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Subject: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: wilbyhillbilly Date: 11 Oct 04 - 05:02 AM I'm stumped. Have searched DT and Google. My mother in law swears this is a song from her past by The Spinners, although I suspect it could be someone else. Anyone got any ideas please, please please. whb |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Joe Offer Date: 11 Oct 04 - 05:15 AM Hi, Wil - I think it the Ellen Vannen (click me). As you can see from the crosslinks at the top of this thread, it has a variety of spellings. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: GUEST,Val Date: 11 Oct 04 - 05:17 AM It is Ellen Vannen (an Isle of Man Steam Packet Co ship that sank, as opposed to drowned). Written by Hughie Jones of The Spinners. I'm not a user of the DT myself, but that might help you - or I'm sure one of the many helpful and more clued people will be along soon anyway. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Seaking Date: 11 Oct 04 - 05:56 AM This is the first folk song I ever sang (in public). The ELLEN VANNIN Tragedy Snaefell, Tyndwall, Benmachree, Fourteen ships have sailed the sea. Proudly bearing a Manx name, But there's one will never again Chorus Oh Ellen Vannin, of the Isle of Man Company, Oh Ellen Vannin, lost on the Irish Sea. At one a.m. in Ramsey Bay Captain Tier was heard to say "The contract says deliver the mail In this rough weather we must not fail." Ocean liners sheltered from the storm Ellen Vannin on the waves was borne Her holds were full and battened down As she sailed towards her Liverpool town With her crew of twenty one Manx men Her Passengers Liverpool businessmen "Farewell to Mona's Isle, farewell This little boat is bound for Hell!" Less than a mile from the Bar Lightship By a mighty wave Ellen Vannin was hit She sank 'neath the waters of Liverpool Bay And there she lies until this day Few Manxmen now remember The third day of the month December That terrible storm in Nineteen-nine Ellen Vannen sailed for the very last time I took the lyrics from the album 'Ten of the best with The Spinners', Fontana label SFXL.51 which was released about 1967. The 'Ellen Vannin' track is a live concert recording from 1965. Chris |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Strollin' Johnny Date: 11 Oct 04 - 08:32 AM Not surprised Wil was confused - sounds like a woman's name but is actually the Manx name for the Isle of Man. :0) |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: wilbyhillbilly Date: 11 Oct 04 - 11:57 AM Well what can I say! except thanks everyone for the terrific response which has answered the question. Apparently Beth's (the wife) grandpa used to sail on the Ellen Vannen, but luckily did not go on the night it went down, which is what prompted this query, so now she can sing it knowing that it means something special to her family. Thanks again, whb |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Reiver 2 Date: 11 Oct 04 - 12:37 PM Fascinating!! Reiver 2 |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 11 Oct 04 - 01:56 PM Interesting! Ellan = island; Vannin from Mannin. For more information on the Isle of Man, see this website: Manx Notebook A short treatise on Manx history (scroll to bottom to get index). |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Liz the Squeak Date: 11 Oct 04 - 05:02 PM Wow Seaking - the first song I ever sang was cribbed from a Spinners' cassette too! LTS |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Susanne (skw) Date: 11 Oct 04 - 05:35 PM Seaking, thanks for posting this. A couple of the names are spelled differently, however. EllAn Vannin has been pointed out by Q above. Snaefell, Tynwald and Ben my-Chree in the first line were three other ships of the Isle of Man Co. named after Man's highest mountain, the Manx Parliament and a Manx expression respectively. (From the Isle of Man website: Ben-my-Chree is actually a term of endearment in the Manx Gaelic language. Literally it means Ben (wife) my (my) Chree (heart).) The Spinners recording was first released on 'More Folk at the Phil', later reissued as 'An Evening With The Spinners' (which I have). Wil's family history certainly puts the song on a timescale in the way the mere mention of the year cannot do. Thanks, Wil! |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: fiddler Date: 12 Oct 04 - 07:30 AM Well, I'll join the club too! Probably the first song I sang in public I still play it on guitar A XX |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Bernard Date: 12 Oct 04 - 07:51 AM The Spinners were an early influence on my singing career, too. Well do I remember their televised concerts from Bolton Octagon Theatre in the late 60s! What the people on telly didn't see was Hughie Jones (usually!) falling about laughing, and the crew having to 'reset' and do another 'take'!! Many people were hypercritical (jealous?) of their commercial