BS: Histories Mysteries

Subject: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,James
Date: 05 Apr 04 - 01:38 PM

I have been at home recuperating from surgery and I have read a LOT of Books..here are some things that I would like to have been around to see, as a fly on the wall sort of thing....How about anyone else. Are there things you would really like to have been there for ?

Is there an authentic Portrait of Shakespeare?
What became of Lord Lucan ?
What Really happened at The Battle of Waterloo ?
Did Richard 111 Kill the princes In The Tower ?
Who Betrayed Anne Frank ?
Did Shakespeare write ALL of those plays ?
Where did Amelia Earhart go?
Who Killed Michael Collins ?
Hundred more..I just would like to be able to go back in time and see what really happebd.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,The All Knowing Seer
Date: 05 Apr 04 - 01:59 PM

Dear James, here are the answers to your queries above.

Is there an authentic Portrait of Shakespeare? No but I could send you his most recent polaroid.

What became of Lord Lucan ? He was turned into butter after running so fast around a large palm tree.

What Really happened at The Battle of Waterloo ? Nappy really won, but he didn't have Carl Rove to spin things for him.

Did Richard 111 Kill the princes In The Tower ? I cannot remember anyone named Richard 111, sorry.

Who Betrayed Anne Frank ? Her publicist, he thought the diary would sell better if there was more tragedy surrounding the release.

Did Shakespeare write ALL of those plays ? Of course not, Neil Simon wrote the comedies.

Where did Amelia Earhart go? She went for an airplane ride, silly.

Who Killed Michael Collins ? No one killed Michael Collins, he is currently living with Elvis in a flat in Queens.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Rapparee
Date: 05 Apr 04 - 02:23 PM

What really happened to Amy Robsart?

What happened at Meyerling?

Was the Virgin Queen one, really?

Why didn't someone think of that before?

Where has my youthful innocence, my enthusiastic smile, gone?

What REALLY happened in Florida in November, 2000?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Apr 04 - 02:36 PM

Who killed JFK ?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,rangersteve at work
Date: 05 Apr 04 - 06:43 PM

The truth about the death of Princess Dianna. Then people can stop talking about her and let her rest in peace.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,The All Knowing Seer
Date: 05 Apr 04 - 10:51 PM

What really happened to Amy Robsart? Aliens got her.

What happened at Meyerling? That's where the Aliens got Amy.

Was the Virgin Queen one, really? No

Why didn't someone think of that before? The opportunity never came up

Where has my youthful innocence, my enthusiastic smile, gone? South

What REALLY happened in Florida in November, 2000? The Texicans snookered us all.

Who killed JFK ? (See previous answer)

The truth about the death of Princess Dianna. She died.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 02:53 AM

Why did the Romans really kill Jesus? (I mean, if we had an account of the trial and crucifixion written from the Roman point of view, what would it say?)

And what was in all those books that were burned in the library of Alexandria? And was the burning really an accident?

Why were the pyramids built? (Sure, they look like tombs, but there's no proof anybody was ever buried in them.) Why did the Egyptians quit building pyramids?

Who originally sculpted the Great Sphinx, and what did it look like? (It has evidently been re-sculpted at some time, since the head is now obviously too small for the body.)

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Kaleea
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 03:06 AM

I recently spoke to my pal, Elvis, & he is most definitely NOT shacking up with Michael Collins, Michael Jackson, or Kendall! NOR is he living in Queens, but he does like to visit Queens from time to time, & he sometimes sings gigs with Mahalia Jackson--Gospel gigs, of course! Anybody catch them at the Apollo Theater? He spends most of his time living in another galaxy far, far away, with his alien pals-DUH!

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,John in Young
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 05:49 AM

Oz mysteries..

who bombed the Hilton in 1978? "Conspiracy", the documentary by
Daryl Dellora, lists evidence of involvement by Australian security forces. NSW attorney general Frank Walker told the press in 1980 that he had been told by a disaffected CSIRO scientist that ASIO had asked CSIRO to build the Hilton bomb.

http://www.filmartdoco.com/conspiracy.html

The asylum seeker boat known as SIEV-X sank in October 2001. 353
passengers drowned at sea. If the Government knew of the imminent sinking of the asylum seeker boat SIEV-X and did not take steps to rescue the survivors, it could quite reasonably be held responsible for the deaths of 353 people.

http://www.cpa.org.au/garchve5/1097overboard.html

The mystery of the disappearance, and certain death, of Juanita Nielsen of Kings Cross in 1975 remains unsolved despite the publication of a new account of the circumstances. Was Nielsen the first victim of urban developers (have there been any others?), of local thugs working for developers who exceeded their brief, or of anyone else? Did the police and the National Crime Authority have any culpability?

