BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins

Subject: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Peter T.
Date: 11 Apr 03 - 07:39 PM

We crazy lefties have been arguing for months that pre-emptive poison would soon begin to do its work. It didn't take long. India's defence minister today said that Pakistan is ripe for a pre-emptive strike as a fomentor of terrorism, since America did the same with Iraq. Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind.

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 11 Apr 03 - 07:41 PM

Move to non-music.

Dear Guest Q, Do you think you could possibly wait longer than 3 MINUTES before pointing out that a thread may need moved? This is also NOT the place to post your requests which should be in the HELP forum. Try to relax a bit. This is NOT a full time moderated forum and if a thread is labeled incorrectly for a few hours or even a day, the world will not come to an end. -- J.C.

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Mrrzy
Date: 11 Apr 03 - 08:40 PM

Yeah, I read that too, Peter. What about North Korea preemptively striking the US, and who would blame them?

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Bobert
Date: 11 Apr 03 - 09:55 PM

Well, I have it from a reliable source that WesT Virgina is gonna take Virginia out.

Bobert

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Amos
Date: 11 Apr 03 - 10:41 PM

Los Angeles has been a nuisance for years, and a threat to San Diego with its weapons of mass urban sprawl. I'm calling on all SUV owners south of Orange County to mobilize. We'll start by taking over LAX. Then John Wayne. Well turn those runways into parking lots. Then we'll take out the exit ramps from the freeways during rushhour until the whole town finds itself going over the Grapevine with no way off!!

Why? To prevent them from using their evil influence on us!


A

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Mark Cohen
Date: 12 Apr 03 - 05:58 AM

Amos, the freeways are already parking lots, and the planes are already sitting on the runways for hours. I don't see that you're proposing a major change here...

Aloha,
Mark

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Apr 03 - 10:59 AM

Amos, my friends in the Bay Area are collecting chainsaws and help. They plan to saw all of Southern California loose just a tad south of Fresno and sort of shove it westward. It's a preemptive move, so it's nothing personal.

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: kendall
Date: 12 Apr 03 - 11:07 AM

STOP the sabre rattling! We in Maine are surrounded by Canadians! They may decide to hit us with a load of short lobsters and cheap potatoes!

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: SINSULL
Date: 12 Apr 03 - 11:11 AM

and Canadian Bacon. YUM.

On a more serious note, the political rumor mill says that Syria is Bush's next target. And it makes sense (?????) for him to take care of business while our troops are over there.

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 12 Apr 03 - 11:59 AM

If nobody's noticed, preemptive strikes consist of taking profiling to a national policy level.

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Amos
Date: 12 Apr 03 - 12:25 PM

Perspicacious, Mister G.


A

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Don Firth
Date: 12 Apr 03 - 02:35 PM

Scenario, based on the idea of pre-emptive strike as it applies to a Western movie:--

The obligatory "mysterious stranger" approaches a small Western town early in the morning. As he nears the town, he hears a sudden flurry of gun-fire. After, maybe, forty-five seconds, all is silence. He rides into town and finds the main street littered with corpses. He finds one man, mortally wounded, who is still alive.

"What in blazes happened here?" he asks the dying man.

"All the men in town were wearing their six-guns," the dying man gasps, "and they might have used them on each other. So we had to shoot first--" (Gasp! Choke! Expire. . . .)

Or

Alternative Star Trek version: Klingon away team beams back up to their war-bird in orbit above the earth, and the leader of the away team reports to his captain: "All dead! And I though we were supposed to be warlike. . . ."

Don Firth

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: CarolC
Date: 12 Apr 03 - 02:55 PM

Iraq, Syria, and Iran were in the plans for pre-emptive action long before 9/11 even. Everything is going according to the schedule that was formulated years ago by most of the people who are now major players in the Bush administration.

Subject: RE: B.S.: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Apr 03 - 01:17 AM

That's accurate, Carol. Afghanistan was also in those plans long before 9/11. 9/11 was exactly what the planners needed to enlist public support for a series of military actions. ("Thanks, Osama!", they might well say...assuming it really was him.)

Kind of reminds me of Hitler, who had plans for the Rhineland, Austria, Spain, Czechoslovakia, Poland, Eastern Europe, and Soviet Russia, in that order...then, perhaps the World. It all went flooey from the moment Britain and France declared war on him in '39 (which he was not anticipating at all).

The Republican administration's plans for a World empire may also go flooey at some point. We shall see. No one country has ever succeeded in totally dominating the World, although the Romans and the British certainly gave at a good shot when they were at their respective peaks. The British are now recalling former glories by attaching themselves to the World's latest great ambitious imperial superpower...rather like Greece attaching itself (somewhat regretfully) to Rome, when the Romans were the supreme power.

Hubris is a terrible thing.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Gareth
Date: 13 Apr 03 - 07:35 PM

MMM! Historically perhaps a premeptive strike in 1776 against the rebels would have been in order.

Cornwallis was stabbed in the back !!!!

Gareth

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Amos
Date: 13 Apr 03 - 08:55 PM

Yeah -- those rebels have weapons of squirrel-destruction hidden in civilian areas. Let's move on them before they come over here and start shooting innocent Hessians....


A

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 12:48 AM

The British DID make pre-emptive strikes on the rebels. Several. The "Boston Massacre" was one. The rebels also made pre-emptive strikes of their own on the British, before the war was official.

If I were the British, I would have made pre-emptive strikes too (AND I would have made significant tax reforms!!!). If I were the revolutionaries I would have done the same (made pre-emptive strikes). Who you think is right or wrong in such a situation as the American War of Independence is an almost entirely arbitrary business...depending on thousandsof possible things which might influence your view of the situation one way or the other.

