BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 10 Oct 09 - 08:07 AM

The Eurosport channel has just started covering Twenty20 cricket, so I've seen it for the first time. For what it's worth, I'd rate this form below 50/50 one-dayers, but above test cricket.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Rasener
Date: 26 Aug 09 - 09:16 AM

Allen

Gary Sobers, what a player.

I actually played on the ground a month or so before he scored his famous 6 sixes on. We used to do a tour in Wales every year.

Whilst it was indeed a great feat, it does have to be put in perspective LOL

When I played on the ground the boundary was very short (the same side that he slogged one out the ground).
I was a specialist point fielder and I fielded on the boundary at the normal point position. It was so strange. It was stop it or its a six.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWA7wYKcPGo

The first 6 he hits, is the side I am on about.

Les

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Allen in Oz
Date: 26 Aug 09 - 07:21 AM

The Villan

You blokes must never sleep over there

Flintoff and Botham must be very high up on our ladder of greats as they perfomed so well when under great pressure in Ashes series ( as did Steve Waugh)

We have left out the mighty Viv Richards aaaargh !( Not to mention Keith Miller and Ted Dexter)


I must admit that the best I ever saw ( and I have been going to the Sydney Cricket Ground since 1951) was Sobers


I went to school and played cricket with Dave Renneberg so I popped out to the SCG to see my old mate bowl for NSW to Sobers . The master had arrived to show the lads from NSW just how to play the game . He scored 130 amazing runs. So fleet footed was he that he could change his mind from a forward shot to defence against fast bowling as the ball was coming down and still hit it for 4.

If I never was another game of cricket after that I would have loved the game for life

AD 1943

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Rasener
Date: 26 Aug 09 - 04:09 AM

Hi Allen
Yes indeed Freddie Flintoff.
>>
Some great names mentioned there.
Frank Tyson (whom Benaud ranks as the fastest ever...and I agree)
Fred Truman, Brian Statham, Wes Hall, Sobers, Gower, Walters,Lara, Tendulkar,Warne,Pollock,Colin Milburn, both Chappels,Lillee,Thomson,Griffith etc etc etc
<<

Beefy Botham
Glen McGrath has always been one of my favourite bowlers.
Sir Frank Worrell was great player
Merv Hughes - was he frightening :-)
Malcolm Marshall, Michael Holding,Courtney Walsh, Curtley Ambrose Evil Gits :-)
Waqar Younis, Imran Khan, Wasim Akran
Jonti Rhodes


Yes your right, the list goes on

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Allen in Oz
Date: 26 Aug 09 - 03:15 AM

To the Villan: "Freddie" Flintoff

I could not agree more (even from an Australian perspective)

When I watched him,my mind went back to some amazing players (inluding Freddie) that I have seen:

Frank Tyson (whom Benaud ranks as the fastest ever...and I agree)
Fred Truman, Brian Statham, Wes Hall, Sobers, Gower, Walters,Lara, Tendulkar,Warne,Pollock,Colin Milburn, both Chappels,Lillee,Thomson,Griffith etc etc etc

Best wishes

Allen

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Aug 09 - 05:31 AM

I would like to wish Freddie a speedy recovery. You have provided such wonderful pleasure to us cricketers over the years. You will be missed in the test matches.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 04:53 PM

It went from 60 to 50 overs in 1987, sorry.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Rasener
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 02:55 PM

Tim
If thats the case. then just ignore him, and talk to the people that do seem to know.
Les

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: mandotim
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 02:28 PM

Villan; One further clarification; Wav's lecturing on things he knows bugger all about. Evidence for that is in this thread; he thinks World Cup games are 60 overs a side (not 50), and had to google to find out what a googly is.
Regards
Tim

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: mandotim
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 02:24 PM

Hi Villan! I'm very cool about this, thanks; and there are no allegations here at all. Everything I've said can be substantiated by reading the vast number of messages WAV has posted here over the last couple of years. Facts, not allegations. When you cross reference WAV's views against academically acceptable definitions, the terms 'fascist' and 'racist' are inescapable.
If you think WAV started this thread to talk about cricket, check out his post early in the thread (7th July) where the real agenda begins to arise.
Tim

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Rasener
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 02:15 PM

Cool it down Tim.
You are making some very serious allegations.

