BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 11:41 AM

"You can run but you can't hide!"
Didn't understand this somewhat melodramatic tailpiece, by the way - a surfeit of Hollywood blockbusters, I suggest.
Should have stuck with the lampreys!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 11:27 AM

"And this has what to do exactly with the fact that Muslim extremism is funded and supported by Muslim countries?"
And where exactly has where Saudi draws its support have anything to do with the fact that is has the support of the West - including Britain?
The Muslim countries which you claim to be the main supporters of Saudi Arabia are in no way answerable to the British people - the elected British Government is.
The Government is selling weapons to and openly supporting terroist states in our name - obviously doesn't bother you - it does me.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:41 AM

You right-wing clowns have yet to respond to the fact that Cameron attended the funeral of the late King while a journalist was being flogged

And this has what to do exactly with the fact that Muslim extremism is funded and supported by Muslim countries?

You can run but you can't hide!

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:35 AM

I have responded to it, Jim. I am as appalled as you are. I don't think any relations should be maintained with a state with laws and practices like those of Saudi, whatever the diplo/economic consequences might be. You tend for some reason to denounce any views I express which in any way conform to your own as mere "lip-service"; I am still much exercised as to how you purport to know what is going on in my head. But, there, you are without doubt a genuine ❤-in-right-place-er, unlike some I could name - indeed, have named.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:22 AM

"What a crock of shit. Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Iran and Pakistan are the primary funders and supporters of Muslim extremists"
The Saudi regime enjoys the full support of the West - on the eve of the Arab Spring, Britain launched a massive arms fair to specifically sell arms to Saudi Arabia
You right-wing clowns have yet to respond to the fact that Cameron attended the funeral of the late King while a journalist was being flogged (1,000 lashes) for speaking out-of-turn.   
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:20 AM

Jim: I do not, as you know, agree with all [or even many] of your views; but I know absolutely that they are sincerely held and come from your deep convictions. They are in no way 'trendy' like the sort of attitudes summed up by that phrase which seems to have won some approval, 'virtue signalling', but a million miles from any such manifestation. It is, for once, by no means you with whom I find myself at odds at the moment.

Best
≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 09:47 AM

(Muslim only) extremism without taking on the fact they enjoy the power that they have largely thanks to the support they are given from the West.

What a crock of shit. Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Iran and Pakistan are the primary funders and supporters of Muslim extremists. But keep on grinding your ideological axe, it makes you look right stupid.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 09:16 AM

"the patronising nature of his trendy leftyism"
The trendy rightism displayed by you and yours seems to need to attack (Muslim only) extremism without taking on the fact they enjoy the power that they have largely thanks to the support they are given from the West.
Rather be a "leftie" - trendy or otherwise, than a right-wing hypocrite.
Will be interested to see whether China's now being welcomed into the fold makes any difference.
Nice cartoon in The Times this morning showing the Chinese visitors embarking on their journey for home via a staircase made up of Her Maj, (gawd bless 'er), Phil the Greek, Cameron and his toadies.
Tiananmen Square - must be some sort of a dance!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:57 AM

"virtue-signalling"

Bang spot on perfect term for a few of our predominately, but not exclusively, Brit posters.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:42 AM

"Why so nasty to MGM, Richard?" asked Al, 9 posts above.

I'll tell you why, Al, since he hasn't; & won't. It's because, ·#1·, he is a spiteful bit of work altogether -- just look at his overall attitude to any sort of opposition.; &, in particular, ·#2·, he knows that I see thru the patronising nature of his trendy leftyism. He doesn't give a bugger for equality, & the Rights·Of·Man & all that caper: he just thinks that being a middle-class lefty is a right-on earnest of ❤·in·right·placery -- what the excellent Rod Liddle in this week's Spectator sums up as "virtue-signalling". How many members of the working class does he actually number among his acquaintance, I wonder, as he pursues his uncontrovertably upper-to- upper-middle-class profession? And, as he doesn't like being seen thru, he goes on getting at me as a form of defensive aggression. As if I should give a flying one what he thinks of me anyhow -- especially since I have pretty well given up reading his boring posts at that.

That answer your question?

