BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Iains
Date: 31 May 17 - 04:51 AM

AND Clubs. Does not seem to pose a problem for seal hunters.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 31 May 17 - 04:32 AM

Nets, ferrets AND clubs? Seems a bit much.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 31 May 17 - 04:28 AM

a lot of hunters use nets and ferrets.
in fact there's a club for them on Portland.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Stu
Date: 30 May 17 - 12:54 PM

Thanks Raggy, never heard of one.

As for fishermen... one of the main objections they had to the reintroduction of beavers in Britain was the fact they would "eat all the fish".*





*I have no axe to grind with game or sea fishermen that eat their catch, indeed I've been game and sea fishing myself.. I love fly fishing (I was spectacularly unsuccessful, never took a single fish home). Coarse fishing I'm not is sure about, and sports fishing can damage the populations of large predatory fish such as sharks.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Iains
Date: 30 May 17 - 12:35 PM

How do you define humane?

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/food-and-drink/what-is-halal-meat-the-big-questions-about-religious-slaughter-answered-9

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 30 May 17 - 12:24 PM

"How do you about amateur fishermen Jim."
Always seemed a bit mindless to tear their insides out with a hook then throw them back to suffer
Apart from that.... no great objection if they're caught and killed instantly for food - though not something that turns me on
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 30 May 17 - 12:24 PM

Our village is right in the centre of many watery places, lakes, rivers and streams. So we get dozens of anglers. I can't accept a 'sport' where a cruel hook is cunningly inserted in an inedible fish's mouth and it's yanked ashore to die. If it's later returned to the water, it must be in agony. Fish do have a nervous system.

I don't object to eating various creatures if they are killed quickly and humanely, and not for some sadistic pleasure.
And I don't object to farmers controlling pests such as foxes etc if it's done instantly with no suffering.

If we could eat kangaroo, there would be a handy pouch one could stuff with sage-and-onion...

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 30 May 17 - 12:19 PM

A longish tale – but true
When I was a maintenance electrician for a brewery I worked with a mate in a pub in the South London sticks of Chessington
Halfway through one afternoon, may mate disappeared and eventually returned with a freshly slaughtered free range, chicken he had bought in a neighbouring farm
Being partial, I asked him to get me one – he promised he would on our next visit.
I forgot about it until I was reminded sharply a few weeks later.
In those days, I was terrified of the dentist and suffered badly for my stupidity with abscesses – one day, my kindly, elderly boss told me of a beautiful woman dentist practising locally – he referred to her as "the tooth-puller with the big boobies"
He persuaded me to visit her and I eventually agreed on the condition that she would 'knock me out' rather than give me a 'local'
This entailed Pat driving from work to get me up when the treatment was over.
I informed my mate that I would not be available an told him why (foolishly forgetting he was a practical joker)
As arranged, Pat picked me up, as arranged and dropped me off home, where I staggered up our three storey winging flight of stairs to our top flat and fell asleep in a chair
Some time later I was woken by the doorbell and staggered down the stairs to find nobody there, but a cardboard box on the step; I brought it in and closed the door.
When I opened the box a live chicken flew out and for the next hour ran up and down the stairs until finally I got it back in the box.
When Pat got home she demanded to know why there was chicken shit on every stair up to our flat
The chicken was given to our kindly ground-floor neighbours who gave it free run of the garden for the rest of its days
Never looked a chicken in the face since
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Raggytash
Date: 30 May 17 - 11:47 AM

How do you about amateur fishermen Jim. Personally I have no problem with killing animals as long as they are for consumption ...... and yes before anyone asks I have been in an abattoir.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 30 May 17 - 11:34 AM

"Ostrich or Kangeroo,"
Gorge beginning to rise steadily
As a lifelong meat eater I have occasionally toyed with vegetarianism but have failed miserably
Venison is forever a no-no, but the thought of adding more creatures to our death list fills me with horror.
Closest I ever got to joining the V set was on the opening night of BBC TV 4 when the first film they showed was 'The Animal Film' - a horrific peep into the dark world of animal-to-food slaughter - lasted about a week
More recently, the sight of a large lobster scuttling through a Lake Garda restaurant, having escaped the clutches of a cook who was intent on plunging it into a boiling pan of water nearly did the trick, but my hypocrisy got the better of me.
Too old to change now.
I must say I find the idea of amateur hunting to eat every bit as disgusting as fox hunting
Anybody who can afford a gun can afford a humanely slaughtered cut of meat
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Raggytash
Date: 30 May 17 - 11:30 AM

It's like a BIG darning needle, threaded with thin slithers of bacon fat which you stitch into a piece of meat to aid cooking. Every home should have one.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Stu
Date: 30 May 17 - 11:14 AM

Erm, what's a larding needle then?

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 May 17 - 10:46 AM

Kangaroo is OK but it can be a bit up and down...

