BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 11:17 AM

Rapaire

I have a friend who works as an editor of state code for LexisNexis in Charlosttesville Virginia. Last year they were trying to convince a number of staff to take positions to India. The company claimed so they would continue in their normal work and train editors and word processors in India. At least they were honest about the change in pay. Not enough to live on in the US but a great income by India's standards.

If she agreed, my friend would have to sell her house in order to pay for accommodation in India and leave her husband who works in Charlottesville.

So now think about any jobs in the US that can be outsourced to countries where pay and conditions are below current US market. Call centers for insurance, banks, telecom, etc. and many products you purchase.

It might get to state agencies using foreign call centers to manage in coming enqiries and using private companies to supply and pay staff. In the UK, the private companies are eyeing libraries greedily and councils are encouraging them. Someone thinks there is a profit to be made in information that is supposed to be (statutorially) free to the public.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rapparee
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 10:45 AM

How soon before these hit the US, do you suppose?

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: bubblyrat
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 10:45 AM

Should be clear to even the simple-of-mind by now that the EU does NOT WORK ,and was never going to !! Pull out now,I say,before it's too late !!

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 10:40 AM

It was Brown who said "British jobs for British workers" at the labour conference so he will in this incidence be given credit for the phrase.

RB - I know Thatcherite regulations penalise unions for taking strike action and this hampers processes and progress. But does that excuse contradicting the union? Only perhaps as a final straw. I don't know what discussions have been taking place, if any.

I believe the reason behind the first unsanctioned strike is as much due to panic over the current financial crisis. Tata cleaning house at Corus Steel did not help matters. Workers everywhere are sweating bullets (myself included).

But I still think it better to fight against unfairness through the proper channels. If the channels are corrupt then vote the people in who can will clean them up. In the interim, large numbers of people should write to their local and central government representatives demanding changes to the laws and regulations. I know that is not going to happen but it still needs to be said, whether it is realistic or not.

An angry mob (especially one focussed against foreign workers) does not help the situation. Whether or not it is good to polarise the voting public at this stage remains to be seen.

That is just my pollyannish take. If I weren't an idealist, I would probably have topped myself long ago. I may yet... just take a nose dive from the top of Essex county hall like that bloke who was restructured out of a job, this time last year.

Nah! I couldn't give em the satisfaction.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: The Barden of England
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 10:30 AM

What about the British workers who are working elsewhere in the EU? Beware lest what's good for the goose turns out to be bad for the gander. Once again xenophobia hits these shores and it bothers me plenty. By the way I am a paid up member of the CWU for what it's worth.
John Barden

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 09:51 AM

I rather think it's the threat of losing their jobs that has many of them out on strike in the first place. No-one takes strike action lightly, least of all those who lose a day's pay because of it.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 09:37 AM

I assume they don't get paid whilst on unofficial strike.
Maybe, they should be threatened with losing their jobs if they don't get straight back to work. I am sure there would be people willing to have their jobs.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 08:18 AM

Any Union is required to give several (I think 6?) months notice of planned strike action and can only do so after lengthy negotiations and a ballot of its members.

That way, the negotiation process can be given full time to work, and many more strikes are called off due to resolution than actually take place.

The government of the Thatcher era, particularly the early-mid 1980's did indeed shackle the Unions to prevent the 'wildcat' strikes, and also to prevent 'flying pickets' - members of other Unions and from other areas coming in to bolster and encourage what might have otherwise been seen as a weak and unstable picket line. These 'flying pickets' were seen as 'rent-a-mob' as violence and breaches of the peace invariably followed their progress across the country. Whether this was fact or not, it was given as a major reason for restricting the number of official pickets now allowed to congregate at a strike site.

I am a Union member, Public and Commercial Services (PCS) and before that UNISON and NALGO (National Association of Local Government Officers). I support my Union in most things but I will not support illegal, wildcat strikes. In my experience they do more harm than good, alienating the general public to what may be a genuine grievance. Thus the whole process of industrial action is tainted and more and more rights of the worker are ignored, agreements broken and people made to suffer.

Strike action should always be the last resort, not the first salvo.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: GUEST,Big Norman Voice
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 08:07 AM

I believe that the phraes, 'Brish jobs for British workers' was stolen from the BNP, and was an attempt to lessen their appeal to disaffected and disillusioned unemployed Britsh workers..
Oh how it has backfired on him, silly man.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 08:05 AM

The facts that I have seen in the papers are way more complex than outlined above - and I may not have all of them on board yet.

However one factor in the fact that these strikes are wildcat strikes is that Thatcher deliberately made the process for a union to call a strike difficult, so that she could fine unions for calling them, and so take thier money, so there would be less money in strike funds to support even legal strikers.

I therefore say tht the reason that these strikes are "wildcat" is that the procedures that would stop them being "wildcat" are deliberately loaded against potential strikers.

The reason that there are these strikes (whether wildcat or not) is that these workers see no other way of defending themselves against organised capital.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 08:00 AM

VT
Very well put and it is nice to see union members who do not condone wildcat strikes.
Les

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 07:55 AM

I am a union member and I do not approve of any action taken that is not sanctioned by the whatever union one is a member of.

If as alledged, the European contractors are discriminating against British workers, then surely it would be provable and as such as illegal. I think it highly unlikely they have done anything illegal.

