BS: Dilemma

Subject: BS: Dilemma
From: fat B****rd
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 03:11 PM

My darling wife bought me a miniature Bodhran on the Holyhead Ferry recently. Should I have thrown myself overboard or should I try and play it ?

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 03:37 PM

Overboard, if you're still on the ferry. If you're not it would be pretty pointless.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: gnu
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 03:47 PM

Miniature? 14" ?

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: gnu
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 03:59 PM

Anything less than 14" isn't worth beating.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: kendall
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 04:09 PM

Gnu, if that's the case, most of us are in trouble!

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: GUEST,Bodhran hater
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 04:46 PM

You could have accidentally dropped it overboard to be sure.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Jeri
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 04:48 PM

Dear fB, what WAS she trying to tell you?

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: jonm
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 04:49 PM

It's a wall ornament.

Identifies you as a folkie to those who don't know you and as a musician to others (by having it on the wall, unplayed!).

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: GUEST,Skipy
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 05:32 PM

How many pints will it hold?
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 06:03 PM

It can also be used as a frisbee -- or a target.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 06:14 PM

Rap's right! Use it as a dartboard for six months, then it will make a first class flour sifter.

Plan B: Take it to the Yukon, pan for gold, then use the gold to buy a musical instrument.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Peace
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 06:20 PM

Ya got half a set of snowshoes there.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Azizi
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 06:59 PM

What's a Bodhran?

I take it it's a kind of musical instrument.

Is it like a lute?

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 07:09 PM

here's looking at ya.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Azizi
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 08:04 PM

Thanks Guest for that link.

Except that after clicking on it, I STILL didn't know what I was looking at when I looked at it. Which I guess is the point of the preceding tongue and cheek posts..

So I googled it myself and visited a site that explained that

"On an old Franciscan Monastery in Roundstone, developed by the Industrial Development Authority , Malachy Kearns, better known as Malachy Bodhrán amongst folk musicians, works at his craft of making Ireland's oldest product the Bodhrán (Bow-Rawn). It is an 18" one sided drum made from Goatskin treated by a traditional process.
Goatskin has unique stretch properties. The Irish word 'Bodhar' means deaf or haunting. The Bodhrán began as a skin tray used for drawing turf (peat) on the bogs.It stirs the spirit when played with the "tipper" or beater hitting the skin in a racing style while a hand presses the back of the skin to vary the tone. Malachy is respected as a fine Bodhrán makers for 25 years.Most of the professional folk Musicians world wide use our Bodhráns we are the only full time makers in the world."

end of quote

for more info. click
bodhran

Okay, now I get the references to wall ornament, frisbee, dart board, pan for gold snowshoe, though the 'how many pints does it hold' is still kinda beyond me.

No matter..I'm getting an education here..

seriously

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 08:14 PM

Azizi,

Every culture has a group, chosen to be the butt of inane humour.

The English tell Irish jokes;
The Irish tell Kerryman jokes;
The Americans tell Polack jokes;

We members of the folk culture tell bodhran, and banjo jokes.

Oh! and the jews tell the best Jewish jokes. I think they are the only ones with the smarts to pre-empt others making them the butt of humour.

Hope that clarifies the above.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Azizi
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 08:43 PM

Don,

Thanks for that info..

I've also noticed some accordian jokes here at Mudcat.

I gather that the people who play those instruments recognize that it's just friends lightly teasing friends. So no one's feelings get hurt.

With regard to the accordian, I like the sound of the accordian in Zydeco music. However, I can't say that I've heard that instrument anywhere else.

No wait. Wasn't there someone who played the accordian many years ago on the Lawrence Welk television show ?

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Col K
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 08:47 PM

Possibly you should have thrown the wife overboard for being so insensitive as to give a musician of you calibre one in the first place.
Just a thought.
Col

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Shanghaiceltic
Date: 12 Mar 05 - 08:59 PM

Treat the skin with a good oil, fill it with cat litter and the cats will love you. They can also use the wood rim to sharpen their claws as they answer the call of nature ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: gnu
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 07:20 AM

I am surprised no one has picked up on : "The Irish word 'Bodhar' means deaf or haunting." Of course, in this sense, "haunting" is the apt variation. Although, I wonder if the other variation may have some merit? Could the "deaf" allude to a deaf person being able to feel the beat?

I have two Kearns Hrans and highly recommend them. I also have a small synthetic and prefer it in pubs and the like. When people throw beer at you, the tone remains unchanged.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Alba
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 08:27 AM

LOL Gnu....synthetic... Tone remains unchanged after Berr drenching lol.