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/03/02/1078191318068.html

why did the Australian government build a refugee camp at Woomera in the Australian desert? Woomera was built out in the desert, five hours from the nearest city and at the end of a closed road. In summer, temperatures often passed 50 degrees Centigrade. PHILLIP RUDDOCK, MINISTER FOR IMMIGRATION: We will be briefing people when they come in here on the nature of the facility, the environment in which it's been placed. It's not a holiday camp, nor should it be seen as one.

Within weeks, the centre, set up for 400 people, was overwhelmed by nearly 1,000. Many of the refugees came with lice, scabies, and they were dehydrated. They did have diseases, such as malaria and things like that, and they were quite sick. So, in this 48-hour process, they were collapsing and fainting and vomiting and all that sort of stuff. Over 1,500 people living in that compound, with, you know, maybe two washing machines or three washing machines and five toilets.

So we had several people that would self-harm with cigarette burns, glass. They'd break glass and threaten to slash themselves. Swallow disinfectant, insect repellant, shampoo. In the end, 80% of those detained there were found to be genuine refugees and given temporary visas.

http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/content/2003/transcripts/s858341.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: greg stephens
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 06:03 AM

The most widespread fiddle tune I am aware of is "Soldiers Joy", and all versions seem sufficiently similar as to imply a specific created source. What I would really like to know is who made up the tune, where, and when.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 09:12 AM

Were the rosenburgs guilty ? Where is Jimmy Hoffa? Yes, it would be interesting to know what REALLY happened.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: sledge
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 09:50 AM

Were the Templers hiding a big secret or was that just a smear campaign by the church and the French Monarchy.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Rapparee
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 10:00 AM

I'd like to know what happened to The Body.

I'd also like to know about the caucasian mummies in China. And how first folks REALLY got the Americas.

But most of all...how and why did a proto-ape decide to become intelligent and evolve into what we are today?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 10:35 AM

Why are all the truly ancient sites in the western hemisphere in south america rather thhan in North America..if people migrated FROM the north would it be sensible to assume the the sites to be newer as people travel south ? I have always been very Curious about this ?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,James
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 10:39 AM

I think people wre buried in Pyramids..weren't they. Wasn't tht the whole point ? I think also that the History of the Templars is fairly well known and that they just got caught up(recently) in Holy Grail conspiracy theories.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: sledge
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 10:39 AM

And Stonehenge, who built it and why.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 11:11 AM

Did Marilyn Monroe kill herself, and if she didn't who did?

Who wrote the Bible? (names and addresses would be nice)

Did Aliens have anything whatsoever to do with building anything whatsoever on our planet? (again, names and addresses?)

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 11:24 AM

Re: The Rosenbergs
I think it's already been shown that Julius Rosenberg was technically guilty, although the information he tried to give the Russians was practically useless. (He didn't know that, but the government did.) Ethel Rosenberg was innocent. The government knew this, too. They prosecuted Ethel to put more pressure on Julius to confess.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,motheaten
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 07:50 PM

Does any one own a copyright for the Bible? If not, can I apply for it?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Benjamin
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 10:16 PM

Raipare, did you want to know whether the virgin was a queen, or if the queen was a virgin?

Anyways, I'd like to know what happened to the lost colony.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Rapparee
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 11:09 PM

Because she was called that, that's how. But I'd like to know if it was accurate.

As for the Lost Colony, yep, that'd be nice to know too.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Apr 04 - 07:32 AM

What Happened aboard the Mary Celeste ? Would I like to know that.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Fiolar
Date: 07 Apr 04 - 08:35 AM

Intersting question about Richard III. Henry who replaced him and who backdated the date of his coronation to before the Battle of Bosworth lost no opportunity to blacken Richard's name but strangely enough never during his reign was it indicated that Richard was responsible for the murder of the princes. That came later with Thomas Moore and Shakespeare. If Richard was so bad why was it that the city of York mourned his death at Bosworth?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Apr 04 - 12:12 PM

Actually Richard was very loyal to the King and showed no signs of the kind of treachery that would cause the killing of his nwephews. Yes, it would be interesting to have been there and seen what did happen.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 07 Apr 04 - 12:27 PM

Riverdance. Why?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Shanghaiceltic
Date: 07 Apr 04 - 07:40 PM

An authenticated picture of Nessie

Are there really wee people in Ireland?

