BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 25 Jan 13 - 06:44 PM

Despite the fact that Chief Spence entered the fray with a poor game-plan, she has awakened many Canadians (and Americans) to the plight of Indians in Canada. I applaud her for that and have argued so on various newspaper sites--under my own name, ollaimh.

You ever have the balls to come see me, do that. My address is no secret.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 25 Jan 13 - 05:46 PM

wonderfly? GREAT new word! ;0)

Wonderful, of course....

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 25 Jan 13 - 01:52 PM

The media- and most Canadians- are tired of that woman and her fast.
No reserve has wasted more money than her reserve; last audit showed 60 percent not accounted for.

Some reserves have no resources to support their people; perhaps they should be consolidated, or at least have their finances controlled by government agencies.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 25 Jan 13 - 07:21 AM

Peering into the abyss of First Nations neglect-Ottawa Citizen

From APTP National News
notes taken by Assembly of First Nations staff during the meeting between Harper

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 25 Jan 13 - 06:45 AM

Sorry ollaimh, regardless of personal viewpoints on issues, or where you come from, posters have to "earn respect", it does not come for free.

IMO, your previous provocative statements,"frequent" lack of posting etiquette and basic "niceness" to some others on here negates any statements you make to defend like-thinking folks. I have an idea, to be taken seriously consider "practicing what you preach"?


Thought for the day:
"prejudice is prejudice, regarding of where it comes from"

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 25 Jan 13 - 05:53 AM

"but the rest of youn out there sat on your hands and voted for a 2 % sales tax reduction and the largest deficits in canadian history"

You have absolutely NO idea how I voted you sanctimonious prat.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: ollaimh
Date: 25 Jan 13 - 02:30 AM

the system of government for band councils imposes colonial "elected" native chiefs to get rid of traditional chiefs. traditional chiefs don't do what they are told by the government, while those imposed by the indian act usually do. especially since they are elected dictators rather than just one vote on council. with department of indian affiars spobsorship most ciiefs do what the government wants and have no effective limits on monetary abuse, that aghain serves the government as when a chief raises embarrasing issues then the government attacvks them for monetary inproprities that the goovernment set up in the first place. the band councils need a major over hai=ul in their constitutions but the federal governmant will not let that happen as they usually win in the game of otiing elected chiefs against traditional leader and creating corruption. the end game is losing because the supremem court of canada has again and again ruled in favour of native rights. they believe in the rule of law and can't keep up the inequality before the law forever. but its a slow process, as natives have to go to the supreme court every time to get rights. settlements almost never happen without a the highest court ruling. the fact that those ruling have almost always gone against the government sinc3 we extended legal rights to natives in the 1970's show that the canadian government has bargained in bad faith throughout.

they are stalling on the ultimate world wide conformation that this was genocide. each government want to leave that for the next. only paul martin was willing to bring in a comprehensive settlement, starting with the kelowna accord,and to fund that accord to the tune of six billion dollars and canadian voted against the only comprehensive attempt at justice in canadian history.

we can never tell out children we tried to solve these probblems. paul martin can say he tired but the rest of youn out there sat on your hands and voted for a 2 % sales tax reduction and the largest deficits in canadian history rather than fiscal responsibility and historic social justice.

the nit picking agains spence is just more mud slinging to cover up and spin that cnada is founded on genocidal injustice(like america and the uk)

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: ollaimh
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 11:06 PM

any thread that mentions north american natives brings out the racist attackers in droves. many even most claim to love their brothers, but you rarely see them go on the attack with personal insults and illogical comments except when natives get mentioned.

to this day the united states and canada remain among the wealthiest nations on earth with the ability to solve most problems of unequal access to education houseing and security for natives and they do nothing. but people never miss the opportunity to attack natives.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Sandy Mc Lean
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 11:03 PM

On Jan.8 I posted a comment about rabbit tracks. That is a truth that has held throughout this protest, as it has lacked focus from the start! It raised many legitimate issues but Chief Spence's stand leaves unanswered questions. Was it all to divert attention from scandal in her own administration? God knows that adject poverty on reservations is a national disgrace but how can chiefs and band councils absolve themselves of blame? How can chief Spence look to be in such good shape after a six week hunger strike? How much salary ( tax free) did Chief Spence earn while her people went cold and hungry?
I grew up in a community that was more than 50% native and I can relate to many whom I consider friends and I want to see them prosper, but I have trouble turning a blind eye to what I view as abuse as well.
I certainly don't have all, or even many of the answers, but I am a bit dismayed by folks from somewhere else who feel that they know it all!