Best regards

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Oct 15 - 06:43 PM

Al, the letter is in the first post on this thread.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 19 Oct 15 - 11:55 AM

perhaps you had worms

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 19 Oct 15 - 10:38 AM

Oh, Steve, for the days when I was cadaverous. I was an exceptionally thin young man -- on my first wedding day in 1959 I weighed under 9 stone tho I am 6 ft tall. But I've filled out a bit over the years and hate to look at myself now. Bring back cadaverous!

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 08:53 PM

i haven't read the letter but as my father in law used to say theres more to be gained by licking than kicking.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 08:40 PM

"Mister" Myer's original letter, while expressing the view that a flogging would be inappropriate, seems calculated to reduce sympathy for the victim and to provide an excuse for the Sordid Arabians.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 07:29 PM

Oh, I dunno, Michael. Cadavers could be quite valuable. You'd just have to promise to lie down and keep very still, that's all... :-)

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 05:26 PM

Don't think you'd get very much for me....

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 05:12 PM

Well, I don't care how old he is.   I'm not necessarily agreeing that Michael shouldn't be flogged.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 02:04 PM

why so nasty to MGM Richard?

you might not agree with him, but we all agree the old man shouldn't be flogged, and at least he's written a letter. most people have done nothing to help him. i haven't.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 01:47 PM

☛〠☚

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 12:34 PM

"Self-righteous hypocrites" - no wonder "Mister" Myer so likes them!

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 08:31 AM

Arms is part of the support I have constantly been referring to - here and on other threads - as has been Cameron's attendance at the King's funeral while one of these barbaric floggings was taking place.
I cannot recall your ever responding to the link between these people and the British Government - happy to be corrected on that one.
Nor can I recall my referring to you in the way you say I did; if I did so, I apologise - I have never regarded you as a racist.
I stand by what I say of your opposition to Israel being as I described it - measurably short of what is actually happening there, compounded by your accusations of "Antisemitism" when I have outlined my own feelings toward Israel - which is both unfair ans Antisemitic by the definition you yourself raised (you may not realise that, but it is, to borrow your own choice of words).
Jackanapes yourself.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 08:15 AM

er....why aren't we all on the same side on this one? none of us want theold man flogged. do we?

anyway well done if they print your letter -they never print any that i send up.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 08:02 AM

The Saudi royalty are self righteous hypocrites who present the face of devout Islam to the outside world whilst boozing and whoring it up behind the walls of their royal palaces.

Wikileaks

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 07:50 AM

In Judaism likewise, of course, Tunesmith. And there is an ambivalence about it in Islam: wine is highly praised in the work of the famous "Persian mathematician, astronomer, philosopher, and poet, Omar Khayyam, who is widely considered to be one of the most influential scientists of all time... Born in Nishapur, in northeastern Iran also known as Persia, at a young age he moved to Samarkand and obtained his education there. Afterwards he moved to Bukhara and became established as one of the major mathematicians and astronomers of the Islamic Golden Age" Wikipedia.

He wrote the famous Rubaiyyat*, so memorably translated [or paraphrased] into English by Fitzgerald, chockful of the delights of "the grape".

So the views of thse Sharia-embracers, with their beheadings & stonings & floggings for possessing alcohol, are not even universal within their Faith.

≈M≈


*"a collection of Ruba'i (a form of Persian poetry") - Wiki

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 07:28 AM

Of course, this highlights the stupidity of religion!

In Christianity, alcohol (in the form of wine) is a central part of the religious service.

Indeed, Jesus undoubtedly had a few glasses at that wedding feast in Cana.

Stupid. Stupid. Stupid!

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 07:21 AM

...and if I haven't objected explicitly to the supply of "arms to those bastards", it's because that particular aspect of the topic has never come up in the particular part of it that I was addressing. But of course I object to it. What sort of cogent or coherent argument do you imagine yourself to be postulating in denouncing me for not having answered a question that nobody had asked me. You are trying to prove a negative, don't you realise, Jim?

Like I say -- 'confused'. "Where exactly am I confused?" you ask in pathetic defensive tones. Well, right there for a start.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 07:05 AM

"Can't remember ever denouncing you as a racist" ---

Forgotten, have you?, the time you accused me of having accused immigrants of "coming here to steal our jobs" when I had never made any such accusation or used that form of words -- so instead of apologising you fell back on some sort of peculiar formula like "well that was what came across emotionally from what I'd said even if I hadn't actually said it". Sorry, Jim, but that is the sort of accusation you do chuck about when you get emotionally involved -- the way you are doing here, with your "praising with faint damns": my damns [of Israel or Saudi!] are no fainter than yours, you over-emotional jackanapes!