What exaclty are ghosts and spirits

Was there ever a Chinese driving school!

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 07 Apr 04 - 07:56 PM

Re: Richard III - it was all Tudor propaganda. Richard proved his brother Edward's previous marriage thus making the three children ineligible to reign. Henry Tudor (pause to spit over shoulder) married the eldest child, Elizabeth. To make her legitimate, he accused Richard of lying, thus making them all legitimate again and true heirs to the throne.

As it was, it appears very much as if Edward wasn't supposed to rule either. His illegitimacy seems now to have been proved by the reports of his hush hush christening and fathers' campaign dates. As eldest son, you'd expect his christening to be huge, but it was a private affair, unlike his brother who came along a year or so later - christened with all the pomp and ceremony befitting the heir to the throne.

This myth was disputed as soon as the Tudor dynasty was over, but it still finds its way into history books now.

As for the pyramids - the answer is Aliens, probably from the region of the constellation Orion. Why else would the four best know pyramids mark out Orion's belt, only obvious from the air.....?

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 07 Apr 04 - 08:28 PM

well, regarding the ancient structures in meso& south america
it doesnt always follow that settling an area first means monumental construction or civilization has to occur there as well. I think that may have more to do with geo-graphical factors. SUch as warmer climate, abundance of food etc.

at least one mystery was solved in the past few days, they found remains of St. Exupery's plane which disappeared 60 years ago off Marseilles. (the Little Prince author)

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: jaze
Date: 07 Apr 04 - 08:29 PM

Thanks for clearing that up, Liz. James in VA.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: sledge
Date: 08 Apr 04 - 02:21 AM

Orion belts, three stars in a stait line.

Pyramid, three of them in a strait line.

Wow, the evidence is overwhelming. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: InOBU
Date: 08 Apr 04 - 06:34 AM

What Happened aboard the Mary Celeste ?

Ah one of my favorite not to hard mysteries. Her cargo contained de-natured alcohol. Though it was not drinkable, her crew may not have known that. Often crews tapped kegs at sea. Above one of the kegs, which had been tapped, there was a burn mark on the overhead. There was also a deap gouge in one gunnel between the cutter falls. Most likely, during a calm, someone in the crew took a lantern below to tap a keg and set off a flash of alcohol fumes. This caused the crew to believe the vessel was about to explode, they quickly launched their cutter, without provisions or navigational tools, causing the gauge in the rail - evidence of extreem haste , meaning to sit off and see if the vessle was indeep about to blow, a wind came up and the ship went off faster than they could row... they were lost... bob's yer uncle.
That was one of the most plausable theories I have run accross. For me, (sorry) mystery solved.
Larry

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: InOBU
Date: 08 Apr 04 - 06:37 AM

One of the sadder mysteries... Where the black moving forms seen at a distance on the ice, by the crew of the California, the morning after the sinking of the Titanic survivors? The crew thought so, the captain was sure they were seals and did not investigate. A large number of survivors may have been stranded on the ice to die of exposure over the first day...
All the best, and hope to those in peril on the sea
Larry

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Apr 04 - 12:18 PM

What is the truth about Atlantis?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: mike the knife
Date: 09 Apr 04 - 04:59 PM

Was there ever a Chinese driving school!

Yes- Shanghaiceltic, there is (or was). I was once nearly killed on Northern Boulevard in Flushing, Queens (NYC) by a student of the "Golden Power Driving School".

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Rapparee
Date: 09 Apr 04 - 05:28 PM

What's with those ruins in New England? The ones called "Mystery Hill" in (I think) New Hampshire? Are they Celtic or what?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Scoville
Date: 09 Apr 04 - 07:00 PM

Who were all those unidentified serial killers (Jack the Ripper, the Cleveland Torso killer, the Austin ripper in the 1880's, etc. etc.)?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Desdemona
Date: 10 Apr 04 - 01:02 PM

Well...