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Charmion
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 09:05 PM

Canada has lots of Aboriginal lawyers. In fact, several law schools run special programs for First Nations students. Of course, they have to be qualified academically, which means that only the 1% of the 1% of Aboriginal youth get a look-in.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: gnu
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 09:03 PM

It means that I interpret those reults as saying that the movement was viewed by most of those polled as ineffective because the movement was viewed as futile against the man with the bigger gun and more lawyers. Which is the way all us have nots feel when we face the government alone. Guns are not an option in Canada (near as the general public knows). Lawyers are. Money and lawyers are best. They can have both and I wish they would get at it and get the job done... in a reasonable fashion. BOTH sides.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 08:46 PM

""First of all, ya can't point a gun at the man with a bigger gun. Secondly, ya can't threaten someone and then back down. Doesn't matter the reasons, it all goes to shit if ya can't or don't back it up.""

Je comprends pas,désolé, gnu

What does that have to do with a poll on Canadians views on the questions asked? I am puzzled? Please explain.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: gnu
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 08:35 PM

I uderstand those poll results, Ed but maybe with a different viewpoint than some. First of all, ya can't point a gun at the man with a bigger gun. Secondly, ya can't threaten someone and then back down. Doesn't matter the reasons, it all goes to shit if ya can't or don't back it up.

I PMd a lot with a number of Mudcatters about "all this" recently and in one of those PMs to one Mudcatter I pondered why there were not HUNDREDS of native lawyers. Indeed, free education surely should promote such? What natives need to enforce the treaties is LOTS of lawyers... not idle threats that have no chance of gaining anything more than media coverage, SOME sympathy from the general public that really do not know how natives have been so poorly treated for centuries and continue to be downtrodden by the "system" (yes, yet again, on BOTH sides) and evoke essentially lip service from the lackies of the big corporations when the idle threats are called.

I may take shit for that but that is the reality. Bravo to the whole works... for what it's worth. But it ain't gonna do SFA in the long run except gain a bit more the haves while the have nots get shafted on both sides.

Now, having said that, if all of this influenced the non-status rights case... YEEHAWWWW! But I still say, a shitload a good lawyers woulda won that one anyway. YMMV.

Why can't Canada turn out 100 native lawyers per year... fer a start?

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 07:03 PM

This, most certainly, has been made with Love!   


Idle No More - Bullet Proof

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Bob the Postman
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 10:27 AM

This article in yesterday's Calgary Herald tells a succinct story with many details of one example of Canada's failure to uphold its treaty obligations.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 09:24 AM

Uh, yep!

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Charmion
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 08:04 AM

Despite its name, the Vancouver Sun is not a Sun Media paper, but an ex-Southam paper now under the Post Media umbrella along with such august organs as the Ottawa Citizen. It retains its traditional centrist political orientation, with the occasional twitch to left or right depending on the prevailing wind of public opinion.

That said, I think Barbara Yaffe has a point.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 07:19 AM

Some folks don't like Sun publications. Fine with me. But, IMO, this article puts forward an interesting perspective on the current situation:

Barbara Yaffe:Canada's First Nations need to learn modern lobbying and stop alienating possible allies.

Lack of unity destroys aboriginal negotiating power

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 06:22 AM

Perspective-Comment on Spence - Jesse Kline: Declaration lets Spence save face, end protest after failing to secure meeting with PM and Governor General



National Post

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 05:27 AM

A recent poll, from the CBC we site on Canadian citizen's current views on the impact they see of of Spence's Hunger strike - only 17.8 per cent believing her hunger strike will advance the cause of aboriginal people.




From CBC

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 24 Jan 13 - 03:58 AM

Speaking the Truth at long last....

Theresa Spence and Raymond Robinson Testimonies

The Hunger Strike of Chief Spence has brought out the Racists BIGTIME and they have put a Spotlight NOT on her, but on THEMSELVES. She's put up with one helluva lot of shite and it's deeply upset her, but that's the way Crooked Governments move, by *neutralizing* those who dare to stand against them, or who look as if they could start a Revolution.

Sadly, Harper's lost this one, for The Revolution is now Unstoppable and never again will Indigenous People allow themselves to be bullied and treated so appallingly...

They've found themselves again, at long last...and Chief Spence has played a huge part in that.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 23 Jan 13 - 07:07 PM

Chief Spence to End Her Hunger Strike Tonight

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: gnu
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 07:09 PM

Ed... I will let our Native brothers answer that.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 07:05 PM

gnu,My observation is many are confused about what the Navigational Water Protection Act does, and never did.

Canada's Navigational Waters Protection act was never designed to protect the environment and had (has) zero provisions to do so to this very day - it was put in place "only" to protect navigation.

