Hilary Clinton

Subject: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST,Rumor Monger
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 01:59 PM

I heard that Hillary appeared on stage at one of the relief concerts in New York and was soundly booed. I was told that it was because of her behavior during Bush's speech in the wake of 9-11-01. There is supposed to have been at least one major op/ed piece on the topic. However, I have heard all this second hand. Does anyone know if there is anything to this?

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: wysiwyg
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 02:02 PM

Ain't It Awful?

BTW I think you'll find the true stories more easily if you spell her name right-- isn't it Hillary?

Oh yeah, and could you please use the BS: prefix on threads like this?

~Susan

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Wesley S
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 02:04 PM

Is there a reason why any of us should care one way or the other ??

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Wesley S
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 02:07 PM

Susan - my question was directed to the original poster of course. People who spend their time watching HC have WAY too much time on their hands - in my opinion.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST,Name Dropper
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 02:18 PM

You are very funny Rumor Monger---So funny that people want to know who you are--and they will--

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 04:00 PM

For your treatment on this thread Guest,Rumor Monger, I apologise. I also I don't usually care to discuss Hillary, but that is no reason to be rude.

She did kind of look concerned during the speech. Anyone who booed her for that wasn't showing a lot of class. Does anyone give another person the benefit of a doubt anymore?

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 04:26 PM

Actually, she looked kind of bored.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST,Rumor Monger
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 04:32 PM

Jack,

Thanks for apologizing on behalf of the boors. Since this is an honest question in regards to events at a MUSICAL event, I thought that I might get some straight scoop instead of smartass remarks. Perhaps there is still hope for some intelligent responses.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST,Rumor Monger
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 04:35 PM

I apologize for the multiple postings, I am new to the board (and haven't gotten much of a welcome) and am working out some bugs in terms of postings. I hope that this does not result in another spate of infantile comments.

---

Duplicates deleted. --JoeClone

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST,Name Dropper
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 05:06 PM

******

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Wesley S
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 05:18 PM

Rumor Monger - Please don't confuse a lack of interest in HC with a lack of interest in you. Welcome to the Mudcat. Tell us about yourself. Play any instruments? What kind of music do you like?

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: JedMarum
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 05:32 PM

HC has greatly angered a lot of NYC police and fire dept folks for a couple of reasons, the main one being her recent lambasting of the NYPD over the incident where an unarmed man was shot and killed when he pointed an object that looked like a gun at the arresting officers. Her remarks damning the incident were seen as damning ALL NYPD cops. She has also been resented by many of the NYC police and fire dept folks for 'cashing in' on the limelight of these events. Bill was likewise booed at the same event for that reason, but the boos were not so strong for Bill as for Mrs C.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: tremodt
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 06:31 PM

wether Bill was booed or not I bet most of the cops and firmen would rather have wc in agagin

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: DougR
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 07:15 PM

Wc? Water Closet? What's water closet got to do with it, ro1sin? >)

But I really doubt the statement if you are referring to Ole' Bill. National polls indicate otherwise by a large margin.

dougR

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: paddymac
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 09:46 PM

Hey, RM - Lots of people get up on the wrong side of the bed once in awhile, some perhaps more frequently than others. Best to just ignore them when they're having a snitty (no mispelling) day. You'll meet them again when they're in a better mood. Welcome aboard.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Margo
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 10:52 PM

Um, I thought that Hillary Clinton did look - well, bored during Bush's speech. I wondered what was up. But that's only my humble opinion. Margo

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: 53
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 11:01 PM

I THOUGHT SHE LOOKED BORED ALSO. BOB

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST,Lucius
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 12:03 AM

So now its unpatriotic to look bored?

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: DougR
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 12:22 AM

Nope, Lucius, but not very smart if you're a politician, evidently.

DougR

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Margo
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 12:27 AM

I found an article.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/printer-friendly.asp?ARTICLE_ID=25096

There must be more out there, going for a look. Margo

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Blackcatter
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 12:44 AM

First of all: Welcome to the Mudcat R.M. - Don't expect a great reception from the regulars around here - unless you start pissing people off - that get's you noticed really quickly.

I would recommend that if you have a desire to be liked here - following the basic rules would be a good start (not to imply that you are "breaking" them - my only note is to use "B.S." on a thread like this. Those Mudcatters who dislike B.S. on the board get upset when they feel that they have been "tricked" into viewing a B.S. thread.