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Raggytash
Date: 30 May 17 - 10:34 AM

Steve, have you tried Ostrich or Kangeroo, not an ounce of fat but the meat is superb

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Iains
Date: 30 May 17 - 07:28 AM

Moses Schallenberger survived on his own at 16 years of age at Donner Lake largely on a diet of fox. Supposedly he found it delicious.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 30 May 17 - 06:56 AM

Haha Greg, looking at my rather fat...er...nether regions, I think someone must have used a larding needle on me!

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 30 May 17 - 03:53 AM

"I'd be surprised if coexisting in this manner has not already at least been tried somewhere in the world...????"
It has - it's called "natural selection"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Greg F.
Date: 29 May 17 - 07:02 PM

That's what larding needles are for, Steve.   ;>)

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 29 May 17 - 06:07 PM

Give me a nice piece of grass-fed beef or free-range pork shoulder on the bone any day. Read my lips: meat needs fat.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 29 May 17 - 02:14 PM

They trialled the idea on Dartmoor ponies about 2 years ago. It's a broad stripe along the animal's flank which glows in the dark. You can see photos of them if you Google it.

I think it's a good idea, as motorists come across the ponies suddenly in the pitch dark and there are several sad accidents each year. Now they're using it for New Forest ponies.

Venison is ridiculously expensive. I saw some in a butcher's here in Norfolk and it was dearer than fillet steak. And many people don't know how to cook it.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 May 17 - 11:38 AM

I am now having visions of New Forest Ponies with glowing demonic designs on them wandering around at night frightening the local population. Like the Hound of the Baskervilles.

I like venison to but it is dead dear...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 29 May 17 - 10:02 AM

If I was a sheep / chicken farmer I'd be inclined to consider occasional losses to fox's a 'nature tax'...

maybe even try to devise a methodical way of sacrificing weak and old livestock
to appease & distract predators from taking healthier animals...???

I'd be surprised if coexisting in this manner has not already at least been tried somewhere in the world...????

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Stu
Date: 29 May 17 - 09:22 AM

"Would they attack lambs etc though?"

Possibly, although Lynx are deer specialists. I have to say that given that toffs and farmers appear to want to kill everything in the countryside this will be a problem, but I'm optimistic that one day everyone will grow up and we can find a way to compensate for losses or avoid them altogether.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 29 May 17 - 08:25 AM

Pterodactyls and T. Rex would sort everything out..

How far is the cloning project coming along...??? 🤔

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 29 May 17 - 08:22 AM

BEST WILDLIFE CARTOON EVER
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: gillymor
Date: 29 May 17 - 07:23 AM

Well, obviously you'd have to introduce Siberian Tigers to control the lynx population. Job done.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 29 May 17 - 07:16 AM

Beautiful creatures aren't they? Lovely tufty ears. Would they attack lambs etc though?

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Stu
Date: 29 May 17 - 07:15 AM

"Deer have few natural enemies, and they're getting far too numerous for comfort."

Reintroduce the Eurasian Lynx. Job done.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 29 May 17 - 07:04 AM

Haha Al! You might have thought you were having a weird vision!

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 May 17 - 06:55 AM

glad you've warned me - i live in Dorset and no one told me about the pony painting.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 29 May 17 - 04:28 AM

I saw the other day they've perfected a special high-viz 'paint' which they put on the underbellies/flanks of New Forest ponies. It makes them very visible in the dark. (big problems with these free-range ponies on the roads in that area) If only one could persuade deer to have their bellies painted too! (and silly pedestrians in black jackets walking along our pavement-less Norfolk roads at night)

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 29 May 17 - 04:21 AM

Sorry don't find anything particularly amusing about that Iains and its relevence to to slaughtering these creatures for pleasure escapes me totally.
Culling is debatable area by area, killing for 'sport' is simply a sadistic example of how man has not learned to share this planet with other creatures.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Iains
Date: 29 May 17 - 04:12 AM

Deer Crossings? Hilarious.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=CI8UPHMzZm8

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 28 May 17 - 04:53 PM

Quite agree gnu, it's barbaric. It was outlawed here in 2004, but Theresa May is saying she'll put it to the vote again.
As you rightly say, a quick humane shot with a rifle is the best way. Foxes must be controlled somehow. But not ripped to shreds by hounds followed by idiots in fancy dress on horseback.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: gnu
Date: 28 May 17 - 04:45 PM

I haven't read but several of the last comments so I fell infinitely qualified to put in my two cents.

Is this about rich people dressing up in fancy uniforms and mounting mighty steeds and blowing a bugle and casting the hounds to run down a fox and watching the hounds rip it to shreds? Because, if it is, what the fuck is wrong these violent assholes? What is wrong with your politicians? Why hasn't this been outlawed YEARS AGO?

The girls I goes wit' knocks a fox on sight wit' a rifle when a fox gets anywhere near the farm. Bang. Done. Fox didn't even know it was comin'. No cruelty. Just switchin' off a chicken killer. No pomp or circumstance and no cruel 'game' for the amusement of some seriously fucked up individuals.

You guys gotta vote on that? It's 2017 FFS!