The only reason it had some impact on federal Environmental Assessments is because it often triggered a higher level assessment (with public input) for projects, when other focused environmental legislation (some also with archaic purpose) failed to trigger such a one. But, that does not mean the specific legislation that was designed to protect the environment was any stronger by this act.

Rather than "working against the existing grain" to repeal a piece of legislation that had no (or a marginal) impact on protecting the enviroment - would it not make more sense to strengthen the legislation that is directly designed to protect the environment? Or, an alternative approach may be to put new legislation that does a more focused (better) job?

I am puzzled as to why folks would take a non-direct and zig-zagged road to an end, versus a direct route that may have a more effective result.
This one beats me?

Some of the federal legislation directly designed to protect the enviroment include (but, this does not include them all) Fisheries Act (sections 33, 32 and 35), Canadian Environmental Assessment Act, Environmental Protection Act, Health Act, Species at risk Act.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: gnu
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 06:44 PM

It is difficult to gauge the Canadian public mood...

Not mine. I am fuckin pissed. I have written everyone in my governments and told them that the bill must be immediately repealed as it is an affront to OUR environment.

I live here too. Generations have. And I ain`t goin ``home``. I am home. Natives don`t own the land... WE do. The Natives and their brothers that built this country. Not the government... not the Crown. They have shown they do not represent WE.

ONCE more... will the pipeline be builtÉ Yes. Can we make sure it get`s built properlyÉ Yes. How do we do thatÉ Repeal the bullshit law.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 06:12 PM

dtg, the threats could move the centre and give a better negotiating base. That is if there is a vialbe centre remaining to negotiate with - I hope it will be so.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 05:55 PM

Thanks Ed - Much appreciated and always good to get the news first hand as it were. Pretty much what I thought. Aggresive action will always lead to aggresive reaction. Looks like it may be the same here but the division amongst the aboriginal peoples is not doing them any good. I hope you were right when you said that the threats may at least move the centre and give a better negotiating base but I sadly doubt it.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 02:23 PM

A fractured aboriginal leadership hurts its own grassroots:


Tim Harper-Star

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 02:03 PM

DTG, In a nutshell, my read on it:

Spence is still on a hunger strike. No end in sight, though some notable personalities have asked her to end it.

PM Harper met with the elected national chief of the Assembly of First Nations and some chiefs (all were invited to also attend). Spence did not attend, mainly (IMO) because the Governor General indicated he would not be attending. Some chiefs supported Spence and did not attend the meeting (others indicated thay were not attending because they did not like the location, format etc). What seems to have came out of the meeting is an agreement to meet again to work on some of the issues. No one knows where this will go?

Some see the non-attendance by some chiefs at the meeting as a division in the First Nations unity. Others see it differently, including an indication of reduced support for the elected leader of the Assemblay of First Nations.

Govenor general did get together with Spence and some First nations leaders. But, it was not a meeting to resolve issues, as requested by Spence.

There was a day of peaceful protest (and initiative to increase the public awareness of issies) today in various locations accross Canada.

Some First nations people threatened initiatives to impact economic interests, if progress is not achieved.

There have been threats of more agressive protests, if progress is not made. Others seem to be trying to keep it peaceful and legal to retain public support..

Considering the number of First nations groups and interests, huge geography, and that many others are involved for a variety of reaseons (some direct and some indirect) there are big differences on issues and approaches to resolve them.

A key demand of the protesters and chiefs is for the Canadian government to back down on changes to environmental oversight in two recent omnibus bills. A government spokesman recently said that there are no plans to reconsider this legislation.

It is difficult to gauge the Canadian public mood (especially since the various elements, positions, broad demands and interests are confusing and hard for many to get a handle on. IMO, most support better living and economic conditions for First nations peoples, yet are frustrated in little action from spending to date (by the federal government and some native governments).

But, as you note - many different, and often opposing perspectives in the media.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Charmion
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 01:50 PM

Shawn Atleo, the national chief of the Assembly of First Nations, has announced that his doctor has ordered him to take 10 days off to recover from exhaustion -- he's worn out from the round-the-clock talk and brinksmanship.
Harper and Atleo need each other by L. Ian MacDonald (Ottawa Citizen)

The Idle No More people are doing a "national day of action" with a blockade on the Canadian National Railway main line in Manitoba, demonstrations in Ottawa and other disturbances.
Idle No More protesters gather at busiest border crossing (CBC website)

Theresa Spence is still refusing solid food and, while some Aboriginal leaders -- notably Matthew Coon Come -- are asking her to stop, others are pleading with the Prime Minister to do what she wants.
Native women's leader pleads with Harper to meet Spence, end her protest by Heather Scoffield, Canadian Press (Ottawa Citizen)

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 12:42 PM

Anyone in the know got an update on what is actuialy going on? Been at it since before Chritmas now and the varous links being posted don't all agree :-( I would have thought with all the support for the Indians and the facebook pressure the Canadian government would have done something by now! A day is a long time in politics. This has been three weeks!

