BS: Excellent budget (UK)

Subject: BS: Excellent budget
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 09:02 AM

Non doms who have lived in the UK 12 years + will be subject to an annual tax charge of £50k - satisfactory for all you lefties???

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget
From: Silas
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 09:04 AM

No.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 10:22 AM

Why not?

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: DMcG
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 10:26 AM

I won't claim to know Silas's reason but a good leftie reason is that taxation should be linked to ability to pay. For some, £50k will be severe but for others it is a fraction of what they would be paying a a resident.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Ringer
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 10:32 AM

"good leftie reason" - oxymoron of the day! *grin*

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 10:41 AM

If ever there was an example of why class warfare is inevitable, Ringer and Bonzo have said it here, on Mudcat.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: DMcG
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 10:47 AM

Glad to be of service, Ringer!

While my views tend to be left of centre, I don't believe either left or right is incapable of reason and the implication that a point is automatically to be dismissed just because it is spoken by someone with a different point of view to me is not a position I'd be comfortable with.

How many UK taxes have an upper limit I wonder (as opposed to an upper percentage?) I don't know, myself, but I'm sure someone will be happy to make a list

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Silas
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 10:51 AM

Because it is not related in any way to income or earnings wether earned or unearned. £50K may be a lot of money to you and me, but for many of these people it is just pocket money.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 10:55 AM

And, it'd be a good thing for government to keep its hands out of people's pockets, imo.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Silas
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 10:58 AM

OK matey. You kep your money so long as you never need access to a doctor, hospital, police service, fire service, use a road or any of the myriad of things tax is used to pay for.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: DMcG
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 11:04 AM

Careful what you wish for, Silas. After all, it wouldn't be the first time those things were pay-as-you-use.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Silas
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 11:14 AM

I'm not wishing for it, I'm (reasonably) happy the way things are.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 12:54 PM

This looks like a pretty good review of the Non Doms Tax

http://realbusiness.co.uk/management/budget_2011_nondoms

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 02:10 PM

An excellent budget, to me, would have been them saying "Fook, we got this soooooo wrong! We've buggered up the country, buggered up the people and now we have to put this right!...So, here's what we're going to do...

As we've only one soldier, one sailer, and one candlestick maker left in the country, along with one vehicle, airborne, seaborne, waxborne or otherwise, for each of them, we're going to take the BILLIONS we keep for defence out of the bank and put it over to hospitals, libraries, communities. We're going to half the price of petrol and make you pay to use motorways, because that way, the ordinary folks who just need their cars to 'live' won't be pushed aside and left marooned in the countryside any longer...

I expect you all noticed how fast we got our plane over to Libya and how much it er...cost us to do this...We're a bit embarrassed about this to be honest....

We're also going to bring all the Bankers to Court, along with all the other Crooked Corporate Bastards, and make them give back all the money they've stolen from the country.

Then, we're going to get the Her Majesty's Custom and Excise to customise and exercise the right of your Ordinary People to take back all the money they've stolen off you these past years...

We're going to talk to the Queen to see if she'll sell of her Crown Jewels and do Something Really Useful with the money for Her People because we think it's way past time that happened...and she can buy copies from Swarvoski for a fraction of the price which will glitter just as nicely...

We're going to set the children free from stress by all us politicians selling off our shares in Edukashon R Us, giving the money to the Lifelong Learning System we aim to set up...where no child will ever have to sit an examination ever again, unless they want to focus in a particular area, such as brain surgery or some other worthy cause, but exams will be removed from schools, replaced by a general Certificate of Learning which every child will get and which talks about their Spirit alongside their academic strengths.

We're going to make everyone feel better by having a Clean Britain again! Yes, we've noticed how filthy this country's become, so we're making thousands of new jobs for Road Sweepers again, all over the country. Parks will also have Park Keepers, to keep them safe and tidy, as they always used to be. Buses will also have Conducters on them again, to ensure the driver can drive safely once more, and that customers are kept safe and happy in a pleasant environment where drinks cans don't roll about all day long, or children shout "Fuck off you tw*t!" in other passengers ears. We're also going to make the Rail Companies halve their fares, and put double the amount of railway coaches on, to ensure that all passengers have seats whilst they travel, and those who don't get a full refund on their ticket.

England will become the same as Scotland and Wales, with free NHS prescriptions, no SATS tests for little children...and a great pride in Being English (no matter what your skin colour) will spread throughout the land...along with free university education and free care for all in their old age, so that no-one has to sell their home off, and children will be able to inherit, as they have always done.

All MPs and Councillors will get ordinary wages..and the Minimum Wage will rise to £9 an hour so that people will be able to have a decent living wage, not having to struggle on wages that haven't changed since 1978....

Car Parks will be 20p an hour...

Speed Cameras will ALL disappear....