Lets just keep on talking about Cricket which is what this thread is about.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: mandotim
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 02:11 PM

Listen WAV; you still haven't answered my question about whether you have in fact been to any first class cricket matches since 2000, and have resorted to calling me stupid and also repeating your vile racist arguments about all over this board. Why should I be nice to you? I can demonstrate conclusively against accepted definitions that you are in fact a racist, and I've never been nice to a racist in my life.
As with almost every other area on which you see fit to pontificate, your outpourings prove beyond doubt that while you may have an interest in cricket, you haven't bothered to learn anything other than the superficial features of the game. That's your problem WAV; it's really irritating when you seek to lecture people who actually know a lot more about the subject in question, and who find your ideas puerile at best and repugnant and obscene at worst. Examples abound, but I guess you lecturing Eliza Carthy on English traditional folk music was a high point. Your views on why women should be prevented from playing lawn tennis were another, and an Australian with no knowledge of football trying to tell a bunch of Brits how the game they grew up with should be organised was truly risible. Your ideas about English culture bear no resemblance to any culture that has existed even briefly in England, and appear to be based on careful study of hymns, a very limited number of traditional songs and perhaps the odd seaside postcard. For someone who claims to have anthropology qualifications, your views appear a little under-researched, don't you think?
Finally, I'd like to add another 'ism' to your growing list. You keep proposing controls that would keep national cultures 'pure' and unadulterated by influences from other nations. An example was your assertion that people in England should not be allowed to perform any music originating in America. That's fascism, WAV, naked and unadorned. Look it up.
I'm not sorry for any of this WAV; you are an unapologetic fascist and a racist, and I will continue to challenge you as I would with any other fascist and racist. The fact that you deny that you are a racist doesn't make it less true; please don't bother to repeat all your ridiculous arguments about imperialism, fair trade and so on; we've heard them before, and they are still irrelevant.
Granma McAlatia says hello, by the way, and hopes you are feeling better.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 01:44 PM

Appreciate that, and hope this thread can continue through the one-dayers.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Rasener
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 01:28 PM

>>
Okay WAV, so you have had a genuine interest in cricket for sometime, and your 2 arguments on this thread re. Welsh cricketers competing for Wales, and One-day cricket being a better game than test cricket, have nothing to do with racism - I'm sorry.
<<

They sure don't as far as I am concerned.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: The Sandman
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 12:52 PM

200,leadfingers is not a cricketer,well he wouldny be with aname like that would he.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 12:49 PM

Here's what you could have replied following my frank answer to your question, Mandotim: "Okay WAV, so you have had a genuine interest in cricket for sometime, and your 2 arguments on this thread re. Welsh cricketers competing for Wales, and One-day cricket being a better game than test cricket, have nothing to do with racism - I'm sorry."

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: s&r
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 06:19 AM

WAV why do you cut and paste the same drivel on different threads like on this thread and your 'poetry' thread 24 August 5.03 and 5.04 Mudcat time. I thought you had stopped cut/pasting..

Stu

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 06:16 AM

I accept that some sports have become global,

Well that's a start. Try applying the same logic to music.

And you would have to be stupid to call me a "racist".

On the contrary. You would have to be stupid not to call you a racist. Apart from your various posts on this forum, all one has to do is read your published MESSAGES there to see your racism writ large.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 06:11 AM

"Oh, and by the way WAV; if you were a proper Englishman, you'd be spending the morning nursing a massive hangover and proclaiming Test cricket to be the greatest and most prestigious game in the world"...that's stupid Mandotim - I started this thread BEFORE the Ashes series started, and I wrote "Dot Ball" years ago, and I stand by those views. And you would have to be stupid to call me a "racist".

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: mandotim
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 05:38 AM

OOOH, Wav, I'd have to be stupid would I? Does that also apply to all the other people on this board who have argued cogently and intelligently that your repugnant and utterly bogus adopted nationalism constitutes racism by any accepted definition? How many people are you calling stupid? You consistently propound views that would prevent those of different nationalities and races from participating in activities that you yourself would be able to enjoy, purely on the grounds of where they happen to be born. That's racism, and if you subscribe to those views, you are de facto a racist, and calling things 'false and defamatory' doesn't change that one bit. It's not me who's out of step here sunshine, your persona on this board is seen clearly for what it is. Don't get me started on your appalling sexism.
Adelaide Oval eh? What year? Which matches? So you haven't watched any first-class cricket since 2000 then. Not exactly an active cricket supporter, are you? I would have thought you'd be a Durham glory-hunter by now, going to watch them now they're doing well.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 05:11 AM

Mandotim, on this occasion, NOT Stu, sorry.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 05:03 AM

S. and Stu: I accept that some sports have become global, and appreciate nations competing, against each other, at them. And, accordingly, I would like Welsh cricketers to compete for Wales, and NOT a combined England plus Wales. I disagree with the British Lions, too, and note that some in rugby circles are also being to question it.

"Oh, and by the way WAV; if you were a proper Englishman, you'd be spending the morning nursing a massive hangover and proclaiming Test cricket to be the greatest and most prestigious game in the world"...that's stupid Stu - I started this thread BEFORE the Ashes series started, and I wrote "Dot Ball" years ago, and I stand by those views. And you would have to be stupid to call me a "racist".