I return you now to your regularly scheduled discussion. Sorry for the interruption. Carry on. Smoke 'em if ya got 'em.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 28 May 17 - 04:06 PM

I love seeing them too Al. One night we were coming home very late (for us!) from Bale (near Little Snoring), and were amazed at the sheer number of fallow deer zooming about all over the road. Literally dozens in the moonlight, darting in front of the car and even galloping alongside it, for the entire journey (about 10 miles).
We absolutely crawled home at a snail's pace, and luckily avoided hitting any of them. We were enchanted.

There were also lots of solitary muntjac around our last house.They have a strange 'bark', and don't seem to be as timid as fallow deer. One used to march past our patio doors in broad daylight (as did the huge orange fox I mentioned earlier) It's all go in Norfolk!

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 28 May 17 - 03:37 PM

you have to drive very slow in deer country - of course outsiders don't realise how slow. even then, its no guarantee.

i do love seeing deer.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 28 May 17 - 03:15 PM

Apparently Volvo in Australia are developing a kangaroo detection and avoidance radar system. Why could this not work for deer?

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 May 17 - 02:54 PM

Hit one in the Quantocks? Sounds bloody painful!

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 28 May 17 - 02:39 PM

I've had deer ticks bite me Al, probably from walking through long grass where the deer pass. They make a strange 'bullseye' red mark. Luckily I was given antibiotics immediately to prevent Lyme disease (prevalent here in Norfolk) which dealt with it.

The only venison I've cooked was in Scotland. (from a butcher)
I wouldn't touch 'roadkill'. But my husband sees it as a terrible waste of good protein.

We really will have to start culling deer, as they're becoming a huge problem.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: akenaton
Date: 28 May 17 - 01:57 PM

The only marks on my insurance schedule are through "deer hits", 've hit three in the last five years. They are a real hazard in this part of Scotland....a fatality involving a young girl of 18 just last week, hit the deer and swerved out into the path of oncoming traffic.
They have regular crossing points, so if one knows the road you at least have a chance to cut down speed.

The council here have started cutting back the scrub and undergrowth on the roadsides so that at night you can see the eyes of the deer sparkling in your headlights before they run across.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 28 May 17 - 01:45 PM

the deer are full of ticks that burrow into you. leave the dead ones by the roadside - buy your venison from a butcher.

i love seeing deer. its always a special day when i see one. they are so beautiful.

people drive at stupid speeds through deer country.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 May 17 - 12:55 PM

Care to speak to the point, Iains, or just more bloviation, BS & name calling?

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Iains
Date: 28 May 17 - 10:24 AM

GregF
Were I an idiot with an IQ of 0-25 I would not be capable of communicating by use of a computer. You however, being a moron (IQ 51-70), may be capable of limited communication and comprehension. This you amply demonstrate most times you post.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Greg F.
Date: 27 May 17 - 06:44 PM

Before babbling further perhaps you should check the Scottish and English legislation stipulating minimum calibre, minimum muzzle velocity, type of ammunition and weight of ammunition for culling the larger deer species.

I have done. However:

Before presenting yourself as an enitirely igniorant prat you might want to recall that we are talking about foxes the averige size of which is about 8 kg.

Idiot.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 27 May 17 - 04:45 PM

There are an estimated 1.5 million deer now in UK. We need to cull about half of these in order to protect habitats and other wildlife populations. Deer have few natural enemies, and they're getting far too numerous for comfort.
I like venison, it has a nice strong flavour, but needs slow cooking to make it tender.
My husband can't understand why I don't immediately stop the car and scoop up the corpse of a muntjac from the roadside. In Africa, any 'meat' at all is instantly conveyed to the pot. Protein is precious there!

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Iains
Date: 27 May 17 - 04:22 PM

Greg F
Before babbling further perhaps you should check the Scottish and English legislation stipulating minimum calibre, minimum muzzle velocity, type of ammunition and weight of ammunition for culling the larger deer species.
If you try very hard you might be able to post something positive one day and amaze us all.

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Greg F.
Date: 27 May 17 - 04:05 PM

one event involving a Highland cow,

Ach- past time we started huntin' heeland coos w' horses & dogs then!

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 27 May 17 - 03:33 PM

My uncle hit one with his transit van [probably the Quantocks..?]...

Plenty enough space in the back, and room in his freezer... 🙄

Subject: RE: BS: 'free vote' about fox hunting?
From: Senoufou
Date: 27 May 17 - 03:25 PM

According to the AA, there are on average 400 car occupants injured every year (figures released Jan 2017) in UK in collisions with deer, resulting in 20 human deaths. And 42,000 deer killed each year.

My sis in Scotland has attended at quite a few deer collisions when she was on call at night (Perthshire). Also, one event involving a Highland cow, whose horns shattered the windscreen and pierced the thorax of the unfortunate woman driver, who later died. Scottish red deer stags have huge antlers, and will attack people when in rut.

We see lots of muntjacs dead at the side of the road. And lots of fallow deer run across the road in herds, especially in autumn/winter.