BS: TRUMP [was: 'he's in the way of ME']

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 09 Apr 16 - 11:42 AM

Glad olddude chimed in on this thread; have noticed his posts on the deleted T***p threads, with his opinions of T***p-speak.

Fellow Mudcatters, if you want this thread not to be deleted, I fear you will have to calm down. Was it not the inflammatory posts that got those earlier threads put down?

I'm trying hard to think what to say to akenaton. Nothing wrong with asking questions, as per your earlier posts. Only, it seems like there ought to be a way to put the subject before the people to whom you direct the question, that is less provocative and more sympathetic?

Please consider the pressure that some of us are under, to conform and not rock the boat. Although I value the right to vote, and do so, I don't talk about whom I vote for or why. It would take a lot of unlearning on my part to break my silence, as it has been schooled into me. If that is cowardice, than I am a coward.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Apr 16 - 12:00 PM

T***p-speak.

That's T***p-Spew. Ditto Ru**o-Spew.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: CupOfTea
Date: 09 Apr 16 - 03:54 PM

Raggy,

Here is one American who fully endorses your right to an opinion on how a (Good Lord, please forbid) president Trump would be scary for the world as a whole. I thought the movement to have him banned from the UK was brilliant, though evidently not entirely possible. Having our first couple be a classic "Ugly American" with a second trophy wife ( with the only recently immigrated accent) would surely have diplomats the world around turning grey and living on antacids.

As America is slipping from the security of being the largest world power, handling that gracefully will be significant. A bully in the "bully pulpit" can make that a diplomatic horror. The dude is scary for thinking people of both major parties here, and *I* fear the popular tide of anti-intellectual sentiment may carry the day for him.

In Cleveland, there is an increasing bunker mentality, wondering what on earth are we going to have to deal with for the Republican convention, even more acutely, should you work downtown as I do. I wonder if there will be an uptick of the sort of declarations heard at other elections " if ______________ wins I'm moving to ______!!!"

I always did want to live in England...

Joanne in Siberia on the Heights
(seriously, it's April and I have 5 inches of very wet snow in the drive)

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Apr 16 - 06:36 PM

I always did want to live in England...

Should Trump win, there will be no place to hide, especially Great Britain.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Apr 16 - 07:22 PM

"Fellow Mudcatters, if you want this thread not to be deleted, I fear you will have to calm down. Was it not the inflammatory posts that got those earlier threads put down?

I'm trying hard to think what to say to akenaton. Nothing wrong with asking questions, as per your earlier posts. Only, it seems like there ought to be a way to put the subject before the people to whom you direct the question, that is less provocative and more sympathetic? "

Keep calm. Believe me, I've been there. Don't up the ante. You're too good.

Trump will not win. In fact, he's doing the world a big favour by keeping more credible GOP people out of the reckoning (which is saying very little indeed). Mrs Clinton is approximately the most uninspiring person on the planet. She is also very devious and dishonest. But she's the least likely person to get us into another useless war. She will do exactly what the world expects of a US president and she will have to put up with constant

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Apr 16 - 08:14 PM

Damn. Constant...? Heheh, dunno what happened to my post there, but I'll let you guess!

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: olddude
Date: 09 Apr 16 - 09:29 PM

Had lunch with her, she is certainly the most qualified and a friend. Bernie however is gaining steam but either of those two are better than any Republican running. Kasich is the most qualified Republican but apparently that is not what their party wants

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: akenaton
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 03:54 AM

Keberoxu...where the "liberal" left are concerned, I don't do sympathy.
They live in a Fairyland, in which they just love to talk about things like "change" and "egalitarianism"......yet when given the chance to actually do something they reject the Corbyns and the Sanders's........in favour of the Blairs and the Clintons.
As far as I can see, there is only one real choice available to the American people......Sanders or Clinton.....change or the status quo.

They are frauds, middle class well educated, comfortable frauds.