Suffice it to say that there were fine men and scoundrels on both sides of that one, but in the end the British lost. Don't waste your time waiting for Hollywood to give you a fair and balanced movie about it, though. They figure it wouldn't get big ticket sales, because the viewers don't want real history, they want melodramatic fiction, with good guys and BAD guys.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Cluin
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 02:19 AM

Pre-emptive poisson?

Send them fish before they notice something fishy is going on?

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: diesel
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 08:03 AM

Hi all !

I wish to put the cat amongst the pigeons here a second if you don't mind.

If it could be accepted that as CarolC says, this agenda was set before 9/11, and as LH reminds us it's exactly what the planners wanted .....

Is it too much to stretch the imagination and say 9/11 may have been a home grown incident planned and executed by a govt. agency ?

I don't think it is imagination at all, black-ops people have some weird ways of thinking.......

food for thought !

Rgds
Diesel

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: John Hardly
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 08:41 AM

If only the Middle East were under the influence of fundamentalist Christianity instead of fundamentalist Islam...

...the mudcat would suddenly be the domain of warmongers instead of peaceniks. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 08:54 AM

Why John Hardly? What have you got against fundamentalist Christians?

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Amos
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 09:04 AM

Pox on both their houses, John!

A

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 09:07 AM

It depends on the breed of Christian. If it were populated by people following the actual commandments of the guy they made the religion because of, there'd be no problem. Bible-thumping, misogynist homophobes who are convinced that everyone who doesn;t agree with them is going to hell? Wouldn't be much different.

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 09:18 AM

Anyone want to start a betting pool on how long it takes the US to start the war with Syria?

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: GUEST,Kaleb
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 02:37 PM

Careful there Bobert, givin' our plans away like that. If you don't watch your step us in north-central WV may have hit you eastern panhandle types.

-Kaleb

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: GUEST,pdc
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 02:42 PM

"Is it too much to stretch the imagination and say 9/11 may have been a home grown incident planned and executed by a govt. agency ?"

There are a lot of threads on a lot of forums on just this issue. Normally I would dismiss this kind of thinking as that of a conspiracy nut, but given the present US government, nothing seems too extreme.

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 03:33 PM

Yeah, it's a possibility they planned 9/11. It's also a possibility that they didn't exactly plan it themselves, but just allowed it to happen anyway through deliberately lapses in intelligence-gathering, etc. In this way, Bin Laden could have played directly into the hands of the people he most detests on this Earth. That would be most ironical.

It's also possible that George Bush had no personal knowledge of such plans (I very much doubt he did), but that some of the key people behind him did.

Oklahoma City was an earlier attempt to provoke the kind of public and governmental reactions that 9/11 produced in the USA. The evidence was all too conveniently removed within a short time, when the remains of the building were razed and carted away...but...seismographic records indicate a rapid series of explosions that took place (within the building) just after the truck bomb went off. Eyewitnesses also reported hearing 2 distinct explosions within a second or two of each other. The seismographs show an initial explosion (the truck), and a very quick series of explosions after that (which would have sounded to the ear like one large explosion). That series of quick explosions blew up a number of key support pillars in the building. There were other explosive devices in the building which did not go off, but were removed by bomb squad officers shortly after the blasts. It's on the record.

Oklahoma City was a setup, an inside job, involving far more people than Timothy McVeigh. Its purpose was to create a climate of fear and reaction in America, allowing the abrogation of Constitional protections for the public.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Peter T.
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 04:15 PM

And what of Scully's alien child?

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 09:38 PM

Little Hawk, there now you've gone and done it- you've pushed my alarm button. What I fear most is people who have an absolute belief that they are correct, so I must resist any such statements as you made at 3:33.

(And I don't mean that you should have added 'imo'; I do realize these posts are all opinions. )

But you cannot credibly assert such astonishing charges and then walk away. So I will say: NO. You know no such thing. What you are saying is absolutely libelous, unsubstantiated, and W A Y beyond what anyone can legitimately pass on as FACT.

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: John Hardly
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 10:09 PM

yikes

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Apr 03 - 11:44 PM

Ah. You're quite right, Ebbie. I don't know it. I merely suspect it very strongly. The number of things I KNOW is limited to my direct personal experience in this life. For instance, I know where I live, and I know that I am now typing on my keyboard, and am about to post on Mudcat. I know that my Yamaha is a hell of a good guitar, and I know that I saw a couple of "UFO's" (you know what I mean) way back in the late 60's.

As far as the political stuff goes...none of us knows a damn thing, but we all have plenty of opinions. My opinion is that the Oklahoma bombing was for the most part an inside job. As for McVeigh, my knowledge about him is fragmentary, at this point. It's not something I spend every day of my life thinking about, because the fact is, I can't DO anything about it.

Tonight I am mainly going to think about editing and working on a couple of songs.

I've been "libelled" on Mudcat from time to time too...but so what? I'm not losing any sleep over it. If I was a politician, I'd worry about this kind of stuff, and be very much more circumspect, but I'm not. (Thank God.)

You consider me dangerous? Hell, it's your national leaders who are dangerous. I'm about as dangerous as our dachshund, whose main desire is to sleep 23 hours a day, and eat for the remaining hour.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Apr 03 - 12:35 PM

If you're 'dangerous', Little Hawk, I wish we all were. You have given me much food for thought and I appreciate that.

I object only to unsubstantiated, meaning unverifiable, inflammatory rhetoric that is meant to imply far more information than you possess.

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Apr 03 - 02:36 PM

Yeah, I can understand your reaction...I guess I was in a kind of inflammatory mood when I wrote that stuff. I was pretty appalled myself when I first encountered that info, I'll tell you. I think it's probably true, but I cannot say for absolute certain sure that it is.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Pre-emptive Poison begins
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Apr 03 - 03:02 PM

Blessin's on ya, friend.