BS: George Zimmerman side of the story published.

Subject: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 11:58 AM

NPR article.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Bobert
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 01:28 PM

The operative word in the thread name is "story"...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Wesley S
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 01:40 PM

Now can we get Trayvon Martins side of the story? Oh - yeah.....

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: gnu
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 01:40 PM

Why is this stuff allowed to be released before trial?

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: GUEST,999
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 01:48 PM

I was just about to ask since when are prosecutors or defense teams allowed to use trial by media? They looking to have the verdict overturned on a tech? Talk about fucked up law.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Greg F.
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 03:47 PM

No, Bruce, talk about fucked up PEOPLE in general.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 04:52 PM

Zimmerman and his lawyers are not building credibility here, especially after the lies at the bond hearing.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 05:36 PM

What lies at the bond hearing?

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Don Firth
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 07:04 PM

Well, among other things:

When the story first broke, the news services published a copy of Zimmerman's mug shot. Other than looking surly, with the eyes of a dead fish, he looked intact.

Within a few days, and after Zimmerman claimed that he shot Martin in self -defense after being attacked by Martin (punched, and his head banged on the sidewalked), someone on his defense team published a badly photoshopped job on the same mug shot, making Zimmerman's fish-eyes look kind and friendly (I think they borrowed them from an old still of Mr. Rogers) and had lurid looking blood smeared on his face and forehead.

You mean the police wouldn't have at least given him a little first-aid before taking the mug shot?

Also, some elements of Zimmerman's story contradict each other.

In my opinion, Zimmerman is a self-appointed vigilante, he had a gun, and he wanted to use it. And a black teen-ager, on his way back from a neighborhood store where he bought a bag of candy, just happened to wander into his sights. "Aha! Ideal! Who'll ever question it!?"

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: gnu
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 08:18 PM

""Aha! Ideal! Who'll ever question it!?""

A jury? BTW, that's what I think might happen. It might go to court. He might be tried. The jurors might not have an opinion before they weigh the evidence. I think that's the way it's suppose to work, no? Innocent or guilty, I think that's the way it's suppose to work. Correct me if I am wrong.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: bobad
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 09:13 PM

That's exactly how it's SUPPOSED to work - see OJ Simpson trial.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Bobert
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 09:26 PM

Make no bones about it... Zimmerman has the full force of the NRA and ALEC behind him so anything that is put out there for public consumption is intended to bring a favorable verdict for Zimmerman...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: gnu
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 09:36 PM

I ain't judgin or takin sides until the trial is over and I have read the full transcript. Your mileage may vary.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Bobert
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 09:56 PM

I'm just hoping that we don't get another O.J. trial, gn-ze...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 10:45 PM

"What lies at the bond hearing?"

Zimmerman's wife said they had no money for bail. They had $100,000 in donations in a bank account. When the judge found out he put Zimmerman back in jail and raised the amount of the bond.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: GUEST,hg
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 10:47 PM

He's guilty of murder. The trial is about the "stand your ground law." A law that has kicked up the murder rate in Florida and thus increased crime statistics. It does not keep citizens safer, contrary to the rhetoric of the gun lobby (Marion Hammer) down the street from me.
love, harpgirl

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 10:56 PM

Thank you Jack. Has Zimmerman's wife been charged with perjury? If not, why not?

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 21 Jun 12 - 11:14 PM

No she wasn't .

The Zimmerman's claimed not to have understood the Judges questions. Maybe that is why?

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Don Firth
Date: 22 Jun 12 - 01:17 AM

Gnu, I said "In my opinion" and I underlined it for emphasis. In the exceedingly unlikely event that I would be called to be on the jury for this case, I would recuse myself.

There may be things of which I am not aware in this case. But it looks pretty clear to me. As I have mentioned on other threads about this, I know how SOME gun enthusiasts, especially some of those who insist on going armed at all times, tend to think and what their proclivities are.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Wesley S
Date: 22 Jun 12 - 08:34 AM

"I know how SOME gun enthusiasts, especially some of those who insist on going armed at all times, tend to think and what their proclivities are."