Before I repatriated, at the Sydney Cricket Ground and Adelaide Oval, I've watched both test and one-day cricket. And, since I repatriated...

Poem 115 of 230: SUNDAY CRICKET AND BERRIES - SUMMER 2000

From a bus (ninety-eight -
    Bury to Manchester),
I got off at the gate
    Of Hamilton Road Park,
Where in situ I ate
    Several blackberries
(The taste too good to wait),
    Before making my way
To a further park-gate,
    From where briefly I watched
How Stand's cricketers rate.

From http://blogs.myspace.com/walkaboutsverse (e-book)
Or http://walkaboutsverse.sitegoz.com (e-scroll)
(C) David Franks 2003

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: The Sandman
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 04:35 AM

mind you watching Boycott bat is seriously stimulating when you compare him to Trevor Bailey,
watching a blank television,is about the only thing more boring,Bailey was the master of cricket stonewalling.
Johnny wont hit today Douglas was another,although he was before my time.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: mandotim
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 04:30 AM

Still no answer to my question (as usual). Have you ever been to a Test Match WAV? Another question; how come (under your philosophy) the Australians are allowed to play cricket at all? Shouldn't they be playing some game that originates from their 'Own Good Culture', not one that grew up in rural England?
As for revealing you as a racist WAV; that has been exhaustively demonstrated on previous threads to be neither false nor defamatory, but rather an accurate summary of your expressed and published views.
Oh, and by the way WAV; if you were a proper Englishman, you'd be spending the morning nursing a massive hangover and proclaiming Test cricket to be the greatest and most prestigious game in the world, because that's what we Brits do on the rare occasions when we're winning at something.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 03:27 AM

To Allen in Oz...
You'd be mad to ditch Ponting as captain too. A real Gent who came across as very professional and magnanimous in his post series interviews. And, anyway, who'd replace him?
A thoroughly enjoyable series, with its myriad twists and turns. The test match is the pinnacle of cricket for me...One good or bad session can change the destiny of a whole match. If the Aussies had managed to be still there at close yesterday, the Brits would have been seriously doubting their abilities to win.
G'Day to you mate.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: mandotim
Date: 24 Aug 09 - 03:18 AM

If it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, it's a duck. Have a listen to WAV talk and 'sing' on his website. You're an Australian pretending to be English cobber, irrespective of where you were born. No one would mind that, if you didn't persist in trying to tell real English people how to be English!
Allen in Oz; respect to the Aussies too, they played a good, hard series in a fine sporting spirit. They'll be itching to do what they did to England the last time we went to Oz!

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Allen in Oz
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 06:54 PM

Dear Paul Burke.

All good fun and no doubt written in jest. I watched Boycott bat and , yes, it did seem like 300 days!. It was not so much " batting" as "occupying the crease". I am still surprised that Australia could not bat for 2 days, notwithstanding the state of the pitch.

Still, congratulations to England... a wonderful effort.

AD 1943

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 06:08 PM

Strange how the Hapless Repatriate accepts that sports can be multi-national, and yet other cultural matters (such as music and dance) must remain confined within strongly Regulated National Boundaries. We are well acquainted with his view of English Football being a Foreign Farce, but what of other countries playing football at all? Have they not got their own sports? Shouldn't Nation States stick to their own Good Indigenous National Sports rather than International ones which no doubt contribute to the loss of indigenous cultural identity by promoting a more cosmopolitan world view? How can he square his fondness for Wimbledon with his love of a Multicultural World wherein National Cultural Identity is being eroded by tennis? And is football more of a Foreign Farce that even WAV would have us believe? Is cricket the legacy of our Imperial Past? Blah blah...

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: The Sandman
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 05:39 PM

bad luck WAV,Maybe the Aussies should have had you in their team.Iam sure you could bowl a maiden over,or two.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 05:10 PM

I'm an English repatriate, Mandotim - actually born here the day Alf Ramsey's English team won the World Cup of football (not to be confused with the World Cup of cricket - decided by LIMITED OVER cricket encounters, of course).

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: mandotim
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 04:53 PM

One dayers; ersatz cricket for people with short attention spans and not much knowledge of the game. 20/20 even more so. Wickets prepared totally in favour of batsmen, bowlers reduced to bowling negatively, artificial fielding restrictions that make a mockery of the subtle, tactical equation of runs, wickets and - crucially - time. Tell me WAV; would you enjoy tennis matches that consisted of a single game to decide the winner? Would you penalise the server a point for missing the first serve? How about football; would five minutes per half be ok? Golf; three holes to decide the Open Champion? All of these are rough equivalents of your assertion that the shorter form of cricket is better. Have you ever been to a Test match (or any professional cricket match, for that matter?)
Well done England, sorry about your countrymen losing WAV; better luck next time.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 04:33 PM

Not long until the far-better-game one-dayers now - when batsman WILL be punished for air-swings with a "Dot Ball" (atop).

