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Orange song sound files on line
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Den Date: 31 Aug 00 - 10:37 PM Heres a recent story and its true incidently. In the little village where I was born in Northern Ireland the local people, in light of the peace process and hope for better days to come, decided that there should be a day to honour their village, the place where they all grew up and the home to generations of their families. Ballymartin is the name of the place by the way at the foot of the Mourne mountains. Anyway a committee was struck, comprising members of all religions, and they decided to have a parade and a village feit. Saint Joseph's pipe band was invited to play in the parade which they agreed to do and in order to keep things even the committee approached the local Orange Order to see if their flute band would parade aswell. They declined the offer to parade with a catholic band. Now it seems to me that in Drumcree the Orange Order were prepared to do anything in order to parade along a road. Now here were the good folks of Ballymartin giving them the chance and they turn it down. Its a funny old world. Den |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: catspaw49 Date: 31 Aug 00 - 11:00 PM Folks, don't misunderstand....Jacking with Conrad is no big deal...He's a jerk and most see that. He's well known around at other places. He will only leave when he feels like leaving.....He's not susceptible to shunning or the like. He's an experienced troll. In his case, do whatever because he won't care. However....As to discussions of NI, they are a part of this place and as Mick said, spirited debate is always acceptable.....but in the end, let's try to remain friends and agree to disagree while we all hope for peace in a place where there has been very little. Let's all leave as the friends we are and as we began. Except for Conrad who's just around......and a bigot. To hell with him. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Bud Savoie Date: 01 Sep 00 - 07:41 AM Spaw, spirited debate is not just acceptable--it's the life and spirit of Mudcat. I love the give-and-take and merciless needling, as long as it is done in the spirit of fun. Conrad and those of his ilk are not a whole lot of fun. And I apologize to Fionn if I misunderstood him (or is it "Fionna"?). I like Irish people of both colors, as long as they leave their shelelieghs [sp? Why can't the Irish spell things the way they're pronounced?] at home. And finally, that Ballymartin Orange pipe band is a bunch of idiots with no music in their souls. How many great jams would never have taken place if no one would jam with people of the "wrong" religion? Bud |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,Fibula Mattock Date: 01 Sep 00 - 08:25 AM Ballymartin! BALLYMARTIN! Massive thread creep, sorry. It's a small world... I used to go out with a fella from Ballymartin (I'm from a hole-in-the-hedge in County Down too) and although I'm still good mates with him I haven't been there in a while. Mind you, I'm off hiking across the Mournes tomorrow, from Rostrevor to Newcastle, so I might get a wee trip to Ballymartin yet. Thread creep ends! |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,Den at work Date: 01 Sep 00 - 01:22 PM You must be an adventurer Fibula to have heard of Ballymartin let alone have an ex beau ;-). What was his name if you can tell. Den |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: SINSULL Date: 01 Sep 00 - 02:03 PM I have heard of Ballymartin. Isn't it mentioned in the "Quiet Man"? Or in.... somebody help me. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,Den at work Date: 01 Sep 00 - 02:21 PM Don't think so Sinsull. Ballymartin is in the north of Ireland in south Co.Down about 30 miles from Belfast. The Quiet man was set in the Republic of Ireland. Den |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Peter K (Fionn) Date: 01 Sep 00 - 02:58 PM Rostrevor to Newcastle...via Ballymartin. Now that would be a decent day's walking, Fibula! Will you follow the wall to Windy Gap, or go the long way round along that marked route? Anyway, good luck - it'll be tough enough even without that Ballymartin detour. Bud (or is it Buddleia?) You're not the first to have voiced a doubt,arising from that nickname I foolishly gave myself. But getting back to the thread, yes I think you misunderstood. No problem. Thanks for explaining, Big Mick. Looks like that pint's on me. Peter Kirker (AKA Fionn for reasons long since lost in the Celtic mists) |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Amergin Date: 01 Sep 00 - 04:54 PM Fionn, I always thought you're name had to do with Fionn Mac Cumhail of the Fianna... |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Den Date: 01 Sep 00 - 06:50 PM I don't know Fionn I've done the Newcastle to Ballymartin (12 miles) many a time and under the weight of more than a pint or two, but back then there was always the after glow from the daliance with a pretty girl, ahhh youth, gone are the days. Anyway another 