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 05:57 AM

"When I have expressed such an opinion, your reaction as often as not has been to denounce me as a racist. Just look back at some of our numerous previous exchanges on this topic."
Can't remember ever denouncing you as a racist, I certainly discussed Keith's attack on British Pakistanis in those terms when you claimed his remarks weren't racist, but that was it.
I do find your Antisemitism in linking the behaviour of the Israeli regime with the Jewish People disturbing - but that had nothing to do with racism either - you're going to have to enlighten me on that one.   
Where have you ever condemned Cameron on his paying respects to the head of the Saudi regime while they were beating the shit out of a journalist - where do you condemn your government for their part in supporting that regime in relation to this topic - you were invited to and you declined-
The sale of arms - have you ever condemned the selling of arms to these bastards?
Your condemnation is somewhat like that of your approach to Israel - don't mention the massacres, condemn the pulling down of olive trees - it's called praising with faint damns.
Where exactly am I confused?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 05:36 AM

& you might as well save your precious breath, Ricarde Ponsibums. Have given up bothering even to read your fatuous selfregarding posts.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 05:18 AM

I am sorry, Jim, but you just haven't been listening. I have frequently expressed my disgust at our government's sycophantic attitude to that disgusting regime just because of its bloody oil. And I'll say it again any time you like.

Tho you seem to me to be a bit two-☹-edly singing simultaneously from two separate hymn sheets in this particular:— When I have expressed such an opinion, your reaction as often as not has been to denounce me as a racist. Just look back at some of our numerous previous exchanges on this topic.

Even you can't have it both ways, you know. I say again, Jim -- you seem to me to be one extremely confused party right now. And note that it was not me who asserted "Things always seem to go down hill when Jim arrives. He is self righteous to an an abnormal extent": I don't even agree with it — but you appear for some reason intent on demonstrating that there might be some truth in the assertion at that, don't you eh!!

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 05:08 AM

"Mister" Myer - you misrepresent your own words. Why am I not surprised? Look back at the original text of your silly letter. The Leveller's summary of you as "pompous and petty" is absolutely spot on.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 05:04 AM

"on what seemed to me a current issue of some concern -- why else?"
Yet you can't bring yourself around to condemning your Prime Minister for supporting regimes that adminiter the punishment you rightly bring to our notice and you become quite abusive to anybody who does - some ******* concern.
Excuse me if I belive you to be a hypocrite
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 04:58 AM

Liks I said -- a nice old

♨

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: theleveller
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 04:49 AM

"Greetings and Peace!"

I'll drink to that! ;)

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 04:46 AM

Why, Jim,I started the thread, as the one word at the end of my OP will reveal, to solicit, as it sez -

"Opinions?" -

on what seemed to me a current issue of some concern -- why else?

It seems to me to have developed thence into quite a worthwhile thread with various relevant issues and opinions being canvassed. The fact that you might not agree with all of the points raised and opinions expressed, Jim, doesn't seem to me worthy of your peculiar animus against it, and against those whose expressed opinions herein do not accord with your own.

Sorry Jim ··· as I remarked above, I genuinely don't know what you are on about:— what the basis of all your rage is here; why you should be so puzzled as to why I started the thread -- why does anyone ever start a thread except for motives as I rubricate above?

I honestly don't know what's come over you, Jim. You seem to me on this occasion to have seriously lost the plot... & I do not appear to be the only one who thinks so, do I?

Best to you as always just the same. I still like to hope that we have more in common over the history of, & our individual and several contributions to, the Revival &c, than we have contrary issues such as irreparably to sour our relationship. Let it be our endeavour to remain affable and civil, whatever...