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 16 Jan 13 - 12:24 PM

Excellent Al Jazeera video on Idle No More and Stephen Harper

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 15 Jan 13 - 07:43 PM

BTP, Most governments (provincial, federal and even municipalities) have an arms-length auditor-general (or similar) and a process to openly expose such spending flaws to those paying the bills - so they can be objectively considered and (hopefully) rectified at some point in time - or, in one manner or another.

My recollection is that the federal government in power responds to the AG report on such problems identified, with a plan to rectify them. Can you identify such a process in the Attawapiskat situation you refer to?

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Bob the Postman
Date: 15 Jan 13 - 06:00 PM

Mind you, the auditor-general has seldom had a good word to say for the way the Feds handle our exchequer. The chief of Ottawapiskat may be less trustworthy than the chief of Attawapiskat.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: pdq
Date: 15 Jan 13 - 03:48 PM

Native people should have to account for money given them.

When Miss Spence was allowed to distribute $101,000,000 since 2007 and cannot account for 86% of it, why is she allowed to touch a single dollar more?

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 15 Jan 13 - 03:04 PM

From CBC:Michaëlle Jean says Theresa Spence should end hunger strike
'We have a Third World in Canada, and it's with our aboriginal peoples,' Jean says ""Jean agreed there have been some encouraging initiatives, but said she's hoping that a "real dialogue" will come to fruition. She said Canadians must to be more aware of the situation. Instead of waiting for people to start protesting in the streets, the public must be more proactive. "It's not an aboriginal issue, it's a Canadian issue," she said.

As for the Idle No More movement, Jean said she was discouraged to see the situation become so chaotic.""

Canada's Former GG weighs in


Commentary from National Post (""Sen. Patrick Brazeau was born in Maniwaki, Quebec, and is a member of the community of Kitigan Zibi. A champion of the rights of aboriginal peoples, he worked with the Congress of Aboriginal Peoples (CAP) from 2001. He was was elected National Chief in February 2006, and re-elected to a four-year term in November 2008"").


From National Post

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 15 Jan 13 - 01:03 PM

"A new documentary by renowned filmmaker Alanis Obomsawin, The People of the Kattawapiskak River, exposes the housing crisis faced by 1,700 Cree in Northern Ontario. The dire situation led Attawapiskat's band chief, Theresa Spence, to ask the Canadian Red Cross for help. With the Idle No More movement making front page headlines, this film provides background and context for one aspect of the growing crisis. This film will stream free of charge until Friday, January 18, 2013."

The People of the Kattawapiskak River

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 09:25 PM

I thought that may awaken your Irish genie, gnu:)

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: gnu
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 09:06 PM

Ed... red... Irish... Viking... Celt... now, there is a story about indigenous peoples trod upon. A thousand years old and as worth discussing as the story in this thread* but just saying that will get me in shit once again. Of course, I am used to it.

Scottei!

Slainte Mhath.

*Difference is, this thread is all about something that can be changed for the better TODAY. Too bad it gets bogged down in bullshit and granstanding by people who ain't got a fucking clue what they are yelling about and can't hear anyone else while they are yelling.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 03:44 PM

As to rust, red haired peoples, freckles and relationships (disfunctional or otherwise):

"In 999, the Viking king of Dublin, Sitric Silkenbeard, surrendered to Brian Boru. In 1014, High King Brian Boru of Munster defeated the allied army of the Vikings and the King of Leinster at Clontarf. Thus ends Ireland's Viking Era".

The Viking era ended in Ireland - (or did it?) No treaties were signed. But, the Viking "red" pumps in Irish veins. Viking "rust" never sleeps, in Ireland, or where the Irish roam.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 03:08 PM

Just remember, rust never sleeps.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: GUEST,Dabit Jij
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 02:48 PM

> what may seem to be rust from afar, may be a potent and reddish Viking or Irishman, on closer examination.