And in my opinion those folks are looking for a fight and hope they find it. In my entire life I've NEVER been in a situation where having a gun on me would have helped me or kept me safe. Those situations are more rare than hens teeth. Common sense and a good pair of feet will usually take care of any situation.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Arkie
Date: 22 Jun 12 - 09:37 AM

As for the Stand your Ground law, does it not also apply to T. Martin. While he may have been unknown to Zimmerman, he was visiting relatives in their own neighborhood. He had as much right to be where he was as did Zimmerman. Except, he did not have a gun.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 22 Jun 12 - 12:38 PM

I have to say. I find the story published by the Zimmermans to be unlikely.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Arkie
Date: 22 Jun 12 - 03:52 PM

I agree. For one thing it would be interesting to know how much time lapsed between the phone call and the shooting.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Neil D
Date: 23 Jun 12 - 02:05 AM

Actually, Shellie Zimmerman has been charged with perjury. Here is a Huffington Post article.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Jun 12 - 10:13 AM

Looks like they charged her last week. The transferred of $9999 and 9990 look very bad because the banks have to report $10,000 transactions. I guess the Zimmermans were not counting on being monitored.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: GUEST,999
Date: 23 Jun 12 - 12:27 PM

Neither of the Zimmermans look like the sharpest knives in the drawer. I think stupidity weighs heavily in this killing and the aftermath. Note I said killing and not murder. That will be established by the prosecution, or not.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Greg F.
Date: 23 Jun 12 - 01:51 PM

All things considered, Bruce, I think stupidity weighs heavily in most killings.

We need a statute to codify "criminal stupidy" as at least a misdemeanor, if not a felony.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Jun 12 - 01:55 PM

No kidding Greg.

How about this one?

Murder for Chinese food.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: gnu
Date: 23 Jun 12 - 02:01 PM

Don... point well made.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 23 Jun 12 - 10:43 PM

The way that the authorities back pedalled about bringing any case, and the fact that the defence are working overtime to try the case by Media, would suggest that, whatever the jury decides will be negated on appeal.

The defence will simply claim that after all the publicity there is no possibility of a fair trial, notwithstanding that they themselves are the authors of most of that publicity.

I'm afraid this case is going, as you might expect, to be just as dead and buried as the black kid with nothing more on his mind than a sweet tooth.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Bobert
Date: 23 Jun 12 - 10:54 PM

The bottom line here here remains the same: When Zimmerman called the police he was told to not leave his car and that the cops were on the way... He ignored their orders...

This is why Zimmerman should inevitably be convicted and get some serious time... 10-15 years

The wife??? Yeah, she perjured herself... Give her community service...

Will this happen???

No...

The NRA-O.J. factor will trump justice and the truth...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: GUEST,Guesr ftom Sanity
Date: 24 Jun 12 - 03:16 AM

Wait for the trial!....That way the EVIDENCE will be weighed, instead of your hatred and wishes, and prejudged nonsense.

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 24 Jun 12 - 12:13 PM

GfS,

If you don't like other people expressing their opinions, why bother reading them, let alone responding.

And you have a very objectionable habit of giving the rest of us orders.

I suggest you mind your manners, and leave us to mind our business.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Ebbie
Date: 24 Jun 12 - 12:56 PM

I echo that.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: ollaimh
Date: 24 Jun 12 - 12:57 PM

the guest from satanism can't even register on mudcat.

zimmer was told not to follow and not to leave his car. he should be convicted of something fro following and leaving the car.

martin was on the cell phone with his girl friend and that recording doesn'y show the conversation claimed by zimmerman.

on another thread the gun toters were discussed. yeah they are lookignf ro trouble. i travelled all over the usa with no weapon and never had a problam. i was carefull but in a middle class neighbourhood zimmerman did not need a carry with hand gun. he might make a case for in his house or even car but to carry it with him is looking for trouble.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: number 6
Date: 25 Jun 12 - 12:18 AM

I have to say I agree somewhat with GFS's post ... this whole thing is a tragedy ... I could say let the courts of justice determine the outcome ... but this whole thing is a mess fueled by racial emotions that have already pre-determined what the outcome will be ...if it was a black guy vs a black guy, or a white guy vs a white guy it would just be (sadly) another statistical killing.

Just more evidence of a dysfunctional society.

biLL ... just stating my opinion

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 25 Jun 12 - 01:18 AM

No. INHO Black or white there is still the "stand your ground BS."

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 25 Jun 12 - 02:01 AM

Thanks biLL...It's re-assuring to know, that there is still someone above lynch mob mentality still on Mudcat!