Just look at the attacks on social conservatives, or people of faith on these pages, perhaps you should try to promote a bit of empathy in the ranks of the "liberal" left

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 12:03 PM

either of those two are better than any Republican running.

Hell, Dan, a ham sandwich is better presidential material than any Republican running.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 12:55 PM

Ake, I wish you'd spend more time talking and fighting about politics in the UK and less about the US, where you are still clueless.

I don't know about that ham sandwich, Greg, but a should such a disaster as (shudder) President Trump happen, he would be impeached and indicted early in his first term, I'd put money on it.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 02:24 PM

well excuuuuuuuuuuse me...

my confusion, in my hopefulness I took the post questions to be "to me (and people like me who hold their tongues)". It appears the questions were not "to me" but "at them." I offered the word "sympathetic" and right away the questions stop and the name-calling starts. I can't even say which of the names has anything to do with my vote. That's me out of here.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 02:31 PM

Changed my mind again.

The OP started with Trump shooting his mouth off. But today...

Newspapers aren't my thing and I have not even seen today's Boston Globe (nearest megalopolis to me). But all I had to do was turn on the car radio, and the frigging news station thinks the Boston Globe headlines are news by themselves. A front page feature imagining Trump's presidency? Really? I'm not sure I even want to look.

It's like the media are competing to see who can be more embarrassing!

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 03:17 PM

No, I still haven't looked at the Boston Globe. Instead I looked at an online Associated Press article about today's issue of the Globe.

Seems this is the "Ideas" section of the Globe, whatever section that is, would not be the A-section up front. The articles on Trump in the "Ideas" section are said to be dated 9 April 2017, and the editorial comment is that they are "an exercise in taking [Trump] at his word."   

Still seems desperate for attention, this piece.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: akenaton
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 06:10 PM

"
well excuuuuuuuuuuse me...

my confusion, in my hopefulness I took the post questions to be "to me (and people like me who hold their tongues)". It appears the questions were not "to me" but "at them." I offered the word "sympathetic" and right away the questions stop and the name-calling starts. I can't even say which of the names has anything to do with my vote. That's me out of here."

I was going to ask what the above post means keberoxu, but I see you're "out of here".......if you come back perhaps you could explain.
My post in response to yours was an explanation of my impatience with left wing "liberal"......I have no idea what your personal politics are.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 06:28 PM

I should have kept my big mouth shut. I don't know what left wing liberal means anyway, so it wasn't about me, and wasn't my business in the first place.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 06:55 PM

"Ake, I wish you'd spend more time talking and fighting about politics in the UK and less about the US, where you are still clueless."

Oh cheers, Maggie. And what exactly have WE done to deserve him! 🙄

Keberoxu, akenaton has a long history of inanity, delusion and downright confusion in everything he posts about. There's always one, isn't there? Your best bet is to engage either not at all or just when you need recreation. That's what I do. "Left-wing liberal" may well mean something or other, but you can be damn sure that it doesn't mean whatever he thinks it does.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Jeri
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 07:58 PM

Left-wing liberals are people that reject the Sanderseses. Just a little bit of irony for us...

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 08:02 PM

Here in the UK we have a long history of thinking that anyone who calls themselves a "liberal" is actually a soft Tory. They may even wear sandals and munch nut cutlets.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: akenaton
Date: 11 Apr 16 - 03:03 AM

I think you all know exactly what I mean, it has been explained to you many times on these pages.
Without political change, the society you say you want will never be achieved
"Liberals" are more interested in "freedom to do unto others" than in any real changes in our society.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 11 Apr 16 - 10:23 AM

Here, Ake, Educate Yourself.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 11 Apr 16 - 10:27 AM

OR HERE AKE

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Joe_F
Date: 11 Apr 16 - 09:02 PM

I wonder if ME stands for mechanical engineering. If so, whoever it is will probably get run over.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: akenaton
Date: 12 Apr 16 - 01:20 PM

I'm certainly not promoting the Republicans Greg, .... don't know why you linked to that.......The point I'm making is that the real choice is for the Democratic candidacy. Either will beat Mr Trump easily so there is no excuse for the Left not to vote for Mr Sanders who can provide the change you all say you want......You know what Mrs Clinton is, today Mr Obama said that Libya was the "worst mistake of his presidency".......a mistake forced upon him by his Secretary of State.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 12 Apr 16 - 02:25 PM

[Libya]...a mistake forced upon him by his Secretary of State.