Don't ask me to examine that red thing close up. I was thinking about our disfunctional relationships and apparatus - not blanks.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 02:24 PM

""I worked with Freud in Vienna. We broke over the concept of penis envy. Freud felt that it should be limited to women"". Movie quote, Leonard Zelig: Movie, Zelig

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 12:09 PM

"rusting gonads"

Defective easy-bake ovens is just as likely as factor for consideration, as Xy's shooting blanks. Regardless, what may seem to be rust from afar, may be a potent and reddish Viking or Irishman, on closer examination.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: GUEST,Dabit Jij
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 11:19 AM

Looking at the Globe article…

Disregarding treaties with First Nations, telling them that we've destroyed you to the point that you are not important and that we will continue to overwhelm the remnants of your civilizations with immigrants now that we, aging Euro-descendants, have rusting gonads, appears to be closer to the problem than to an answer.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 07:51 AM

Other perspectives:


Hill Times

National Post


From the Globe and Mail (this paper does not link well)

Harper needs to stay the course in winter of native discontent JOHN IBBITSON

The Globe and Mail
Monday, Jan. 14 2013,

Public support for the Harper government in the weeks ahead will hinge on how well it handles the native protests that threaten to escalate this week.

Thus far, the Conservatives have gotten the big things right, by ignoring peaceful demonstrations and engaging with the responsible leadership in order to marginalize extremists. That is about what Canadians expect from their government at times like this.

The militant tendency within the native movement is vowing a day of action Wednesday that could block roads, bridges and rail lines in Ontario, Manitoba, Saskatchewan and elsewhere. There are other protests planned for Jan. 28, when Parliament resumes.

The opposition parties have already staked their ground: The native protests, they maintain, are rooted in centuries of injustice compounded by Conservative intransigence.

"It is not a comedy of errors but it's a tragedy of errors that we find ourselves in this situation today," Interim Liberal Leader Bob Rae maintained. Both the NDP and Liberals insist Mr. Harper must deal swiftly and substantively with native claims.

But public expectations are low. Last summer, Nanos Research and the Institute for Research on Public Policy produced a study that rated major issues by two criteria: how important a policy challenge was to the public, and how confident the public was that government could meet the challenge.

First nations issues ranked at the very bottom in both public importance and in public confidence that government could make things better.

While the Idle No More Movement and Chief Theresa Spence's hunger strike may have increased the importance of native issues for most Canadians, it is unlikely they are any more confident that anything can be done. Mr. Nanos described that attitude as a sense of "public-policy futility."

Of course the Harper government is, like all governments, most interested in keeping its own supporters onside. The Conservative coalition consists, in part, of rural voters in Ontario and voters in the West apart from downtown Vancouver. These voters tend to be impatient with native demands for greater control over land and resources.

The other part of the coalition consists of suburban immigrant voters in Ontario. Most of them come from places such as India, the Philippines and China, which also suffered colonial oppression. They are themselves the children of the dispossessed.

While they may empathize with native Canadians, most immigrant Canadians are willing, even eager, to integrate into Canadian society. It would hardly be surprising in that case if they had only limited empathy for native claims to land and sovereignty, and little sense of collective responsibility for the poverty on many reserves.

Remember: There are roughly 370,000 first nations living on reserves. About 250,000 immigrants, almost all from non-European societies, arrive in Canada every year. Time is not on the natives' side.

Mr. Harper also knows that he faces a divided opposition. Native leaders who are unhappy with National Chief Shawn Atleo's willingness to negotiate with the Harper government are challenging his leadership of the Assembly of First Nations.

Again, politically, this works to the Prime Minister's advantage. If Mr. Harper can demonstrate that he takes native demands seriously and that he can and will work with Mr. Atleo and the AFN, then there will be little public sympathy for the militants.

The wild card is anarchy. If the chiefs opposing Mr. Atleo and the Idle No More activists escalate their demonstrations to the point where there is risk of violence or serious economic disruption, then the federal government will have to be firm in enforcing the rule of law.

But that is exactly the moment at which events can spiral out of control: Oka; the Dudley George shooting. Then no one can predict what will happen.

Short of that, if the Harper government stays the current course, then the Conservative coalition of support should hold and the government should emerge from this winter of native discontent in reasonable shape – politically, at least.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Ed T
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 07:35 AM

Two different perspectives from topday's news:


Winnipeg Free press

Michael Harris

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 07:05 AM

That really is how to get back at them :-) Thanks for the link and the laugh, Dabit.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: Charmion
Date: 14 Jan 13 - 06:58 AM

Har, har, Dabit.

Yes indeed, the federal government flings money around like sailors on a Friday night on Barrington Street. Drunk sailors know what they're doing at some level and sober up eventually, however; governments, well, not so much.

Pot and kettle, pot and kettle.

Subject: RE: BS: Get Harper Out - Petition (Canada)
From: GUEST,Dabit Jij
Date: 13 Jan 13 - 10:51 PM

You might like this one, Charmion.