Republican Party over the years) there is virtually no evidence — anywhere in the country, going back many elections — of people showing up at the polls and voting when they are not entitled to.

Meanwhile, Republicans aren't saying anything about another more serious voter-registration scandal: the fact that about one-third of eligible voters are not registered. The racial gaps are significant and particularly disturbing. According to a study by Project Vote, a voting-rights group, in 2006, 71 percent of eligible whites were registered, compared with 61 percent of blacks, 54 percent of Latinos and 49 percent of Asian-Americans.

Much of the blame for this lies with overly restrictive registration rules. Earlier this year, the League of Women Voters halted its registration drive in Florida after the state imposed onerous new requirements.

The answer is for government to a better job of registering people to vote. That way there would be less need to rely on private registration drives, largely being conducted by well-meaning private organizations that use low-paid workers. Federal and state governments should do their own large-scale registration drives staffed by experienced election officials. Even better, Congress and the states should adopt election-day registration, which would make such drives unnecessary.

The real threats to the fabric of democracy are the unreasonable barriers that stand in the way of eligible voters casting ballots.

(NYT)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 17 Oct 08 - 01:13 PM

Online's Marc Pitzke writes:

"In the end, with this debate McCain -- in the absence of unforeseeable events -- has gambled away his best and perhaps last chance to halt Obama's climb. He fought back bravely -- and better than ever. But, the sum total was still not enough. All the subsequent flash polls crowned Obama as the debate's winner. Normally, such values are of fleeting importance. This time, however, they are decisive. The third debate in Hampstead on Long Island was considered the 'point of no return,' as even one of McCain's people in the press center said, though admittedly off the record."

"It was McCain's now-or-never moment: 19 days ahead of the election, he needed to take the helm."

The Financial Times Deutschland writes:

"McCain has also lost the last television debate against Barack Obama. The Republican US presidential candidate didn't succumb to the Democrats because he had worse arguments regarding the economy. ... In recent weeks Obama simply managed to evoke more confidence among the voters -- and confidence is tantamount to hard currency in times of crisis."

"It is curious that Obama may win the presidency on the basis of the economy of all things. After all, in his speeches across America the Democrat seems to be speaking to a country which no longer exists. ... Obama's program is a program of moderate wealth redistribution. A program with a feel-good factor. A program for an America which is not in the throes of a financial crisis."

"After the election a possible President Obama would have to react to the real America: a country with an enormous debt burden plus a costly bank rescue plan. A country in which there is not a lot left to redistribute."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 17 Oct 08 - 03:12 PM

Electoral Count With No Toss Up States


Obama/Biden 364
McCain/Palin 174

Solid Obama
CA (55) CT (7)
DC (3) DE (3)
HI (4) IA (7)
IL (21) MA (12)
MD (10) ME (4)
MI (17) NH (4)
NJ (15) NY (31)
OR (7) PA (21)
RI (4) VT (3)
WA (11) WI (10)
Leaning Obama
CO (9) MN (10)
NM (5) VA (13)
Obama Up
FL (27) MO (11)
NC (15) NV (5)
OH (20)   
McCain Up
IN (11) ND (3)
WV (5)   
Leaning McCain
GA (15)   
Solid McCain
AK (3) AL (9)
AR (6) AZ (10)
ID (4) KS (6)
KY (8) LA (9)
MS (6) MT (3)
NE (5) OK (7)
SC (8) SD (3)
TN (11) TX (34)
UT (5) WY (3)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 17 Oct 08 - 03:52 PM

The Los Angeles Times writes:

"It is inherent in the American character to aspire to greatness, so it can be disorienting when the nation stumbles or loses confidence in bedrock principles or institutions. That's where the United States is as it prepares to select a new president: We have seen the government take a stake in venerable private financial houses; we have witnessed eight years of executive branch power grabs and erosion of civil liberties; we are still recovering from a murderous attack by terrorists on our own soil and still struggling with how best to prevent a recurrence.

We need a leader who demonstrates thoughtful calm and grace under pressure, one not prone to volatile gesture or capricious pronouncement. We need a leader well-grounded in the intellectual and legal foundations of American freedom. Yet we ask that the same person also possess the spark and passion to inspire the best within us: creativity, generosity and a fierce defense of justice and liberty.

The Times without hesitation endorses Barack Obama for president.

Our nation has never before had a candidate like Obama, a man born in the 1960s, of black African and white heritage, raised and educated abroad as well as in the United States, and bringing with him a personal narrative that encompasses much of the American story but that, until now, has been reflected in little of its elected leadership. The excitement of Obama's early campaign was amplified by that newness. But as the presidential race draws to its conclusion, it is Obama's character and temperament that come to the fore. It is his steadiness. His maturity.

These are qualities American leadership has sorely lacked for close to a decade. The U.S. Constitution, more than two centuries old, now offers the world one of its more mature and certainly most stable governments, but our political culture is still struggling to shake off a brash and unseemly adolescence. In George W. Bush, the executive branch turned its back on an adult role in the nation and the world and retreated into self-absorbed unilateralism. ..."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 17 Oct 08 - 05:26 PM

A Liberal Supermajority
Get ready for 'change' we haven't seen since 1965, or 1933.

If the current polls hold, Barack Obama will win the White House on November 4 and Democrats will consolidate their Congressional majorities, probably with a filibuster-proof Senate or very close to it. Without the ability to filibuster, the Senate would become like the House, able to pass whatever the majority wants.


APThough we doubt most Americans realize it, this would be one of the most profound political and ideological shifts in U.S. history. Liberals would dominate the entire government in a way they haven't since 1965, or 1933. In other words, the election would mark the restoration of the activist government that fell out of public favor in the 1970s. If the U.S. really is entering a period of unchecked left-wing ascendancy, Americans at least ought to understand what they will be getting, especially with the media cheering it all on.

The nearby table shows the major bills that passed the House this year or last before being stopped by the Senate minority. Keep in mind that the most important power of the filibuster is to shape legislation, not merely to block it. The threat of 41 committed Senators can cause the House to modify its desires even before legislation comes to a vote. Without that restraining power, all of the following have very good chances of becoming law in 2009 or 2010.

- Medicare for all. When HillaryCare cratered in 1994, the Democrats concluded they had overreached, so they carved up the old agenda into smaller incremental steps, such as Schip for children. A strongly Democratic Congress is now likely to lay the final flagstones on the path to government-run health insurance from cradle to grave.

Mr. Obama wants to build a public insurance program, modeled after Medicare and open to everyone of any income. According to the Lewin Group, the gold standard of health policy analysis, the Obama plan would shift between 32 million and 52 million from private coverage to the huge new entitlement. Like Medicare or the Canadian system, this would never be repealed.

The commitments would start slow, so as not to cause immediate alarm. But as U.S. health-care spending flowed into the default government options, taxes would have to rise or services would be rationed, or both. Single payer is the inevitable next step, as Mr. Obama has already said is his ultimate ideal.

- The business climate. "We have some harsh decisions to make," Speaker Nancy Pelosi warned recently, speaking about retribution for the financial panic. Look for a replay of the Pecora hearings of the 1930s, with Henry Waxman, John Conyers and Ed Markey sponsoring ritual hangings to further their agenda to control more of the private economy. The financial industry will get an overhaul in any case, but telecom, biotech and drug makers, among many others, can expect to be investigated and face new, more onerous rules. See the "Issues and Legislation" tab on Mr. Waxman's Web site for a not-so-brief target list.

The danger is that Democrats could cause the economic downturn to last longer than it otherwise will by enacting regulatory overkill like Sarbanes-Oxley. Something more punitive is likely as well, for instance a windfall profits tax on oil, and maybe other industries.

- Union supremacy. One program certain to be given right of way is "card check." Unions have been in decline for decades, now claiming only 7.4% of the private-sector work force, so Big Labor wants to trash the secret-ballot elections that have been in place since the 1930s. The "Employee Free Choice Act" would convert workplaces into union shops merely by gathering signatures from a majority of employees, which means organizers could strongarm those who opposed such a petition.

The bill also imposes a compulsory arbitration regime that results in an automatic two-year union "contract" after 130 days of failed negotiation. The point is to force businesses to recognize a union whether the workers support it or not. This would be the biggest pro-union shift in the balance of labor-management power since the Wagner Act of 1935.

- Taxes. Taxes will rise substantially, the only question being how high. Mr. Obama would raise the top income, dividend and capital-gains rates for "the rich," substantially increasing the cost of new investment in the U.S. More radically, he wants to lift or eliminate the cap on income subject to payroll taxes that fund Medicare and Social Security. This would convert what was meant to be a pension insurance program into an overt income redistribution program. It would also impose a probably unrepealable increase in marginal tax rates, and a permanent shift upward in the federal tax share of GDP.

- The green revolution. A tax-and-regulation scheme in the name of climate change is a top left-wing priority. Cap and trade would hand Congress trillions of dollars in new spending from the auction of carbon credits, which it would use to pick winners and losers in the energy business and across the economy. Huge chunks of GDP and millions of jobs would be at the mercy of Congress and a vast new global-warming bureaucracy. Without the GOP votes to help stage a filibuster, Senators from carbon-intensive states would have less ability to temper coastal liberals who answer to the green elites.

- Free speech and voting rights. A liberal supermajority would move quickly to impose procedural advantages that could cement Democratic rule for years to come. One early effort would be national, election-day voter registration. This is a long-time goal of Acorn and others on the "community organizer" left and would make it far easier to stack the voter rolls. The District of Columbia would also get votes in Congress -- Democratic, naturally.

Felons may also get the right to vote nationwide, while the Fairness Doctrine is likely to be reimposed either by Congress or the Obama FCC. A major goal of the supermajority left would be to shut down talk radio and other voices of political opposition.

- Special-interest potpourri. Look for the watering down of No Child Left Behind testing standards, as a favor to the National Education Association. The tort bar's ship would also come in, including limits on arbitration to settle disputes and watering down the 1995 law limiting strike suits. New causes of legal action would be sprinkled throughout most legislation. The anti-antiterror lobby would be rewarded with the end of Guantanamo and military commissions, which probably means trying terrorists in civilian courts. Google and MoveOn.org would get "net neutrality" rules, subjecting the Internet to intrusive regulation for the first time.

It's always possible that events -- such as a recession -- would temper some of these ambitions. Republicans also feared the worst in 1993 when Democrats ran the entire government, but it didn't turn out that way. On the other hand, Bob Dole then had 43 GOP Senators to support a filibuster, and the entire Democratic Party has since moved sharply to the left. Mr. Obama's agenda is far more liberal than Bill Clinton's was in 1992, and the Southern Democrats who killed Al Gore's BTU tax and modified liberal ambitions are long gone.

In both 1933 and 1965, liberal majorities imposed vast expansions of government that have never been repealed, and the current financial panic may give today's left another pretext to return to those heydays of welfare-state liberalism. Americans voting for "change" should know they may get far more than they ever imagined.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: PoppaGator
Date: 17 Oct 08 - 05:58 PM

And this is a bad thing? ;^)

I have a problem with any essay that sneers at "free speech and voting rights."

Seriously, though, I do understand that some of those rightist concerns are legit. Nevertheless, I absolutely believe that it is well past time for the pendulum to swing back from the steadily intensifying right-wing rule, and the growing power of the miliitary-industrial complex, that we've been enduring since 1980.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Oct 08 - 04:23 PM

Surely the picture on this page should settle the question of who is fit for purpose. Any purpose.