15 miles will bring you to beautiful Rostrevor. I wouldn't recommend cutting through the mountains thats a rather round about way. My name is carved into the granite in the windy gap by the way as is my mothers (her idea). Anyone notice how this thread has taken a turn towards the descent (sp). You see theres a whole other side to NI. Den |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Noreen Date: 01 Sep 00 - 07:00 PM The ascent of a thread to the decent! Good one Den- it's like a nice chat between friends, the trouble makers give up after a while. I'd love to be on the Mourne shore now...... Noreen |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Den Date: 01 Sep 00 - 07:10 PM Thank you Noreen, I knew I shouldn't have put that "s" in there. Ohh God girl you're right. Just for an evenings stroll between the Point and Ballykeel. Den |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,Unk Met-Det Date: 02 Sep 00 - 08:05 AM Hi Fib |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Big Mick Date: 02 Sep 00 - 11:00 AM I don't get all the confusion on Fionn's name. Of course he is a he. What the hell else would he be with a name like Fionn???...........................LOL. And Bud, what the heck's your problem with spelling shillelagh? Just sound it out. hahaha Great to see a potentially bad thread lift itself up like this. Mick |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Bud Savoie Date: 02 Sep 00 - 11:08 AM OK Mick here goes: shulaylee. Right? Maybe it's my Ne England accent getting in the way. By the way, my Irish and Scots friends tell me that Gaelic is an extremely difficult language to master, although I think it is one of the most beautiful I have heard. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Big Mick Date: 02 Sep 00 - 12:11 PM Well, Bud, that depends on which Gaelic language you refer to. The Irish language is known in English as simply "Irish". In Irish it is Gaeilge, which accounts for the confusion. Gaelic is a family of languages which includes Irish, Scots Gaelic (the only one in which it is proper to use the term Gaelic) and Manx. The other family of Celtic languages includes Welsh, Breton, and Cornish. Manx and Cornish, in their respective branches, are said to be extinct in that there are no communities that use them as their first language. But there are people in each of those area who are determined not to let the languages die. The thing I love about the language and dialects of my people is that it has so many more shades than English, especially as it is spoken in the US. It lends an incredible depth to the language. But it does make it difficult to study, especially with no other speakers about. I have always felt that if I became independently wealthy (fat chance for a union organizer/civil activist) I would pack up and move to one of the Gaeltacht areas so that I could immerse myself and resurrect the lost language skills of my youth. Mick |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Bud Savoie Date: 02 Sep 00 - 12:47 PM I know the feeling. I can speak Montrealese French, which is a type of patois nearly undecipherable to people who know European French. My 17-year-old dauaghter has just ensconced herself at McGill University in Montreal, where she is doing just what you mentioned: immersing herself in the language and culture. I often think that regional dialects are more interesting than the "standard" forms of languages. Hey, what happened to the Orange content of this thread? |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Jon Freeman Date: 02 Sep 00 - 03:34 PM Mick, I don't understand these things but I sometimes use http://www.yourdictionary.com/. They group Manx with Irish and Scots Gaelic in the subgroup Goidelic languages rather than grouping them with Welsh and Breton which they call Brythonic languages. Unfortunately, the site does not offer a Cornish dictionary. Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Jon Freeman Date: 02 Sep 00 - 04:36 PM Sorry Mick - I'll learn to read one day! Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Peter K (Fionn) Date: 02 Sep 00 - 06:06 PM Fib, you'll have to turn in a post-hike report after all this. I half hope Conrad might come back to see where we went with his thread.*BG* |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Jon Freeman Date: 02 Sep 00 - 07:09 PM Ffion, I think that one of the beauties of the Mudcat is that there are a number of people quite capable of rising above the crap and they can turn nasty threads in to fun threads, or sensible discussions. I doubt seeing where this thread has gone would make any difference to Conrad. As spaw said, he is an experienced troller and I would go as far as suggest a master at his "craft". I am pretty sure that while people take his bait (and there will always be newcomers who don't know him), he will carry on regardless. BTW, I did not state my viewpoint regarding the Orange songs earlier but I am in complete agreement with Mick. Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Noreen Date: 02 Sep 00 - 07:29 PM You see, Fionn, (and Mick), Jon made the same mistake- glad it's not just me! Ffion = welsh female name Fionn = not! Noreen |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Jon Freeman Date: 02 Sep 00 - 07:34 PM Oops - sorry Fionn and I do know you are a male. I live in Wales and am used to spelling it the Welsh female way! Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,yum yum Date: 02 Sep 00 - 09:36 PM Jon well sus'ed out! conrad is a folkie, he in my opinion was not out to start a row! Irish trad' ballads covers the whole spectrum, if we are to consider ourselves trad' folkies (whatever label you wish to place upon yourselves) it is all part of our past, no matter what way we look at our history. We can't change the past, we can live with it! Ballads tell us how others see history (looking back) as they see it.(from all angles) Irish Traditional music is LIVING MUSIC (so accept it and carry on) We can however form the future, by using the past as a yard stick.We can only get better. But what a past! The Irish have been abused by all ( most of all by our- selves )Do we not have the 'greatest'(for want of a better word) music in the world! come on, lets not fall out over something we cant change, by forming an alliance through music we can rise above the past. SHIT !!! I cant believe I've just written that. I have a black-bush just set in front of me, so Goodnight folkies, it's my birthday tomorrow ( so- folk u-all} Conrad I dont know your past, but I will be watching out for you in the future. You have the benefit of the doubt! SLAN yum yum. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,yum yum Date: 02 Sep 00 - 09:39 PM Sorry folks, I think I have seen the best of this bottle of Bush. Good night. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Jon Freeman Date: 02 Sep 00 - 09:45 PM Well yum yum, if you have had a bottle of Black Bush (or other Bushmills), I will forgive you everthything except not sharing it with me ;-) Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,yum yum Date: 02 Sep 00 - 10:08 PM Thanks Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Jon Freeman Date: 02 Sep 00 - 10:37 PM Well yum yum, I turn 40 on Wednesday so I will drink your health then although I think I will be going down the Scotch rather than the Irish route for my whisky and it will probably be a glass of Lagavulin - my favourite of all the whisk(e)ys I have ever tried. Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Lepus Rex Date: 03 Sep 00 - 01:19 AM Bud, my grandma spoke the French dialect you're talking about as her first language. Then she went to a French-Catholic school, and had to learn both Euro-French and English. (And was made to be ashamed of, and to deny, her Canadian heritage) Some time, I'd really like to learn French the way it's spoken over there in Quebec. Creep, creepy thread, creep! ---Lepus Rex |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,Philippa Date: 03 Sep 00 - 06:47 AM Now that you've nicely turned this thread into chat about oor charming wee Ulster, do you mind if I turn it back round again? It seems to me that Michael's reason for giving the odious links was misinterpreted. I think it was meant to be a comment on Conrad's links, that Michael thinks they are of the same ilk. He was trying to use a more oblique approach than Catspaw! Personally, I find the white supremicist links more offensive than the Orange ones. I looked up Michael's other contributions to the Cat and they are straight forward music. And I was surprised to hear that Conrad Bladey is a well known flamer, as I am familiar with his name as the contributor of countless Geordie lyrics to Mudcat. I tend to look at and participate in lyric threads more than in discussions and I don't have personal knowledge of Conrad's reputed darker side. I tried clicking on *Conrad Bladey # 1Peasant* in this thread and strangely got a notice that no records match this criteria. I don't quite agree with Annroi's comparison. There are Loyalist songs and Loyalist songs, but most of them would be closer to the rallying type of Irish Nationalist songs such as The Boys of the Old Brigade or Follow Me Up to Carlow than to Bonny Kells Water. for lots of Loyalist lyrics see the Ulster Orange Loyalist Songbook For an essay with songs, see < a href=http://www.leeds.ac.uk/music/DeptInfo/Staff/DGC/celtmus.htm>Celtic Minstrels and Orange Songsters by David Cooper (University of Leeds) also do a Mudcat forum search for "Loyalist" |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Quincy Date: 03 Sep 00 - 07:49 AM You're dead right Philippa! There are Loyalist's songs and Loyalist's songs...just the same as with nationalists and there is nothing whatsoever to be ashamed of in celebrating our heritage. Unfortunately, what sometimes starts with 'parodies' of songs can turn them into descriminatory and nasty.....as you say 'the rallying songs' I'm a Prod myself from a Belfast family and would no more want to sing about being 'up to my neck in Fenian blood' (Billy Boys) than I would sing rebel songs! I'm very proud of my heritage but I'm no fan of violence or the encouragement of it. I know the songs from both sides and have been at 'gatherings' where the singing of songs has led to people on the same side fighting with each other!!!! It's the alcohol content that had the biggest influence!! As for the 'tune' side of things....the truth is that if anyone stands in Belfast on the 12th of July or on the 15th of August for the Hibernians, the flute and accordian bands will be playing pretty much the same songs anyway cos it's only the words to them that are different!!!! best wishes, Yvonne |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Jon Freeman Date: 03 Sep 00 - 08:12 AM Phillippa, I don't think that the search likes "#" or maybe "*". A forum search for Conrad will work. Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,Fibula Mattock Date: 03 Sep 00 - 08:39 AM Post hike report as requested Fionn! It was a hike organised by the Outward Bound Association in NI - £10 to enter and it goes towards bursaries for outdoor pursuits etc. You could do a 10 mile or 20 mile treck (in a fit of madness I decided on 20). We walked from Rostrevor along the Ulster Way (which follows the road inland along the Rostrevor Forest) then on to Windy Gap, followed the wall up Slieve Moughanmore (steep!), down the other side and up Pigeon Rock Mountain, then through about a mile of rushes and bog to Spelga Dam. Spelga was the stop for the 10 mile hike. We had lunch and a sock change at Spelga then set off across Butter Mountain, along the Ulster Way by Fofanny Dam, followed the Mourne Wall to Trassey, walked down the Trassey Track and into Tollymore Forest Park, and then through Tollymore and into Newcastle, ending in Donard Park. I was in a group with my current Significant Other and a couple of friends from work. We walked it all in about 8.5 hours (that includes a half hour stop for lunch). They gave us a can of coke and a medal at the end! A medal! Last time I got a medal it was for runner up in the Slip Jig when I was about 10 years old. Anyway, it was a beautiful day. The sun shone the whole time, the company was great and there must have been about 300 people in all enjoying the spectacular scenery of the Mournes. It wasn't the most picturesque route to take, but it was great fun and a very enjoyable day. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,Fibula Mattock Date: 03 Sep 00 - 08:46 AM Den, the fella is a young man from Pat's Road (right down there by Ballykeel Bay) and he's about 26 years old now, but I don't want to post his name - he'd go spare if he found out I was discussing him on an internet forum! |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Bud Savoie Date: 03 Sep 00 - 09:17 AM C'mon, Fib, you weren't really in Ireland. Not when the weather was sunny the whole time. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Peter K (Fionn) Date: 03 Sep 00 - 05:06 PM That's a tough eight hours you did Fibula. Is the Ulster Way the route they follow (mostly along the wall) on the Mourne Walk? In fact does the Mourne Walk still happen? Last time I heard of it there was concern about the environmental impact. Anyway, glad the sun shone. You could go out on the Mournes ten or twenty times and not get a day like that. Constructive post, Phillipa, and I'm with you too, Quincy (Yvonne).I agree about the songs and I agree about Conrad - I too have yet to see the side of him that's earned him his reputation. Good links too - the second was quite thought provoking. Normally there would be a rush of gallant Mudcatters to repair a broken link - I'll not read too much into the slow response this time *BG* but here's that second link again, this time as a blue clicky I hope: Celtic Minstrels and Orange Songsters by David Cooper (Leeds University) Forgot to say Amergin, you're quite right about "Fionn" - what's lost in the Celtic mists is why I brought my nickname into this forum. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,JTT Date: 03 Sep 00 - 07:05 PM Thanks for the link, Conrad. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: dick greenhaus Date: 03 Sep 00 - 07:11 PM I've heard an Irishman described as someone with a thick head and a thin skin. The responses to Conrad's posting confirms this, I personally have no stake in either side, but I'm a bit furious at a concerted partisan effort to stifle the propagation of songs from 'tother side. This kind of knee-jerk political vituperation chased me off the IRTRAD list; I hope it doesn't chase me off Mudcat. However argumentative and vituperative Conrad Bladey may have been in the past, there was nothing in his post that warranted the kind of insulting ad-hominem response that resulted. Stifle it! If you don't like the political contents of posted songs, ignore them. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Quincy Date: 03 Sep 00 - 07:25 PM Fionn......great link!!!! Made very interesting reading. Dick, You've got a point there! I've just been looking back over previous threads from past months and there seems to be an awful lot of Nationalist/Republican songs.....Come out you black and tans etc. S'pose it should be evened out once in a while..*bg* Yvonne |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: GUEST,Paddy(1) Date: 03 Sep 00 - 07:27 PM For the benefit of those who want to know the correct pronunciation is 'shileala'