Well I was thinking if you had a dog...if not get a Dog then used said ornament as fribee.(expanding Rapaire's suggestion)

A unique fruit Bowl perhaps

Strategic placing below right or left foot in front of Armchair... then stand up...result...smashed..oh dear, how sad, never mind.

Leave House to go to Session, taking said ornament. Disgard before arriving at session most definetly, Find dumpster, Trashcan, garden..far from Home...dispose.
Arrive Back Home loudly complaining that some B****** stole your " Mini Bodhran":>)and no you do not want a replacement, it just wouldn't be the same....

Blessings
Jude

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 10:47 AM

Did ytou know the Bodhran is one of the worlds very few folding musical instruments?

With care, it can compacted into 3% of its original volume (1), and when opened out again, it's musical qualities will not have suffered at all. There is a subtle change of tone, which is much prefered by many, who are so keen on this(2) tuning method, they will tune the instruments of any Bodhran players nearby in this fashion without hesitaition.

(1) Heavy work boots are traditional for this purpose, but walking boots with crampons are quite acceptable.

(2) Also see entry for Banjos.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: CarolC
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 02:13 PM

Every culture has a group, chosen to be the butt of inane humour.

The English tell Irish jokes;
The Irish tell Kerryman jokes;
The Americans tell Polack jokes;

We members of the folk culture tell bodhran, and banjo jokes.


...and everyone tells Morris Dance jokes ;-)


Oh! and the jews tell the best Jewish jokes. I think they are the only ones with the smarts to pre-empt others making them the butt of humour.

Newfoundlanders tell the best Newfie jokes for exactly the same reason. Thank goodness nobody ever tells any accordion jokes.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Raedwulf
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 03:54 PM

Azizi - I may one day be able to forgive you for imagining that a bodhran & a lute might be vaguely related! ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: frogprince
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 04:03 PM

As someone who grew up in Minnesota, with polka bands from New Ulm on the radio and performing locally all the time, I can barely grasp the thought that anyone has "never" heard accordian apart from zydeco.
Y' know though, what those polka bands all lacked was a good bodhran player...

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Layah
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 04:06 PM

Did they lack a bodhran player, or just a good one?

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Azizi
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 05:22 PM

Please forgive me, Raedwulf. I gather that you are a lute player?

Well I figure if Imma gonna hang around this here Mudcat, I betta learn more about all these folkie type instruments that I never heard of or I only heard about a long time ago when I was in school or maybe heard some mention of when I was skimming one of them educationalble channels on my teevee..

So I said "Google, don't fail me now!" and I wrote in the word "lute" and "Lordy be!", "God Bless America", what did I see?!"

There were lots of places I could go to learn about that there old lute instrument.

So I picked one, and went a-lookin to see what I could see.

And I'm glad I picked that page cause they even have some pretty pictures. Here's some of what was written there:

"The Roman lute predates the Medieval lute, the true forerunner of the guitar, but was itself preceded by the Greek and the Egyptian lute.The lute, the true forerunner of the guitar (kithara), is considered a medieval instrument but was played by the ancient Romans. The Roman lute had three strings and was not as popular as the lyre or the kithara, but was easier to play"..

end of quote.

And they go on to talk about some other types of lutes [but why they don't just call them a guitar I don't know]

Oh well, maybe I gotta go back here

and read more..Then I guess I'll understand it better by and by.

;O)

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Peace
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 05:25 PM

A bodhran is just a banjo without the good parts.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Azizi
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 05:28 PM

And frogprince,

On another thread I said I was culturally deprived.

But do I have to listen to polka to be a real folkie?

[Please say no.]

Oh, okay..If I must. ;O}

Who knows? Maybe I'll like polka music if I get rid of my
pre-conceived notions about it.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: CarolC
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 05:35 PM

You never have to listen to polka to be a real folkie, Azizi, unless you live in the upper Midwest, or parts of Pennsylvania west of Philidelphia. Fortunately for the both of us, there are so many other and better folk-type uses for an accordion.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 05:50 PM

I've alwways fancied owning a bodhran since seeing Christy Moore play one. I bought a tuition video, for a friend and it looked so hard - he gave up without trying.

I've always fancied one of those with bits of goat hair still stuck to it =- however I notice that that guy who charges a fair bit and advertises on mudcat - he hasn't got bits of goathair hanging off.