I mean, be serious.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Oct 08 - 07:41 PM

That all sounds good to me.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Oct 08 - 08:11 PM

(The Politico) It's unlikely that the American media will produce the "penetrating exposé" into whether members of Congress are "pro-America or anti-America" that Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.) called for Friday, but there has been at least one consequence she may not have expected: Her congressional opponent, Democrat El Tinklenberg, has been showered with cash from all parts of the country — America, that is — as apparently insulted Americans respond to Bachmann's request.

"I can absolutely confirm that we have had in the last 24 hours donations from hundreds and hundreds of people from all over the country," said Tinklenberg campaign manager Anna Richey. "It's coming in so fast I can't get a hold on it and can't give a precise number. It's still coming in." At minimum, she said, $150,000 has so far been donated and she expects the total, which the campaign will release later today, to be far higher.

"It's overwhelming," said Richey. "I've gotten 600 e-mail messages into our info e-mail account in the last 12 hours. People are outraged." She said a number of the e-mails decried Bachmann's call for the investigation as modern-day McCarthyism. "People shared personal stories of how their parents were discriminated against" during that time, said Richey.

The messaes, she said, came from "Republicans, Democrats, people who professed to be out of work and struggling economically but wanted to give what they could."

Bachmann on Friday told MSNBC's Chris Matthews that Barack Obama is not the only anti-American member of Congress. "The news media should do a penetrating exposé and take a look. I wish they would. I wish the American media would take a great look at the views of the people in Congress and find out: Are they pro-America or anti-America? I think people would love to see an exposé like that," she said.

Richey said she's been amazed at the response. "It's really exciting, but unfortunate it had to come under these circumstances. This is what we've been trying to eliminate for months," she said of Bachmann..."

---

McCarthyism is right. This is a most refreshing repsonse.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Charley Noble
Date: 18 Oct 08 - 10:03 PM

Where do I send my check and whom do I make it out to?

I got nothing else to say.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Oct 08 - 11:10 PM

Which Papers have Endorsed Whom?? summarized.

"As of 10/18, among the top 100 papers, Obama has been endorsed by papers with a circulation of 6.9 Million, McCain by papers with a circulation of 1.3 Million."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 11:13 AM

Sunday morning, NBC's Tom Brokaw talked with MSNBC political analyst Chuck Todd about how the polls are shaping up just several weeks prior to the election. Todd told Brokaw that at this point, McCain appears to be "conceding the popular vote" in order to pursue victory through the Electoral College, similar to how outgoing President George W. Bush came to power.

Todd, making the argument that older voters could be the crucial demographic in the election's endgame, claimed there's been some evidence that they are shifting toward Obama.

"That's how this thing becomes, from a close Electoral College battle to a landslide," he said.

"And by the way, one more point about our map, as we're seeing this shift. It's almost as if the McCain campaign is conceding the popular vote. We're seeing a lot of tightening in some places that, while Obama won't carry them, he's not gonna lose by large margins.

"That means the McCain path is solely now an Electoral College path. If he wins the Electoral College, it's hard to see how he actually wins the popular vote."

See story here.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 03:29 PM

IN Waiting for the Barbarians, Richard Kim examines the hate-quotient now pulsing through the death-mask of the neoconservative political wing.



A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 08:55 AM

"It never ends. The Republican Party never gets tired of spraying its poison across the American political landscape.

So there was a Republican congresswoman from Minnesota, Michele Bachmann, telling Chris Matthews on MSNBC that the press should start investigating members of the House and Senate to determine which ones are "pro-America or anti-America."

Can a rancid Congressional committee be far behind? Leave it to a right-wing Republican to long for those sunny, bygone days of political witch-hunting.

Ms. Bachmann's demented desire ("I would love to see an exposé like that") is of a piece with the G.O.P.'s unrelenting effort to demonize its opponents, to characterize them as beyond the pale, different from ordinary patriotic Americans — and not just different, but dangerous, and even evil.

But the party is not content to stop there. Even better than demonizing opponents is the more powerful and direct act of taking the vote away from their opponents' supporters. The Republican Party has made strenuous efforts in recent years to prevent Democrats from voting, and to prevent their votes from being properly counted once they've been cast.

Which brings me to the phony Acorn scandal.

John McCain, who placed his principles in a blind trust once the presidential race heated up, warned the country during the presidential debate last week that Acorn, which has been registering people to vote by the hundreds of thousands, was "on the verge of maybe perpetrating one of the greatest frauds in voter history."

It turns out that a tiny percentage of these new registrations are bogus, with some of them carrying ludicrous names like Mickey Mouse. Republicans have tried to turn this into a mighty oak of a scandal, with Mr. McCain thundering at the debate that it "may be destroying the fabric of democracy."

Please. The Times put the matter in perspective when it said in an editorial that Acorn needs to be more careful with some aspects of its voter-registration process. It needs to do a better job selecting canvassers, among other things.

"But," the editorial added, "for all of the McCain campaign's manufactured fury about vote theft (and similar claims from the Republican Party over the years) there is virtually no evidence — anywhere in the country, going back many elections — of people showing up at the polls and voting when they are not entitled to."

Two important points need to be made here. First, the reckless attempt by Senator McCain, Sarah Palin and others to fan this into a major scandal has made Acorn the target of vandals and a wave of hate calls and e-mail. Acorn staff members have been threatened and sickening, murderous comments have been made about supporters of Barack Obama. (Senator Obama had nothing to do with Acorn's voter-registration drives.)

Second, when it comes to voting, the real threat to democracy is the nonstop campaign by the G.O.P. and its supporters to disenfranchise American citizens who have every right to cast a ballot. We saw this in 2000. We saw it in 2004. And we're seeing it again now.

In Montana, the Republican Party challenged the registrations of thousands of legitimate voters based on change-of-address information available from the Post Office. These specious challenges were made — surprise, surprise — in Democratic districts. Answering the challenges would have been a wholly unnecessary hardship for the voters, many of whom were students or members of the armed forces.

In the face of widespread public criticism (even the Republican lieutenant governor weighed in), the party backed off.

That sort of thing is widespread. In one politically crucial state after another — in Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin, you name it — the G.O.P. has unleashed foot soldiers whose insidious mission is to make the voting process as difficult as possible — or, better yet, impossible — for citizens who are believed to favor Democrats.

For Senator McCain to flip reality on its head and point to an overwhelmingly legitimate voter-registration effort as a "threat to the fabric of democracy" is a breathtaking exercise in absurdity."

Bob Herbert, NYT OpEd

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 11:34 AM

Home » Politics » First Read

Web MSNBC First Read   ABOUT FIRST READ
First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.


Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director


Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director


Domenico Montanaro, NBC Political Researcher


   McCain vs. Obama: Before and after Posted: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 9:39 AM by Domenico Montanaro
Filed Under: 2008, McCain, Obama

A New York Times/CBS poll conducted among the same respondents before the first debate -- and then after the last one -- shows that Obama's favorability rating increased while McCain's declined. "As voters have gotten to know Senator Barack Obama, they have warmed up to him, with more than half, 53 percent, now saying they have a favorable impression of him and 33 percent saying they have an unfavorable view. But as voters have gotten to know Senator John McCain, they have not warmed, with only 36 percent of voters saying they view him favorably while 45 percent view him unfavorably."

More: "Mrs. Palin's negative rating is the highest for a vice-presidential candidate as measured by The Times and CBS News. Even Dan Quayle, with whom Mrs. Palin is often compared because of her age and inexperience on the national scene, was not viewed as negatively in the 1988 campaign."

The Washington Post/ABC poll has started a daily tracking, and it has Obama up 53%-44% among likely voters.    ..."

(MSNBC)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 10:49 PM

TROY — County elections officials are blaming a computer spell-checking program for the error in hundreds of mailed absentee ballots that spelled Barack Obama's surname Osama.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 09:28 AM

10-22-08

USA Today leads with news that more Democrats are voting early in several key states, which marks a change from previous elections. "This is like a mirror image of what we've seen in the past," one expert tells the paper. The Wall Street Journal leads its world-wide newsbox with a new poll that gives Barack Obama a 10-point lead over John McCain. Despite McCain's efforts to make taxes a central part of the campaign, Obama has a 14-point lead on the issue. Meanwhile, Sarah Palin's popularity continues its downward spiral. Only 38 percent of voters have a positive view of the Alaska governor, and 55 percent say she isn't qualified to be president.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 09:34 AM

Just this morning I saw on local FOX TV, Karl Rove on stage with two other crusty old white guys when a beautiful woman dressed in a Nieman Marcus suit was allowed to walk onstage and proceed to make a citizen's arrest of Karl Rove for Treason and vote tampering.
CLASSIC!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 25 Oct 08 - 03:29 PM

"Charles Krauthammer shrugs his shoulders. "Contrarian that I am, I'm voting for John McCain," he writes. "I'm not talking about bucking the polls or the media consensus that it's over before it's over. I'm talking about bucking the rush of wet-fingered conservatives leaping to Barack Obama before they're left out in the cold without a single state dinner for the next four years."

E.J. Dionne, however, thinks the phenomenon is more significant than mere bandwagon-jumping. "These conservatives deserve credit for acknowledging how ill-suited Palin is for high office," he writes. "But what we see here is a deep split between parts of the conservative elite and much of the rank and file." Dionne continues:

"For years, many of the elite conservatives were happy to harvest the votes of devout Christians and gun owners by waging a phony class war against "liberal elitists" and "leftist intellectuals." Suddenly, the conservative writers are discovering that the very anti-intellectualism their side courted and encouraged has begun to consume their movement.

The cause of Edmund Burke, Leo Strauss, Robert Nisbet and William F. Buckley Jr. is now in the hands of Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity — and Sarah Palin. Reason has been overwhelmed by propaganda, ideas by slogans, learned manifestoes by direct-mail hit pieces..."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 25 Oct 08 - 09:45 PM

It's fine as far as it goes, but look at the mindless buffoons who are carrying the banner for the Democratic Party.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 12:35 AM

ABout as mindless as their numb-nutted opposite numbers across the aisle, Rig. Come on.



A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Barry Finn
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 12:57 AM

When you run on an anti-intelligence platform who or what did you expect to represent the idiots, not anyone with brains or did you? If you want low intelligence levels just look at Bush who's been running the show the last 8 yrs. Only an imbecile or the insane would want more of the same.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 09:44 AM

"Only an imbecile or the insane would want more of the same."


             Most people would agree with that. That's why rational voters are trying to steer people away from Obama.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 11:55 AM

"..(H)uman nuances are lost on conservative warriors of the Allen-McCain-Palin ilk. They see all Americans as only white or black, as either us or them. The dirty little secret of such divisive politicians has always been that their rage toward the Others is exceeded only by their cynical conviction that Real Americans are a benighted bunch of easily manipulated bigots. This seems to be the election year when voters in most of our myriad Americas are figuring that out..."

In a thoughtful and insightful essay Times columnist Frank Rich defends the character of actual Americans from the facile racism imputed to it by the Palins and McCains and other macaca-slingers of the political game. Recommended read.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 12:00 PM

"...The McCain campaign's response to its falling chances of victory has been telling: rather than trying to make the case that Mr. McCain really is better qualified to deal with the economic crisis, the campaign has been doing all it can to trivialize things again. Mr. Obama consorts with '60s radicals! He's a socialist! He doesn't love America! Judging from the polls, it doesn't seem to be working.