Peace!
GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: GUEST,999
Date: 25 Jun 12 - 07:58 AM

It doesn't matter what people on Mudcat thinks. It does matter what the jury concludes.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: GUEST,gillymor
Date: 25 Jun 12 - 02:46 PM

Zimmerman should probably be praying for a conviction because his life probably ain't worth a plug nickel on the outside unless he can raise enough money from the redneck-vigilante community to buy a small island in the South Pacific.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 25 Jun 12 - 03:12 PM

No one will bother with him one the trial is over. Though, no matter the result, it has put a damper on his dreams of being a cop.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: GUEST,gillymor
Date: 26 Jun 12 - 12:30 PM

I disagree,Jack. I have some African American friends and co-workers here in Florida and the consensus opinion seems to be that Zimmerman will recieve justice one way or another. I don't wish him any harm because I feel Karma will take care of him. I only hope he doesn't attain hero status (or martyrdom) amongst the gun-toting crowd.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 Jun 12 - 12:46 PM

hope he doesn't attain hero status ... amongst the gun-toting crowd.

Too late. He's already an NRA poster boy.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 26 Jun 12 - 01:03 PM

The NRA will find another poster boy, with less baggage ASAP. Maybe the African Americans you know are different from the ones I do. But the Zimmerman would be way, way down the retaliation list if they had one here.

They are more concerned with the way the local authorities handed the case and the way the new gun laws encouraged that.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 Jun 12 - 02:09 PM

No argument- and that's good old Florida for ya- somehow folks tend to forget that it is, and always WAS, a Deep South State. For a period at the turn of the 19th/20th century, believe it led the nation in lynchings. "Stand Your Ground" = Open Season On Minorities, no question.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 26 Jun 12 - 04:07 PM

Gillymoor: PMSL!

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: CET
Date: 26 Jun 12 - 04:19 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Bobert - PM
Date: 23 Jun 12 - 10:54 PM

The bottom line here here remains the same: When Zimmerman called the police he was told to not leave his car and that the cops were on the way... He ignored their orders...

This is why Zimmerman should inevitably be convicted and get some serious time... 10-15 years

The wife??? Yeah, she perjured herself... Give her community service...

Will this happen???

No...

The NRA-O.J. factor will trump justice and the truth...

B~

Bobert:

I have as much use for your opinion as anyone on Mudcat, which is saying a lot. I consider you to be one of the Mudcat grown ups. I also have as little use for GfS as most people here, but ... Your reasoning has some logic holes.

Zimmerman left the car - bad mistake but not illegal. It is no evidence at all that he went hunting for black guys. It says nothing about whether he feared for his life.

He was carrying a gun - he was allowed to do so.

You don't believe his story? Fair enough, you don't have to, but you are not a prosecutor, and even less a judge. It will be up to the prosecutor to prove that he was lying by the evidence and not by appealing to hatred of guns and liberal guilt for the many crimes committed by whites against blacks.

He's lied about his financial resources. The state has legal recourse for that, but it says nothing about the night that Martin died.

Don: you don't like orders? Try one from me. Wait for the damn trial.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 26 Jun 12 - 07:55 PM

""Though, no matter the result, it has put a damper on his dreams of being a cop.""

It strikes me that he would be exactly the sort of cop the Florida legislature would want.

""Don: you don't like orders? Try one from me. Wait for the damn trial.""

Question for you. When a jury of Southern redneck gun lovers acquit him, will you really be able to convince yourself that it was an honest and fair verdict, in spite of the facts:

1. The kid was seventeen.
2. He was armed with nothing more lethal than tea and candy.
3. Zimmerman was carrying a hand gun.

Now, I don't know what Americans consider life threatening, but I can't see me with a gun, being scared of a schoolboy throwing tea and skittles at me. Nor can I see any circumstances when merely poking the weapon into his ribs wouldn't make an unarmed youth back down without the need to fire. And if I were scared of him, I would not confront him, but stay in my vehicle and simply observe.

4. Zimmerman was told to let the police deal with it.
5. Zimmerman made the comment that "They always get away with it".

Who always get away with it? Black people!
Get away with what? Anything he imagines they might do, with the emphasis on "imagines"!

Any logical holes in that?


"Don: you don't like orders? Try one from me. Wait for the damn trial.""

So, who died and left you thinking you might be the boss? I will express my opinion when and where I choose.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 26 Jun 12 - 07:59 PM

One question: Who speaks for a dead black kid in Florida?

The authorities wouldn't even have arrested Zimmerman without the outcry their inaction caused.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Zimmerman side of the story published.
From: Bobert
Date: 26 Jun 12 - 08:13 PM

The lying about resources under oath and the code talk between Zimmerman and his wife have hurt his defense...

If, like some have suggested, ALEC and the NRA give up on him, he goes down...

If, however, they double down, then a good chance of an O.J. outcome... High priced attorneys win a lot of cases...

B~