Town cameras will ALL disappear....

People will once again be presumed Innocent, rather than Guilty....

No-one will have to have NVQs to get a job, nor PVAs nor QSAs or RVUs, because folks will become sensible again and realise that everyone can learn the job as they go along...

People will get decent annual pay rises, as they always used to, instead of 7pence an hour more.

People will get decent Christmas Bonuses, as they always used to, instead of 'an extra £10' if that...

People will have CONTRACTS for every job in the land.

People will no longer be expected to be available to an employer for 6/7 days 7am to 11pm, when only accepting a job for 4 hours, with no contract.

Unions will be Government funded to ensure no workers are treated as slaves.

The National Curriculum will focus on ensuring children always ask questions, WANT to be Individuals, creative and free-thinking Spirits. They will be taught kindness and empathy, sensitivity and compassion and be given in lessons in how to build, run and be part of Happy Communities where everyone cares for everyone else, regardless of age, colour or creed...

People who want to have 16 children and expect the State to house them will be told they can't.

Mothers will be held up as being great for the country! They'll no longer be overshadowed by Child Minders, because mothers will be paid to stay at home to care for their children, create the communities and bring up the next generation to be intelligent, loving and caring.

How are we going to fund this?

By using all the money we now spend on Wars, Prisons, Drug Centres, Alcohol Centres, ASBOs, Social Services for Abused Children, Fostering Socieities, Accident and Emergency Departments, Counsellors for families of those who've committed suicide...the list is endless...

How will it work?

It will work because FINALLY, we've had the guts to stand up and say it's not just our finances that are broken, it is US.   We have allowed so much stress to be put on people that they are imploding at the speed of our one aircraft flying to Libya at this moment...and we need to end it all.

When we do, many things will change.

We are coming together as a country, as a nation, as political parties, as People. There will be an end to class, to division, to the sickeningly rich and the sickened poor.

We can do this if we all pull together....and that is precisely why, I, as your Chancellor, will be the first to sell my big house, give away so much of family wealth..and re-connect with everyone, for I realise that the only hope of Survival is.....Equality & Unity."


Now *that* would be an excellent budget.....

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 02:16 PM

A budget that redistributes funding for services for the most disadvantaged in society that was cut at the spending review, to those who would be marginally better off, i.e. floating voters.

How would a person with learning disability on an income of less than £2,000 a year benefit from the budget. Raising tax thresholds are of no benefit at all to the lowest paid.

At the moment I am sceptical about the unification of tax and NI, whether this would be a first step towards a health service funded by private insurance.

Non doms - I need to get my head round this before I comment.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: GUEST,Will Fly on Mac No. 2
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 02:23 PM

Lizzie - I read on the BBC text service that they're going to do something to reduce the higher-than-average water prices in the South-West.

I know this is an issue you've raised here, now and then, so thought I'd mention it. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 02:31 PM

SPB - With you on the disability side. It's very worrying.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 02:34 PM

What please is learning disability - do you mean mentally handicapped?

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 02:42 PM

I guess the following would apply.

learning disorder: a disorder found in children of normal intelligence who have difficulties in learning specific skills

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: GUEST,Will Fly on Mac No. 2
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 02:43 PM

Bonzo - predictably trollish as per usual. You know perfectly well what is meant by learning disability, so do stop being silly.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 04:02 PM

Lizzie - I read on the BBC text service that they're going to do something to reduce the higher-than-average water prices in the South-West.

I know this is an issue you've raised here, now and then, so thought I'd mention it. :-) <<<<<<


Thanks, Will, I'd not heard that today. That'll be great news for so many people..and I know Adrian Sanders, our local MP will be thrilled, because he's campaigned so hard, for so long, to get something done about this iniquitous situation. It causes so much distress to many folks down here..not to mention businesses..

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Penny S.
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 04:20 PM

One point on non-doms made by Digby Jones was that a number of them are academics teaching at our universities. Not obviously remunerated at a rate allowing payment on £50 thou. As usual, not thinking all the implications.

And the one thing I heard in passing was a removal of the "no win, no fee" style of legal action to prevent "victimisation" of businesses. Taken with the earlier cuts in legal aid, where does this leave the exploited worker? That is, the few workers who fall foul of the few bad employers. I wouldn't want to look lefty over this.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 04:29 PM

You know perfectly well what is meant by learning disability, so do stop being silly.

Actually no, as an accountant I have no knowledge of this type of jargon.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 04:31 PM

One point on non-doms made by Digby Jones was that a number of them are academics teaching at our universities. Not obviously remunerated at a rate allowing payment on £50 thou. As usual, not thinking all the implications.