Will the nation's new demand for seriousness last? Maybe not — remember how 9/11 was supposed to end the focus on trivialities? For now, however, voters seem to be focused on real issues. And that's bad for Mr. McCain and conservatives in general: right now, to paraphrase Rob Corddry, reality has a clear liberal bias."

NYT

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: heric
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 07:11 PM

"Democratic presidential contender Barack Obama, working to win over Latino voters in Colorado, chanted ``si se puede,'' or ``yes we can,'' in Spanish along with an outdoor crowd in Denver estimated at more than 100,000."

Oh My God he's just throwing it in their faces now. The rural rightists in the pro-American parts of the country must be pissing their drawers lol.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 08:32 PM

"The rural rightists in the pro-American parts of the country must be pissing their drawers..."


                Which would seem to impy that the anti-American forces are winning.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Barry Finn
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 08:37 PM

Well can you visualize MaCain singing in Spanish "No, we can't". The latino vote well go to Obama based on intelligence & the Latino's in America both citizens & non citizens have much to fear from a MaCain/Palin administration. Palin will make it her religious crusade to come down on them (Latianos) with a vengence in the guise of immigation reform.
Speaking of the MaCain/Palin ticket, in the waining days it seem that their camain is starting to implode. There is in-fighting among each idiots camps. Although MaCain is trying to keep up a good face the fuss is spilling over. If the the Obama campain wants to run with the disent it's all over. "Imagine MaCain & Palin sharing the White House, they can't even share in their campains".

"Only an imbecile or the insane would want more of the same."

I guess you just don't get it Rig!
It's the republicans that have been dissing intelligence throughout this campain, from the very beginning. Trying to downplay "those Harvard elitists". MaCain isn't working with that much to start with & now he picks someone who's got less going for her than Bush & what's worst is he's surrounding himself with mediocre leftovers from the same Bush administration. Meanwhile, the intelligence of the Obama/Biden ticket is showing through like sunshine through a break in a cloudy sky, what makes it all clearer are those that are coming out for Obama (like Powell) & the intelligence that he's surrounding himself with.
No one with brains is steering anyone from Obama, if anything those with brains all seem to be blazing a trail towards the Obama/Biden ticket, you should ask yourself why. If you think it won't take brains to get US out of this mess & if you think that intelligence is on the side of MaCain/Palin you need to rethink your thought process.

Barry for Obama

We are witnessing the beginning of the end of the Sweetheart John & Sara Story, check out the early voting. MaCain did get one important vote, Bush's, 'enough said.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 11:14 AM

I like this by Jack Myers:

The Obama Campaign's Only Fear is Fear Itself

The only threat to the Obama campaign in the next week is the festering threat that Americans will take to the streets and riot if McCain wins. I forecast a relatively fraud-free election and a sweeping victory for both Barack Obama and Democratic candidates across America. Although I supported Hillary Clinton in the primary, I predicted during the Convention that Obama would defeat McCain with at least 52% of the vote (and probably 53%) to McCain's 46%. I anticipate Obama will capture more than 300 electoral votes and win as many as 38 states.

We have reason to believe that such a landslide victory is at hand but we are also realistic. It has been stolen before, but these were very tight races following poorly run Democratic campaigns in 2004 and 2000. Early voting had called attention to potential problems in West Virginia, Florida and Ohio, but the immediate response of the press was a warning to perpetrators. This time you will be uncovered. While some may try to obstruct the votes of Democratic-leaning segments of society, hundreds of thousands of poll watchers are on hand outside polling places. The Democratic National Committee has lawyers standing at the ready in contested states.

The prospect of a McCain upset has become progressively more untenable among Obama supporters. But news reports on the threat of riots in the event of an Obama loss are fear-mongering -- intended to provoke memories of race riots in the 1960s and 1990s. There is no comparison.

In the unlikely case Sarah Palin becomes one heart beat away from the Presidency there will be demonstrations, but they will not be race related. Millions will march on Washington – people of all colors, creeds and beliefs. Not because of rebellion but because of popular uproar, Americans will force an aggressively liberal mandate on Congress and John McCain will be unable to exert any control over government.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 11:25 AM

The FInancial Times of London opines:

Obama is the better choice
Published: October 26 2008 19:31 | Last updated: October 26 2008 19:31

US presidential elections involve a fabulous expense of time, effort and money. Doubtless it is all too much – but, by the end, nobody can complain that the candidates have been too little scrutinised. We have learnt a lot about Barack Obama and John McCain during this campaign. In our view, it is enough to be confident that Mr Obama is the right choice.

At the outset, we were not so confident. Mr Obama is inexperienced. His policies are a blend of good, not so good and downright bad. Since the election will strengthen Democratic control of Congress, a case can be made for returning a Republican to the White House: divided government has a better record in the United States than government united under either party.

EDITOR'S CHOICE
Full coverage: US elections 2008 - Oct-21McCain insists polls are misleading - Oct-26'Bridge to nowhere' shows divide in spending - Oct-27Left set to shape politics for a generation - Oct-26Candidates woo 'Wal-Mart moms' - Oct-27On the trail: Campaign diary - Oct-26So this ought to have been a close call. With a week remaining before the election, we cannot feel that it is.

Mr Obama fought a much better campaign. Campaigning is not the same as governing, and the presidency should not be a prize for giving the best speeches, devising the best television advertisements, shaking the most hands and kissing the most babies.

Nonetheless, a campaign is a test of leadership. Mr Obama ran his superbly; Mr McCain's has often looked a shambles. After eight years of George W. Bush, the steady competence of the Obama operation commands respect.

Nor should one disdain Mr Obama's way with a crowd. Good presidents engage the country's attention; great ones inspire. Mr McCain, on form, is an adequate speaker but no more. Mr Obama, on form, is as fine a political orator as the country has heard in decades. Put to the right purposes, this is no mere decoration but a priceless asset.

Mr Obama's purposes do seem mostly right, though in saying this we give him the benefit of the doubt. Above all, he prizes consensus and genuinely seeks to unite the country, something it wants. His call for change struck a mighty chord in a tired and demoralised nation – and who could promise real change more credibly than Mr Obama, a black man, whose very nomination was a historic advance in US politics?

We applaud his main domestic proposal: comprehensive health-care reform. This plan would achieve nearly universal insurance without the mandates of rival schemes: characteristically, it combines a far-sighted goal with moderation in the method. Mr McCain's plan, based on extending tax relief beyond employer-provided insurance, also has merit – it would contain costs better – but is too timid and would widen coverage much less.

Mr Obama is most disappointing on trade. He pandered to protectionists during the primaries, and has not rowed back. He may be sincere, which is troubling. Should he win the election, a Democratic Congress will expect him to keep those trade-thumping promises. Mr McCain has been bravely and consistently pro-trade, much to his credit.

In responding to the economic emergency, Mr Obama has again impressed – not by advancing solutions of his own, but in displaying a calm and methodical disposition, and in seeking the best advice. Mr McCain's hasty half-baked interventions were unnerving when they were not beside the point.

On foreign policy, where the candidates have often conspired to exaggerate their differences, this contrast in temperaments seems crucial. For all his experience, Mr McCain has seemed too much guided by an instinct for peremptory action, an exaggerated sense of certainty, and a reluctance to see shades of grey.

He has offered risk-taking almost as his chief qualification, but gambles do not always pay off. His choice of Sarah Palin as running mate, widely acknowledged to have been a mistake, is an obtrusive case in point. Rashness is not a virtue in a president. The cautious and deliberate Mr Obama is altogether a less alarming prospect.

Rest assured that, should he win, Mr Obama is bound to disappoint. How could he not? He is expected to heal the country's racial divisions, reverse the trend of rising inequality, improve middle-class living standards, cut almost everybody's taxes, transform the image of the United States abroad, end the losses in Iraq, deal with the mess in Afghanistan and much more besides.

Succeeding in those endeavours would require more than uplifting oratory and presidential deportment even if the economy were growing rapidly, which it will not be.

The challenges facing the next president will be extraordinary. We hesitate to wish it on anyone, but we hope that Mr Obama gets the job.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 12:10 PM

Anchorage (Alaska) Daily News (esp. note the last paragraph):


Obama for president

Palin's rise captivates us but nation needs a steady hand

Published: October 25th, 2008 07:37 PM
Last Modified: October 25th, 2008 08:10 PM

Alaska enters its 50th-anniversary year in the glow of an improbable and highly memorable event: the nomination of Gov. Sarah Palin as the Republican vice presidential candidate. For the first time ever, an Alaskan is making a serious bid for national office, and in doing so she brings broad attention and recognition not only to herself, but also to the state she leads.

Alaska's founders were optimistic people, but even the most farsighted might have been stretched to imagine this scenario. No matter the outcome in November, this election will mark a signal moment in the history of the 49th state. Many Alaskans are proud to see their governor, and their state, so prominent on the national stage.

Gov. Palin's nomination clearly alters the landscape for Alaskans as we survey this race for the presidency -- but it does not overwhelm all other judgment. The election, after all is said and done, is not about Sarah Palin, and our sober view is that her running mate, Sen. John McCain, is the wrong choice for president at this critical time for our nation.

Sen. Barack Obama, the Democratic nominee, brings far more promise to the office. In a time of grave economic crisis, he displays thoughtful analysis, enlists wise counsel and operates with a cool, steady hand. The same cannot be said of Sen. McCain.

Since his early acknowledgement that economic policy is not his strong suit, Sen. McCain has stumbled and fumbled badly in dealing with the accelerating crisis as it emerged. He declared that "the fundamentals of our economy are strong" at 9 a.m. one day and by 11 a.m. was describing an economy in crisis. He is both a longtime advocate of less market regulation and a supporter of the huge taxpayer-funded Wall Street bailout. His behavior in this crisis -- erratic is a kind description -- shows him to be ill-equipped to lead the essential effort of reining in a runaway financial system and setting an anxious nation on course to economic recovery.

Sen. Obama warned regulators and the nation 19 months ago that the subprime lending crisis was a disaster in the making. Sen. McCain backed tighter rules for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, but didn't do much to advance that legislation. Of the two candidates, Sen. Obama better understands the mortgage meltdown's root causes and has the judgment and intelligence to shape a solution, as well as the leadership to rally the country behind it. It is easy to look at Sen. Obama and see a return to the smart, bipartisan economic policies of the last Democratic administration in Washington, which left the country with the momentum of growth and a budget surplus that President George Bush has squandered.

On the most important issue of the day, Sen. Obama is a clear choice.

Sen. McCain describes himself as a maverick, by which he seems to mean that he spent 25 years trying unsuccessfully to persuade his own party to follow his bipartisan, centrist lead. Sadly, maverick John McCain didn't show up for the campaign. Instead we have candidate McCain, who embraces the extreme Republican orthodoxy he once resisted and cynically asks Americans to buy for another four years.