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Wyrd Sister
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 04:05 PM

Wa-hey!!

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: alanabit
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 01:52 PM

Well done England. Australia were on over three hundred for five when I went out to pick up the family. I was starting to think that they were going to bat into day five with five wickets up. I came back an hour later and it was all over.
Les, it looks like your faith was justified. I am always very surprised that we can even compete at cricket. So I have a lot of respect for all concerned this time around.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Rasener
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 01:22 PM

Well done England

I haven't commented until now, so that I didn't put the mockers on England

I bet the Aussies are sick as a pig now :-)

You bet our economy will pick up tomorrow :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: mandotim
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 01:15 PM

Like I said, racism.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: The Sandman
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 12:54 PM

the best team won,never mind luck,skill is involved to run people out.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 09:49 AM

At last a bit of luck! Two run-outs have changed the match position after a good stand for the third wicket. After all the playing and missing, near lbws and misplayed shots (as well as some really good batting) England are strong favourites again. Until the next century stand. Nice to see Freddie getting into the action in his last Test Match, running out Ricky Ponting - champagne moment!

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: The Sandman
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 07:44 AM

alec bedser learned ballrom dancing sometime before Simpson.
Garfield Sobers footwork was better than either,he scored 365 not out on one occasion.as far as I know he did not take dancing lessons.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: alanabit
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 07:25 AM

This looks as if it is going to be a game. Australia are now at 130-2. Their run rate is on target for a win, isn't it? Let's hope England can take a couple of wickets this afternoon. I am going to be very worried if Australia have four wickets standing at the end of the day.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 05:59 AM

Bobby Simpson, I believe, learnt classical dance to improve his footwork - perhaps that helped toward his 300 plus.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 05:22 AM

"Bobby Simpson some years ago bemoaned the fact that none of our batsmen could bat for 3 days (he once did for over 300!)"

Batted for 300 days? That out-Boycotts Boycott! If Oz get to 200, or even 150, without loss, there will be tightening of scrota...

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 05:05 AM

Using "racism" is false and defamatory, Mandotim; what I do want, rather, is to live in an independent republic of England; and, accordingly, would like to see Wales playing AGAINST England, Australia, etc., at cricket - as well as rugby, football, etc.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: mandotim
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 04:49 AM

It's always fun to here someone who knows nothing about a subject holding forth. WAV reminds me of the Private Eye 'Sally Jockstrap' column, always confusing sports. Back to WAV's real agenda, racism; WAV, it's true that Scotland and indeed Ireland have ICC playing sides; but I think you'll find that the good Scots and Irish players have usually opted to play for England, the only Test playing nation in these isles. You won't remember most of them, as your interest in cricket seems to be like your interest in folk music; very recent, and massively incomplete. I'll give you Mike Denness and Ed Joyce as starters. See if you can find some more. A cursory flick through Wisden would help. You mean you don't buy Wisden every year? Shame on you, call yourself a cricket fan!

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: alanabit
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 04:10 AM

The fact is, that if Australia can bat for two days, they will win easily. I think they can afford to score less than three runs an over. It is going to be warm, so they should cruise it. I shall get pretty excited if wickets go before tea time today, but I can't see Australia losing if they have four wickets left at the end of today's play.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: Allen in Oz
Date: 23 Aug 09 - 01:03 AM

We will be glued to our televisions this evening in Australia. An amazing series really. Bobby Simpson some years ago bemoaned the fact that none of our batsmen could bat for 3 days (he once did for over 300!)   Surely it can't be too hard to bat for 2 days in a Test. We will see...
Allen in OZ

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: The Sandman
Date: 22 Aug 09 - 02:16 PM

England declared too early,they should have let the last pair try and snick 20 more runs.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 22 Aug 09 - 12:29 PM

...and, from an Englishman, it's certainly not cricket, but Inveraray just beat Kingussie, at Scotland's shinty, in an exciting MacAulay Cup final.

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: goatfell
Date: 22 Aug 09 - 06:29 AM

I just hope the best team win the ashes.

from a scot

Subject: RE: BS: Bury 'The Ashes'?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 22 Aug 09 - 05:06 AM

...I repeat, what about Welsh cricket - from what I can gather, they'd be a pretty handy cricketing nation already?...in case you haven't noticed, the Scots are independent re. cricket.