I notice he wants a hundred and eighty quid, which is quite a lot in my circle - plus p&p and a bit more for the case. Still it looks a very good one. Its actually cheaper to buy one of his from an American website than it is from him directly - but I guess you would miss out on his expertise and personal contact. Anybody got any tales, theories about the ones with bits of goathair, and other things...

big al

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Raedwulf
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 05:54 PM

Oooof! That site knows rather less than it thinks it does, Azizi (of course you're forgiven, how could I not?! :) ). The lute is not the forerunner (true or otherwise) of the guitar, any more than the rebec is the forerunner of the violin (so there's another one for you to go & look up ;-) ). And the Roman instruments are not directly related to the medieval ones.

And yes, I do play the lute, also the guitar. Both fairly badly, these days!

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Azizi
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 06:31 PM

CarolC, you said
"You never have to listen to polka to be a real folkie, Azizi, unless you live in the upper Midwest, or parts of Pennsylvania west of Philadelphia"

Well I DO live in Pittsburgh, PA which is definitely "parts of Pennsylvania west of Philidelphia".

But there's not a lot of cultural sharing in Pittsburgh..and so-if you want to experience other folk's culture you really have to work at it...

****

Raedwulf-glad that I'm forgiven. But are you telling me that I can't trust GOOGLE to give me accurate information?

Oh woe is me, woe is me!!

Then do you or anyone else have any websites that really and truly would give information about what a lute [one site said it was like a harpsichord?? is that better??} and the next question is "What is a harpsichord"??

not to mention what is does a 'rebec' look like..

I'm shattered that Google failed me..those pictures were so pretty and they SAID they were lutes..

I'm so discombobulated, I'm not even going to look up 'rebec'...

But I'll read what you and others say..

You guys [and gals] are the experts..

I don't play a darned thing.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: CarolC
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 07:07 PM

Have you been to the Pittsburgh Folk Festival, Azizi?

It doesn't look like the folk music and folkways of African Americans, the African continent, or other groups from the African diaspora were represented to any extent last year except for The Flow Band ("reggae and island sounds"), and African tile motif craft demonstrations. Maybe they need some help in getting some more representation for African / African American / African diaspora folk culture at that festival.

Festival website

P.S. Sorry for the thread drift, fat B****rd.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Azizi
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 08:27 PM

THREAD DRIFT..

Carol,
Re the folk festival..I haven't been in a while. When I used to put on my West African clothing and go to the annual folk festival,
I usually didn't see many African American, African, Caribbean etc performers..Of course, I did find the other performers interesting, but still....

Though I'm not sure, I think the problem is 'moola'{money to pay the performers who may not be into volunteering year after year..}

And then there's the unfortunate fact that we {African Americans} need to be get more comfortable about going places on our 'off' time where we'll be a minority. I didn't mean to make a pun..but maybe both common uses of that word ""minority" are applicable here.

When African Americans in Pittsburgh area leave our neighborhoods we are ALWAYS seen as a minority racial group. Since only 10% of this county's residents are Black {and 20% of Pittsburgh's population are Black} when we leave our [usually segregated communities-some very nice, some nice, some not nice at all, some very much not nice at all]there are always going to be far fewer of us than there are of White people {there are few if any Latinos, and also few Asians, Middle Easterners etc in this county}.

Does this matter?? Apparently for alot of Black people- YES.

I've gone to cultural programs at institutions like the Carnegie Museum, the Science Center, and the Children's Museum and seen few if any other Black people...Some of this is because of the entrance fee and lack of private transportation to get to these places. But that's only a small part of it..

Besides a good number of African Americans here have money, so it's not just the money-I contend that much of it is pyschological..
It's a challenge, that's for sure...

Anyway, thanks, Carol for the links. I'll check them out.

Azizi

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: CarolC
Date: 13 Mar 05 - 09:12 PM

You're welcome, Azizi. I understand what you're saying. Anyway, good luck in your endeavors, whatever they may be.

BTW, lutes and harpsichords (and rebecs too, if I remember correctly) are generally grouped into the "classical" music category, "early music" subgroup - medieval, renaissance, and early baroque, although it does appear that some "folk" type musicians are using some of these kinds of instruments as well. A Google search using "early music" (in quotes) and "instruments" is a good place to start looking for information on those instruments.

"early music" instuments

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 12:12 AM

To get back to the original question - yes, Fat Bustard, you should try playing your new bodhran. You might be like my dear husband, an absolute natural.