It is Sen. Obama who truly promises fundamental change in Washington. You need look no further than the guilt-by-association lies and sound-bite distortions of the degenerating McCain campaign to see how readily he embraces the divisive, fear-mongering tactics of Karl Rove. And while Sen. McCain points to the fragile success of the troop surge in stabilizing conditions in Iraq, it is also plain that he was fundamentally wrong about the more crucial early decisions. Contrary to his assurances, we were not greeted as liberators; it was not a short, easy war; and Americans -- not Iraqi oil -- have had to pay for it. It was Sen. Obama who more clearly saw the danger ahead.

The unqualified endorsement of Sen. Obama by a seasoned, respected soldier and diplomat like Gen. Colin Powell, a Republican icon, should reassure all Americans that the Democratic candidate will pass muster as commander in chief.

On a matter of parochial interest, Sen. Obama opposes the opening of the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge, but so does Sen. McCain. We think both are wrong, and hope a President Obama can be convinced to support environmentally responsible development of that resource.

Gov. Palin has shown the country why she has been so successful in her young political career. Passionate, charismatic and indefatigable, she draws huge crowds and sows excitement in her wake. She has made it clear she's a force to be reckoned with, and you can be sure politicians and political professionals across the country have taken note. Her future, in Alaska and on the national stage, seems certain to be played out in the limelight.

Yet despite her formidable gifts, few who have worked closely with the governor would argue she is truly ready to assume command of the most important, powerful nation on earth. To step in and juggle the demands of an economic meltdown, two deadly wars and a deteriorating climate crisis would stretch the governor beyond her range. Like picking Sen. McCain for president, putting her one 72-year-old heartbeat from the leadership of the free world is just too risky at this time.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 12:47 PM

BAttleground STates today (per Real Clear POlitics averages):

Battleground
States Obama McCain Spread
Colorado 51.3 44.8 Obama +6.5
Ohio    49.9 43.9 Obama +6.0
Florida   47.7 45.8 Obama +1.9
Nevada    49.0 45.5 Obama +3.5
Missouri 47.0 46.0 Obama +1.0
North
Carolina   48.8 47.3 Obama +1.5
Virginia   51.6 43.9 Obama +7.7

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 01:46 PM

DOnna Brazile remasrks:\

"..The so-called ACORN scandal is no more than a few canvassers trying to meet their quota and make easy money by cheating the system.

Ask yourself how likely is it that someone would go through the effort and risk of submitting multiple false registration forms, find an accomplished forger capable of producing IDs of sufficient quality to trick election officials, and then spend Election Day racking up a couple extra votes at the potential cost of spending a decade in jail?

A simple cost-benefit analysis tells us this is not a reasonable or significant threat. The real threat here is the Republican Party using attacks on ACORN as a calculated strategy to justify massive challenges to the votes cast in Democratic-leaning voting precincts on Election Day. And this is what is truly outrageous, but where is John McCain's concern when it comes to people being harassed at the voting booth?

The same Republican Party shouting "Voter fraud!" is also furiously trying to prevent Ohio from registering voters at early voting sites and suing to shut down some early voting sites in Indiana.

Just as the GOP will use the so-called "Bradley effect" to explain away voting irregularities it created through voter suppression, it will use allegations of voter fraud to cover its efforts of voter suppression.

McCain and Republican candidates up and down the GOP ticket don't want increased voter turnout.

Let them sputter and fret. A swelling of the voter rolls strengthens our democracy. The more eligible voters we have participating in the process, the stronger we are as a nation -- and the more accurately the results on November 4 will reflect our nation's choice for president.

We must be vigilant in protecting people's right to vote, not vigilant in suppressing it. We must be vigilant that new voters aren't threatened, harassed or turned away. And we must be vigilant that resources like voting machines and poll workers are distributed appropriately to accommodate the projected influx of new voters.

Finally, we must be vigilant that this election, unlike 2000 or 2004, doesn't return conspicuous voting irregularities, and that those irregularities aren't left unchallenged.

We must be vigilant in the protection of our democracy because the way things are going in the United States right now, democracy may be the only valuable left in our national treasury..."

(DOnna Brazile on CNN)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 05:55 PM

The national headquarters of John McCain's campaign are in northern Virginia, near the condo where he stays when he is working across the river in Washington. But McCain didn't get around to actually campaigning in the most pivotal part of this pivotal state — exurban Prince William County — until the weekend of Oct. 18. That's when he realized he was running about 10 points behind in a state that hasn't voted Democratic since 1964.


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That pretty much sums up the entire race with just a week remaining: McCain is having to spend what little money and time he has left to defend the ground he thought he had locked up months ago. In Prince William County, about 30 miles south of Washington, he told a crowd of around 10,000 that electing Barack Obama would bring a new wave of socialism to the U.S. "America didn't become the greatest nation on earth by giving our money to the government to 'spread the wealth around,'" he said outside the county government headquarters in Woodbridge. "In this country, we believe in spreading opportunity." Leaving the rally, supporters handed out black bumper stickers with the word change written in red letters, the c in the shape of a U.S.S.R.-era sickle and hammer.

Virginia has become a make-or-break state for McCain, and Prince William County is its red-hot center. The site of the first and second battles of Bull Run more than 140 years ago, it now marks a new Mason-Dixon Line on the electoral map: a midpoint between the largely blue-leaning industrialized North that stretches up to Maine and the agrarian, conservative South. The western part of Prince William is old Virginia, rural horse country dotted with estates and polo fields. This end of the county helps make it the ninth richest in the U.S.; if the whole region were so wealthy, McCain would have less to worry about. But as you head east toward Washington, the antebellum mansions turn into McMansions, then give way to middle-class row houses whose shiny blue roofs gleam through the trees from Prince William Highway like giant Lego plantations.

On the other side of the tracks — literally Amtrak's line from Washington to Richmond — the county's eastern corridor is one of the fastest-growing areas in the state, home to a Latino population that has swelled from about 5% of the population in 1990 to approximately 20% in 2007. Along the Occoquan and Potomac rivers, the state's northern and eastern borders, historic black neighborhoods argue for space with new developments: golf courses, strip malls, gated communities, retirement villages — many that stand half finished, caught off guard by the subprime crisis. Such bedroom communities have been the worst hit in the state by the economic downturn; before the market plunge, high gas prices and highway congestion topped the list of concerns for those commuting to Washington or the northern Virginia cities of Arlington and Alexandria. This is the new face of Virginia — and the South — one where white working-class voters are being replaced by booming Hispanic and Asian populations and white college students outnumber white seniors 21% to 13%, according to a new Brookings Institution study.

All those new voters moving into Prince William have helped make the once reliably Republican district a swing county and the linchpin for Democratic statewide victories. The county voted 52% for President Bush in 2000 and 53% in 2004. But in 2005, Prince William residents helped elect Tim Kaine, a Democrat, governor with 50% of the ballots and the next year voted in nearly identical numbers to put Democrat Jim Webb in the Senate. "If Democrats split the vote in Prince William and win big in the northern counties, they win the state," says Mike May, a Republican Prince William County supervisor.

Even Republicans who didn't vote for Webb in 2006 are looking at Democrats this year. Karen Krivo, a 41-year-old mother of two who until now never considered voting for a Democrat for any office, is fed up. The high price of gasoline has made commuting the 30 miles into Washington impossible for some, and the housing crisis has glutted the once booming market. "It's a vote against President Bush and the Republican Congress's policies," she says. "I know we need to change, and Barack Obama provides that change."

McCain has also been forced to quell disgruntlement among rank-and-file Republicans over immigration. After an increase in gang activity, the board of county supervisors took the controversial step of checking the immigration status of every person arrested, irrespective of guilt or the degree of crime, from jaywalking to felonies. If a detainee is found to be illegal, the county immediately initiates deportation procedures with Immigration and Customs Enforcement. The move, by the largely conservative Republican board, drew national attention and placed the local party at odds with its presidential nominee, who helped write the failed 2006 immigration bill that would have granted a path to citizenship for illegal aliens. "McCain's at risk here because people are concerned that he has not taken a strong enough position on illegal immigration," says Corey Stewart, Republican chairman of the county board.

The McCain campaign got into trouble on Oct. 11 when Jeffrey Frederick, the 33-year-old head of the Virginia Republican Party, likened Obama to Osama bin Laden. "Both have friends that bombed the Pentagon," he told a group of about 30 canvassers. "That is scary." It is also not exactly true — though that distorted reference to Obama's controversial association with William Ayers, a former '60s radical, was enough to stoke the volunteers at McCain's campaign office in Gainesville. "He won't salute the flag," one woman said, repeating another myth about Obama. She was quickly topped by a man in the crowd, wearing a polo shirt embroidered with "I Love America," who called out, "We don't even know where Senator Obama was really born." (Actually, we do. It's Hawaii.) Frederick beamed: "You need to go out and tell people that from your hearts," he said as he sent the volunteers on their way to knock on doors across Prince William County. (The McCain campaign distanced itself from Frederick, who later claimed he'd been joking.)

Meanwhile, Obama — who, like McCain, has made only one appearance in the county, though Joe Biden has made three — spent all summer quietly registering thousands of new voters in Prince William, which had the second largest increase by county in a state that has seen its voter rolls swell by 436,000 since the beginning of the year. The Obama campaign has made a massive push to register blacks, who make up 20% of the population, as well as Latinos and students at the four colleges in the district. Obama will need these voters to eke out a win in Prince William. And if he does that, the state's 13 electoral votes will probably move into the Democrats' column. .... (TIME)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 06:04 PM

"The so-called ACORN scandal is no more than a few canvassers trying to meet their quota and make easy money by cheating the system."


             A few cheaters here, a few cheaters there, and pretty soon we're talking about a stolen election.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 06:08 PM

If you can't figure out the difference between registration cards filled in by minimum wage recruits and voter fraud, I kinda think you deserve to have your election stolen. Sheeshe, Rig. I KNOW you are smarter than that.

In other news:


"John Edwards was an elitist and out of touch with the American people for getting $400 haircuts.

Caribou-Moron Barbie spent $22,800 on two weeks worth of makeup, $150,000 on clothes that she claims she's going to give to charity (yeah, Goodwill would love that Prada stuff), $17,000 in per diem charges for sleeping in her own house, $21,012 in state funds to fly her kids around, and $50,000 to redecorate the Wasilla mayor's office — which is in a strip mall.


Now, I'm not calling her an "elitist," but she's revealed herself for what she truly is — not a pit bull with lipstick, but rather George W. Bush with lipstick — $22,800 worth.

After eight years of Dick Cheney, we have learned (I hope) that the Vice President matters. That is especially the case when you have a President who has a 1 in 6 chance of dying in the next four years — the same odds as you losing your luggage on a domestic flight. Couple that with the fact that she's the greatest fear-monger since Cheney, but probably couldn't beat a chimp in an IQ-off, we have the recipe for complete disaster. Corrupt, stupid, and power-hungry… do we really need more of that? Didn't we try that for the past eight years?" The Legal Satyricon

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: heric
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 06:45 PM

1 in 6 chance of dying?

And what odds of becoming disabled? Or being excessively grumpy?
----------------------------------

Obama never told me about this one:

"Under Ms. Ghilarducci's plan [presented to a favorable reception by House Education and Labor Committee Chairman George Miller, D-Calif., and Rep. Jim McDermott, D-Wash., chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee's Subcommittee on Income Security and Family Support], all workers would receive a $600 annual inflation-adjusted subsidy from the U.S. government but would be required to invest 5% of their pay into a guaranteed retirement account administered by the Social Security Administration. The money in turn would be invested in special government bonds that would pay 3% a year, adjusted for inflation.