It is an actual place between Tinahealy and Tullow in the County of Wicklow in the Republic of Ireland
Nice pub/restaurant called Taylors and the village is picturesque
. . . and Conrad my opinion of you is lower than 'spaw's. Paddy(1) |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: catspaw49 Date: 03 Sep 00 - 07:36 PM This has nothing to do with the content of songs from either side or the middle.......Most involved in the NI debates only object generally to songs that still stress the deviseness of the situation. This has to do with Conrad. Ignore anything I have to say to him and ignore anything he has to say period. Conrad is an instrument of deviseness in both NI and the 'Cat. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Jon Freeman Date: 03 Sep 00 - 07:44 PM I can't say I have any worries about the songs. I remain unsure about Conrad's motives for posting that particular link. My wish for NI is for peace and personally, I don't consider a site publishing an article like this: http://www.orangenet.org/ethnic.htm particularily helpful. Jon |
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Subject: Predjudices From: Brendy Date: 03 Sep 00 - 07:54 PM "I've heard an Irishman described as someone with a thick head and a thin skin. The responses to Conrad's posting confirms this," Care to elaborate, Dick? B. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: dick greenhaus Date: 03 Sep 00 - 08:10 PM No problem. I've noticed that every time there's a post with an orange flavor, the common rules of courtesy vanish, in a flare of Republican hysteria. Not just on this site, either. The poting that started this thread, whatever the motives of the poster was basically nob-emotional and was a link to some music. Now go back and admire the next dozen or so posts to this thread. Case made. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Brendy Date: 03 Sep 00 - 08:12 PM Where's the Republican hysteria, Dick? B. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: paddymac Date: 03 Sep 00 - 09:04 PM There's a bit of humor to be found in song titles on occasion. For example; we do a tune called the "Dumore Lasses". One of our members went on-line looking for it and found several versions, each different, and each also known as either the "Fairies Hornpipe" or the "King of the Fairies". My personal favorite, which I would like to dedicate to Conrad, and three alternative names: "Dunmore Lasses - King of the Faeries - William of Orange". I have encountered sly references to his appetites in various readings, but this was the first time I ever encountered such a thing in tune titles. *BG* |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Brendy Date: 03 Sep 00 - 09:08 PM Ahhhhhhhh........!!!!! Velly intellesting....... B. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Bud Savoie Date: 03 Sep 00 - 09:34 PM Well, I haven't a drop of Irish blood (or whiskey) in me, and I find bigotry unpalatable, whether it's Orange, Green, white, or black. There are zillions of Ulster songs that are always worth a singing. I recall a woman from the Republic saying that it was a pity that so many of the great Irish songs seem to come from the North. She wasn't referring to songs of hatred, but to the kind that bring us together. Anyone who wants to spew intolerance can find websites devoted to it. Mudcat is not one of them. |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Den Date: 03 Sep 00 - 10:45 PM "I've heard an Irishman described as someone with a thick head and a thin skin". What are you some kind of fucking moron, making a comment like that. What are we cartoon characters to you. Grow the fuck up...or better still read. Den |
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Subject: RE: BS: ORANGE SONG SOUND FILES ON LINE From: Big Mick Date: 04 Sep 00 - 12:22 AM Dick, you know I think the world of you, but your post indicates that you didn't check Conrad's postings to this forum in the past. He is an accomplished flamer and troll who seems to get his gratification from starting a fight with bigoted posts and links to sites that if you would follow through them as Jon did, you would see that it isn't about the music. It is about promulgating the same crap that has gone on forever. He is isn't about music. The music is a vehicle for him to spread the same old crap. And most of the posts, with a couple of notable exceptions, indicated that all of the posters (Nationalist and Loyalist alike) felt that the legacy of the Orange music is important to preserve. If you were to do a check on my posts, you would find that about 2 years ago there was a post in one of the threads by me in which I believed that this was important music to preserve. I still feel that way. It is not what my family would sing, but it must be preserved. Mick |
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