Secondly - I was bored during Bush's speech - which is unusual, because most of the time I am incredulous about how poor of a public speaker the man is.

As for Hillary Clinton, I'm not much of a supporter of her either, but frankly, I'm not sure why it should be impolitic for a Democrat to show disinterest in a Republican? And by the way - maybe she was preoccupied with figuring out ways to help her constituents in NYC (Just a guess).

pax yall

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Margo
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 12:45 AM

Here's a page with links to other articles...

http://www.newsmax.com/hottopics/Sen._Hillary_Clinton.shtml

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 08:19 AM

I don't share a lot of people's animosity towards Hillary Clinton, but she really needs to work on her people skills. Image is important to a politician (duh!), and more often than not Hillary comes across as a condescending phony. During Bush's speech, she looked bored, distracted, chatting with the people around her at all the wrong times, etc. Let's remember, this was not a speech to defend a tax rebate or a Social Security lock-box; this was the equivalent of FDR's Day of Infamy speech, and any politician, from whatever party, should know enough about the business of politicking to look like she's taking it seriously. People love to hate Hillary, and she keeps handing them more reasons to do so. It surprises me that she can be so smart, yet so oblivious.

The concert was an interesting clash of personal styles, with celebrities and drunken police/firefighters jockeying for position in front of the mikes. I don't blame the cops and firefighters for indulging -- God knows they needed to blow off a little steam after all they've been through -- but if they were professional musicians, actors or politicians they would have known that getting plastered and stepping in front of a microphone is not a great idea. It doesn't surprise me that they directed some hostility towards Hillary; I'm sure most of them can't relate to her at all.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: kendall
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 09:11 AM

Why shouldn't she be bored? She was not the only one! I wonder if this country will ever be ready for an intelligent, assertive woman in a position of leadership? What was the object the guy "Pointed" at the cops? Is this the case of the guy who had his wallet in his hand and they shot him 75 times?

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 09:43 AM

I can't imagine an intelligent Senator being bored with Bush's speech. Agree with him or not, any thinking person would recognize that this was a serious moment, and that our actions now will have profound consequences for many years to come, so you damn well ought to pay attention. Moreover, any astute politician should know that, even if she is bored or disinterested, she should not make it so obvious to everyone. Ideology aside, I consider Hillary's cluelessness about the image she projects to be one of her greatest failings. And after all these years, she still hasn't figured it out.

Yes, the object was a wallet.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: JedMarum
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 09:51 AM

I thought HC's obvious irritation and disdain for Bush's speech was juvenile, at best - it was certainly the wrong place/time to behave that way ... but then I am not a Hillary fan anyway. Whether or not the NYPD and Fire dept folks found that as a single reason for their dislike - I cannot judge.

You're right Kendall, the incident that I had heard was to blame for the NYPD dislike of Hillary was the one where the guy who "pulled his wallet" on the cops was shot 75 times. Hillary's public condemnation of the NYPD was made before any investigation/trial could take place - the incident may well have been as gross a violation, as the headlines make it sound, but the cops involved, and the NYPD felt they deserved their day-in-court just like any other US citizen ... and should not be subject to public judgements by their public officer holders, prior to a trial. This I think is the biggest issue the NYPD has with HC.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: JedMarum
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 10:06 AM

... and by the way, I think the NYPD shooting incident DOES sound like a gross violation - or at least a major screw up. But that is why we have investigations, reviews, courts, trials, juries.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: SharonA
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 10:22 AM

Welcome, Rumor Monger. Sorry that things have gotten off on the wrong foot for you here; I'm sure you'll have better luck when you're not talking about a woman people love to hate. Still waiting to hear you tell us about yourself and the music you like to hear and, perhaps, play.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: DougR
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 11:59 AM

There you go again, Kendall! Kowtowing to the women. :>)

DougR

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Kim C
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 12:09 PM

I still don't understand why the people of New York would elect to represent them, someone who didn't even LIVE there until she decided she was going to run for office. Was the other choice that bad? Maybe some New Yorkers can enlighten me on this. I have always perceived New Yorkers as sort of a tight-knit bunch, so it surprised me when an outsider was elected.

There were some things about her being booed in the Drudge Report last week.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Troll
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 12:20 PM

Kendall,

so she's an intelligent, assertive woman. Does this mean that she cannot also be a sleazy, self-serving, totally insincere, liar who will say whatever is expedient at the moment with no regard to truth or consistancy?