Then they would be paid under the PAYE system.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 23 Mar 11 - 06:42 PM

The reason why I ofter refer to learning disability as firstly, my work specialises in Management Accountancy for charities and social enterprises, and secondly, it is a significant sector of society who are most marginalised - one reason being the limits of protected earnings (I think it is less than £20/week) which if exceeded not only impact on benefits, but also on other areas such as free prescriptions.

I was referring to this example to illustrate a point that raising tax thresholds does not benefit those who are already below the threshold.





Source Below- National Mencap Web Site



What is a learning disability?

A learning disability is caused by the way the brain develops.

There are many different types and most develop before a baby is born, during birth or because of a serious illness in early childhood. A learning disability is lifelong and usually has a significant impact on a person's life.

Learning disability is not mental illness or dyslexia.

People with a learning disability find it harder than others to learn, understand and communicate. People with profound and multiple learning disabilities (PMLD) need full-time help with every aspect of their lives - including eating, drinking, washing, dressing and toileting.

There are 1.5 million people with a learning disability in the UK. Like all of us, they are individuals who want different things in life and need different levels of support.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: GUEST,Steamin' Willie
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 06:26 AM

All in all, he could have delivered a worse budget. Not saying I fully agree with it all, but if he is serious about a private sector led recovery, then this is not a bad start. Dropping corporation tax to encourage companies to invest in UK jobs is possibly the best bit, although there are other ways of encouraging inward investment that don't reduce the tax take as much, but to moan about that would be churlish on my part.

Personally, I will be worse off by this budget, but the government is not just for me, it is for us all and I ain't about to starve.

There is one fundamental part I disagree with though, and stating it could have me being seen to agree with Ed Balls and that would never do. However;

Osborne feels you need to address the deficit before you can talk growth. I reckon there is a case for growth to address the deficit. The trick is to use growth to to reduce deficit rather than the quick political trick of spending the growth in wooing voters, as an election always seems to come around when the country's coffers can be robbed, so we never spend growth to pay for yesterday. Hence the mess we are in. (I accept that the last government were incompetent, but every Tory & Lib Dem MP has been told to preface every statement / interview with "the mess the last lot left us in" and it is becoming tiresome hearing it. We have had almost a year of this government and indicators such as inflation, GDP etc have their effect in the figures now.)

Oh, and the inheritance tax break for charities. Fine thought, but as it is using money that would otherwise go to the treasury in order to give to charities, my fear is that childrens' and fluffy bunny rabbits charities will do well, and charities looking after vulnerable older people will do less well. But I suppose that's people power and the big society eh?

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 07:05 AM

"There are 1.5 million people with a learning disability in the UK. Like all of us, they are individuals who want different things in life and need different levels of support."

I did the accounts of the charity "Contact A Family" back in the early 1990s - which was set up to support families with mentally handicapped children, and blow me, my first wife worked as a carer at a day centre for mentally handicapped adults in the 1970s.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 07:59 AM

A learning 'disability' should actually be called a Learning **Difference* for that is all it is....

There are some who are utter and completely unfeeling and arrogant prats though, and these are the ones I deem to be mentally 'handicapped'..their handicap being a seeming complete inability to care if they cause distress to others...


I learn *differently* from others, they learn *differently* from me, from each other...

You may learn through your ears, your eyes, your nose, your sense of touch...wherever and however your brain is wired up...

Helen Keller, for instance, would have been called 'mentally handicapped' by those I deem to be idiots, because she could not see hear or communicate, yet, by simply putting her hands on the vocal chords of Annie Sullivan, then tapping out her own words in reply, she was able to communicate with the entire world who recognised the brilliance, compassion and deep wisdom which lay inside Helen's black cave of an existance...and from her blackness she illuminated the world with so many colours of absolute beauty within her thoughts, her words...

She simply learned *differently*...and had she had the misfortune to have had an accountant for her teacher, or perhaps a 'carer in a day centre where the carer concerned deemed those she cared for 'mentally handicapped', poor Helen may have had to have spent her entire life locked inside that blackness...shut in a straitjacket with the words 'mentally handicapped' stamped across her forehead..............


"The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched. They must be felt within the heart." - Helen Keller

Helen felt everything in life. For her the mere whisper of the wind would have been absolute magic...She had immense knowledge, given to her by a woman who saw no handicap, just a brilliant mind, a wonderful Spirit deeply frustrated at no-one around her being able to understand her.

Annie Sullivan saw through to Helen's Soul....


Please stop being so bloody insulting to those who learn and think differently to you..and I thank God that I am 'different' in so many ways to the deeply insensitive and smug bastards I see around me in this world...some of whom are accountants and who appear to live only for profit and gain, sneering at those who do not want to live their life ruled by the penny....

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 08:34 AM

But that is the jargon I knew at the time and I will not change. It's no different from students being referred to as learners.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Will Fly
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 08:54 AM

But that is the jargon I knew at the time and I will not change.