I think it more likely that these Wildcatters have been led by unsavoury sources of information. Some newspapers come to mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 07:53 AM

I don't support wildcat strikes but it is important to understand what they are all about, why they happen and why people take part in them and to look at what other options people have for protest.

Pat McFadden, the employment minister, has asked ACAS, the independent arbitration body, to investigate allegations that British workers were being excluded illegally from working for certain foreign-owned construction firms. The government has promised to act, let's hope they do.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 07:41 AM

Look I don't like Brown, but am not having a go at him on this.

It's about Wildcat strikers. Do you support their actions and if so, why?

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 07:36 AM

Listen, can you hear something?

Yes, it's the lesser Brown Backpedaller....

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 07:34 AM

Gordon Brown says today that his "British jobs for British workers" slogan was actually referring to plans to give British workers more skills.

"When I talked about British jobs, I was taking about giving people in Britain the skills, so that they have the ability to get jobs which were, at present, going to people from abroad… and actually encouraging people to take up the courses and the educational and learning that it is necessary for British workers to be far more skilled for the future," he will tell BBC's Politics Show.

here

Pity he hadn't it made it clear at the time.

Of course he hasn't said how he will address the issue of foreign firms undercutting British engineering and construction companies.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: GUEST,Aston
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 07:10 AM

Eastern European workers had added to the problems here. It's a bomb waiting to explode. The government MUST place restrictions on numbers entering county.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:59 AM

"as they do the lower paid, mainly agricultural jobs that most Brit workers did not want to touch."

Really? So why is it is nigh impossible to find a plumber or an electrician or a builder or a loft converter in east London who doesn't have a middle European accent?

Those jobs are neither agricultural nor low paid.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Arnie
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:54 AM

The problem stems from EU labour laws - these give the right to freedom of movement, and jobs, throughout the EU for all EU citizens. Not a problem in times of plenty but I think Brussels will find it's chickens coming home to roost during a recession. The French were taking to the streets to protest about unemployment before the wildcat strikes over here, and predictably these demonstrations will spread throughout the EU. Of course, there were few if any protests in the UK over the recent E.European invasion of Poles and Lithuanians, as they do the lower paid, mainly agricultural jobs that most Brit workers did not want to touch. The problem in Lincolnshire is that the Italians and Portuguese have been brought in to do skilled, high-paid jobs that the unemployed in the local populace are capable of doing and want to do. However, any attempt to ban EU workers from British jobs is illegal and just will not happen, so I hope Brown and his mates have got a real solution rather than just mealy-mouthed phrases about British jobs for British workers.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:37 AM

Whats that got to do with Wildcat Strikes Rog?

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rog Peek
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:31 AM

Haven't you noticed Villan, the banks and the government have already brought the country to its knees.

Rog

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Paul Burke
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:31 AM

I do support the idea that we should be careful about importing labour when it forces down conditions for local workers. But it's just a little more complicated than that. These contracts were made probably years ago. The contractors recruited their workforces probably a year or more ago, when employment was pretty full in Britain for anyone with the necessary skills. They don't want to sack an existing workforce, and have to take on and probably train new ones, who are hammering at the door only because their old jobs have gone.

"Wildcat" strikes? We have very poor employment rights in Britain compared with most other semicivilised countries.

The real worry about this wave of actions is that the labour movement is powerless, and there is no political party that supports the working class- indeed, most people deny that it exists, and are very shocked to find that they are working class, when they cease to be working. This denial gives the racist parties a crack to push their skrewdriver into, blaming not cynical employers and fatcat bosses* but foreigners (and how long before pakis, coons and pikies?) for their problems.

*Politics of envy? Is that worse than the politics of gluttony and avarice?

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:29 AM

wildcat strikes are not the answer

I agree but what is the answer?

If companies are practising discrimination against British workers then surely the companies should be prosecuted and made to change their policy. Is the government doing anything about this?

The trouble is that things can get out of hand in these situations and turn nasty.

Thye just bring the country to its knees

.....and to add to the strikes bringing everything to a halt we now have the snow......!

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:20 AM

Yes of course Eanjay.

However, wildcat strikes are not the answer. Thye just bring the country to its knees.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:17 AM

As I understand it the strikes have come about because British workers are being specifically excluded from working on contracts by European contractors. If that is the case then surely it is discrimination against British workers?

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Megan L
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:10 AM

"British Jobs for British workers" Thats a laugh there are no British jobs left as for forieng workers well they only ever took the jobs that British "workers" deemed beneath them.

Subject: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 06:03 AM

I support the issue concerning Britsh Jobs for British Workers.

However, what I do not support, is Wildcat or Unofficial Strikes.

This country is already on its knees, and these strikes will only make matters worse.

All I can say, is that the people on strike are lucky to have a job.

Quote fromm BBC News
Wildcat strikes are "not defensible", Gordon Brown has told those angry at the employment of foreign workers.

Hundreds of employees staged unofficial walkouts across the UK over the use of foreign staff at Lincolnshire refinery.

The PM told the BBC's Politics Show he understood workers' fears, but walkouts were "not the right thing to do".

The Tories said they did not back strikes either but said Mr Brown's 2007 "British jobs for British workers" pledge had been exposed as "fiction".

End of quote.

I don't like Gordon Brown to say the least, but I have to put my hands up and support what he says. Of course the Tories agree with him, but have to make cheap snidey comments, that IMHO do not help matters.