-The etching in the first folio edition of Shakespeare's plays, published in 1623 (7 years after his death), is generally agreed to be the nearest thing we have to a contemporary likeness.

And yes, he really did write all those plays (including "The Two Noble Kinsmen", in collaboration with Fletcher). And all the sonnets, too.

-While we can never be entirely certain what she got up to *before* becoming Queen, it's un-bloody-likely that Elizabeth I ever had sex during the entirety of her 46 year reign (and that's a loooong time, folks---she might as *well* have a virgin at that point in any case!). For one thing, the very notion of personal privacy out of the question for a person in her position (who literally had some one appointed to hand her the 16th C equivalent of toilet paper, and they counted themselves fortunate!)...any number of people would have known about any sexual activity, and AT LEAST one of them would have sung like a canary to SOMEONE. She was also all too aware of the risks inherent in allowing herself to become emotionally attached to anyone: while her affection for Dudley is indisputable, she knew it would be impossible to marry him without causing enormous factional dissension at Court, and after Amy Robsart's death it became completely out of the question. She was also always at pains to distinguish herself as "a prince", and to be taken seriously in the political arena; an alliance with anyone would have undermined her position. Additionally, she would never have run the risk of---God forbid!---an accidental pregnancy; her attitude towards ladies in waiting who became pregnant out of wedlock is enough to illustrate her feelings on that point.

-While Henry VII certainly the motive to play the villain in the murder of the "princes in the tower", he had nothing like the opportunity or immediate necessity that Richard III had to be rid of those boys. While history has often chosen to overlook the fact that he was in many respects an able administrator and a relatively just ruler during his brief reign, the fact remains that he was in all likelihood responsible for ordering and/or arranging his nephews' murder.

And those are the only of the above burning questions which I'm presently qualified to answer with any authourity!!

D.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: jaze
Date: 11 Apr 04 - 10:28 AM

What about the "Miracle of Fatima" where 70,000 people witnessed the sun "dance" in the sky? Miracle or mass hysteria?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Shlio
Date: 11 Apr 04 - 07:03 PM

Who was the model for the Cerne Abbas Giant?

Following the big bang theory, how can nothing explode?

Why?

Why is the answer to life, the universe and everything 42?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Penny S.
Date: 12 Apr 04 - 09:41 AM

Orion's belt - three stars not quite in a straight line. Pyramids - also not quite in a straight line.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Apr 04 - 09:46 AM

Nah, Desdemona, I know that E1 couldn't have married Dudley after Amy's fall. I'd just like to know if the fall was an accident or a set-up. As for her makin' whoopee while Queen, yes, it would have been awfully difficult, but before queenhood, not quite as hard to get away with a little dilly-dallying.

As for Shakespeare's authorship, I've read -- and it's on excellent authority indeed -- and believe, that the plays and sonnets attributed to William Shakespeare were not written by William Shakespeare, but by someone else with the same name!

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Big Mick
Date: 12 Apr 04 - 10:06 AM

What's the mystery about the wee folk? Of course they are real, you feckin' eejit! Go ahead and have a go with the wee lads and see if they're not. Could we stick with things about which there is some doubt????

All the best,

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Desdemona
Date: 12 Apr 04 - 11:51 AM

There's an interesting theory that William Cecil was behind Amy Robsart's tumble downstairs, for the precise reason that he knew it would completely eliminate *any* possibility of QEI marrying Dudley. Howsoever it came about, I've never believed it was really an accident.

*Serious* academic scholars generally agree that William Shakespeare from Stratford upon Avon is the author of the plays, sonnets & lyric poems attributed to him. The various arguments bandied about re:his not having gone to university, etc, fail to take into account the fact that a university education was by no means considered the essential part of being a well-rounded person that it is in modern times. In the 16th century, attending unicversity was generally in the interest of entering clerical orders or studying the law, not in pursuit of a liberal arts & humanities education that it is today.

A person (like William Shakespeare, Ben Jonson, Thomas Middleton, et al) with "only" a grammar school education would have been more conversant with Latin & even Greek than most modern classics scholars, and would certainly have read Ovid's "Metamorphoses", for example (from which many themes are used in Shakespeare's work), in the original Latin, despite its availability in an English translation circa 1567.

The attribution of his work to various candidates who were dead (Oxford, Marlowe[dead in a tavern brawl in *1593*!!!, etc)] when a great many of the plays were written is at best simply amusing, and at worst just plain dumb!