Just about sums you up. The world moves on, but Bonzo is stuck in his own personal time warp, however naff it appears.

By the way, we never called students "learners" at the university I worked in - we called them "students". If you're going to try to make a point, do make it apposite. (Apposite, by the way, means being strikingly appropriate. It may be a difficult word for you to comprehend but it's a word many of us have learned at some point in time and, as you know, it's so difficult for us to change...)

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 10:26 AM

Anyway, all in all an excellent budget.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Stu
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 10:48 AM

"Speed Cameras will ALL disappear...."

I'm always a bit bedfuddled as to why people hate speed cameras so much. They are useful for controlling those tossers who love to hare around the country regardless. If you obey the law, you don't get caught. If you do, then tough shit, there's a limit there for a reason.

As for the budget, load of short-termist crap as usual from the toffs at No.11. They should have put 10p on the cost of petrol.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 10:54 AM

Not nearly enough on beer and cigarettes.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Stu
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 12:00 PM

Well, beer's fine left as it is as there are so many small breweries and pubs struggling, as for the fags I agree.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 02:57 PM

I wonder if we would have economic problems if we:-

1) legalised some drugs
2) started factories with secure jobs for people paying taxes on legally earned wages - manufacturing,packaging distributing, advertising, wholesaling and retailing a product many people want.
3) Got rid of many of the gangsters - got the police concentrating on the really dangerous bastards.
4) taxed the product.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: MikeL2
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 04:10 PM

<"Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: GUEST,Steamin' Willie - PM
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 06:26 AM

<"but every Tory & Lib Dem MP has been told to preface every statement / interview with "the mess the last lot left us in" and it is becoming tiresome hearing it. We have had almost a year of this government and indicators such as inflation, GDP etc have their effect in the figures now.)>"

Willy I couldn't agree more. !!!!!!!

They've all been brainwashed and programmed into an automatic reply to ant question posed that they don't know how to answer.

Cheers

MikeL2

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Octoman
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 04:18 PM

"people with a learning disability earning less than £2000 a year" - Come off it SPB Cooperator, that must be 0.0001% of the population. Pity Gordon isn't around to sort out his own mess, left to the Tories to get things real again.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Richie Black (misused acct, bad email)
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 05:09 PM

Alcohol should have been hit much harder. Private landlords should have faced a higher tax.

Over all it was an average budget . Northern Ireland cutting corporation tax from 28% to 12% the same as Irish Republic. It will cost the Northern Ireland economy 300 million, but it will see mainland UK companies transfer over there.

I am pleased to see the government has employed three private companies to observe those choosing to leech off the benefits system. They are paid on their successes. All of those on Incapacity benefit will have their claim re examined. Those on Disability Living Allowance will face tougher tests.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 06:08 PM

Yeah trust Mr Schwartz to kick a cripple. What a nice man (not).


I can see one good thing - caning the oil companies. But Bullingdon boy should have stopped the escape loopholes before sending in the ferret.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Richie Black (misused acct, bad email)
Date: 24 Mar 11 - 06:58 PM

Wow, that is amazing. Bridge appeared on this thread and I never said " Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice. Who called him ?

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 25 Mar 11 - 03:48 AM

You don't even seem to know the thrust of that part of the film plot, idiot.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: Richie Black (misused acct, bad email)
Date: 25 Mar 11 - 04:52 AM

Oh come on Hoff, you have to admit there is a significant resemblance to your good self.

Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice.

Subject: RE: BS: Excellent budget (UK)
From: GUEST,Steamin' Willie
Date: 25 Mar 11 - 09:26 AM

Beutlegeuse (as opposed to beetlejuice) has a large red florid face. Perhaps you are onto something? (red rather than yellow, as it is a cool star.)

Always fancied myself as a bit of a cool star, but despite the new Oakely shades, just can't seem to manage it. Keep getting called a folk singer when in the big society I prefer being a roots performer. Ah well.

Not too sure about hitting the landlords so much. Until wages catch up with property prices a bit more, (can't happen sadly) there will be a need for private housing available for rent. Despite what the indicators say, it is my larger detached properties that are never vacant. If you hit the landlords, we have less incentive to provide the service, and judging by the waiting lists our letting agents have, we appear to be in demand.

Alan Whittle reckons, with good cause, that manufacturing needs a boost. Too true, although you need to ensure customers, and for that you might need the government to keep cheap imports at bay. Import tariffs lead to others imposing them and the whole effect being counter productive, so how can you remain competitive?

Tell you what, get one of M'Unlearned friend's colleagues to advise on how to keep wage and entitlement costs down. You see, that's the problem with a global economy. You are competing with those who treat their workers in the way M'Unlearned friend and others reckon we do here. If we did, we'd be more competitive. But also, we'd be as bad as the doom mongers reckon we are, and that would never do.

Chin Chin