The current system of providing tax breaks on 401(k) contributions and earnings would be eliminated."

Granted - this is just a new idea in the formative stages. But it should give anyone pause about the Democrats controlling House Senate and Executive all at once.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 10:05 PM

"And what odds of becoming disabled? Or being excessively grumpy?"


                      If Barack Obama becomes excessivley grumpy before election day, it will be because he spoke the truth to Joe the Plumber, and didn't throw Reverend Wright under the bus soon enough.
                      Keep an eye on him!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 11:37 PM

10-27) 19:39 PDT -- With seven days until election day, this is a terrible week to be an undecided voter. The rumor-and-smear mill is in overdrive, and credible, substantive information about the presidential candidates is as rare as a quiet moment on "Hardball."

The happiest Americans right now are the ones who have voted - they no longer have to pay attention.

Many of the attacks flying through the air are reheated versions of attacks that have long been discredited by The Chronicle in its regular "Lies, half-truths outed" feature, other news organizations and independent fact-checking organizations. So despite what voters may hear this week, Barack Obama is a Christian, John McCain is a citizen of the United States, and Sarah Palin never said she can see Russia from her house. That was comedian Tina Fey, who has become almost as famous as Palin by impersonating her on "Saturday Night Live."

Last-minute smear jobs are as old as the American presidency and are rooted in the darkest corners of the human psyche. The smearer usually supports the candidate who is trailing in the polls, analysts said.

"It's consistent with human psychology that people who are behind or feel they have nothing to lose are less risk-averse," said Jack Glaser, an associate professor of public policy at UC-Berkeley and an expert on politics and emotion. "So Sen. McCain and his supporters are throwing everything at the wall and seeing what sticks.

"They feel that they have less to lose. What's the difference if they lose by 3 points or 6? Of course, those Republicans further down on the ticket might disagree with them," Glaser said.

An e-mail sent by the Pennsylvania Republican Party to 75,000 Jewish voters in Pennsylvania last week warned "Fellow Jewish Voters" of the danger of a second Holocaust and linked it to Obama's possible election.

"Jewish Americans cannot afford to make the wrong decision on Tuesday, November 4th, 2008," the e-mail read. "Many of our ancestors ignored the warning signs in the 1930s and 1940s and made a tragic mistake. Let's not make a similar one this year!"

Paid for by the Republican Federal Committee of PA - Victory 2008, it warned of the danger of a second Holocaust because of threats to Israel by neighboring countries and touted McCain's policies over Obama's.

One of the e-mail's signatories was former Pennsylvania Supreme Court Justice Sandra Schultz Newman, a member of McCain's national task force that is monitoring election day voting. She apologized today.

Glaser said the move could backfire with the target audience.

"Jewish voters are very sensitive to being manipulated by the Holocaust," said Glaser, who is Jewish and whose grandparents were killed in the Holocaust. "And I think these types of attacks will alienate independent voters. From what I've seen, they (the McCain campaign) are just reaching out to their base and making sure it shows up (to vote.)"

Democratic vice presidential nominee Sen. Joe Biden invoked some of the history of smears today when addressing voters in North Carolina. He mentioned attacks against Thomas Jefferson, Abraham Lincoln and John F. Kennedy as a "dangerous choice in difficult times."

"Sound familiar?" Biden asked the audience. "The defenders of the status quo have always tried to tear down those who would change our nation for the better."

Some voters are fighting back. Three dozen workers at an Indiana telemarketing call center quit rather than read a McCain campaign script attacking Obama, the liberal blog TalkingPointsMemo.com reported today. One of the robo calls said that Obama voted against "protecting children from danger" but offered no other specifics.

Even if there is an "October surprise" - a last-minute news event or smear that could affect the outcome of the election - a UC-Berkeley professor who has researched the topic says it might not have much of an impact. Robb Willer, an assistant professor of sociology and a social psychologist, said voters are likely to see last-minute smears for what they are.

"No one should be surprised to see campaigns trailing in the polls flinging mud in the final days," Willer said. "For one, they're desperate. And two, because there isn't much time to refute them."...(SFGate)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 11:55 PM

"If Barack Obama becomes excessivley grumpy before election day, it will be because he spoke the truth to Joe the Plumber,"

Rig, pat, pat, pat...

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Barry Finn
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 02:08 AM

The Joe & Jill six pack crowd won't be voting come Nov 4th.


They were arrested for DWI & will remain in jail till the election is over or until hockey season's ended, which ever is longer

No, Sara Palin can't afford to bail them out, she's suspected of spending her money on things more important, a facial.

Now to more important issues, Obama is way more color co-ordinated than MaCain but not more that Sara, Sara doen't like mixing colors at all, she's more of a solid gal. Obama's posture is better than MaCain's & it shows when MaCain's head tilts to the side as he tends to list towards port alot & the drool drips on his shirt, Sara doesn't drool but she spits venom vigorously like a viper but she doesn't get it on herself, it seems to smear on MaCain's slacks, below the belt, Sara's posture is all bent out of shape, espically for an athlete. Obama plays better basketball than Sara & John combined, he's what a player would call a straight shooter, something that MaCain claims to be but you should've seen him in court, tax fraud or higher taxes or something stupid & false like that.
OK, that's about it on the real important issues & no Sara will not give back the clothes if she's not elected na, na, she lied, so sue me in Anchorage.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 11:12 AM

Palin has been a curse to National Hockey League teams, too. Every team for which she has dropped the starting puck has lost not just that game but subsequent ones, too and/or had a player injuried.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: heric
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 03:27 PM

David Sedaris on undecided voters:

"...look at these people and can't quite believe that they exist. Are they professional actors? I wonder. Or are they simply laymen who want a lot of attention? To put them in perspective, I think of being on an airplane. The flight attendant comes down the aisle with her food cart and, eventually, parks it beside my seat. 'Can I interest you in the chicken?' she asks. 'Or would you prefer the platter of shit with bits of broken glass in it? To be undecided in this election is to pause for a moment and then ask how the chicken is cooked.'"

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Bobert
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 03:55 PM

Amos,

I don't believe there is one single undecided voter left in the country... After 18 months of campaigning the only folks who claim to be undecided are just doing so so they won't have to tell anyone how they plan to vote... Or if they are going to vote... But, all the minds have been made up...

The only true factor left is voter turnout which can be influenced by fear and/or motivation (long lines, bad weather, etc.)...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: John O'L
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 04:10 PM

Sedaris has hit the nail on the head. For weeks now I have been dumbfounded that there is any serious discussion at all. It's an open-and-shut case, or as you Americans are so fond of saying, a no-brainer.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 04:30 PM

That's what I've decided, Bobert. I don't think there are any undecideds. I think they like the attention and probably aren't even going to vote.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 04:55 PM

Meanwhile, in the Dirty Tricks Department:

"A forged flyer going to voters in a closely fought Virginia congressional district seems aimed at suppressing Democratic turnout on Election Day.

Purporting to come from Virginia's Board of Elections, the flyer says "All Democratic party supporters and independent voters supporting Democratic candidates shall vote on November 5th." That's one day after Election Day.

Whoever is circulating the flyer seems concerned with electing Republicans. The phony information tells "Republican party supporters and independent voters supporting Republican candidates" to vote on Nov. 4, the real day of the election.

The flyer's circulation was first reported in the Virginian-Pilot.

The somewhat official-looking flier - it features the state board logo and the state seal - is dated Oct. 24 and indicates that "an emergency session of the General Assembly has adopted the follwing (sic) emergency regulations to ease the load on local electorial (sic) precincts and ensure a fair electorial process."

The four-paragraph flier concludes with: "We are sorry for any inconvenience this may cause but felt this was the only way to ensure fairness to the complete electorial process."
The flyer was circulated around several locations in Hampton Roads, according to the paper.

Hampton Roads, in southeast Virginia near Virginia Beach, sits in the commonwealth's 2nd Congressional District, where Democrats are in a hard-fought race to unseat incumbent Republican Rep. Thelma Drake, who won re-election two years ago by a margin of just 5,000 votes. The latest poll in the district shows Drake leading by just 5 percent.

It is unclear who is circulating the flyer, but state police are investigating.

Hampton County Virginia also was strongly supportive of Barack Obama's candidacy during this year's primary. Obama took nearly 80 percent of the vote from the county's Democrats; the county's Republicans split their votes between John McCain and Mike Huckabee.

Polls have showed Obama is pulling away in Virginia in recent weeks, and many analysts say it is becoming more likely he will prevail in the state. ..." From Raw Story

A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 05:01 PM

"Eight days before any election results come in, NBC News is essentially predicting Barack Obama will win the presidency. The network's electoral vote projections -- which are based on an analysis of state-by-state polling, campaign efforts, early turnout and other factors -- say a majority of electoral votes will go to the Democratic candidate.

Even without factoring in the "toss up" states where the outcome is too close to predict, Obama can get more than 270 electoral votes, enough to win the presidency, assuming he prevails in states that are solidly in his column or leaning toward voting for him. NBC political director Chuck Todd said Colorado and Virgina -- two states that went for President Bush in 2000 and 2004 -- were now leaning toward Obama, putting him over the threshold.

If Obama also wins Nevada, where polls give him a narrow lead, the Democratic candidate can win the presidency without winning Pennsylvania, Ohio and Florida -- the three states that have proved most critical in the last two elections. That scenario is exceptionally unlikely, however. Obama holds a double-digit lead in Pennsylvania and is up by about 6 points in Ohio, while Florida remains essentially tied.

The fact of the matter is that Obama is solidly on offense during the last week of the campaign, with the toughest fights occuring in red states.

Things are so bad for McCain that voters in his home state of Arizona are trending toward Obama.

Even some Republicans are beginning to doubt John McCain's chances.

"Any serious Republican has to ask, 'How did we get into this mess?' " Newt Gingrich, the former Republican house speaker, said in an interview. "It's not where we should be, and it's not where we had to be. This was not bad luck."

As Mr. Obama uses his money and political organization to try to expand the political map, Mr. McCain is being forced to shore up support in states like Indiana and North Carolina that have not been contested for decades. His decision to campaign on Sunday in Iowa, a day after Ms. Palin campaigned there, was questioned even by Republicans who noted polls that showed Mr. Obama pulling away there. But it reflected how few options the campaign really has, as poll after poll suggests that Mr. Obama is solidifying his position.
Gallup notes that history is on Obama's side. Just twice in the last 14 elections has the leader in the Gallup poll at this point in the race not gone on to win the presidency, the organization notes.

Independent number cruncher Nate Silver outlined the narrow path McCain can take to victory, but the candidate does not seem to be following his advice. The FiveThirtyEight.com analyst gives McCain just a 5 percent chance of victory.""

Ibid

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 05:06 PM

A Video on Vote-FLipping by machines shows them to be completely unreliable, and to flip for Nader as well as McCain.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 06:05 PM

Oct. 29 (Bloomberg) -- Barack Obama leads in Florida and Ohio, states Republican John McCain must win to capture the presidency, as voters prefer the Democratic presidential nominee's personal traits and approach on the economy and health care.