D.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Apr 04 - 12:20 PM

Which brings up something else I'd like to know: what was the real story behind the death of Chris Marlowe? Was he a spy for Walsingham, bumped off for reasons of State? Was he really QE1's love child, his father Philip of Spain? 8-)

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Desdemona
Date: 12 Apr 04 - 12:49 PM

"QE1's love child"---LOL! And can we think of a less likely candidate for the father (hmmmm....it's brilliant: that whole Armada business was just a clever ruse...!)?!

There is evidence to support the idea that Marlowe had been working as part of Walsingham's underground spy network, and that the "great reckoning in a little room" wasn't just an ordinary argument over the bill, but it's probably impossible to know the deatils for certain.

Some of my other favourite crackpot theories, in terms of comic relief, are that QEI was the author of the plays (again, since she died in 1603, that was a pretty impressive trick!), or that he was in fact a MAN, baby (*another* neat trick---fooling all those ladies-in-waiting!!!)!

D.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Apr 04 - 09:26 AM

is there really a treasure on Oak Island, Nova Scotia ?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 13 Apr 04 - 09:38 AM

Speaking of another William Shakespeare with the same name...I recall a serious theory that the William Shakespeare who lived in Stratford and the William Shakespeare who acted and wrote plays in London were two different men with the same name. (I don't know enough details to either defend this theory or refute it.)

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 13 Apr 04 - 10:49 AM

Has anyone mentioned that Elizabeth I was also hinted at writing those plays?

But of far more importance, WHO eats the milk and cookies put out for Santa?..xx..e

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: LadyJean
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 01:03 AM

A classic line from one of my father's letters: "Your mother is reading a book that says Richard III didn't murder his two nephews. She'd never believe it if she'd seen Barrymore play him."

While we're at it, what happened to the Lost Colony? What were Aaron Burr and George Blennerhesset really up to? Did Dr. Mudd know whose leg he was setting? Who really killed Huey Long? Here's a biggie. If a Vulcan had landed on earth in the fifteenth century, he would have figured that in the 21st century, the Arabs and the Chinese would be on their way to Mars, while the barbarians of Europe would be struggling to heat their homes.
Said Vulcan would, of course, have been wrong.
So, what went wrong in China and the Middle east?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 02:16 PM

I was going to ask "How did the Indian rope trick work?" – but I see from this site that the mystery has been solved; at least two ways! Take your pick which is correct.

I recall Penn & Teller (well, Penn, actually) saying on TV that they didn't know how it was done and would love to know, so they could add it to their repertoire.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Teribus
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 02:52 PM

"What went wrong in China and the Middle east?"

On earth in the fifteenth century - to the present day.

China:
Too big, too vast to govern efficiently, or effectively. They considereded the rest of the world to be barbarians. Expended all their energy in trying to keep what they had together, became very introverted.

Europe:
Fall of the Eatern Roman Empire, the Renaissence and the knowledge that flooded west with the collapse, caused those in the west to question and challenge as they had never done before. We got rid of a church that for centuries had told people what to do and what to think, what was allowed and what wasn't. Major advances in science, technology, medicine and the arts.

Middle East:
They adopted a religion and a theocracy that told people what to do and what to think, what was allowed and what wasn't.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 03:23 PM

I'll 2nd Oak Island...

I also wanna know what REALLY happened to Travis Walton...

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Don Firth
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 04:41 PM

Yeah, put me down as curious about the Oak Island thing also.

I think we have a fair handle on the mystery of the "Lost Continent of Atlantis."

The legend pretty much originated with Plato, in his dialogues Timaios and Kritias. According to the story, Atlantis was a large island or small continent whose inhabitants had developed an exceptionally high standard of civilization.

Recent legends (within the past century) have been promulgated by kooks, woo-woos, and outright frauds. One of these was Richard S. Shaver, who wrote bad science fiction and fantasy and tried to peddle it as all true. Things like "The Hollow Earth" (ask your friendly neighborhood astromoner or physicist about bodies the size and mass of the earth possibly being hollow!) and "The Lost Continent of Lemura" (presumed to be like Atlantis, but in the Pacific, and taking the statues on Easter Island as the main evidence for its existence), are all part of this pulp-paper mythology. The legend of Atlantis got a big spurt with this sort of thing. Self-appointed mystics used to make a fair living going around and giving lectures on this stuff, and they drew surprisingly sizable audiences of pretty gullible people.