Nonsense.

Gee, Ake, and here I thought the Libya episode was a NATO operation. Imagine myy surprise to learn that it was concieved, planned, and carried out by Mrs. Clinton alone!

You know what Mrs Clinton is

Yes, indeed I do. But you don't.

Keep reading.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: akenaton
Date: 12 Apr 16 - 06:02 PM

Please address my point re Sanders/ Clinton, Greg.

Stop obfuscating.    Get a Grip!

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 12 Apr 16 - 08:57 PM

You HAVE no point, Ake, re: Sanders/Clinton. Nothing to be addressed.

Educate yourself.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 12 Apr 16 - 10:21 PM

Yes, we know what Mrs. Clinton is. She is an experienced politician, an experienced statesman, a talented attorney, and many things more. Positive things. She has more experience than any other candidate in the race, and has lived a life in service to others. She is not a liar, she is not ignoring important issues to benefit others, but she is having to make choices. And that galls some, who can't understand that a life in politics is about making choices, and trying to compromise to get the best outcomes. We're not crowning a king or queen, we're electing a president.

Sanders is in lala land, making promises and offering solutions he doesn't have a remote chance of achieving. He's the old white man running against the first truly qualified woman candidate, and is benefiting from those who don't understand how government works and want his policies to come true (we all do, but it ain't gonna happen with this congress), or who have been scared away from Hillary by female-averse pundits.

Now stop bashing Hillary when you simply don't know what you're talking about. From Bill Moyers, a Republican journalist:

The Media Have a Hillary Story and They're Sticking to It: The Clintons have always been fodder for the mainstream media scandal mill and this year's election is no different.

As the media have fired their blunderbusses at Donald Trump, trying to take down his candidacy — even as they benefit from the attention he brings them — you may have missed the whacks they've been taking at Clinton. She has been the media's national piñata for so long, and the criticisms of her are so familiar by now, they are embedded in our consciousness as presumptions of guilt.

Of course, the basic narrative is that she did this to herself because she is a bundle of character flaws. She is duplicitous and untrustworthy. She lies. She is a pawn of the rich and powerful. She feels entitled to do anything she damn pleases. That pretty much sums up the media take on Hillary, and that take is virtually unanimous, so much a given that practically no one in the media has bothered to give it a second thought. This isn't the "sorta know" journalism I referenced last week. This is "we-all-know" journalism.

Except we don't all know it, and neither does the press. I hold no brief for Hillary Clinton or anyone else in the race. In the electoral hurly-burly, it is the job of every candidate to hold brief for himself or herself, and the media's job to examine that brief. Indeed, preordained, unexamined ideas are just another way the media continue to fail the public, and when it comes to Hillary Clinton, the failure is spectacular. The media needle has been stuck in the same groove for two decades. And she is not getting a reboot. . . .

Whatever her faults, what really hurts Clinton may lie not so much in herself as in a post-modernist fault of the media. First, they set up a narrative — typically the sort of novelistic narrative that will give reporters traction with their readers. Then they keep pounding on it, over years, so that, in this particular case, they aren't really reporting on Hillary Clinton anymore, they are reporting on their version of Hillary Clinton. The more they report, they more invested they become in their version.

Read the rest at the link. Ake, you don't know anything about Hillary, you just know about the headlines and the media hype.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: akenaton
Date: 13 Apr 16 - 03:04 AM

Thanks for that fair summary of your views Acme, I agree the Media are foul creeps and go in for distortion, but I base my views on serious UK commentators and film footage of which I have viewed personally.