success, but they provided many thousands of people with their first taste of folk music - not just British, but from around the world. Such was the measure of their influence that an American group with the same name agreed to be known over here as 'The Detroit Spinners', whilst 'The Liverpool Spinners' was the name our lads used over in the USA! |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: fiddler Date: 12 Oct 04 - 09:00 AM this is like a group meeting - I'm a Folkie and I listened to the spinners - not something we usually say in open forum - but very interesting. Andy |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: VIN Date: 12 Oct 04 - 11:54 AM Nicely put Bernard. Seem to remember them doin a tv prog with Stan Hugill at some point aswell. Felt great to be at a Spinners concert, ('specially the good ole Free Trade 'all). Nice times. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Kenny B (inactive) Date: 12 Oct 04 - 04:03 PM Another song called Ellan Vannin (Words by Eliza Craven Green before 1896, Music by J Townsend) Recorded by the good old Folk? Group "The Bee Gees" Kenny B |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Susanne (skw) Date: 12 Oct 04 - 05:16 PM I have no problem admitting that The Spinners were my first experience of British folk music. I still cherish my dozen Spinners albums, though I've since acquired a lot of material that I think more highly of, and I still regret never having seen them live. |
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE ELLAN VANNIN TRAGEDY (Hugh E Jones) From: Jim Dixon Date: 13 Oct 04 - 08:07 PM I found these lyrics at the website of The Stationary Willberries a folk band based on the Isle of Man. Considering the source, I think they would at least get the names spelled right. And their spelling is certainly different from that of the other 3 copies of the song we have at Mudcat: here (in the DT), here (in an old thread), and above (in this thread). Also, they say they have the author's permission to post an .mp3 file of their own recording, so I'd bet they have the rest of the lyrics right also. Or maybe not. Judge for yourself. THE ELLAN VANNIN TRAGEDY Words and music by Hugh E. Jones (Wee Huge Publications) Snaefell, Tynwald, Ben My Chree: Fourteen ships had sailed the sea Proudly bearing a Manx name, But there's one will never again. CHORUS: Oh, Ellan Vannin, of the Isle of Man Company, Oh, Ellan Vannin, lost in the Irish Sea! At one a.m. in Ramsey Bay, Captain Teare was heard to say: "Our contract said, 'deliver the mail.' In this rough weather, we must not fail." Ocean liners sheltered from the storm. Ellan Vannin on the wave was borne. Her hold was full and battened down As she sailed towards far Liverpool Town. With a crew of twenty-one Manxmen, Her passengers Liverpool businessmen, Farewell, Mona's Isle, farewell! This little ship was bound for hell. Less than a mile from the Bar lightship, By a mighty wave Ellan Vannin was hit. She sank in the waters of Liverpool Bay. There she lies until this day. Few Manxmen now remember The third day of the month December, The terrible storm in Nineteen-nine. Ellan Vannin sailed for the very last time. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 13 Oct 04 - 10:07 PM Interesting to note the similarity of Hughie Jones' tune -particularly the chorus- to the (also modern, but older) Yiddish song Dona Dona (see various threads here on that song). |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: PennyBlack Date: 14 Oct 04 - 04:35 AM The Spinners helped to keep "Folk Music" in the public's eye for quite some time and were a great bunch of guys (rubbish at darts though ;0). Hughie is still doing the clubs and is of course a regular at Lancaster (UK) Festival every Easter, many of his self penned songs have been wrongly attributed to "Trad" over the years. His songbook and CDs can be found at Jan's (fellow Mudcatter)website. PB |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Seaking Date: 14 Oct 04 - 01:45 PM There's probably a 'What was the first song you sang' thread to start sometime. Liz, what was that song you mentioned ? In my earlier post I took the spelling straight off the Album cover. Great links and interesting comments everyone..... Chris |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: GUEST,Ms Lemon Date: 15 Oct 04 - 12:00 PM Schantieman and I went to The Everyman Folk Club (every Tues at the Everyman Theatre, Liverpool. Brill food there too) and Hughie (who's there every week) asked did anyone have any requests, and of course I asked for this song. To hear it by THE MAN was wonderful. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Drowning of Ellen Valin? From: Susanne (skw) Date: 15 Oct 04 - 01:38 PM Malcolm, I've never been able to see more than a very superficial similarity of the tunes, certainly not enough to confuse ME, which is saying something! |
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