Actually, if there ever was such a place as Atlantis, it was probably the island of Thera, where there was indeed a highly developed civilization (relative to its times, but they had no special wisdom, nor, for that matter, had they mastered telepathy, levitation, astral projection, or space travel). The civilization came to an abrupt end when Thera, a volcanic island in the Aegean, erupted massively around 1600 BC (made Krakatoa look like a sneeze by comparison), wiped out everybody on the island, dumped ash on the whole eastern Mediterranean, and the resultant seismic sea waves (tsunamis) may have been responsible for legends like Noah's flood, the parting of the reed sea (Red Sea), and a whole bunch of other chronologically scrambled legends. The circular island of Santorini (a caldera) is all that remains of Thera—or Atlantis, if you will.

People quibble that Plato said that Atlantis was beyond the Gates of Hercules, or the Straits of Gibraltar, and that it happened 9,000 years before Plato's time, but others point out that there were places in and around the Aegean Sea that were referred to as "the Gates of Hercules" (there seemed to be no consensus as to where they actually were), and that the Thera eruption took place closer to 900 rather than 9,000 years before Plato's time—possible misplaced decimal. Also, Plato was certainly not an eye-witness to the sinking of Atlantis; he was drawing on legends.

As far as Atlantis being in the Atlantic Ocean somewhere, satellite technology, geodetic surveys, and deep-diving submarines and oceanographic research vessels have covered a lot of pretty soggy territory, discovered the mid-Atlantic ridge, tube worms and other strange life forms living around volcanic "smokers," and a whole bunch of other stuff about the deep oceans, with sunken buildings here and there, but—no sunken continents.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 06:41 PM

Re: Atlantis. There's a theory going around currently that the Black Sea was once a large inland lake, smaller and lower than now, with no connection to the Mediterranean. It had several villages around its shores. Rising sea levels due to the melting of ice at the end of the last ice age eventually caused water to break through the Bosporus, quickly (in geological terms) raising the water level in the Black Sea basin, inundating the villages and forcing their abandonment.

Although there is pretty strong evidence for the geological story, whether this is what gave rise to stories of the Biblical flood, or the sinking of Atlantis, is still pretty much conjecture.

Click here for a review in the journal Achaeology of the book Noah's Flood: The New Scientific Discoveries About the Event that Changed History by William Ryan and Walter Pitman.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 14 Apr 04 - 09:01 PM

Id take a stab at Ladyjeans question; re what went wrong with China and the Middle east.

you could say year 1000 rather than the 15th century,
because at that time both were far more advanced than Europe
by the 15th century things were starting to change. (with Gutenberg and the fall of Constantinople especially, since a lot of refugees and books (greek classics) arrived in Italy at the same time the printing press was

China: up until 1420 or so China was sending out explorers with huge ships, (far bigger than anything Spain or Portugal could muster) but there was a shift in power away from the eunuch philosopher/bureaucrats, further exploration was abandoned and the ships ordered destroyed. China was also a unified kingdom, compared to Europe which was a number of competing states (thereby honing their military skills as well as competing for resources and colonies)

The scientific tradition of logic and reasoning, which started in Ionian Greece, gave the Europeans an advantage as well, since you could make models and test with experiments, the Chinese believed that everything had a living force and thus you could not make models of the world. The chinese were also pigeonholed into their positions in life, one could not improve ones status, so theres no incentive to try.

As far as the ARabs, Cordoba Spain, did in fact have a scientific renaissance of sorts, in the 10-11th century - a lot was learned from translating the greek texts, and algebra, distillation of alcohol, as well as the latine sail, all came from the Arabs, - Id say that ultimately the pervasive religion and status of women hindered development.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 15 Apr 04 - 06:25 PM

Why does the left testicle hang lower than the right?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 15 Apr 04 - 06:35 PM

So that way, when you walk, yer not banging them into each other...

d'uh

LOL

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Rapparee
Date: 15 Apr 04 - 06:41 PM

Are those like popsicles?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 15 Apr 04 - 07:01 PM

That makes sense ... but why always the left one Clinton ... is it the same reason water drains clockwise in the northern hemisphere?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Apr 04 - 07:37 PM

Jim Dixon, I did a painting of the great Black Sea flood.


http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/balls1a.jpg

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Pied Piper
Date: 16 Apr 04 - 08:31 AM

Donuel, it's a great picture and it would make a great Album (sorry CD)cover.
PP

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: InOBU
Date: 16 Apr 04 - 08:51 AM

Great man yerself Donuel... perfection... (I'd only add a guy holding a headline saying concervatives discount danger of impending eccological trouble! - ) no kidding, great stuff. Cheers Larry

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Melani
Date: 16 Apr 04 - 07:07 PM

Amy Robsart had breast cancer, had been left alone in the house, and likely fell down the stairs on her own.