Obama, an Illinois senator, tops Arizona Senator McCain by 50 percent to 43 percent among likely voters in Florida, a Bloomberg/Los Angeles Times poll shows. He leads 49 percent to 40 percent in Ohio, as voters in the two states overwhelmingly rate domestic concerns as more important than national security.

Voters choose Obama, 47, as the candidate best able to handle the financial crisis and health care. And by an almost 2- to-1 margin, they say the Democrat has ``the better temperament and personality to be president.''

``Domestic issues are the outstanding issues of the day, and Obama has been owning those,'' says Susan Pinkus, the Los Angeles Times polling director. What is more, ``voters are more comfortable with him'' after his three debate performances.

Florida voters by more than 2-to-1 say a candidate's views on domestic issues such as health care and the economy are more important than positions on the war in Iraq and terrorism; voters in Ohio say the same by a 3-to-1 margin. (Bloomberg)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 11:13 AM

Christopher Hitchens, in a piece entitled Sarah Palin's War on Science--The GOP ticket's appalling contempt for knowledge and learning:

"This is what the Republican Party has done to us this year: It has placed within reach of the Oval Office a woman who is a religious fanatic and a proud, boastful ignoramus. Those who despise science and learning are not anti-elitist. They are morally and intellectually slothful people who are secretly envious of the educated and the cultured. And those who prate of spiritual warfare and demons are not just "people of faith" but theocratic bullies. On Nov. 4, anyone who cares for the Constitution has a clear duty to repudiate this wickedness and stupidity."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 12:41 PM

From a questionaire by Reason, the LIbertarian think-magazine:

David Brin


1. Who are you voting for in November? For not a single "liberal" reason, I am voting not only for Obama, but for the GOP to be utterly spanked and sent into exile, where, perhaps, sincere men and women may remember Barry Goldwater and resurrect some kind of healthy, libertarian Conservatism.

2. Who did you vote for in 2004 and 2000? I could tell that the neocons were mad in 2000 and that their allies were fanatics or thieves. It was blatant in 2004. Those who act shocked (shocked!) and betrayed today were fools then and are likely fools now.

3. Is this the most important election in your lifetime? Without any doubt. The most important issues at stake today have nothing to do with "left-vs-right" (and those who think so are reflex troglodytes.) No, the issue is light-vs-dark, in the sense that we have been subjected to a kleptocratic raid that depended upon one thing—quashing every possible system of accountability. Especially the U.S. Civil Service. If Obama does nothing else—passes no new laws or initiatives—he will save us simply by expelling those 10,000 enemies of accountability and promoting from within the Civil Service. Only then can we properly argue which civil servants are useful and which aren't

4. What will you miss about the Bush administration? Their perfect purity of purpose. I have looked for a single example of their acting in the best interests of the American people, the republic, or even decent conservatism. There are no examples, whatsoever. Such perfection belies the "Standard Model" that they were merely venal morons. Such uniformity of accomplishment smacks of deliberate intelligence.

5. Leaving George W. Bush out of consideration, what former U.S. president would you most like to have waterboarded? I find this question offensive. I will swallow my anger when Bush pardons thousands...and then let Cheney pardon him. I am too busy for vengeance.

David Brin is a scientist and Hugo award-winning science fiction author whose novels include The Postman and Kiln People.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 01:12 PM

Some Alaska Senators watched John McCain on MSNBC the other night,

.....and when McCain, (in a tenuous, but ultimately false bid to justify Palin's qualifications by pushing that 'executive experience' angle), said that Sarah Palin watched over 24,000 state employees, and Sarah looked on nodding agreement with that statement, those Alaska Senators got to thinking.....

There are 15,000 employees known to be working for the State of Alaska.

...those Senators are currently looking for where Sarah has stashed those extra 9,000 shadow workers.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 01:23 PM

They're probably working for Stevens!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 02:42 PM

POllster.com aggregates for Wednesday: 49.8% Obama--44% McCain. See this page for a graph..


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 02:55 PM

"After the rally, we witnessed a near-street riot involving the exiting McCain crowd and two Cuban-American Obama supporters. Tony Garcia, 63, and Raul Sorando, 31, were suddenly surrounded by an angry mob. There is a moment in a crowd when something goes from mere yelling to a feeling of danger, and that's what we witnessed. As photographers and police raced to the scene, the crowd elevated from stable to fast-moving scrum, and the two men were surrounded on all sides as we raced to the circle.

The event maybe lasted a minute, two at the most, before police competently managed to hustle the two away from the scene and out of the danger zone. Only FiveThirtyEight tracked the two men down for comment, a quarter mile down the street.

"People were screaming 'Terrorist!' 'Communist!' 'Socialist!'" Sorando said when we caught up with him. "I had a guy tell me he was gonna kill me."

Asked what had precipitated the event, "We were just chanting 'Obama!' and holding our signs. That was it. And the crowd suddenly got crazy."

Full Article Here

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 03:42 PM

""We are one nation, all of us proud, all of us patriots," Obama said in Ohio. "Patriots who believe in Democratic policies and those who believe in Republican policies." And those who have served in the armed forces, he said, have not served a red America or a blue America, but the United States of America. These words echo his speech to the 2004 Democratic Party Convention -- the speech that made him famous.

It is a long-planned thematic arc, the finale of a clever drama, and nothing can put him off this course. The speech in the key swing state of Ohio -- where Obama for the first time returned to the hope rhetoric to go along with the key topics of taxes, health care, economy, education, foreign policy and energy -- was described by reporters as his "closing statement." The candidate was returning to the tenor of his beginnings in order to end his run with "a kind of positive appeal." The speech will also be sent to registered fans as a Web video.

McCain Uses Every Speech to Raise Fears

The way the two candidates are presenting themselves to the voters says a lot about them and about the quality and state of their campaigns. While Obama is demonstratively acting the statesman, McCain has decided in the face of poor opinion polls to go in the opposite direction.

The themes of McCain's speeches and appearances have narrowed considerably -- and become much more negative. While Obama is already coming up with scenarios for a new America after Jan. 20, 2009, McCain is still bitterly fighting over the issue of character, over his unfortunate running mate Sarah Palin, and over "Joe the Plumber," his poorly selected symbol of the average American.

He does whatever he thinks it will take. Instead of using the final stretch to present his own abilities and to reiterate his heroic biography, McCain prefers to use every appearance to raise fears of a "Democratic takeover." His speeches consist almost exclusively of attacks on Obama. Accompanied by boos from his audience, he attacks him for being a socialist or, indirectly through his mouthpieces on US television, a communist.

It is a glaring discrepancy -- a political generation gap that is obvious to those who visit an Obama and a McCain event back-to-back. That is what many undecided voters are doing in the swing states as the candidates often appear on the same nights in Ohio, Pennsylvania and Florida.

How much these impressions will have an impact on the election result is hard to say, despite what is being described as Obama's "comfortable lead." ... And Obama is not resting on his laurels. "That's why we cannot afford to slow down or sit back," he said in Ohio. "We cannot let up for one day, or one minute, or one second in this last week."

And so Obama is planning a double assault for Wednesday evening. He has bought a half hour of prime-time TV on the big networks -- CBS, NBC, Fox and Univsion, the biggest Spanish-speaking station in the US. Each slot costs around $1 million. Later on the same evening he is appearing in Florida with former President Bill Clinton for the first time -- an open air even at a theme park, which should attract tens of thousands of people.

But McCain, whose people insist that their internal polls have him gaining support, is fighting for every last vote. In particular in Pennsylvania, which he has declared central to his election strategy, even though Obama has a two-figure lead there. He also has to fight to hold on to traditional Republican states like Florida, Nevada, North Carolina and Colorado -- he cannot afford to lose any of those states that George W. Bush won in 2004.

An increasing number of US media outlets are already predicting an Obama victory. Newsweek put him on the cover with the words "President Obama," while New York Magazine had a feature on how an Obama presidency would look. The big newspapers have endorsed Obama, including the New York Times and Washington Post and, between the lines, even the Wall Street Journal. In all, 162 newspapers are backing Obama, compared to 62 backing McCain.

The New York Times Magazine even shocked McCain with a story about the disputes within his team and the mismanagement of his campaign. It was the beginning of a wave of leaks, showing that McCain and Palin loyalists are apparently already trying to save face.

One prominent conservative after the other is jumping ship and the Republicans are also threatened with major losses in Congress. "There are many ways to lose a presidential election," wrote David Frum, Bush's former speechwriter, in the Washington Post. "John McCain is losing in a way that threatens to take the entire Republican Party down with him."" (Der Spiegel)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 03:54 PM

"In an interview posted online Wednesday, Sarah Palin told Dr. James Dobson of "Focus on the Family" that she is confident God will do "the right thing for America" on Nov. 4.

...

She also thanked her supporters — including Dobson, who said he and his wife were asking "for God's intervention" on election day — for their prayers of support.

"It is that intercession that is so needed," she said. "And so greatly appreciated. And I can feel it too, Dr. Dobson. I can feel the power of prayer, and that strength that is provided through our prayer warriors across this nation. And I so appreciate it."

From this we can deduce that:

Sarah Palin believes God personally chooses our Presidents and Vice Presidents.
Sarah Palin believes that God should choose her as Vice President.
Sarah Palin believes that without God's intervention she will lose.
Sarah Palin is out of her mind. " (FireDOgLake)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 03:58 PM

The Atlantic reveals the Republican operative and Rove disciple who is Sarah Palin's Personal Shopper.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 03:59 PM

It's going to be interesting to see how god intervenes.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: heric
Date: 29 Oct 08 - 04:15 PM

>"There are many ways to lose a presidential election," wrote David Frum, Bush's former speechwriter, in the Washington Post. "John McCain is losing in a way that threatens to take the entire Republican Party down with him."" (Der Spiegel)<

Well, there's one prominent Republican who has got it ass-backwards. They'll want to blame McCain, when anyone who breathes knows it's their own damned fault, en masse. Are they able to learn?



(Or will we just have to endure eight years of Democratic incompetence and switch back to incopmetent Republicans?)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 30 Oct 08 - 08:50 AM

To all those who name the name of Christ who plan to willfully disobey Him by voting for Obama, take warning... No, this election is not about race. It's not about the economy. It's about obeying God... Obey Him in the voting booth and out of it. If not, do us all a favor and quit calling yourself a Christian."
-- radio host and commentator Janet Porter


Ya gotta wonder how nutballs like this even get started. The election is about "obeying God"????? WTF??

I'm all for obeying GOd, mind youm when you can find Him. But the last time I checked he was not messing with the elections. He leaves that to his Fallen Friends.

Witness 2000, 2004, Nixon, and the fall of Carter.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 30 Oct 08 - 10:27 AM

Stolen elections and media blackouts: An interview with Mark Crispin Miller is worth reading.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 30 Oct 08 - 10:35 AM

I just hope the wrong guy doesn't steal this one!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 30 Oct 08 - 01:40 PM

The stark contrast between the whiz-bang Clinton years and the dreary Bush years is familiar because it is so recent. But while it is extreme, it is not atypical. Data for the whole period from 1948 to 2007, during which Republicans occupied the White House for 34 years and Democrats for 26, show average annual growth of real gross national product of 1.64 percent per capita under Republican presidents versus 2.78 percent under Democrats.

"That 1.14-point difference, if maintained for eight years, would yield 9.33 percent more income per person, which is a lot more than almost anyone can expect from a tax cut.