There is nothing quite so fascinating as a really good bodhran solo. Go to a concert by a really good band and hear how much can be done on a bodhran, and see how everyone listens silently and intently.

(Ignore all those jealous fiddlers.)

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: frogprince
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 12:31 AM

Actually, Azizi, even then back in Minnesota I couldn't take anything like a steady diet of polka myself. I never thought of polka as folk then; it was never promoted under that name; but in retrospect I guess it is "folk" to "folks" from a number of countries. Hope you know I wasn't meanin' at all to put you down; I was just stuck once again by what should be obvious; people in one country can "come from" very different "places" I'm not sure how old I was when I first heard a bodhran, but I'll bet I was far older than you before I knew the name for it. I was pushing 20 the first time I learned to recognize a classical composition by name (Well, I did know the real name for the Lone Ranger theme); Forty-some years later I sometimes think I'm not so naive anymore, but other times I'm not sure.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Shanghaiceltic
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 01:08 AM

I have four lovely bodhrans, three tuneable and one big 22" beasty which is not. I must admit I would never turn them into litter trays for our three cats as they are plain scared of the site and sound of them. As soon as I get them out to practice the cats are bouncing off the windows and doors. Do they not appreciate what a fine set of instruments I have??

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Peace
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 01:10 AM

Much can be made of a cat if caught while young.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 09:33 AM

Mittens or kittens.....

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 12:46 PM

Good for you, shanghai. (May I call you shanghai?)

The cats are probably objecting because the bodhrans are too loud. For some reason, a cat which is bothered by music doesn't just leave the room. Oh no! The cat must stick around, registering its disapproval. It's something to do with the fact that they are actually the bosses of the house.

If I were you, I would just put the cats in another room and close the door. That way you can practice without worrying that you are hurting them.

I shared a room recently with a cat who objected to my flute playing. Philistine!

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 01:23 PM

Shanghaiceltic, the fact that they are "bouncing off the windows and doors" suggests to me that maybe they would like some bodhrans of their own to play. Is there any kind of rythm to their bouncing? That will tell you whether or not they have any ability, and hence, whether or not you would want to invest in getting them their own instruments.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: fat B****rd
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 03:17 PM

Actually I used to play the drums in a "Beat Group" but I had to give up due to........ skin trouble......sorry

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: artbrooks
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 03:37 PM

Azizi, while I own, and like, my Malachy Kearns' bodhran, his site is just a bit off. First, there is no reliable record of the bodhran in Irish (or any other kind) of music much before the 1930s, if that early. Second, his drums are at best B or B+ in quality...there are much better, and less expensive, ones out there.

Keep trying to find International and other kinds of folk stuff in Pgh. Its out there, but that city, like many others in the Rust Belt, is more noted for its individual (and inbred) ethnic communities than for any kind of transfusion between them. My wife is from Pgh. and we've lived in both Erie and Cleveland, so we've had that experience.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: gnu
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 03:44 PM

Art... please share your knowledge of these bargains. I'm always looking for a bargain.

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: GUEST,Skipy
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 04:29 PM

Azizi, is that welk or whelk?
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Azizi
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 05:03 PM

Frogprince: no the thought that you were trying to put me down never came into my mind.

Artbrooks: Since your wife is from Pittsburgh you can identify with what I'm sayin. Thanks for the encouragement. I'm tryin to expand my cultural horizons by joining this community [but I still can't quite call myself a folkie??!!]. And I promise I'll try to do better in the real[?] world about leaving the comfort of my cultural community to seek out cultural offerings that are unfamiliar to me.

Skipy: Naughty! Naughty! Poor Lawrence Welk-He still gets picked on..His music show is still considered to be a joke, but I'm sure it had some redeeming qualities [well maybe I should say I GUESS it did..since I can't remember back that far!!]

;O))

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: Shanghaiceltic
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 05:58 PM

Their motion when I play is totally random, no rythm to it, just sort of stood up hair, extended claws, and whipping round the room like little whirlwinds, bit like watching a pinball machine. Had thought of getting ear muffs for them, but have you ever tried to put muffs on a cat!

When the bodhrans are bagged and in their opinion safe they like to tip them flat on the floor and sleep on them. They is philistines!

Subject: RE: BS: Dilemma
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Mar 05 - 06:09 PM

*g*

Sounds like they're getting off on it, Shanghaiceltic. Might be interesting to see what they'd do if you gave them some catnip before you start playing your bodhran. If it's good, take a video of it and post it somewhere where we can see it.