I eat Santa's cookies and milk.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Jay
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 05:22 AM

i am santa

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Jay
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 05:25 AM

Will any one ever know the real reason for the mary celeste because i know. The chef got drunk on alcohol and gave everyone food poisoning he felt bad so lobbed them all overboard then he felt bad so he mashed himself over the side of the boat

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 05:30 AM

So Santa you decided he was naughty and not nice?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 05:32 AM

Status of women hindering developemnt? what of Europe then?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: freda underhill
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 08:12 AM

what happened at Hanging Rock?


Was Harold Holt a spy for China? did they whisk him away in a submarine?



did einstein's wife write his theories?


why do birds fly south?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: robomatic
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 08:22 AM

Who really killed cock robin?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 08:58 AM

Why didn't my post post?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 09:27 AM

how much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: John O'L
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 09:37 AM

What did Heathcliff do all that time in Liverpool?

Was he actually in Liverpool at all?

Were'd he get all that money from?

What was his real name?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 09:53 AM

Easy. Real name is MacHeath.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Bill D
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 10:07 AM

are rhetorical questions inundating the forum?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 11:09 AM

wow i would never have known if you hadnt asked.
sarcasm inundating the forum too.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: JennyO
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 08:37 AM

How many roads must a man walk down???

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: John O'L
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 10:08 AM

Cap'n, art sleeping thar below?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 10:25 AM

What happened to the Neanderthals? (Other than getting elected in Texas)

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: mack/misophist
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 06:46 PM

The shrub is clearly not a neanderthal. It's not that good looking.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: John O'L
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 07:38 PM

...or that sophisticated

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 15 Apr 05 - 11:01 AM

I think it was Jim Dixon who asked:

Why were the pyramids built? (Sure, they look like tombs, but there's no proof anybody was ever buried in them.) Why did the Egyptians quit building pyramids?

Obvious. The real estate developers looked at occupancy records and decided there was severe overbuilding and marketing problems, so they stopped building them.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Scaramouche
Date: 15 Apr 05 - 12:27 PM

Actualy, there is a mystery about Shakespeare that I wonder what people think. Was he a soldier or wasn't he?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: John O'L
Date: 15 Apr 05 - 07:55 PM

I think the arguement goes thus:

If the writer of the plays was in fact Marlowe, then the man Shakespeare who stood in for him when he had to disappear was a small landowner who had been a soldier.
I think Marlowe had been a soldier too.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,Scaramouche
Date: 16 Apr 05 - 01:13 PM

Never heard that one before. What I understood was that there is a time in his life we know nothing about, and just the way he describes soldiers, it feels right.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,J
Date: 25 Apr 05 - 06:25 AM

soldiers are cool

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 11 May 05 - 09:58 AM

hey yall, I have a question about history. Why did they make it?? it's really boring to learn about if your not a history teachor or proffesor.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: RangerSteve
Date: 11 May 05 - 03:34 PM

Where's the peck of pickled peppers Peter Piper picked?

And, can I grow pickled peppers? How?

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: Ebbie
Date: 11 May 05 - 06:55 PM

Sure. If you pick the peppers you can pickle them- but they will be pink. I think.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: John O'L
Date: 12 May 05 - 05:47 AM

History was invented by several civilizations independently and inadvertantly, at different times or possibly at the same time.
It was only later that it was recognised (by historians) for what it was. Or is.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 12 May 05 - 10:34 AM

Loved your analysis of the pyramids, Dave. Common sense, really.

Subject: RE: BS: Histories Mysteries
From: GUEST
Date: 12 May 05 - 06:38 PM

I wish Guest All Knowing Seer would come back. There are a lot of unanswered questions above. I can't wait to read his answers.