"The two Great Partisan Divides combine to suggest that, if history is a guide, an Obama victory in November would lead to faster economic growth with less inequality, while a McCain victory would lead to slower economic growth with more inequality. Which part of the Obama menu don't you like? "


Cited from here

The quotation is from an article by Alan S. Blinder, a professor of economics and public affairs at Princeton and former vice chairman of the Federal Reserve."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 30 Oct 08 - 03:06 PM

Obama    McC       Net

RCP Electoral Count 311      142 Obama +169
No Toss Up States    364       174 Obama +190
Battleground States       Obama McCain Spread
Florida                     48.5 45.0 Obama +3.5
North Carolina             48.7 46.2 Obama +2.5
Virginia                   51.0 44.5 Obama +6.5
Ohio                        49.2 43.4 Obama +5.8
Missouri                   48.0 47.8 Obama +0.2
Colorado                   50.8 44.3 Obama +6.5
Nevada                      50.4 43.0 Obama +7.4


Keep your fingers crossed, your powder dry, and your eyes open.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 30 Oct 08 - 04:46 PM

Washington Post: (main editorial- after endorsing Obama.)


Can One Party Rule?
Neither Democrats nor Republicans have a monopoly on policy wisdom.

Thursday, October 30, 2008; Page A22

OUR OLD-FASHIONED inclination would be to wait for the election before discussing its results. But since Republican presidential nominee John McCain has introduced the specter of Democratic control as an argument in his favor, it seems reasonable to examine the case. Should voters choose Mr. McCain over Democrat Barack Obama so as not to empower the Obama-Reid-Pelosi triumvirate that Mr. McCain paints in such ominous shades? Alternatively, as some down-ballot Republicans are urging, should voters stick with GOP senators or members of Congress to keep a President Obama in check?

For true partisans of either stripe, there's no quandary here. Most true-blue Democrats would be delighted to see their party in charge of both ends of Pennsylvania Avenue, though some worry that subsequent overreaching might harm the party in the long run. Most true-red Republicans have mirror-image feelings. So the question is most pertinent for centrists and independent voters, who tend to have contradictory emotions. On the one hand, they bemoan gridlock in Washington and would like government finally to come up with answers on some big issues such as health care and energy. On the other hand, they worry about what those answers would be if formulated by one party alone.

We worry, too, though we support Mr. Obama even knowing the result may be one-party rule. A political theorist might root for the Democrats to win the White House, a 60-vote majority in the Senate and a clear majority in the House. Then voters could find out what the Democrats really stand for and render a thumbs-up or thumbs-down in two and four years -- just as they passed judgment in 2006 on the one-party rule (though short of 60-vote control in the Senate) of Tom DeLay, Ted Stevens and George W. Bush.


But we don't believe either party has a monopoly on policy wisdom. We liked Mr. Bush's insistence on accountability in education, tempered by Sen. Edward M. Kennedy's reminder that you couldn't fix urban schools without some money. We don't support the Democrats' plan to allow unionization without secret ballots, but we agree with them that National Labor Relations Board rules have tipped too far toward management. And so on. We like to think, in other words, that a process in which both parties play a role can sometimes lead to better outcomes and not always to dead ends.

That's harder to imagine, though, as each party's moderate wing shrinks. A Democratic sweep might bring to Washington some relatively centrist freshmen who would provide a check on the most liberal wing of the party. But it might claim as victims some of the few remaining Republican moderates, such as Sen. Gordon Smith of Oregon and Rep. Christopher Shays of Connecticut, and some of the real workhorses who are more interested in legislating than grandstanding -- the capable New Hampshire senator John E. Sununu, for example. The defeat of such politicians would be a loss for the country, not just for their party.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Charley Noble
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 08:44 AM

The ads from the Republican Trust PAC are on in full force in Maine. The Rev. Wright is back screaming "God damn America!" from the pulpit, the association with known terrorist Bill Ayers, association with Pro-Palestinian groups, the rise of socialism, and much much more. Weird that they would spend the money on such ads in Maine where Obama is leading in all polls by almost 20%.

The morning talk shows are discussing weather Palin was unfairly treated by the media, compared with Biden. Will a sympathy vote for Palin carry the day for McCain?

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 08:57 AM

Hopefully!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 11:39 AM

The number of early voters throughout Illinois could top 700,000, said Dan White, executive director for the State Board of Elections. With absentee voters, White estimated nearly 1 million Illinois residents have voted.

By Wednesday, the top number of early voters turned out in Chicago's 42nd Ward, where 7,530 people cast ballots. The next four highest early voting totals were on the South Side: the 6th, 8th, 34th and 21st wards.

Rosemarie Bitner waited more than two hours Thursday to cast her vote at a library in Lake View.

Was it worth the wait?

"Oh absolutely," she said. "I would wait much longer for Obama anytime."

Before the polls opened Thursday morning, 85 people were in line at the 6th Ward polling place. The first people in line got there at 6 a.m., said James Allen, Chicago election board spokesman.

"They win the award for most patient, vigilant voters on the planet," Allen said.

Among Cook County suburbs, Orland Park led the pack with the most early voters, with more than 12,000 votes cast by Wednesday, according to County Clerk David Orr's office.

"I can't believe we waited in this line," Marion Caselberry said as she smoothed a fresh "I Voted!" sticker on her shirt after voting in Evanston. "Can you imagine what Tuesday will be like?"

...

---

THese are historic times, my friends....

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 03:08 PM

"Washington: Is there any reason I should have more confidence in Florida's ability to run a fair election this time around?

Dan Seligson: Florida has certainly been the "poster child" for election reform since 2000... but no state has done more to try address the problems it's been facing. The amount of change in the Sunshine State has been staggering - in South Florida they'll be using the third separate voting technology in as many presidential elections. That said, the Secretary of State (himself a former county election official) has repeatedly told his colleagues that they must do whatever they can to "not be the next Florida."

_______________________

Loudoun County, Va.: Please be sure to let everyone know that if they have any problems at their polling location -- if they have their drivers license or other valid identification and are turned away for any reason, or if they have any issues with the voting process, ballots or voting machine -- they immediately should call 1-800-OUR-VOTE. Volunteers will assist them. Don't walk away without voting!

Dan Seligson: Agreed. The only vote that is definitely not going to count is the one that doesn't get cast. "

_______________________

Other helpful questions about voting procedures on this site.

ALso of interest:www.elections.gmu.edu --the United States Election Project hosted by Prof. Michael McDonald of GMU--

The Washington Post's Vote Monitor page covers issues that come up.

HEre, also, is their Twitter string.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 03:35 PM

IF the rest of the world could vote in this election how would they vote?

Seems off hand that it would be the biggest Democratic landslide ever.

Except for Georgia, et alia.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 08:51 PM

"...First and foremost, Republicans are actively seeking to suppress the voter turnout among the youth and minorities and poor people likely to support Obama.

In Indiana, for example, Republicans filed a lawsuit to block early voting in and around the struggling industrial city of Gary. Republicans lost the suit, but they are appealing.

Republicans are sending private investigators to intimidate lower-class Democratic voters in New Mexico who were legitimately registered by ACORN and other grassroots organizations. (Please see related postings exposing the fraudulent swiftboat-style attacks on ACORN to distract public scrutiny of the Republican vote scams.)

Under the Help America Vote Act (HAVA), voter ID laws or being erratically enforced around the country. Some (not all) Republican election officials have been accused of requiring government-issued photo IDs from all voters, which impacts those in poverty as well as legal immigrants who often lack the means to obtain birth records and other documents needed for photo IDs.

While Ohio now allows voters to prove their identity with any array of documents, for example, Republican dominated states like Kansas and Missouri are enforcing the strictest possible interpretation of the law in urban areas likely to vote Democratic.

Another tactic is removing American citizens from the voter registries for dubious reasons. Here in Colorado, for example, as reported by the New York Times, more than 37,000 names were purged from the registration database by the Republican Secretary of State Mike Coffman, who critics contend should have resigned his post from the conflict-of-interest when he won the Republican nomination to run for congress. The Colorado court of appeals on October 30 ordered these voter registrations restored, fortunately.

Also here in Colorado, as another example, Republicans last month told students at liberal Colorado College (in conservative Colorado Springs) that students could not register to vote if their parents live out of state, which as untrue.

And right here in predominantly Democratic Denver, Republican-owned Sequoia voting systems company failed to deliver to the post office more than 10,000 mail-in ballots while telling city election officials that all of the expected 21,000 ballots had been mailed. (This incident represents only one of the required mailings.) Sequoia now admits they made a "technical" error, and the ballots have been mailed to waiting voters.

Elsewhere around the country, as you can learn with a simple Web search, we're seeing Republican voting officials being accused of disenfranchising voters in Democratic districts by not printing enough paper ballots, not assigning enough voting machines, or even reducing the number of polling places....

(Huffington Post)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 08:55 PM

And if the world gets what they want, then what happens? Nothing.



"[B]y no means scientific" is surely an understatement. If they could isolate and idenify the financial elite on each country, then it might hold some interest.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Janie
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 12:38 PM

As of Thursday, more than 50 % of the registered voters in my county (Orange Co., NC) have already voted.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 02:58 PM

Charles Blow, NYT Columnist:

"...So McCain's final volley was to brand Barack Obama a socialist, assail his associations and rile up the rurals. For that to work, everything else would have to fall in McCain's favor. To say that it hasn't is a gross understatement.

Oct. 19: Colin Powell endorses Obama.

Oct. 20: Al Qaeda endorses McCain.

Oct. 22: Sarah Palin gets smacked down for dressing up. (You know it's hard out here when you primp.)

Oct. 23: The candidates personally reach out to a campaign volunteer who claimed that a black man had carved a backward "B" on her face during a mugging to punish her for not supporting Obama. The volunteer later confesses to fabricating the story. Scars all around.

Oct. 24: $22,800 for makeup. Wow.

Oct. 25: McCain's people begin to turn on Palin, making her sound like the title character of a bad movie: "Whack job," "diva," "gone rogue."

Oct. 28: The Pew Center reports that Obama leads among early voters by a margin of 19 percent.

Oct. 29: Obama buys a chunk of prime-time and broadcasts a love-in to himself, then he has a late-night rally with his former grudge buddy Bill Clinton. It looks like a coronation. McCain responds on Larry King in a room that looks like the lobby of a funeral parlor.

Throughout October: The Republican Egghead Revolt: the party's highbrows huff that the appeal of the Grand Old Party needs to be broader than the audience of the Grand Ole Opry. Many defect to Obama.

And there you have it — a calamity of missteps and misfortunes.

Of course, anything could happen. There are three days left. McCain could still win. And, a drunk man wearing a blindfold could get a puck past Marc-André Fleury.

Yeah, unlikely. It's a wrap. Fade to black.".


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 03:44 PM

You can see why they call him "Blow."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 05:38 PM

I sort of like Pilin's warning that Obama's policies would wreck the economy. From where it is now, a wreck would be a considerable improvement.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 09:22 AM

Actually, Riginslimer, it is because it happens to be his name.