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 04:09 AM

"Things always seem to go down hill when Jim arrives. He is self righteous to an an abnormal extent, "
I come to this forum to discuss subjects that interest me and on which I have opinions.
I have become a little tired of abusive people who come to these threads offering nothing but abusive comments - Lilo being a case in point (should have stuck to the beach job)
Whoever you are - you make no point of your own and no comments on what I have to say, just trolling from the sidelines - something you are very proud of I'm sure.
I've said what I believe - the response has been pretty pathetic so far - a retreat into the schoolyard in response to what I have said, after claiming that he didn't understand those points - (reminiscent of the "I'm no historian" and "I only believe it because somebody told me it was true and they are "experts"".
ow - let's have some of your "Jimbo·me·duckling... Aaahhh, is it all a poo-wold twosspatch coz Megan made it look so silly?" (Megan said nothing, by the way, she did promise to "tell you what I think of self important people who harangue others." -0 but failed to deliver, so how she managed to "made it look so silly" is a little beyond me.
Don't know why you started this thread Mike - it certainly wasn't to discuss the subject in any depth.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Oct 15 - 03:14 AM

Thanks, leveller/Pete. Glad to know you properly at last.

All sorts of people write to The Times, ya-kno -- it's quite an MOR journal, nicely poised between the extremities of Gdn & Tele IMO.

Steve -- As to fantasies of flinging shit at my windows -- You may talk tough; but I have a sort of gut instinct that, like me, for all the pugnacious flak one occasionally gets tempted into on this somewhat truculently-oriented forum, you are quite a nice·old·cup·of·tea at ·♥· really.

("Curses! — Discovered!!" you exclaim, twirling your moustachios and gnashing your teeth!)

Greetings and Peace! to Pete & Steve & all·our·readers --

〠≈Michael≈〠

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: LadyJean
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 11:02 PM

I had a friend who served in Desert Storm, who told me that he and his army buddies made prune juice into brandy. Nobody seemed to mind.

In college, I had to tell my friends that Muslims didn't drink alcohol. I had a hard time convincing them, since most of the Muslims at Ohio University did, and did it a lot.

The Saudi Government could have saved themselves a boatload of trouble if they'd just deported the old guy, quickly and quietly.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 09:22 PM

To think, Michael, if only I'd known. When I lived in Loughton I could have been up that M11 in half an hour chucking rotten eggs at your front window. Damn!

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: theleveller
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 08:00 PM

Sorry, that was me on my Kindle. If you really want to know who I am this is me:

https://www.facebook.com/pete.thompson.900

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 07:50 PM

Oh dear, sense of humour bypass, Michael? Now you're sounding like the type of right-wing reactionary who one expects to write to The Times. As a matter of consistency I post as theleveller ever since I inadvertently acquired that name back in the days if the beeb folk forum and people who got to know me in real life still call me that. You can, if you wish, call me Pete Thompson, from Wressle, East Riding of Yorkshire, so please descend from your high horse before you fall off and do yourself a mischief (you wouldn't want people think you'd been drinking, would you?).

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 07:09 PM

right on michael!

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 04:42 PM

No leveller -- I signed with my own name -- as I do on this forum [or at least a recognisable version of it so that everyone knows who I am]

unlike some I can think of on the forum, with silly names like "The One Who Knocks The Houses Down" or "The Man Who Does The Ironing" or "The Guy Who Evens Everything Up", cos they seem ashamed to let anyone know who they really are! Probably becoz so much of what they post is so all-fire bleeding silly...

MICHAEL GROSVENOR MYER

34 West End   
Haddenham
Cambridge

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 04:31 PM

Things always seem to go down hill when Jim arrives. He is self righteous to an an abnormal extent, put him on high ignore, best policy, I think.

I have empathy for him.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: theleveller
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 02:49 PM

What I want to know is, did you sign your letter Disgusted of Cheltenham, you quaint old-fashioned thing, you?

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 08:35 AM

what hard facts?

apparently i am taking the piss and i've taken sides.

thou speakest in riddles my friend.

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 08:25 AM

"N' wot's rocking your old boat today den, Jimbo·me·duckling.
Back to the schoolyard then Mike - as I said - beats responding to hard facts.
Puts all your compassion for the Saudi grandfather where it belongs, doesn't it - of no interest if it shows our betters in a bad light.
I do respect a man of principle and compassion!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 06:55 AM

'N' wot's rocking your old boat today den, Jimbo·me·duckling... Aaahhh, is it all a poo-wold twosspatch coz Megan made it look so silly?

Open mouth nice & wide now -- here's a luvly wigglyworm 4U

Subject: RE: BS: expatriate drinkers in Saudi
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 Oct 15 - 06:32 AM

"I am going down the garden to eat worms."
Beats responding to facts any day
Jim Carroll