"The media needle has been stuck in the same groove for two decades. And she is not getting a reboot. . . "
It seems to me that Mrs Clinton has been stuck in the same groove for two decades.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Apr 16 - 09:01 AM

The media needle has been stuck in the same groove for two decades

As have you, Ake.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: akenaton
Date: 13 Apr 16 - 10:48 AM

:0)....I've been stuck in the same groove for over six decades Greg, trying to expose people like the Clintons and Mr Blair, LBJ, Mr Bush, Mr Heath, Mrs Thatcher and all the others who kept this stinking system on the road!

I think at last things are starting to move as Western Corporate Capitalism collapses......we have Mr Sanders and Mr Corbyn giving the electorate the chance to vote for a different way forward. You can take donkeys to water but can you encourage them to drink?

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 13 Apr 16 - 12:59 PM

You go, Bill Moyers!

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 13 Apr 16 - 01:03 PM

whoops.....I should have said, You go, Neal Gabler.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Apr 16 - 01:04 PM

You can take donkeys to water but can you encourage them to drink?

Absolutely correct.

And in this case, you are the donkey under discussion. And the answer is: apparently not.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 13 Apr 16 - 07:35 PM

Astrology only interests me when it is entertaining, and one fellow with a website, Michael Lutin, is nothing if not entertaining. He also copyrights his stuff. So:

the following quotes about the candidates are under copyright, 2016, to Michael Lutin.

Donald Trump, June 14, 1946
"In addition to adoring his natal Uranus rising just before the Sun --
the planet of madness, genius, and the uncontrollable urge to flip turtles on their backs just for fun --
he is deeply and sincerely fed up with the whole rotten system. President?
This Gemini would rather own a president than be one....
the eclipse in his eighth house is casting doubt on his sexuality, virility, and ability to perform.
Also, he is at the age when so many normal men hit the john seven times a night.
That could be what this whole thing has probably been about...."

No forecast whatever for John Kasich. Which in itself says something.

Bernie Sanders, September 8, 1941
"At fancy functions, Virgos are more comfortable out in the kitchen, hanging out with the help....When he goes all Einstein, however, he looks like a rabbi who's stumbled late into the wrong Bar Mitzvah....
If there's anything broken or screwed up, a Virgo is right there to help fix it -- and usually filling the air with an aroma of self-righteousness....
He's a dreamy idealist with down-to-earth belief in economics. And it's nice to see that at least one spirit from the '60's is alive and well. We have to hope that, at Woodstock, he didn't fall asleep under a tree [like Rip van Winkle]...."

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: akenaton
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 11:11 AM

You forgot the other one Keberoxu :0).

"• "The whole Congress-health care fiasco was a disaster, partly because Scorpios do lack subtlety when they have a goal."
• "Scorpios always have not only Plan B, but they usually have it figured out all the way up to Plan Z." [Ed: From now on, your Plan C is "Cry."]
• "In the end, foreign or domestic policies notwithstanding, Scorpio always turns out to be an issue of gender. "
• "When situations are dire, enterprises failing, businesses stalling, empires falling and extinction is right around the corner, Scorpios get turned on. Only they can walk right down into the Valley of the Lepers with bagels and cream cheese and think nothing of it."
• "It should come as no surprise that Hillary Clinton came out swinging after her defeat in Iowa. After all, it was in the stars: she is a Scorpio and Scorpio rules the instinct for survival. Scorpio also rules cockroaches. Did you ever try to spray or drown them? They can hold their breath and play dead until you walk out of the kitchen and turn out the light."

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: akenaton
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 11:14 AM

Copyright Michael Lutin....:0(

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 02:00 PM

Interesting Viewpoint

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 08:14 PM

The Michael Lutin quotes on Hillary Clinton still hold current even though they come from dispatches some time back. The following quotes, however, are from his latest release.