A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 03:22 PM

This morning I was sent a new lawn sign: Geezer ________ Dingbat

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 03:23 PM

That must be Alaskan for Biden/Obama, what?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 05:21 PM

I liked this from the CSM:

This election is not about major policies. It's about hope.
By Jonathan Curley

from the November 3, 2008 edition

Charlotte, N.C. - There has been a lot of speculation that Barack Obama might win the election due to his better "ground game" and superior campaign organization.

I had the chance to view that organization up close this month when I canvassed for him. I'm not sure I learned much about his chances, but I learned a lot about myself and about this election.

Let me make it clear: I'm pretty conservative. I grew up in the suburbs. I voted for George H.W. Bush twice, and his son once. I was disappointed when Bill Clinton won, and disappointed he couldn't run again.

I encouraged my son to join the military. I was proud of him in Afghanistan, and happy when he came home, and angry when he was recalled because of the invasion of Iraq. I'm white, 55, I live in the South and I'm definitely going to get a bigger tax bill if Obama wins.

I am the dreaded swing voter.

So you can imagine my surprise when my wife suggested we spend a Saturday morning canvassing for Obama. I have never canvassed for any candidate. But I did, of course, what most middle-aged married men do: what I was told.

At the Obama headquarters, we stood in a group to receive our instructions. I wasn't the oldest, but close, and the youngest was maybe in high school. I watched a campaign organizer match up a young black man who looked to be college age with a white guy about my age to canvas together. It should not have been a big thing, but the beauty of the image did not escape me.

Instead of walking the tree-lined streets near our home, my wife and I were instructed to canvass a housing project. A middle-aged white couple with clipboards could not look more out of place in this predominantly black neighborhood.

We knocked on doors and voices from behind carefully locked doors shouted, "Who is it?"

"We're from the Obama campaign," we'd answer. And just like that doors opened and folks with wide smiles came out on the porch to talk.

Grandmothers kept one hand on their grandchildren and made sure they had all the information they needed for their son or daughter to vote for the first time.

Young people came to the door rubbing sleep from their eyes to find out where they could vote early, to make sure their vote got counted.

We knocked on every door we could find and checked off every name on our list. We did our job, but Obama may not have been the one who got the most out of the day's work.

I learned in just those three hours that this election is not about what we think of as the "big things."

It's not about taxes. I'm pretty sure mine are going to go up no matter who is elected.

It's not about foreign policy. I think we'll figure out a way to get out of Iraq and Afghanistan no matter which party controls the White House, mostly because the people who live there don't want us there anymore.

I don't see either of the candidates as having all the answers.

I've learned that this election is about the heart of America. It's about the young people who are losing hope and the old people who have been forgotten. It's about those who have worked all their lives and never fully realized the promise of America, but see that promise for their grandchildren in Barack Obama. The poor see a chance, when they often have few. I saw hope in the eyes and faces in those doorways.

My wife and I went out last weekend to knock on more doors. But this time, not because it was her idea. I don't know what it's going to do for the Obama campaign, but it's doing a lot for me.

Jonathan Curley is a banker. He voted for George H.W. Bush twice and George W. Bush once.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 06:53 PM

"If they could isolate and identify the financial elite in each country, then it might hold some interest. "

You'd hardly want to take the advice of those buffoons on anything, in the light of what they've done to the economy.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: heric
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 06:55 PM

(Yeah, that's what I meant. If we knew who they really prefer, we'd know who not to trust.)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 07:17 PM

I just sent his (Obama) campaign another $25, despite the lead, despite the polls. I can't afford not to have him in the White House. I think a McCain presidency would drag us deeper into Hooverville.

HEre's to Obam in 08!!!



A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Nov 08 - 07:44 PM

Here's a handy site for anybody obsessed with American politics - Real Clear Politics Seems to link to about everything.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 04:22 PM

Famed boxing promoter Don King, who backed George W. Bush in the 2004 US presidential election, urged Americans to set aside race issues and support Barack Obama's historic bid for the White House.

"If Barack Obama was white, it would be a landslide win in this election," King said.

"For those Americans who just can't fathom voting for an African-American when you go into the voting booth, as God to help you pretend that Barack Obama is white."

King, known for his high-standing gray hair and over-the-top talkative nature when hyping fights, is in China to promote a boxing card.

But that did not stop him from releasing a statement Monday urging support of Obama, a fellow African-American, in Tuesday's US election to decide a replacement for Bush, an unpopular US leader and political foe of Obama.

"To my fellow Americans who feel they just can't vote for a black man, I want you to know that I am emphatic, sympathetic and commiserate with your plight," King said.

"After more than three centuries of being taught, conditioned and indoctinated to hate the black man as your inferior, it is unrealistic to think that now you can just change to respect him. That's easier said than done.

"Try not to think of Barack Obama as a black man but as an American fighting for what's best for your children and your country."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 04:27 PM

Leonardo DiCaprio is crossing his fingers for a US election win by Democrat Barack Obama and said Monday he believes the rest of the world is, too.

"I think it is the true ideals and dreams of America to have an African-American president named Barack Obama to be the representation of the United States at a time like this," said DiCaprio, in Paris as co-star of Middle-East themed movie "Body of Lies."

Obama, DiCaprio went on, is "a man that has great policies, a man that is a great intellectual, who knows what he's doing."

"I've my fingers crossed that he will win because I think he'll make some dramatic changes in our country that we're looking for, but the rest of the world is as well."

Talking to reporters about his role as a gritty CIA operative tracking terrorists in Ridley Scott's latest movie on conflict between the West and the Arab world, DiCaprio added that in this troubled world, most countries were rooting for Obama.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 04:39 PM

Obama and the Better Angels of Our Nature (The Nation)


...At the close of his first inaugural address, Abraham Lincoln spoke to those who would divide the United States.

"We are not enemies, but friends," said the 16th president. "We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battlefield and patriot grave to every living heart and hearthstone all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature."

Almost 150 years after Lincoln uttered those words, America is again divided.

The question that will be answered by voters on this first Tuesday in November is whether the land must remain divided.

Eight years of George Bush's tragically flawed attempt at a presidency have strained the very fabric of the American experiment. Our debates about war and peace, taxes and spending, civil rights and civil liberties have developed bitter edges that suggest we are enemies: Democrat versus Republican, Red State versus Blue State, liberal versus conservative.

The banner-carrier of Lincoln's Republican party in this fall's election, John McCain, has torn open holes in that fabric, exploiting the oldest and ugliest of our differences.

And yet, most Americans are still touched by the better angels of our nature.

We still believe that this great nation can and should be what Lincoln imagined: "the last best hope of Earth."

That, more than any of the vagaries of campaign finance, battleground-state calculations or simplistic candidate comparisons, explains why Barack Obama's campaign for the presidency has been so successful -- and why its success has become an imperative no less consequential than those of other historic candidacies: Jefferson in 1800, Lincoln in 1860, Roosevelt in 1932.

It may be mere coincidence that Obama is, like Lincoln, an Illinoisan with a relatively short resume of electoral service.

But as Obama submits himself to what his home-state predecessor called "this great tribunal of the American people," we are reminded of the essential message of Lincoln's distant campaigning: "The dogmas of the quiet past are inadequate to the stormy present. The occasion is piled high with difficulty, and we must rise -- with the occasion. As our case is new, so we must think anew, and act anew and then we shall save our country."

The more cautious among us still suggest that to support Obama requires too great a leap of faith, just as it has always been suggested of young men who bid for the presidency before the established order judges it to be their time. But the American people have a history of understanding, as they did with Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt, Franklin Roosevelt and John Kennedy, that sound judgment and an ability to inspire should count for more than a long resume and the burden of knowing too much of what is not supposed to be achievable and too little of the infinite possibility of this unfinished American project.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: GUEST,Justin Urquart
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 05:07 PM

Obamas granny just joined the nightshift.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 05:20 PM

"Famed boxing promoter Don King, who backed George W. Bush in the 2004 US presidential election, urged Americans to set aside race issues and support Barack Obama's historic bid for the White House."


             He's punch drunk. That's why his hair stands straight up all the time.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 05:33 PM

So glad to see you and Justin have found each other, Rig. You really deserve each other; just don't talk about religion, okay?


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Barry Finn
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 05:38 PM

BB
Your copy/paste about fears of an overwhelming Democrate government are what we had to deal with for the past 8 yrs of Republician majority rule & they really fucked it up, royally. A House & Senate & an administration (& an SS Court) that saw fit to fight the American people tooth & nail while fighting the world to boot. They trashed civil & human rights at home & abroad, started 2 wars, caused a world economic bankruptcy, divided not just a nation but pit a world against it's self, tried to justifiy the destruction of the earth's enviorment for profit, put faith before future, crippled our educational & health care systems instead of improving them, tried to rape our Social Security system (imagine where it would've been if they succeeded?) stole our civil liberties that were granted us as citizens when this nation was first founded & were part of the reason this nation was founded. We, the American people have indured the without revolt what no other nation would suffer & this election is our revolt against all the injustices that have been heaped upon US for the past 8 yrs. Tomorrow is the people's day & they will reign rightous, have no fear, it'll be a celerbration to remember.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 05:40 PM

Well, to be fair now, Barry, the hard-oppressed tribal peoples of Iraq put up with worse while Saddam was in power. Their lot has improved a little . Aside from that I generally agree with you completely.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Bill D
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 05:54 PM

The GOP in Pennsylvania is now running THIS ad!. Wouldn't you know it?

The thing is, some other GOP umbrella group is running one VERY similar in Maryland! I have seen it 3 times now. It is not 'officially' being done BY the McCain campaign, but it is despicable.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 06:11 PM

It's about time, too!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 06:51 PM

As I have pointed out before, slimeball, the Rev Wright was right.

And Amos - you may be right (funny that more Iraqis have been dying since the invasion) or you may be wrong that life for Iraqis has improved (I don't think I believe you) - but the USA had no right to invade Iraq on that cause. How would the USA respond if Russia invaded it to improve the US's economics?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Bill D
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 07:00 PM

Here is the group running those ads in Maryland (just saw it again!)

Nasty ....

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 07:06 PM

If you're an Iraqi who is still alive and if you haven't had too many of your family killed, and if you aren't one of the millions who have been driven into exile, I suppose it's possible that life might be better than before the invasion.   But those are pretty big "if"s!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 07:35 PM

"...the Rev Wright was right."


             So what's your beef?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 07:54 PM

I think the absence of a despot at the top is an improvement, but one which is badly obscured by (a) the ham-fisted mismanagement of the whole military campaign until the "awakening", and (b) the presence of a whole slew of lesser despots desperately trying to preserve their despotic spheres against any improvement.


That said, I am completely in agreement about the wisdom of the initial choice made by Bush in launching the invasion; it was a profoundly misguided, unintelligent, misestimated, and immoral step.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 03 Nov 08 - 10:12 PM

Okay! He'll be gone on 1/21/09.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: curmudgeon
Date: 04 Nov 08 - 05:55 AM

Obama has won his first two towns in NH, the first Democrat to do so since Hubert Humphrey.

More details   here.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Charley Noble
Date: 04 Nov 08 - 10:22 AM

Two towns down! How many left to rack up?

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Charley Noble
Date: 04 Nov 08 - 10:27 AM

According to Goggle:

"Number of Cities, Towns and Villages in the United States ( Answered 5 out of 5 ... we arrive at a total of 18,218 places in the 50 states."

So only 18,216 to go!

Cheerily,
Charley Noble