For example, when she was running for office, she "discovered" the Yankees and became a born-again Yankees fan. At least that's what she told the crowds in NYC.

She has never attended a game. Not one game. Some fan.

And she won't go to the World Series either because "congress will be in session".

That I could maybe give her if she has important bills coming up for a vote but I rather doubt that's the case. It's more likely that she wouldn't be caught dead in a ball park where she couldn't network with Important pols.

There'll be time enough to romance the voters later on when she needs the votes again.

troll

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 12:48 PM

Is it not pssible that the night before the speech,being the senator form NY,she up up with planning and decision making re: this momentous event which struck her state? Could she not simply have been stressed and tired?? I'm sure the general content of Bush's speech was not news to her. I have seen her on many programs since 9/11 and she has always and ardently supported Bush's actions and handling of this attack. If she were to attend a game wouldn't she be critized for not working? Sheesh, I'd hate to have some of these judgemental people on a jury.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Troll
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 12:58 PM

Of course she's going to support Bush on a one-on-one show.
DUH!
The speech was not a case where the camera was on Her. A lot of people were stressed out and tired that night including, I'm sure, President Bush. She was alert enough to chat with others before the President began speaking.
Her constituents in NYC wouldn't think she was slacking if she took in a game. I think that they are aware of how much work is involved in her job. Don't sell people short.
Judgemental goes both ways. There are those who think that Hillary can do no wrong, too.

troll

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: DougR
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 01:12 PM

I suspect it would help her with NY voters (in the city anyway) if she did attend a game. I'm a bit surprised she hasn't been advised to do that. The cameras would be on her from time to time, you can bet on that. It might call for a better acting job, though, than she is capable of. She would have to look like she was having a good time for it to work to her advantage.

DougR

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST,MandolinMike
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 01:50 PM

If you are going to judge people by the expressions they have on their faces, what about our President? He can't go for more than about fifteen seconds without making a goofy face--Hasn't done anything goofy, though, and that is what counts--To take it back to music, have you ever noticed the goofy faces that bluegrass pickers make? They all shove their heads down, squint, and then try to smile at the audience with one eye on the fingerboard--That's why I don't practice in front of the mirror--

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST,I luv HRC
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 02:10 PM

Lay off Hilary she has had a tough time. She has had to act like she's got some degree of pride and self-respect even though her husband has tried to nail everything in a skirt but her over the last two decades. And she has a right to roll her eyes and offer only "golf claps" during Bush's speech if she wants. What's the big deal? You people are just jellous because she got elected to a bigtime office by people who did not even know that she isn't from New york. And she is a lot better looking than bushes wife who looks like she spent 8 million bucks on plastic surgury. Go eat some sour grapes and crowes.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: DougR
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 03:15 PM

So, how's been your day Chelsea?

DougR

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: kendall
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 03:30 PM

I kowtow to the women? HHmm, never thought of treating them as equals would be seen as Kowtowing. Kim C, they elected her because she is a democrat, and her opponent came across as a snot. As for being a carpet bagger, Robert Kennedy did it, and so did Dick Cheney. Troll, show me a politician who does not lie. And, what would you say if she went to a ball game instead of doing her job in the Senate? Come on you guys, admit it! she is a woman and cant win with conservatives. Guest, I disagree, Laura Bush is prettier, and, she knows her place. Republican women learn that at an early stage. Just for the record, I am not a big Hillary fan, but, I am an "Equal in all things fan" You may fire when ready, Gridley!! hehehe

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 04:04 PM

Right on, Kendall.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: kendall
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 04:07 PM

Well, geez, I was all loaded for a broadside!

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Greg F.
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 04:26 PM

While it might have been impolitic on Senator Clinton's part to show it- although many others in the audience looked equally unimpresses- Dumbya's speech was, well, boring. And inane.

Do we really want to judge senators on the basis of what sports team they support, or if they support one, or if they go to matches? Jesus, folks, grow up.

So the cops in NYC wanted their day in court- uh, you mean like both the Clinton's should have had before they were crucified by right-wing politicians and the gutter press over and over during his presidency with charges that were demonstrably false??

There are a certain group of folks that simply have an irrational hatred of the woman and simply start foaming at the mouth at the mere mention of her name. They need professional help.