[copyright Michael Lutin 2016]
Hillary Clinton:....this year, Chiron and the south node of the moon are in her solar fifth house:
She's got deeper emotional vulnerability which you'll never know about,
mainly because when there's a job to be done or a mortal crisis,
Scorpios privately clutch their wounds and carry on.
But don't be fooled: it's business as usual.
She can get pretty scary when Saturn and Pluto kick in.
Then she can smile for the birdie, while at the back of her head,
she's making an indelible list of who's been nice and who's been naughty. [endquote]

There is one other candidate under the Michael Lutin spotlight now.
Ted Cruz: December 22, 1970
Here's something many people don't know: he's actually a pretty creative and sexy guy, especially where nobody can prove it.
In a moment of pure soul, he might go to a party and run around in a toga with nothing underneath.
Go easy on Ted, though, if he's a little spooked about spending money, especially his own.
He's got a case of starvation anxiety that's absolutely genetic. Capricorns are famous for expecting nuclear winter, drought, and famine. So although they don't usually have a great time in high school, they save their money, so that later in life they are the people you go to when society collapses.
He has conflict about his background: he can haul out the native dress when it suits him, but is easily embarrassed about family.
The present retrogrades of Mars and Saturn gives all the manic liberals their chance to sneak around behind him.
But: As a Capricorn, he's remarkably (and to some, unbearably) persistent.
Jupiter approaching the top of Cruz's solar astrological chart always denotes a major career opportunity. So Cruz doesn't have to go home anytime soon. [endquote, copyrighted]

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 15 Apr 16 - 05:15 PM

I do have one wee question.

"Bill Moyers, a Republican journalist."

It was LBJ's administration that Moyers was part of, when he was young and getting his feet under him, wasn't it?

Lyndon Johnson, a Republican? I was pretty young at the time, but even I recall it differently....

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 15 Apr 16 - 08:04 PM

Bill Moyers is a REAL journalist - possibly one of the last ones alive.

Dunno where that "Republican" crap came from- likely from a standard-issue brain-dead Republican.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 09:54 AM

Moyers is a moderate Republican, a dying breed.

That was back in the days when it was more commonplace to have members of both parties in the cabinet and around the president, to get balanced information. The last couple of Democratic presidents have continued to do so, but it is less common when there is less civility between the parties.

LBJ was interested in having the Texan Moyers work for him, probably less concerned about his party affiliation. :)

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: olddude
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 11:37 AM

Hillary is possibly the smartest person I know.
She is also the most caring. Unless you know her you cannot knowhow wwrong the bs about her is

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: JHW
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 11:54 AM

Meteora concert April 29 Scarborough ME

wtf is ME

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 12:13 PM

Moyers is a moderate Republican, a dying breed.

Rather, an EXTINCT breed. He WAS a moderate Republican with LBJ - today he'd readily disown the appelation, methinks.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: keberoxu
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 01:41 PM

JHW, you gave me a good laugh. He's in the way of Maine....

Seriously, though, this was well reported at the time. This was T***p waxing wroth with John Kasich, in public. For some reason, he could not say, "He's in my way."

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 04:50 PM

In recent years he has discussed this on his blog. I think he still considers himself a Republican.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 17 Apr 16 - 10:02 AM

I think he still considers himself a Republican.

HE may, but I don't. ;>)

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 17 Apr 16 - 10:08 AM

But you don't count. When he goes to the polling booth he enters the Republican primary. He probably votes independently as far as the general election, considering his opinions. There just aren't enough moderate Republicans to make a difference these days. He might as well switch, but perhaps he holds onto his party affiliation as a matter of principle.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 17 Apr 16 - 10:09 AM

JHW, you gave me a good laugh. He's in the way of Maine....

No, Paul LePage is in the way of Maine.

Subject: RE: BS: 'he's in the way of ME'
From: Greg F.
Date: 17 Apr 16 - 10:17 AM

perhaps he holds onto his party affiliation as a matter of principle.

That would be the antithesis of most everything he's stood for over the last quarter century.

And again: the "moderate"[sic] Republican is extinct.