You trying to maintain, Troll, that Senator Clinton is the only politician who lies, is self-serving, is insincere, or a champion of expediency? Christ, I thought those qualities were job requirements for all of 'em. Look at [sm]Armey or DeLay for instance!

Best, Greg

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Steve in Idaho
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 04:46 PM

Mandolin Mike - If I look at my fingerboard I mess up - but my wife cracks up at me because I get this "Wierd look on my face." Says it's like I'm trying to suck my teeth into my lips or something! At least I don't talk to myself at the same time - I'd really be in trouble!

RM - join up, enter the fray, be spectacular - I also am curious as to what you play, what type of music you like, a bit about the music side of you!

Steve

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Kim C
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 05:06 PM

Kendall, my husband says that Fire when ready Gridley thing. :-) He told me who Gridley was but now of course I can't remember.

The thing about Hillary is this... it's the thing about most women who say what's on their mind... some people are intimidated by her because she won't be bullied. Now, I'm all for people who won't be bullied. There don't seem to be quite enough of them. However, she has never come across as a personable individual, at least to me, anyway. She doesn't seem like someone I could be friends with, and it doesn't have anything to do with her Democratness. She just rubs me the wrong way, is all.

Laura Bush and Tipper Gore are both welcome to tea at my house anytime.

Now, that being said, I generally do believe it is rude behavior to boo someone. Maybe the people who did it felt like they had a good reason, but free speech is no excuse for poor manners.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: DougR
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 08:54 PM

Okey dokie, Greg F., give me an example of Delay and Armey telling a lie.

DougR

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: kendall
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 08:57 PM

I judge a politician on his/her politics. Not on their personality. Remember when George the first looked at his watch during the debates? He was roundly pounded for that. These people are under a microscope all the time, and, democrat or republican, they all have ememies who want them to fall. HC may be a witch, but, she's OUR witch! I'm just glad I dont have to sleep with her.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Greg F.
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 09:23 PM

Absolutely no point, Doug.

Anything that doesn't fit into the naive, self-satisfied, comfortable fantasy world you've created for yourself or that conflicts with your carefully crafted 'reality' you'd simply label as the opinion of a biased observer and disregard, without- as you've repeatedly stated- feeling the need to consult factual material of any sort or to educate yourself about the point under discussion.

I'm not about to play your game any longer- save it to suck in the un-initiated.

Best, Greg

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: kendall
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 09:34 PM

I'll give you an example Doug, but, I know you will find something wrong with it. As you must know, there is a bil in congress to make the security people at airports government employees. The republicans are holding it up, because, they want them to be civilian employees. Well, guess what? they ARE civilians, and they work for minimum wage, and some of them have been exposed as convicted felons! Armey stated on TV, that the reason the democrats want them to be Federal employees is because they would have to belong to a union that makes donations to the democrat party! What a crock! I worked for the govt. for many years, and I didnt belong to any union.

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Greg F.
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 09:40 PM

Kim-

The 'Gridley bit' is supposedly Commodore George Dewey to Captain Charles Gridley at the Battle of Manila Bay in the Spanish-American War.   :>)

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: DougR
Date: 30 Oct 01 - 10:14 PM

I only worked for the government for a couple of years, Kendall, and I didn't belong to a union either. But I don't think that is the main reason the Republicans object to them being federal employees. Armey is an ass, I agree. I think they favor strict federal oversight, but having the folks that do the checking employees of a privately owned company. Why? If they screw up, they could be more easily replaced. Even the whole company could be replaced if necessary. The key would be federal oversight, I think.

I have no idea what federal regulations are regarding employees that are unionized and those that are not. I'm sure Mick does, but I'm not sure that qualifies as a lie. I'm sure we will see, though.

By the way, Kendall, I'm sure you will be delighted to know in the fifth inning of the WS, the game is tied up!

DougR

Subject: RE: Hilary Clinton
From: Troll
Date: 31 Oct 01 - 12:18 AM

Greg, I am well aware that Hillary is not the only self-serving etc. out there and I really don't think that I tried to give that impression. Sorry if you thought I was.
We all build our own reality. Some just do a better job than others and some are satisfied with a fairly simple reality and some build elaborate confections.
Others are never satisfied but keep changing their reality until they aren't sure what it is any more. Still others try to make everyone else change their reality to conform with theirs and get nasty when folks won't go along with the program.
I know where mine is. Where's yours?

troll